The Official Magnepan Owners Thread - Page 222 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #6631 of 6663 Old 08-13-2019, 11:22 AM
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Originally Posted by sgibson View Post
I'll pray for you...if you post some pics
Pics of what? Me? Waiting while being unusually calm and collected ? No problem, here I am.
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post #6632 of 6663 Old 08-13-2019, 11:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles Mooney View Post
Yeah..I remember reading about the ridiculous delivery estimates before I called and ordered. He said 5-8 weeks I told the dude at Magnepan I was aware of the delays told him I wouldn't start getting pissy until after Labor Day.

His semi-confident reply was something like "Oh, you'll definitely have them bye the end of August...you really should have them by then."... you could tell he was getting tired of dealing with this issue.

A coworker wanted to know about Maggies and how they do what they do, etc and I also had to explain to him what WAF meant...

We all (ok maybe not ALL) have to deal with this issue...
What's that old sayin'..."the wheel that squeaks..."
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post #6633 of 6663 Old 08-13-2019, 01:01 PM
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Originally Posted by sgibson View Post
I'll pray for you...if you post some pics
Posting the requested pics, no prayers needed anymore, but your offer is greatly appreciated.
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post #6634 of 6663 Old 08-13-2019, 07:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grigorianvlad View Post
Posting the requested pics, no prayers needed anymore, but your offer is greatly appreciated.

Thanks for the pics, looking good!!!

'scuse me while I drool
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post #6635 of 6663 Old 08-15-2019, 04:26 PM
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This shows the Maggies' sheer size. Even plants are trembling before them.


I had to move the turntable, I cannot play it louder than 30% volume without developing a horrible runaway bass rumble. So it is back in the left rear corner where I can spin the vinyl at any volume.

I know, I need to move that stupid plant!
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post #6636 of 6663 Old 08-15-2019, 06:44 PM
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Talking

Quote:
Originally Posted by grigorianvlad View Post
This shows the Maggies' sheer size. Even plants are trembling before them.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HxYBzdtfCpk

I had to move the turntable, I cannot play it louder than 30% volume without developing a horrible runaway bass rumble. So it is back in the left rear corner where I can spin the vinyl at any volume.

I know, I need to move that stupid plant!
Oh no...do not touch that plant!
After all, Magnepan's chief guru-Wendell Diller wouldn't think of showing off the Maggies without any plants. See attached Pic from AXPONA 2019...if you don't believe me
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post #6637 of 6663 Old 08-15-2019, 06:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sgibson View Post
Oh no...do not touch that plant!
After all, Magnepan's chief guru-Wendell Diller wouldn't think of showing off the Maggies without any plants. See attached Pic from AXPONA 2019...if you don't believe me
I believe you. It is just my plant stands on a 2,700W Sunfire sub that shakes it violently when bass is heavy. The RELs on the right never shake at any volume, they shake the room though.
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post #6638 of 6663 Old 08-15-2019, 06:51 PM
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This track is just designed for Maggies. Unreal.

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post #6639 of 6663 Old 08-15-2019, 06:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grigorianvlad View Post
This track is just designed for Maggies. Unreal.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E7vkobAkyjI
wow!!!
I'm a man of few words
But in this case I'll add that is stunning, superb, beautiful...and so on...
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post #6640 of 6663 Old 08-15-2019, 07:35 PM
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Some observations and settings adjustments (and a question) so far.

1) Magnepan suggests ribbon tweeters on the outside for better imaging. I assume they don't know what kind of a room I have. So, the tweeters are on the inside for me.

2) The specs say 86db sensitivity and 8ohm. Like hell it is. The actual sensitivity is 83.5dB (which is actually higher from a distance than cone speakers because of the way Maggies work) and mostly 4ohm, with a minimum 3.3 ohms at 10kHz. The impedance only touches 8ohm in the 1.6kHz, otherwise lays almost flat at 4ohm. So, Magnepan is full of sh*t. See the pic attached. So, disconnected the speaker cables from 8ohm taps on the ARC and connected to 4ohm power amp binding posts. The 3.7i are 4ohm even in the specs.

3) This scared me a lot when I just got the 3.5R.s. This is because of my stupidity which knows no limits. It has been a year or two since I owned Maggies. I put them together, mounted and secured the crossovers and took out jumpers from the tweeter attenuators (marked by a red arrow in the pic). Turned them on - horrible, muddy mess. Then I realized the ribbon tweeters are turned off. My mistake was that I thought the jumpers in turns the tweeters off, which is not correct. You need to install them to turn the tweeters on. I shouldn't have taken the jumpers out.

4) As soon as the issue with the dead tweeters was resolved I decided to recalibrate the room acoustics. With any cone speakers Audyssey invariably set crossover to 40hz. It measured the speakers range and promptly set the crossover for the 3.5R's at not 40hz, not 60hz, not even 80hz but 115hz. I have never seen anything like this. Yet these 3.5R's generated more bass than any other pair of Maggies I've owned. I am not sure why Auddysey thought they need so much bass reinforcement from the subs. Of course, I lowered the crossover to 60hz. 40hz sounded like there was a hole in the range.

5) There is a mysterious part that came with them. Looks like a wrench with cut outs of sorts, but it doesnt fit anything on the outside of the speakers. Does anyone know what it is?
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post #6641 of 6663 Old 08-16-2019, 07:20 AM
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1. I've almost always preferred tweeters on the inside. Lately they have been re-affirming the need for the tweeter to be a little (inch or) further from the listener than the bass panel for proper time alignment and that requires tweeters in with a little toe-in to aim at the listener. You can do it with them on the outside but toe-in tends to be less and I don't like the image as much. The only times I have had tweeters outside was in very large rooms when I was a fair distance away. Less than that, and it tends to sound impressive with a wider image, but never quite sounded "right" to me over time and I put them inside.

2. If Magnepan stated 8 ohms it is a typo; they've always been ~4 ohms nominal, with a little dip around the crossover points, and the ribbon tweeter drops to 3 ohms or below in most cases. Some are closer to 5 ohms, mainly the centers and smaller guys. They do spec at 2.83 Vrms without an impedance so the actual sensitivity is about 3 dB lower than typical. Not lying, but presenting "in the best possible light", to be kind. They do send most of their energy forward (and to the rear) and do not radiate much to the sides or above/below so at a distance are more sensitive than a conventional speaker that radiates much more to the sides and top/bottom. Magnepan's claim has been for decades that their radiation pattern (from the lower midrange up) provides them an advantage over conventional designs -- but they are still pretty durn insensitive.

3. RTFM? The jumpers are there to make it easy to add tweeter resistors since for many folk the tweeter runs "hot" so they use the included resistors to reduce its output a little.

4. Audyssey, and may room correction programs, can get confused by dipoles especially if the rear wave is not damped. Maggies, like any planar speaker, have somewhat limited excursion (compensated by large panel area) and distort badly when driven by large bass signals. I crossed my MG-IIIa's at 70-80 Hz, an octave above their -3 dB point. That provided better bass and on up since the panels mo longer had to deal with large bass sounds. Helps the amplifier as well.

5. The wrench used to be to tighten the bolts/nuts for the attaching the stand. Embarrassingly I've forgotten what the cut-out end is for...

FWIWFM - Don
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post #6642 of 6663 Old 08-16-2019, 10:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grigorianvlad View Post
This track is just designed for Maggies. Unreal.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E7vkobAkyjI
Ducks Quacking x2 ?

This song is 4 min 3 seconds on Tidal
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post #6643 of 6663 Old 08-17-2019, 04:01 PM
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Was the other end with the cutouts used to remove the fuse maybe

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post #6644 of 6663 Old 08-17-2019, 04:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by threshold350 View Post
Was the other end with the cutouts used to remove the fuse maybe

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You could be right. But the manual doesnt mention any such accessory. The previous owner has no clue as well, he has never used that mysterious wrench.
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post #6645 of 6663 Old 08-17-2019, 05:03 PM
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Isn't this an innovative way of using LED lights?

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post #6646 of 6663 Old Yesterday, 07:28 AM
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Cool

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Originally Posted by grigorianvlad View Post
Isn't this an innovative way of using LED lights?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rAFWG8XHBi4
Oh...yes.."Shine your light upon me". As quoted by your "Maggies". Cool.
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post #6647 of 6663 Old Yesterday, 07:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grigorianvlad View Post
Isn't this an innovative way of using LED lights?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rAFWG8XHBi4
Whose are those that close to the front wall and that close together?
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post #6648 of 6663 Old Yesterday, 09:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scotth3886 View Post
Whose are those that close to the front wall and that close together?
Yeah, if I move them just a bit away from the wall they will end up behind me.

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post #6649 of 6663 Old Yesterday, 04:04 PM
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Magnepan owners past and present, advice please.

I just completed my move across country and have my 1.7i's in their new listening room. I no longer have a dedicated listening room and they are now located in a 11' x 14' room sharing space with my home office.

The 1.7i's are across the short wall (11') and my desk, chair, computer is on the opposite short wall.

I've read tons of thread about placement regarding speaker placement (Kardas, rule of thirds..): space to rear wall, listener, side wall etc. and believe I have them placed fairly well.

I'm using an Aragon 8008x3 which provides 400W of SS into 4 ohms. I'm using an Aragon Stage 1 preamplifier set in "Direct Mode" receiving the digital out (Toslink optical feed) from my source (Sonos Connect Streamer). I'm also using a REL R-328 sub running the 1.7i's full range (suggested per REL) with the REL set for 60hz and below. I have about 20hz of overlap from 40hz to 60hz since the 1.7i's bottom at 40hz. Also suggested by past REL owners in the REL Subwoofer threads.

I chose to use the DAC in the SONOS because it is much newer than the DAC in the Stage 1 which is over 15 years old now. Another reason is because the analog only "Direct Mode" on the Stage 1 is supposed to be using the same electronics/circuit that was contained in the highly acclaimed Aragon Aurum Preamplifier.

So while I'm pretty happy with the sound I currently have, I'm looking to make some changes and/or tweaks to get the best possible sound I can from the Maggies.

I've read several threads with owners stating that you have to run a tube preamp when using a SS amplifier to get the Maggies to sound their best and truly sing.

That said I've love to hear some suggestions on a good used (maybe new?) tube preamp to try in the system? My top end budget is 2K
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post #6650 of 6663 Old Yesterday, 04:45 PM
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What are you missing or looking to improve with your current setup? I don't think you need a tube preamp to make Maggies sing.

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post #6651 of 6663 Old Yesterday, 05:45 PM
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Quote:
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What are you missing or looking to improve with your current setup? I don't think you need a tube preamp to make Maggies sing.

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That's just it. I don't know what I'm missing if anything but am curious how my system would sound with a tube preamplifier. That's why I was hoping someone had a similar situation with replacing their SS preamp with a tube and could post their opinions/findings
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post #6652 of 6663 Old Yesterday, 05:49 PM
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Switched the speakers. Now the tweeters are on the outside. Surprisingly, there is more treble and bass became more defined. How is that possible? The bass panels are closer to center and should be less defined. And the treble?

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post #6653 of 6663 Old Yesterday, 05:50 PM
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only tube I currently have is a headphone amp. I dont know if my lrs would soud better with tube/reverby pre or amp. it would sound different ofc.

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post #6654 of 6663 Old Yesterday, 05:54 PM
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Originally Posted by PRO710HD View Post
That's just it. I don't know what I'm missing if anything but am curious how my system would sound with a tube preamplifier. That's why I was hoping someone had a similar situation with replacing their SS preamp with a tube and could post their opinions/findings
I cannot speak for (or against) a tube amp switch (unless we are talking $30,000 ARC tube preamp upgrade), but the best bang for the buck would be to upgrade your 1.7is to a higher model. You can spend 10 times the amount of such an upgrade, you would still get only 10% of an improvement gotten from lets say a 3.7i upgrade.

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post #6655 of 6663 Old Yesterday, 06:05 PM
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Yeah, if I move them just a bit away from the wall they will end up behind me.
That works too. Just turn your chair around.
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post #6656 of 6663 Old Yesterday, 06:07 PM
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That works too. Just turn your chair around.
I did . They're still too close, even on the other side.

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post #6657 of 6663 Old Yesterday, 07:09 PM
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What are you missing or looking to improve with your current setup? I don't think you need a tube preamp to make Maggies sing.

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The other thing is I've never owned tubes or even auditioned a system with tubes, so I've always been curious as to how they would sound vs all SS systems.
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post #6658 of 6663 Old Yesterday, 07:21 PM
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china makes cheap tube stuff w/russian tubes that arent horrible for low risk/cost.

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post #6659 of 6663 Old Yesterday, 08:24 PM
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All IME/IMO.

@PRO710HD : I would never run the panels full-range. Maggies distort very badly (10's of %) when driven with large bass signals. I would set them up using conventional bass management with the crossover set to 80 Hz (standard setting, and an octave above their LF corner). Every time I have set up Maggies they have sounded much better that way with possible exception of the 20.x which I could crossover lower. I played with the crossover many times over the years (~1979 on for me) and the lowest I ever ran was around 60 Hz on my MG-IIIa's and similar. I tried lower on the 20's on it worked for some music, not all, and ultimately set them around 50~60 Hz IIRC. I would set it at 80 Hz for 1.7i's. I'll just say I do not agree with REL's scheme but you could try it both ways.

As for a tube preamp, I have done that, along with a number of different tube and hybrid power amps in addition to SS amps. These days Primaluna and Rogue Audio seem to be highly recommended and they have models in your price range.

That is a fairly small listening space so I am not sure I would go to larger Maggies. What I would do is to treat the wall behind with absorbers or diffusion. You'll lose a bit of "space" in the sound but gain a much better image.

@grigorianvlad : Given the small size of your room and close spacing of the speakers tweeters on the outside makes a lot of sense. I did not realize they were so close; that is one of my "special cases" where outside works better. Bass is typically mixed to mono/center and, especially with Maggie's relative low-order crossovers, having the tweeter and midrange panels out provides a much better stereo image. Chances are the mid/tweeter sections were simply too close leading to collapse of the stereo image and in a small room with not a lot of distance behind the panels the bass was cancelling. Swapping puts the bass panels closer so they act more like a single source (due to the long wavelength of bass signals) and moving the mid/tweeter out provides more of a stereo image.

I am sorry I did not mention that before but I did not realize how close your speakers were to each other. You may find less toe-in works better in that situation; at least, I often found slight to no toe-in worked better, but it very much depends upon your room and MLP relative to the speakers.

FWIWFM - Don
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"After silence, that which best expresses the inexpressible, is music" - Aldous Huxley
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post #6660 of 6663 Old Yesterday, 09:20 PM
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Originally Posted by PRO710HD View Post
That's just it. I don't know what I'm missing if anything but am curious how my system would sound with a tube preamplifier. That's why I was hoping someone had a similar situation with replacing their SS preamp with a tube and could post their opinions/findings
I would look into the LTA MicroZotl MZ2. Under your budget and I think you'll like it. I don't think it has that "tubey" warm euphonic sound. Almost solid state like but with more air and transparency.

I'm saving up for the MZ3. I'm currently using a Placette passive and it's been difficult to be kicked out. I do use a tube dac which is probably why I really don't have an urge to replace. The Placette is very transparent and neutral so it passes what ever my dac sends.

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