Frame Interpolation and the Soap Opera effect - Page 3 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
Forum Jump: 
 40Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #61 of 104 Old 11-08-2018, 03:45 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
bud16415's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Erie Pa
Posts: 7,832
Mentioned: 115 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2135 Post(s)
Liked: 1075
I used to use the terms film like and plasma like but I think I will switch to film like and HDR like. This soap opera like doesn’t appeal to me for some reason.

Frame rate may play a part of it but it’s more than just that because I can enjoy film like at greater frame rates.

The posts above about the entire annoying things involved going to a movie theater today are all correct. I think that needs a term also I will call that Cineplex like.

Bud
bud16415 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #62 of 104 Old 11-08-2018, 04:23 PM
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Posts: 868
Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 519 Post(s)
Liked: 293
Quote:
Originally Posted by brazen1 View Post
Imo, using native 60hz displays, SOE and FI only contribute to a worse looking picture but with native 120Hz and those capable of higher such as 240Hz, SOE and FI open a whole new window.
I do kind of agree with this, MEMC does look significantly better to me on my 144hz Gsync monitor than my 60hz DLP.

That's one of the things pulling me towards upgrading to a native 1080p 120hz DLP, but I'm holding out for one with good enough contrast so that I don't feel like I'm paying to downgrade.
BattleAxeVR is offline  
post #63 of 104 Old 11-08-2018, 08:16 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
rekbones's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Somers, CT
Posts: 3,173
Mentioned: 69 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1057 Post(s)
Liked: 547
I love FI and colorized B/W films. I guess I am not a very artistic person and want my movies to be as close to reality (or fantasy) as possible. I hate anything in the camera work that brings me out of the movie. Shaky cam, super closeups, muted colors, film grain all are just distractions to me. Boxed wine is just fine for me maybe why I am a raving alcoholic, been in recovery for many years by the way. In the upcoming zombie apocalypse would your rather have the Mona Lisa painting or a tanker of gasoline.

"Smart enough to know better, to old to care" ------ Dedicated Bat Cave Home Theater, JVC RS49U/Mitsubishi HC7900DW Projector, 110" 16:9 Jamestown screen with variable power masking for CIW 2.50:1 to 16:9, Marantz 7009 with 7.1.4 Atmos with Ohm mains,3 DIY Subs (2 15" (1 ported, 1 sealed and a 12" 4th order bandpass), 1 DIY butt kicker, Custom Built HTPC, 18TB DroboFS NAS
rekbones is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #64 of 104 Old 11-10-2018, 08:23 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
MagnumX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Midwest USA
Posts: 1,987
Mentioned: 39 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1147 Post(s)
Liked: 667
I don't mind colorized as long as the original is available. The way some elitist blowhards had a fit (calling on Congress to stop it even if I recall correctly?) when Ted Turner was colorizing classics like The Maltese Falcon was ridiculous. I thought it looked pretty fake back then, but I imagine they could do a much more realistic job today. I'd watch it at least some once. It'd definitely have a different feel. All but 4 of 73 Bogey movies (true roles not those ones listed on Wikipedia where his footage was deleted or he had a 10 second cameo as himself or it wasn't an actual movie, just dance footage or some crap) were in black and white do there's plenty of material with Bogart alone.

Many of these films from that era weren't in black and white because the director didn't like or want color, but because Technicolor at the time only rented cameras, used 3x the film and sent their own person to consult who notoriously interfered and oversaturated the films so it didn't look very realistic. It was also a delicate and very expensive setup (again using three separate rolls of film and an expensive film dye process) and needed tons of light control which meant mostly indoor shoots with very hot lighting early on. This limited scope and director control and drove up prices beyond many budgets' capacity (patents kept prices high and competition non-existent for some time). Lower budget and action movies tended to be in black and white until a competitor developed single high quality film emulsion (Eastman Kodak) in 1950 that simplified the camera setups, allowed plenty of light and brought competition. Technicolor cameras didn't last much longer and most movies were in color by the mid 1960s.

So the question if director "intent" isn't really what some make it out to be. In my opinion, it's a straw man argument used more to give credence to one's "elitist" opinion than any true valid argument.

There's also more people involved in filmmaking than just the director, especially these days where credit lists can run into the thousands, but apparently only one person gets to have an opinion..........

Click THEATER (Updated: Oct-19-2019) for pics: Epson 3100 3D Projector, DaLite 92" screen, 11.1.6 (Marantz SR7012 + Yamaha HTR-5960 + Onkyo ESPro) - Dialog Lift - PSB T45/B15/S50/X1T/CS500 Speakers & Def Tech PF-1500 15" sub; 2nd Room (Updated Apr-22-2019): 48" Plasma TV, Carver AL-III, Carver C-5 Pre-Amp, Technics SH-AC500D, Dual Carver TFM-35x Amps (Active Bi-Amp), Klipsch Surrounds ; Sources: PS4, LG UP875 UHD, Nvidia Shield (KODI), ATV4K, Zidoo X9S, LD, GameCube : Props (Updated 10-13-19)
MagnumX is online now  
post #65 of 104 Old 11-10-2018, 03:21 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
bud16415's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Erie Pa
Posts: 7,832
Mentioned: 115 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2135 Post(s)
Liked: 1075
Quote:
Originally Posted by MagnumX View Post
I don't mind colorized as long as the original is available. The way some elitist blowhards had a fit (calling on Congress to stop it even if I recall correctly?) when Ted Turner was colorizing classics like The Maltese Falcon was ridiculous. I thought it looked pretty fake back then, but I imagine they could do a much more realistic job today. I'd watch it at least some once. It'd definitely have a different feel. All but 4 of 73 Bogey movies (true roles not those ones listed on Wikipedia where his footage was deleted or he had a 10 second cameo as himself or it wasn't an actual movie, just dance footage or some crap) were in black and white do there's plenty of material with Bogart alone.

Many of these films from that era weren't in black and white because the director didn't like or want color, but because Technicolor at the time only rented cameras, used 3x the film and sent their own person to consult who notoriously interfered and oversaturated the films so it didn't look very realistic. It was also a delicate and very expensive setup (again using three separate rolls of film and an expensive film dye process) and needed tons of light control which meant mostly indoor shoots with very hot lighting early on. This limited scope and director control and drove up prices beyond many budgets' capacity (patents kept prices high and competition non-existent for some time). Lower budget and action movies tended to be in black and white until a competitor developed single high quality film emulsion (Eastman Kodak) in 1950 that simplified the camera setups, allowed plenty of light and brought competition. Technicolor cameras didn't last much longer and most movies were in color by the mid 1960s.

So the question if director "intent" isn't really what some make it out to be. In my opinion, it's a straw man argument used more to give credence to one's "elitist" opinion than any true valid argument.

There's also more people involved in filmmaking than just the director, especially these days where credit lists can run into the thousands, but apparently only one person gets to have an opinion..........
If you can provide any documentation from any directors from the B&W days or movie companies saying they made B&W but really wanted color I would be interested in reading them.

B&W was an art form in and of itself. They studied contrast and even applied makeup in shade of blues because it enhanced the B&W outcome.

No one is being an elitists it just is what it is. It is really no difference than an objection to pan & scan. Many think that makes a movie better because it now fits a TV better. It is wrong simply because it is not of the period it was created in for those that like things historically correct. I don’t have an issue with you watching it anyway you want it is a free country. I simply just don’t endorse the practice or encourage it.

Bud
bud16415 is offline  
post #66 of 104 Old 11-10-2018, 04:12 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
MagnumX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Midwest USA
Posts: 1,987
Mentioned: 39 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1147 Post(s)
Liked: 667
Quote:
Originally Posted by bud16415 View Post
If you can provide any documentation from any directors from the B&W days or movie companies saying they made B&W but really wanted color I would be interested in reading them.
I ran into some material suggesting why so many Bogart movies were made in black & white when color became available before 1940 and Bogart wasn't a true "leading man" until The Maltese Falcon in 1941 (some say High Sierra lead to this, but he had other "leads" to lesser known movies in the 1930s and usually a 2nd or 3rd billing (often playing the bad guy), but they didn't get him anywhere new like The Maltese Falcon did. The one-two punch of The Maltese Falcon and Casablanca cemented the rest of his career. It talked about how most of Bogart's movies were action movies that either didn't have unlimited budgets, were largely filmed with lots of outdoor scenes (he tended to be in action/noir films) where color was not convenient and directors like John Huston valued full artistic control (Technicolor was known to interfere; plenty of articles exist on that subject). Trying to find that stuff again is not worth my time. It's somewhat conjecture anyway. It doesn't necessarily apply to every single film situation, but the fact remains it's well known only top budget films got color back then and only if they thought it would greatly benefit it and if the locations were doable (Technicolor did make single film emulsions but they were very grainy and unsuitable for most cinema pieces).

I mean you can believe whatever you want, but if black and white were as highly valued as you seem to think it was, then certainly lots of directors today would be begging the studios to let them make their project in black and white. Of course, you can always turn ANY film into a form of black and white by turning saturation all the way down. How many do that because they think it looks better?

Quote:
B&W was an art form in and of itself. They studied contrast and even applied makeup in shade of blues because it enhanced the B&W outcome.
Doing something well and doing it because it's preferred are two entirely different things.

Quote:
No one is being an elitists it just is what it is.
Crap?

I'm only half kidding. I already said I wouldn't object to seeing a color version, but only as long as the original is maintained. Whether I would ever watch it more than once is something I cannot predict without seeing the end result first. To me, the story is what matters most. But I can't say that black and white is anything but a technological shortcoming anomyaly in the grand scheme of world history. No one would have chosen to create black and white if color had been easy to do and without limitations. This is born out by the fact that other than one or two anomalies, no major movies or TV Shows are made in black & white any longer except to make flashbacks look like old TV (e.g. That '70s Show used some to recreate those documentary short looks). I used to hear people dream in black and white, but the only time I ever did was when I fell asleep with Mr. Ed running in the background on TV Land (as it was the only frame of reference I had my dream was in black and white). I've since read that was made up. There is no evidence anyone ever dreamed in black and white before film came about and it's almost unheard of these days outside some film buffs that watch it a lot. People that are color blind still see in color (they can't distinguish some shades from others, but they still see a "color"), after all. No one sees the world in "black and white". Even most animals see some kind of color shading variants (often not as many as us, but that doesn't make it black and white either). It's unnatural.

Quote:
It is really no difference than an objection to pan & scan. Many think that makes a movie better because it now fits a TV better. It is wrong simply because it is not of the period it was created in for those that like things historically correct.
And yet most film fans don't think full frame is acceptable either, even though nothing is missing and no panning is added. There are people on the Blu-Ray forums that argue that films like Blade Runner 2049 should not be released in IMAX format even though it was at the theaters because the director "prefers" the 2.35:1 version (even though he authorized the IMAX version as official as well as it was shot with both in mind).

Quote:
I don’t have an issue with you watching it anyway you want it is a free country. I simply just don’t endorse the practice or encourage it.
I don't really care whether you have a problem with it or not. You can watch whatever you want. What I have/had a problem with was various people writing Congress to try and FORCE Ted Turner to stop colorizing movies (as near as I can tell that played a big factor in the practice being stopped). Unless he's destroying the original masters, it's none of their god damned business, IMO. Using strong arm government tactics to stop free exchanged of information is not my idea of a "free" country.

Click THEATER (Updated: Oct-19-2019) for pics: Epson 3100 3D Projector, DaLite 92" screen, 11.1.6 (Marantz SR7012 + Yamaha HTR-5960 + Onkyo ESPro) - Dialog Lift - PSB T45/B15/S50/X1T/CS500 Speakers & Def Tech PF-1500 15" sub; 2nd Room (Updated Apr-22-2019): 48" Plasma TV, Carver AL-III, Carver C-5 Pre-Amp, Technics SH-AC500D, Dual Carver TFM-35x Amps (Active Bi-Amp), Klipsch Surrounds ; Sources: PS4, LG UP875 UHD, Nvidia Shield (KODI), ATV4K, Zidoo X9S, LD, GameCube : Props (Updated 10-13-19)
MagnumX is online now  
post #67 of 104 Old 11-10-2018, 07:55 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Dave in Green's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: USA
Posts: 8,369
Mentioned: 152 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3792 Post(s)
Liked: 3008
As much as my wife and I enjoy watching classic black and white movies the way they were intended to be presented, reality today is that there's no demand for black and white movies beyond nostalgia. When given a choice the public prefers contemporary movies in color just as they prefer movies with soundtracks over silent movies accompanied by a live organist. Had color film and synchronized sound been easily and economically available in 1900 there would have been no demand for black and white or silent movies so none would have been made and we wouldn't have any to reminisce over.
Dave in Green is offline  
post #68 of 104 Old 11-10-2018, 09:14 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
MagnumX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Midwest USA
Posts: 1,987
Mentioned: 39 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1147 Post(s)
Liked: 667
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave in Green View Post
As much as my wife and I enjoy watching classic black and white movies the way they were intended to be presented, reality today is that there's no demand for black and white movies beyond nostalgia. When given a choice the public prefers contemporary movies in color just as they prefer movies with soundtracks over silent movies accompanied by a live organist. Had color film and synchronized sound been easily and economically available in 1900 there would have been no demand for black and white or silent movies so none would have been made and we wouldn't have any to reminisce over.
I don't actually reminisce over them because I was born in the 1970s (no nostalgia for B&W for me). Everything was already in color by then except old repeats. I don't love Bogart movies because all but four are in black and white. They could be in color or with modern surround sound and it wouldn't change the fact they are great movies either way. Todays' movies are all CGI and effects and explosions. Dialog usually sucks. Characters are often one dimensional. Most actors lack presence. I can't imagine acting against a green screen is very conducive to a great performance either. The African Queen was filmed IN Africa. Today it would be filmed in front of a flipping green screen if they remade it. It's horse manure to some degree and it has NOTHING to do with the soundtrack or the color grading or the surround sound. A GREAT movie needs a great script with great actors and a director that can pull it off. But I've seen pre-code movies that blow away Citizen Kane in terms of acting and a story I actually care about. Camera angles are great, but nothing makes up for a great story told by great actors. That won't change if a film is colorized or desaturated or whether I see it on a 19" TV or a 250" projection system. Even Pan & Scan can't totally ruin a movie like The Empire Strikes Back or Back To The Future because the sum total is still way better than the limitations of the playback system. Yes, Sci-Fi movies need a certain amount of believability, etc. but I know plenty of people that love the original Star Trek and old Doctor Who that look cheesy as hell because the stories and concept and characters interest them more than believability.

Again, I'm not suggesting replacing black and white. I'm simply not sold 100% on this "director intent" concept because a movie is more than just a director and his intent. Would The Maltese Falcon worked as well with George Raft instead of Bogart? I personally kind of doubt it. A movie is more than the sum of its parts and yet some of the parts are very important. I personally think the screenwriters (and in cases where it's based on books the authors) don't get nearly enough credit as they designed the working of the movie. The director's job is to try and turn that into reality. But when someone like Nolan say no 3D or no Atmos retrofit, I find that kind of presumptuous. I like Blade Runner 2049 in 3D much better than in 2D, but the director (Denis Villeneuve) doesn't think so. I'd like the IMAX ratio at home, but he prefers the 2.40:1 ratio (IMO it's room/screen dependent which will look better at any given moment; the story doesn't change in a significant manner either way). But some people act like the director is god and they wouldn't cross god for fear of burning in hell. To each their own.

Click THEATER (Updated: Oct-19-2019) for pics: Epson 3100 3D Projector, DaLite 92" screen, 11.1.6 (Marantz SR7012 + Yamaha HTR-5960 + Onkyo ESPro) - Dialog Lift - PSB T45/B15/S50/X1T/CS500 Speakers & Def Tech PF-1500 15" sub; 2nd Room (Updated Apr-22-2019): 48" Plasma TV, Carver AL-III, Carver C-5 Pre-Amp, Technics SH-AC500D, Dual Carver TFM-35x Amps (Active Bi-Amp), Klipsch Surrounds ; Sources: PS4, LG UP875 UHD, Nvidia Shield (KODI), ATV4K, Zidoo X9S, LD, GameCube : Props (Updated 10-13-19)
MagnumX is online now  
post #69 of 104 Old 11-11-2018, 06:26 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
bud16415's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Erie Pa
Posts: 7,832
Mentioned: 115 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2135 Post(s)
Liked: 1075
@MagnumX , Like many people the world of technology started the year you were born and in your case it was 1970 and some of our fondest memories are from our formative years. You say you have no nostalgic feeling towards B&W being born long after that era. Having your exposure to B&W side by side to better technologies. Following that logic a child born today will not feel 1080 resolution is acceptable to watch and will much prefer having it manipulated into 8k or 16k in order to watch it in any interesting way. Other wise they will say 4k is crap still.

You are correct the motion picture industry and Ted Turner are all about only one primary thing and it is not creating art. It is about making money. They employ artistic folks because the consumer demands a product they enjoy to watch, but for the most part if the max profit can be had shooting on 35mm then that’s what they will do. Look at the spaghetti westerns of the 60’s. They shot them as cheaply as they could over seas with open matte with low budget all the way and the return on cost at the box office were incredible.

Ted Turner wasn’t colorizing movies to make them better he was trying to wring out profits from old stuff that was sitting around by putting a new spin on it, And IMHO was not improving it at all. Now if he owned the rights to them he shouldn’t have been taken to court over it. If I want to buy a Rembrandt and paint a picture of my dog on it I guess I have the right to do that, even though a lot of people are not going to like it. Around here a lot of historic wonderful old buildings are being bought and tore down to build Burger Kings. I don’t like it. I could have bought the building if I wanted and didn’t and as many people that hate it there are an equal number that call it progress and like the idea.

@Dave in Green and I are not 100 years old and grew up in the golden years of B&W. We are older than you and I think our parents were that generation. But you don’t have to be from a generation to admire that time and like to enjoy it as it was then.

Film-Like clearly has a different meaning to me than it does you.

Bud
bud16415 is offline  
post #70 of 104 Old 11-11-2018, 07:02 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
MagnumX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Midwest USA
Posts: 1,987
Mentioned: 39 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1147 Post(s)
Liked: 667
Quote:
Originally Posted by bud16415 View Post
@MagnumX , Like many people the world of technology started the year you were born and in your case it was 1970
No, not 1970, but good guess.

Quote:
and some of our fondest memories are from our formative years. You say you have no nostalgic feeling towards B&W being born long after that era. Having your exposure to B&W side by side to better technologies. Following that logic a child born today will not feel 1080 resolution is acceptable to watch and will much prefer having it manipulated into 8k or 16k in order to watch it in any interesting way. Other wise they will say 4k is crap still.
I don't think comparing a picture RESOLUTION to B&W versus color are in the same ballpark as one another. I grew up watching FILMS and films were higher than 4K resolution at the movie theater. Many very recent movies were shot in 2K digital and CANNOT be increased to 4K or 8K no matter what beyond "upconversions" whereas film can be rescanned to 4K or even 8K. There is a limit of usefulness to resolution versus screen size and watching movies on a 22" CRT TV didn't need 4K in the 1980s. I had a laserdisc player in the late 1980s and sought out widescreen versions wherever possible as I did not want parts of the picture removed. Now one can talk about wanting to get rid of black bars and fill the screen (something I feel is a legitimate desire), but I did not want to trade losing picture for it. Full frame movies lose nothing, however (they actually gain) and if I had to watch a movie on a 4:3 sets and had a choice between 1.85:1 and full frame, I'd choose full frame for that reason (larger picture as long as information is not lost).

In other words, these choices are about wanting to see the best quality picture and as much picture as possible for IMMERSION reasons. Thus, when a director says he doesn't want say Terminator 2 given a Dolby Atmos (or DTS X) soundtrack for the 4K re-release, I have to disagree. The 5.1 soundtrack was nice for its day, but unlike the picture/movie itself, the sound can be remixed for better immersion using more channels. The alternative is to let a pre-set upmixer to do it (e.g. Neural X) to less controlled results. I honestly have to question the sanity of someone like James Cameron for choosing a computer program over human remixing (most using Atmos capable systems will not choose straight 5.1, particularly if they have a larger home theater with multiple rows as coverage is poor with only some of the speakers being used; actual theaters with 5.1 would have had arrays so the tradeoff is not 1:1).

Quote:
You are correct the motion picture industry and Ted Turner are all about only one primary thing and it is not creating art. It is about making money. They employ artistic folks because the consumer demands a product they enjoy to watch, but for the most part if the max profit can be had shooting on 35mm then that’s what they will do. Look at the spaghetti westerns of the 60’s. They shot them as cheaply as they could over seas with open matte with low budget all the way and the return on cost at the box office were incredible.
I cannot know Ted Turner's intentions at the time. Assuming he had no interest in colorization and was just trying to make money doesn't sound plausible to me. All companies would have been doing it. Some people despise black and white the way others despise pan & scan. The sheer overreaction from people like Roger Ebert was ridiculous, IMO. They lobbied Congress to stop it. So much for free expression.

Quote:
Ted Turner wasn’t colorizing movies to make them better he was trying to wring out profits from old stuff that was sitting around by putting a new spin on it, And IMHO was not improving it at all. Now if he owned the rights to them he shouldn’t have been taken to court over it. If I want to buy a Rembrandt and paint a picture of my dog on it I guess I have the right to do that, even though a lot of people are not going to like it.
The comparison is absurd given he was not altering or changing the original film stocks. Painting over an actual Rembrandt instead of a copy is another story entirely. That is defacing the original.

Quote:
Around here a lot of historic wonderful old buildings are being bought and tore down to build Burger Kings. I don’t like it. I could have bought the building if I wanted and didn’t and as many people that hate it there are an equal number that call it progress and like the idea.
I'm not a huge fan of Burger King (liked it when I was a kid, but tend to choose Wendy's if fast food is the only choice now) and clearly it's nice to preserve historical things, but OTOH we can't keep every old car, building and house that was ever made. There is limited space and resources and also safety to consider.

Quote:
@Dave in Green and I are not 100 years old and grew up in the golden years of B&W. We are older than you and I think our parents were that generation. But you don’t have to be from a generation to admire that time and like to enjoy it as it was then.
Despite saying several times I do not want to replace the orginal and would not support releasing a catalog with only a colorized version, I keep getting responses as if I had. All I said is I'd be interested enough to watch a modern colorization of a film I love like The Maltese Falcon. If I didn't like it, I wouldn't have to watch it again. I wouldn't mind it being an "extra" on a disc that had the room just to compare. I'd even watch the Ted Turner version if I could get a hold of it and hadn't sold my VHS transfer hardware (already transferred all my stuff). Like or not, that event was part of human history too! But instead my very point is that I get these knee-jerk "OMG!" type reactions that clearly Turner got as well that places one's own self-importance and opinions above that of other humans. It's this fundamental "I don't like it so no one else should either!" egotistical gut reaction that when taken to extremes (as has been done throughout human history) has lead to numerous atrocities, wars and other "bad" things all because someone doesn't like something or they think their rights should supersede everyone else's rights in turn and they think everyone else on the Earth should agree with them. You might as well call it the God complex because it's a god-like ego that drives that kind of thinking. How many wars and other atrocities have been committed by people who think they shouldn't have to put up with this group or that group thinking/worshiping/screwing the wrong thing/god/person? No, whether I like colorization or I don't, it's not my place to tell others to think like I do nor would I want to. Differences should be celebrated not attacked as long as they are hurting no one.

Quote:
Film-Like clearly has a different meaning to me than it does you.
I shot 35mm film myself for nearly two decades. I think I know what film-like means....

Click THEATER (Updated: Oct-19-2019) for pics: Epson 3100 3D Projector, DaLite 92" screen, 11.1.6 (Marantz SR7012 + Yamaha HTR-5960 + Onkyo ESPro) - Dialog Lift - PSB T45/B15/S50/X1T/CS500 Speakers & Def Tech PF-1500 15" sub; 2nd Room (Updated Apr-22-2019): 48" Plasma TV, Carver AL-III, Carver C-5 Pre-Amp, Technics SH-AC500D, Dual Carver TFM-35x Amps (Active Bi-Amp), Klipsch Surrounds ; Sources: PS4, LG UP875 UHD, Nvidia Shield (KODI), ATV4K, Zidoo X9S, LD, GameCube : Props (Updated 10-13-19)
MagnumX is online now  
post #71 of 104 Old 11-11-2018, 09:02 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
steve1106's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Northern, Va
Posts: 2,129
Mentioned: 30 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 828 Post(s)
Liked: 549

[
(Sadly I really wanted one of these as a kid. They looked so good in the printed ads back then.)

To my eyes colorization technology in the beginning became like the old color screen for black and white TVs. It just didn't work very well and tended to take me out of the movie. I remember tuning in only to tune out when I discovered a classic had been butchered by bad colorization. I do the same now with some TV movies and shows which have been altered from the original 4:3 broadcast to fit today's 16:9. Recently my daughter and I sat down to watch Disney's "Halloweentown" via cable and gave up after a few minutes of watching the altered mess.

Now this doesn't translate to altering scope to fit 16:9. I can enjoy a movie in 16:9 via cable even knowing I could easily pop in the scope blu-ray. I figure the director could care less how I watch his movie as long as he got paid. Same goes for watching 16:9 larger than scope in my home. It is my home and I could care less what the director and others (CIHers) think...at least until the THX/SMPTE police show up or as a member posted "Spielberg shows up and punches me in the nose." After the attack, I would argue to Steven that he should be punching out the guys watching his movies on phones vs me watching it in 143.5" of scope.

The soap opera effect....I couldn't wait to get a better/bigger TV a few years ago. I plugged it in and everything looked fake...like an old black and white soap opera. (Wife loves Dark Shadows and has the disk set, so yes it reminded me exactly of the 1960s soap's look.) It was easily fixed. I turned it off and left it off. (I can remember Dad buying his elderly parents a color TV and my Grandmother complaining about the color making it look "wrong". It was an easy fix to turn the color off and Dad gradually would add color back over the next few weeks until it was fully restored. .) I tried the FI on the projector I bought last year and ended up turning it off because it looked fake. I'm sure I could adjust by gradually bumping up the FI, but I'm happy with the image the way it is. (I get it now Grandmother.)

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/15-ge...eap-build.html
Epson HC3700/HC2000; Screen - 151.5" 16:9/TV or 143.5" 2.35:1/HT at a seating distance of 12-15 feet; Yamaha RXV675 for 7.4; Speakers - Infinity Primus; Subs - 3 Polk PSW10s, 1 BIC F12; Headphones - 5 JVC wireless; Sony 3D Blu-ray player/six pairs 3D glasses.
steve1106 is offline  
post #72 of 104 Old 11-11-2018, 09:08 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
MagnumX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Midwest USA
Posts: 1,987
Mentioned: 39 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1147 Post(s)
Liked: 667
My aunt/uncle had those over their family room TV when I was a kid (it was still black and white). Utterly ridiculous. My mom tells me her dad would only spring for one of those. She didn't see a real color TV program until the early 1970s at a friend's house. My brother had a black and white TV in our shared bedroom for several years when I was a child as well. I'm no stranger to black and white TV.

Click THEATER (Updated: Oct-19-2019) for pics: Epson 3100 3D Projector, DaLite 92" screen, 11.1.6 (Marantz SR7012 + Yamaha HTR-5960 + Onkyo ESPro) - Dialog Lift - PSB T45/B15/S50/X1T/CS500 Speakers & Def Tech PF-1500 15" sub; 2nd Room (Updated Apr-22-2019): 48" Plasma TV, Carver AL-III, Carver C-5 Pre-Amp, Technics SH-AC500D, Dual Carver TFM-35x Amps (Active Bi-Amp), Klipsch Surrounds ; Sources: PS4, LG UP875 UHD, Nvidia Shield (KODI), ATV4K, Zidoo X9S, LD, GameCube : Props (Updated 10-13-19)
MagnumX is online now  
post #73 of 104 Old 11-11-2018, 10:53 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Dave in Green's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: USA
Posts: 8,369
Mentioned: 152 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3792 Post(s)
Liked: 3008
Quote:
Originally Posted by bud16415 View Post
... But you don’t have to be from a generation to admire that time and like to enjoy it as it was then. ...
One of but many truisms in this interesting discussion mixed in with many personal preferences. In many cases those preferences aren't that far apart, and I don't think any of us is trying to dispute the fact that personal preferences that may differ from our own are completely valid for others. In many discussions our differences tend to appear more exaggerated when we focus on reinforcing our point of view without acknowledging that other points of view have equal merit for others.

None of the things that we're discussing are inherently right or wrong but just different options to suit different preferences. The most important thing is to have freedom of choice from within many different options so that each of us can find the formula that best suits us. If we all had to live under a single rigid set of rules with limited options most of us would be miserable.
bud16415 likes this.
Dave in Green is offline  
post #74 of 104 Old 11-11-2018, 05:39 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: Dongguan, CH
Posts: 494
Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 264 Post(s)
Liked: 86
Quote:
Originally Posted by MagnumX View Post
My aunt/uncle had those over their family room TV when I was a kid (it was still black and white). Utterly ridiculous. My mom tells me her dad would only spring for one of those. She didn't see a real color TV program until the early 1970s at a friend's house. My brother had a black and white TV in our shared bedroom for several years when I was a child as well. I'm no stranger to black and white TV.

when I was I was a child I remember having our TV in Tubes & my dad would open the back so that it would cool those tubes, I like watching them glow up together with the size of the TV screen as power was low(AC voltage) @ primetime & the screen size would be full screen after 2~3 hours lol. We had another one that had sliding doors to cover the screen, I guess it was Radiowealth brand. Those where the days where Godzilla was in B&W

XGimi CC, XGimi Z6, UKCSIS, Vmai M200 Pico
Xbox One S, LG SH4
wheelee is online now  
post #75 of 104 Old 11-12-2018, 01:25 AM
Senior Member
 
Nuieve's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 266
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 141 Post(s)
Liked: 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave in Green View Post
As much as my wife and I enjoy watching classic black and white movies the way they were intended to be presented
They never were INTENDED to be 24 frames/s. It was just a limitation or whatever of primitive technnology. It's like saying cars were meant to run on steam because first one were made that way and that's how God intended cars to be.

Utter nonsense.

FI on MILD-MEDIUM setting completely eliminated judder without introducing soap opera effect. But between judder and soap opera effect I'll take soap opera all day every day.
Nuieve is offline  
post #76 of 104 Old 11-12-2018, 01:41 AM
Senior Member
 
Nuieve's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 266
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 141 Post(s)
Liked: 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave in Green View Post
One of but many truisms in this interesting discussion mixed in with many personal preferences. In many cases those preferences aren't that far apart, and I don't think any of us is trying to dispute the fact that personal preferences that may differ from our own are completely valid for others. In many discussions our differences tend to appear more exaggerated when we focus on reinforcing our point of view without acknowledging that other points of view have equal merit for others.

None of the things that we're discussing are inherently right or wrong but just different options to suit different preferences. The most important thing is to have freedom of choice from within many different options so that each of us can find the formula that best suits us. If we all had to live under a single rigid set of rules with limited options most of us would be miserable.
It's not just about personal preferences. We, as a society, are smart enough to see which preferences have merit and are reasonable enough to be deemed as equal and which are nothing more than a disease of the mind like love for judder which is irrational rejection of technology advancement that improves comfort due to some imaginary theory or belief that judder was created to be that way... like in 1905 or whatever they were watching movie shot in 120 fps and the one shot in 24 and all agreeed that 120fps sucked and movies should be in 24fps.

I personally find people propagating ancient technology and not willing to appreciate comforts of science advancements utterly annoying. You like your horse carriage, fine, enjoy it, just stick to your boonies, don't come to car meetings and start telling everyone how awesome it is to feel every bump in the road in your carriage. Everyone will think you're a weirdo or insane. Enjoy your carriage/judder whatever just don't come and say it's how things need to be. Because they don't.
Nuieve is offline  
post #77 of 104 Old 11-12-2018, 05:11 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
bud16415's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Erie Pa
Posts: 7,832
Mentioned: 115 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2135 Post(s)
Liked: 1075
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuieve View Post
It's not just about personal preferences. We, as a society, are smart enough to see which preferences have merit and are reasonable enough to be deemed as equal and which are nothing more than a disease of the mind like love for judder which is irrational rejection of technology advancement that improves comfort due to some imaginary theory or belief that judder was created to be that way... like in 1905 or whatever they were watching movie shot in 120 fps and the one shot in 24 and all agreeed that 120fps sucked and movies should be in 24fps.

I personally find people propagating ancient technology and not willing to appreciate comforts of science advancements utterly annoying. You like your horse carriage, fine, enjoy it, just stick to your boonies, don't come to car meetings and start telling everyone how awesome it is to feel every bump in the road in your carriage. Everyone will think you're a weirdo or insane. Enjoy your carriage/judder whatever just don't come and say it's how things need to be. Because they don't.
Base on your own beliefs why are you even in the projector forum. It is abundantly clear that flat panel displays have surpassed front projection in every category. Front projection even with FI can’t hold a candle to flat panel displays with HDR or color reproduction let alone they need a perfect room to even come close. For anyone to own a projector in today’s world and claiming it is good because of the FI feature is like driving a buggy to a car show.

Move on to the superior technology and leave FP for those that want the nostalgic movie experience.

Bud
bud16415 is offline  
post #78 of 104 Old 11-12-2018, 08:16 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
steve1106's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Northern, Va
Posts: 2,129
Mentioned: 30 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 828 Post(s)
Liked: 549
Home theater is about personal preferences. Life is about personal preferences. Lose the freedom of personal preferences and

I prefer to turn off the FI on my projector to avoid the soap opera effect...

but I bought a projector with FI. Just like my carriages...er...cars/truck/van the projector has features/capabilities I don't use. The tech is great and just because I don't care to use it, it doesn't mean other family members don't. The wife slips the 70" TV's FI on and I slip it off. The kids...er...24 and 22 year olds prefer streaming music in the vehicles and I stick with satellite radio. The wife prefers plain old FM.

Looking back on the "family" farm, Dad had 200 acres and his brother had another adjacent 150 acres in Tennessee. The go-carts, 3&4 wheelers, tractors, dozer, dirt bikes and old trucks were fun in the days before a driver's license...but oddly I miss the horses/ponies and even the "buggy/carriage" the most.

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/15-ge...eap-build.html
Epson HC3700/HC2000; Screen - 151.5" 16:9/TV or 143.5" 2.35:1/HT at a seating distance of 12-15 feet; Yamaha RXV675 for 7.4; Speakers - Infinity Primus; Subs - 3 Polk PSW10s, 1 BIC F12; Headphones - 5 JVC wireless; Sony 3D Blu-ray player/six pairs 3D glasses.

Last edited by steve1106; 11-12-2018 at 08:21 AM.
steve1106 is offline  
post #79 of 104 Old 11-12-2018, 10:52 AM
Senior Member
 
jurid001's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 266
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 75 Post(s)
Liked: 25
Anti-BS effect

Quote:
Originally Posted by BattleAxeVR View Post
The Soap Opera Effect is a misnomer, I think.

60 fps is closer to reality than 24 fps, so it's more appropriate if 24 fps had a nickname associated with it.

Like Flickery Choppy Motion Blur Effect.

Yes indeed, the SO Effect should be called the Anti-BS effect. The BS Effect (Blur and Stutter Effect, associated with the 24fps blur and stutter) can be quite off-putting. I like to sit close to the TV (at about 50 degrees angle), and look around the picture frame, and when things are moving, esp. panning, things become jarring. There are courses in film institutes on how to do panning properly, minimizing the BS effect. Doesn't help, though. Blur and stutter are there.

Agreed, the sensitivity to the BS effect depends on your viewing habits. For me, it's hard to go back to the BS effect.
Another thing I noticed, good players produce cleaner picture and less artifacts during frame interpolation (like OPPOs). Correspondingly, if the encode is bad, interpolation creates more artifacts. Also it depends whether your TV is 60Hz or 120Hz, and on whether your player can output 24fps. So it's not only the TV which is responsible for the interpolation.

Enabling the anti-BS effect, I like that I can follow an object onscreen and see the detail in it. It also means that in order to see everything encoded on BD/DVD, one _needs_ to enable the anti-BS effect.
JeffR1 likes this.

A2, A35, 150, 62fd, s790, s6500, x800, 83, 103D, HTPC w/ HD-DVD/BD
jurid001 is offline  
post #80 of 104 Old 11-12-2018, 12:00 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
MagnumX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Midwest USA
Posts: 1,987
Mentioned: 39 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1147 Post(s)
Liked: 667
Hey, I used to watch soaps... When Burt got kidnapped by aliens on Soap, it was priceless.... I used to watch Knots Landing as well... Misogynist my arse....

Frankly, the angry attitudes you see when people disagree bothers me. Taken to extremes, it leads to bad places of intolerance.

Frankly, if you want the horse and buggy feel of bump bump bump, get a Corvette or Ferrari or even a Subaru WRX STI (no wagon required). My god what a harsh ride on Northern (crap) roads. I owned two WRX models and no more STI suspension for me unless I'm planning on moving to Arizona or only using in on a track.

Click THEATER (Updated: Oct-19-2019) for pics: Epson 3100 3D Projector, DaLite 92" screen, 11.1.6 (Marantz SR7012 + Yamaha HTR-5960 + Onkyo ESPro) - Dialog Lift - PSB T45/B15/S50/X1T/CS500 Speakers & Def Tech PF-1500 15" sub; 2nd Room (Updated Apr-22-2019): 48" Plasma TV, Carver AL-III, Carver C-5 Pre-Amp, Technics SH-AC500D, Dual Carver TFM-35x Amps (Active Bi-Amp), Klipsch Surrounds ; Sources: PS4, LG UP875 UHD, Nvidia Shield (KODI), ATV4K, Zidoo X9S, LD, GameCube : Props (Updated 10-13-19)
MagnumX is online now  
post #81 of 104 Old 11-12-2018, 12:35 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
bud16415's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Erie Pa
Posts: 7,832
Mentioned: 115 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2135 Post(s)
Liked: 1075
OMG you guys have convinced me. I got my hands on a colorized copy of The Blair Witch Project (1999) and I watched it with FI turned on. It was so smooth and realistic and wasn’t at all scary. I thought I was watching a new soap opera from 2018. I never realized it was a movie about some kids going to summer camp and all the fun stuff they saw along the way. You miss so much without FI turned on.

Bud
bud16415 is offline  
post #82 of 104 Old 11-12-2018, 02:55 PM
Senior Member
 
jurid001's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 266
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 75 Post(s)
Liked: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by MagnumX View Post
I owned two WRX models and no more STI suspension for me unless I'm planning on moving to Arizona or only using in on a track.
Kool. My wife has WRX

A2, A35, 150, 62fd, s790, s6500, x800, 83, 103D, HTPC w/ HD-DVD/BD
jurid001 is offline  
post #83 of 104 Old 11-12-2018, 03:18 PM
Senior Member
 
indio22's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Chicagoland area
Posts: 477
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 49 Post(s)
Liked: 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by BattleAxeVR View Post
The "real cinema experience" wouldn't be complete without:

-annoying teenagers talking through the whole movie
-ten dollar popcorn
-sticky floors
-films show only at specific times, on rotation
-no pausing the movie when you go to the bathroom, you have to hold it in or miss the best part of the film
-no changing the volume, ever
-30 minutes of annoying, super loud ads
-trailers that give away the entire movie
-trailers for movies you would never want to see
-15-20 dollars per person per showing, and your partner or kids always fall asleep halfway and miss half of it anyway. Charging kids 20 bucks for a nap.

At a certain point it begins to dawn on you that the cinema experience is kind of terrible.
Amen to that! Several experiences with persons in theaters who didn't know how to behave, prompted my first projector purchase. Haven't looked back since. There is one theater we still occasionally attend for certain films, but I can choose ahead of time the seats. And there is a certain row I always choose, with an aisle behind so no one is kicking my seat or talking right behind me, or chewing popcorn with mouth open, etc.
indio22 is offline  
post #84 of 104 Old 11-12-2018, 03:29 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Dave in Green's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: USA
Posts: 8,369
Mentioned: 152 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3792 Post(s)
Liked: 3008
When the talk shifts to cars it's a sure sign that a thread is nearing its end with no one having changed their opinions.
Dave in Green is offline  
post #85 of 104 Old 11-12-2018, 05:01 PM
Senior Member
 
jurid001's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 266
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 75 Post(s)
Liked: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by MagnumX View Post

……..

I don't think comparing a picture RESOLUTION to B&W versus color are in the same ballpark as one another. I grew up watching FILMS and films were higher than 4K resolution at the movie theater. Many very recent movies were shot in 2K digital and CANNOT be increased to 4K or 8K no matter what beyond "upconversions" whereas film can be rescanned to 4K or even 8K.

…..
I am afraid you are misremembering FILMS. Before the digital era, they were quite fuzzy. Good quality theater would deliver around 700 lines of resolution, often less ( http://www.motionfx.gr/files/35mm_re...on_english.pdf ). In fact many people preferred DVDs to theaters.

A2, A35, 150, 62fd, s790, s6500, x800, 83, 103D, HTPC w/ HD-DVD/BD
jurid001 is offline  
post #86 of 104 Old 11-12-2018, 06:36 PM
Senior Member
 
Nuieve's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 266
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 141 Post(s)
Liked: 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by bud16415 View Post
Base on your own beliefs why are you even in the projector forum. It is abundantly clear that flat panel displays have surpassed front projection in every category. Front projection even with FI can’t hold a candle to flat panel displays with HDR or color reproduction let alone they need a perfect room to even come close. For anyone to own a projector in today’s world and claiming it is good because of the FI feature is like driving a buggy to a car show.

Move on to the superior technology and leave FP for those that want the nostalgic movie experience.
When I can buy a 165" flatscreen that is 2" deep and that I can somehow squeeze through a 30x80" door for less than $2000 I will.

Btw, many say "nostalgic"... Do you guys cry when the scene pans out with all that judder... Do you have tears running down your cheeks and you hug each other with each skipping frame crying "I miss my wonderful days of my youth in 1920s... " Do you just weep in profound sadness during fight scenes in Avenger when due to judder you can't really see what's going on? Do watch that juddery mess and just feel like you're in heaven?
JeffR1 likes this.
Nuieve is offline  
post #87 of 104 Old 11-13-2018, 06:04 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Frank714's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Berlin
Posts: 1,495
Mentioned: 10 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 969 Post(s)
Liked: 429
Quote:
Originally Posted by jurid001 View Post
Yes indeed, the SO Effect should be called the Anti-BS effect. The BS Effect (Blur and Stutter Effect, associated with the 24fps blur and stutter) can be quite off-putting.

"BS Effect"?!? I love it, especially given its ambiguity.


Creative Frame Interpolation should be called the "Anti-BS effect". I'm in!

"It is only about things that do not interest one that one can give a really unbiased opinion, which is no doubt the reason why an unbiased opinion is always absolutely valueless." Oscar Wilde
Frank714 is offline  
post #88 of 104 Old 11-13-2018, 06:05 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
bud16415's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Erie Pa
Posts: 7,832
Mentioned: 115 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2135 Post(s)
Liked: 1075
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuieve View Post
When I can buy a 165" flatscreen that is 2" deep and that I can somehow squeeze through a 30x80" door for less than $2000 I will.

Btw, many say "nostalgic"... Do you guys cry when the scene pans out with all that judder... Do you have tears running down your cheeks and you hug each other with each skipping frame crying "I miss my wonderful days of my youth in 1920s... " Do you just weep in profound sadness during fight scenes in Avenger when due to judder you can't really see what's going on? Do watch that juddery mess and just feel like you're in heaven?
So it sounds pretty clear that you feel there are only two advantages to front projection screen size and cost, and you are more than willing to watch an inferior display device in order to have those two advantages.

You must have a large number of viewers at your house to need such a large screen, I’m guessing about a dozen or more per showing. Otherwise if it was just 4 people or less you could adjust seating distance in front of say an 86” TV in your price range and have the same immersion with all the benefits of a flat panel TV.

Some of us feel there are other benefits to front projection thus our desires to watch that way. Some of them are practical and some are “nostalgic” That Avenger movie you mentioned did Bogart play the leading man in that one. Sorry once I reached 110 years old I don’t remember that good. Plus all the crying we do about judder doesn’t help.

Bud
bud16415 is offline  
post #89 of 104 Old 11-13-2018, 09:09 AM
Senior Member
 
jurid001's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 266
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 75 Post(s)
Liked: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank714 View Post
"BS Effect"?!? I love it, especially given its ambiguity.

.[/I] I'm in!
What ambiguity?
Frank714 likes this.

A2, A35, 150, 62fd, s790, s6500, x800, 83, 103D, HTPC w/ HD-DVD/BD
jurid001 is offline  
post #90 of 104 Old 11-13-2018, 12:57 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Verge2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: arkansas
Posts: 3,325
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 915 Post(s)
Liked: 244
Why can't Soap Opera's just shoot in 24p and this nonsense will go away.
bud16415 likes this.
Verge2 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply Digital Projectors - Under $3,000 USD MSRP

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off