Benq tk850 (No Price Talk) - Page 2 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #31 of 202 Old 10-10-2019, 03:55 AM
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I am also interested on input lag and color wheel speed and total segments.
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post #32 of 202 Old 10-10-2019, 03:25 PM
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Is there anyone more knowledgeable than myself that can list the advantages of the TK850 over the TK800M? Trying to compare the two and it's all a bit confusing at to what is new on the TK850. Things like tone mapping are listed on the specs page of the TK850, but I don't see that feature listed in the TK800M spec page (unless I'm missing it). If anyone can give a little more insight, would be appreciated.

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post #33 of 202 Old 10-11-2019, 12:24 PM
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I am also interested on input lag and color wheel speed and total segments.


I would not expect lower input lag than what the Ht3550 can currently achieve.

Color wheel will be some variation of the RGBWRGBW that all of these bright Quad shift models employ.

What to do if you find yourself stuck with no hope of rescue:
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post #34 of 202 Old 10-11-2019, 02:22 PM
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Is there anyone more knowledgeable than myself that can list the advantages of the TK850 over the TK800M? Trying to compare the two and it's all a bit confusing at to what is new on the TK850. Things like tone mapping are listed on the specs page of the TK850, but I don't see that feature listed in the TK800M spec page (unless I'm missing it). If anyone can give a little more insight, would be appreciated.


Vertical lens shift, more zoom range, MEMC motion interpolation, HDR Pro tone mapping... that’s all I can say for now.
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post #35 of 202 Old 10-11-2019, 02:30 PM
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Originally Posted by sage11x View Post
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Originally Posted by bboucher790 View Post
Is there anyone more knowledgeable than myself that can list the advantages of the TK850 over the TK800M? Trying to compare the two and it's all a bit confusing at to what is new on the TK850. Things like tone mapping are listed on the specs page of the TK850, but I don't see that feature listed in the TK800M spec page (unless I'm missing it). If anyone can give a little more insight, would be appreciated.


Vertical lens shift, more zoom range, MEMC motion interpolation, HDR Pro tone mapping... that’️s all I can say for now. [IMG class=inlineimg]/forum/images/smilies/smile.gif[/IMG]
Great thanks!
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post #36 of 202 Old 10-11-2019, 02:47 PM
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Originally Posted by sage11x View Post

Color wheel will be some variation of the RGBWRGBW that all of these bright Quad shift models employ.
Thanks.

That means an 8 segment color wheel.
If that's the case, then it'll be pretty cool.

An 8-segment color wheel, offers the engineers the opportunity to achieve enough speed to mitigate any rainbow effect issues.
A high speed, would definitely be a strong sales point.

They did a great job with the HT2050/3050 models on that, so I hope they can duplicate that with this model.
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post #37 of 202 Old 10-11-2019, 02:55 PM
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Gotta be honest, I bought a TK800M and I freaking love it!

3D isn't broken like the TK800 and images pop. I been playing Gears of War 4 and Resident Evil 2 remake and omg the detail!

if the 850 is the same but better tone mapping I am all in on the 850..
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post #38 of 202 Old 10-11-2019, 03:00 PM
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Originally Posted by longhornsk57 View Post
Gotta be honest, I bought a TK800M and I freaking love it!

3D isn't broken like the TK800 and images pop. I been playing Gears of War 4 and Resident Evil 2 remake and omg the detail!

if the 850 is the same but better tone mapping I am all in on the 850..

Consider that the TK800M is currently the best XPR based DLP for gaming due to it's lower than typical (for XPR) input lag, if the TK850 is similar to the 3550 then the input lag will be higher than the TK800M.

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post #39 of 202 Old 10-11-2019, 04:47 PM
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Originally Posted by longhornsk57 View Post
Gotta be honest, I bought a TK800M and I freaking love it!

3D isn't broken like the TK800 and images pop. I been playing Gears of War 4 and Resident Evil 2 remake and omg the detail!

if the 850 is the same but better tone mapping I am all in on the 850..

Consider that the TK800M is currently the best XPR based DLP for gaming due to it's lower than typical (for XPR) input lag, if the TK850 is similar to the 3550 then the input lag will be higher than the TK800M.

- Jason
It sounds like it will be the 3550 without 100% Rec 709 or DCI 95%. Should be brighter and have lower input lag, with slightly lower Rec 709.

Also everyone is always focused on input lag for gaming. Almost as important, for me, is motion handling. My plasma destroys my IPS for motion, but struggles with input lag. However, there is a clear difference in motion between those two technologies. LCD is simply not as good for motion as other display methods. DLP is a huge factor that I considered when making my decision over the LCD Epson 5050. As much as I wanted to get the 5050, sports and games will look blurry to me.
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post #40 of 202 Old 10-11-2019, 07:47 PM
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I would not expect lower input lag than what the Ht3550 can currently achieve.

Color wheel will be some variation of the RGBWRGBW that all of these bright Quad shift models employ.
Interesting. I would expect the TK series would be focused delivering low input lag, as did the 800. You seem to have some inside info on this product, but I'd be surprised if it didn't end up having input lag similar to its cousins.
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post #41 of 202 Old 10-12-2019, 02:18 AM
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Goodmorning everyone. Does anyone know if in January it will also be sold in Europe?
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post #42 of 202 Old 10-12-2019, 09:39 AM
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Originally Posted by evonimos View Post
Thanks.



That means an 8 segment color wheel.

If that's the case, then it'll be pretty cool.



An 8-segment color wheel, offers the engineers the opportunity to achieve enough speed to mitigate any rainbow effect issues.

A high speed, would definitely be a strong sales point.



They did a great job with the HT2050/3050 models on that, so I hope they can duplicate that with this model.


Well it will be some variation.

Just an FYI, all the Quad shift 4K DLPs have an effective ‘4X’ color wheel speed due to the fact that the system has to run at 240Hz in order to produce enough pixels to complete a full 4K image at 60Hz. I’ve gone into great detail on this in the past and I won’t wander back into those weeds here but any .47” quad shift should be reasonably resistant to RBE— much more so than ‘2X’ Hd DLPs.

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post #43 of 202 Old 10-12-2019, 09:56 AM
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Interesting. I would expect the TK series would be focused delivering low input lag, as did the 800. You seem to have some inside info on this product, but I'd be surprised if it didn't end up having input lag similar to its cousins.


I have open communication with BenQ, yes.

The issue seems to be the MEMC feature. On all of these DLPs with 4K motion interpolation, even when the feature is disabled it causes the projector to have more input latency than models without the feature equipped. This happens on both Optoma and BenQ models.

What to do if you find yourself stuck with no hope of rescue:
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post #44 of 202 Old 10-12-2019, 09:57 AM
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Goodmorning everyone. Does anyone know if in January it will also be sold in Europe?


January appears to be the target for the European release date. Still waiting on word if it will come to the states earlier...

What to do if you find yourself stuck with no hope of rescue:
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post #45 of 202 Old 10-12-2019, 04:34 PM
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Consider that the TK800M is currently the best XPR based DLP for gaming due to it's lower than typical (for XPR) input lag, if the TK850 is similar to the 3550 then the input lag will be higher than the TK800M.



- Jason
I think people get too caught up in a frame or two max per second.

I don't play competitive FPS games and if I did I doubt I'd be using a projector anyways.

Games like Gears, Horizon Zero Dawn, even Smash Bros and Zelda etc, a few ms here or there isn't noticeable. I had the 3550 for a couple weeks and gaming was totally fine. It just wasn't bright and pop enough for me, I like that white slice.
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post #46 of 202 Old 10-12-2019, 09:03 PM
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Originally Posted by DaGamePimp View Post
Consider that the TK800M is currently the best XPR based DLP for gaming due to it's lower than typical (for XPR) input lag, if the TK850 is similar to the 3550 then the input lag will be higher than the TK800M.



- Jason
I think people get too caught up in a frame or two max per second.

I don't play competitive FPS games and if I did I doubt I'd be using a projector anyways.

Games like Gears, Horizon Zero Dawn, even Smash Bros and Zelda etc, a few ms here or there isn't noticeable. I had the 3550 for a couple weeks and gaming was totally fine. It just wasn't bright and pop enough for me, I like that white slice.
I find it annoying, to be honest. Playing on my plasma works fine, but when I switch back to my IPS it feels like a million bucks.
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post #47 of 202 Old 10-12-2019, 10:08 PM
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I've never owned a plasma but gaming on the tk800M on 150" in 4K is the height of awesomeness.
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post #48 of 202 Old 10-13-2019, 05:28 AM
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Yea I can’t wait to get my home theater in March, gaming will be transformed. TK800M seems to fit the bill. Crossing my fingers for low input lag with the TK850.
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Yea I can’t wait to get my home theater in March, gaming will be transformed. TK800M seems to fit the bill. Crossing my fingers for low input lag with the TK850.


Gaming has been great with my TK800M, the first projector I’ve had. I find first person shooters tough on a 120’ screen though, and I don’t normally get motion sick.


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post #50 of 202 Old 10-13-2019, 08:19 AM
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January appears to be the target for the European release date. Still waiting on word if it will come to the states earlier...
It's strange, I can't find any information about this projector on the BenQ.de version of the site. (The link on the top post doesn't work for me). I *can* find information on the US site, though, which makes me wonder if it's coming to the US first?

This is an important topic for me because I want to upgrade our failing 720p projector and I'm thinking about holding off for the tk850. I can wait until January, but if it's going to be March or June before Amazon gets it here in Berlin then I will probably have to settle for a lesser projector.
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post #51 of 202 Old 10-15-2019, 07:02 AM
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I think the TK850 is what I'm going to try too. I also am using a decrepit w600 right now, so it will be a big step up for me in resolution. That one has 2800 lumens projecting on a 1.1 gain light rejecting screen. I am tempted by the HT3550, but sometimes that W600 is not quite bright enough for afternoon viewing. I love it at night. I think the extra brightness of the TK850 will be a good fit and I think the addition of the iris is going to help with nighttime viewing. Really looking forward to the release.

I have been watching the HT3550 pretty closely. I noticed a few days ago, the list price at Benq has gone up a couple hundred dollars for the HT3550. I don't have any first hand knowledge but I suspect that they are trying to figure out how the Trump administration's tariffs plan is going to shake out for them before pricing the TK850 for release. Maybe they raised the HT3550 so there would be a little room to insert the TK850 into the price sheet without coming in too low.
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post #52 of 202 Old 10-15-2019, 08:39 AM
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It's strange, I can't find any information about this projector on the BenQ.de version of the site. (The link on the top post doesn't work for me). I *can* find information on the US site, though, which makes me wonder if it's coming to the US first?



This is an important topic for me because I want to upgrade our failing 720p projector and I'm thinking about holding off for the tk850. I can wait until January, but if it's going to be March or June before Amazon gets it here in Berlin then I will probably have to settle for a lesser projector.


It’s not technically announced yet. This thread exists mostly due to BenQ leaking the product page (as well as information me and Scotty have shared over the prior year).

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post #53 of 202 Old 10-15-2019, 08:55 AM
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Originally Posted by longhornsk57 View Post
I think people get too caught up in a frame or two max per second.

I don't play competitive FPS games and if I did I doubt I'd be using a projector anyways.

Games like Gears, Horizon Zero Dawn, even Smash Bros and Zelda etc, a few ms here or there isn't noticeable. I had the 3550 for a couple weeks and gaming was totally fine. It just wasn't bright and pop enough for me, I like that white slice.


This is exactly why I stopped making black and white recommendations when it comes to whether or not a display is suitable for gaming. Everyone’s tolerance here is different. I think you’re right in that most people won’t notice the lag. The lag will still effect them to one degree or another but the majority likely won’t notice it. I will say, FOR ME, the 4K DLPs still have too much lag for me to consider them a serious gaming display. But then, I’m VERY sensitive to input lag and even more so to pixel response/blur. I think more people might notice the difference if they had access to multiple displays but this is something I’ve sort of gone down the rabbit hole with and I doubt many would be willing to chase the issue as far as I have.

I was very happy with the last gen of HD DLPs especially BenQ’s HT2050A for console gaming. I still think it’s one of the best console gaming displays on the market. It’s combination of virtually non-existent lag and excellent motion resolution makes it a standout. So sensitive am I to pixel response/blur that I find IPS monitors and VA TVs to be virtually unusable for gaming. Because of this I’ve been sort of stuck at 1080p with the BenQ DLP, a pair of Panasonic plasmas and a TN pro gaming monitor that I’ve used for years. That is until recently when I decided to test out one of the only 4K TN gaming monitors on the market, the BenQ EL2870u (review inbound).

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post #54 of 202 Old 10-15-2019, 09:36 PM
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Ya I been playing Gears 4 local co-op and Smash Bros on the TK800M and it's a dream and I don't notice any lag, so I'm thinking it just doesn't bother me no matter what.

Nobody at my house seems to notice any lag as well..
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post #55 of 202 Old 10-16-2019, 06:31 AM
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This is exactly why I stopped making black and white recommendations when it comes to whether or not a display is suitable for gaming. Everyone’s tolerance here is different. I think you’re right in that most people won’t notice the lag. The lag will still effect them to one degree or another but the majority likely won’t notice it. I will say, FOR ME, the 4K DLPs still have too much lag for me to consider them a serious gaming display. But then, I’m VERY sensitive to input lag and even more so to pixel response/blur. I think more people might notice the difference if they had access to multiple displays but this is something I’ve sort of gone down the rabbit hole with and I doubt many would be willing to chase the issue as far as I have.

I was very happy with the last gen of HD DLPs especially BenQ’s HT2050A for console gaming. I still think it’s one of the best console gaming displays on the market. It’s combination of virtually non-existent lag and excellent motion resolution makes it a standout. So sensitive am I to pixel response/blur that I find IPS monitors and VA TVs to be virtually unusable for gaming. Because of this I’ve been sort of stuck at 1080p with the BenQ DLP, a pair of Panasonic plasmas and a TN pro gaming monitor that I’ve used for years. That is until recently when I decided to test out one of the only 4K TN gaming monitors on the market, the BenQ EL2870u (review inbound).
I have seen this in real-time. As a former PC gamer, I told non-techie PS4 friends to disable V-Sync for lower input delay. They had no idea what I was talking about. None of them noticed a difference when they disabled V-Sync. I, on the other hand, can notice the delay instantly and cannot play Rocket League with V-Sync on.

Additionally, I cannot handle the motion handling of LCD technology (TN is borderline). It's utter trash IMO. I only game on plasma (terrible input lag on my set), and formerly on my TN monitor. DLP is the next frontier for me. I was going to go with the 5050 due to its sub 30ms input delay, until I realized it was an LCD. Nope, not happening. Not spending $3000 on a display that can't do motion well. I notice LCD's poor motion handling for not only gaming, but in movies and TV as well.

Originally, I was going to go with OLED until I started to research 4K projectors. They seem to have a good balance of price, motion, input lag, massive size, and picture quality. The decision was made . I'm hoping I am fine with the 45ms delay of the TK800M. After gaming for years in 4K, I cannot go back. I know you said the PS4 Pro isn't a good 4K gaming machine, but I have to disagree with you on that one. It's been a fantastic 4K device, even if checker-boarding isn't always perfect. Haven't had many issues with performance, either.

With the PS5 coming soon, I'm hoping that the TK850 can work some gaming magic. Would love to see the added features in the TK850, while keeping the input lag in the same ballpark as the TK800M. I'll be patiently waiting .

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post #56 of 202 Old 10-17-2019, 01:16 AM
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I think the TK850 is what I'm going to try too.

I have been watching the HT3550 pretty closely. I noticed a few days ago, the list price at Benq has gone up a couple hundred dollars for the HT3550. .
Not just the HT 3550 went up in price, It seems their whole lineup has increased $200-$300 in the last month.
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post #57 of 202 Old 10-17-2019, 06:11 PM
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Not just the HT 3550 went up in price, It seems their whole lineup has increased $200-$300 in the last month.


Tariffs.
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post #58 of 202 Old 10-18-2019, 09:07 AM
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Quick update. I know a lot of you guys/gals are watching this space and waiting for this model to release. While I don’t have a firm date yet there has been some movement on this model and we might see a US launch sooner than anticipated. Also, I’ve just received word that review samples are being shipped out soon so there is a good chance I’ll be able to share some hands on impressions in the very near future.

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post #59 of 202 Old 10-18-2019, 09:10 AM
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Quick update. I know a lot of you guys/gals are watching this space and waiting for this model to release. While I don’t have a firm date yet there has been some movement on this model and we might see a US launch sooner than anticipated. Also, I’ve just received word that review samples are being shipped out soon so there is a good chance I’ll be able to share some hands on impressions in the very near future.


Great news. Thanks for the update.
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post #60 of 202 Old 10-18-2019, 09:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sage11x View Post
Quick update. I know a lot of you guys/gals are watching this space and waiting for this model to release. While I don’t have a firm date yet there has been some movement on this model and we might see a US launch sooner than anticipated. Also, I’ve just received word that review samples are being shipped out soon so there is a good chance I’ll be able to share some hands on impressions in the very near future.
Wahoo! I'll be watching closely.... I'm needing to order soon and need to decide between 800M and 850.
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