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-   -   BENQ W2000+ : Premium version of the famous W2000 (https://www.avsforum.com/forum/68-digital-projectors-under-3-000-usd-msrp/2895577-benq-w2000-premium-version-famous-w2000.html)

kraine 07-13-2017 07:52 AM

BENQ W2000+ : Premium version of the famous W2000
 
BenQ will bring out this fall in Europe a Premium version of his famous W2000 : The BENQ W2000+

http://www.projection-homecinema.fr/...-succes-w2000/

I will receive a sample on Monday, slight improvements have been made :

2200 lumens instead of 2000 lumens
Low input lag
Wireless HDMI box is now hidden inside the projector
Every owner will get a full calibration report (W2000+/W2000)

And still color accuracy, full glass lenses, MasterAudio, etc.....

sage11x 07-13-2017 08:10 AM

BENQ W2000+ : Premium version of the famous W2000
 
The black is sexy. Wonder if this will cost more or come in at the same price as the old unit as a value added model. Here in the states the 3050 is considered a mostly superfluous upgrade over the 2050 (w1110).

As for the lumen rating-- I never really understood why the 3050 was only rated at 2000 when the mostly identical 2050 was rated at 2200. Seems they 'fixed' that.

kraine 07-15-2017 03:50 AM

W2000+ has just landed, in the same time as the X12000 (4K HDL LED) and the W1600UST, I will post the first measures and pics tonight here :


http://www.projection-homecinema.fr/...-w2000/?page=2

http://www.projection-homecinema.fr/...37a66c9014.jpg

Dave in Green 07-15-2017 07:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sage11x (Post 54246721)
... As for the lumen rating-- I never really understood why the 3050 was only rated at 2000 when the mostly identical 2050 was rated at 2200. Seems they 'fixed' that.

I always assumed that was related to the factory calibration of the 3050. When calibrated most projectors produce fewer lumens. The 2050 could go a little brighter but colors would have been off in the highest setting. The 3050 would remain more color accurate in its highest setting but with slightly less brightness than the 2050.

kraine 07-15-2017 09:09 AM

Input lag can be reduce with a dedicated option, the normal input lag value without this option is : 49,7 msec. With the fast mode on, I have measure 33,1 msec.

http://www.projection-homecinema.fr/...87accd4931.jpg

sage11x 07-16-2017 07:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave in Green (Post 54295433)
I always assumed that was related to the factory calibration of the 3050. When calibrated most projectors produce fewer lumens. The 2050 could go a little brighter but colors would have been off in the highest setting. The 3050 would remain more color accurate in its highest setting but with slightly less brightness than the 2050.



That would make sense but it's not just the rec709 mode that is dimmer on the 3050. http://www.projectorcentral.com/benq...ge=Performance

Also, chris heinonen calibrated both and the findings are what made me opt for the 2050 over the 3050:

http://referencehometheater.com/revi...ector-reviews/
http://referencehometheater.com/revi...jector-review/

sage11x 07-16-2017 07:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kraine (Post 54311761)



That's pretty impressive performance for a single chip DLP. Especially one that costs as little as it does!

Dave in Green 07-16-2017 07:46 AM

@sage11x , the difference in lumens could be explained by a difference in the color wheels. There has been discussion but to my knowledge no actual proof that the HT3050 has a higher quality color wheel than the HT2050. If you look at BenQ's description of the two models' color wheels you can see the difference (note bolded part in HT3050 description):

Quote:

We have re-engineered our six-segment color wheel (RGBRGB) with 6X speed to maximize color depth and range for the clearest images. And with BrilliantColor™ Technology enhancing each color, the HT2050 home theater projector achieves truly captivating, lifelike color performance so your entire family can enjoy movies to the fullest.
Quote:

Using the latest and most advanced 6X Speed RGBRGB color wheel with custom segment angles and coatings, the HT3050 achieves Rec. 709 cinematic color reproduction, delivering precise Hollywood Studio color right out-of-the box.
The HT2050 apears to be more of a combination home theater/home entertainment model while the HT3050 seems to be more of a pure home theater model. Typically home theater models produce fewer lumens than home entertainment models as they are optimized more for use in a dark theater than with some ambient light. Certainly the HT2050 has proved itself good enough in home theater use that many simply pass on the more expensive HT3050. :)

Dave in Green 07-16-2017 08:35 AM

I should mention that while it's frequently stated on this forum that the only image difference between the HT2050 and HT3050 is that the HT3050 is calibrated at the end of the production line and the HT2050 is not, there's much information on the BenQ website suggesting there are more differences:

Quote:

How Our Projectors Are Designed for Rec. 709

While most projector manufacturers choose a saturated color tone bias towards increased colorfulness, resulting in color accuracy loss, the HT3050 fully achieves the Rec.709 color standard. The process of building a projector includes many variables such as lenses, lamps and color wheel coating. We work relentlessly to close any gaps from those variances and to make our projectors perform exactly to Rec. 709. This is because we believe that colors matter to our customers when enjoying movies as they were meant to be seen.

Hardware Design

BenQ’s ISF-trained expert engineers tried more than 20 different combinations of color segments and color wheel coating, the factors that directly affect color gamut and brightness of a projector.

Software Optimization

To maximize color accuracy, the process of software optimization involved adjusting the blacks, whites and greys towards D65 defined by Rec. 709. And the three primary and three secondary colors were adjusted one by one, until they were as close as possible to the references on the Rec. 709 color gamut.

Production Line Quality Control

Three color adjustment stations in our production line perform final checks on every single unit of our Rec. 709 projectors. Using exclusive BenQ color adjustment procedures, we make sure each projector is manufactured according to the Rec. 709 color standard, and BenQ quality engineers perform final color tests on each projector built to ensure Rec.709 performance.

sage11x 07-16-2017 11:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave in Green (Post 54316009)
I should mention that while it's frequently stated on this forum that the only image difference between the HT2050 and HT3050 is that the HT3050 is calibrated at the end of the production line and the HT2050 is not, there's much information on the BenQ website suggesting there are more differences:

Yes, well all this optimization is arguably what resulted in the 3050 having a lower contrast ratio than the 2050. It looks like the '+' model will retain the pre-calibration but achieve better contrast results than even the 2050 could manage. That's good news! Now my only questions are: is this coming to the states? And: how much will it cost? :)

RLBURNSIDE 07-16-2017 02:01 PM

2500:1 CR, that's nice.

I just saw some Barco 1080p models that do 5300:1 native CR using DC3, so it is possible to improve it further.

If this BenQ offered 1080p60 frame packing 3D (so, 1080p120 2D*) I'd be all over it, due to the native CR, but alas...

*problem with DLP Link is it uses Red Flash, is there a way to dial it out for 2D (720p120)? I tried toning down the red channel on my w1070, but it didn't help.

sage11x 07-16-2017 02:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RLBURNSIDE (Post 54322897)
2500:1 CR, that's nice.



I just saw some Barco 1080p models that do 5300:1 native CR using DC3, so it is possible to improve it further.



If this BenQ offered 1080p60 frame packing 3D (so, 1080p120 2D*) I'd be all over it, due to the native CR, but alas...



*problem with DLP Link is it uses Red Flash, is there a way to dial it out for 2D (720p120)? I tried toning down the red channel on my w1070, but it didn't help.



Better glasses? My glasses do a good job of tuning out the red.

RLBURNSIDE 07-16-2017 05:04 PM

I mean for 2D use. I'd love to be able to use my w1070 at 720p120 in 2D (you have to activate frame sequential 3D mode for the odd / right eye frames to be shown, which activates Red Flash and messes up the colours). But it passes the true 120 fps at 120 hz test at blurbusters, so it's the real deal. Shows look insanely good with Dmitri Render interpolation. It's like getting a new display. For 720p shows it's a no-brainer to switch to 720p120 instead of upscaling to 1080p60. That's why I was looking at Optomas or other IR based 3D projectors. With IR-based 3D projectors, you can get 120hz 2D when not wearing 3D glasses.

Ruined 07-16-2017 05:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RLBURNSIDE (Post 54322897)
2500:1 CR, that's nice.

I just saw some Barco 1080p models that do 5300:1 native CR using DC3, so it is possible to improve it further.

If this BenQ offered 1080p60 frame packing 3D (so, 1080p120 2D*) I'd be all over it, due to the native CR, but alas...

*problem with DLP Link is it uses Red Flash, is there a way to dial it out for 2D (720p120)? I tried toning down the red channel on my w1070, but it didn't help.

How about getting some DLP link glasses that color correct the red but offer a no 3D mode? best bet.

I know for instance the Optoma ZD101 allowed for this type of operation, but they are out of production.

Ruined 07-16-2017 05:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kraine (Post 54246241)
BenQ will bring out this fall in Europe a Premium version of his famous W2000 : The BENQ W2000+

http://www.projection-homecinema.fr/...-succes-w2000/

I will receive a sample on Monday, slight improvements have been made :

2200 lumens instead of 2000 lumens
Low input lag
Wireless HDMI box is now hidden inside the projector
Every owner will get a full calibration report (W2000+/W2000)

And still color accuracy, full glass lenses, MasterAudio, etc.....

Looks like BenQ did it again with the best value in projectors. Really well done!

RLBURNSIDE 07-17-2017 08:02 AM

Hmmm, ya no. 2500:1 is a good upgrade but it took them what, five years to go from 1800:1 to 2500:1 ? Not exactly earth-shattering. Not to mention 42db of noise! Like wtf, that's a leaf blower next to your head.

sage11x 07-17-2017 12:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RLBURNSIDE (Post 54336057)
Hmmm, ya no. 2500:1 is a good upgrade but it took them what, five years to go from 1800:1 to 2500:1 ? Not exactly earth-shattering. Not to mention 42db of noise! Like wtf, that's a leaf blower next to your head.



That's in high lamp isn't it? And from what i see that's a claim and not a measurement right?

Verge2 07-17-2017 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RLBURNSIDE (Post 54322897)
2500:1 CR, that's nice.

I just saw some Barco 1080p models that do 5300:1 native CR using DC3, so it is possible to improve it further.

If this BenQ offered 1080p60 frame packing 3D (so, 1080p120 2D*) I'd be all over it, due to the native CR, but alas...

*problem with DLP Link is it uses Red Flash, is there a way to dial it out for 2D (720p120)? I tried toning down the red channel on my w1070, but it didn't help.

Barcos are prolly using the larger chip. It has better CR along with a good lens.

Frank714 07-18-2017 12:56 AM

No pun, but something is missing, IMHO:


Nous regrettons: Pas d'interpolation d'images (No frame interpolation to reduce motion blur and judder) :(


Of the four leading manufacturers of DLP front projectors BenQ obviously remains the only one that doesn't consider FI as an important feature.


Acer (AcuMotion), Optoma (PureMotion) and Vivitek (VividMotion) feature FI (even for their UHD front projectors) but BenQ remains stubborn and withholds this feature.


Wake me up again, once BenQ implements good FI in its front projectors.

Dave in Green 07-18-2017 08:50 AM

@Frank714 , BenQ adds Motion Enhancer (FI) on their HT4050 (W3000) and models priced above it. So it's really just a question of how low in the model lineup pricing structure do the various projector companies make FI a standard feature, i.e. how much less than an HT4050 (W3000) do the lowest cost models with FI from Acer, Optoma and Vivitek sell for? It's a marketing decision that each projector company makes.

sage11x 07-18-2017 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kraine (Post 54355289)



Thanks for the review. Wow, looks like BenQ knocked another one out of the park! Disappointed to hear about the fan noise. Hopefully, that's just a demo bugaboo and the actual retail units will be quieter. Maybe that's hoping too much? :) In either case the contrast and color performance are phenomenal. Did I read this model is for France only? If so, that would be a disappointment for the rest of us.

sage11x 07-18-2017 09:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave in Green (Post 54360881)
@Frank714 , BenQ adds Motion Enhancer (FI) on their HT4050 (W3000) and models priced above it. So it's really just a question of how low in the model lineup pricing structure do the various projector companies make FI a standard feature, i.e. how much less than an HT4050 (W3000) do the lowest cost models with FI from Acer, Optoma and Vivitek sell for? It's a marketing decision that each projector company makes.



Unfortunately the 4050 already had lower contrast than the HT2050/3050 and now with this most recent upgrade the 4050 will be even further behind. BenQ actually advertises the 4050 at 10k:1 where as the 2050/3050 and even the budget HT1070 are advertised at 15k:1-- that tells you a little about what BenQ thinks about the 4050's performance. Sadly, the 4050 looks a little adrift in their lineup. Nice to see BenQ has been able to squeeze even more contrast from this new case design.

Not that any of this bothers me. CFI has never been a feature I've cared about and on the one display I own that has the feature it stays off all of the time. :)

Radio81 07-18-2017 10:11 AM

Bummer about the fan noise. More fan noise = more heat dissipation, which is already somewhat of an issue in my 11’ x 12’ room and HT2050. The noise is not much of an issue as I mostly use the setup for PS4 gaming with headphones, so I don’t really notice the fan noise much. The room will get warm after a couple of hours though.

The black case is a welcomed addition. Thanks for the review.

RLBURNSIDE 07-18-2017 11:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frank714 (Post 54355361)
No pun, but something is missing, IMHO:


Nous regrettons: Pas d'interpolation d'images (No frame interpolation to reduce motion blur and judder) :(


Of the four leading manufacturers of DLP front projectors BenQ obviously remains the only one that doesn't consider FI as an important feature.


Acer (AcuMotion), Optoma (PureMotion) and Vivitek (VividMotion) feature FI (even for their UHD front projectors) but BenQ remains stubborn and withholds this feature.


Wake me up again, once BenQ implements good FI in its front projectors.

1080p projectors don't need FI nearly as badly as UHD ones do, because it's easy to rip 1080p content to your HTPC and do the FI from there.

If I could do this with UHD Blurays I wouldn't pay 500 bucks more for FI. Convenience is good but not when it adds multiple frames of latency (UHD65 vs UHD60 for example) or a lot of $$.

I would definitely rate a 2500:1 native CR way higher than FI on a 1080p DLP, in the list of desirability, for sure.

But the noise on these...ugh. Plus, there are 1080p DLPs coming out with HDR10 support and UHD downscaling (making 2160p 420 video equal 1080p 444, plus compression artifacts are 1/2 of the size, i.e. blended away). 1080p DLP with lasers, WCG, HDR10, HDCP 2.2, laser dimming, low lag, 2500:1 native and way more dynamic, and of course HDMI 2.0 means 1080p120 in 444 (including with HDR). And even 1080p60 frame sequential 3D. Possibly even 1080p72 (for native 144hz). Actually I believe the bandwidth for 1080p144 in 10-bit in 444 is there with HDMI 2.0.

2160p60 = 1080p240 in terms of bandwidth. Take off 20% for 10-bit, you're left with 192hz. So 192hz in HDR10 2D, or 96hz per eye 3D, also in HDR10. All possible with 18gbps at 1080p.

cololo 07-19-2017 09:28 AM

I am thinking between Vivitek H1188 and BenQ W2000+
Did someone make any comparisons between both of them?

Projection-homecinema awarded H1188 with 74% award and W2000+ more than 90%
But at the same way W2000+ still cheaper then H1188, and looks like they are at different class.
Can someone advise which is better? Should I wait W2000+ or buy H1188? (I was planning to buy Vivitek in the middle of the August)

JonasHansen 08-01-2017 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kraine (Post 54311761)

Really impressive numbers!

Am I the only one wondering about the BenQ W11000/Acer V9800 which measures half the native contrast and same brightness?

sage11x 08-01-2017 01:27 PM

BENQ W2000+ : Premium version of the famous W2000
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by JonasHansen (Post 54565856)
Really impressive numbers!



Am I the only one wondering about the BenQ W11000/Acer V9800 which measures half the native contrast and same brightness?



It seems the new 4k DMDs have some inherent limitations in terms of contrast and brightness. This seems to be related to both the size of the mirrors, which are much smaller due to the higher resolution, and the fact that each mirror is responsible for two separate pixels as opposed to the 1:1 you get with a 1080p chip. This also places additional demand on the optics to transfer that contrast and detail to the screen. The irony is newer, smaller, cheaper DMDs require more expensive optics to keep pace with their older, larger, more expensive DMD predecessors. This makes sense as DLPs that use the older .95 DMD are often said to have much higher potential contrast. It's also the rumored reason why TI abandoned their proposed .45 1080p DMD.

Verge2 08-01-2017 01:47 PM

The .95s are much better.

pablovi 02-21-2018 05:45 PM

So, is this projector any good? For the price?

I’m between a Xgimi H1 and this BenQ W2000+.

But I can’t find any reviews, in English. It appears it only sells in Europe. And in my country, Mexico.

It appears that BenQ has different models names in the US than the rest of the world. Can’t find any HT projector on the BenQ page. And those are the popular model names in this forum. HT2050, HT3050, etc.

So, does anyone know how this PJ perform? Has any link to a few English reviews? Or know the equivalent model number for he US market?

Thanks!

roni44 02-21-2018 07:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pablovi (Post 55734392)
So, is this projector any good? For the price?

I’m between a Xgimi H1 and this BenQ W2000+.

But I can’t find any reviews, in English. It appears it only sells in Europe. And in my country, Mexico.

It appears that BenQ has different models names in the US than the rest of the world. Can’t find any HT projector on the BenQ page. And those are the popular model names in this forum. HT2050, HT3050, etc.

So, does anyone know how this PJ perform? Has any link to a few English reviews? Or know the equivalent model number for he US market?

Thanks!

Hi Pablo, W2000 for the US is HT3050, not sure if BenQ will bring W2000+ to the US. I didn't want to say anything in H1 thread, I ended up buying W2000/HT3050 and never look back. While I really want to like H1S and keeping it, however, the color and red saturation just something I can't overlook. If you are after best picture quality for the money, you just can't go wrong with BenQ HT2050/HT3050, XGimi just not there yet, however, I do miss instant on and off, built in media player and the size.


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