Official Sony VW885ES / VW760ES Owner's Thread - Page 215 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #6421 of 6435 Old 03-24-2020, 02:34 AM
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Originally Posted by fatherom View Post
Hi fellow owners,

Question about Digital Focus Optimizer. For anyone that has Reality Creation turned on, and has DFO turned on...would you be willing to check a scene for me?

(I also wonder if this, POSSIBLY, could be the cause of the near black artifacts that others have reported)

Now I have a lumagen with DTM, which obviously is another variable, but I've determined that having DFO on during this scene really makes the image look bad. Thor Rangnarok, start playing at 19:00. A bit later, when Loki stands up after landing on the grass, look at the clouds on the top right. Then when Thor approaches Odin, and they show Odin close up, also look at the clouds on the top right. For me, there's tons of banding and blocky artifacts in the clouds (like a weather contour map). If I turn DFO off, the problem completely goes away and the clouds are smooth.

Just curious if others see this and/or can reproduce it. Thanks!

Chris
DFO is a double edged sword that is for sure.

It can really help with lenses that may have softer peripheries or for those using a lot of lens shift, but it can also give many, many artefacts.

I will take a look at that scene as soon as I get a chance (he says on lockdown in his house) but I think I tried that on Terminator salvation and it didn't really help, however, I think a lot of what happens in that film/scene is down to the encoding and how each different device handles it.

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post #6422 of 6435 Old 03-24-2020, 05:20 AM
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Originally Posted by mobiousblack View Post
How easy is it to setup the vertex 2?

Does it really make that big of a difference with hdr content to the point that it's like having dtm?

Any idea if it might introduce input lag of any sort?

Also assuming I have my devices plugged into my Marantz 8802 this device would go between the marantz and the Sony in the chain?

Sorry for all the questions just want to be sure about a few points before pulling the trigger.


I run this from Marantz 8802A to the Sony 760ES. So only one input is used on the Vertex 2. Follow vollans guide. The first one was simpler and worked pretty much out of the box.

I had some spare cables so I ran two HDMI paths to the Sony. One from Monitor Out 1 (direct) and one via the Vertex 2 from 8802A Monitor Out 2 to HDMI 2 on the Sony

Yes there is a bit more lag. They said turning HDCP to 1.4 will help. I didn’t turn it on.
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post #6423 of 6435 Old 03-24-2020, 05:40 AM
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I tried this scene with Thor Rangnarok but have no trouble with banding nor with artifacts, perhaps because I go through Vertex2. I tested DFO full, middle and off. I use sony 800M2 through Denon 8500 to Vertex2 and out to Sony 760es. I have RC in middle.
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post #6424 of 6435 Old 03-24-2020, 07:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pär Lundvik View Post
I tried this scene with Thor Rangnarok but have no trouble with banding nor with artifacts, perhaps because I go through Vertex2. I tested DFO full, middle and off. I use sony 800M2 through Denon 8500 to Vertex2 and out to Sony 760es. I have RC in middle.
DFO doesn't have full/middle/off settings.

DFO is Digital Focus Optimizer, which is under the Reality Creation menu, and can either be on or off.
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Theater 1: LG OLED55E6P, Oppo UDP-203, Apple TV 4K, Dune HD Solo 4K
Theater 2: Sony VPL-VW885ES, Seymour Premier 16:9 128", Lumagen 4242, Oppo 103D (CFW) & 203, Apple TV 4K, Sony MDR-DS7500 Wireless Surround Headphones & Denon AVR-X6500H (7.1.4)
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post #6425 of 6435 Old 03-24-2020, 08:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fatherom View Post
DFO doesn't have full/middle/off settings.

DFO is Digital Focus Optimizer, which is under the Reality Creation menu, and can either be on or off.
Sorry I ment dynamic controll
My DFO is on and the result is what I said earlier.
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post #6426 of 6435 Old 03-26-2020, 07:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fatherom View Post
Hi fellow owners,

Question about Digital Focus Optimizer. For anyone that has Reality Creation turned on, and has DFO turned on...would you be willing to check a scene for me?

(I also wonder if this, POSSIBLY, could be the cause of the near black artifacts that others have reported)

Now I have a lumagen with DTM, which obviously is another variable, but I've determined that having DFO on during this scene really makes the image look bad. Thor Rangnarok, start playing at 19:00. A bit later, when Loki stands up after landing on the grass, look at the clouds on the top right. Then when Thor approaches Odin, and they show Odin close up, also look at the clouds on the top right. For me, there's tons of banding and blocky artifacts in the clouds (like a weather contour map). If I turn DFO off, the problem completely goes away and the clouds are smooth.

Just curious if others see this and/or can reproduce it. Thanks!

Chris
Hi.
I have just looked at that scene and yes I see exactly the same as you.
Turning off DFO immediately sorts it out.

I then tried setting RC to 0 and then using DFO and although much reduced the effect was still apparent.
So it looks like DFO is running to a fixed algorithm that also suffers more from using RC as you ramp it up, which is understandable as that is how RC works.

Turning RC up without DFO on can give a better effect without the weird artefacts shown by DFO.

As I said DFO will have varying levels of support amongst users depending on personal taste, environment and lens shift/lens quality etc.

It is certainly better to have the choice to use it rather than not at all.

I leave it off these days as having it on, makes me pause movies quite often to see what on earth 'that funny effect was'.

Just turn RC up a little more and you get what to me looks like the same benefit but with none of the per pixel downsides of using it.

Having said that, I do tend to have it switch on with normal broadcast TV, as I have yet to see any downsides with that and it helps sharpen the picture nicely.
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post #6427 of 6435 Old 03-27-2020, 08:27 AM
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I think that the beginning of 1917 (two guys walking) has similar issues. The sky/clouds are doing some strange things with RC/DFO. Might also be my Lumagen, but turning off RC/DFO helps. SJ
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post #6428 of 6435 Old 03-27-2020, 01:05 PM
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Originally Posted by SJHT View Post
I think that the beginning of 1917 (two guys walking) has similar issues. The sky/clouds are doing some strange things with RC/DFO. Might also be my Lumagen, but turning off RC/DFO helps. SJ
I think on things like big swathes of similar colour, it gets 'confused'. Things like clouds will have details in them and the DFO looks like to tries to emphasise every pixel, even when it really doesn't need it.
It of course does this more towards the corners and edges of the screen as that is how it is designed and that also tends to be where most swathes of colour tend to be on movie frames hence the artefacts.

Being able to switch on and off is good and I am glad it is not a forced feature.


“Remember to look up at the stars and not down at your feet. Be curious. And however difficult life may seem, there is always something you can do and succeed at. It matters that you don’t just give up."
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post #6429 of 6435 Old 04-03-2020, 11:24 PM
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Hey guys,

Im just wanting your input on the 885es, Im looking at buying as i think the newer 695es being bulb and 1800 lumens on a woven screen 0.95 gain will not be bright enough, and i cant afford the 13k price hike the 995es is.

Does this projector still hold a candle to the newer ones out there, any issues that you wouldnt purchase one now ?

Im sticking clear of JVC as in Australia you get dicked on with rough postage and no wholesalers, meaning any issues/returns are done back and forth over seas

your input would be appreciated, cheers guys
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post #6430 of 6435 Old 04-04-2020, 03:49 AM
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Hey guys,

Im just wanting your input on the 885es, Im looking at buying as i think the newer 695es being bulb and 1800 lumens on a woven screen 0.95 gain will not be bright enough, and i cant afford the 13k price hike the 995es is.

Does this projector still hold a candle to the newer ones out there, any issues that you wouldnt purchase one now ?

Im sticking clear of JVC as in Australia you get dicked on with rough postage and no wholesalers, meaning any issues/returns are done back and forth over seas

your input would be appreciated, cheers guys
Hi.

If you don't live in the US, then the 760 is a really great value proposition and the laser light source is a major reason to buy. I am susceptible to micro flicker from lamps myself and so the laser is fantastic as it is utter stable and easy on the eyes. It also seems brighter than its specs suggest.
Now it has dual contrast and DFO it is 98% of the 870 anyway, but significantly better value.

The only projectors that this one doesn't really beat are many times the cost, especially considering your self imposed decision not to buy from the only other consumer native 4K projector manufacturer, which is fully understandable considering your predicament.

l love mine and haven't regretted it, especially since the 8.102 firmware.
Have fun with the journey.
Stay safe.
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post #6431 of 6435 Old 04-04-2020, 03:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Archibald1 View Post
Hi.

If you don't live in the US, then the 760 is a really great value proposition and the laser light source is a major reason to buy. I am susceptible to micro flicker from lamps myself and so the laser is fantastic as it is utter stable and easy on the eyes. It also seems brighter than its specs suggest.
Now it has dual contrast and DFO it is 98% of the 870 anyway, but significantly better value.

The only projectors that this one doesn't really beat are many times the cost, especially considering your self imposed decision not to buy from the only other consumer native 4K projector manufacturer, which is fully understandable considering your predicament.

l love mine and haven't regretted it, especially since the 8.102 firmware.
Have fun with the journey.
Stay safe.
Ahh awesome, Cheers.

Trying to catch up on the firmware update now...... I walked into a shop and said i want a home theatre.... 20k max

Im now at the 63k mark.... this stuff can get expensive as hell. So might as well dive in and get the projector suitbale for the rest of the gear.

Ive heard the DFO isnt that great, are you having issues with it ?
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post #6432 of 6435 Old 04-04-2020, 04:02 AM
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Originally Posted by Lilboots View Post
Ahh awesome, Cheers.

Trying to catch up on the firmware update now...... I walked into a shop and said i want a home theatre.... 20k max

Im now at the 63k mark.... this stuff can get expensive as hell. So might as well dive in and get the projector suitbale for the rest of the gear.

Ive heard the DFO isnt that great, are you having issues with it ?
Yes this can be (and usually is) an expensive hobby that is like a bottomless pit.

The DFO is a bit marmite. The best thing is you can suck it and see. It's effectiveness depends on individual setup, throw, screen size and lens shift etc.

So, once installed you can play around with it on or off to your hearts content. I use it on broadcast TV, but leave it off for UHD/HDR etc.
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“Remember to look up at the stars and not down at your feet. Be curious. And however difficult life may seem, there is always something you can do and succeed at. It matters that you don’t just give up."
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post #6433 of 6435 Old Yesterday, 09:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Archibald1 View Post
Yes this can be (and usually is) an expensive hobby that is like a bottomless pit.

The DFO is a bit marmite. The best thing is you can suck it and see. It's effectiveness depends on individual setup, throw, screen size and lens shift etc.

So, once installed you can play around with it on or off to your hearts content. I use it on broadcast TV, but leave it off for UHD/HDR etc.
Dumb question: I want to disable DFO, but I can’t find it when navigating the settings - Can someone point me in the right direction?

Video: OPPO UDP-203 / Apple TV 4K —> Lumagen Radiance Pro 4446 —> Sony VPL-VW885ES —> Panamorph Paladin DCR —> Stewart Luxus Deluxe Wallscreen 135” 2.4:1 w/ StudioTek 130 G3 1.3 White; Audio: Anthem AVM 60 (Dolby Atmos 5.1.4) —> Rotel RMB-1585 / Lexicon DD-8 —> GoldenEar (GE) Triton Two+ LR, GE SuperCenter XXL center, GE Invisa HTR 7000 surround, GE Invisa MPX rear / JL Audio E-Sub e112-ASH sub
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post #6434 of 6435 Old Yesterday, 10:07 AM
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Dumb question: I want to disable DFO, but I can’t find it when navigating the settings - Can someone point me in the right direction?
Hi.
It is under the Reality Creation menu.
Just press the 'Reality Creation' button on your remote.

Also, I would have thought they would have posted an up-to-date version of the manual by now, but the one on the UK site still doesn't mention the iris or DFO etc.

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post #6435 of 6435 Old Yesterday, 10:10 AM
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Nice update from Vincent


I hope Sony listen to him (and us) re the near black issue.

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“Remember to look up at the stars and not down at your feet. Be curious. And however difficult life may seem, there is always something you can do and succeed at. It matters that you don’t just give up."
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