Need Help! Equipment for "semi" dedicated HT room - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 9 Old 07-17-2019, 02:55 AM - Thread Starter
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Need Help! Equipment for "semi" dedicated HT room

Hello everyone!


It's been a LONG time since I've posted on here and even longer since I've had to ask for help getting a projector (put it this way, my current projector is the 720p Panasonic AE900u, which I still love).


So the time has come to change my basement romper room into semi dedicated HT. I say semi because it will still be used for the kids to hang out a little etc BUT I will be using it primarily to watch movies/shows on the new projection system.


So first thing's first... ...my assumption is that a new projector will be leaps and bounds better than my current Panny. This thing is 15 years old, its 720 and I'm sure projector tech has come a long way.


That being said, I'm a little confused by HDR vs 4K, etc. Is HDR and 4K the same thing? Will I see a huge improvement from just regular 1080p to 4K/HDR? I know I need the prerequisite items to feed the projector 4K, but just wondering if it would be leaps and bounds better, or just marginally better. Wondering if I should consider any 1080p only projectors?


My room is 25 x 12 and I'll be watching from about 23 feet away projected onto a painted screen on the wall.


Here's what i'm thinking for equipment:


Projector: Optoma UHD50 (or 51 if there is a imagine quality reason why) or BenQ HT2550, or any other similarly priced projector that you guys would suggest be better.
Screen: Painted screen on the wall, approx. 130 inches diagonally. Don't know if I should go gray, silver or white. Depends on which projector, correct?
Receiver: Thinking of the Denon AVR-X2500H (4K Ultra HD 60hz supports HDCP 2.2 on all HDMI ports)
Source 1: Amazon Fire Stick 4k
Source 2: Sony UBP-X700 4k Blu Ray Player
Cables: I'm a little confused here as well. I buy my cables from Monoprice and looked up 4K HDMI cables and see all different ones, some 4K at 24hz, some 4K @60hz. No idea what I should be getting here...


Is the items above all I need to get true 4K and the best out of these projectors? Or am I missing something?


Another question, is Rainbow effect still a thing with the new tech out there? I tried an Infocus projector about 15 years ago and it had bad rainbow effect for me. Just wondering if that's still a consideration in DLP vs LCD these days?


I know this is a lot so thanks for anyone that can help out!


Best Regards,
Midfi
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post #2 of 9 Old 07-17-2019, 07:35 AM
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At 23' from a 130" screen unless you have the eyes of a Hawk I doubt you will see any difference between 4K and 1080p. Screen type has more to due with the room environment then the projector. A bat cave with no white reflective surfaces a white screen is best if ambient light is 100% controlled. Other then that screen selection can get very complicated. Projectors are not actually capable of projecting HDR so the projector or external source needs to "Tone Map" HDR to closer to what the projector can display. 4K will cost you 2 to 3 times what 1080p costs for very equivalent PQ. RBE is still an issue with single chip projectors, some are worse then others so all you can do is try it and find out for your self.

"Smart enough to know better, to old to care" ------ Dedicated Bat Cave Home Theater, JVC RS49U/Mitsubishi HC7900DW Projector, 110" 16:9 Jamestown screen with variable power masking for CIW 2.50:1 to 16:9, Marantz 7009 with 7.1.4 Atmos with Ohm mains,3 DIY Subs (2 15" (1 ported, 1 sealed and a 12" 4th order bandpass), 1 DIY butt kicker, Custom Built HTPC, 18TB DroboFS NAS
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post #3 of 9 Old 07-17-2019, 07:57 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks rekbones. The Optoma UHD50 doesn't seem all that expensive at about $1100ish. However, if what you're saying is true, and I wouldn't notice a big diff between that 4K and a good 1080p projector, is there one or a couple that stand out that I should instead consider that have a decent amount of price diff? It looks like the Benq HT2050 for about $700 and Epson 2150 for similar money look like top picks. I don't mind forking over for 4K for $400-$500, but not if its not going to make almost no diff in what I see for pic quality.


Just for reference, its a basement room with a small window maybe 30 x 12 close to the screen, but with the ability to block almost all light with room darkening shades, and more windows in the back of the room, but similar capabilities.


Thanks again!
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post #4 of 9 Old 07-17-2019, 10:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by midfidude View Post
Hello everyone!


It's been a LONG time since I've posted on here and even longer since I've had to ask for help getting a projector (put it this way, my current projector is the 720p Panasonic AE900u, which I still love).


So the time has come to change my basement romper room into semi dedicated HT. I say semi because it will still be used for the kids to hang out a little etc BUT I will be using it primarily to watch movies/shows on the new projection system.


So first thing's first... ...my assumption is that a new projector will be leaps and bounds better than my current Panny. This thing is 15 years old, its 720 and I'm sure projector tech has come a long way.


That being said, I'm a little confused by HDR vs 4K, etc. Is HDR and 4K the same thing? Will I see a huge improvement from just regular 1080p to 4K/HDR? I know I need the prerequisite items to feed the projector 4K, but just wondering if it would be leaps and bounds better, or just marginally better. Wondering if I should consider any 1080p only projectors?


My room is 25 x 12 and I'll be watching from about 23 feet away projected onto a painted screen on the wall.


Here's what i'm thinking for equipment:


Projector: Optoma UHD50 (or 51 if there is a imagine quality reason why) or BenQ HT2550, or any other similarly priced projector that you guys would suggest be better.
Screen: Painted screen on the wall, approx. 130 inches diagonally. Don't know if I should go gray, silver or white. Depends on which projector, correct?
Receiver: Thinking of the Denon AVR-X2500H (4K Ultra HD 60hz supports HDCP 2.2 on all HDMI ports)
Source 1: Amazon Fire Stick 4k
Source 2: Sony UBP-X700 4k Blu Ray Player
Cables: I'm a little confused here as well. I buy my cables from Monoprice and looked up 4K HDMI cables and see all different ones, some 4K at 24hz, some 4K @60hz. No idea what I should be getting here...


Is the items above all I need to get true 4K and the best out of these projectors? Or am I missing something?


Another question, is Rainbow effect still a thing with the new tech out there? I tried an Infocus projector about 15 years ago and it had bad rainbow effect for me. Just wondering if that's still a consideration in DLP vs LCD these days?


I know this is a lot so thanks for anyone that can help out!


Best Regards,
Midfi
Is there a reason you want to sit so far back? I would try for ~10ft seating from a 130in screen. Also I would try to get a 10ft grey screen width for a 138in diagonal. You will see zero benefit in terms of increased 4K resolution from 23ft:

http://s3.carltonbale.com/resolution_chart.html

The projector can be mounted as close as 11ft 6in for a 130in screen:

https://www.projectorcentral.com/Opt...ulator-pro.htm

I would set the equipment on a stand against the wall so that it's as close as possible to the projector to minimize HDMI cable lengths. Long cables = problems.

The UHD50/51A gets good marks for low or no RBE from online reviews and I've never seen any on mine.


Edit: 4K = 3840 x 2160 pixel and HDR = High Dynamic Range which also requires 10bit data and DCI-P3 colour gamut, although the wider gamut is kinda optional.

Last edited by DunMunro; 07-17-2019 at 03:30 PM.
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post #5 of 9 Old 07-17-2019, 03:35 PM - Thread Starter
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Unfortunately the layout of the room doesn't afford us to sit closer. We may put a loveseat width row in front of there so that viewing distance might be more like 18' which would help a lot. I know it still not gargantuan, but i'm okay with that.

This might lead me towards the 1080p route and save the money and put it towards the screen, etc.


What about the cables? If i'm buying new cables, may as well go with the right ones to make them work with today's 4K/HDR.

Thanks
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post #6 of 9 Old 07-17-2019, 08:00 PM
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If cable length is under 25' regular 18Gb rated coper cables are most likely OK. Over that length you should get opt cables but they are expensive. You mention the room is fairly ambient light controlled but no mention of the ceiling/wall color as this is very important in screen selection.

"Smart enough to know better, to old to care" ------ Dedicated Bat Cave Home Theater, JVC RS49U/Mitsubishi HC7900DW Projector, 110" 16:9 Jamestown screen with variable power masking for CIW 2.50:1 to 16:9, Marantz 7009 with 7.1.4 Atmos with Ohm mains,3 DIY Subs (2 15" (1 ported, 1 sealed and a 12" 4th order bandpass), 1 DIY butt kicker, Custom Built HTPC, 18TB DroboFS NAS
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post #7 of 9 Old 07-18-2019, 01:29 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by rekbones View Post
If cable length is under 25' regular 18Gb rated coper cables are most likely OK. Over that length you should get opt cables but they are expensive. You mention the room is fairly ambient light controlled but no mention of the ceiling/wall color as this is very important in screen selection.
Ah yes, the ceiling and wall colors are not ideal. The ceiling is a drop ceiling which is white and the walls are a dark red on top with white wainscoting on the bottom. So not ideal at all but I don't know what that does for screen color...
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post #8 of 9 Old 07-21-2019, 01:24 AM
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Originally Posted by midfidude View Post
Ah yes, the ceiling and wall colors are not ideal. The ceiling is a drop ceiling which is white and the walls are a dark red on top with white wainscoting on the bottom. So not ideal at all but I don't know what that does for screen color...
Well, if you want the room to be at least semi-dedicated, you must try doing something about the walls and ceiling. My room is semi-dedicated too. I didn't want to have it permanently black (because it's my living room/studio and I didn't want it to be ugly), so I installed curtains 140cm on the sides of the screen, and on the wall/windows opposite to the screen. This opposite wall has windows and a glass door (which I can shut with an opaque blind), so it allows for a huge amount of light to get into the room when I'm not using the projector. Still, even when retracted, the black curtains give the room a heavier look, so that's something to consider. For the ceiling, I have installed these boards covered in black velvet, and they can be attached and detached using magnets. The goal was not to compromise the white ceiling too much, but now it's obvious that I will rarely remove the boards. Still, I used hexagonal boards in a somewhat decorative effort. But nowadays I would've thought about some system to cover and uncover the sides and ceiling. For a compromise solution, I would use dark navy blue instead of black.
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post #9 of 9 Old 07-21-2019, 09:41 AM - Thread Starter
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Well, if you want the room to be at least semi-dedicated, you must try doing something about the walls and ceiling. My room is semi-dedicated too. I didn't want to have it permanently black (because it's my living room/studio and I didn't want it to be ugly), so I installed curtains 140cm on the sides of the screen, and on the wall/windows opposite to the screen. This opposite wall has windows and a glass door (which I can shut with an opaque blind), so it allows for a huge amount of light to get into the room when I'm not using the projector. Still, even when retracted, the black curtains give the room a heavier look, so that's something to consider. For the ceiling, I have installed these boards covered in black velvet, and they can be attached and detached using magnets. The goal was not to compromise the white ceiling too much, but now it's obvious that I will rarely remove the boards. Still, I used hexagonal boards in a somewhat decorative effort. But nowadays I would've thought about some system to cover and uncover the sides and ceiling. For a compromise solution, I would use dark navy blue instead of black.
Thanks Descalabro. Given its a basement room, I'm thinking of painting the grid and ceiling panels black to make this work better. Likewise, I'm thinking of maybe painting the waitscotting on the bottom of the walls with a semi gloss gray (I know matte would be better, but I don't need the kids marking it all up either!).
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