I agree here ... I'm still not that convinced that going beyond 9.x.6 is that beneficial ... are we not hitting a massive diminishing investment return thing here ?
I do own a 32ch Altitude but I'm not that sure what would be the real value in going beyond 9.x.6 .

For those who have greater than 9.x.6 speakers do you hear a big change ? subtle ? was it worth to spend the extra money, more cables, more calibration sessions, more reflections to tame ... ?

thanks for the clarifications :-)

Ben

Password is 6 digits; for if your S/N is 512; enter password 000512

This is why they have thought of upmix part as well. Of course; we should hope that some of the studios have management with A16/A32 - then we will get more DTS:X titles with objects. We also have the Atmos titles hard coded to 2 or 4 ceiling channels.

Netflix seems to have some people in charge sitting with an A32. They use all the channels on their Atmos titles.

Edit:
of course, I suspect the entire DTS:X is in reality dead (with or without Pro); everyone uses Atmos it seems. Only benefit is that we now don't have the 11+1 channels restriction - meaning we can use Neural:X upmix for all channels.

We can only hope dolby will follow up with an improvement - to support the missing speakers. Then DTS:X is really dead. We could of course see an increase in DTS:X titles which uses objects. If DTS makes great tools for the mixers (which is free); this might happen. I would hope we have both formats available and active for a long time - else Dolby will screw us over completely very soon

Many thanks. I’ll try it tonight.
Watched the tank battle from fury last night and it almost blew my room apart! The bass is so visceral, even with one sub.
Loving the gunshots in John wick 😀

The Altitude is the best device ever. Love it! Looking at all the others changing gear to get a new sound, poor bastards

The password is your unit's serial number, including any preceding zeros e.g. 0054.

Speaking only for myself (who else would I speak for?), going beyond 9.1.6 is definitely incremental. However, in my room it offers two advantages:
1) With a single row of seats, I can have front side surrounds and bed side surrounds positioned so that I can mitigate focus point effects for listeners by having these speakers at 75 degrees and 105 degrees (approximately). However I use 3D remapping with this approach. A side effect is that the front side surrounds (SS1) are always playing, since along with their own native object passthrough content for Atmos, they're also playing the bed sides with remapping engaged
2) With left and right centers (Lc/Rc) inside the screen at about 17 degrees, when these speakers are in use, you get more precision of effects inside the screen on some content (Oblivion, War for the Planet of the Apes, Hunter Killer come to mind), and it's audible compared to the broader soundstage emitting from my mains

Having said this, I only did the Lc/Rc because I had the extra channels available, and I picked up a pair of bookshelves that were timbre matched to my mains (same tweeter) used from my PSB dealer at a discount.

If I had a high performance multi-seat, multi-row theatre rather than a personalized HT room (20x14x9) for three to five in a hi-rise, I'd have went differently on my speaker choice and probably wound up with 9.1.6 or at most 11.1.6. And if my primary influences were AVSers with Altitudes in 2019, probably 9.1.8 if anything assuming I still had the Altitude 32/24.

Don't get me wrong, the extra speakers CAN be rewarding, and I'm still glad I did them rather than not. But if you're looking at this from a strict performance/value POV and have a pre-engineered room with near-perfect speaker placement....you might feel differently unless you have the channels to burn and/or don't mind experimenting.

Common misunderstanding is that small rooms requires less ceiling speakers; this is actually wrong - I'm sitting in a 12x12ft area with 9 ceiling speakers. I could easily add a few more.

I was told to back up all my setting before I do the update. I have a flash drive in the back..and can't find the 'magic' panel, or tab where I can back up everything? Thanks

After inserting the flash drive my A16 automatically displayed the back-up options page on my VNC screen.

Several parameters can be saved, archived and restored using a USB key:
1. Insert a USB key in one of the USB Port located on the rear panel of the Altitude32.
2. As the USB Pop-up menu displays, select the operation you want to execute:
• Save or Load presets to/from the USB Key
• Save or Load profiles (sources configurations) to/from the USB Key
• Save or Load microphone compensation files to/from the USB Key
• Generate and save a PDF Report for each of your presets on the USB Key. This report includes data from the
Optimizer including speaker positions, optimizer settings amplitude, phase and impulse response of every
speaker, before and after correction.
• Save a Bug report to the USB Key: when an expected error occurred, the system is halted to prevent damage to
your system and a bug report is generated. After the restart of the Altitude32, you can save that bug report on the
USB Key and send it to Trinnov support at [email protected] for analysis.
• Save Screenshots to the USB Key: you can take screenshots of the Altitude32’s Graphical User Interface by pressing
the “print screen” key of a keyboard connected to the Altitude32.

IMPORTANT NOTE: to ensure the data integrity of your USB Key, please press the Close button and wait until the USB
Pop-up menu has disappeared to remove it.

NOTE: be careful when reloading presets from a USB Key: preset are identified by their memory slot. Therefore, a preset
initially saved as preset number 5 would overwrite the preset number 5 stored on the Altitude32 without warning.

Edit:
Remember to plug in the USB flash _after_ the A16/32 is turned on and started.

Berland already gave you the answer but I'll reinforce it since I initially tried to leave it plugged in the back for convenience & found it doesn't work that way. You boot it up first, allow the main screen to appear and then insert the drive. The OS will then recognize the drive and the popup should appear with all the save/reload options. When done, you "unmount" the flash drive; there's a software button to remove the drive. It shouldn't matter which USB port but if it's balky, unplug and try another port. But the key is not to have it inserted when the Altitude is off.

First of all congratulations on your purchase, I think most people were excited about the firmware update yesterday and overlooked your post.

The mappings for the various audio formats can be viewed on the speaker config page. Trinnov have chosen the default mappings based on the various speaker layout. You can change any of the default mappings quite easily from this screen and create arrays if needed, to use any of your un-mapped speakers

Take a look at the screenshot, in particular the vertical columns under the names for the audio formats.

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Software backup and update were easy. Having the target curves to 10Hz is a welcome improvement. When I look at optimizer curves the graph still only goes to 20Hz. Any way to change the display?

Is it normal for status to remain "Update queued" for more than 24 hours?

Thank you very much for your reply :-)

so would you say that in a room with less the ideal speaker placement the more speaker the better as the Altitude would be in a better position to use 3D Remapping to 'properly position' the speakers ?

as far as I know you can't use an existing preset to benefit from the new 10hz extension, you need to start all over again.

but please more expert people correct me if I'm wrong

This is because you display 20-20.000Hz; try selecting 10-300Hz instead (x-setting at the lower right part of screen).

Thanks a lot! Indeed the new firmware is exciting Just opened the required port to allow Trinov support to upgrade mine.

Back to my question for another newbie understanding (and really appreciate the camaraderie in this thread) - I see you have for various formats, multiple Speakers left as 'none'. For example LRH for Auro, or LTM for DTS.

With my 7.2.14 installation, I get a great many of the speakers as 'none' for the various formats. I'm sure it's very immature of me, but I was hoping to get as many of them potentially engaged in the different formats

Is there a boilerplate for 7.2.14 to make sure I max out the speakers assigned for each format? I can explain what my physical installation looks like if that would help.

I was also considering whether sounds could (or should) be duplicated to speakers unassigned, and is there any sonic value to this.

Again, complete newbie, and ahead of calibration and tweaks etc. Just trying to get my head wrapped around this incredible device.

You do need to start with the "Built In Preset" to take advantage of it.

It would be nice (at least for me) if there were a way to copy the actual room measurements from one preset to the new one (there may be but I could not find it). The 10Hz ability has little value to me. But the ability to save and load a target curves is of major importance. The only way for me to get that ability, however, is to re-measure, which is a pain in the rear particularly since I already have perfectly good measurements (lots of them, in fact).

As long as I have a wish list, it would be really nice to be able to save individual speaker measurements and use them in other presets. In my case, 99.999% of the reason I re-measure is created by diddling with my subs, and their placement. I got very spoiled because the Datasat RS20i using Dirac had that ability and I can't even begin to say how much I made use of it. Not only in my own room but in other rooms I calibrated.

I don't mind (re) creating the target curves I use if I just didn't have to run all of the measurements again. But oh, well!!

EDIT: Actually, I have sort of done this previously. I always PEQ my LFE channel to very flat prior to Optimizer and save the response in OmniMic. If (when?) I move my subs, I create a new Preset with my old LFE measurements and I replace the old PEQs with ones for the new sub position so that the new PEQd response is virtually identical to the previous PEQd response. And then I re-run Optimizer in the new Preset, and it seems to work. Eventually I do re-measure everything but can detect no difference between my new fully measured system and my sub only "cheating" approach.

I have a quick question.

I have my wides (at +/-60 degree), currently set up as Atmos wides. As I understand it, if I want DSU to utilise them, I could set them as Ls1/Rs1 as forward side surrounds - it was my previous understanding that DSU would use these positions where it doesn't use the Lw/Rw positions?

I thought I could achieve that simply by designating the Lw/Rw speakers as Ls1/Rs1 in the routing table under the Dolby column within the speaker set-up page. Having tried that, it doesn't seem to work, I still get no output from those channels under DSU.

Does this mean I need to create a whole new preset with the Lw/Rw speakers actually designated as Ls1/Rs1 from the outset - therefore requiring a whole separate calibration?

Can someone who has this working, please confirm?

I'm attending today's webinar on the new software and hopefully, I get the chance to ask about this. I do know that I was able to create target curve-save files on my existing presets with the "beta" RC9. It was a hassle with some glitches but after some time with the process, I did have success in doing & saving them and clicking Apply Changes; remeasuring not needed.

Jon H wasn't sure if the new software had a script for migrating existing preset curve data to the new architecture so you wouldn't have to do that up & down adjustment first. In the end, if the user still has to do that up/down data point adjustment, it might be best to start over with the new built-in preset. 'Cause in the RC, that was quirky.

But I totally agree that it would be fantastic if the measurement data could be saved as files, to be exported & imported at will. Someone like Adam might not like this idea but it would be a god-send to some advanced DIY'rs. Maybe not possible or practical from a programming standpoint but we can dream...

This works fine, but you need to keep in mind that upmix selection have an effect on which layout to use. For example dolby surround upmix will make DSU use the atmos layout. While upmix selection "upmix on native" will actually use the dolby layout for DSU.

Also when checking this in processor/meters tab; there is a refresh issue here; so switch to for example master then back to meters to make sure you are looking at reality.

Edit:
You can also set default PCM upmixer under decoder setup/general, but the listening format in sources/decoders actually define which layout to use for DSU (its complicated I know).

From the manual; this will make it all more clear:


Edit:
LW/RW and Ls1/Rs1 can be set to same position; but if they are not you can enable 3D-remapping to actually position the Ls1/Rs1 at correct position; then the Altitude will use Lw together with Ls and Rw together with Rs to get correct position of the Ls1/Rs1 channels.

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I have actually lately disabled the remapping for the front speakers; since they are close to perfect positioned - the sound quality is actually slightly better without remapping on these channels. This flexibility is great; I can disable remapping on the perfectly positioned front speakers but still use remapping for the surrounds (which have different optimal position based on format).

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Not exactly. With less than ideal placement, you can often get good results from a standard speaker layout IF the speakers aren't too far from ideal. Example: mains at 25 degrees where you want a 30 degrees ideal placement. In my case, with the two pairs of side surrounds, the bed side surround is about 15 degrees from ideal, but still within spec (90 to 105 degrees). So Remapping is helpful so that I can avoid a 90 degrees speaker firing straight at a single row of seats. A riser or in-wall speakers aren't practical for me in the condo, so this was a solution. I could do this without 3D Remapping, but I enjoy the sound more for Atmos and 3D audio. I go a different route for upmixing, namely a speaker array that Curt Hoyt and I worked up. But regardless, it's not the Swiss Army Knife for all cases. If you've got side surrounds at 60 degrees, rears at 90 degrees azimuth in a 7.1 layout or height speakers a foot above the mains , nothing's going to fix that.

Using 3D Remapping is one way to solve this problem, but Trinnov's universal/best practice placements and high performance HT design as you'll see in the CEDIA Designer or the way Adam would approach the problem in a multi-seat, multi-row context would rely on placement (risers, sightly raised speakers for some rows) rather than electronics. IMO Remapping was designed in the days where the focus was on pro audio monitoring and a stereo, 5.1 or 7.1 context. It's less clear how appropriate it still is in the high performance, high channel count HT world of today, at least as a best practice except for specific cases like mine.

Where an extra speaker comes in handy is for specific purposes, such as having a center speaker below an OLED TV or a non-AT screen (NOT a recommended approach if you can help it) and another speaker, call it the "center height", physically located above the TV/screen. You could create a two-way active speaker with that "center height" creating a phantom image from the two speakers as if there were a single speaker for content where there was no legal center height (e.g. Atmos), or use 3D Remapping. If I were interested in an actual center height for Auro or DTS:X Pro (soon to be on an Altitude near you later this year), I'd use 3D remapping if those were my choices. Or maybe a case where I was forced to have rears at different elevation due to a room constraint; a secondary speaker might help there with remapping even if it were used for no other purposes (you'd have to give it some available nominal designation for the calibration, though). There's others, but these are ones I can think there off the top of my head.

However, you can't just add more speakers into the room just to use 3D Remapping with better resolution. They still require placement that's beneficial for the purpose.

3D-remapping is fantastic for ceiling speakers; the optimal position is not the same between Atmos, DTS:X and Auro-3D. Hence this is were 3D-remapping really shines. Besides; I have still never seen perfect position of all ceiling speakers regardless of format (this is complicated to mount perfect). Floor standing speakers often needs multiple adjustments to hit the spot perfectly; it is hard to do this process with ceiling speakers (drilling a new hole in the ceiling for every attempt can be messy).

My understanding as well. If you can position your speakers within the format's recommended ranges, remapping does not necessarily add value if your aim is to come as close as possible to the mixer's intent.

Still, if you can not position your speakers within recommended ranges, more speakers will per definition improve the accuracy of 3D remapping.

How would you define perfect? Staying within recommended positional ranges for all formats (Atmos, DTS:X and Auro3D) is not necessarily impossible, see: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-re...l#post55222282

Ideally you would want to have the ability to on basis of listening tests adjust the position (and tilt and toeing) of ceiling and wall mounted speakers to find the optimal orientation within the recommended positional ranges, and be able to make such changes within a minute or so between listening tests. Not an easy job to figure out how to engineer something like that for multiple speakers each weighing up to about 15 kg. I have been working on such flexible mounting system for my lab (annex concept room/ experience center) for quite some time, and am at the verge of the manufacturing and constructing phase.

It should work like that.

(on holiday, so no possibility to check)

Thanks, that’s the bit I was missing!