Epson 5050UB, BenQ HT5550, JVC X790R - Which one to get? - Page 6 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #151 of 171 Old 05-21-2019, 08:59 PM
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Why is the JVC LX UH1 never thrown in the mix or talked about much?
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post #152 of 171 Old 05-22-2019, 04:22 PM
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I received and installed the X790. I then used Tom Norten's settings and found the SDR picture to be really good. On some material it looks to me like I would have a tough time between seeing the difference between a 5550 4K and the 790 4K resolution. I can also see an improvement over the 5050 in black/contrast.

The HDR is another challenge. It looks like the complexities we have all read about of matching source and projector are very real. I'm a little flustered with trying to get the right look. I'm thinking I'm going to rely on a good calibrator to get it dialed in and set up so that I have only a couple of parameters to modify when HDR material is watched.

One conclusion I have reached is that after installing two V2 .47 DLPs and the 5050, the X790 has the best potential to be the closest to 4k satisfaction.
I think HDR is where the Epson would have shone over the others, since I got mine calibrated for HDR I haven’t had to adjust the HDR slider one bit, each movie I throw in the player looks great. Admittedly our TW9400 are the 6050 but I believe the 5050 and 6050 are identical in HDR ability.
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post #153 of 171 Old 05-28-2019, 01:12 PM
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Would the jump from 5040 to 5050 be greater, or 5050 to x790r? Trying to determine the most cost effective choice.

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post #154 of 171 Old 05-28-2019, 02:14 PM
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Would the jump from 5040 to 5050 be greater, or 5050 to x790r? Trying to determine the most cost effective choice.
There was a topic posted today that the X790 production is done and no new orders will be filled. So if true that may make your decision an easy one (unless you can find someone with stock that doesn't want a crazy price for a X790).

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post #155 of 171 Old 05-28-2019, 02:20 PM
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I think HDR is where the Epson would have shone over the others, since I got mine calibrated for HDR I haven’t had to adjust the HDR slider one bit, each movie I throw in the player looks great. Admittedly our TW9400 are the 6050 but I believe the 5050 and 6050 are identical in HDR ability.
The JVC calibrated in high bulb comes close to the lumens offered by the Epson and has a usable BT2020 filter (the Epson sacrifices too much light with its filter). The Epson 5050's improved tonemapping implementation would definitely best the options the JVC X790 has though. To get that level of functionality you would need to pair the JVC with a Panasonic 820 (or Lumagen/MadVR). Still both projectors calibrated with tonemapping I don't think the Epson would necessarily be the winner. But I don't think it would be embarrassed either.

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post #156 of 171 Old 05-28-2019, 09:54 PM
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The JVC calibrated in high bulb comes close to the lumens offered by the Epson and has a usable BT2020 filter (the Epson sacrifices too much light with its filter). The Epson 5050's improved tonemapping implementation would definitely best the options the JVC X790 has though. To get that level of functionality you would need to pair the JVC with a Panasonic 820 (or Lumagen/MadVR). Still both projectors calibrated with tonemapping I don't think the Epson would necessarily be the winner. But I don't think it would be embarrassed either.
I had the 5050 for a week. I've had the X790 for two weeks. The JVC is better in blacks/contrast and perceived pixel density, if that's the right word. I could not zoom the 5050 out for a larger 2.35:1 screen on the 5050 without seeing the pixels. On the JVC they are much less obvious, although can be noticed as somethings not just right. Probably need native 4K for that. The handshake on the JVC is longer that with the 5050 if my memory serves me correctly. Both were brand new, neither was professionally calibrated. The JVC was $400+. Tax on the 5050, none on the JVC made the difference smaller.
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post #157 of 171 Old 06-03-2019, 10:38 PM
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I had the 5050 for a week. I've had the X790 for two weeks. The JVC is better in blacks/contrast and perceived pixel density, if that's the right word. I could not zoom the 5050 out for a larger 2.35:1 screen on the 5050 without seeing the pixels. On the JVC they are much less obvious, although can be noticed as somethings not just right. Probably need native 4K for that. The handshake on the JVC is longer that with the 5050 if my memory serves me correctly. Both were brand new, neither was professionally calibrated. The JVC was $400+. Tax on the 5050, none on the JVC made the difference smaller.
How were the brightness for the 5050 vs the X790? It would be used partially in the daytime light-uncontrolled living room, so having extra brightness would be really useful here for me. Thanks

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post #158 of 171 Old 06-04-2019, 09:13 AM
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How were the brightness for the 5050 vs the X790? It would be used partially in the daytime light-uncontrolled living room, so having extra brightness would be really useful here for me. Thanks
Neither one is as bright as I expected. My screen is 106", 1.0 gain. The room is small, 11' x 13', with dark walls and floor. The throw is about 14'. I thought they would blow off the screen set at ECO but at ECO they were no brighter than my PF1500 LED mini projector. When I watch HDR on the JVC it shifts to high lamp mode and I would like it to be brighter. I use Picture Mode Natural for SDR and HDR for HDR.

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post #159 of 171 Old 06-05-2019, 09:01 AM
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So is the JVC X790r worth the higher price of the Epson 5050? I hope to be in the market for one of them by Christmas of this year and if the boss, I mean wife says ok.

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post #160 of 171 Old 06-05-2019, 05:46 PM
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So is the JVC X790r worth the higher price of the Epson 5050? I hope to be in the market for one of them by Christmas of this year and if the boss, I mean wife says ok.
It was/is in my case. But I had a situation where I saved sales tax of about $250 based on buying from a known supplier in the right state and he also gave me about a $400 discounted price. So the $1K difference was reduced by $650. So if I had to pay the entire $1k extra? I'll wait until I have 100 hours and have it calibrated professionally before I think about that.

I've always subscribed to the practice that price differentials absolutely disappear if you end up happy with the higher priced item. Goes for TVs, electronics, cars, furniture, etc.

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post #161 of 171 Old 06-06-2019, 01:42 PM
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Neither one is as bright as I expected. My screen is 106", 1.0 gain. The room is small, 11' x 13', with dark walls and floor. The throw is about 14'. I thought they would blow off the screen set at ECO but at ECO they were no brighter than my PF1500 LED mini projector. When I watch HDR on the JVC it shifts to high lamp mode and I would like it to be brighter. I use Picture Mode Natural for SDR and HDR for HDR.
Is it a 106” 16:9 or 21:9 screen, also what’s your viewing distance?

I’ve a 100” 16:9 1.1 gain screen and sit approximately 9-10ft from the screen depending on either reclined or not, ECO mode is definitely bright enough from SDR viewing in my light controlled room and Medium is all I need to use to watch HDR with Cinema Filter enabled.

I reckon where we differ is projector distance as mine is only 3.08m from the screen.

P.S. Professional calibration is worth it’s weight in gold IMO, for fun I put the settings in to mine from Projector Reviews to compare with my calibrated ones and despite the push towards the reds the amount of detail present in the image was surprising and by this I don’t mean sharpness.

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post #162 of 171 Old 06-06-2019, 01:59 PM
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Quote:
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Neither one is as bright as I expected. My screen is 106", 1.0 gain. The room is small, 11' x 13', with dark walls and floor. The throw is about 14'. I thought they would blow off the screen set at ECO but at ECO they were no brighter than my PF1500 LED mini projector. When I watch HDR on the JVC it shifts to high lamp mode and I would like it to be brighter. I use Picture Mode Natural for SDR and HDR for HDR.
What brand of screen do you have? I have seen the 5040 of a on a 146" wide 2.35:1 Elite screen where the projector is at least 16' from the screen or more and it was a lot brighter then a JVC 520.

From the older JVC E shifts to the Epson 5040 I think the Epson's are brighter, not sure about the new ones. Would be nice to see a side by side comparison and calibrated.

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post #163 of 171 Old 06-06-2019, 02:25 PM
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What brand of screen do you have? I have seen the 5040 of a on a 146" wide 2.35:1 Elite screen where the projector is at least 16' from the screen or more and it was a lot brighter then a JVC 520.

From the older JVC E shifts to the Epson 5040 I think the Epson's are brighter, not sure about the new ones. Would be nice to see a side by side comparison and calibrated.
My screen is a Silver Ticket. My sitting distance is about 10'. The projector about 13'-14'. It's possible that when I have it calibrated the brightness could improve. It's been a couple of months since I had the 5050 but my recollection is that the brightness was similar to the JVC.

For SDR brightness was fine; not too much but not any brighter than high mode in the PF1500 LED.

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post #164 of 171 Old 06-06-2019, 11:31 PM
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My screen is a Silver Ticket. My sitting distance is about 10'. The projector about 13'-14'. It's possible that when I have it calibrated the brightness could improve. It's been a couple of months since I had the 5050 but my recollection is that the brightness was similar to the JVC.

For SDR brightness was fine; not too much but not any brighter than high mode in the PF1500 LED.
I’m shocked you can’t see pixel grid from 10ft away on either the JVC or Epson, after hearing this remark I’ve had numerous people watch stuff on mine, ones with 4K Sony, Optoma E-shift, JVC and question has been ask ‘do you see the pixel grid’ and on each occasion they all need to move to less than 6ft (in most cases much closer) before there’s any visible present of it.

Of course increasing the screen size will have a similar effect as moving closer so maybe under 120” is the sweet point at 8-10 foot away.

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post #165 of 171 Old 06-07-2019, 01:01 AM
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What brand of screen do you have? I have seen the 5040 of a on a 146" wide 2.35:1 Elite screen where the projector is at least 16' from the screen or more and it was a lot brighter then a JVC 520.

From the older JVC E shifts to the Epson 5040 I think the Epson's are brighter, not sure about the new ones. Would be nice to see a side by side comparison and calibrated.
The Epsons are a lot brighter with a slightly off calibration, but if you are going for a purist calibration, the JVC and EPSON will be similar. That said, the Epsons have a ton more room for brightness overall as you make compromises to the color.

The biggest difference between the Epson and JVC is contrast, the JVC RS-5xx/6xx series are the sub-$100k dollar contrast champions of the projector world. The contrast looks near OLED levels even as you open the fixed aperture up about halfway, even though it's not quite that high.

The JVC RS-5xx/6xx are the only projectors that will give you that 'true black' look with the aperture halfway to open, whereas the older JVC's (RS-5x/6x) will do a decent job, but not as good unless you are at least at -10 to -12 on the aperture. So it means the JVC RS-5xx/6xx have a lot more contrast when brightness matched.

The newest JVC's (NX5/7/9 - RS1k/2k/3k) unfortunately took a major hit in the contrast department, and also are choked full of some annoyances, but it's their first year of Native 4k panels on their non-laser models, so it's kind of expected on a first run.

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post #166 of 171 Old 06-07-2019, 02:23 AM
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Why is the JVC LX UH1 never thrown in the mix or talked about much?
Because it's a DLP projector and can't compete with the projectors being discussed here in terms of contrast and black levels. Besides, unlike other JVC projectors, its main imaging technology and engineering are not the work of JVC but instead it uses parts of similar DLP projectors from other brands.
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post #167 of 171 Old 06-07-2019, 10:05 AM
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The Epsons are a lot brighter with a slightly off calibration, but if you are going for a purist calibration, the JVC and EPSON will be similar. That said, the Epsons have a ton more room for brightness overall as you make compromises to the color.

The biggest difference between the Epson and JVC is contrast, the JVC RS-5xx/6xx series are the sub-$100k dollar contrast champions of the projector world. The contrast looks near OLED levels even as you open the fixed aperture up about halfway, even though it's not quite that high.

The JVC RS-5xx/6xx are the only projectors that will give you that 'true black' look with the aperture halfway to open, whereas the older JVC's (RS-5x/6x) will do a decent job, but not as good unless you are at least at -10 to -12 on the aperture. So it means the JVC RS-5xx/6xx have a lot more contrast when brightness matched.

The newest JVC's (NX5/7/9 - RS1k/2k/3k) unfortunately took a major hit in the contrast department, and also are choked full of some annoyances, but it's their first year of Native 4k panels on their non-laser models, so it's kind of expected on a first run.
I'm keeping the JVC because it is clearly better on black level/contrast and the pixel structure or lack thereof, is better than the Epson. The thing that broke down for me was when I zoomed the Epson out to a dimension that represented a larger 2.35:1 screen if mounted behind my 106" 16x9 screen, the pixels were seeable. Doing the same thing to the JVC does show some pixel breakdown but not too bad. The biggest problem for me is in finding a low cost widescreen, pull-down or electric, that would give me the increased size, but not as big as the one I have simulated. The simulated one is 114"s made by Vutec.

Edit: The one flaw in my testing simulation is that the widescreen picture is showing on the 16x9 probably about 6"s to 10"s closer than it would be when mounted behind the existing screen. I guess I could move my chair back a foot to see if that makes a difference. (God, are we crazy or not with this hobby?)

Jack

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post #168 of 171 Old 07-02-2019, 05:55 AM
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Ultimately, after much debate & discussion, I ended up changing course.

The JVC camp convinced me! Ordered the JVC NX5 (includes free replacement bulb - part of current JVC offer), a Silver Ticket 135" Screen (1.1 Gain), the XPAND 3D Glasses & 3D Emitter.

Everything all in rounded up to $4800.

Considering the True (Native 4K), the great deal on the Projector, the free bulb, the new & higher gain screen then the one I have, I think it just made sense and came out to be a rather good deal. Will be getting everything in within the next 4 days. Will start setting up next week!

Thanks all who contributed. I'll definitely post back with reviews, photos and experience.
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post #169 of 171 Old 07-06-2019, 10:01 AM
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I was in a same dilemma trying to replace my aging Panasonic PTAE4000U projector. I had the Panasonic over 10 years with its 3LCD lens system. One of thing that I hated about this projector was that the dust blubs accumulate inside the lens system and it is visible during the light background scenes. It is PITA to remove the ceiling mounted projector to clean off the dust blubs every once in awhile. I got tired of it so last three years I didn't bother to remove the dust blubs and just live with it. So I wanted to try out the DLP projector with sealed lens system but many that I considered didn't have enough lens shift for flexible installation.

So after many months of researching, it came down to two models, Epson 5050UB vs BenQ HT5550. My screen size is 110" 16x9 with manual horizontal masking system when viewing extra widescreen sized movies. The distance from screen to projector is about 14 feet. So having a motorized lens memory was not a factor for me since I haven't used its feature in Panasonic projector. If you have scope 2.35 screen, there is no discussion which is better fit for that situation, Epson 5050UB is the clear winner with better black level along with brighter light output. I ended up purchasing BenQ HT5550 for following reasons. First, it gives sharper picture vs Epson. Second, I don't have to worry about dust blubs since it is suppose to be sealed lens system in DLP BenQ projector. Third, the replacement bulb is much cheaper and it is said to have 10,000 hours in eco mode. With that kind of life of bulb, I can use projector daily for many years to come before replacement and its cost is only about $150. My last Panasonic only lasted 3000 hours and that was eco mode with price tag of $300. This BenQ HT5550 is the only reasonably priced DLP projector with enough lens shift to satisfy my installation requirement. The only thing that I wasn't sure about is DLP's potential rainbow effect and whether it is going to bother me or not.

Well, it has been about two weeks since I replaced old Panasonic projector with BenQ. And I am happy to know that I made the right decision for my situation. In my darken room, BenQ gives me beautiful plenty enough bright picture even with eco mode. The picture quality is extremely sharp with vibrant colors. So far, there is no visual rainbow effect for my eyes. When you first turn on the projector, it gives off some noise while settling its lens to proper position setting but once it is settled in a few seconds, it is very quiet in my room. I have 10 feet high ceiling so that might have contributed to its quietness. The surprise to me is how well this model renders 3D movies. I have never quiet satisfied with other projector's 3D movies so this was never enter my decision process but it is welcomed surprise. Now I have to start collecting 3D movies now!
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post #170 of 171 Old 07-23-2019, 12:54 AM
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Read this whole thread and was about to post about the Benq not getting any love but apparently finally I am not entirely alone with it as my frontrunner given the above post.

Here are what I see as the advantages:

Resolution/sharpness
color
auto hdr unlike epson
3d
pre calibrated
cheaper
24hz
motion
smaller, black case
brighter p3 color
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post #171 of 171 Old 08-13-2019, 09:27 PM
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