Epson Home Cinema LS100 UST HD Laser Projector at CEDIA 2017 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 233 Old 09-06-2017, 01:04 AM - Thread Starter
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Epson Home Cinema LS100 UST HD Laser Projector at CEDIA 2017

The Epson Home Cinema LS100 brings the cost of ultra short-throw, laser-illuminated projection down to earth.

https://www.avsforum.com/epson-home-c...or-cedia-2017/
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post #2 of 233 Old 09-06-2017, 01:49 AM
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@kraine saw this at IFA and posted his thoughts in the PJHC forum. It was paired with an Elite UST screen and he seemed really impressed by its performance. I was curious whether it would make its way to the states as a lot of UST models available overseas never get released here.

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post #3 of 233 Old 09-06-2017, 03:25 AM
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Is this projector 16:9 0r 16:10?
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post #4 of 233 Old 09-06-2017, 05:02 AM
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Can it do 3D?
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post #5 of 233 Old 09-06-2017, 05:47 AM
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I have wanted a projector for so long, and these UST are exactly what I need (WAF)!
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post #6 of 233 Old 09-06-2017, 06:03 AM
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Are UST laser projectors cheaper to make than traditional throw length laser projectors?
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post #7 of 233 Old 09-06-2017, 06:08 AM
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Do laser projectors have a closed light path compared to Epson's lamp fp?
I like Epson but dust blobs have made them a no go for me.
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post #8 of 233 Old 09-06-2017, 06:10 AM
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That's great but it's not 4K! 4K has been around for 4+ years....no excuse to release anything new with this resolution....
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post #9 of 233 Old 09-06-2017, 06:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Wilkinson View Post
The Epson Home Cinema LS100 brings the cost of ultra short-throw, laser-illuminated projection down to earth.

https://www.avsforum.com/epson-home-c...or-cedia-2017/
Scott,

I think it's great to see more UST projectors hitting the market, and a lower price range too. Sure, it would be great if it supported 4K and HDR but the industry still sees the sweet spot as 1080p. For the person who wants >100" these UST projectors are a great value. Heck, I bet if you used this in a light controlled room...you could push the image to 150". Let us know if you get a chance to see it on display.

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post #10 of 233 Old 09-06-2017, 06:57 AM
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It's got my interest
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post #11 of 233 Old 09-06-2017, 07:48 AM
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Looks great - I hope I get a chance to try it out! It is too bad about the HDR and 4K, but I don't really consider those an absolute necessity (most of the time).
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post #12 of 233 Old 09-06-2017, 08:13 AM
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So it's 4,000 lumens. Closer to the screen. Why one earth would one be "limited" to 120"???

If anything- given the lumens and closer range, couldn't you go significantly larger than a "typical" 2K lumen, long-throw unit?

Maybe they're going all in on the typically BRIGHT living room and saying one will really not be losing much at 120" vs a typical display?

I have a moderately controlled lower level and my Sony 45ES does a great job on a 150" at 14' with a lowly 1800 lumens...

And sorry, even with the short-throw and laser...a $3,000 1080 PJ in 2018 really doesn't excite me too much. Lamps seem to be coming down fast (both of my existing Epson's are under $100) so it's really no that much of a game changer to switch out a $70 lamp every 2-3 years. Although this is good option for the "set it and forget it" crowd.

We (basically anyway, given the typical screen sizes and viewing distances of LCD/LED flat panel displays) have the ONE video display tech that can actually BENEFIT from 4K and it just cannot seem to happen (for us mere-mortals, anyway) after nearly a half-decade, lmao.

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post #13 of 233 Old 09-06-2017, 08:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Supermans View Post
Can it do 3D?
My sentiment exactly. It should, however active glasses are trash.
So there is that.
I think I might pick one up for gaming and keep my OLED for 3D.

OLED is a game changer.
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post #14 of 233 Old 09-06-2017, 08:58 AM
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If your screen was away from the wall a bit, can you put a UST projector behind the screen and flip the image for a rear projection UST?

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post #15 of 233 Old 09-06-2017, 09:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevrock17 View Post
That's great but it's not 4K! 4K has been around for 4+ years....no excuse to release anything new with this resolution....
The optics for a UST to display 4k in a uniform manner are very expensive, and would move this waaaay out of the under 3000 forum.

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post #16 of 233 Old 09-06-2017, 10:08 AM
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Grrr still waiting for just a normal Short Throw 4k UHD projector, I mean 1080p is already so saturated with both short and ultra, I just dont see the point to adding another option... we need more focus on working on standard for HDR in projectors and making short throw options, there are a few UST for like $15-30k but yeah no thanks... we need 4k UHD short throw options for under $3k would be nice.

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post #17 of 233 Old 09-06-2017, 11:21 AM
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For 120" what is the throw distance going to be approximately? Do we think this will have a horizontal flip so you could place it behind a screen and in-front of a baffle wall?
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post #18 of 233 Old 09-06-2017, 11:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yuppiemike View Post
For 120" what is the throw distance going to be approximately? Do we think this will have a horizontal flip so you could place it behind a screen and in-front of a baffle wall?
You can find the video I made at IFA on the Epson booth about this LS100 here

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post #19 of 233 Old 09-06-2017, 11:51 AM
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Scott, Did Epson happen to mention if there were going to be any changes to the LS10500 this year?

It seems like this projector could use a few updates like slightly brighter laser, full 18 Gbps HDMI, and improvements to e-shift that would help it's sales numbers.
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post #20 of 233 Old 09-06-2017, 11:54 AM
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Sigh...was really hoping for a Home Cinema line update.

Might consider this thing if it had:
Faux-K
HDR support
low input lag
18 gbps HMDI chipset

Otherwise....meh....
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post #21 of 233 Old 09-06-2017, 12:19 PM
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I love the idea of the UST projectors. Like I've said in other threads, I think that I would love to flush mount one of these types of projectors into the ceiling, being almost completely hidden and not taking up the space for the center speaker.

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post #22 of 233 Old 09-06-2017, 12:29 PM
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post #23 of 233 Old 09-06-2017, 12:51 PM
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I feel like every piece of projector news I read these days is a few moments of elation followed by profound disappointment.
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post #24 of 233 Old 09-06-2017, 12:54 PM
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Some answers (from Projector Central and my own knowledge)...

No 3D support. Only 2D.

It WILL support 4K inputs. Not sure if that includes higher color space as well, but I'm expecting it does. So, you will start with higher image quality and color depth and it may get bumped down, but it still should be a very solid image for the money.

Typically UST lenses aren't capable of going beyond a certain size due to the actual demands of UST. The mirror bounce, combined with very wide optics loses focus beyond a certain size. This is unfortunate for those wanting UST and a screen over 120" in diagonal, but it is just a common fact in the industry. If this model delivered 2,500 real world lumens that would be plenty for a screen size of over 200" diagonal with 18 lumens per square foot. That would be pretty amazing pool side after dark!

UST ALR screens will run you $1,000+, so add that into the $3,000 that the projector will run you if you are using it in your bright family room. Still, a fair bit less than the 90" NEC LCD screen at over $6,000.

UST projectors vs. standard projectors don't really have any cost benefits. The lens setup used to be fairly pricey and now has dropped to similar pricing as standard lenses, so I would expect a standard throw laser model to be available as well... Maybe. The bigger issue is that Epson has almost made the need for the laser projector to be completely irrelevant. With $80 replacement lamps and 3,000+ hour lamp life you get 6 replacement lamps for $500 and you are well under the cost of a laser light engine.

I'm not even sure why they went laser here, except to say that they could do it. I think Epson is going to really be blowing the doors of some others with their newest models shortly. A 4,000 lumen laser projector that delivers on brightness with 1080p or WUXGA resolution? Yep! That'll sell.
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post #25 of 233 Old 09-06-2017, 02:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jetsen View Post
You can find the video I made at IFA on the Epson booth about this LS100 here

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zt4N-YuLhUQ
That video didn't contain literally one piece of information, let alone what the quoted OP was asking.
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post #26 of 233 Old 09-06-2017, 02:55 PM - Thread Starter
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I just confirmed that the LS100 does accept 4K signals, but it does not offer 3D. I added that to the article.
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post #27 of 233 Old 09-06-2017, 02:56 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GregCh View Post
Scott, Did Epson happen to mention if there were going to be any changes to the LS10500 this year?

It seems like this projector could use a few updates like slightly brighter laser, full 18 Gbps HDMI, and improvements to e-shift that would help it's sales numbers.
No mention of that yet. I'll ask them when I go to the booth tomorrow.
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post #28 of 233 Old 09-06-2017, 04:20 PM
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Not sure what all the hate is for. I've been waiting for Epson to release a laser based LCD projector for a long time.

No 4K..don't have it, don't care. No HDR..well, we've lived with REC 709 high def color for many years, and it can still be beautiful.

No 3D? Some of us (well, maybe a lot of us don't care. sorry.)

The main point..laser based (or any other illumination technology) UST projectors have existed. Most, (or all?..please correct me if I'm wrong) have been DLP based. Rainbow city.

This could be a great quality, rainbow free solution with a very long 'lamp' life, minimal color/white balance shifting over a generous amount of time.

I'm personally very happy about this particular announcement. A lot of people will be like 'been there, done that', but this particular combination seems unique to me. Especially for the price.

done. thanks
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post #29 of 233 Old 09-06-2017, 04:28 PM
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Can this be ceiling mounted to keep the shelf space?

If so, I may get it and sell my current 5040 hanging above my head.

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post #30 of 233 Old 09-06-2017, 04:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AV_Integrated View Post
Some answers (from Projector Central and my own knowledge)...

The bigger issue is that Epson has almost made the need for the laser projector to be completely irrelevant. With $80 replacement lamps and 3,000+ hour lamp life you get 6 replacement lamps for $500 and you are well under the cost of a laser light engine.

I'm not even sure why they went laser here, except to say that they could do it. I think Epson is going to really be blowing the doors of some others with their newest models shortly. A 4,000 lumen laser projector that delivers on brightness with 1080p or WUXGA resolution? Yep! That'll sell.
I think there's a misconception of lamp cost vs. performance. Math wise, yes..you can add up the cost of a number of lamps vs an upfront cost of a device. My personal experience with lamps is that I hate them. I've owned an Epson 6500UB for about 6 years, and have bought about 6 or 7 lamps throughout the years.

When a lamp is rated "4000 hours", people think wow, I only have to buy a lamp every 3 years. Plenty of lamps don't even last as they're rated, and on top of that the life span is how long it lasts to half brightness. Depressing.

But when you put that fresh new lamp in (a wonderful feeling indeed), after a month it's starts to go south pretty quickly. No other display tech (LCD, Plasma, CRT, etc.) has that particular issue. That's why I'm excited about the laser aspect in general. I've never owned a laser powered display device, but everything I've read indicates its dimming is negligible for a very long time.

To me, that aspect alone fixes 90% of my personal problems with projectors.
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