Why ONLY JVC or Sony? Where is Barco or Christie? - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 32 Old 04-01-2019, 11:27 AM - Thread Starter
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Why ONLY JVC or Sony? Where is Barco or Christie?

So, I am looking for a projector for a dedicated HT space, and have spent a ton of time in both the JVC and Sony threads on both this forum and the $3,000+ forum

It seems that roughly 90% of all buyers who are looking in the 20,000+ section at least seem to gravitate between the Sony VW5000 and the RS4500 when they are looking for the highest performing projectors.

But occasionally I will see mention of Barco or Christie projectors, but there is almost NO recent information regarding these projectors on these boards. The RS4500 thread is probably one of the most active threads on this forum, which obviously says great things about the RS4500.

There is also at least SOME participation on the VW5000 threads.

I know the VW5000 is more expensive than the RS4500 and so less people are looking at projectors near that price range, so naturally their "owners" thread would be less busy.

But my biggest question is Why do the Sony and JVC projectors, at the top end get so much love and attention, but there is soooo little information regarding the Barco and Christie projectors on these forums?

I am of the understanding that both Barco and Christie make some of the HIGHEST level personal use projectors, and I also know that the Sony VW5000 is at least on-par cost wise with some of their options.

So why do Barco or Christie get seemingly so much less love/attention here?

Are the Sony and JVC options just significantly better at a price/performance ratio?

I know a lot of people even in the RS4500 and VW5000 threads will occasionally bring up Christie projectors with some admiration, but I have seen MAYBE 2-3 posts regarding Barco projectors on these forums.

Is this an availability thing? Its much easier to find pricing for the Sony and JVC projectors, is that why people automatically go for these options?

Just looking for some information why JVC and Sony seem to rule the roost of this forum? Are the Barco's and Christie's priced even out of this forum's comfort levels?

Just looking for some information really, and just noticed a LARGE disparity between information online regarding the Sonys and JVC's vs particularly Barcos (which seem to at least have offerings in the same ballpark as the Sony and JVC) and the Christie's, which the only thing I hear about is "If you have an unlimited budget, get a Christie!"

Apologies if this is a stupid question or I am unknowingly beating a dead horse.

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post #2 of 32 Old 04-01-2019, 11:51 AM
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Why ONLY JVC or Sony? Where is Barco or Christie?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maestrosc View Post
So, I am looking for a projector for a dedicated HT space, and have spent a ton of time in both the JVC and Sony threads on both this forum and the $3,000+ forum



It seems that roughly 90% of all buyers who are looking in the 20,000+ section at least seem to gravitate between the Sony VW5000 and the RS4500 when they are looking for the highest performing projectors.



But occasionally I will see mention of Barco or Christie projectors, but there is almost NO recent information regarding these projectors on these boards. The RS4500 thread is probably one of the most active threads on this forum, which obviously says great things about the RS4500.



There is also at least SOME participation on the VW5000 threads.



I know the VW5000 is more expensive than the RS4500 and so less people are looking at projectors near that price range, so naturally their "owners" thread would be less busy.



But my biggest question is Why do the Sony and JVC projectors, at the top end get so much love and attention, but there is soooo little information regarding the Barco and Christie projectors on these forums?



I know that both Barco and Christie make some of the HIGHEST level personal use projectors, and I also know that the Sony VW5000 is at least on-par cost wise with some of their options.



So why do Barco or Christie get seemingly so much less love/attention here?



Are the Sony and JVC options just significantly better at a price/performance ratio?



I know a lot of people even in the RS4500 and VW5000 threads will occasionally bring up Christie projectors with some admiration, but I have seen MAYBE 2-3 posts regarding Barco projectors on these forums.



Is this an availability thing? Its much easier to find pricing for the Sony and JVC projectors, is that why people automatically go for these options?



Just looking for some information why JVC and Sony seem to rule the roost of this forum? Are the Barco's and Christie's priced even out of this forum's comfort levels?



Just looking for some information really, and just noticed a LARGE disparity between information online regarding the Sonys and JVC's vs particularly Barcos (which seem to at least have offerings in the same ballpark as the Sony and JVC) and the Christie's, which the only thing I hear about is "If you have an unlimited budget, get a Christie!"



Apologies if this is a stupid question or I am unknowingly beating a dead horse.


I’ve asked myself the same thing. I think it’s several reasons mainly. Barco and Christie are DLP which is generally much lower contrast. DLP does have a longer life span, lcos panels degrade over time. Also, from what I’ve seen Barco and Christie projectors tend to be bigger and more difficult to install often requiring outboard processors. Generally they have much more brightness interchangeable lenses etc. So even though the some of Barco/Christie projectors are close in price they’re really not when you consider the cost of having a much bigger screen, more seats, professional installation video processors etc. You can read more on this very contentious vs thread below.

Barco Loki Vs Sony 5000 Vs Balder Vs Vivitek
https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink?sha...2&share_type=t

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post #3 of 32 Old 04-01-2019, 04:30 PM
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Price, size, cumbersome home implementation all reduce the numbers of owners dramatically.

Art
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post #4 of 32 Old 04-02-2019, 05:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Art Sonneborn View Post
Price, size, cumbersome home implementation all reduce the numbers of owners dramatically.

Art
The new Barco Bragi is my latest desire. 2.37 chip and a much smaller chassis......
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post #5 of 32 Old 04-05-2019, 05:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Art Sonneborn View Post
Price, size, cumbersome home implementation all reduce the numbers of owners dramatically.

Art
Well price isn't really the issue, for the one or two VW5000 crowd, value for money might be. As the LCoS projectors have higher on-off contrast levels and lower black levels than the DLP projectors. But if you are willing to accept 5K+:1 on-off. Then get the all-in-one RGB laser CP4325 and call it a day. At the same money or even less money than your Sony Stack. The 2K versions are roughly half the height, probably not just half the price?

Peter tweeted from Cinemacon the new Barco(Residential?) replacement for the original SuperKontrast, 4K RGB integrated lasers.

There are less expensive and smaller options, but they shpw the low on-off contrast DLP traditionally has been known for. On the other end of the brightness scalle and pixel shifting, still might suit plenty of people's need, at 1/4 to 1/3 rd the cost.
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post #6 of 32 Old 04-05-2019, 05:33 AM
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I do still love and like the look of pictures got from Barco projector as it much differ from waching TV
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post #7 of 32 Old 04-05-2019, 07:15 AM
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Originally Posted by donaldk View Post
But if you are willing to accept 5K+:1 on-off.
The operative phrase and the answer is no I'm not, been there done that..or accept that I can get DLP ANSI contrast, better sequential than I have but have to go with 1080p, or blitzfarben.. the step up from where I am is a lot more money.

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post #8 of 32 Old 04-05-2019, 08:02 AM
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The big Sony looks promising except the speced contrast is lower than my stack and the light output is similar or lower but it is in a single device . I'd hate to use up a chunk of the funds I'd like to have for the Christie Large Venue on this.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Art Sonneborn View Post
The big Sony looks promising except the speced contrast is lower than my stack and the light output is similar or lower but it is in a single device . I'd hate to use up a chunk of the funds I'd like to have for the Christie Large Venue on this.

This the small Sony;-). Compared to the other DCi projectors, like the 815. These are often sold in pairs for 3D and full cinema brightness. Sony is working on a true follow-on to the 5000 I heared around ISE. No details, as aparantly it was a NDA signed access only demo. Only that it is still a long time off.

As for DLP on-off, it clearly is a prime reason people here are looking at the LCoS projectors. Canon is no option in that respect, it traditionally has low on-off for LCoS, that leaves Sony and JVC.
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post #10 of 32 Old 04-06-2019, 03:16 PM
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BARCO Bragi Cinemascope one of the best projector at this price level MSRP $30,000 . It's come with long life (50,000 hours) LED light source , 0.9 inch DMD NATIVE CINEMASCOPE , 5K display on screen , auto aspect ratio detection , auto tone mapping, auto screen luminance adjust , high performance professional aspherical glass lens , better rigid structure designed , FW upgradeable , no black bar on cinemascope screen ,etc .
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Originally Posted by Boonyarat View Post
BARCO Bragi Cinemascope one of the best projector at this price level MSRP $30,000 ..
What is the expected lumen output? Is TI making special chips just for Barco? Are DLP chips in Barcos any different than the ones found in BenQ 990?
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What is the expected lumen output? Is TI making special chips just for Barco? Are DLP chips in Barcos any different than the ones found in BenQ 990?
The brightness for Bragi Cinemascope is 2100 lumens and 0.9 inch DMD cinemascope just for BARCO . Please try to find your nearest Barco dealer to see how Barco Bragi Cinemascope perform
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audvid View Post
What is the expected lumen output? Is TI making special chips just for Barco? Are DLP chips in Barcos any different than the ones found in BenQ 990?


Yes, much larger (which results in better contrast) with a much higher native resolution.
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post #14 of 32 Old 04-06-2019, 04:29 PM
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Yes, much larger (which results in better contrast) with a much higher native resolution.
What is the much higher native contrast ?


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post #15 of 32 Old 04-06-2019, 04:56 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Boonyarat View Post
The brightness for Bragi Cinemascope is 2100 lumens and 0.9 inch DMD cinemascope just for BARCO . Please try to find your nearest Barco dealer to see how Barco Bragi Cinemascope perform

goddamnit!!

LMAO

I need more lumens.

Are 150" screens really this rare? Its amazing how few projectors there are for consumers that can fill these screens.

I really let my ambitions for this screen get out of hand apparently lol. Should have researched what I was doing to myself getting such a monster screen. - but bigger is sooooo much better lol.
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post #16 of 32 Old 04-06-2019, 05:08 PM
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Why ONLY JVC or Sony? Where is Barco or Christie?

Quote:
Originally Posted by audvid View Post
What is the expected lumen output? Is TI making special chips just for Barco? Are DLP chips in Barcos any different than the ones found in BenQ 990?
Quote:
Originally Posted by bix26 View Post
Yes, much larger (which results in better contrast) with a much higher native resolution.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Art Sonneborn View Post
What is the much higher native contrast ?





Art


I didn’t state “much” in reference to contrast. I was referring to DMD size, a larger DMD will generally have “better” contrast than a smaller one (due to a higher pixel fill). Also, the XPR DMD historically have less contrast than even equal sized DMD’s due to the added subframes used to create a 4k image.

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goddamnit!!

LMAO

I need more lumens.

Are 150" screens really this rare? Its amazing how few projectors there are for consumers that can fill these screens.

I really let my ambitions for this screen get out of hand apparently lol. Should have researched what I was doing to myself getting such a monster screen. - but bigger is sooooo much better lol.
As the Barco quite conservative to present technical data for commercial application unlike some others that provide much on marketing . Even I'm quite sure that the Bragi can handle your 150" diagonal screen but it outside recommendation from Barco that only limit to about approx 130" diagonal . If your room well light control then you can contact Barco dealer to demo in your room and see how it perform. Otherwise you have to go for other model , BALDER CINEMASCOPE P3/DCI that has 3600 lumens and I use with my approx 200" diagonal screen in control room light still perform OK ,even over size from guideline . Anyway you had better to get demo in your room before made decision .
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maestrosc View Post
goddamnit!!



LMAO



I need more lumens.



Are 150" screens really this rare? Its amazing how few projectors there are for consumers that can fill these screens.



I really let my ambitions for this screen get out of hand apparently lol. Should have researched what I was doing to myself getting such a monster screen. - but bigger is sooooo much better lol.


You should look at Barco Balder CinemaScope which I have. 4,000 lumens. I use on a 159 inch wide screen and it is extremely bright. Plenty of horsepower. Also won’t need an anamorphic lens - as it projects different aspect ratios. I can’t recall MSRP but I think was 32-35k


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post #19 of 32 Old 04-06-2019, 07:18 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boonyarat View Post
As the Barco quite conservative to present technical data for commercial application unlike some others that provide much on marketing . Even I'm quite sure that the Bragi can handle your 150" diagonal screen but it outside recommendation from Barco that only limit to about approx 130" diagonal . If your room well light control then you can contact Barco dealer to demo in your room and see how it perform. Otherwise you have to go for other model , BALDER CINEMASCOPE P3/DCI that has 3600 lumens and I use with my approx 200" diagonal screen in control room light still perform OK ,even over size from guideline . Anyway you had better to get demo in your room before made decision .
Any ballpark on price? Also how does it handle HDR?

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Originally Posted by gwthacker View Post
You should look at Barco Balder CinemaScope which I have. 4,000 lumens. I use on a 159 inch wide screen and it is extremely bright. Plenty of horsepower. Also won’t need an anamorphic lens - as it projects different aspect ratios. I can’t recall MSRP but I think was 32-35k


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How does it handle HDR?



Also why does Barco do so little marketing for their lines? Its just so strange to me I know so much more about the Sony and JVC and BenQ lines and see almost nothing on the Barco stuff.


Also, my projector is going to be mounted in the room with no plans for a hushbox currently, so I need to know how they would work in this spaces.

Maybe I will get in contact with my HT contractor and ask him about the barcos and if he knows a dealer or can get me some demos lined up.
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Any ballpark on price? Also how does it handle HDR?



How does it handle HDR?



Also why does Barco do so little marketing for their lines? Its just so strange to me I know so much more about the Sony and JVC and BenQ lines and see almost nothing on the Barco stuff.


Also, my projector is going to be mounted in the room with no plans for a hushbox currently, so I need to know how they would work in this spaces.

Maybe I will get in contact with my HT contractor and ask him about the barcos and if he knows a dealer or can get me some demos lined up.
The Barco BALDER CINEMASCOPE with P3/DCI color wheel MSRP $39,000 . I always play with 4K HDR Blu-Ray disc and the Balder cinemascope P3/DCI perform very nice with 4K HDR movies on big screen . The current model come with new FW that improved many features compare to previous , such as Auto Tone mapping , Auto white point dimming , Screen luminance adjust , Auto detect aspect ratio .
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post #21 of 32 Old 04-06-2019, 08:30 PM
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Any ballpark on price? Also how does it handle HDR?



How does it handle HDR?



Check the native sequential contrast after calibration.. this is one biggy. The other is reflected nits on your screen size. These numbers must be quite large to get anything to speak of from HDR IMO.
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Originally Posted by bix26 View Post
I didn’t state “much” in reference to contrast. I was referring to DMD size, a larger DMD will generally have “better” contrast than a smaller one (due to a higher pixel fill). Also, the XPR DMD historically have less contrast than even equal sized DMD’s due to the added subframes used to create a 4k image.

Ah, sorry misread that.

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post #23 of 32 Old 04-06-2019, 08:48 PM - Thread Starter
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The Barco BALDER CINEMASCOPE with P3/DCI color wheel MSRP $39,000 . I always play with 4K HDR Blu-Ray disc and the Balder cinemascope P3/DCI perform very nice with 4K HDR movies on big screen . The current model come with new FW that improved many features compare to previous , such as Auto Tone mapping , Auto white point dimming , Screen luminance adjust , Auto detect aspect ratio .
The not needing an anamorphic lens is nice.

Kinda puzzling how none of the consumer projectors are for a scope screen. Seems like at least one of the companies would look to offer a projector that doesnt need an additional lens purchase to get scope screens, seems like more people in the higher $$ projectors seem to prefer scope to 16:9
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... I use with my approx 200" diagonal screen in control room light still perform OK ,even over size from guideline . ..
Did you check out the Sony 5000 also? I realize Sony is a higher price point.
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post #25 of 32 Old 04-07-2019, 06:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maestrosc View Post
goddamnit!!

LMAO

I need more lumens.

Are 150" screens really this rare? Its amazing how few projectors there are for consumers that can fill these screens.

I really let my ambitions for this screen get out of hand apparently lol. Should have researched what I was doing to myself getting such a monster screen. - but bigger is sooooo much better lol.
Well in my case after careful and taking a long time to consider what screen size to go with ???
I went with the Stewart Firehawk 1.35, 123" 16x9 W/4-way remote masking.
And honestly I'm so glad I didn't go BIGGGGGGGGGGGGGG
The current JVC RS4500 has Brilliant images on Both Medium & High laser according to if it's HDR or 4K Ultra HDR content.

I think there sometimes is something to be said for NOT going BIGGGGGGGGGGGG

Unless, you just happen to be in the position monies wise to afford like the Sony ES5000 that is.

Terry

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post #26 of 32 Old 04-08-2019, 04:58 AM
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Well in my case after careful and taking a long time to consider what screen size to go with ???

I went with the Stewart Firehawk 1.35, 123" 16x9 W/4-way remote masking.

And honestly I'm so glad I didn't go BIGGGGGGGGGGGGGG

The current JVC RS4500 has Brilliant images on Both Medium & High laser according to if it's HDR or 4K Ultra HDR content.



I think there sometimes is something to be said for NOT going BIGGGGGGGGGGGG



Unless, you just happen to be in the position monies wise to afford like the Sony ES5000 that is.



Terry

When I did my theater I debated forever between a 135 inch wide and 159 inch. I went with the 159 and it looked enormous- I was afraid I made the wrong choice. I’m so used to it now I’m debating going to 170 inch wide screen (max size for my spot) with 4 way masking starting in 2.0.

I personally blame Art and his ginormous screen for my upgraditis. I have the Barco Balder CinemaScope and it’s definitely enough for my current screen. I’ve debated moving to Sony 5000 if I upgrade my screen, although it’s a jump in $ plus need A lens.

I’ve found it interesting how quickly you get used to a big screen. But definitely agree with you to go with smaller screen if you’re just hampering the picture quality with a projector that can’t light it fully. Defeats the purpose.


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post #27 of 32 Old 04-08-2019, 05:16 AM
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When I did my theater I debated forever between a 135 inch wide and 159 inch. I went with the 159 and it looked enormous- I was afraid I made the wrong choice. I’m so used to it now I’m debating going to 170 inch wide screen (max size for my spot) with 4 way masking starting in 2.0.

I personally blame Art and his ginormous screen for my upgraditis. I have the Barco Balder CinemaScope and it’s definitely enough for my current screen. I’ve debated moving to Sony 5000 if I upgrade my screen, although it’s a jump in $ plus need A lens.

I’ve found it interesting how quickly you get used to a big screen.

Hanging out with Rob (19' wide), Wolfgang (23' wide) and Chris (17') will do that to you. For my room this is as large as I'd want but for immersion it really is an enjoyable thing. It does ,of course, paint one into a corner with projector choices.

Art
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post #28 of 32 Old 04-08-2019, 10:01 AM
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Hanging out with Rob (19' wide), Wolfgang (23' wide) and Chris (17') will do that to you. For my room this is as large as I'd want but for immersion it really is an enjoyable thing. It does ,of course, paint one into a corner with projector choices.



Art


I knew about Rob and Chris- but didn’t realize Wolfgang has 23 wide. That must be an impressive sight. Explains his need for a Thor!


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post #29 of 32 Old 04-08-2019, 11:13 AM
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I knew about Rob and Chris- but didn’t realize Wolfgang has 23 wide. That must be an impressive sight. Explains his need for a Thor!


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Yea great big ..
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post #30 of 32 Old 04-08-2019, 01:09 PM - Thread Starter
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Yea great big ..
#goals right here lol.
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