Samsung The Wall MicroLED 4K TV at CES 2018 - Page 2 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #31 of 340 Old 01-08-2018, 12:11 PM
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How long did it take OLED before they started shipping in volume and at relatively affordable prices?

microLED is at a more nascent state now, supposedly.

So we're talking several years from now.
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post #32 of 340 Old 01-08-2018, 12:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rudy1 View Post
I'm told six figures. And no current plans for Dolby Vision support.
It's SAMSUNG so it will support HDR 10 PLUS not Dolby Vision

If SONY releases their own MicroLED based consumer displays those will support Dolby Vision.

Personally, I hope SONY does indeed do so because SONY and SAMSUNG slugging it out will inevitably drive prices of MICROLED technology based TVs downwards and the technology forwards, the both of which is good news for consumers

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post #33 of 340 Old 01-08-2018, 12:16 PM
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Originally Posted by wco81 View Post
How long did it take OLED before they started shipping in volume and at relatively affordable prices?

microLED is at a more nascent state now, supposedly.

So we're talking several years from now.
The big difference is that OLED has been patent encumbered for the only affordable way to produce them. That doesn’t seem to be the case with MicroLED, so we could see competition driving the prices down quickly vs what we’ve seen with OLED where LG Display the only game in town.
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post #34 of 340 Old 01-08-2018, 12:30 PM
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I think I'm more excited about the roll-up OLED display someone is showing, particularly if it could scale up to this size. My theater is in my basement with a sharp turn in the staircase. I got a projection screen of this size down the stairs, but I could never get a fixed panel around the corner. Or I could install a roll-up in my living room, which doesn't have any empty walls for a fixed panel configuration.

I wish the future would get here a little faster!

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post #35 of 340 Old 01-08-2018, 12:31 PM
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Are there any downside to this that we can think of? I've been waiting for OLED for 17 years, but damnit...
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post #36 of 340 Old 01-08-2018, 12:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Jgr9 View Post
Are there any downside to this that we can think of? I've been waiting for OLED for 17 years, but damnit...
Price is the primary downside. But if Sony joins the fray, we could see more reasonable pricing in the next couple of years or so. Of course, if the breakthrough Nanosys is rumored to have made last year with emissive QD leads to mass production within that timeframe, all bets are off. The way the engineers talk to me about emissive QD, you'd think it was the holy grail of display technology.

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post #37 of 340 Old 01-08-2018, 12:49 PM
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Can't wait to see this tomorrow!!!

Can't wait to see this tomorrow!!! I replaced my 1999 56" rear-projection CRT HD-Ready tv last year with an 65" LG OLED......OLED, I hardly knew ye.....
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post #38 of 340 Old 01-08-2018, 12:57 PM
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One thought I just had. This does require assembly. I don’t know if any manufacturer would risk selling this retail for two reasons. First most consumers and some state laws require a return option. Secondly I could see a lot of people messing up the panels or installation, then blaming the manufacturer. what I’m getting to is I doubt this will ever be a consumer product. I do think it will likely become a custom install option for professional installers/integrators. Average Joe’s (including myself) maybe should curb our enthusiasm a bit.
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post #39 of 340 Old 01-08-2018, 12:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jgr9 View Post
Are there any downside to this that we can think of? I've been waiting for OLED for 17 years, but damnit...
Aside from price, acoustics. In addition to not being able to put speakers behind the screen you will have a very large, highly reflective surface covering the front wall of the theater.
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post #40 of 340 Old 01-08-2018, 01:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DuaneAA View Post
I think I'm more excited about the roll-up OLED display someone is showing, particularly if it could scale up to this size. My theater is in my basement with a sharp turn in the staircase. I got a projection screen of this size down the stairs, but I could never get a fixed panel around the corner. Or I could install a roll-up in my living room, which doesn't have any empty walls for a fixed panel configuration.

I wish the future would get here a little faster!

Duane
For this kind of money you could lift the house move in then set it back down.

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post #41 of 340 Old 01-08-2018, 01:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DuaneAA View Post
I think I'm more excited about the roll-up OLED display someone is showing, particularly if it could scale up to this size. My theater is in my basement with a sharp turn in the staircase. I got a projection screen of this size down the stairs, but I could never get a fixed panel around the corner. Or I could install a roll-up in my living room, which doesn't have any empty walls for a fixed panel configuration.

I wish the future would get here a little faster!

Duane
Hopefully this can be assembled to size on site and not scaled to size at the factory. Not many people can get a 146" tv through their front door. That would be 2inches under the 6'8" of a standard door and you would need wheels or hands or something to fit in addition.

Who knows what the future will hold though once something like this is affordable. I'm still placing my bet on personal displays via AR/VR taking over in 5-10 years, but initial consumer versions of those have been pretty lack luster so far.
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post #42 of 340 Old 01-08-2018, 02:13 PM
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The Wall (Samsung)

Mods feel free to delete. Idk there was already a topic on this.

Samsung The Wall MicroLED 4K TV at CES 2018
https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink?sha...0&share_type=t
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post #43 of 340 Old 01-08-2018, 02:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rudy1 View Post
Price is the primary downside. But if Sony joins the fray, we could see more reasonable pricing in the next couple of years or so. Of course, if the breakthrough Nanosys is rumored to have made last year with emissive QD leads to mass production within that timeframe, all bets are off. The way the engineers talk to me about emissive QD, you'd think it was the holy grail of display technology.
Wouldn't self emissive QD and micro - led produce near identical image quality? Was waiting to buy an OLED, now this.... feel like I'm going to wait forever.
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post #44 of 340 Old 01-08-2018, 02:25 PM
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it would be perfect for home theater and would compete 100% with projectors if 3d was reintroduced .
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post #45 of 340 Old 01-08-2018, 02:30 PM
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Hopefully the technology is more stable than the video led walls currently being used for mainly outdoor advertising. I’ve experimented with several brands, and led pixels do die, tile interconnects are fragile, power consumption is relative high, and colors change somehow over time, making tile replacements without complicated calibration very difficult.

I wonder how Samsung manages zero bevel on each tile, would like to see such a panel in real life.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Wilkinson View Post
Samsung is introducing The Wall MicroLED 4K TV, a modular tiled display that undoubtedly beats all projectors in terms of brightness and black level.

https://www.avsforum.com/samsung-wall...play-ces-2018/
Reminds me how much I miss home theatre geeks, and scott wilkinson. Can’t we crowd fund or something to get him back?!
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post #47 of 340 Old 01-08-2018, 02:58 PM
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I keep saying that I am not a videophile, but I just bought a LG 4K Super UHD TV and it is horrible. I am sending it back. I am hooking back up my 2011 Samsung D8000 as it still beats a brand new LG 4K TV in PQ IMO. My wife even said that the LG was horrible. I am now on the hunt for a new TV and looking at a OLED under $2K. Also interested in the 65” TCL TV.

This new LCD technology has me super excited as I have been eager to ditch the PJ for a 120” TV. I love the movie theater feel from a PJ and screen and also love acoustical transparent screen, but I would ditch it all in a minute for an affordable 120” 4K TV. I am hoping in 5 years for this to start making it to home theaters for the average philes!!! Still very happy with my Epson 5040UB in the theater. The projector has not disappointed from the second I turned it on.
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post #48 of 340 Old 01-08-2018, 03:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Rudy1 View Post
I'm told The Wall goes on sale early in 2019; . . . they will announce pricing sometime this week or shortly after CES, and are expected to launch in the second half of 2018.
OK, I'll take a pot-shot guess, say $250K!

Best regards,
Lloyd C.

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post #49 of 340 Old 01-08-2018, 04:07 PM
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Imo, Good for Samsung! Better to “steal an idea and be first to the plate” Than to play it safe and wait for a patent lawsuit for revenue.
I long for the 'good old days' (of rationality), when it simply wasn't possible to patent an idea.
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post #50 of 340 Old 01-08-2018, 04:13 PM
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I wonder how Samsung manages zero bevel on each tile, would like to see such a panel in real life.
Possibly with a small overhang on 2 adjacent edges of each panel (e.g. left and top), and a beveled substrate. And I too would like to see such a panel.
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post #51 of 340 Old 01-08-2018, 04:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Off_Tempo View Post
Since the demo is a combination of panels, or "tiles" as Scott mentioned, I'm curious what size those tiles are and what the smallest grouping of them will be to form a display, or if each tile could act as an individual display. That would have uses for commercial displays where each tile could show different content. Instead of just picture in picture, have as many different source signals as there are tiles.
Something like this?



Just as a WAG, the (initial) tiles will likely be 16x9, and around 25.45"x14.32". That way, you could scale any size 16:9 screens, and their 146" version would be 5x5 tiles. 6 feet high, and ~10 and a half wide. [With smaller 12.72x7.16" tiles (higher yields?), they'd need 100 tiles to do the job.] They could also be doing 4x4 or 3x3 for the prototype, but as the sizes increase, you lose the ability to scale to fit (e.g., limiting to 4', 6', or 8' high, etc.).

Of course, nothing says they couldn't also do tiles in a 2.4 aspect ratio, and offer them alongside the 16:9's (and in a variety of sizes as well).


One huge win for tiling displays is the ability to ship them... both safely, and economically. Oh, and get them in the door!
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post #52 of 340 Old 01-08-2018, 04:44 PM
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Well, you did say "each tile could show different content", not just capable of doing so. So I guess this one might be more apropos...



Those 4x3 screens do look a little funny though.
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post #53 of 340 Old 01-08-2018, 04:50 PM
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Something like this?




Of course, nothing says they couldn't also do tiles in a 2.4 aspect ratio, and offer them alongside the 16:9's (and in a variety of sizes as well).


One huge win for tiling displays is the ability to ship them... both safely, and economically. Oh, and get them in the door!
If you can do 200 inch wide 2:40 that would be awesome - now 16:9 I don't know what it will be BUT you will get a constant height setup... in this case.
When 2:40 will display the black bars will be so dark (like in a OLED) that you would not need AR masking...
I visualize a theater with a Balcony :-) for a 200 inch wide screen no projector in the way - and the gaudy interior I like - with doors you can open when watching sports with no concern of ambient light...
Video Nirvana...
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post #54 of 340 Old 01-08-2018, 04:54 PM
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Samsung The Wall MicroLED 4K TV at CES 2018

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I long for the 'good old days' (of rationality), when it simply wasn't possible to patent an idea.


I don’t know if I’d go that far. I think if someone comes up with a great idea they should be able to make a good profit from it. I also think if a person or company isn’t able or willing to use that idea they should sell it to someone who will. They shouldn’t be able to sit on the patent stifling innovation and progress waiting and hoping for a law suit opportunity before their patten expires. Please excuse my rant.
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post #55 of 340 Old 01-08-2018, 04:55 PM
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Please excuse my rant.
Amen to that... finders keepers
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post #56 of 340 Old 01-08-2018, 04:58 PM
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With this news I'm certain my next display will be a MicroLED, even if it's 3+ years off, I'm in no hurry. Can't believe I'll be jumping from my 2014 F8500 plasma all the way to MicroLED, skipping OLED altogether. Would have never guessed that would happen just a couple years ago when OLED looked like the endgame for TVs. Hopefully MicroLED will eventually be capable of 100% rec.2020 and 10,000 nits peak white. That is the dream
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Samsung The Wall MicroLED 4K TV at CES 2018

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Originally Posted by DRN94 View Post
With this news I'm certain my next display will be a MicroLED, even if it's 3+ years off, I'm in no hurry. Can't believe I'll be jumping from my 2014 F8500 plasma all the way to MicroLED, skipping OLED altogether. Would have never guessed that would happen just a couple years ago when OLED looked like the endgame for TVs. Hopefully MicroLED will eventually be capable of 100% rec.2020 and 10,000 nits peak white. That is the dream


Does it need 10,000 nits? I thought it was 1,000 nits. I might be confused with DCI-P3 or Dolby Vision can’t remember.
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post #58 of 340 Old 01-08-2018, 05:05 PM
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Does it need 10,000 nits? I thought it was 1,000 nits. I might be confused with DCI-P3 or Dolby Vision can’t remember.
Dolby Vision is mastered up to 10,000 nits I believe, some content targets 1000, 2000, and 4000 as well. I want a TV that can faithfully reproduce all of these different peak white targets but to me full rec.2020 coverage is a must. I don't care if I have to wait 5-10 years before upgrading lol
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post #59 of 340 Old 01-08-2018, 05:28 PM
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Hopefully this can be assembled to size on site and not scaled to size at the factory. Not many people can get a 146" tv through their front door. That would be 2inches under the 6'8" of a standard door and you would need wheels or hands or something to fit in addition.
You think it's one solid display panel that can't be broken down into smaller pieces?
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post #60 of 340 Old 01-08-2018, 06:48 PM
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I keep saying that I am not a videophile, but I just bought a LG 4K Super UHD TV and it is horrible. I am sending it back. I am hooking back up my 2011 Samsung D8000 as it still beats a brand new LG 4K TV in PQ IMO. My wife even said that the LG was horrible. I am now on the hunt for a new TV and looking at a OLED under $2K. Also interested in the 65” TCL TV.

This new LCD technology has me super excited as I have been eager to ditch the PJ for a 120” TV. I love the movie theater feel from a PJ and screen and also love acoustical transparent screen, but I would ditch it all in a minute for an affordable 120” 4K TV. I am hoping in 5 years for this to start making it to home theaters for the average philes!!! Still very happy with my Epson 5040UB in the theater. The projector has not disappointed from the second I turned it on.
The current 65" TCL is edge-lit, but they did announce a new 65" FALD today. Sony 900E/F or 930E are also worth looking at, as is an OLED if you can snag a 65" for under $2K.

The problem with LG's LCDs is they're all IPS, which is great if you want super-wide viewing angles, but bad if you want good black levels in a dark room. Go OLED or a nice VA panel with FALD and you'll be impressed.
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