Epson 5040/6040 3D ghosting/crosstalk issue - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 160 Old 04-06-2017, 04:10 PM - Thread Starter
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Epson 5040/6040 3D ghosting/crosstalk issue

PLEASE CALL EPSON 562-981-3840 and ask for Cortney. Tell him of the problem with the 6040 showing crappy 3D!!!


They have to be advised of the problem to be able to fix it. As of right now, I am the only person (IN THE WHOLE WORLD) that they have heard from about the ghosting/crosstalk with the 6040/5040.


Let's hope for a fix, but only FW...I like my calibration!

...finally retired and spending time in my dedicated HT!!!

SPARKSPLEX HT - Epson 6040 3D/4K UB Projector; 110" 16x9 Dalite HD Progressive Screen; Sammy 3D/4K K8500 region free; 7.2.4. w/Def Tech speakers, Earthquake P12v2 Subs; Auto Source 100vs Amp; Denon 4300H; MX990 Remote; 5 Bello chairs; Coaire Mini-split.

Last edited by inspector; 04-07-2017 at 08:01 AM.
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post #2 of 160 Old 04-06-2017, 06:25 PM
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I haven't had any 3D issues with any of the side by side or over/under Mkv files I've watched. All with default settings


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post #3 of 160 Old 04-06-2017, 07:32 PM - Thread Starter
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You mean to tell me that any of the 3D movies that you have watched, you have not encountered any ghosting/crosstalk in any scenes? The movie has played 3D perfectly and it was on a 5040/6040...and you have not had to use 3D DEPTH for anything?

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post #4 of 160 Old 04-06-2017, 07:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by inspector View Post
You mean to tell me that any of the 3D movies that you have watched, you have not encountered any ghosting/crosstalk in any scenes? The movie has played 3D perfectly and it was on a 5040/6040...and you have not had to use 3D DEPTH for anything?
I've watched beauty and the beast, avatar, sammys adventure and titanic all looked great to me much better than my Sony 55es projector and 60" lx900 Sony tv. I'm using the Samsung 3300gr glasses $20 for two pairs on amazon
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post #5 of 160 Old 04-06-2017, 07:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by inspector View Post
PLEASE CALL EPSON 562-981-3840 and ask for Cortney. Tell him of the problem with the 6040 showing ****ty 3D!!!


They have to be advised of the problem to be able to fix it. As of right now, I am the only person (IN THE ****ING WHOLE WORLD) that they have heard from about the ghosting/crosstalk with the 6040/5040.


Let's hope for a fix, but only FW...I like my calibration!
As stated in the owner's thread, you are not the only person who has spoken with Epson about this problem. I spoke with them about the ghosting issue as far back as February and had an incident report opened back then. The person I spoke with said the problem was escalated to engineering, and they have been researching the problem since.

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post #6 of 160 Old 04-07-2017, 07:28 PM
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can anyone else confirm that the crosstalk occurs in SBS and simulated 3D?
I am thinking it may be happening in 3d blu ray only . . .
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post #7 of 160 Old 04-08-2017, 04:11 AM
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Originally Posted by db999md View Post
can anyone else confirm that the crosstalk occurs in SBS and simulated 3D?
I am thinking it may be happening in 3d blu ray only . . .
It happens on bluray disc as well. Like life of pie bluray 3d. Also on sbs 3d avatar. Both which play perfectly on my lg passive 3d tv.
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post #8 of 160 Old 04-08-2017, 09:27 AM - Thread Starter
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They play perfect on my Passive too!

...finally retired and spending time in my dedicated HT!!!

SPARKSPLEX HT - Epson 6040 3D/4K UB Projector; 110" 16x9 Dalite HD Progressive Screen; Sammy 3D/4K K8500 region free; 7.2.4. w/Def Tech speakers, Earthquake P12v2 Subs; Auto Source 100vs Amp; Denon 4300H; MX990 Remote; 5 Bello chairs; Coaire Mini-split.
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post #9 of 160 Old 04-08-2017, 09:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by inspector View Post
They play perfect on my Passive too!
Somebody posted in the owner's thread that if they change the screen size under 3D settings that it seems to help with the crosstalk. Can anyone else confirm this?

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post #10 of 160 Old 04-08-2017, 11:37 AM - Thread Starter
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I just watched my friends Epson 5010 and it has ZERO GHOSTING!!!


Between that player and ours...they screwed up big time. We shouldn't have to use 3D DEPTH, the 5010 doesn't have it!


Epson must fix this problem, give us players that work or refund our money to buy another brand!!!


I didn't spend $4000 to have this kind of hassle.


...and yes, I'll try to change the screen size to see if that helps with the ghosting...and I'll try on Monday my new HDMI 2.0 high speed super duper cable that does everything under the sun going from the 6040 to my Sammy K8500.

...finally retired and spending time in my dedicated HT!!!

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post #11 of 160 Old 04-08-2017, 09:34 PM
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So I tried letting the projector warm up for about an hour while I watched another program, then I tried a 3D disc. Crosstalk was minimal on low 3D brightness. If I cranked up brightness to medium, I could see more crosstalk. On high the crosstalk was very apparent. I will try again tomorrow and see if I get the same results.
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post #12 of 160 Old 04-09-2017, 03:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seplant View Post
Somebody posted in the owner's thread that if they change the screen size under 3D settings that it seems to help with the crosstalk. Can anyone else confirm this?

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That setting -i believe just reduces the 3d effect... so yes you can change it and the crosstalk is less...but so is 3d effect...so its not really helping fix the issue.
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post #13 of 160 Old 04-09-2017, 03:46 AM
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Lens shift

Does anyone know if the crosstalk issue is impacted by things like lens shift or keystone or just not having the perfect size or shape of the image projected? Mine is always slightly not perfectly rectangle because my screen is not in a fix spot.
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post #14 of 160 Old 04-09-2017, 06:12 AM
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Mine has crosstalk too. It is not a huge deal breaker but it should work properly as advertised.
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post #15 of 160 Old 04-09-2017, 06:26 AM
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Wow!! I'm glad inspector let me know about this issue. I had considered upgrading to a 5040 from my 5010 but "no thanks". My 3D needs no adjustment, has always worked perfectly so I'll just keep my old 5010!!. It just sounds like there is an issue with the 5040 that Epson should make good.
Good luck guys.

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post #16 of 160 Old 04-10-2017, 09:52 AM - Thread Starter
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Just got a call from Courtney of Epson this morning and Epson is now aware of the 3D problem. Follow what he says and get those emails, phones call and pics over to him asap!


Thanks,


John (inspector)


Hey John,

In order to research the issue you're having with the 3D ghosting on the 5040/6040UB, we would like for you to provide screen captures of the following when the issue occurs:

-3D menu, Info menu, Signal and Image menu,
-What source device is being used to play the 3D content and screenshot of the current 3D settings from the menu of the source device (blu ray player, cable box, etc.)
-The title of the movie, and a time stamp where the issue can clearly be seen.
-Manufacturer of the 3D Glasses being used (if not Epson glasses).

Please feel free to pass this information along to anyone experiencing these issues and contact us to provide us with this information. I can be reached directly at 1.562.981.3840 ext 19014

Best Regards,

Courtney T.
Epson America


THIS IS THE ADDRESS THAT IT CAME FROM;


[email protected]

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...finally retired and spending time in my dedicated HT!!!

SPARKSPLEX HT - Epson 6040 3D/4K UB Projector; 110" 16x9 Dalite HD Progressive Screen; Sammy 3D/4K K8500 region free; 7.2.4. w/Def Tech speakers, Earthquake P12v2 Subs; Auto Source 100vs Amp; Denon 4300H; MX990 Remote; 5 Bello chairs; Coaire Mini-split.

Last edited by inspector; 04-10-2017 at 09:54 PM.
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post #17 of 160 Old 04-10-2017, 11:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seplant View Post
Somebody posted in the owner's thread that if they change the screen size under 3D settings that it seems to help with the crosstalk. Can anyone else confirm this?

Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk
Changing screen size cannot have any effect on crosstalk other than changing the width of the crosstalk area. This setting merely adjust the scaling of the stereoscopic separation between L/R image elements. The 3D depth setting also automatically tracks the screen size setting. So if the screen size adjustment also causes the depth setting to increment or decrement, then the crosstalk could be shifted to more forward or rearward screen elements. This could affect the appearance of the crosstalk depending on the contrast and focus or sharpness of the particular picture element. Crosstalk is less stark on out-of focus picture elements such as often seen in background parts of the picture.

Crosstalk on this projector (or any other active shutter 3D display) is entirely an artifact of the 3D glasses failing to completely block the opposite-eye image, either through inadequate shutter contrast, and or improper on/off timing.

Passive 3D display system, those relying on polarization alone, are not susceptible to these active shutter glasses' LCD performance and timing problems.
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Last edited by Geraldius; 04-10-2017 at 11:36 AM.
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post #18 of 160 Old 04-10-2017, 12:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by inspector View Post
Just got a call from Courtney of Epson this morning and Epson is now aware of the 3D problem. Follow what he says and get those emails, phones call and pics over to him asap!


Thanks,


John (inspector)


Hey John,

In order to research the issue you're having with the 3D ghosting on the 5040/6040UB, we would like for you to provide screen captures of the following when the issue occurs:

-3D menu, Info menu, Signal and Image menu,
-What source device is being used to play the 3D content and screenshot of the current 3D settings from the menu of the source device (blu ray player, cable box, etc.)
-The title of the movie, and a time stamp where the issue can clearly be seen.
-Manufacturer of the 3D Glasses being used (if not Epson glasses).

Please feel free to pass this information along to anyone experiencing these issues and contact us to provide us with this information. I can be reached directly at 1.562.981.3840 ext 19014

Best Regards,

Courtney T.
Epson America

I'm glad to hear Epson has recognized they do have a problem with the 5040, however it seems to me that they could pull one or two new ones out of the box and do their own testing. With as many 5040 owners having issues with the 3D surely units which have not been sold will have the same issues.
Just saying!!

Projectors: 35mm Kinoton PK60D/Epson 5010
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Speakers: JBL 3678's L-C-R (3), JBL 4645C's 18" SUBS (2) JBL 8330's SURROUNDS (4)
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post #19 of 160 Old 04-10-2017, 01:49 PM
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I thought all LCD displays have ghosting in 3D due to the image retention inherent in the technology?
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post #20 of 160 Old 04-10-2017, 05:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Geraldius View Post
Changing screen size cannot have any effect on crosstalk other than changing the width of the crosstalk area. This setting merely adjust the scaling of the stereoscopic separation between L/R image elements. The 3D depth setting also automatically tracks the screen size setting. So if the screen size adjustment also causes the depth setting to increment or decrement, then the crosstalk could be shifted to more forward or rearward screen elements. This could affect the appearance of the crosstalk depending on the contrast and focus or sharpness of the particular picture element. Crosstalk is less stark on out-of focus picture elements such as often seen in background parts of the picture.

Crosstalk on this projector (or any other active shutter 3D display) is entirely an artifact of the 3D glasses failing to completely block the opposite-eye image, either through inadequate shutter contrast, and or improper on/off timing.

Passive 3D display system, those relying on polarization alone, are not susceptible to these active shutter glasses' LCD performance and timing problems.
Adjusting the screen size actually seemed to help reduce the crosstalk for me. If I have 3D Depth set to zero and the screen size setting at 110" (the size of my screen), I sometimes get terrible crosstalk. Playing around with settings yesterday, I was able to leave the 3D Depth at zero but adjust the screen size to 140", and all of the foreground ghosting went away. There was still a bit of background ghosting present, but it was definitely better. The 3D effect still seemed to be good.

I was actually able to capture screenshots of some remaining ghosting from Rogue One by putting the lenses of my 3D glasses in front of my cell phone camera. The photos are in a document on Google Docs here. The first photo in each set is what the camera saw. The second photo in each set has the ghosting circled. Where the same screenshot seems to be repeated is the view from the other lens of the glasses.
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post #21 of 160 Old 04-15-2017, 11:09 PM
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Any further updates on this from Epson ?.
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post #22 of 160 Old 04-16-2017, 05:00 PM
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I watch perhaps 50% 3D on my Optoma 131xe DLP projector, but I was intrigued with 4k enhancement of the 5040UB. Well so far, I've been unimpressed with the slight difference between the 5040UB and my Optoma. And 3D is "horrible" on the 5040UB compared to my Optoma for most movies. Others are just okay. Well last night I watched Rogue One, and as everyone has stated the crosstalk is awful. I reduced the separation on the 5040UB and it looked okay for some scenes, but others were very foggy looking, especially the dark scenes. Increasing brightness did not help. I got very frustrated and decided to watch Rogue One on my Optoma. Well, folks, I was blown away by the difference. On the Optoma there was NO crosstalk, the colors, brightness and everyone was great. To the point, that I have decided to keep the Optoma and return the 5040UB. I mean it was not only better, it was night and day different. And given the so-so 3D of other movies I've watched and the only slightly difference in resolution of the 5040UB--really hard to tell, and I even watched a 4K UHD of Passengers, and it really didn't look much different. So I'm forgoing the expense and keeping what I have until 4K DLP comes out with 3D (although that might not be this year). Oh well, carry on people...If Epson is all you know, then 3D is probably okay to you, but if you're coming from a DLP, there is just such a big difference that it's down right disruptive.
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post #23 of 160 Old 04-16-2017, 06:33 PM
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Do you have crosstalk at the center or on the sides only?
I notice my 2040 when sitting at 11 ft away with 120 inch, I get cross talk on the sides. Turns out my Samsung glasses is just not designed to be viewed on such a big screen because the shutter darkness gets lower as you look though it at an angle.
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post #24 of 160 Old 04-16-2017, 07:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by panman40 View Post
Any further updates on this from Epson ?.
I sent Epson a link to a document I created with photos of crosstalk in Rogue One that I was able to capture by putting one lens of my 3d glasses at a time in front of my phone camera, and here is their reply: "Thanks for taking the time to send the detailed info. I have passed along your comments and image to our engineers and asked them to treat this matter as "tender" for our market (expedite). Hopefully we will hear back shortly!"
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post #25 of 160 Old 04-17-2017, 10:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seplant View Post
I sent Epson a link to a document I created with photos of crosstalk in Rogue One that I was able to capture by putting one lens of my 3d glasses at a time in front of my phone camera, and here is their reply: "Thanks for taking the time to send the detailed info. I have passed along your comments and image to our engineers and asked them to treat this matter as "tender" for our market (expedite). Hopefully we will hear back shortly!"
That does seem pretty bad considering it's happening everywhere.
What 3D glasses are you using?
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post #26 of 160 Old 04-17-2017, 10:43 AM
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That does seem pretty bad considering it's happening everywhere.
What 3D glasses are you using?
I'm using the Epson glasses called out in the manual.


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post #27 of 160 Old 04-17-2017, 10:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seplant View Post
I'm using the Epson glasses called out in the manual.


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That is very strange. Have you tried using a different cable?
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post #28 of 160 Old 04-17-2017, 11:21 AM
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Originally Posted by jasonsong View Post
That is very strange. Have you tried using a different cable?
I haven't tried a different cable for this specific issue. I am using a Cabernet Ultra CL2 Active High Speed HDMI Cable.

Hey, Inspector, if I remember correctly, you recently changed out your cables, so did you notice any difference in your 3D performance?

Last edited by seplant; 04-17-2017 at 03:36 PM.
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post #29 of 160 Old 04-17-2017, 07:57 PM
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That is very strange. Have you tried using a different cable?
I tried a different cable. No difference. Also tried using a PS3 instead of my Oppo BDP-93. While the ghosting varied from scene to scene, it was still there.
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post #30 of 160 Old 04-17-2017, 09:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3DBob View Post
I watch perhaps 50% 3D on my Optoma 131xe DLP projector, but I was intrigued with 4k enhancement of the 5040UB. Well so far, I've been unimpressed with the slight difference between the 5040UB and my Optoma. And 3D is "horrible" on the 5040UB compared to my Optoma for most movies. Others are just okay. Well last night I watched Rogue One, and as everyone has stated the crosstalk is awful. I reduced the separation on the 5040UB and it looked okay for some scenes, but others were very foggy looking, especially the dark scenes. Increasing brightness did not help. I got very frustrated and decided to watch Rogue One on my Optoma. Well, folks, I was blown away by the difference. On the Optoma there was NO crosstalk, the colors, brightness and everyone was great. To the point, that I have decided to keep the Optoma and return the 5040UB. I mean it was not only better, it was night and day different. And given the so-so 3D of other movies I've watched and the only slightly difference in resolution of the 5040UB--really hard to tell, and I even watched a 4K UHD of Passengers, and it really didn't look much different. So I'm forgoing the expense and keeping what I have until 4K DLP comes out with 3D (although that might not be this year). Oh well, carry on people...If Epson is all you know, then 3D is probably okay to you, but if you're coming from a DLP, there is just such a big difference that it's down right disruptive.
What type of room? Light controlled and dark walls or a room with light colored walls/floor/ceiling? Surprised that you didn't see much difference between the two projectors with regular 2d content. Pretty much every review/person claims the 5040 is quite a bit better than any of the budget dlps that have been out in the past few years.
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