Official BenQ HT2050/W1110 Owner/Settings Thread - Page 56 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1651 of 1683 Old 03-08-2019, 03:12 PM
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Has anyone ever experimented with how the different 3D signal types affect detail (ie vertical / horizontal resolution) on this projector?


I never saw a review that covered this detail and don't own a 3D 'calibration' disc to check it myself.



Edit: ok never mind the details of why I was asking in the first place : If the HT2050 does what any projector is expected to do when presented with various 3D signals, then I guess we can all move along, nothing to see here...

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post #1652 of 1683 Old 03-09-2019, 07:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AschMan View Post
FWIW, my original bulb blew after three years while my daughter was playing games. She said it sounded like a balloon popping.

Ordered this replacement for $80 and will report back on how well it works. Much less than the OEM part on the BenQ website.

https://www.amazon.com/EWOS-5J-JEE05...-1-spons&psc=1
New bulb worked great, install was not too bad. Cover was a bit more difficult than expected to remove and there is a sticky clear plastic piece covering the bulb assembly. Peel it off delicately and you can apply it back after bulb is replaced. Total time to replace about 20 minutes after taking projector off ceiling.

Interestingly, original bulb only had 1,500 hours on it before exploding. 3 years of occasional use.

Will report back if new bulb blows sooner than expected. For <$90 this is recommended.
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post #1653 of 1683 Old 04-30-2019, 03:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tonybradley View Post
I've had my HT2050a for several months, and have been using it with the Settings out of the Box on Eco Mode and Cinema.

I borrowed my friend's Spears and Munsil Blu-ray to calibrate it the other day. I calibrated my last PJ, MANY years ago with DVE. So I've forgotten a lot.

While calibrating, I bumped the Brightness up from 50 out of the box to 51. Contrast went from 48 out of the box down to 38.
Quote:
Originally Posted by noob00224 View Post
For grayscale you can use the AVS 709 calibration disk, specifically 1-Black Clipping and 3-White Clipping in Basic settings. There is also a 5-Sharpness & Overscan test: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/139-d...libration.html
I don't know why you got 38 for contrast, I have 51 Brightness and 50 Contrast (with 2.4 gamma) on a Cinegrey 3D (1.2 gain) screen.
Make sure the Dynamic Range is set correctly from your devices and software, as well as gamma (if available).
Tony, if you haven’t already arrived at this result in the last few months, raise your contrast. You can have more light, and you’re not missing out on anything by doing so.

I think there’s two schools of thought on contrast. Some faithfully set contrast on their display so that all video levels up to 254 are perfectly distinguishable, nothing crushed. For me this indeed results in a very low setting on the HT2050. (41 for me, not too far from the 37 you used). You may find you get substantially less actual light out of 100% white levels this way however. (the difference was something like 17 FtL instead of 19 FtL peak white in my setup. I have a 0.9 gain screen, by the way, in case that sounds low.)

The alternative school of thought, heretical though it may be, holds that real-world video content above reference white, 235, can be ignored *at the display*. Further up the chain, yes, fine, it’s good to continue to pass this information if for no other reason than headroom for all the video processing along the way. But for the very last step between the display’s input and its glass, you can finally crush it, it has served its purpose, and there is no benefit leaving reference white 235 dimmer than necessary just for the theoretical possibility of code 236 appearing in a pixel or two. Real world content doesn’t ever contain this “information”. You can disregard it.

You can guess what Spears and Munsil say about this. If you follow the ‘help’ screen advice on the spears & muesli disc, they show a screenshot of what their ramp pattern looks like with this kind of setting, clearly labeled “WRONG”. So I can see why people would be discouraged.

But - and this is a big caveat - as long as you aren't using Brilliant Color, I personally bet you will not see any artifacts by crushing 236 and up, and indeed you will certainly get a brighter picture. Your test patterns may look discolored in places (that go over 100% white), but your calibration runs (which only measure 100% and below) will still look perfect.

Edit: Brilliant Color, in addition to a pronounced green push, seems to re-level things and generally drive the display harder. So if you're planning on using that feature regularly for things other than bright-room viewing of sports etc, maybe you just stick with the conservative play. Honestly, calibrating for Brilliant Color really requires its own collection of settings.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tonybradley View Post
When performing the Sharpness Test, it said to jack it all the way up and bring it down when jagged lines disappear etc. Out of the Box, Sharpness was a 7. All the way up, or all the way down changed absolutely nothing on the Test Pattern. Zilch. So I left it on 7. Does this mean I have an issue with my BenQ PJ since Sharpness does nothing?
Quote:
Originally Posted by noob00224 View Post
The sharpness setting does have an effect, check out this review for the W2000/HT3050 (identical with this feature): http://projectiondream.com/en/review...or-benq-w2000/ You can click the pictures to make them larger.
As noob points out, there’s a generic sharpness pattern on the AVS709 disc, and if that’s all I had to go on I would agree the sharpness control on this device seems to have no effect.

But since you have the Spears and Munsil disc, you may be interested in investigating the effect of sharpness in unexpected places, such as on the chroma burst pattern. On my setup, high sharpness seems to have a noticeable effect.

[For me personally, the biggest improvement was telling my Oppo not to send 444 to my video processor but just leave it as 422. This is very visible on the burst patterns and also the chroma alignment pattern. Sadly, finding out what combination of settings works best for your processing pipeline is tedious. See spears and munsil’s own advice on how to use this pattern at http://spearsandmunsil.com/portfolio-item/choosing-a-color-space/ ]

Meanwhile, that projectiondream.com review of the HT3050 (aka W2000) linked to by noob is amazing. And not just for the screenshots of real-world content *clearly* showing the effect of sharpness (if you zoom in enough and flip back and forth between them rapidly). Additionally their findings on real-world (eg white-room) contrast ratios is revelatory. Too bad they seem to have stopped reviewing new models.. (last review was 2016?)
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post #1654 of 1683 Old 05-07-2019, 05:51 AM
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NxNW, thank you very much for this informative post; I too have wondered about the contrast settings suggested by the S&M disc and I will definitely try and "force myself" into ignoring it, and bump the contrast up.
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post #1655 of 1683 Old 06-24-2019, 12:58 PM
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Does Noise Reduction affect the image in any way?
An older post claimed the higher the setting, the more noise. I can't see any difference.

Manual:
• Noise Reduction
Reduces electrical image noise caused by different media players. The higher the value,
the less the noise.
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post #1656 of 1683 Old 07-05-2019, 08:00 PM
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Wondering if someone can help me figure out my problem, this happened pretty much from one day to the other, have not changed any settings, had the projector for about 2 years, 2300 hours on lamp time in eco mode. So a 1/3 or 1/4 of the picture seems to be darker then the rest. Not sure if I hit a setting or somehting on accident, tried to Google for a solution but didn't really know how to narrow down my search. I included couple pics so I can show what I'm talking about, I think the issue is pretty clear, this is driving me nuts if someone knows how to fix of what my issue is I would greatly appreciate it

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk
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post #1657 of 1683 Old 07-05-2019, 08:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kingtana1 View Post
Wondering if someone can help me figure out my problem, this happened pretty much from one day to the other, have not changed any settings, had the projector for about 2 years, 2300 hours on lamp time in eco mode. So a 1/3 or 1/4 of the picture seems to be darker then the rest. Not sure if I hit a setting or somehting on accident, tried to Google for a solution but didn't really know how to narrow down my search. I included couple pics so I can show what I'm talking about, I think the issue is pretty clear, this is driving me nuts if someone knows how to fix of what my issue is I would greatly appreciate it

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk
Try the pattern from the menu.
In the 3550 thread some users turned it on and off to fix a similar issue.
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post #1658 of 1683 Old 07-07-2019, 07:31 PM
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This is my first time connecting a PJ to a receiver. Is there a specific cable or anything to connect these two in order for the PJ to play through the surround speakers? I am sure there is some sort of cable I need, could you please link a few or PM me. No idea how to do this. Connecting to a Denon x2400 - Thanks.

Last edited by Patrick Flaherty; 07-07-2019 at 07:39 PM.
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post #1659 of 1683 Old 07-07-2019, 08:37 PM
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Hello Patrick,
If Projector is the only output device (No TV) in your setup , then connect PJ to HDMI out / Monitor 1 port on your AVR via HDMI cable. There are lots of diff HDMI cables that you can buy online depending on the distance you have between PJ and AVR (from local store or online). Your AVR shall send video to PJ and keep the audio for itself (and your speakers) when you connect it to any source.
Hope that helps.
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post #1660 of 1683 Old 07-08-2019, 06:17 AM
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Originally Posted by argentum246 View Post
Hello Patrick,
If Projector is the only output device (No TV) in your setup , then connect PJ to HDMI out / Monitor 1 port on your AVR via HDMI cable. There are lots of diff HDMI cables that you can buy online depending on the distance you have between PJ and AVR (from local store or online). Your AVR shall send video to PJ and keep the audio for itself (and your speakers) when you connect it to any source.
Hope that helps.
Thanks, okay so just a general HDMI cable? Put that in the PJ HDMI out on the AVR and then into HDMI1 or HDMI2 ports on the PJ itself? There is no specific 'best' type of HDMI for this set up as far as type - not length?
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post #1661 of 1683 Old 07-08-2019, 09:17 AM
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I just purchased this PJ and will be setting up later this week when it arrives. I watch Netflix TV shows and movies 95% of the time with some sports in there too. Does this PJ have any presets for different types of viewing such as a sports or cinema?
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post #1662 of 1683 Old 07-08-2019, 11:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick Flaherty View Post
I just purchased this PJ and will be setting up later this week when it arrives. I watch Netflix TV shows and movies 95% of the time with some sports in there too. Does this PJ have any presets for different types of viewing such as a sports or cinema?
It has Cinema mode for tv/movies, and Vivid for sports.
The main difference is the Brilliant Color option being turned on for Vivid. BC give more brightness at the expense of color accuracy.
There is also a Bright mode, but that has a green tint.

They can be accessed via the menu or the mode key on the remote.
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post #1663 of 1683 Old 07-08-2019, 07:58 PM
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**The BenQ HT2050 can be had for $535 currently. $635 + $50 gift certificate, and somehow there was another $50 discounted in my cart. Images attached. Purchased this earlier today.**

I even went back and calculated my full cart since I had ordered multiple items. Then I spoke with customer service and they insisted the gift card was on the way. Great deal on this PJ that seems very highly spoke of.
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post #1664 of 1683 Old 07-09-2019, 10:25 AM
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Those who have this PJ, did you do any calibration or do you find the image great out of the box? Are the preset vivid and cinema options which I will mostly be using pretty solid options?
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post #1665 of 1683 Old 07-09-2019, 10:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick Flaherty View Post
Those who have this PJ, did you do any calibration or do you find the image great out of the box? Are the preset vivid and cinema options which I will mostly be using pretty solid options?
You can't use other people's settings since they are unique to their setup.
Calibration can be done, but the default settings are pretty good out of the box.
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post #1666 of 1683 Old 07-09-2019, 06:45 PM
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How is the 3D on this PJ? Debating picking up some glasses and some 3D movies if recommendations are good for the 3D option on this. If you have tried the 3D, what glasses are available/compatible with this PJ? Expected delivery date tomorrow - getting excited!
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post #1667 of 1683 Old 07-09-2019, 06:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick Flaherty View Post
How is the 3D on this PJ? Debating picking up some glasses and some 3D movies if recommendations are good for the 3D option on this. If you have tried the 3D, what glasses are available/compatible with this PJ? Expected delivery date tomorrow - getting excited!
This projector is bright so the 3D is not dim. DLP's are considered the best when it comes to 3D.
I'm using the Benq glasses, DGD5 (part number 5J.J9H25.001), which apparently are the best.
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post #1668 of 1683 Old 07-10-2019, 07:09 AM
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Originally Posted by noob00224 View Post
This projector is bright so the 3D is not dim. DLP's are considered the best when it comes to 3D.
I'm using the Benq glasses, DGD5 (part number 5J.J9H25.001), which apparently are the best.
So in your opinion the 3D is pretty good? Any place I can find these glasses cheaper than $60/pair for the newest version? Saw them going for that price on BenQ website and $80 or something like that on ebay. These seem like a really good trade off otherwise I am thinking..

https://www.amazon.com/ELEPHAS-Recha...08980373&psc=1
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post #1669 of 1683 Old 07-10-2019, 07:28 AM
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Official BenQ HT2050/W1110 Owner/Settings Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick Flaherty View Post
So in your opinion the 3D is pretty good? Any place I can find these glasses cheaper than $60/pair for the newest version? Saw them going for that price on BenQ website and $80 or something like that on ebay. These seem like a really good trade off otherwise I am thinking..



https://www.amazon.com/ELEPHAS-Recha...08980373&psc=1


Any DLP link glasses will work just fine with the HT2050A. I use the BenQ as well and can attest to their quality. But I also use a pair of “Ultra Clear 3D Heaven” goggles that work just as well. Hell, even the cheap button-cell models work great but they’re so uncomfortable I save them for when kids visit.
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post #1670 of 1683 Old 07-13-2019, 12:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick Flaherty View Post
So in your opinion the 3D is pretty good? Any place I can find these glasses cheaper than $60/pair for the newest version? Saw them going for that price on BenQ website and $80 or something like that on ebay. These seem like a really good trade off otherwise I am thinking..

https://www.amazon.com/ELEPHAS-Recha...08980373&psc=1
My favorite pair are the Elephas DLP Link 3D glasses. I also use the Apeman DLP link 3D Glasses. They are just fine. I have used Ultimate 3D Heaven and I PERSONALLY don't recommend those. (perhaps the pair I purchased were defective but there seems to be a film on the lenses and is very distracting)
My Favorite 3D movies are Dr Strange, Avatar, and Guardians of the Galaxy Vol 2.
3D movies are harder to come by in the USA. More often than not you have to import which can get to be pricey. I LOVE 3D and I'm a huge fan but unfortunately it is all but dead.

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/68-di...l#post53368666

Last edited by Aceklub96; 07-13-2019 at 01:13 PM. Reason: added link to previous review
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post #1671 of 1683 Old 08-11-2019, 05:22 PM
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What is the actual lumens of this projector?
In 2 reviews there are 2 different measurements with about 500 lumens difference:
https://www.projectorcentral.com/ben...ge=Performance
https://www.projectorreviews.com/ben...w-performance/

Projector central claims in Full lamp, Cinema, with lens at the widest angle, results in 1160 ANSI lumens.
Using the zoom reduces the brightness by 27%.

Projector reviews claims in Full lamp, Cinema, with lens at midpoint, results in 1535 lumens.
They claim that from midpoint to widest angle is 10% increase in lumens. Which puts lumens with lens at widest angle at 1691.

In this one they claim with Full lamp, wide angle lens, it has 1550 ANSI lumens in it's Brightest Cinema mode and 1160 in Standard Cinema mode. What are Brightest and Standard Cinema modes? Brilliant Color?
https://www.projectorcentral.com/home-theater-projectors-under-$1000.htm?page=Performance

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post #1672 of 1683 Old 08-11-2019, 09:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by noob00224 View Post
What is the actual lumens of this projector?
I have a meter.

I can tell you measurements of cd/m2 (nits)(also converted easily into foot-lamberts) measured off the screen. It's my understanding distance from the screen is not critical as long as the test pattern being measured fills the field of view of the measuring device.

Or I can tell you lux measured facing the lens and give you the distance the reading was taken at, which I believe *is* critical to getting a result that is comparable across devices.

Does anyone have a handy formula for converting either of these measurements to "lumens"? I know it's one of the oldest questions in all of home theater but for some reason I never have the necessary formula(s) handy.
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post #1673 of 1683 Old 08-11-2019, 09:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NxNW View Post
I have a meter.

I can tell you measurements of cd/m2 (nits)(also converted easily into foot-lamberts) measured off the screen. It's my understanding distance from the screen is not critical as long as the test pattern being measured fills the field of view of the measuring device.

Or I can tell you lux measured facing the lens and give you the distance the reading was taken at, which I believe *is* critical to getting a result that is comparable across devices.

Does anyone have a handy formula for converting either of these measurements to "lumens"? I know it's one of the oldest questions in all of home theater but for some reason I never have the necessary formula(s) handy.
That would be great!
What I would need is the measurement off screen, but I'm not sure how the measurement is done in the reviews. Could you do both?
Also the throw distance, size and format of the screen, screen gain, lamp type used during test (preferably Normal, not SmartEco), mode (preferably Cinema without Brilliant Color).
The value in the projectors menu>System Setup:Advanced>Lamp Settings>Lamp Timer>Equivalent Lamp Hour.
Is the projector calibrated to 16-235?

I think it's this one: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/26-ho...l#post57641982

Last edited by noob00224; 08-11-2019 at 09:44 PM.
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post #1674 of 1683 Old 08-12-2019, 08:22 AM
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Originally Posted by noob00224 View Post

That would be great!
Ok when I get back to all my gear I'll have a look. I'm still not convinced this effort would lead to a result given in *lumens* but maybe that's not really what you meant in the first place?
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post #1675 of 1683 Old 08-12-2019, 08:27 AM
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Originally Posted by NxNW View Post
Ok when I get back to all my gear I'll have a look. I'm still not convinced this effort would lead to a result given in *lumens* but maybe that's not really what you meant in the first place?
Yes, I think you're right, the lumens, but I would still need the other details, how many hours on the lamp from that specific menu, zoom factor (which can be determined by screen size and throw range), etc. Screen gain does not matter.
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post #1676 of 1683 Old 08-13-2019, 08:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by noob00224 View Post
Yes, I think you're right, the lumens, but I would still need the other details, how many hours on the lamp from that specific menu, zoom factor (which can be determined by screen size and throw range), etc. Screen gain does not matter.
Well, I'm just going to give you what I've got, and if certain parameters don't turn out to matter, you can ignore them accordingly.

Ok the basic measurement off the screen is

60.560 nits (or 17.67 FtL if you prefer)

This was observed by pointing an i1 display colorimeter (itself calibrated previously for this exact display) positioned somewhat below the center of the screen, reading the center of the screen, i.e. facing upwards at about 45deg, from a distance of a foot. No shadow was anywhere in the meter’s field of view. (see note 1)



The pattern measured was a full field of 100% white generated by the HCFR software itself.

The non-ALR screen has a 0.9 gain and is basically ‘lambertian’ i.e. has no hot spots and performs equally in all viewing directions. (see 2)


The 16:9 test pattern used here was 82” wide and 46” tall.


The screen itself is actually a 2.35:1 aspect ratio silver ticket (see 3). It is normally used with an active image area of 104.5” wide x 44.5” tall for scope movies, but a native 16:9 image such as this test pattern would be displayed with the dimensions above. The test pattern therefore did not fill the screen. There were pillar bars. The meter was not pointed anywhere near these areas.

The projector is mounted more or less in the middle of its usable range, at 10’3” between lens and screen surface.

The room is fairly light controlled with black ceiling and walls and gray flooring and furniture.

The projector’s settings were as follows:


Cinema mode


Brightness 50
Contrast 49

gamma 2.2


brilliant color off


Lamp Power was set to Normal


HDMI settings were set to auto but I confirmed they were functioning in the normal video 16-235 range.


The equivalent lamp hour is 1840




I will PM you some CMS and Color temp settings as well just for thoroughness, but I don't like put those in public because it tends to lead people astray..


Trust me that the dE's were all under 2 on the grayscale and mostly under 2 for the primaries and secondaries (I let blue stay mostly where it was - my experience is it's not worth chasing that one) and that the settings that led to these low dE's were themselves not extreme deviations from the factory defaults.





(1) As long as the screen uniformity is ok and you're not measuring your own shadow, it's my belief the details of the meter placement are not especially important in measuring nits.

(2) I believe gain matters very much when speaking about nits
(3) I am of the opinion that screen dimensions aren't important when speaking about nits. Computing lumens may require knowing the surface area of the illuminated region however.



Hope this helps!



If you come up with a formula for calculating *lumens* let me know! It's my understanding is it's a bit of black art.
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post #1677 of 1683 Old 08-16-2019, 03:44 AM
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Well, I'm just going to give you what I've got, and if certain parameters don't turn out to matter, you can ignore them accordingly.

Ok the basic measurement off the screen is

60.560 nits (or 17.67 FtL if you prefer)

This was observed by pointing an i1 display colorimeter (itself calibrated previously for this exact display) positioned somewhat below the center of the screen, reading the center of the screen, i.e. facing upwards at about 45deg, from a distance of a foot. No shadow was anywhere in the meter’s field of view. (see note 1)



The pattern measured was a full field of 100% white generated by the HCFR software itself.

The non-ALR screen has a 0.9 gain and is basically ‘lambertian’ i.e. has no hot spots and performs equally in all viewing directions. (see 2)


The 16:9 test pattern used here was 82” wide and 46” tall.


The screen itself is actually a 2.35:1 aspect ratio silver ticket (see 3). It is normally used with an active image area of 104.5” wide x 44.5” tall for scope movies, but a native 16:9 image such as this test pattern would be displayed with the dimensions above. The test pattern therefore did not fill the screen. There were pillar bars. The meter was not pointed anywhere near these areas.

The projector is mounted more or less in the middle of its usable range, at 10’3” between lens and screen surface.

The room is fairly light controlled with black ceiling and walls and gray flooring and furniture.

The projector’s settings were as follows:


Cinema mode


Brightness 50
Contrast 49

gamma 2.2


brilliant color off


Lamp Power was set to Normal


HDMI settings were set to auto but I confirmed they were functioning in the normal video 16-235 range.


The equivalent lamp hour is 1840




I will PM you some CMS and Color temp settings as well just for thoroughness, but I don't like put those in public because it tends to lead people astray..


Trust me that the dE's were all under 2 on the grayscale and mostly under 2 for the primaries and secondaries (I let blue stay mostly where it was - my experience is it's not worth chasing that one) and that the settings that led to these low dE's were themselves not extreme deviations from the factory defaults.





(1) As long as the screen uniformity is ok and you're not measuring your own shadow, it's my belief the details of the meter placement are not especially important in measuring nits.

(2) I believe gain matters very much when speaking about nits
(3) I am of the opinion that screen dimensions aren't important when speaking about nits. Computing lumens may require knowing the surface area of the illuminated region however.



Hope this helps!



If you come up with a formula for calculating *lumens* let me know! It's my understanding is it's a bit of black art.
Thanks for the test.

Regarding the screen, it's an 0.9 gain and the result is 60.560 nits. Calculating to 1.0 would make it 67.28 nits, but I don't think that's the way it works. If the screen is calibrated to show 16-235, or the same white level/brightness as an 1.0 gain screen, then the brightness was increased, and the 60.560 nits would be the value for a 1.0 gain screen?

Any measurement when the lamp was new?

It seems Projector Central measurements are the ones that are accurate, according to this review: http://projectiondream.com/en/review...or-benq-w2000/

From the measurements given the throw range is very close to 1.15, the projector's minimum, which means about x1.28 zoom factor (out of x1.3). The screen seems to be an 114" (2:35.1): https://www.projectorcentral.com/Ben...ulator-pro.htm
PC calculator nits estimate with new lamp is 81, and 139 according to manufacturer estimate. Not clear in what modes though.

Since the projector does not have an 2:35:1 mode, the 16:9 projection is for an 120" screen. Square surface would be 42.67 ft². Ansi lumen measurements from PC in Cinema, Full lamp, widest lens position, no BC, (gamma 2.2?), is 1160. 1160 /42.67 ft² is 92.5 nits brightness, with new lamp.

Now the question is how to calculate the progression of brightness decrease, since it's not linear:
https://www.projectorreviews.com/hom...ojectors-lamp/

LE: can a screen gain be measured with a colorimeter?

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Calculating to 1.0 would make it 67.28 nits, but I don't think that's the way it works.
I think that's exactly how that works. If I owned a white screen instead of a grey one I expect my meter would read higher, probably around 67, just as you calculated.



If we're trying to infer lumens from readings taken *off the screen* then I believe the screen gain is critical to the calculation. I probably shouldn't have tossed out this number so casually. The 0.9 figure I gave is just a guess. Here's why:


First, the publicly claimed gain figures supplied by manufacturers are not to be trusted generally. Check out the tabular data presented in Jeff Meier's excellent round up at https://www.accucalav.com/wp-content...een_report.pdf



Silver ticket *says* my grey screen (which is perfectly matte and has no ALR properties) has a gain of 1.0. That already seems false on its face. Further, Wirecutter measured the hell out of a silver ticket and determined their basic product fell well short of their claim, by as much as 10 or 15%. https://thewirecutter.com/reviews/be...jector-screen/ Charitably I am using 10%. This is why I say the gain is 0.9 I could be even more conservative and declare that my screen's gain is 0.85, but I really have no way of nailing down the exact amount. Which brings us to..

Quote:
LE: can a screen gain be measured with a colorimeter?
We might be going in circles:



You could do it with a single reading but that would require knowing in advance.. wait for it.. the exact light output of the projector in lumens.


Quote:
Any measurement when the lamp was new?
No and I wish I did! I had an old busted meter when it arrived and it took my, well, 1850 hours of lamp life to buy a new meter, learn a new software package, etc.


Measuring light is physics lab stuff. We might have to have this conversation over in the display calibration area of the forum so as not to derail the "owner's thread" here
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I think that's exactly how that works. If I owned a white screen instead of a grey one I expect my meter would read higher, probably around 67, just as you calculated.
From what I've been reading a negative gain grey screen will darken the image. It is possible to brighten up the image to what an 1.0 gain screen would be. This is done by calibration. So if it's calibrated to 16-235, the 1.0 gain screen would have the same nits as the 0.9 screen. The difference between a grey (negative gain) and a white screen would be that ambient light will be reflected back according to the negative gain, and the projector's image, since it's been increased in brightness, will look the same as a 1.0 screen.
Not entirely sure though.

Been doing some calculations based on your measurements, and are about right. The formula is, the lamp loses 20% of it's brightness in the first 500 hours. There are a remaining 6500h of lamp life (on SmartEco, since the hours in that specific menu are SmartEco equivalent) until the lamp reaches 50% of it's original brightness.
1800-500=1300 hours from the 6500h, which is 20% (of 6500h). Lumens of a new lamp with the settings above was measured at 1160. Half brightness is 580 lumens. After 500h the lumens would be 928.
After this the lamp has 6500h to consume (928-580)348lumens. 20% (1300h) of 348 lumens (6500h) is 69.6 (spent) lumens. 928-69.6=858.1‬ lumens=68.9 nits (on an 120" 16:9) on a 1.0 gain screen.


Not sure what thread it should be moved since this is about brightness.

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From what I've been reading a negative gain grey screen will darken the image. It is possible to brighten up the image to what an 1.0 gain screen would be. This is done by calibration.
I would dearly love to see the source you've been reading that leads to this last conclusion.



The basic analogy I think of is like sculpting a specific shape out of a shapeless chunk of marble: an uncalibrated projector can make a lot of light but its not very accurate. (Consider how pleasant it is to watch the 2050's "Bright" mode.) The process of calibration involves "chipping away" the machine's inaccurate behaviors. Inevitably this involves trading off raw light output for accuracy. Always. Green light seems really bright but if it makes everything green, you do something to make it less green. Now everything looks better. And darker. That's calibration in a nutshell.



(True, in the middle of the applicable adjustment ranges, you can "reduce" the effect of an overly green condition by simply increasing red and blue to restore balance, but at the high end of the range you can't do this, it just drives the machine beyond its capabilities and causes inaccuracies that are even worse.)



There is no part of calibration, that I know of, that involves making a projector brighter. The exceptions to this rule are really rare and I can't think of any off the top of my head.



To keep the analogy going, you try to chisel away only what you need to reveal the perfect sculpture you had in mind *in its biggest possible size*. You don't continue chiseling and make a dwarf version of the same shape. If you do that, you should have just saved your money and started with a smaller block of marble.


People generally watch projectors as bright as they will reasonably go (or at least as bright as their tolerance for inaccuracy will allow). Never dimmer. Not on purpose.


So I've never heard of the ability to take a projector that has been optimized to put out a good picture and then just suddenly increase its brightness after it's been calibrated. At least not without undoing some aspect of the calibration. You can always make a picture brighter and less acurate, never birgter while maintaining accuracy.


People instinctively love brightness, make no mistake, and many times you make a change and people's taste for brightness will lead them to pronounce the result "better", but there was probably a tradeoff somewhere that makes things less faithful to the original image that was encoded in the signal.



When people calibrate their projectors, the results will generally be the same no matter what surface they are shining the projector on, unless there's a pronounced color shift or something. The surface is a "given" - your only task is to optimize the things you *can* change.



Shining a previously calibrated projector on a darker screen only has one effect: the image gets darker. There's isn't some button you can press that allows the projector to get you back up to your old experience. If it was calibrated right, there's nowhere left to go. It's already at the optimal balance of brightness and accuracy. You can't add rock to the original chunk of marble to allow a bigger result of the same shape.



Anyway, back to the specific topic at hand, ie how bright is a reasonably good looking picture on a HT2050 when it is new, your calculations seem to satisfy you that my real world measurements are in the same ballpark as one of the reviewers. I agree.



I'm not sure it's easy to directly measure lumens. The required device looks pretty formidable (see image here https://i.stack.imgur.com/MJqAP.jpg) The best you can do is measure some other related property and go from there.



In this case, if the thing being measured is reflected light off of the screen surface, then the screen gain seems to have to enter the calcluation.



We can avoid that extra wrinkle by taking a measurement with the meter *facing* the lens. This results in a quantity with different units, lux, not cd/m2, but can still be used to get at the original thing your after, lumens. I think I have a few readings taken this way somewhere, or I can make some new ones if you think that would be helpful?
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