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post #1 of 23 Old 05-23-2019, 06:56 AM - Thread Starter
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I need your assistance on what to do here.

I'm really stuck, and I need you guys to open my wallet for me. I know you guys get alot of these threads. Trust me I've done probably 100 hours of research. But I know every HT room requires a different projector based on needs, and room and I'm hoping you guys can help me make the right decision.

I'm budget orientated building my first true HT. I finished my basement in the idea of having perfect light control. The only light source (outside dimmable lights) is from a rear double barn door that can be closed and sealed 100% light out. So I have full control.

My options right now are
TK800M
TK800
HT2550

HT3550 is outside my price range, TK800M was my original goto. But these recent refurb deals at benq are making them some really hard choices. Right now I can get an HT2550 for $670, or Tk800 for $700.

This is my setup.
Pioneer VSX-1020k 2x Def Tech BP8020 Procenter 1000 Pro monitor 1000 rear surrounds.
Nvidia shield with dedicated server for plex streaming.
I have $1300 to spend.

What I use it for.
Hockey, very big blues fan (not a bandwagoner, have been since a kid). I watch damn near every game. I also would lightly game with the shield, and extremely big into movies. HDR is a must, and I prefer natural colors as close as possible (this is where I'm leaning towards the 2550). But the TK800/m would certainly benefit me during watching hockey, and having people over with lights on.

My biggest issue right now is my old VSK1020K it needs an upgrade as it does not have the new HDMI standards, cannot passthrough 4k, or HDR. It makes everything so difficult. I can't get lossless audio unless I run splits for audio, and off the shield it doesn't work very well. (usually down samples to DD+ on my current setup through ARC).

So here's my options.
TK800M keep my 1020VSX.
Get the 2550 or Tk800 and upgrade receiver to something that does 4k/hdr.

Right now I'm leaning towards the 2550, or the TK800M.

I'm still learning alot however, and I'm not 100% but is the 2550 true 4k like the new Tk800m/3500? Or is it the faux 4k that you can't really tell? And does it support HDR10?

Thanks for everyones help, I know it's a question you get far too often.
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post #2 of 23 Old 05-23-2019, 07:10 AM
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… I'm still learning alot however, and I'm not 100% but is the 2550 true 4k like the new Tk800m/3500? Or is it the faux 4k that you can't really tell? And does it support HDR10? ...
All of the projector models you mention use a 0.47" DLP chip with 1920x1080 micromirrors that shift 4x to create a 3840x2160 pixel 4k image that's close enough to native 4k to satisfy all but those who are willing to triple their budget to be able to afford the least expensive native 4k model.
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post #3 of 23 Old 05-23-2019, 07:23 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Dave in Green View Post
All of the projector models you mention use a 0.47" DLP chip with 1920x1080 micromirrors that shift 4x to create a 3840x2160 pixel 4k image that's close enough to native 4k to satisfy all but those who are willing to triple their budget to be able to afford the least expensive native 4k model.
Again I'm still learning alot but I thought the new 3550/Tk800M had the new TI chip that did 4k? That still shifts?

Does the 2550 support HDR10? I think at this point I'm leaning towards the HT2550. Given that I want good quality HDR and contrast, and it'll still work for the hockey games.

I forgot to include I will be using a 120" Silver Ticket white screen.

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post #4 of 23 Old 05-23-2019, 07:32 AM
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I have a used Optoma UHD60 for sale in the classified section. You might want to check it out. Here's a comparison of the UHD50 vs the HT2550. The 60 is the version with the bigger .66 dmd chip and does 2k x2 eshift vs 1k x4 eshift, so my opinion is the 60 is preferred over the 50.



https://www.tvspecialists.com/optoma...arison-part-i/
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post #5 of 23 Old 05-23-2019, 07:41 AM - Thread Starter
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I have a used Optoma UHD60 for sale in the classified section. You might want to check it out. Here's a comparison of the UHD50 vs the HT2550. The 60 is the version with the bigger .66 dmd chip and does 2k x2 eshift vs 1k x4 eshift, so my opinion is the 60 is preferred over the 50.



https://www.tvspecialists.com/optoma...arison-part-i/
It's something I'd definitly consider, however being out of warranty I'm a little bit concerned. And the 2550 for $674 with a warranty is still probably a little bit more appealing to me. If you'd be willing to do a little less on the price I'd probably consider it, but I'd need to do a little more research first as I really haven't looked much into the Optomas at all.
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post #6 of 23 Old 05-23-2019, 07:51 AM
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All currently available DLP 4k home projectors use pixel shifting. The only native 4k DLP projectors are high end professional models that cost tens of thousands of dollars.
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post #7 of 23 Old 05-23-2019, 08:48 AM
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Originally Posted by CurrentlyPissed View Post
Again I'm still learning alot but I thought the new 3550/Tk800M had the new TI chip that did 4k? That still shifts?



Does the 2550 support HDR10? I think at this point I'm leaning towards the HT2550. Given that I want good quality HDR and contrast, and it'll still work for the hockey games.



I forgot to include I will be using a 120" Silver Ticket white screen.
Thought the main difference between the tk800/2550 and 3550/800m was its just the newer .47 chip that ditches the 5" gray border bar along with some other benefits. They are both shifting to create a true 4k pic based on pixels on the screen. The 3550 also gets you a new lens, shorter throw, dynamic iris for better contrast, better color.

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post #8 of 23 Old 05-23-2019, 09:03 AM
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Do understand for true light control requires the rooms ceiling and walls to be a dark none reflective surface as just the light from the projector alone will light up the room with say a white ceiling. If is really light controlled I would make every effort to snag a Epson 5040 refurbed. All the projectors on your list have very poor contrast. As far as HDR no projector can really display it as it needs to be tone mapped either by the projector or externally and the 3550 is the first 4K DLP that does a decent job at it. If the Epson is not an option personally I would forget 4K and get something like a BenQ 2050a. You also need to give us a range of room dimensions , screen sizes, screen AR, throw range, seating distance as all are a factor in projector selection.
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post #9 of 23 Old 05-23-2019, 09:07 AM
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Well said. If you go the 5040 refurb route, it does take some effort and patience.

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post #10 of 23 Old 05-23-2019, 01:15 PM
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Originally Posted by dbpaddler View Post
Well said. If you go the 5040 refurb route, it does take some effort and patience.

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Why do you say that? Just because they are hard to snag and/or the quality or something else?

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post #11 of 23 Old 05-23-2019, 01:36 PM - Thread Starter
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Do understand for true light control requires the rooms ceiling and walls to be a dark none reflective surface as just the light from the projector alone will light up the room with say a white ceiling. If is really light controlled I would make every effort to snag a Epson 5040 refurbed. All the projectors on your list have very poor contrast. As far as HDR no projector can really display it as it needs to be tone mapped either by the projector or externally and the 3550 is the first 4K DLP that does a decent job at it. If the Epson is not an option personally I would forget 4K and get something like a BenQ 2050a. You also need to give us a range of room dimensions , screen sizes, screen AR, throw range, seating distance as all are a factor in projector selection.
Correct, the ceiling is actually painted with a rubberized flat black with exposed rafters, and the walls are a dark mocha, eggshell paint that is non-reflective. There is no reflective material in the entire room. The room dimensions are 17'x25' so I have ample space for throw distance.

I will look into the Epson, but it looks like it's much more than I'm willing to spend. Thank you for the suggestion. Another member offered the UHD60 on here, would there be any feedback on that aswell as comparison? Doing weeks of research into hours as I'm trying to get this finished up for the Stanley Cup Playoffs.
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post #12 of 23 Old 05-23-2019, 01:51 PM
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Why do you say that? Just because they are hard to snag and/or the quality or something else?

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It's only $1151 for a refurb. And yes to both. Refurb stock is sporadic. You play a refresh game day to and have your info at the ready to buy. And then QC seems to be spotty on them so you play a little roulette in getting a good one. Of course it's probably not as bad, because not everyone going for them is on this forum. So I'm sure the sample size is quite skewed.

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post #13 of 23 Old 05-23-2019, 02:12 PM
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It's only $1151 for a refurb. And yes to both. Refurb stock is sporadic. You play a refresh game day to and have your info at the ready to buy. And then QC seems to be spotty on them so you play a little roulette in getting a good one. Of course it's probably not as bad, because not everyone going for them is on this forum. So I'm sure the sample size is quite skewed.

https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink?url...3&share_type=t

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Gotcha, I actually got one after a few weeks of refreshing, setting up alerts etc (which didn't help) and I was worried after reading some of the posts, but luckily mine seems to be good so far!

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post #14 of 23 Old 05-23-2019, 02:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Hossien Oveys View Post
Gotcha, I actually got one after a few weeks of refreshing, setting up alerts etc (which didn't help) and I was worried after reading some of the posts, but luckily mine seems to be good so far!

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Nice. Congrats. I would have played the game, but I need a shorter throw. 3550 is my only real option. I don't mind waiting a year to see what else comes to market.

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post #15 of 23 Old 05-23-2019, 07:14 PM
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Correct, the ceiling is actually painted with a rubberized flat black with exposed rafters, and the walls are a dark mocha, eggshell paint that is non-reflective. There is no reflective material in the entire room. The room dimensions are 17'x25' so I have ample space for throw distance.

I will look into the Epson, but it looks like it's much more than I'm willing to spend. Thank you for the suggestion. Another member offered the UHD60 on here, would there be any feedback on that aswell as comparison? Doing weeks of research into hours as I'm trying to get this finished up for the Stanley Cup Playoffs.
Contrast is going to be the biggest factor in that room and the 4x DLP's are the worse possible choice. With the budget you have and an ideal room I would buy a used JVC before any of the DLP's. If your totally opposed to used here are some suggestions. The Optoma UHD60 or even better is the UHD65 as it has FI great for smoothing out sports broadcasts as these would be a better choice then any of the 4X DLP's with the .46 chip. Some projectors in your budget that have good contrast are Epson 5030 refurb (1080p), Epson 4000 (4K compatible, mediocre blacks), Sony 45es (1080p) and the before mentioned Epson 5040 refurbed.

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post #16 of 23 Old 05-23-2019, 10:55 PM
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Correct, the ceiling is actually painted with a rubberized flat black with exposed rafters, and the walls are a dark mocha, eggshell paint that is non-reflective. There is no reflective material in the entire room. The room dimensions are 17'x25' so I have ample space for throw distance.

I will look into the Epson, but it looks like it's much more than I'm willing to spend. Thank you for the suggestion. Another member offered the UHD60 on here, would there be any feedback on that aswell as comparison? Doing weeks of research into hours as I'm trying to get this finished up for the Stanley Cup Playoffs.
Keep in mind that the Epsons accept only a 10GB 4K input signal rather than the full 18GB of the Benqs. The Epsons also do not display 4K on screen -- they only double their 1080P resolution instead of quadrupling like the Benqs. In other words, they are only half-4K resolution. So you get better contrast but lower resolution if you go the Epson route.


If your room is 17x25, why have you decided on such a small screen of 120" ? How far away will your seats be ? Generally, you want a 16:9 screen that is large enough that the diagonal measure is equal to your viewing distance. So your eyes should not be further than 10' from a 120" screen. Especially if you have more than a single row of seating, a small screen feels like some viewers are in the cheap seats. Also, if you will be watching a lot of sports, some people really like having the bottom of the screen almost down a floor level. They say it feels like sitting court/rink-side.


When deciding on a projector, remember that they all have different lenses that require the projector be mounted at different distances and heights from a given size screen. It sounds like distance won't be a problem, but there will be a limit to how close you can get the lens to the ceiling and there will be a minimum distance from that to the top of the screen. So did you select a 120" screen because you took that into account and have low ceilings ?

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post #17 of 23 Old 05-24-2019, 04:15 AM
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If I were you I’d look into buying a used audio receiver on Craigslist or Facebook marketplace. I’d bet you could find one that supports 4k for $100 or even less.
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post #18 of 23 Old 05-24-2019, 06:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rekbones View Post
Contrast is going to be the biggest factor in that room and the 4x DLP's are the worse possible choice. With the budget you have and an ideal room I would buy a used JVC before any of the DLP's. If your totally opposed to used here are some suggestions. The Optoma UHD60 or even better is the UHD65 as it has FI great for smoothing out sports broadcasts as these would be a better choice then any of the 4X DLP's with the .46 chip. Some projectors in your budget that have good contrast are Epson 5030 refurb (1080p), Epson 4000 (4K compatible, mediocre blacks), Sony 45es (1080p) and the before mentioned Epson 5040 refurbed.
I'll send him my RS45 for $600 Loved it, but I outgrew the max screen in my small room. My 2050a is nice, but it's not the JVC.

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post #19 of 23 Old 05-24-2019, 07:23 AM - Thread Starter
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Keep in mind that the Epsons accept only a 10GB 4K input signal rather than the full 18GB of the Benqs. The Epsons also do not display 4K on screen -- they only double their 1080P resolution instead of quadrupling like the Benqs. In other words, they are only half-4K resolution. So you get better contrast but lower resolution if you go the Epson route.


If your room is 17x25, why have you decided on such a small screen of 120" ? How far away will your seats be ? Generally, you want a 16:9 screen that is large enough that the diagonal measure is equal to your viewing distance. So your eyes should not be further than 10' from a 120" screen. Especially if you have more than a single row of seating, a small screen feels like some viewers are in the cheap seats. Also, if you will be watching a lot of sports, some people really like having the bottom of the screen almost down a floor level. They say it feels like sitting court/rink-side.


When deciding on a projector, remember that they all have different lenses that require the projector be mounted at different distances and heights from a given size screen. It sounds like distance won't be a problem, but there will be a limit to how close you can get the lens to the ceiling and there will be a minimum distance from that to the top of the screen. So did you select a 120" screen because you took that into account and have low ceilings ?
The room is 17x25 but the projector wall is the shorter wall and due to a drainage pipe that had to be framed around I only have about a 12' built in section. 120" was the maximum I could fit with the abillity to have wall mounted speakers if I ever choose to. There will be a sectional about 10' feet from the screen. Still furnishing so not entirely sure yet. Rear surrounds are 12' from screen. The ceilings are only 8' aswell so the screen will be lower level.

I did decide on the HT2550. The price of $640 was just too low to pass up. And since I'm going budget for now it's the easier justifiable upgrade in 2~ years. I also picked up a Onkyo TXNR686 7.2Ch for $248 brand new from Frys.
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The room is 17x25 but the projector wall is the shorter wall and due to a drainage pipe that had to be framed around I only have about a 12' built in section. 120" was the maximum I could fit with the abillity to have wall mounted speakers if I ever choose to. There will be a sectional about 10' feet from the screen. Still furnishing so not entirely sure yet. Rear surrounds are 12' from screen. The ceilings are only 8' aswell so the screen will be lower level.

I did decide on the HT2550. The price of $640 was just too low to pass up. And since I'm going budget for now it's the easier justifiable upgrade in 2~ years. I also picked up a Onkyo TXNR686 7.2Ch for $248 brand new from Frys.
looking forward to your impression once all set up and experienced
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post #21 of 23 Old 05-24-2019, 06:40 PM
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Quote:
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The room is 17x25 but the projector wall is the shorter wall and due to a drainage pipe that had to be framed around I only have about a 12' built in section. 120" was the maximum I could fit with the abillity to have wall mounted speakers if I ever choose to. There will be a sectional about 10' feet from the screen. Still furnishing so not entirely sure yet. Rear surrounds are 12' from screen. The ceilings are only 8' aswell so the screen will be lower level.

I did decide on the HT2550. The price of $640 was just too low to pass up. And since I'm going budget for now it's the easier justifiable upgrade in 2~ years. I also picked up a Onkyo TXNR686 7.2Ch for $248 brand new from Frys.

Well, the 10' seating distance at least will be large enough, but I wonder about the rear 15' of the room. It will be tempting to put more seating back there and from there the 120" will seem small.

The Silver Ticket screens get good reviews, but their frames are not particularly wide and the early 4k DLPs like the HT2550 or my own TK800 do have an obvious 5" wide gray border on all four sides of the image and it will show up even on a dark paint -- mine shows up on my navy blue painted wall behind my screen. You can alleviate this by tacking a 5" wide strip of black velvet to the wall surrounding the screen. $20 for two yards of black velvet and you'll have enough not only for the border but to create masking panels top and bottom for watching 2.40:1 movies. I intend to do that when I move into my final room but haven't yet and the gray border is sometimes distracting with all lights out. $640 for the HT2550 is ridiculous !

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Last edited by dreamer; 05-24-2019 at 06:46 PM.
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post #22 of 23 Old 05-24-2019, 07:02 PM
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If his rear surrounds are 12' away from the screen, I'm guessing that extra space behind them is earmarked for things other than expanding his seating. Though he could always do the bar setup behind the main seating.

And I would've jumped on the 2550 too instead of 2050a. If only they shared the same throw range. Odd that the 2550 isn't the same as the 2050 and 3550. That would've prompted me to get some velvet sooner than later, although the elite Sable screens have a decent border.

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post #23 of 23 Old 05-24-2019, 08:35 PM - Thread Starter
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If his rear surrounds are 12' away from the screen, I'm guessing that extra space behind them is earmarked for things other than expanding his seating. Though he could always do the bar setup behind the main seating.

And I would've jumped on the 2550 too instead of 2050a. If only they shared the same throw range. Odd that the 2550 isn't the same as the 2050 and 3550. That would've prompted me to get some velvet sooner than later, although the elite Sable screens have a decent border.

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Correct there will be bar seating behind the couch. We have a main bar, but this is for more additional seating. There will be a rather large sectional as the "main row". It's also just extra room for kiddos (have a 4 year old, and 1 year old). It ties into a barn door that ties into the play room / PC room.
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