CINERAMAX Cedia 2019 Alcon Demo - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 57 Old 07-17-2019, 10:24 AM - Thread Starter
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CINERAMAX Cedia 2019 Alcon Demo

CINERAMAX will be allowed to feature specially curated high spl immersive demos at the end of the day in the Alcons Booth. Multichannel Music Included.
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post #2 of 57 Old 07-17-2019, 12:40 PM
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"High SPL" however at CEDIA 2018 CMax's special Alcons presentation was nice and not TOO LOUD despite high SPL!
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post #3 of 57 Old 07-17-2019, 12:51 PM
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I think the world of Max and spoke to him last week in fact but I hope he keeps the volume down just a little bit.

Those Alcon demos have been very good with implementing self control on the volume knob.
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post #4 of 57 Old 07-17-2019, 03:33 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by mmiles View Post
I think the world of Max and spoke to him last week in fact but I hope he keeps the volume down just a little bit.

Those Alcon demos have been very good with implementing self control on the volume knob.
I spoke with the world famousCINERAMAX here is his response.

Indeed, Mike, it won't be THAT loud. Since achieving the perfect bed channel phase coherency at La Salle's LOGE theater last April with the Alcon's CRMS-MKII LCR and 11 CRMS-SR 4" ribbon +8" on the bed channels (also Trinnov 3D microphone's gets the credit there) for a GREAT BUBBLE, he is trying to convince La Salle to replace the Front and Back tops with this new speaker Alcons 4" 90x90+ 8" Introduced at Infocomm, perhaps the top contender of all the speakers currently in the market for tops duty he thinks, because some studios like Paramount, SONY, and Warner often do not remix for small speakers their ATMOS MIXES and have full bandwidthon tops. After amassing the most complete immersive Kaleidescape library for mining widths and tops intensive scene analysis he proposed to Alcons to experiment at CEDIA with this purported next frontier, because once you have the perfect Bubble what comes next?





Alcons-CEDIA 2018 demo room waiting line.

You might want to "drop the hippopotamus on top of the bubble", Synthesis owners might have to replace their sc-3's tops with more m2's, LOL. But all future Alcons owners should consider being able to do the "Hippo Drop on Top", after blowing 7 NON-ALCONS, woofers but eventually succeeding he fully believes this is the next frontier for ATMOS and NEURAL-X PRO.

Alcons did consider the suggestion but due to the booth's low ceilings, where the projected light would hit the speakers and not wanting to play so loud, the non-bass managed "hippo drop" was a bridge too far for THIS CEDIA. So the curated end of day demo will try to create as close to La Salles current system Buble-wise, as the booth permits.
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post #5 of 57 Old 07-17-2019, 06:16 PM
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The “hippo on top” is an interesting concept. It does make sense to feel the weight of a full bandwidth mix if it does exist in the content. It’s discussions like this where I think Cineramax is missed in this forum.
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post #6 of 57 Old 07-18-2019, 11:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by taker View Post
I spoke with the world famousCINERAMAX here is his response.

Indeed, Mike, it won't be THAT loud. Since achieving the perfect bed channel phase coherency at La Salle's LOGE theater last April with the Alcon's CRMS-MKII LCR and 11 CRMS-SR 4" ribbon +8" on the bed channels (also Trinnov 3D microphone's gets the credit there) for a GREAT BUBBLE, he is trying to convince La Salle to replace the Front and Back tops with this new speaker Alcons 4" 90x90+ 8" Introduced at Infocomm, perhaps the top contender of all the speakers currently in the market for tops duty he thinks, because some studios like Paramount, SONY, and Warner often do not remix for small speakers their ATMOS MIXES and have full bandwidthon tops. After amassing the most complete immersive Kaleidescape library for mining widths and tops intensive scene analysis he proposed to Alcons to experiment at CEDIA with this purported next frontier, because once you have the perfect Bubble what comes next?





Alcons-CEDIA 2018 demo room waiting line.

You might want to "drop the hippopotamus on top of the bubble", Synthesis owners might have to replace their sc-3's tops with more m2's, LOL. But all future Alcons owners should consider being able to do the "Hippo Drop on Top", after blowing 7 NON-ALCONS, woofers but eventually succeeding he fully believes this is the next frontier for ATMOS and NEURAL-X PRO.

Alcons did consider the suggestion but due to the booth's low ceilings, where the projected light would hit the speakers and not wanting to play so loud, the non-bass managed "hippo drop" was a bridge too far for THIS CEDIA. So the curated end of day demo will try to create as close to La Salles current system Buble-wise, as the booth permits.
I tend to disagree with what I have highlighted in Red. From personal experience at least with 705's, SCL4's, amd M2's.
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post #7 of 57 Old 07-18-2019, 12:27 PM
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That has to be Peter's photoshopped drawing!!!??
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Goodbye to a great audio and video genius and writer... JOHN GANNON. I enjoyed your friendship, wit and a nice long run we took around Indianapolis at CEDIA years back... and for buying my Runco 980 Ultra years back... you saved my ass! Rest in peace.
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post #8 of 57 Old 07-18-2019, 12:35 PM
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That has to be Peter's photoshopped drawing!!!??
Yes, a true master, the good news is they never can pass for reality.

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post #9 of 57 Old 07-19-2019, 10:14 AM
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Is just for avs forum members.? I plan on attending.

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post #10 of 57 Old 07-19-2019, 10:53 AM
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Originally Posted by dan webster View Post
Is just for avs forum members.? I plan on attending.
You don't take a lie detector test or have your identity checked to attend! Anyone with a CEDIA badge who is allowed on the CEDIA floor may attend. Simply a matter of knowing about it thanks to AVS Forum!
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post #11 of 57 Old 07-19-2019, 11:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Bruzonsky View Post
You don't take a lie detector test or have your identity checked to attend! Anyone with a CEDIA badge who is allowed on the CEDIA floor may attend. Simply a matter of knowing about it thanks to AVS Forum!
Good thing because i would fail any lie detector test about pretty much anything. Thanks I am looking forward to it.

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post #12 of 57 Old 07-20-2019, 09:38 AM - Thread Starter
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Respone I got from Cineramax

Hi Lon,I have been meaning to congratulate you for months on being among the first Rhino Drop compliant synthesis owners, the specs those 705 your 3D audio consultant recommended pack a wallop, will be nice if he continues that practice on his other new clients.

The comment about the M2's was directed at the owner of the sickest Synthesis system on the planet. A certain TYROLEAN master calibrator loves the M2 so much that he made a bed of 9x M2's (did he not like so much the other models? Don't know).

The same person calibrated La Salles, and here are the facts and La Salle Is witness: 10 minutes after the Kaleidescape scene analysis demo started, where many different short segments are parsed and strung for effective scene analysis (because if the scenes become too long habituation kicks in and confuses the understanding, so i keep it short and to the point, that opens up the other side of habituation, that maintaining the clips short and alternating act like ice cream cleaning the palate preparing you brain for instant absorption of fresh information. The clips are of the sound going around the head, exaggerated width channel objects, and top intensive ( raining piglets in La Salle's) segments, he came over to La Salle and me, shaking his head. He threw his arms up into the air and said: "YOU CAN"T DO THIS WITH JBL". As an unbiased opinion as the Alcons could get? Maybe.

The following such scenes are available only from Kaleidescape in lossless. Time and Alcons permitting I will try to recreate the raining piglets and around the head pans intensive La Salle experience with some of these, and more non-k exclusive clips . To the curious pursuer of absolute immersion, piqued by the comment of the synthesis record holder, you guys should ask Brad to throw an avs party. Not all titles bellow are ATMOS but some sound uncannily as good with Neural-X. (The concept of Format Inconsequetiality)
Sherlock Gnomes (4K) - Added 5 June 2018; 4K Disc - No Disc - No Info
Elysium (4K) – Added 2017; 4K Disc – No Info
Flatliners (2017) (4K) – Added 2017; 4K Disc – No Info
Goosebumps (4K) – Added 2017; 4K Disc – No Info
The Girl in the Spider's Web (4K) - Added 22 January 2019; 4K Disc - No Info
Into the Storm (4K) - Added 2017; 4K Disc - No Info
Man from U.N.C.L.E (4K) - Added 2017; 4K Disc - No Info
Sherlock Holmes (4K) - Added 2017; 4K Disc - No Info
Live Die Repeat: Edge Of Tomorrow (4K) - Added 21 April 2018; 4K Disc - No Info
The Wave (4K) - Magnolia Pictures added 9 August 2018; 4K Disc - No Info

10 reasons for an immersophile to invest in a Strato s-6



Lastly, progressive 70's music originally mixed in Quad is prime for ATMOS remixing, Andrew Poulain agreed the Moog is the ideal instrument to take flight and do 3D sonic pirouettes. Time permitting I have a selection of Steve Wilson mixed Emerson Lake and Palmer, Pink Floyd, Yes, Tangerine Dream and others that hopefully will confirm this theory about prog rock being ideal for ATMOS reissuing. Andrew Poulain is not familiar with Steve Wilsons remixing prowess, the best lays ahead for ATMOS Music at home.
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post #13 of 57 Old 07-20-2019, 09:52 AM
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Please tell me you have an Atmos remix of ELP Tank !
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post #14 of 57 Old 07-21-2019, 01:27 PM
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HAHA I was talking to Peter on Twitter and he was talking about the sensation of a hippo falling on the floor above you lol with a good Atmos speaker. Now those would be some low hz reaching tops lol.

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post #15 of 57 Old 07-21-2019, 02:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by taker View Post
Respone I got from Cineramax

Hi Lon,I have been meaning to congratulate you for months on being among the first Rhino Drop compliant synthesis owners, the specs those 705 your 3D audio consultant recommended pack a wallop, will be nice if he continues that practice on his other new clients.

The comment about the M2's was directed at the owner of the sickest Synthesis system on the planet. A certain TYROLEAN master calibrator loves the M2 so much that he made a bed of 9x M2's (did he not like so much the other models? Don't know).

The same person calibrated La Salles, and here are the facts and La Salle Is witness: 10 minutes after the Kaleidescape scene analysis demo started, where many different short segments are parsed and strung for effective scene analysis (because if the scenes become too long habituation kicks in and confuses the understanding, so i keep it short and to the point, that opens up the other side of habituation, that maintaining the clips short and alternating act like ice cream cleaning the palate preparing you brain for instant absorption of fresh information. The clips are of the sound going around the head, exaggerated width channel objects, and top intensive ( raining piglets in La Salle's) segments, he came over to La Salle and me, shaking his head. He threw his arms up into the air and said: "YOU CAN"T DO THIS WITH JBL". As an unbiased opinion as the Alcons could get? Maybe.

The following such scenes are available only from Kaleidescape in lossless. Time and Alcons permitting I will try to recreate the raining piglets and around the head pans intensive La Salle experience with some of these, and more non-k exclusive clips . To the curious pursuer of absolute immersion, piqued by the comment of the synthesis record holder, you guys should ask Brad to throw an avs party. Not all titles bellow are ATMOS but some sound uncannily as good with Neural-X. (The concept of Format Inconsequetiality)
Sherlock Gnomes (4K) - Added 5 June 2018; 4K Disc - No Disc - No Info
Elysium (4K) – Added 2017; 4K Disc – No Info
Flatliners (2017) (4K) – Added 2017; 4K Disc – No Info
Goosebumps (4K) – Added 2017; 4K Disc – No Info
The Girl in the Spider's Web (4K) - Added 22 January 2019; 4K Disc - No Info
Into the Storm (4K) - Added 2017; 4K Disc - No Info
Man from U.N.C.L.E (4K) - Added 2017; 4K Disc - No Info
Sherlock Holmes (4K) - Added 2017; 4K Disc - No Info
Live Die Repeat: Edge Of Tomorrow (4K) - Added 21 April 2018; 4K Disc - No Info
The Wave (4K) - Magnolia Pictures added 9 August 2018; 4K Disc - No Info

10 reasons for an immersophile to invest in a Strato s-6



Lastly, progressive 70's music originally mixed in Quad is prime for ATMOS remixing, Andrew Poulain agreed the Moog is the ideal instrument to take flight and do 3D sonic pirouettes. Time permitting I have a selection of Steve Wilson mixed Emerson Lake and Palmer, Pink Floyd, Yes, Tangerine Dream and others that hopefully will confirm this theory about prog rock being ideal for ATMOS reissuing. Andrew Poulain is not familiar with Steve Wilsons remixing prowess, the best lays ahead for ATMOS Music at home.
Pease send Peter regards, I miss him here
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post #16 of 57 Old 07-21-2019, 05:26 PM
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Not a very Kosher demo - cows would be better!

Oh well - I like Pepperoni on pizza!

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post #17 of 57 Old 07-21-2019, 10:10 PM
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I thought it was the "when pigs fly" reference.

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post #18 of 57 Old 07-22-2019, 08:18 PM
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Looks like pork bellies are up. Sorry lol.
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post #19 of 57 Old 07-25-2019, 10:33 AM
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Quote:
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Pease send Peter regards, I miss him here
Does he choose not to come back? or is he banned? (and what the heck could he have done to earn so long a ban???) let's start a petition!
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post #20 of 57 Old 07-26-2019, 04:14 AM
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Does he choose not to come back? or is he banned? (and what the heck could he have done to earn so long a ban???) let's start a petition!
Two consecutive permanent bans.
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post #21 of 57 Old 07-26-2019, 08:41 AM
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^yikes. Maybe I don't want to know what he did to deserve that!

L + L = R
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post #22 of 57 Old 07-26-2019, 09:44 AM
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^yikes. Maybe I don't want to know what he did to deserve that!
It's not all that hard, I was suspended for a short time for an innocent mistake.
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post #23 of 57 Old 07-26-2019, 04:24 PM
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^yikes. Maybe I don't want to know what he did to deserve that!
I believe the last one was for pre announcing DTS:X Pro for Trinnov 6 months before they issued a press release.
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post #24 of 57 Old 07-26-2019, 08:39 PM
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I believe the last one was for pre announcing DTS:X Pro for Trinnov 6 months before they issued a press release.
Eh, I doubt Trinnov has any sway with whoever issues bans on AVS Forums.

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post #25 of 57 Old 07-26-2019, 11:21 PM
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I believe the last one was for pre announcing DTS:X Pro for Trinnov 6 months before they issued a press release.
AVS bans are for a few days or a week generally. I should know as I've had happen a few times over the years. HA! Keep in mind AVS is a for profit forum that sells advertising and if you don't think this affects certain decisions then you don't understand capitalism. HA! HA! Unfortunately as CMax can be quite interesting and intriguing. I agree with Adam no way CMax was banned for that.

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post #26 of 57 Old 07-27-2019, 01:34 AM
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AVS bans are for a few days or a week generally. I should know as I've had happen a few times over the years. HA! Keep in mind AVS is a for profit forum that sells advertising and if you don't think this affects certain decisions then you don't understand capitalism. HA! HA! Unfortunately as CMax can be quite interesting and intriguing. I agree with Adam no way CMax was banned for that.
Peter is a friend and I wish he was able to post again. His last posts on this forum were about Trinnov supporting DTS:X Pro well before it was announced. I would tend to agree
That it was not Trinnov that banned him as he has had a good relationship with Arnold. I bought my Trinnov from Peter and he was able to get them to very quickly
Apply the 16 digital, 16 analog channel patch to my system. There were however some AVS members who were upset he was discussing the DTS:X Pro support.
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post #27 of 57 Old 07-27-2019, 10:47 AM
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Any news on a Sentinel amp with more channels?

Also, anyone tried to run Alcons without their amps, i.e. with generic amps having the crossover in the processor? Is it possible?

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post #28 of 57 Old 07-27-2019, 11:03 AM
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^yikes. Maybe I don't want to know what he did to deserve that!

I'd guess excessively self-promoting posts, IMO often bordering on spam.

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post #29 of 57 Old 07-27-2019, 02:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Stephan View Post
Any news on a Sentinel amp with more channels?

Also, anyone tried to run Alcons without their amps, i.e. with generic amps having the crossover in the processor? Is it possible?
I don’t see any reason why they can’t be run with any other amp . You only connect audio signal cables and not connect the SIS cables in the four conductor neutrik connector . But as far as I know they don’t sell speakers without their amps and cost of basic tuning/ commissioning included in the project cost
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post #30 of 57 Old 07-27-2019, 09:30 PM
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Originally Posted by mani View Post
I don’t see any reason why they can’t be run with any other amp . You only connect audio signal cables and not connect the SIS cables in the four conductor neutrik connector . But as far as I know they don’t sell speakers without their amps and cost of basic tuning/ commissioning included in the project cost
Sure, you could theoretically run CRMS with other amps too, but you would miss out on their normalisation filtering which is custom for each speaker and included with the amps. As for the SIS system it might have more of an effect for longer stretches of cable, but according to Alcons at least - even on rather short stretches it does have an actual impact on the stabilisation of the impedance drop caused by cable loss that is measured and compensated for continuously on the fly.

That said, knowing that the Sentinels are using custom made Hypex amps in the NC1200-class they are actually not that expensive compared to other similar solutions either, so it´s not like you´re paying "Apple prices" for using their proprietary hardware solutions. Have a look at these pretty low cost NC1200 based modules from NORD for example, https://www.nordacoustics.co.uk/nc1200, they´re charging about 2500USD per channel which is actually about the same you would pay per channel for a 4ch Sentinel3 from Alcons but without all the additional tech supplied by Alcons. Not saying the NORD amps are bad in any way BTW, it´s just an example.
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