Epson Home Cinema LS100 UST HD Laser Projector at CEDIA 2017 - Page 4 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #91 of 233 Old 09-14-2017, 10:08 AM
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Originally Posted by AV_Integrated View Post
There is no indication in their datasheet that this projector has lens shift at all, and while it does claim some zoom range, it then goes on to say 'DIGITAL' for zoom, which is not what any of us want to employ.

This is, by everything I can tell, just another 16:10 UST projector, but using a solid state light source instead of a lamp.

https://www.epson.eu/products/projec...inema/eh-ls100

It may be optimized for home theater use, but I think it is more likely that it is designed to go with a ALR screen in the family room.

Waiting on reviews to see how it stacks up against their 3100/3700/5040. At a higher price than the 5040, it better perform very well.
I'm beginning to see what you're saying.

Only 3 color modes (Dynamic, Bright Cinema, and Cinema) -edit: under 'advanced controls' there's also a Game mode

AND an operational noise of 39db (high/OUCH) and 30db (low)??


The contrast ratio (inflated of course) is what had me the most intrigued, seemingly representing a decent native contrast.

BUT, being laser illuminated, they could just be using a number that represents black being full black in which the lasers are usually just switched off.

If that's the case, that says nothing about true and/or native contrast.

Throw a mostly black screen with some visual content, like credits or something, and the light source has to be back on. That's when we'll see the true contrast.

Going by the pdf specsheet, it's looking pretty average. I want to like it though. Time will tell.
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Last edited by cbaseuser; 09-14-2017 at 10:22 AM.
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post #92 of 233 Old 10-19-2017, 10:57 AM
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Projector Central review is up:

http://www.projectorcentral.com/Epso...tor-review.htm
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post #93 of 233 Old 10-19-2017, 03:40 PM
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cool, reading it now! thanks
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post #94 of 233 Old 10-19-2017, 07:10 PM
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That's just the review I was hoping for. Input lag was my main concern. While it's not hitting sub-20ms like many LED TVs are these days, 30ms is still pretty fast. I just wish Projector Central would post images along with their reviews but at least they tested it with a UST screen this time.

Viewsonic PX800HD | 100” Snowhite UST Screen | Pioneer Elite LX-503 | HDFury Diva | 7.2.4 Surround | Sony Core Series LCR + Atmos | Cambridge Min 12 Side Surrounds | Monoprice Rear Atmos Surrounds | Bic V1020 x2
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post #95 of 233 Old 10-19-2017, 07:32 PM
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I'm pretty disappointed by the brightness uniformity, but at least it sounds like the image quality is pretty good. Hopefully someone will post a review with pictures and/or video so we can see how bad the uniformity really is.
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post #96 of 233 Old 10-19-2017, 09:03 PM
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I'm pretty disappointed by the brightness uniformity, but at least it sounds like the image quality is pretty good. Hopefully someone will post a review with pictures and/or video so we can see how bad the uniformity really is.
Yes, this disappointing, but apparently it goes with the UST territory. I'm more than willing to try this projector, but it begs the question of why they just can't put a laser light engine in a 5040?

A UST projector is intriguing, but if the uniformity is a side effect of the technology (UST), that's not very cool.

I've said it before, as they did in the article...this offering is unique, in that it's laser light based, LCD and not DLP, and it's bright and pretty much geared towards home theater. If brightness uniformity is it's 'only' shortcoming, why can't they just put a laser in a standard projector with decent specs, and not have it cost a fortune?????????
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post #97 of 233 Old 10-20-2017, 02:50 AM
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Sounds exactly like the projector I wanted to have 5 years ago Will probably buy it anyway while waiting for a similar offering that can do 4K UHD.

Markus

"In science, contrary evidence causes one to question a theory. In religion, contrary evidence causes one to question the evidence." - Floyd Toole
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post #98 of 233 Old 10-20-2017, 03:46 PM
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10 Bit Color Movie Content Playable?

The published specs for this projector include 10 bit color. Is there any 10 bit movie content that can be displayed on this projector?

Specifically, will a 4K player be able to process 4K HDR-10 Blu Ray content, rescale to 1080P while preserving the 10 bit color output to this projector? If so, it would seem that at least some of the benefits of HDR would be available for this projector. Otherwise, it would seem that 10 Bit Color processing would be a waste for movies as there is no 10 Bit movie content that is available for this projector that can be played through a 1080P non-HDR input.

Please let me know your thoughts. Thanks to all!
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post #99 of 233 Old 10-23-2017, 07:34 AM
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Originally Posted by cbaseuser View Post
Yes, this disappointing, but apparently it goes with the UST territory. I'm more than willing to try this projector, but it begs the question of why they just can't put a laser light engine in a 5040?

A UST projector is intriguing, but if the uniformity is a side effect of the technology (UST), that's not very cool.

I've said it before, as they did in the article...this offering is unique, in that it's laser light based, LCD and not DLP, and it's bright and pretty much geared towards home theater. If brightness uniformity is it's 'only' shortcoming, why can't they just put a laser in a standard projector with decent specs, and not have it cost a fortune?????????
The bolded is what I've been thinking since the announcement of this projector.

Just put this laser source in the 5040 and change the chip to 18Gbps and boom, perfect projector for me.

Since I'm starting to project my next (and evolved) home theator room, and want to go with a huge screen (200" - 250"), those 4000 lumens would be so welcome to my needs.

Do it Epson. My wallet is waiting your move.
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post #100 of 233 Old 11-02-2017, 01:52 PM
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Well it’s November and I don’t see this on Amazon yet. Anyone have a good date on when we can expect these?

Stop Dfast DVI, and all that ****
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post #101 of 233 Old 11-02-2017, 01:55 PM
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Well it’s November and I don’t see this on Amazon yet. Anyone have a good date on when we can expect these?
It's only November 2nd. The Projector Central review said "... it will be available on Amazon in early November". So probably in the next 1-2 weeks.
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post #102 of 233 Old 11-02-2017, 09:42 PM
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It’s now on Amazon, only one left now delivery scheduled for the eighth
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post #103 of 233 Old 11-03-2017, 08:09 AM
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Amazon is sold out but projector people has them in stock, they are not on the website just chat with them or call.
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post #104 of 233 Old 11-03-2017, 01:26 PM
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It’s now on Amazon, only one left now delivery scheduled for the eighth
Very interested in hearing your impressions! Also want to hear your take on the brightness uniformity (as well as what kind of screen you're using)
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post #105 of 233 Old 11-03-2017, 02:54 PM
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Originally Posted by cbaseuser View Post
Very interested in hearing your impressions! Also want to hear your take on the brightness uniformity (as well as what kind of screen you're using)


I’m a noob at this, so I’ll probably just love it. However, I saw the 63% uniformity number so I’ll keep an eye out. Screen will be the wall for a few weeks.

Stop Dfast DVI, and all that ****
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post #106 of 233 Old 11-03-2017, 05:41 PM
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I’m a noob at this, so I’ll probably just love it. However, I saw the 63% uniformity number so I’ll keep an eye out. Screen will be the wall for a few weeks.
cool

Even projected on a wall, you can probably still discern brightness uniformity...just throw an all white frame or image, and see what's happening at the corners.

I realize test patterns are one thing, while real video/images/movies are another, but it would be nice to know if it's obtrusive or distracting with live video.

cheers!
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post #107 of 233 Old 11-04-2017, 12:39 PM
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Also, I haven't seen any info on digital panel alignment (I know digital 'fixes' to physical problems are usually frowned upon-especially keystoning, but I think most people accept digital panel alignment with aplomb) ..I hope this projector is not completely crippled with a lack of CMS, white balance, convergence help, etc.....
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post #108 of 233 Old 11-06-2017, 10:03 AM
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Epson LS100 Now Available

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Wilkinson View Post
The Epson Home Cinema LS100 brings the cost of ultra short-throw, laser-illuminated projection down to earth.

https://www.avsforum.com/epson-home-c...or-cedia-2017/
I just discovered the Epson Home Cinema LS100 is available on Amazon. Best Buy did not have them as of Saturday, but probably will soon.

Projector Review already posted a review. I hope more reviews appear soon.
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post #109 of 233 Old 11-06-2017, 10:06 AM
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Correction: Projector Central already posted a review.
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post #110 of 233 Old 11-09-2017, 04:30 PM
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I️ just made a couple of really terrible videos, I’ll put some movies on the wall tomorrow.
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post #111 of 233 Old 11-10-2017, 07:55 AM
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Quote:
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I️ just made a couple of really terrible videos, I’ll put some movies on the wall tomorrow.
https://youtu.be/7uFTa2NPN2Q
https://youtu.be/HpsrQ8mR2j4
Thanks for your message and videos. I received the Epson Home Cinema LS100 yesterday evening. I quickly had it running and was able to watch the NFL game last night.

I am projecting an image size of 125" diagonal with an aspect ratio of 16:9 onto a screen from Elite Screens that is for use with USTs. It only cost a few hundred dollars or so and is not one of the special UST screens that can cost more than a projector.

I am lucky in that my center channel speaker fits partially under the screen and the rest of the speaker just barely fits horizontally between the projector and screen. The bottom of the speaker is at the top of the projector, so the sound is not blocked. Also, the speaker is located just below the path of the image as it moves from the projector to the screen. I had been worried about where I could place this speaker and am glad how things worked out. I will be doing some fine tuning with the focus today.

The picture is not as good as that of my Panasonic plasma TV. However, watching a large 125" image more than offsets this for me. I have not gone to a movie theater in many years and forgot how much impact a large screen has. I watched a movie that I am familiar with on the plasma and was surprised at how much more was visible in it at 125". I saw many details I had never noticed before. The experience was much better than I expected and I was drawn into the movie so much more than on my plasma TV. I am not sure if a similar experience would also be true for others, but I have no buyers remorse and am now very glad that I purchased the LS100. I will still be using my plasma TV - kind of like having different tools to choose from. Each has its own strengths and weaknesses.

I have recently read about the new 80" line of OLED panels from LG that are scheduled to start shipping in 2019, with rollable OLED panels planned for 2020. I may upgrade from my Panasonic plasma TV at that time, but I am glad to have the LS100 while I wait.

I plan to use both my projector and plasma TV, depending on what I am viewing. In the future I would consider an instant upgrade to a revised model of this projector if it had 4k (or 8k), UHD and other new features. Even without these features, the LS100 is worth it to me for now. Gaining the new features would make the use of it even better. Ideally, at some point I will be able to purchase an OLED TV with a screen as large as the image from my projector. Then I would have the best of both.
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post #112 of 233 Old 11-10-2017, 08:18 AM
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Thanks for your message and videos. I received the Epson Home Cinema LS100 yesterday evening. I quickly had it running and was able to watch the NFL game last night.
Can you post a few pics of your setup?

Epson 3700 | 106" EluneVision Screen | Paradigm Cinema 100 CT cinema speakers | Yamaha RX-V681 receiver
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post #113 of 233 Old 11-10-2017, 08:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Aja View Post

I have recently read about the new 80" line of OLED panels from LG that are scheduled to start shipping in 2019, with rollable OLED panels planned for 2020. I may upgrade from my Panasonic plasma TV at that time, but I am glad to have the LS100 while I wait.
What is an 80" OLED going to cost????
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post #114 of 233 Old 11-10-2017, 08:43 AM
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Thanks for your message and videos. I received the Epson Home Cinema LS100 yesterday evening. I quickly had it running and was able to watch the NFL game last night.

I am projecting an image size of 125" diagonal with an aspect ratio of 16:9 onto a screen from Elite Screens that is for use with USTs. It only cost a few hundred dollars or so and is not one of the special UST screens that can cost more than a projector.

I am lucky in that my center channel speaker fits partially under the screen and the rest of the speaker just barely fits horizontally between the projector and screen. The bottom of the speaker is at the top of the projector, so the sound is not blocked. Also, the speaker is located just below the path of the image as it moves from the projector to the screen. I had been worried about where I could place this speaker and am glad how things worked out. I will be doing some fine tuning with the focus today.

The picture is not as good as that of my Panasonic plasma TV. However, watching a large 125" image more than offsets this for me. I have not gone to a movie theater in many years and forgot how much impact a large screen has. I watched a movie that I am familiar with on the plasma and was surprised at how much more was visible in it at 125". I saw many details I had never noticed before. The experience was much better than I expected and I was drawn into the movie so much more than on my plasma TV. I am not sure if a similar experience would also be true for others, but I have no buyers remorse and am now very glad that I purchased the LS100. I will still be using my plasma TV - kind of like having different tools to choose from. Each has its own strengths and weaknesses.

I have recently read about the new 80" line of OLED panels from LG that are scheduled to start shipping in 2019, with rollable OLED panels planned for 2020. I may upgrade from my Panasonic plasma TV at that time, but I am glad to have the LS100 while I wait.

I plan to use both my projector and plasma TV, depending on what I am viewing. In the future I would consider an instant upgrade to a revised model of this projector if it had 4k (or 8k), UHD and other new features. Even without these features, the LS100 is worth it to me for now. Gaining the new features would make the use of it even better. Ideally, at some point I will be able to purchase an OLED TV with a screen as large as the image from my projector. Then I would have the best of both.
I only have a couple of questions...

- Is your screen 'white', or a negative gain/grey type? (you mentioned a screen that is for use with UST's..does that mean specifically designed for them, or just compatible with them?) Any perfectly flat screen can be a candidate for UST, just curious if it's specially developed further.
- During night time viewing, are the black levels decent, or grayish?
- Also, do you see any noticeable problems with brightness dropping off around the corners?

thanks!

p.s. would love to hear any additional impressions you have in general about the projector (brightness, colors, noise/fan level, etc..)


Congrats on the new projector btw!!

Last edited by cbaseuser; 11-10-2017 at 08:50 AM.
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post #115 of 233 Old 11-10-2017, 09:16 AM
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What is an 80" OLED going to cost????
Pricing was not mentioned. I have no idea where the pricing will start. I suspect high initially, then dropping, but I have no idea how high.
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post #116 of 233 Old 11-10-2017, 10:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cbaseuser View Post
I only have a couple of questions...

- Is your screen 'white', or a negative gain/grey type? (you mentioned a screen that is for use with UST's..does that mean specifically designed for them, or just compatible with them?) Any perfectly flat screen can be a candidate for UST, just curious if it's specially developed further.
- During night time viewing, are the black levels decent, or grayish?
- Also, do you see any noticeable problems with brightness dropping off around the corners?

thanks!

p.s. would love to hear any additional impressions you have in general about the projector (brightness, colors, noise/fan level, etc..)


Congrats on the new projector btw!!
I am using a CineWhite material screen from Elite Screens. I am not sure if CineWhite is compatible with or designed for USTs. The literature states that USTs are supported for Cinewhite. I suspect it is compatible. Please see the following URL for the details on the CineWhite screen: https://elitescreens.com/front/front...il/product/287

My screen is perfectly flat (Stretched around an aluminum frame). I read that that is critical for projector screens.

At night I think it was a bit grayish. It was not pure black like OLED. I prefer the pure blacks of OLED, but find a bit grayish to be an acceptable compromise considering the large 125" image size. The image is viewable when I have the ceiling lights on, and even better when I turn them of. Note that I am not using the same degree of judgement that some enthusiasts use. This project has its compromises, but I find them acceptable and am glad that I purchased it. In the future if a better model were offered I would like to upgrade in order to improve this, but for now am quite accepting of this compromise. During the day the image is easy to watch with the blinds closed. I just opened the blinds to the side of the screen and there is no impact on screen image. However, when the sun starts to directly shine through the windows, any direct light from the sun onto the screen causes problems. It still may be watchable, but the image degrades depending on how much direct sunlight reaches it. I believe the special UST screens that cost thousands help reduce this problem. I will instead simply use my blinds. They are electric and I can easily close them remotely as I wish.

I find the image to be plenty bright. I suspect it is in some form of vivid mode. I need to try with the various modes. I was so blown away by the large picture that I stopped my setup and simply enjoyed watching for a bit.

The colors are bright and real to my eyes. Such a statement is subjective as opposed to empirical, so I repeat - it is important to view one of these in person. Only when I have too much direct light does the image/color start to change. Depending on the amount, intensity, and direction of light, change may be gradual or sudden. Sunlight on the screen is quite sudden and washes out the image. Based on my limited use so far, this projector can be used during the day a long as the sun does not shine directly on the screen. Shutting off lights in the room may also help, depending on the circumstances.

I hope that I have addressed all of your questions.

I just took a look and do not see any brightness drop-off around the corners, not even slightly.

It is important to make an informed decision. With a projector such as this I strongly suggest that you view it in person to be sure you are aware of what the projector output looks like. It is not perfect, but I found the compromises to be acceptable. I liked being able to quickly set up the projector close to the screen, I like the idea of the lasers, I like how bright the image/colors are, I am blown away by the large image size, etc. Best Buy is supposed to be selling these through their in-house Magnolia shop. My local Magnolia salesman said that the Best Buy warehouse servicing his store was scheduled to get these in a few more weeks.

I am slowly working my way through the setup/menu as I watch it. For now it is very bright. I need to go to the menu and check which mode it is using, then try the other modes. The fan is supposed to blow harder and make more noise in bright modes and I can hear it somewhat when there is no sound. This fan noise is not objectionably loud for me and I believe the noise lowers if I were to choose a less bright mode. However, I do not even notice the fan noise at all with the sound on. I am using a 5.1 home theater speaker setup.
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post #117 of 233 Old 11-10-2017, 03:09 PM
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... Projector Review already posted a review. I hope more reviews appear soon.
Quote:
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Correction: Projector Central already posted a review.
Your first prediction just came true as Projector Reviews has also posted an LS100 review:

projectorreviews.com/epson/epson-home-cinema-ls100-laser-projector-review/
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post #118 of 233 Old 11-10-2017, 03:25 PM
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I am using a CineWhite material screen from Elite Screens. I am not sure if CineWhite is compatible with or designed for USTs. The literature states that USTs are supported for Cinewhite. I suspect it is compatible. Please see the following URL for the details on the CineWhite screen: https://elitescreens.com/front/front...il/product/287

My screen is perfectly flat (Stretched around an aluminum frame). I read that that is critical for projector screens.

At night I think it was a bit grayish. It was not pure black like OLED. I prefer the pure blacks of OLED, but find a bit grayish to be an acceptable compromise considering the large 125" image size. The image is viewable when I have the ceiling lights on, and even better when I turn them of. Note that I am not using the same degree of judgement that some enthusiasts use. This project has its compromises, but I find them acceptable and am glad that I purchased it. In the future if a better model were offered I would like to upgrade in order to improve this, but for now am quite accepting of this compromise. During the day the image is easy to watch with the blinds closed. I just opened the blinds to the side of the screen and there is no impact on screen image. However, when the sun starts to directly shine through the windows, any direct light from the sun onto the screen causes problems. It still may be watchable, but the image degrades depending on how much direct sunlight reaches it. I believe the special UST screens that cost thousands help reduce this problem. I will instead simply use my blinds. They are electric and I can easily close them remotely as I wish.

I find the image to be plenty bright. I suspect it is in some form of vivid mode. I need to try with the various modes. I was so blown away by the large picture that I stopped my setup and simply enjoyed watching for a bit.

The colors are bright and real to my eyes. Such a statement is subjective as opposed to empirical, so I repeat - it is important to view one of these in person. Only when I have too much direct light does the image/color start to change. Depending on the amount, intensity, and direction of light, change may be gradual or sudden. Sunlight on the screen is quite sudden and washes out the image. Based on my limited use so far, this projector can be used during the day a long as the sun does not shine directly on the screen. Shutting off lights in the room may also help, depending on the circumstances.

I hope that I have addressed all of your questions.

I just took a look and do not see any brightness drop-off around the corners, not even slightly.

It is important to make an informed decision. With a projector such as this I strongly suggest that you view it in person to be sure you are aware of what the projector output looks like. It is not perfect, but I found the compromises to be acceptable. I liked being able to quickly set up the projector close to the screen, I like the idea of the lasers, I like how bright the image/colors are, I am blown away by the large image size, etc. Best Buy is supposed to be selling these through their in-house Magnolia shop. My local Magnolia salesman said that the Best Buy warehouse servicing his store was scheduled to get these in a few more weeks.

I am slowly working my way through the setup/menu as I watch it. For now it is very bright. I need to go to the menu and check which mode it is using, then try the other modes. The fan is supposed to blow harder and make more noise in bright modes and I can hear it somewhat when there is no sound. This fan noise is not objectionably loud for me and I believe the noise lowers if I were to choose a less bright mode. However, I do not even notice the fan noise at all with the sound on. I am using a 5.1 home theater speaker setup.
Thanks Aja for your detailed initial impressions

It sounds like all of the compromises you are seeing would still be there with a 'normal' / non-UST projector involving light pollution. I think if I get this projector it will mostly be for night time viewing in a 'cinema mode', where I don't need a ton of lumens and the brightness will hopefully be enough without sacrificing black level quality.
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post #119 of 233 Old 11-10-2017, 03:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Dave in Green View Post
Your first prediction just came true as Projector Reviews has also posted an LS100 review:



projectorreviews.com/epson/epson-home-cinema-ls100-laser-projector-review/


Thanks for the link

Stop Dfast DVI, and all that ****
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post #120 of 233 Old 11-10-2017, 04:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Dave in Green View Post
Your first prediction just came true as Projector Reviews has also posted an LS100 review:

projectorreviews.com/epson/epson-home-cinema-ls100-laser-projector-review/
Thanks for the link to the review. It was quite interesting to read and matched my experience so far.
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