The Official Magnepan Owners Thread - Page 228 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #6811 of 6993 Old 09-05-2019, 05:09 PM
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Ordered this SS power amp, used. Lets see if a Hypex class-D amplifier circuit from the Netherlands outputting [email protected] will open up the 3.5R Magnepans.
I listed the Maggies for sale a while ago. But I am very much afraid to have sold them without giving them a fair chance. That's why the Wyred4Sound power amp. If it will make the speakers sing I will keep them. Possibly along with the amp. Just create a Maggies listening room next to this one, move one of the three subs there. Will see.
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Site. DAC: Mytek Brooklyn DAC+ || Processor: Marantz AV8801 11.2 Ch || Power Amp: Audio Research Reference 75 (75W tube) || Speakers: Magnepan 3.5R/Polk LSiM707 || Sub 1: REL 212/SE (1,000W). Sub 2: REL S/3 (400W). Sub 3: Sunfire TS-EQ12 (2,700W). || Cables: Cardas Clear, MIT Matrix & T || Power: PS Audio P5 || Headphones: HifiMan HE560 || Turntable: Pro-Ject RPM5 Carbon w SoundSmith Zephyr MKIII
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post #6812 of 6993 Old 09-05-2019, 05:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stustan View Post
I don't know if they integrated the subs yet ...... the speakers arrived only a few days ago. I will find out as much as I can about the setup. The room is "tuned" and calibrated by Dolby Labs before each project begins ...... that much I know.
"...The room is "tuned" and calibrated by Dolby Labs before each project begins...".
Now that's getting real interesting, keep it coming
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post #6813 of 6993 Old 09-05-2019, 06:45 PM
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I will be back at the studio this Monday ...... they have been mixing in 12 hour shifts on some huge project. I will try to get some more technical info but I am sure I won't get my "ears on the Maggies" until they finish the show. They know I'm dying to hear them and they do want me to play with the speaker / listening locations.
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Magnepan 1.7's (LR), Magnepan CC5/DWM (Center Channel), Magnepan MC1's (Surrounds), Rythmik F12 (Sub), Emotiva XMC-1 (Processor), Emotiva XPA-2 Gen2 Drives the 1.7's, Emotiva XPA-5 Drives the Center and Surrounds, Oppo BDP-103 (Audio/Video Source), Oppo UDP-203 (Audio/Video Source), Apple TV 4K (Audio/Video Source), Sony PS4 (Audio/Video Source), LG OLED65B6P (Monitor)
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post #6814 of 6993 Old 09-06-2019, 06:44 AM
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Well, all is now wonderful in the House of Chuck.

When last I posted it appeared that I might have a pair of dud LRS speakers. Was playing music at a loud – but certainly not unreasonable – volume (set between 1 and 2 pm if the dial is a clock) when both speakers suddenly dropped in loudness and sounded like they were smothered by a thick blanket. Most depressing.

Then came Labor Day etc, and to be honest I was pessimistic at this problem having an easy solution

Yesterday I finally found time to play troubleshooter, cut off some iffy parts of my ancient speaker cable, and made sure ONLY the LRS were connected to the Parasound 2250. When I swapped out the fuses (an extra two come in a bag), voila I am in heaven again and this time for more than 5 minutes. Spent a good 90 minutes with Santana, Springsteen, Billy Joel, and Nirvana’s Nevermind.

Still kinda nervous at having that volume go past 1 o’clock given what happened last week.

Now I need to get better speaker cable in a color scheme that might best blend in with a orangish clay colored hard floor. I don’t wanna go uber expensive but not cheap out either. Probably 25 feet each. Thoughts?
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post #6815 of 6993 Old 09-06-2019, 06:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles Mooney View Post
Well, all is now wonderful in the House of Chuck.
Glad you resolved it, Chuck!
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Site. DAC: Mytek Brooklyn DAC+ || Processor: Marantz AV8801 11.2 Ch || Power Amp: Audio Research Reference 75 (75W tube) || Speakers: Magnepan 3.5R/Polk LSiM707 || Sub 1: REL 212/SE (1,000W). Sub 2: REL S/3 (400W). Sub 3: Sunfire TS-EQ12 (2,700W). || Cables: Cardas Clear, MIT Matrix & T || Power: PS Audio P5 || Headphones: HifiMan HE560 || Turntable: Pro-Ject RPM5 Carbon w SoundSmith Zephyr MKIII
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post #6816 of 6993 Old 09-06-2019, 08:08 AM
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Well, at RMAF and Magnepan isn’t on the list...
I guess I won’t hear them here. :-/
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post #6817 of 6993 Old 09-06-2019, 08:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles Mooney View Post
Well, all is now wonderful in the House of Chuck.

When last I posted it appeared that I might have a pair of dud LRS speakers. Was playing music at a loud – but certainly not unreasonable – volume (set between 1 and 2 pm if the dial is a clock) when both speakers suddenly dropped in loudness and sounded like they were smothered by a thick blanket. Most depressing.

Then came Labor Day etc, and to be honest I was pessimistic at this problem having an easy solution

Yesterday I finally found time to play troubleshooter, cut off some iffy parts of my ancient speaker cable, and made sure ONLY the LRS were connected to the Parasound 2250. When I swapped out the fuses (an extra two come in a bag), voila I am in heaven again and this time for more than 5 minutes. Spent a good 90 minutes with Santana, Springsteen, Billy Joel, and Nirvana’s Nevermind.

Still kinda nervous at having that volume go past 1 o’clock given what happened last week.

Now I need to get better speaker cable in a color scheme that might best blend in with a orangish clay colored hard floor. I don’t wanna go uber expensive but not cheap out either. Probably 25 feet each. Thoughts?
I'll mail you my bill. Better get extra fuses now for future episodes of exuberance. It happens.

For speaker cable Maggies really are not exotic so the only real requirement (for any speaker) is large enough to do the job. You can read more at http://www.roger-russell.com/wire/wire.htm or go here for a table: http://www.roger-russell.com/wire/wire.htm#wiretable

Personally I'd get some nice Blue Jeans 10 AWG cables -- nice (welded) connectors attached to good wire. https://www.bluejeanscable.com/store/speaker/index.htm Done.

FWIWFM - Don
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post #6818 of 6993 Old 09-06-2019, 08:49 AM
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I have 10 awg 16ft each cables and they long enough in my setup

Power: Marantz sr7008, NAD C 275Bee x 2, Video: Oppo 103, Samsung 75un6300
Speakers: Focal aria 948, Focal cc900, Klipsch synergy KSF 10.5, Magnepan LRS
Subs: Rythmik FV25HP, Rythmik FV15HP
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post #6819 of 6993 Old 09-06-2019, 09:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DonH50 View Post
I'll mail you my bill. Better get extra fuses now for future episodes of exuberance. It happens.

For speaker cable Maggies really are not exotic so the only real requirement (for any speaker) is large enough to do the job. You can read more at http://www.roger-russell.com/wire/wire.htm or go here for a table: http://www.roger-russell.com/wire/wire.htm#wiretable

Personally I'd get some nice Blue Jeans 10 AWG cables -- nice (welded) connectors attached to good wire. https://www.bluejeanscable.com/store/speaker/index.htm Done.

FWIWFM - Don
..will banana plugs WORK in that lil hole on the back of the Maggies or will I need to remove ?
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post #6820 of 6993 Old 09-06-2019, 09:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles Mooney View Post
Well, all is now wonderful in the House of Chuck.

When last I posted it appeared that I might have a pair of dud LRS speakers. Was playing music at a loud – but certainly not unreasonable – volume (set between 1 and 2 pm if the dial is a clock) when both speakers suddenly dropped in loudness and sounded like they were smothered by a thick blanket. Most depressing.

Then came Labor Day etc, and to be honest I was pessimistic at this problem having an easy solution

Yesterday I finally found time to play troubleshooter, cut off some iffy parts of my ancient speaker cable, and made sure ONLY the LRS were connected to the Parasound 2250. When I swapped out the fuses (an extra two come in a bag), voila I am in heaven again and this time for more than 5 minutes. Spent a good 90 minutes with Santana, Springsteen, Billy Joel, and Nirvana’s Nevermind.

Still kinda nervous at having that volume go past 1 o’clock given what happened last week.

Now I need to get better speaker cable in a color scheme that might best blend in with a orangish clay colored hard floor. I don’t wanna go uber expensive but not cheap out either. Probably 25 feet each. Thoughts?
Glad you got it solved

Last edited by sgibson; 09-06-2019 at 09:44 AM.
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post #6821 of 6993 Old 09-06-2019, 10:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles Mooney View Post
..will banana plugs WORK in that lil hole on the back of the Maggies or will I need to remove ?
They always have in the past, though I tend to use bare or tinned wire or pin connectors. With banana plugs I would plug them in and screw them tight anyway in case someone (not me, never, of course ) tripped over a cable.

Blue Jeans welds their connectors instead of soldering or screwing the wire to them. A better connection but you'd have to cut off the connectors if you don't want them. Or order without. You can get the cable (wire) itself elsewhere for less money; the BJ advantage is their premium connection service IMO.

You might want to just try a banana plug in one to see, or call Magnepan to double-check, but I'd be surprised if they did not. I have been surprised before, however...
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Last edited by DonH50; 09-06-2019 at 09:21 PM.
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post #6822 of 6993 Old 09-06-2019, 01:08 PM
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Talking bout bad timing. As soon as I bought that Wyred4Sound SS power amp to push the Maggies a little bit, to open them up, and then this beauty shows up. Just listed. A REL 212/SE sub. A grand below MSRP. These rarely show up on the used market, may be once a year. If you are looking for a sub vendor perfectly capable to accompany a pair of Magnepans REL is it.
It will be outrageous if the power amp will not be any help with the Maggies and these RELs (there are two of them) will be sold as well.
An hour gone, one sub is sold already, one left.
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Site. DAC: Mytek Brooklyn DAC+ || Processor: Marantz AV8801 11.2 Ch || Power Amp: Audio Research Reference 75 (75W tube) || Speakers: Magnepan 3.5R/Polk LSiM707 || Sub 1: REL 212/SE (1,000W). Sub 2: REL S/3 (400W). Sub 3: Sunfire TS-EQ12 (2,700W). || Cables: Cardas Clear, MIT Matrix & T || Power: PS Audio P5 || Headphones: HifiMan HE560 || Turntable: Pro-Ject RPM5 Carbon w SoundSmith Zephyr MKIII

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post #6823 of 6993 Old 09-06-2019, 03:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by laserjock II View Post
Well, at RMAF and Magnepan isn’t on the list...
I guess I won’t hear them here. :-/
wonder if any of the electronic vendors have maggies in their demo rooms. maggies have really great sound if have them setup right.

Power: Marantz sr7008, NAD C 275Bee x 2, Video: Oppo 103, Samsung 75un6300
Speakers: Focal aria 948, Focal cc900, Klipsch synergy KSF 10.5, Magnepan LRS
Subs: Rythmik FV25HP, Rythmik FV15HP
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post #6824 of 6993 Old 09-06-2019, 04:10 PM
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Originally Posted by laserjock II View Post
Well, at RMAF and Magnepan isn’t on the list...
I guess I won’t hear them here. :-/
Why dont you swing by my place? RMAF is about as far away from you as me. My better half will spend a week in Spain closer to the end of the month.
There is plenty of free bedrooms here, a pair of Maggies at your disposal, a couple of power amps too. Blast them as loud as you want. Unlimited beer and grilling guaranteed. I have a Broil King Regal S590 grill that will leave your Camado (you still have that?) in the dust.
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Site. DAC: Mytek Brooklyn DAC+ || Processor: Marantz AV8801 11.2 Ch || Power Amp: Audio Research Reference 75 (75W tube) || Speakers: Magnepan 3.5R/Polk LSiM707 || Sub 1: REL 212/SE (1,000W). Sub 2: REL S/3 (400W). Sub 3: Sunfire TS-EQ12 (2,700W). || Cables: Cardas Clear, MIT Matrix & T || Power: PS Audio P5 || Headphones: HifiMan HE560 || Turntable: Pro-Ject RPM5 Carbon w SoundSmith Zephyr MKIII
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post #6825 of 6993 Old 09-06-2019, 05:30 PM
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Originally Posted by laserjock II View Post
Well, at RMAF and Magnepan isn’t on the list...
I guess I won’t hear them here. :-/
Unless Wendell has some secret room that's not part of the official show.
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post #6826 of 6993 Old 09-06-2019, 06:02 PM
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Wink

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scotth3886 View Post
Unless Wendell has some secret room that's not part of the official show.
Hi Scotth3886,

I thought I saw mention of Wendell touring the whole country to sell more Magnepans.
Makes me think of..."where's Waldo"? Could it be Wendell heard of grigorianvlads open invite to his "Grill n' Audio" show and is headed there?
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post #6827 of 6993 Old 09-06-2019, 06:18 PM
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Originally Posted by sgibson View Post
Hi Scotth3886,

I thought I saw mention of Wendell touring the whole country to sell more Magnepans.
Makes me think of..."where's Waldo"? Could it be Wendell heard of grigorianvlads open invite to his "Grill n' Audio" show and is headed there?
That was with the 30.7s, but I believe its all over now after he's visited 62 dealers.
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post #6828 of 6993 Old 09-06-2019, 08:53 PM
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Originally Posted by grigorianvlad View Post
Why dont you swing by my place? RMAF is about as far away from you as me. My better half will spend a week in Spain closer to the end of the month.
There is plenty of free bedrooms here, a pair of Maggies at your disposal, a couple of power amps too. Blast them as loud as you want. Unlimited beer and grilling guaranteed. I have a Broil King Regal S590 grill that will leave your Camado (you still have that?) in the dust.
Sounds like a challenge!

Speaking of Spain, I heard the AlsyVox Botticelli

Nice sound. Not sure of the price.
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post #6829 of 6993 Old 09-07-2019, 05:43 AM
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Originally Posted by laserjock II View Post
Sounds like a challenge!

Speaking of Spain, I heard the AlsyVox Botticelli

Nice sound. Not sure of the price.
You lucky bastard. The price is around $87k I think. I have no idea how they compare to Maggies sound wise, but those look like a million bucks, don;t they?
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Site. DAC: Mytek Brooklyn DAC+ || Processor: Marantz AV8801 11.2 Ch || Power Amp: Audio Research Reference 75 (75W tube) || Speakers: Magnepan 3.5R/Polk LSiM707 || Sub 1: REL 212/SE (1,000W). Sub 2: REL S/3 (400W). Sub 3: Sunfire TS-EQ12 (2,700W). || Cables: Cardas Clear, MIT Matrix & T || Power: PS Audio P5 || Headphones: HifiMan HE560 || Turntable: Pro-Ject RPM5 Carbon w SoundSmith Zephyr MKIII
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post #6830 of 6993 Old 09-10-2019, 12:24 PM
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Got the Wyred4Sound 460W power amp. Disconnected the sensitive Polks, lined them up parallel to the wall.
Put the Maggies in front of them and connected to the power amp. This amp is 6 times as powerful as the tube ARC I have. But the ARC is exactly 6 times as expensive as the W4S.
Lets see if it will open up the 3.5R's.
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Site. DAC: Mytek Brooklyn DAC+ || Processor: Marantz AV8801 11.2 Ch || Power Amp: Audio Research Reference 75 (75W tube) || Speakers: Magnepan 3.5R/Polk LSiM707 || Sub 1: REL 212/SE (1,000W). Sub 2: REL S/3 (400W). Sub 3: Sunfire TS-EQ12 (2,700W). || Cables: Cardas Clear, MIT Matrix & T || Power: PS Audio P5 || Headphones: HifiMan HE560 || Turntable: Pro-Ject RPM5 Carbon w SoundSmith Zephyr MKIII
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post #6831 of 6993 Old 09-10-2019, 06:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grigorianvlad View Post
Got the Wyred4Sound 460W power amp. Disconnected the sensitive Polks, lined them up parallel to the wall.
Put the Maggies in front of them and connected to the power amp. This amp is 6 times as powerful as the tube ARC I have. But the ARC is exactly 6 times as expensive as the W4S.
Lets see if it will open up the 3.5R's.
uumm....yummy!
YouTube Video in 1080P(or 4K) and 44.1K audio...please
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post #6832 of 6993 Old 09-10-2019, 06:42 PM
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Originally Posted by sgibson View Post
uumm....yummy!
YouTube Video in 1080P(or 4K) and 44.1K audio...please
Unfortunately, the W4S power amp made a little difference.
1) It was 7dB louder than the ARC.
2) It improved the dynamics by approx (hard to quantify this accurately) 10%
3) The Maggies created more bass, just a bit. But it was still not enough to justify keeping neither the W4S, nor the Maggies.
Once that decision was made, I requested a return of the amp. I will absorb the shipping fee both ways, which is not much, below a hundred.
Then more interesting stuff began. I decided to test both amps with the more resolving Polks, instead of the muddy Maggies that would only have shown a difference in volume and nothing else. It was an interesting exercise. Solid state vs tube. W4S vs ARC. $2K amp vs $12K amp. 480W vs 75W. Which will sound better?
Recorded both in this YT video. It is in 4K, but the YT sound is just 320kbps. Still, should be good enough to hear a difference through good speakers or headphones.

Quote:
This is a combined clip of two power amps, each around 1:15 long.
1) The first is a Wyred4Sound ST1000 MKII, a $2,000 solid state power amp rated [email protected] It is the black unit on top of the rack.
2) The second is an Audio Research Reference 75 tube amplifier, only 75W. It is directly below, second from the top, with the VU analog meters.
The first is six times as powerful, the second is six times as expensive. Lets see if you can hear a difference, if at all possible in a YT compressed audio track. Volume leveled for the difference between the amps, as the more powerful amp was 7dB louder.
The audio track is Froncois-Joseph Gossec's "(Le) Triomphe de la République", Allegro Molto, Radio Svizzera + Diego Fasolis. @2006 Chandos Records LTD.
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post #6833 of 6993 Old 09-10-2019, 06:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grigorianvlad View Post
Unfortunately, the W4S power amp made a little difference.
1) It was 7dB louder than the ARC.
2) It improved the dynamics by approx (hard to quantify this accurately) 10%
3) The Maggies created more bass, just a bit. But it was still not enough to justify keeping neither the W4S, nor the Maggies.
Once that decision was made, I requested a return of the amp. I will absorb the shipping fee both ways, which is not much, below a hundred.
Then more interesting stuff began. I decided to test both amps with the more resolving Polks, instead of the muddy Maggies that would only have shown a difference in volume and nothing else. It was an interesting exercise. Solid state vs tube. W4S vs ARC. $2K amp vs $12K amp. 480W vs 75W. Which will sound better?
Recorded both in this YT video. It is in 4K, but the YT sound is just 320kbps. Still, should be good enough to hear a difference through good speakers or headphones.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6PYVAbQT2aY
Grigorianvlad...Thanks!....great video and audio. Enjoyed it...those polks sound great!

The Eyes have it for looks and my Ears say Yay for the Tubes
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post #6834 of 6993 Old 09-10-2019, 09:53 PM
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Really difficult to judge with the YT video. I didn't read the description so I was unsure which was which when watching.

I liked the 1st one which I later learned was the W4S. Through my phone it sounded like it had better pace, rhythm and timing. More Dynamics. The 2nd one sounds flat or slower at certain parts.

Too bad the W4S didn't help improve the 3.5's. i thought for sure what I heard in your clip is what would happen with the 3.5's.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
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post #6835 of 6993 Old 09-10-2019, 11:20 PM
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you can hear difference on youtube vid between amps, but I dont feel either sound good. I looked up a bunch of tacks on tidal and couldnt find exact version as I was wanting to hear on my speakers instead of my headphone systems. lets just say I cant get tidal like sound from youtube vid on any system I have.

on headphones the 1st part of youtube sounded honky.
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post #6836 of 6993 Old 09-10-2019, 11:51 PM
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omg, after listening to youtube vid I decided to pull out my maggies. spent 30 minutes track after track and going thru avr settings wondering what the hell happened to my imaging....duh...one of the speakers was out of phase, holy crap that screw **** up. black wire in red and red into black....Im losing it.

back to normal now, yup, lrs still rock.

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post #6837 of 6993 Old 09-11-2019, 05:41 AM
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Let me tell you what I heard and what perhaps was left out of the video due to audio compression and/or lack of personal bias.
The W4S maintained firm grip of the speakers, especially in the bass area. That is to be expected if you compare their damping factor ratings (which is precisely how the amp is capable of controlling bass, the higher the better):
ARC damping factor (100Hz 8Ω): 8
W4S damping factor(100Hz 8Ω): 4,000!
But somehow that W4S bass felt unpleasant, however prodigious it was. It was like a rubber tire hitting you in the face. Similar with midrange, except the SS power amp managed to swallow or skip every fourth note, especially if it was low dB content.
Then there comes treble. There was not any above 16hZ. I mean there was , but it was not airy, it didnt work for the lower frequencies making them more 3D. It was just .. well ... treble, something high frequencies the tweeters produced that had almost nothing to do with the music.
The fact that I disconnected the W4S only after 15 minutes of listening tells a lot. There were a couple of exercises to conduct, namely:
1) Run Audyssey for the W4S and see if the processor makes the sound more pleasant and compare the both amps output graphs. BTW, attaching two graphs I created before, the Polks vs the Maggies, with the same ARC. Very revealing!
3) Try the W4S as a lower end biamping amp. What I mean is my processor has both RCA and XLR outputs. XLR out go to the ARC (it doesnt even have RCA in!) and RCA out goes to the W4S. The ARC will be powering the mids/highs of the 3.5R's, the W4S - the lower end.
Not sure if it is worth doing.
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post #6838 of 6993 Old 09-11-2019, 06:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grigorianvlad View Post
Let me tell you what I heard and what perhaps was left out of the video due to audio compression and/or lack of personal bias.
The W4S maintained firm grip of the speakers, especially in the bass area. That is to be expected if you compare their damping factor ratings (which is precisely how the amp is capable of controlling bass, the higher the better):
ARC damping factor (100Hz 8Ω): 8
W4S damping factor(100Hz 8Ω): 4,000!
But somehow that W4S bass felt unpleasant, however prodigious it was. It was like a rubber tire hitting you in the face. Similar with midrange, except the SS power amp managed to swallow or skip every fourth note, especially if it was low dB content.
Then there comes treble. There was not any above 16hZ. I mean there was , but it was not airy, it didnt work for the lower frequencies making them more 3D. It was just .. well ... treble, something high frequencies the tweeters produced that had almost nothing to do with the music.
The fact that I disconnected the W4S only after 15 minutes of listening tells a lot. There were a couple of exercises to conduct, namely:
1) Run Audyssey for the W4S and see if the processor makes the sound more pleasant and compare the both amps output graphs. BTW, attaching two graphs I created before, the Polks vs the Maggies, with the same ARC. Very revealing!
3) Try the W4S as a lower end biamping amp. What I mean is my processor has both RCA and XLR outputs. XLR out go to the ARC (it doesnt even have RCA in!) and RCA out goes to the W4S. The ARC will be powering the mids/highs of the 3.5R's, the W4S - the lower end.
Not sure if it is worth doing.
You know you gotta try...or as Yoda said..."Try not. Do. Or do not. There is no try."
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post #6839 of 6993 Old 09-12-2019, 08:35 PM
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when not jamming to lrs...Im in my office deciding on 10 different pair of headphones, tube or digital amp, audioengine speaks w/velodyne sub....which screens to watch not counting hdtv on wall.....and even what chair to sit in...got some nice powered recliners behind me. tell ya what...I love it when my audiophile padded door is sealed and shut. pardon my mess...Im ocd to be not clean.

should of turned on tubes to see them glow
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Last edited by torii; 09-12-2019 at 08:41 PM.
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post #6840 of 6993 Old 09-13-2019, 08:28 AM
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I wonder who this guy is and how much does he charge to remake Magnepans like they were designed by Sonus Faber. Positively gorgeous.
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