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post #7411 of 8066 Old 06-03-2019, 09:49 AM
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Originally Posted by RUR View Post
Good news, Trinnovites*! Curt showed me the latest Beta, and it does allow copying/moving target curves between pre-sets.
I've been waiting for that feature for a LONG time....really looking forward to seeing this in practice.

Quote:
Looks like the official release is getting close.
Some things take time, but the features keep improving....

Quote:
* Trinnovians?
Trinnovists?
Or, since Curt and I are rabid espresso makers, we could be Trinnovistas?
I like Trinnovistas too. I'm also a fan of a good Italian espresso...although I do put a time limit on when I drink it to avoid being up until the early hours of the morning these days...

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post #7412 of 8066 Old 06-03-2019, 09:49 AM
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Originally Posted by A7mad78 View Post
Nice! What machine are you using? Curt's got an Alexandria with a couple of Mazzers and I use an R58v2 + Baratza Forte.
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post #7413 of 8066 Old 06-03-2019, 09:58 AM
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Originally Posted by santodx5 View Post
I use the zoom buttom after shaping the curve....
"Zoom" can be applied at any time - it doesn't affect the curve, itself.

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How do u apply a target curve? So edit, amplitude only, click apply and compute then save to a preset?
Yep, that's exactly what you do. Make sure you've linked the appropriate channels before you create your new curve(s).

Edited to add: BTW, to change the Y axis scale in the Optimizer Graphs, use the + and - buttons lower right in your last photo under the "Y".
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post #7414 of 8066 Old 06-03-2019, 10:25 AM
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Originally Posted by sdrucker View Post



Some things take time, but the features keep improving....



I hope it’s not suffering from feature (scope) creep.
I get it that they want to get it right before release but this release has taken far too long. There are also two important updates that they promised us this year. Dts:x pro and a little less important to me at least imax.

I think 14 months between releases is far too long. It’s time to Freeze -> Release, so they can work on bug fixes whilst gearing up to deliver the next major release which at this point is quite some way off.

There, done. Somebody had to say it.



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post #7415 of 8066 Old 06-03-2019, 10:43 AM
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Originally Posted by kingwiggi View Post
I hope it’s not suffering from feature (scope) creep.
I get it that they want to get it right before release but this release has taken far too long. There are also two important updates that they promised us this year. Dts:x pro and a little less important to me at least imax.

I think 14 months between releases is far too long. It’s time to Freeze -> Release, so they can work on bug fixes whilst gearing up to deliver the next major release which at this point is quite some way off.

There, done. Somebody had to say it.
I hear your dissatisfction. It all depends on perspective and past experience. I am incredibly impressed that the improvements/fixes continue to come, regardless of the time between them. I was a Datasat owner previously, and the Trinnov update frequency surpasses it. And before that, I had other chip based processors. Would less time between updates be better? I guess, but I'm not the least bit dissatisfied. Trinnov at least, has a process where user input can be evaluated and eventually put into the system if it makes sense to do so. I'm not aware of any other audio processor company that listens like Trinnov (on the video side, Lumagen does listen to user input as well).
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post #7416 of 8066 Old 06-03-2019, 11:01 AM
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Trinnov Altitude

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Originally Posted by audioguy View Post
I hear your dissatisfction. It all depends on perspective and past experience. I am incredibly impressed that the improvements/fixes continue to come, regardless of the time between them. I was a Datasat owner previously, and the Trinnov update frequency surpasses it. And before that, I had other chip based processors. Would less time between updates be better? I guess, but I'm not the least bit dissatisfied. Trinnov at least, has a process where user input can be evaluated and eventually put into the system if it makes sense to do so. I'm not aware of any other audio processor company that listens like Trinnov (on the video side, Lumagen does listen to user input as well).


Not dissatisfied at all. I don’t currently have any problems with my Altitude. Although I do think most would like to see more frequent releases.

Trinnov does a very good job at identifying and providing small patches to certain machines that not everyone is aware of but more people would benefit if they knew the patch was available. I certainly think that could be handled better with more frequent releases or patch rollouts.

My understanding is that the next major release will allow certain owners to apply the update themselves. Certainly looking forward to that since we will be less reliant on the mothership to perform our updates which in turn might in fact help Trinnov to provide the updates more frequently.




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post #7417 of 8066 Old 06-03-2019, 11:38 AM
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Originally Posted by RUR View Post
Good news, Trinnovites*! Curt showed me the latest Beta, and it does allow copying/moving target curves between pre-sets.

A very welcome feature! It can't come soon enough IMO. That alone should save lots of time and tedious work. I have one of the "beta" rc versions, rc4, and would like to see as an official release soon. For me, it's worth a risk to try a "beta" but then I'm not going to a CI if a problem develops. Risk tolerance is variable

Steve

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post #7418 of 8066 Old 06-03-2019, 11:45 AM
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Originally Posted by santodx5 View Post
Can someone post their's Harman curve here? I will try it.


Thanks
Santo -

I see you are having some issues and maybe need some help. Feel free to give me a call and I will be sure to get you the help you may need.

Thanks
Craig Shumer
Theatermax LLC
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post #7419 of 8066 Old 06-03-2019, 04:06 PM
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Santo -

I see you are having some issues and maybe need some help. Feel free to give me a call and I will be sure to get you the help you may need.

Thanks
Craig Shumer
Theatermax LLC
I don't think Santo is in the US so could be a time-zone issue with contacting him!
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post #7420 of 8066 Old 06-03-2019, 07:29 PM
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Originally Posted by audioguy View Post
Having now calibrated a Trinnov in 4 different spaces, the same target curve doesn't work in every room. Room treatment, speaker choice and user preference play a key role.

That said, I have been experimenting with all kinds of target curves since the Trinnov makes it so easy to change and compare. (In fact, I can't seem to stop!!). And most of the curves I like tend to have a lot in common, and do have some of the same characteristics to the curves you pointed to. My most recent attempts have been with a curve where the flat part in Ken's curve has a very slight downward slope. It sounds particularly nice for music.

What I am discovering is the audio mix can dictate which curve works better for which movie. Almost reminds of the days of analog turntables where adjusting VTA for each record was a deal for those who were particularly obsessive (and while I can be very obsessive, I never went that far).

The good news: Once I get the general shape of the target down, and while small adjustments may be audible, I still end up with slightly different versions of awesomeness !!

yeah i just installed a multiroom system for our house and it allows for EQ in each room. No question, the target curve in each room ended up being quite different to get thing sounding right.

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post #7421 of 8066 Old 06-04-2019, 03:33 AM
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I don't think Santo is in the US so could be a time-zone issue with contacting him!

Thank you I am not from USA. I'm in Asia.


My system will be dramatically change soon as I will have my center speaker and Prism converter.


I will post result here when they are ready. Right now I'm pretty happy with my 2.1
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post #7422 of 8066 Old 06-04-2019, 05:02 AM
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Originally Posted by santodx5 View Post
Thank you I am not from USA. I'm in Asia.


My system will be dramatically change soon as I will have my center speaker and Prism converter.


I will post result here when they are ready. Right now I'm pretty happy with my 2.1
What is a "Prism converter"?
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post #7423 of 8066 Old 06-04-2019, 05:13 AM
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Originally Posted by RUR View Post
Good news, Trinnovites*! Curt showed me the latest Beta, and it does allow copying/moving target curves between pre-sets.

Looks like the official release is getting close.



* Trinnovians?
Trinnovists?
Or, since Curt and I are rabid espresso makers, we could be Trinnovistas?
Great news! Fingers crossed for a save and load feature to work in a similar way to the PEQ profiles!
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post #7424 of 8066 Old 06-04-2019, 05:51 AM
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Great news! Fingers crossed for a save and load feature to work in a similar way to the PEQ profiles!
The only thing I'm not sure about is if when you do a save, you are saving ALL of the targets for that preset (I hope not) OR just the target for that speaker (I hope so)
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Originally Posted by audioguy View Post
The only thing I'm not sure about is if when you do a save, you are saving ALL of the targets for that preset (I hope not) OR just the target for that speaker (I hope so)
It really needs to be a load/save option on a per speaker target basis. The current 'linking' option is a waste of time the way it currently works, unless you're starting from scratch on a preset.

If for example you are creating a new preset, or adding speakers to an existing preset with targets in place for some/most speakers, the linking is no use at all as it only transmits changes to the newly linked speaker targets. Rather the linking should mirror the absolute values. I actually can't believe there is no ability to copy targets between speakers within the same preset.

if you can load/save per speaker target, that will be the ideal.
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post #7426 of 8066 Old 06-04-2019, 06:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Wookii View Post
I actually can't believe there is no ability to copy targets between speakers within the same preset.
I don't know if there is or is not.

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if you can load/save per speaker target, that will be the ideal.
Agree
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post #7427 of 8066 Old 06-04-2019, 06:09 AM
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Originally Posted by audioguy View Post
I don't know if there is or is not.
I've not seen it if there is? (Though It wouldn't be the first time I've missed something obvious)
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What is a "Prism converter"?

Prism ADA-X8, multi DAC converter.
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post #7429 of 8066 Old 06-04-2019, 06:43 AM
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Originally Posted by Wookii View Post
It really needs to be a load/save option on a per speaker target basis. The current 'linking' option is a waste of time the way it currently works, unless you're starting from scratch on a preset.

If for example you are creating a new preset, or adding speakers to an existing preset with targets in place for some/most speakers, the linking is no use at all as it only transmits changes to the newly linked speaker targets...
I experienced some frustration in linking speakers when I discovered that it links delta's not values. Drove me nuts when all my linked curves were going wonky & ended up calling my buddy audioguy Chuck who explained how it worked I thought it was going to copy the actual data points but nope. How I handled the issue was zeroing out all the other speakers in a group I wanted linked and then work on the 1st one in that group. I have to agree that the way it currently works is kind of kludge-y and not obvious. Once learned, it's not a problem but still could be improved for more efficient use.

So I too hope it works to save the actual data values. I may be getting online advice on how the new feature will work soon. However the new feature works, it's better to have it than not So keep the improvements coming...

As someone who was involved for 8+ years on a software project with IT creating a piece of software for our reps involving intensive calculations and creating proposal documents, I learned there's things that could always be better and things that doesn't work as users would like. When rolling it out, it became obvious that software & database designers (in which I played a key role) can't account for every unintended consequence or someone who tries to use it in a way it wasn't designed to work. Training meetings & manuals are only part of the answer. It takes actually using it with sufficient "frequency" to become proficient & learn the ropes & pitfalls.
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post #7430 of 8066 Old 06-04-2019, 10:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wookii View Post
It really needs to be a load/save option on a per speaker target basis. The current 'linking' option is a waste of time the way it currently works, unless you're starting from scratch on a preset.

If for example you are creating a new preset, or adding speakers to an existing preset with targets in place for some/most speakers, the linking is no use at all as it only transmits changes to the newly linked speaker targets. Rather the linking should mirror the absolute values. I actually can't believe there is no ability to copy targets between speakers within the same preset.

if you can load/save per speaker target, that will be the ideal.
Hey Gareth,

Here's how it works:

1) Create target curve
2) Name TC
3) Save TC
4) Select a new channel or linked channels where you want to import the target curve
5) Select the TC from your newly created list of TC's
6) Load the TC to the channel(s) i.e. the selected channel alone, if unlinked, or the selected channel + all linked channels
7) Re-compute
8) Save the pre-set

In summary, you're creating a new folder of target curves by saving them under names you've chosen, which may then be used on any pre-set now or in the future - the TC's are not pre-set specific.

Hope that helps!
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Last edited by RUR; 06-04-2019 at 02:30 PM. Reason: Edited to add: Steps 7 & 8
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Originally Posted by RUR View Post
Hey Gareth,

Here's how it works:

1) Create target curve
2) Name TC
3) Save TC
4) Select a new channel or linked channels where you want to import the target curve
5) Select the TC from your newly created list of TC's
6) Load the TC to the channel(s) i.e. the selected channel alone, if unlinked, or the selected channel + all linked channels

Can't recall if you have to hit the calculate button.

In summary, you're creating a new folder of target curves by saving them under names you've chosen, which may then be used on any pre-set now or in the future - the TC's are not pre-set specific.

Hope that helps!
It certainly does help Ken, that’s superb news!

Edit: I don’t suppose Curt suggested when the FW might be released did he?

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post #7432 of 8066 Old 06-04-2019, 02:28 PM
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It certainly does help Ken, that’s superb news!

Edit: I don’t support Curt suggested when the FW might be released did he?
Depends on any bugs found in this beta. Hopefully soon!

Note that I've edited my prior post to clarify.
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post #7433 of 8066 Old 06-06-2019, 04:38 AM
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Halo,


I played around with the speaker setup layout today. I want to have 9.1.6 Atmos setup.


How do you add middle overhead channel? I can only find 9.1.4 atmos layout.


Thanks
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post #7434 of 8066 Old 06-06-2019, 04:41 AM
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Halo,


I played around with the speaker setup layout today.


How do you add middle overhead channel? I can only find 9.1.4 atmos layout.


Thanks
You can add middle height. If you mean 1 single VOG speaker, you would need to select Auro speaker layout.

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You can add middle height. If you mean 1 single VOG speaker, you would need to select Auro speaker layout.
To add Top Middle speakers to an existing layout, go to the Speaker Configuration menu, select “Add Speaker”, and pick the Atmos (narrow) layout. You’ll have to add both Ltm and Rtm, taking care that you’ve selected the correct output channels to your amplifier for them.

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Wondering if anyone has any opinions/thoughts. I have a bit of a surround speaker layout dilemma...

I'm currently running a 7.2.6 Atmos configuration. My side surrounds are the issue. I have two options:

A. Use the matching bookshelf to my front LCR and rear surrounds. However, location of the bookshelf for the side surrounds is a size issue. Just not enough room between the end seats and the wall. I'd have to locate them along the side walls but somehwhere between the front seats and the front left and right speakers.

B. Select a different brand of in-wall or on-wall speaker and locate them where Dolby recommends.

Thanks in advance,
Paul

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post #7437 of 8066 Old 06-06-2019, 09:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dinamigym View Post
Wondering if anyone has any opinions/thoughts. I have a bit of a surround speaker layout dilemma...

I'm currently running a 7.2.6 Atmos configuration. My side surrounds are the issue. I have two options:

A. Use the matching bookshelf to my front LCR and rear surrounds. However, location of the bookshelf for the side surrounds is a size issue. Just not enough room between the end seats and the wall. I'd have to locate them along the side walls but somehwhere between the front seats and the front left and right speakers.

B. Select a different brand of in-wall or on-wall speaker and locate them where Dolby recommends.

Thanks in advance,
Paul
There's tradeoffs. You'll probably have more placement flexibility for any adjustments to locations in Option A (i.e. adjusting exact location, possibly where a vertical placement is (elevation) based on your observed results. And you'll start with timbre-match.

However, Option B can give you much of the same flexibility if you're careful, and have aimable tweeters to fine-tune on-axis performance. It's also more aesthetic to place in/on-wall, and you can avoid some SBIR issues that you'd get from bookshelves placed into the room. On the other hand, you'll have to make sure that your speakers can reasonably support a target curve (e.g. without major boosts) that will make the sound more similar to your LCRs, and that might take some hands-on fine tuning above and beyond your first try and/or a curve you might define in the Configuration Wizard of the Altitude 16 that you have (coming to the 32 unless you have beta software).

I saw your signature. Does Magico have in wall or on-wall options?
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post #7438 of 8066 Old 06-06-2019, 09:44 AM
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There's tradeoffs. You'll probably have more placement flexibility for any adjustments to locations in Option A (i.e. adjusting exact location, possibly where a vertical placement is (elevation) based on your observed results. And you'll start with timbre-match.



However, Option B can give you much of the same flexibility if you're careful, and have aimable tweeters to fine-tune on-axis performance. It's also more aesthetic to place in/on-wall, and you can avoid some SBIR issues that you'd get from bookshelves placed into the room. On the other hand, you'll have to make sure that your speakers can reasonably support a target curve (e.g. without major boosts) that will make the sound more similar to your LCRs, and that might take some hands-on fine tuning above and beyond your first try and/or a curve you might define in the Configuration Wizard of the Altitude 16 that you have (coming to the 32 unless you have beta software).



I saw your signature. Does Magico have in wall or on-wall options?


I have Magicos A3s and purchased the new matching ACC center and A1 bookshelves for rears. They really have no in/on wall options available. I’d have to go with another manufacturer. I could go A1 sides but they are fairly large 45# each and placement would be limited to some angled position in front of the MLP.


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post #7439 of 8066 Old 06-06-2019, 09:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dinamigym View Post



A. Use the matching bookshelf to my front LCR and rear surrounds. However, location of the bookshelf for the side surrounds is a size issue. Just not enough room between the end seats and the wall.

Side surrounds can be placed slightly forward of the MLP and angled towards the MLP they do not have to be at 90 degrees to the MLP that might help with your narrow room.

If your room is length and width restricted then in-walls may be a better option.





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post #7440 of 8066 Old 06-06-2019, 10:24 AM
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