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post #11671 of 11841 Old 05-21-2020, 04:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dimifoot View Post
Check n.3 from the manual, below:
Thank you!

Reminds me of my Pioneer AVR era here in the forum. Pioneer used a lot of these kind of notes after many of their general instructions. Many times Pioneer owners who posted something wasn't working etc, missed the notes, exceptions & clarifications - usually below the corresponding section and in fine print.

A good manual and reading it helps a lot! I confess to missing this one myself so always good to have someone find that it's "in the manual"

Steve

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post #11672 of 11841 Old 05-21-2020, 11:58 PM
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Not sure why, but again, tonight....I played and Atmos file, MKV. The Altitude reads it as Dolby True HD, from the Zappiti player. I have to select a surround format, Dolby Surround, Auro, etc.....then it changes to Atmos/True HD. I played an entire movie in Atoms. Then watched a movie in DTS-MA. Then went to a different Atmos Movie...and the same thing. The window on the Trinnov reads True HD, untill I select a surround format..then it switches to Atmos...which of course, does not allow for a surround format. Anyone else experience this issue with a Zappiti Player?
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post #11673 of 11841 Old 05-22-2020, 03:53 AM
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Apologies if this seems off topic but since the Altitude is the only unit currently with DTS:X Pro support I thought I would ask here. Does anyone have or know where to obtain any 9.1.6 or more DTS:X test tones or channel callouts?
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post #11674 of 11841 Old 05-22-2020, 04:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveN View Post
Recently my Altitude 32 had not outputted on Ceneter channel with AppleTV. Today with Panny UB820 I tried playing the new Top Gun Atmos 4k disk and still no center output. I tried native as well as Auro for decoder setting. Did a hard boot of Altitude still no center channel output. Decoder shows all channels in input and every other channel is being sent to amps. Suggestions?
Exactly the same thing has happened to me yesterday ! Finished watching a John Wayne movie , all well ; loaded a UHD and no dialogue in Centre only bleed from L/R as appropriate . 32 reports 7.1 in and out on Processor Meters page but no sound . Tried Pink Noise and all except Centre work fine . Speakers are Meridian dsps and all track volume fine without any reported errors . Tried hard Restart from back panel , nothing changed . The Preset being used was the default , locked one same as always so I 'm really stumped at the moment

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post #11675 of 11841 Old 05-22-2020, 09:05 PM
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Some excellent seminars online by Anthony Grimani and lots of great seminars by Trinnov!

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/86-ul...avpro-etc.html

Anthony Grimani talks about I think generally more modest systems, primarily up to 7.4.6, as we all know Trinnov goes far beyond that.

What's interesting is the biggest divergence in methodology is Trinnov gives a combined approach in speaker placement for Dolby Atmos, DTS:X (and Pro) and Auro 3D, whereas Anthony seems to focus on Dolby Atmos with either 2 or 4 top/ceiling speakers; and whereas Trinnov talks about placing top front left and right, etc at the same horizontal distance (to the left and right of the MLP) from you as the front left and right speakers, Grimani says that doesn't sound very good and recommends placing them halfway between the the left and right speakers.

I recently ran across Cineramax saying the same as Grimani on Facebook!

What gives here? How can the halfway approach even makes sense on objects panning when the seats to the very left and right after outside the top left and right speakers? And of course the pluses of aiming all speakers including tops at the MLP?

Personally given the many many speaker systems and experience with Trinnov processing and Jon Herron and company's expertise, and as well Adam Pelz' setup genius, I am "listening" to them. But again what gives here?

Here are the home Dolby Atmos speaker setup recommendation:

https://www.dolby.com/us/en/guide/sp...tup-guide.html

Pray for all of our healthcare providers, food manufacturing and delivery workers, all of whom are doing their best at great risk to help us survive the current Covid-19 virus crisis.

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post #11676 of 11841 Old 05-22-2020, 09:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Bruzonsky View Post
Some excellent seminars online by Anthony Grimani and lots of great seminars by Trinnov!

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/86-ul...avpro-etc.html

Anthony Grimani talks about I think generally more modest systems, primarily up to 7.4.6, as we all know Trinnov goes far beyond that.

What's interesting is the biggest divergence in methodology is Trinnov gives a combined approach in speaker placement for Dolby Atmos, DTS:X (and Pro) and Auro 3D, whereas Anthony seems to focus on Dolby Atmos with either 2 or 4 top/ceiling speakers; and whereas Trinnov talks about placing top front left and right, etc at the same horizontal distance (to the left and right of the MLP) from you as the front left and right speakers, Grimani says that doesn't sound very good and recommends placing them halfway between the the left and right speakers.

I recently ran across Cineramax saying the same as Grimani on Facebook!

What gives here? How can the halfway approach even makes sense on objects panning when the seats to the very left and right after outside the top left and right speakers? And of course the pluses of aiming all speakers including tops at the MLP?

Personally given the many many speaker systems and experience with Trinnov processing and Jon Herron and company's expertise, and as well Adam Pelz' setup genius, I am "listening" to them. But again what gives here?
That is one of the things that I will be able to investigate thoroughly when the Lab is completed. All of the overhead speakers will be able to move in 2 dimensions, so I can listen and measure many different speaker configurations. The ear level surrounds will also be on trolleys to move horizontally and linear actuators for vertical changes, along with the ability to scale from 5.1 all the way to 18.1.12.

I have my own opinions and expectations based on my experiences in both modest and high channel count systems, of course. But I don't think anyone has really had the ability to listen to different configurations in the same room, exploring not only the width of the speakers, but also the angle to the main listening position, how that affects secondary listeners, while also having the ability to invoke all 3 immersive audio formats. Should be fun! And I encourage anyone to come visit once completed. Donations accepted.

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post #11677 of 11841 Old 05-22-2020, 10:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Bruzonsky View Post
Some excellent seminars online by Anthony Grimani and lots of great seminars by Trinnov!

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/86-ul...avpro-etc.html

Anthony Grimani talks about I think generally more modest systems, primarily up to 7.4.6, as we all know Trinnov goes far beyond that.

What's interesting is the biggest divergence in methodology is Trinnov gives a combined approach in speaker placement for Dolby Atmos, DTS:X (and Pro) and Auro 3D, whereas Anthony seems to focus on Dolby Atmos with either 2 or 4 top/ceiling speakers; and whereas Trinnov talks about placing top front left and right, etc at the same horizontal distance (to the left and right of the MLP) from you as the front left and right speakers, Grimani says that doesn't sound very good and recommends placing them halfway between the the left and right speakers.

I recently ran across Cineramax saying the same as Grimani on Facebook!

What gives here? How can the halfway approach even makes sense on objects panning when the seats to the very left and right after outside the top left and right speakers? And of course the pluses of aiming all speakers including tops at the MLP?

Personally given the many many speaker systems and experience with Trinnov processing and Jon Herron and company's expertise, and as well Adam Pelz' setup genius, I am "listening" to them. But again what gives here?

When I upgraded the theater to ATMOS I went through the same debate with the height channels. To resolve it, I rented trusses to mount the height channels that allowed me to listen to various speakers in different positions and the effect it had on two rows. What I found (as expected) was that there is no one answer to this question as it is dependent on seat position, room size, and dispersion characteristics of the speaker relative to the listening position and distance they are apart from each other. Choosing speakers with greater dispersion characteristics (like the RSL) however helps a great deal to mitigate placement as the effect still sounds like it is coming from above you regardless of exact seat position.
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post #11678 of 11841 Old 05-22-2020, 11:06 PM
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The Trinnov solution is unified for a triple format situation. If you listen or care more about ATMOS Grimani is dead on because most ATMOS releases are not nearfield remixed (only some Disney) for the home ATMOS standard. Not unlike 2 channel stereo where if you separate the mains towards the corners of the room the image dilutes placing tops speakers in the Home Atmos azimuth separation pushes their imaging towards the wall and dilutes a lot of HRTF imaging potential from those speakers especially the front heights and top fronts which behave very much like 2 channel stereo despite being up high. One should mimic the mixing console position is what he is saying to better enjoy the mixers' intentions which can be easily spread to 3 seating positions per row. How do the seats outside the 3 seater sound if you follow the Cinema Atmos spacings he espouses? No different than listening slightly off-axis to a great audiophile pair of speakers outside their main listening triangle still sounds great especially for the uninitiated. Also the auro and dts do not sound bad at all following this overheads approach.

Also interesting is he has moved from inwall to on wall and now this year he wants the speakers bracketed off wall to eliminate boundary interactions. He also gave his word that more new mixes will exploit the discrete width channels because it is a vital element of the front stage, width channel snap to front or snap to surround mixes will be phased out gradually by the mixing community. Thus it is not Illogical that Trinnov will adapt in the near future by upgrading the firmware so that the speaker positioning definition includes not only home atoms standards but cinema as well, it will help 3D remapping because it will not be correcting for what is not wrong in the first place.

As to why Grimani recommends a lesser count of speakers, he has invested a lot into developing his brand of speakers that because they use an upward-firing compression tweeter that deflects into a HiHat a la Bang and Olufsen flying saucer speaker (same patent). These speakers have a VERY wide dispersion. I believe that has some consideration in his recommendation. Certainly, high channel counts are very (if at 15 degree+-3) localizable for speaker positions forward of MLP, which he also states is the most resolvable range of angles in multichannel.

Tops siting separation Experimentation with overhead rich objects content will yield convincing results that validate what he is saying 100%.
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post #11679 of 11841 Old 05-23-2020, 03:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Bruzonsky View Post
Some excellent seminars online by Anthony Grimani and lots of great seminars by Trinnov!

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/86-ul...avpro-etc.html

Anthony Grimani talks about I think generally more modest systems, primarily up to 7.4.6, as we all know Trinnov goes far beyond that.

What's interesting is the biggest divergence in methodology is Trinnov gives a combined approach in speaker placement for Dolby Atmos, DTS:X (and Pro) and Auro 3D, whereas Anthony seems to focus on Dolby Atmos with either 2 or 4 top/ceiling speakers; and whereas Trinnov talks about placing top front left and right, etc at the same horizontal distance (to the left and right of the MLP) from you as the front left and right speakers, Grimani says that doesn't sound very good and recommends placing them halfway between the the left and right speakers.

I recently ran across Cineramax saying the same as Grimani on Facebook!

What gives here? How can the halfway approach even makes sense on objects panning when the seats to the very left and right after outside the top left and right speakers? And of course the pluses of aiming all speakers including tops at the MLP?

Personally given the many many speaker systems and experience with Trinnov processing and Jon Herron and company's expertise, and as well Adam Pelz' setup genius, I am "listening" to them. But again what gives here?
Peter (Cineramax) has been pushing for closer (horizontal to MLP) Atmos Top speaker placement for the last 3 years. He has insisted the wider placement creates an imaging hole above your head and uses Gravity as a reference track. This was a major discussion when we designed my HT. I was able to stay within the Trinnov guidelines and still address Peter’s concerns. First, despite having a 26 foot wide HT we used 3 seats per row. Per the Trinnov guidelines this allowed for the Top speaker tweeter to be over the outside ear of the end seat but still being inside the Front main channel (R,L) speaker. Second the top speakers are 12 feet up allowing for a elevation angle (from the MLP) closer to that of a more inward position at a lower 8-10ft height.

EDIT From Peter: “ Hi Brad, i was at the gravity premiere with tony grimani in the room where atmos was created. Gravity Is not reference grade in home video. Cloverfield 10 and the invisible boy are.”
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post #11680 of 11841 Old 05-23-2020, 03:57 AM
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Interesting discussion on height speaker placement. Just like so many other aspects of audio, personal preference will play a roll. In my case, my original height speaker placement followed (only by accident), Peter's recommendation. When I changed height speakers (to the RSL's) I aligned them pretty much with my L&R. I much prefer this placement over the original one. As an FYI, my height speakers are about ~4.5 feet from my side walls, room is 19.3 feet wide, and my ceiling height (unfortunately) is only 8 feet.

Given what Adam is doing with movable surround and height speakers, that should prove most interesting. It may be that it is not just the position of height speakers that is important but rather the combination of height speaker placement AND the distance from the height speakers to the surrounds. I mention this because when I first moved my height speaker to their current position, the surrounds were a one position, but I moved them down about 15" the overall immersive effect greatly improved.

@appelz What will be the room dimensions of your lab?
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post #11681 of 11841 Old 05-23-2020, 05:58 AM
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I've been reading a few posts on a BEQ for War of the Worlds 4K. Not sure I follow the author's way of listing the filters, like a low shelf "x4"? Does he intend x4 to mean 4th order or add 4 shelf filters or...?

IF I read his graphs correctly, the difference in bass between WOTW BD and WOTW 4K is huge! Like the 4K's bass falls off the cliff starting in the mid 30hz range and nearly nothing < 20. I can only guess that whoever mixed this title had soundbars in mind or at least a wimpy sub. Even my original fake-spec'd DefTech SC 1 had extension to 27hz. Hard to believe Paramount green-lit this considering the DVD &BD.

4K WOTW may be the 1st title I try a BEQ. Is it better to add to the Altitude's sub PEQ's (output) or to an external DSP's input filter (if one uses one)?

Has anyone played this one yet on their Altitude? Without BEQ, what did you try to restore the bass impact?

And finally, a note that any HiDef Digest review on audio shouldn't be taken to the bank; their reviewer had nothing but praise for WOTW Atmos. But some folks noted he apparently lists a soundbar as well as a lifestyle-size small sub in his gear. I guess we should take their reviews with the proverbial grain of salt.

Bill Hunt of Digital Bits is going to have his review of WOTW up soon and it'll be interesting to read his comments on the bass.

Steve
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post #11682 of 11841 Old 05-23-2020, 06:10 AM
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Originally Posted by ss9001 View Post
I've been reading a few posts on a BEQ for War of the Worlds 4K. Not sure I follow the author's way of listing the filters, like a low shelf "x4"? Does he intend x4 to mean 4th order or add 4 shelf filters or...?
it means 4 shelf filters (using multiple shelf filters when Q>0.707 rather than 1 big one is a way to reduce the overshoot at either end of the shelf)
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post #11683 of 11841 Old 05-23-2020, 07:15 AM
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Hello,

I’m incorporating a lumagen radiance pro 4242 into my system. I’m getting video but no audio.

Setup:

JVC projector to Lumagen video

Lumagen audio into Trinnov input? Correct? Does not work with output...

Strato into Lumagen input 1... I get picture but no audio

Apple TV into lumagen input 2

Xbox x into lumagen input 3

I’m sure its just a minor thing I’m missing... any thoughts ?

Thank you

JVC RS3000 : Panamorph DCR Lens :Seymour Reference NEO 2.40 144"
Trinnov Altitude 16 : Kaleidescape Strato S 12TB :Kaleidescape 24TB Server :Apple TV 4K
Oppo 203 : Xbox One X
Procella P8's LCR and P5IW/P5's for surrounds and atmos
Procella P15SI x 4 : Audiocontrol G4 AMPS x 4 : Current Setup 9.4. 4 Atmos : Control 4
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post #11684 of 11841 Old 05-23-2020, 07:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audioguy View Post
Interesting discussion on height speaker placement. Just like so many other aspects of audio, personal preference will play a roll. In my case, my original height speaker placement followed (only by accident), Peter's recommendation. When I changed height speakers (to the RSL's) I aligned them pretty much with my L&R. I much prefer this placement over the original one. As an FYI, my height speakers are about ~4.5 feet from my side walls, room is 19.3 feet wide, and my ceiling height (unfortunately) is only 8 feet.

Given what Adam is doing with movable surround and height speakers, that should prove most interesting. It may be that it is not just the position of height speakers that is important but rather the combination of height speaker placement AND the distance from the height speakers to the surrounds. I mention this because when I first moved my height speaker to their current position, the surrounds were a one position, but I moved them down about 15" the overall immersive effect greatly improved.

@appelz What will be the room dimensions of your lab?
Roughly 18x23x10. At some point I was still start a build thread. I've been taking pictures throughout the process.

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post #11685 of 11841 Old 05-23-2020, 08:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Applemike68 View Post
Hello,

I’m incorporating a lumagen radiance pro 4242 into my system. I’m getting video but no audio.

Setup:

JVC projector to Lumagen video

Lumagen audio into Trinnov input? Correct? Does not work with output...

Strato into Lumagen input 1... I get picture but no audio

Apple TV into lumagen input 2

Xbox x into lumagen input 3

I’m sure its just a minor thing I’m missing... any thoughts ?

Thank you
I would ask this question in the Lumagen thread. https://www.avsforum.com/forum/37-vi...ro-series.html

We could go round and round getting the details of your setup and signal flow, what input and output cards you have, what input on the Trinnov, but it would mostly clutter up this thread with Lumagen related questions. Jim Peterson with Lumagen has a Trinnov, so he is familiar with it.
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post #11686 of 11841 Old 05-23-2020, 10:14 AM
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I took a screen shot of the Atmos not being detected right away, with my Zappiti player. Before is the MKV being played with just the 'play button' being pushed. After pic is after I selected a surround format and it changed to Atmos. I have also used MKVToolNix to isolate the audio to Atmos only...same thing. It play Dolby True HD until I select a different surround format
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post #11687 of 11841 Old 05-23-2020, 10:46 AM
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Roughly 18x23x10. At some point I was still start a build thread. I've been taking pictures throughout the process.
Gee with my remodel I am roughly 18 X 23 X12!!!

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post #11688 of 11841 Old 05-23-2020, 11:00 AM
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Originally Posted by dancjodanc View Post
I took a screen shot of the Atmos not being detected right away, with my Zappiti player. Before is the MKV being played with just the 'play button' being pushed. After pic is after I selected a surround format and it changed to Atmos. I have also used MKVToolNix to isolate the audio to Atmos only...same thing. It play Dolby True HD until I select a different surround format
The "Listening Format" drop down menu allows you to force a decoder choice. If you select Neural:X, you don't get Dolby Atmos. I can check with my HDMI analyzer at some point, but I wonder if the source sees that in the Altitude EDID, and recognizes that Dolby Atmos is not an option?

Anyway, so when you then select Dolby as the decoder, all is well. Setting the decoder to Auto or Upmix on Native will let the Altitude decide which decoder to use based on the incoming signal.

Page 136 in the manual.

Short answer. Use Upmix on Native for that source.
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The thing it's doing is NOT selecting Atmos at the get go. Some times it does, sometimes it doesn't. I have Neural:X as a default listening preset. So when I start a movie with Atmos, it does show that preset, and Dolby True HD. It does not matter what preset Listening Format I have it default too, it still starts playing in TrueHD, and only changes to Atmos, when I change the surround format. In other words, toggle to something else, any format, for it to see the Atmos flag and swtich to Atmos, then of course, no Listening format is engaged because of Atmos. It's just getting it to use Atmos the first time, without the extra step
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post #11690 of 11841 Old 05-23-2020, 11:30 AM
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Quote:
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The thing it's doing is NOT selecting Atmos at the get go. Some times it does, sometimes it doesn't. I have Neural:X as a default listening preset. So when I start a movie with Atmos, it does show that preset, and Dolby True HD. It does not matter what preset Listening Format I have it default too, it still starts playing in TrueHD, and only changes to Atmos, when I change the surround format. In other words, toggle to something else, any format, for it to see the Atmos flag and swtich to Atmos, then of course, no Listening format is engaged because of Atmos. It's just getting it to use Atmos the first time, without the extra step
If you have Neural:X as the default, the Altitude will not automatically switch to Dolby Atmos. You need to have Auto or Upmix on Native selected for that source. Could be some setting in the Zappiti also, but I have zero experience with that device.

Gears > Home > Source Config > Whatever profile is the Zappiti . Set the Listening Format to Upmix on Native and save. Let us know if that solves the problem.

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post #11691 of 11841 Old 05-23-2020, 01:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dancjodanc View Post
The thing it's doing is NOT selecting Atmos at the get go. Some times it does, sometimes it doesn't. I have Neural:X as a default listening preset. So when I start a movie with Atmos, it does show that preset, and Dolby True HD. It does not matter what preset Listening Format I have it default too, it still starts playing in TrueHD, and only changes to Atmos, when I change the surround format. In other words, toggle to something else, any format, for it to see the Atmos flag and swtich to Atmos, then of course, no Listening format is engaged because of Atmos. It's just getting it to use Atmos the first time, without the extra step
I use Upmix on Native as default with PCM default upmix set to Surround (you can select Neural:X here of course). With this setup the Altitude is always doing the right thing regardless of material. For music I use Native (sometimes Auro3D is manually selected).

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post #11692 of 11841 Old 05-23-2020, 06:17 PM
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Originally Posted by DaveN View Post
Recently my Altitude 32 had not outputted on Ceneter channel with AppleTV. Today with Panny UB820 I tried playing the new Top Gun Atmos 4k disk and still no center output. I tried native as well as Auro for decoder setting. Did a hard boot of Altitude still no center channel output. Decoder shows all channels in input and every other channel is being sent to amps. Suggestions?
Some of your configurations are broken (most likely the preset); reach out to Trinnov support.
Both Apple TV 4K and the Top Gun UHD in Atmos works fine here. You could try to set the Atmos mapping for center channel again (put it to something different first, then back to C again). If this does not work; test the same with bypass activated. If it works then; your calibration for C channel is broken. Also validate that input or output channel is not muted.

By the way, Atmos track for Top Gun UHD release (2020) is fairly good Ambient sound for movie in ceiling seems to be locked to LTM and RTM, but effects play on all channels.

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Last edited by Berland; 05-23-2020 at 06:22 PM.
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post #11693 of 11841 Old 05-23-2020, 07:21 PM
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Keep in mind that Trinnov recommends NOT that top speakers get placed same distance from wall as screen left and right channels, but Trinnov draws a rectangle over the actual listening area (using the listeners' ears) and advises to place speakers not inside that rectangle. Whereas Dolby Atmos states top speakers to be placed same distance as screen left and right channels from the side walls. So perhaps Grimani and Trinnov aren't that far off from each other?

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post #11694 of 11841 Old 05-23-2020, 10:53 PM
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Peter (Cineramax) has been pushing for closer (horizontal to MLP) Atmos Top speaker placement for the last 3 years. He has insisted the wider placement creates an imaging hole above your head and uses Gravity as a reference track. This was a major discussion when we designed my HT. I was able to stay within the Trinnov guidelines and still address Peter’s concerns. First, despite having a 26 foot wide HT we used 3 seats per row. Per the Trinnov guidelines this allowed for the Top speaker tweeter to be over the outside ear of the end seat but still being inside the Front main channel (R,L) speaker. Second the top speakers are 12 feet up allowing for a elevation angle (from the MLP) closer to that of a more inward position at a lower 8-10ft height.

EDIT From Peter: “ Hi Brad, i was at the gravity premiere with tony grimani in the room where atmos was created. Gravity Is not reference grade in home video. Cloverfield 10 and the invisible boy are.”



Halo,


Anthony also states that surround back is suppose to be at 165° to avoid psycho acoustics, while Trinnov recommends 150°



Any takes on this?


Thanks

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post #11695 of 11841 Old 05-24-2020, 03:59 AM
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Originally Posted by santodx5 View Post
Halo,


Anthony also states that surround back is suppose to be at 165° to avoid psycho acoustics, while Trinnov recommends 150°



Any takes on this?


Thanks
No, mine are in line with the Trinnov recommendations and on the riser plane.
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post #11696 of 11841 Old 05-24-2020, 05:08 AM
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Hi All,

Hope everyone has been keeping safe and well. Last night I carried out some REW measurements and have tried to align my subs to each other the best I can.

I have 6 x 18" sub woofers (2 x behind my AT Screen between my L C R, 2 x on the left side wall almost half way into the room and 2 x behind my seating area as a near field).

I have 2 x inuke NX6000 (non DSP) and 1 x NX6000D (with DSP). The 2 x subs behind my screen are connected as Stereo on the inuke NX6000D and have their own outputs on the miniDSP 2x4HD as:

Output 1 for the Left Screen Sub
Output 2 for the Right Screen Sub
Output 3 is assigned to one of the NX6000 in mono mode and control the 2 x side subs which act as one sub
Output 4 is assigned to the the 2 x rear subs in mono mode which also act as one.

Both side and rear subs are placed side by side.

The reason I chose this way of assigning the side and rears as mono is because I wanted all the subs to be connected via the miniDSP so that I can implement BEQ to all my subs


I have taken some screen shots of my overall graphs. Please see below. I would really appreciate if anyone would be happy for me to send the actual .mdat files so you can have a closer look and inspect to see if I have done anything wrong or if there are any areas of concern.

Here are some results...Please take note of these pictures:

Picture 1: All my 6 x 18 inch subs connected directly to the AL32 (Notice how this is not as good as when connected to the miniDSP)???
Picture 2: All 6 x subs connected to the miniDSP 2 x 4HD with REW EQ applied for a flat curve response before handing over to the AL32 for optimization
Picture 3: All 6 x subs after miniDSP 2x4HD REW EQ and Trinnov Optimization
Picture 4: Both before and after Optimization Overlay
Picture 5: All 6 Subs with EQ and Optimization (Waterfall Graph)
Picture 6: All 6 Subs with EQ and Optimization (Spectrogram Graph)
Picture 7: All 6 Subs with EQ and Optimization (Distortion Graph)

Ok so here is the link for Dropbox with my measurements



https://www.dropbox.com/sh/kfieq6psx...Uda63iVka?dl=0
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Last edited by mkohman; 05-24-2020 at 05:17 AM.
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post #11697 of 11841 Old 05-24-2020, 05:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by santodx5 View Post
Halo,

Anthony also states that surround back is suppose to be at 165° to avoid psycho acoustics, while Trinnov recommends 150°

Any takes on this?

Thanks

Mine are at 150 degrees. I have no psycho acoustic issues. I have a client who had his rear surrounds at about 170 degrees and we moved them to 150 degrees. MUCH better this way. MUCH !! Far more immersive.
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post #11698 of 11841 Old 05-24-2020, 07:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mkohman View Post
Hi All,

Hope everyone has been keeping safe and well. Last night I carried out some REW measurements and have tried to align my subs to each other the best I can.

Spoiler!
For comparison, I've attached screenshot of my dual PSA TV42 subs in opposing corners in a relatively small 1,700 cubic foot room. I've used the same dB scale to help compare more easily. I used your REW .mdat file to make easier comparisons (albeit with different rooms) using all the same scales.

One important thing for posting your REW graphs is to try to scale in the more common format of 0 or 10 Hz to 200 Hz with a logarithmic scale rather than linear scale. This will make things easier to compare.

My initial impression is that you probably don't have a lot of bass trapping in your room looking at the decay rates. If that's the case, the first thing I would do is to add floor to ceiling large square or triangular traps in any corner that you can. I also attached a photo of my room to see what I did. I purchased some of my traps from GIK and then learned to build my own which is a fairly easy DIY project.

The big thing to notice in the waterfall comparison is to look at the much more even decay between each slice (the wavy lines) indicating a more uniform fall off in decay. Your response has a lot of ringing by comparison (lots and lots of very closely spaced lines).

Your equalized frequency response does look good for the one seat you measured at with not a lot of variation.

As I've continually improved my setup over the years, I've come to believe the following factors in order of importance are the best determining factors in sound quality improvement:

1. Speakers
2. Speakers
3. Speakers
4. Room Acoustic Treatment
5. Room Acoustic Treatment
6. Quality of Room EQ (whether it be Trinnov, Audyssey, DIRAC, etc.)

When I first started with my current room with lower quality speakers, subs and no acoustic treatment, we usually listened to movies at -15 dB to -20 dB below reference otherwise it felt "loud". Today, after continual upgrades to have all similar high quality speakers and a lot of acoustic treatment work, we typically listen to movies at reference (0 dB) to -6 dB below reference with absolute clarity and no feeling of movies being "loud". In addition, I'm typically running a house curve with the bass at least 6 dB hot and often BassEQ on top of that. Finally, I added Crowsons which I really love to further enhance the viewing experience.

I think you've done a nice job with EQing and you have a tremendous processor with the Trinnov. I'd probably check with an acoustic calibrator or do a free consult with GIK for recommendations for your room.
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post #11699 of 11841 Old 05-24-2020, 08:35 AM
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Update on the remote trigger solution: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/f...-7#post-409837

I bought some cheap components on Amazon, plumbed them together, "taught" my Harmony One the new power-on sequence (including a 60-s delay for the SDP-75 to wake up), and it works like a champ. This should be a half-hour project except I had to find some wire spools for jumpers (we've dome remodeling and a lot of years since I needed them) and then our Internet flaked out so it took a while to get the Harmony set up.

Thanks for the suggestions! - Don
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post #11700 of 11841 Old 05-24-2020, 08:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mkohman View Post
Hi All,

Hope everyone has been keeping safe and well. Last night I carried out some REW measurements and have tried to align my subs to each other the best I can.
I'd be happy with that. Stop measuring and start enjoying.
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