My CEDIA 2018 Impressions - Page 7 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #181 of 253 Old 09-29-2018, 09:45 AM
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To dismantle my theater for a new buyer (someday) would almost be sacrilegious. They don’t want the theater, move along please, no sale!
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post #182 of 253 Old 09-29-2018, 10:35 AM
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My home buyer bought the house. And just before I was to vacate, decided he wanted the whole enchilada.... Trinnov, subs and all. Worked out great for me. Would’ve been a weekend to dismantle and store for 1.5 years until new house is built. Big PITA. Glad he liked it.
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post #183 of 253 Old 09-29-2018, 11:37 AM
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Originally Posted by G-Rex View Post
To dismantle my theater for a new buyer (someday) would almost be sacrilegious. They don’t want the theater, move along please, no sale!

Exactly what I actually have to do myself , dismantle my current theater, move most to the new one. I almost had a buyer interested in the home sale with theater, the husband was totally smitten with the idea . His wife however had the last word, did not want the additional cost for me to leave the theater as is, was happy enough for me to leave it at the lower price though . I'm going to remove the seats and my custom door, the projector and screen, turn it back into a family den. I wanted new seats for the new theater , guess I'll be repurposing the old ones now .

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post #184 of 253 Old 09-29-2018, 11:45 AM
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Originally Posted by roxiedog13 View Post
Exactly what I actually have to do myself , dismantle my current theater, move most to the new one. I almost had a buyer interested in the home sale with theater, the husband was totally smitten with the idea . His wife however had the last word, did not want the additional cost for me to leave the theater as is, was happy enough for me to leave it at the lower price though . I'm going to remove the seats and my custom door, the projector and screen, turn it back into a family den. I wanted new seats for the new theater , guess I'll be repurposing the old ones now .
Wait... you’re moving? What’s the new theater diva like? You built your original from for a theater from the ground up, right??
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post #185 of 253 Old 09-29-2018, 11:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roxiedog13 View Post
Exactly what I actually have to do myself , dismantle my current theater, move most to the new one. I almost had a buyer interested in the home sale with theater, the husband was totally smitten with the idea . His wife however had the last word, did not want the additional cost for me to leave the theater as is, was happy enough for me to leave it at the lower price though . I'm going to remove the seats and my custom door, the projector and screen, turn it back into a family den. I wanted new seats for the new theater , guess I'll be repurposing the old ones now .

A couple of years ago I decided that my current house is the one that I will die in. So I built the theater and made the mods for me.
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post #186 of 253 Old 09-29-2018, 12:36 PM
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A couple of years ago I decided that my current house is the one that I will die in. So I built the theater and made the mods for me.

Angela and I talked about this ,her art studio is about the same size as my theater but we went from six to very soon one child and he is a junior in high school. "Do you want to move ,.."you have to accept a small studio" ...done we are staying. Of course , it would have broken my heart to give up the theater.


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post #187 of 253 Old 09-29-2018, 02:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Steve Bruzonsky View Post
Along with lifetime free dental work to the buyer and his immediate family?
Didn’t have to give away that!

I think what helped is it was on the main floor and did not overtake a family room, living room, etc. this was a separate addition without sacrificing other ‘more important’ areas of the home.

Moreover, the buyer was well healed. Wrote a check and didn’t try and negotiate the price I was asking for alll. .

He was a unique buyer but the realtors told me that all serious buyers (we had 3 offers) wanted the theater and thought it was an asset.

We marketed the theater as a ‘one of a kind’ build and implementation that spared little cost and was fully professionally designed and built by an out of state company - as no local retailers had the capability. So, we positioned it as a theater so upscale, none of their friends would have one. For some, the exclusivity was a factor. The realtors ran a 5 min demo loop for each showing - programmed for maximum bass and surround activity . Fortunately, the house was under contract within a week. Hot market out here.

Now, the cost of the theater was a pretty small percentage of the home’s price. I suppose, if the theater and equipment were 10%-20% the cost of the home or more, the sale might be an issue.

Worked out great for me and the buyer. He loves the theater!

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post #188 of 253 Old 09-29-2018, 02:55 PM
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Originally Posted by GaryArthur View Post
A couple of years ago I decided that my current house is the one that I will die in. So I built the theater and made the mods for me.
My theater is so integrated and built into the room, that removing/dismantling it would be disastrous. The large central riser, the entire front velvet wall, the Vistascope screen, the room treatments behind the fabric... not going to happen. Besides, I likely will own my house until the end. I can’t see me downsizing, which will mean losing my favorite room in my house.

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post #189 of 253 Old 09-29-2018, 07:04 PM
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Didn’t have to give away that!

I think what helped is it was on the main floor and did not overtake a family room, living room, etc. this was a separate addition without sacrificing other ‘more important’ areas of the home.

Moreover, the buyer was well healed. Wrote a check and didn’t try and negotiate the price I was asking for alll. .

He was a unique buyer but the realtors told me that all serious buyers (we had 3 offers) wanted the theater and thought it was an asset.

We marketed the theater as a ‘one of a kind’ build and implementation that spared little cost and was fully professionally designed and built by an out of state company - as no local retailers had the capability. So, we positioned it as a theater so upscale, none of their friends would have one. For some, the exclusivity was a factor. The realtors ran a 5 min demo loop for each showing - programmed for maximum bass and surround activity . Fortunately, the house was under contract within a week. Hot market out here.

Now, the cost of the theater was a pretty small percentage of the home’s price. I suppose, if the theater and equipment were 10%-20% the cost of the home or more, the sale might be an issue.

Worked out great for me and the buyer. He loves the theater!

I think you found "the fit" in your sale. Of course,the internet says pools, decks,theaters are all liabilities but this is a statistic. individually, circumstances are all over the map.... you found that to be the case obviously.
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post #190 of 253 Old 09-29-2018, 08:47 PM
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Originally Posted by audioguy View Post
Good point.

Sort of wandering OT here: I have always wondered how many homes actually have theaters of the caliber that we see on this site. I ask, because in the 27 years I have had a serious home theater, I have met so, so, so, so few who also have one - or much less even been in one. I have many friends and acquaintances who have net worths far in excess of what is necessary to participate in this crazy hobby and have never even seen a room such as mine.

This whole "theater in the home" market must be REALLY small. Wonder if anyone has done any studies in this regard?
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You are right. I announced my home theater meet about a month ahead. I was asked what if a thousand people want to come ? I assured the poster that this really is more of a niche than he thought. Those interested in attending were quite far flung.


Art
They are out there, but I am sure the overall numbers are pretty small. I have been in a lot of homes and rarely see a HT. I see more living room pj setups then dedicated HTs. Of course, sometimes they are hidden. I was in a house last year and was looking for the bathroom. Yes, I opened the door to the theater.

For a lot of people, I think the home theater craze has passed. You can see it in the evolution of Cedia.

AG,
Whereabouts do you live?

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post #191 of 253 Old 09-29-2018, 09:09 PM
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I think you found "the fit" in your sale. Of course,the internet says pools, decks,theaters are all liabilities but this is a statistic. individually, circumstances are all over the map.... you found that to be the case obviously.
Funny how we enthusiasts look at things differently than the mainstream. I think of my theater as the house’s greatest asset and not remotely a liability.
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post #192 of 253 Old 09-29-2018, 09:09 PM
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AG,
Whereabouts do you live?
Greensboro, GA. Lake Oconee. About halfway between Atlanta and Augusta. Just off I-20.
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post #193 of 253 Old 09-29-2018, 10:13 PM
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Greensboro, GA. Lake Oconee. About halfway between Atlanta and Augusta. Just off I-20.
Ok, I know it well or use to.

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post #194 of 253 Old 09-30-2018, 04:29 AM
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Wait... you’re moving? What’s the new theater diva like? You built your original from for a theater from the ground up, right??

Yes, built the current theater from the ground up and pretty much hands on for most, I even built my own entrance door by hand. Two years of work, then my wife decides she wants to move to the lake house permanently . I reluctantly agree as I'm the one doing all the maintenance on two homes, between garden and snow clearing alone it is nearly a full time job. Added a large addition to the lake house , unfortunately my theater has not been the priority in the move, that is ongoing now . The current theater is only 13ft X 30ft the new theater will be 16ft X 30ft and allow a much larger screen, will not incorporate the simulator I have in the old but most of the other components will be repurposed . VW5000 is on the top of my list for replacement projector, it's the only one capable of lighting a 150" + size ST100 reference screen .
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post #195 of 253 Old 09-30-2018, 06:00 PM
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Any of you that find the JVC 4500/Sony 5000 lacking in output considering the step up Sony's, the SRX-R815/810?
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post #196 of 253 Old 10-01-2018, 04:17 AM
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Any of you that find the JVC 4500/Sony 5000 lacking in output considering the step up Sony's, the SRX-R815/810?

The VW5000 is actually a little overkill for what I need, the new line here is in yet another league well beyond the VW5000 . No need for a VW5000 double stack with these projectors unless the price is prohibitive certainly.

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post #197 of 253 Old 10-01-2018, 10:48 AM
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Funny how we enthusiasts look at things differently than the mainstream. I think of my theater as the house’s greatest asset and not remotely a liability.

I certainly agree with you more than twenty years in the hobby and history being into it going back to the Kloss Novabeam Model One says I love it but I know a lot of people who just shrug their shoulders. For me it gets way more use than say a boat might. for example
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post #198 of 253 Old 10-01-2018, 10:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Ericglo View Post
For a lot of people, I think the home theater craze has passed. You can see it in the evolution of CEDIA

This is why I asked the question about CEDIA in my thread ,not many responses there.
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post #199 of 253 Old 10-01-2018, 10:56 AM
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The VW5000 is actually a little overkill for what I need, the new line here is in yet another league well beyond the VW5000 . No need for a VW5000 double stack with these projectors unless the price is prohibitive certainly.

I think if you want any kind of HDR performance you might find 2200 lumens anemic. Interesting to see what might be the final calibrated value.
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I think if you want any kind of HDR performance you might find 2200 lumens anemic. Interesting to see what might be the final calibrated value.

I couldn’t agree more!
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In my case, given the changes I made to the original space, it would most certainly be a liability. And to get it back to a more generic usable space would be VERY expensive. Since I am older than my wife, I told her to sell all of the expensive equipment, replace it with something very inexpensive, remove all of the hidden room treatment, paint the room some light generic color, get rid of the screen and projector and hang a flat screen on the wall, get rid of the theater seats and sell it. In my last home, one of the selling points (for the husband) was the theater. In this home, since we live in an "over 55" community, it would be a huge liability. But in the meantime, I, like you, use our theater as an escape mechanism by either listening to music or watching a movie.

Apparently, The Bland was able to sell his home, including all of his expensive equipment, to the new owner. Pretty rare I imagine.
Last week was a long and busy week. Did not get to use the theater any. So Sunday early evening, watched three movies, all back to back.
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post #202 of 253 Old 10-01-2018, 02:26 PM
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Last week was a long and busy week. Did not get to use the theater any. So Sunday early evening, watched three movies, all back to back.
Does your wife watch with you when you watch 3 movies?
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post #203 of 253 Old 10-02-2018, 03:59 AM
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I think if you want any kind of HDR performance you might find 2200 lumens anemic. Interesting to see what might be the final calibrated value.



I assume @Art Sonneborn you are referring to my suggestion of using a 150" scope screen with AT or unity gain between .84- 1.0 gain . In that case I would agree 100% , in-fact that is exactly what I said . If I stick with the VW885 I have no choice to go with a 1.3 gain or higher , 140" max, would need the anamorphic lens and ideal black theater room to make it .



I would agree that 2200 lumens is anemic on a 150" scope screen with a low gain material , on the correct screen size with appropriate gain 2200 lumens would be fantastic. Realistically a 2200 lumen projector will not work well on screen above 120" with a 1.0 gain or less for acceptable HDR , 140" range would require a gain of at least 1.3 or greater . That 2200 lumens would have to be a laser as well in order to have a stable light output . The lamp based projector would start fading immediately, so you would want to downsize the screen to adjust for this inevitability of 25% loss within the first 500-1000 hours , everything has to be considered.


To be honest I am struggling to make a 150" screen work , especially if I go with a ST100 or equivalent . The RS4500 can produce the addition lumens over the other laser choices but at a cost to contrast , P3 and then there is the noise and cooling considerations. There is a big hole between the current offerings and the VW5000 , nothing has filled that space this year , there is no guarantee that may arrive next year either. The ideal projector on a 150" unity gain screen would be 2400 calibrated at around 75% laser output, that projector does not exist and there is a big jump to the VW5000 from this for performance and pricing .

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post #204 of 253 Old 10-02-2018, 04:37 AM
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The lamp based projector would start fading immediately, so you would want to downsize the screen to adjust for this inevitability of 25% loss within the first 500-1000 hours , everything has to be considered.
This is so exaggerated. At least with JVC lamps, they don't fade that quick at those ranges. My sony 675ES lamp tanked at 880 hours, but I think it was a bad lamp. My JVC lamps (since the RS500 on) have lasted well into the 2000 hour ranges without significant drop. As I said before, my old RS500 left here with about 200 lumens drop at 3000 hours. I think max is maybe 200 lumen drop in 1000 hours. (That's about 10%).

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This is so exaggerated. At least with JVC lamps, they don't fade that quick at those ranges. My sony 675ES lamp tanked at 880 hours, but I think it was a bad lamp. My JVC lamps (since the RS500 on) have lasted well into the 2000 hour ranges without significant drop. As I said before, my old RS500 left here with about 200 lumens drop at 3000 hours. I think max is maybe 200 lumen drop in 1000 hours. (That's about 10%).
Is that in high lamp or low lamp though? I thought (from memory) you only ran in low lamp - in the context of this thread and the screen sizes being discussed, low lamp would never be an option. My old RS600 lost at least 15% in the first 500 hours being ran mainly on high lamp.
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post #206 of 253 Old 10-02-2018, 05:15 AM
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This is so exaggerated. At least with JVC lamps, they don't fade that quick at those ranges. My sony 675ES lamp tanked at 880 hours, but I think it was a bad lamp. My JVC lamps (since the RS500 on) have lasted well into the 2000 hour ranges without significant drop. As I said before, my old RS500 left here with about 200 lumens drop at 3000 hours. I think max is maybe 200 lumen drop in 1000 hours. (That's about 10%).
This isn't an exaggeration if you use at or near high lamp. With both UHP and Xenon the first 25% to 30% of the output can go in 400 hours. I did this to run a larger screen . Between two projectors I went through 15 lamps. I graphed the degradation and found as advertised that the loss after that was much more gradual but this is a fact of lamp life.
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post #207 of 253 Old 10-02-2018, 05:23 AM
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Originally Posted by markmon1 View Post
This is so exaggerated. At least with JVC lamps, they don't fade that quick at those ranges. My sony 675ES lamp tanked at 880 hours, but I think it was a bad lamp. My JVC lamps (since the RS500 on) have lasted well into the 2000 hour ranges without significant drop. As I said before, my old RS500 left here with about 200 lumens drop at 3000 hours. I think max is maybe 200 lumen drop in 1000 hours. (That's about 10%).

If lamps were even close to the level you have suggested laser would not exist period, the main reason for the advancement was to avoid the inevitable and guaranteed loss of light that lamps are noted for . Without question the vast majority of owners have had the same consistent losses with lamps across the board regardless of manufacturer . I also had the RS600 and VW675, both were down 15-20% by 400 hours , the biggest loss is immediate . There is a reason why owners with lamp based projectors wait until 100 hours to do the first calibration , number one is the loss expected from the lamp, color shift and gamma droop that accompanies this . Doesn't matter the brand, they all fade . The only minor differences everyone has, is in how fast it occurs , there are some differences in the decay but not by much.



200 lumen drop in 3000 hours is quite impressive for a lamp, I just hope my laser is as capable moving forward . With my Minolta T-10 light meter I'm not seeing any degrading so far at 450 hours with the laser , wasn't the case with my lamp based projectors , not even remotely close .

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post #208 of 253 Old 10-02-2018, 07:11 AM
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Does your wife watch with you when you watch 3 movies?
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post #209 of 253 Old 10-02-2018, 09:05 AM
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Originally Posted by roxiedog13 View Post
If lamps were even close to the level you have suggested laser would not exist period, the main reason for the advancement was to avoid the inevitable and guaranteed loss of light that lamps are noted for . Without question the vast majority of owners have had the same consistent losses with lamps across the board regardless of manufacturer . I also had the RS600 and VW675, both were down 15-20% by 400 hours , the biggest loss is immediate . There is a reason why owners with lamp based projectors wait until 100 hours to do the first calibration , number one is the loss expected from the lamp, color shift and gamma droop that accompanies this . Doesn't matter the brand, they all fade . The only minor differences everyone has, is in how fast it occurs , there are some differences in the decay but not by much.



200 lumen drop in 3000 hours is quite impressive for a lamp, I just hope my laser is as capable moving forward . With my Minolta T-10 light meter I'm not seeing any degrading so far at 450 hours with the laser , wasn't the case with my lamp based projectors , not even remotely close .

So true: and that's the essential reason that I sprang for the 4500, and cannot say how pleased I am with it. In about a yr I'm already over 2000 hrs with no perceptible change (it helps to be semi-retired!). I agree that it would be nice to have the native CR of my previous RS600, but I would not come close to going back to it. The only thing that would make me upgrade is for a successor to the 4500 that has the much higher CR of the lamp-based JVCs.
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post #210 of 253 Old 10-02-2018, 09:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markmon1 View Post
This is so exaggerated. At least with JVC lamps, they don't fade that quick at those ranges. My sony 675ES lamp tanked at 880 hours, but I think it was a bad lamp. My JVC lamps (since the RS500 on) have lasted well into the 2000 hour ranges without significant drop. As I said before, my old RS500 left here with about 200 lumens drop at 3000 hours. I think max is maybe 200 lumen drop in 1000 hours. (That's about 10%).
That wasn't my experience with my RS600. The JVC lamps are pretty good compared to others, but looking at some old notes here, my RS600 dropped 13 lux in the first 45 hours, and 61 lux in 260 hours. My Sony VW600 lost 41 lux in 409 hours. I think the contrast on the VW600 took a dump around the same time. My Sim2 Lumis lamps never made it past 1000 hours - they were too dim. You must have a magic bulb, or you watch in huge increments and have very few on / off cycles. My typical watching habits are one 1 1/2 - 2 hour movie, and that's it. Laser suits that usage well, since on / off cycles have no effect on laser life.

As I near 1000 hours on my RS4500, last I checked, no measurable drop in lumens. In fact, for scope movies, my brightness has gone up 38% by adding the Panamorph DCR lens, which is nice !
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