Sony VPL-VW5000ES 4K Laser - Page 75 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #2221 of 2242 Old 01-22-2019, 07:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Harper View Post
You have to be careful using Contrast Enhancer though. I’ve seen it crush blacks and blowout whites when I was tweaking up the VW675ES I had here awhile back.

A good scene to notice it is in The Revenant, the next morning scene after the one where the indian throws DiCaprio a slab of the buffalo meat when he crawls up begging at night. The following morning the Indian pokes him awake with his bow and then the camera pans up the Indian’s body, where the pan takes it from very bright white snow to shadows in his clothes and midsection and then finally to bright highlights of the sky and his face. You can really see the Contrast Enhancer working there and I recall losing shadow detail in his clothing and blown out whites of the snow and sky. I had to back it down some and then all was well.
Agree completely Dave. The name is a misnomer because it doesn't actually enhance real contrast, only subjective contrast. And it indeed clips near white and near black to achieve this, but it also modulates the gamma. I don't like it at all with SDR. With HDR it changes the gamma enough that it makes the image look more "HDR" like. In many ways it brings the image more in line with what I see from something like the Radiance Pro or the Panasonic tone mapping, but those don't need to clip to get it. But once you've got those solutions dialed in for tone mapping, going to the stock Sony tone mapping just looks dull in comparison. The Contrast Enhancer can bring a bit of that life back, but at a price that may show up once in awhile.
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post #2222 of 2242 Old 01-22-2019, 07:43 AM - Thread Starter
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Sony VPL-VW5000ES 4K Laser

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kris Deering View Post
Agree completely Dave. The name is a misnomer because it doesn't actually enhance real contrast, only subjective contrast. And it indeed clips near white and near black to achieve this, but it also modulates the gamma. I don't like it at all with SDR. With HDR it changes the gamma enough that it makes the image look more "HDR" like. In many ways it brings the image more in line with what I see from something like the Radiance Pro or the Panasonic tone mapping, but those don't need to clip to get it. But once you've got those solutions dialed in for tone mapping, going to the stock Sony tone mapping just looks dull in comparison. The Contrast Enhancer can bring a bit of that life back, but at a price that may show up once in awhile.


I agree. Sony internal tone mapping is just “average” at best.

I finally got my lumagen where it’s basically set it and forget it. For a long time I was happy with some titles but not others. But now I have it adjusted to the point where it seems to work great with just about every title I throw at it.

But it does a way way better job than the Sony tone mapping.


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Last edited by ccool96; 01-22-2019 at 12:56 PM.
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post #2223 of 2242 Old 03-03-2019, 02:48 AM
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Sony 5000 HDR10 ?

I have the Sony 5000ES projector and also have a Oppo 203 4K Blu Ray Player, using certified HDMI cables.
I just up dated to the most recent firm ware in both units.
Sony - 4.700
Oppo - 65- 0131
Is anyone getting a HDR10 picture on there screen? and if so, what indicates you are getting HDR10 and what settings are used, most of mine are at Auto.
Of course using a HDR10 Blu Ray disc.
When playing a 4K HDR disc The picture image is several shades darker.
Sony contrast is set at 98, brightness about 53, also Cinema bright mode.
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post #2224 of 2242 Old 03-03-2019, 07:09 AM
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Anyone installed the Dynamic Tone Mapping on the Lumagen and the 5000 yet ?



Sorry found the Lumagen thread....

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post #2225 of 2242 Old 03-03-2019, 01:50 PM
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Originally Posted by pevco View Post
I have the Sony 5000ES projector and also have a Oppo 203 4K Blu Ray Player, using certified HDMI cables.
I just up dated to the most recent firm ware in both units.
Sony - 4.700
Oppo - 65- 0131
Is anyone getting a HDR10 picture on there screen? and if so, what indicates you are getting HDR10 and what settings are used, most of mine are at Auto.
Of course using a HDR10 Blu Ray disc.
When playing a 4K HDR disc The picture image is several shades darker.
Sony contrast is set at 98, brightness about 53, also Cinema bright mode.
If you pull up the "info" menu it'll show you the format of the video.

You need to adjust the Contrast (HDR) control while HDR content is playing, so make sure you did not simply change the SDR contrast when you put it up to 98. It's the same menu item, but will show a different value depending on whether SDR or HDR is playing.

So once you confirm HDR10 is playing, adjust the Contrast (HDR) control with that content on screen.

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post #2226 of 2242 Old 06-13-2019, 01:33 AM
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Wasn't sure where to put it, but since the predecessors were mentioned in this thread, here is news about the Sony VPL-GTZ240 presented at InfoComm 2019:


https://www.projectorcentral.com/inf...tm#sony_gtz240

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post #2227 of 2242 Old 06-13-2019, 03:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Frank714 View Post
Wasn't sure where to put it, but since the predecessors were mentioned in this thread, here is news about the Sony VPL-GTZ240 presented at InfoComm 2019:


https://www.projectorcentral.com/inf...tm#sony_gtz240
That model has more in common with the 870/995 than the 5000 I believe.

Thanks for the link. Interesting read.

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post #2228 of 2242 Old 06-13-2019, 03:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Art Sonneborn View Post
Anyone installed the Dynamic Tone Mapping on the Lumagen and the 5000 yet ?



Sorry found the Lumagen thread....

Art

@Art Sonneborn


I updated the DTM on my Lumagen, firmware update on the VW5000 is the latest available as of last week . I've owned the VW5000 only a couple of weeks, watched a couple movies only before the update and then re-watched after the update . Suffice it to say it made a substantial difference. Oddly enough I was concentrating on the low end contrast areas which in fact are much improved visibly for contrast, but coverage is more broad in general, all scenes appear to have been adjusted instead of select scenes. Not sure if I'm explaining properly . With the VW885 for example, I felt that many scenes did not have appropriate contrast, now with the update I see a more broad, aggressive approach throughout . Now, what I didn't anticipate was improvements at the brighter end of the spectrum . I'm seeing spectral highlights that just look much more realistic overall , the bright areas and colors that are supposed to pop, do so with a sense of realism that is more accurate and appropriate.
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post #2229 of 2242 Old 06-13-2019, 03:59 AM
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Originally Posted by carguy84 View Post
Anyone know where I can buy a ceiling mount for the 5000?

Someone shared this link (below) in a previous post , in the list of items shown there is a 250LB projector mount, worth a look if you plan to ceiling mount .



https://www.projectorcentral.com/inf...tm#sony_gtz240

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post #2230 of 2242 Old 06-13-2019, 04:36 AM
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Originally Posted by ccool96 View Post
I agree. Sony internal tone mapping is just “average” at best.

I finally got my lumagen where it’s basically set it and forget it. For a long time I was happy with some titles but not others. But now I have it adjusted to the point where it seems to work great with just about every title I throw at it.

But it does a way way better job than the Sony tone mapping.


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That's what I notice too, Sony's tone mapping was really underwhelming and inconsistent from scene to scene . Then again the VW5000 was introduced back when HDR was a new technology, no projector had internal tone mapping solution that actually worked, all HDR tone mapping solutions included with available projectors were a disaster to use, everyone used an external solution or just did not use it at all. Onboard solutions have vastly improved but the best solutions are still provided with external devices, if you want the best DTM it would seem the Lumagen is one of the better alternatives , amd the very reason the vast majority who have a flagship projector utilize one. I'm sure MadVR offers something similar, but unless you already own a HTPC, that it's any easier or cheaper. For me the Lumagen is nearly plug and play, once the update with DTM was completed, taking all of 10 minutes, I was viewing the results immediately.

I'm sure a few VW5000 owners would appreciate improved internal HDR tone mapping solutions, the vast majority, however, do own a Lumagen Pro to provide the best turnkey plug and play solution. The Lumagen may be expensive, but when you consider they have upgradeable boards to keep pace with technology changes, replacements are not necessary. My Lumagen has already bridged three projectors, I expect it will last at least another.
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post #2231 of 2242 Old 06-13-2019, 04:41 AM
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That model has more in common with the 870/995 than the 5000 I believe.

Thanks for the link. Interesting read.

Nothing new about that model , it's been available a long time, a year or more I believe. It's really suited to a commercial application such as flight simulation , doesn't have the features the consumer model has .

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post #2232 of 2242 Old 06-13-2019, 07:17 AM
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Originally Posted by roxiedog13 View Post
Nothing new about that model , it's been available a long time, a year or more I believe. It's really suited to a commercial application such as flight simulation , doesn't have the features the consumer model has .
It also features some the consumer models do not.

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post #2233 of 2242 Old 06-13-2019, 11:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Archibald1 View Post
It also features some the consumer models do not.

Yes, it does have additional features all designed and intended for simulation though . This projector does not have dynamic dimming, it does have options for two lens choices, a short throw and long throw lens . Not sure why they just didn't just add dynamic dimming to this one and call it a day . They have a dedicated short throw model ,the VZ1000ES laser 4K , you'd think one model with optional lens could have covered the entire range. There must be some specific mods to the simulation models that are not applicable to the HT environment I suppose.

They also have a VW5000 like simulation model, very specific purpose obviously otherwise they wouldn't separate the two models .
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Originally Posted by roxiedog13 View Post
Yes, it does have additional features all designed and intended for simulation though . This projector does not have dynamic dimming, it does have options for two lens choices, a short throw and long throw lens . Not sure why they just didn't just add dynamic dimming to this one and call it a day . They have a dedicated short throw model ,the VZ1000ES laser 4K , you'd think one model with optional lens could have covered the entire range. There must be some specific mods to the simulation models that are not applicable to the HT environment I suppose.

They also have a VW5000 like simulation model, very specific purpose obviously otherwise they wouldn't separate the two models .
That is a good point. They could/should have just had optional lenses on the basic chassis and had differing prices for the lenses. Makes sense to me.

The main features not on the HT versions are sturdy optical mechanism that is resistant to knocks and movement, 120hz capability, night vision goggle compatibility and anti smear functionality (not sure id that is a sort of motionflow or something different).

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Originally Posted by Art Sonneborn View Post
Anyone installed the Dynamic Tone Mapping on the Lumagen and the 5000 yet ?



Sorry found the Lumagen thread....

Art
The latest Lumagen DTM is the single best improvement available to the Sony 5000es for HDR.
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post #2236 of 2242 Old 08-01-2019, 02:29 PM
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The latest Lumagen DTM is the single best improvement available to the Sony 5000es for HDR.
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I love my Lumagen and the very fine technical support provided... has anyone started looking at the MadVR Envy as an alternative? ..just asking.

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post #2240 of 2242 Old 08-02-2019, 06:38 AM
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I love my Lumagen and the very fine technical support provided... has anyone started looking at the MadVR Envy as an alternative? ..just asking.



Art


The Envy doesn’t exist yet. Maybe there will be a prototype and pricing info at Cedia.


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post #2241 of 2242 Old 08-02-2019, 09:00 AM
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The Envy doesn’t exist yet. Maybe there will be a prototype and pricing info at Cedia.


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I wouldn't bet on it!

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post #2242 of 2242 Old 08-02-2019, 09:10 AM
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I wouldn't bet on it!
They do have a booth at Cedia, so maybe they will have a static mock up on display. For me it's moot since I have a Lumagen. More curious for other folks that may want one.
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