Official JTR speaker thread - Page 1320 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #39571 of 39610 Old 11-24-2019, 08:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raynist View Post
Would you not be using subs?



If your amp has DSP that would work, or add a MiniDSP between the avr and your amp.



You could add a MiniDSP nanonavr and contour the signal before it gets to the avr.



The nx4 would work, but they can take much much more that they can provide.
I don't think my current subs can keep up with the 215rt's, which are 2 Reaction Audio BPS-215's. It looks like I might go with a Lab Gruppen clone (Bortec Lab) with dsp. Plans might change, but the Bortecs, if reliable and if it does rated power should be plenty.

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post #39572 of 39610 Old 11-24-2019, 08:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thisgsx View Post
I don't think my current subs can keep up with the 215rt's, which are 2 Reaction Audio BPS-215's. It looks like I might go with a Lab Gruppen clone (Bortec Lab) with dsp. Plans might change, but the Bortecs, if reliable and if it does rated power should be plenty.

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You may not need subs with the 215’s. If you have the ability to tweak the bass they are as capable as most any sub available.

Look into and amp with DSP. Maybe an NX6000DSP and one NX3000DSP.
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post #39573 of 39610 Old 11-25-2019, 10:26 AM
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I realize many use the 215 RT full range for music. If used with stand alone subs does that increase effective sensitivity? Crossed at 60 for home theater theoretically would increase efficiency right?
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post #39574 of 39610 Old 11-26-2019, 10:40 AM
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For those classical music fans out there:

My Noesis 212HTs and Captivator 4000ULF playing the last 1:30 of Tchaikovsky's 1812 Overture, Op. 49 by Erich Kunzel, The Cincinnati Pops Orchestra, TELARC edition. Yes, the one with cannon shots at around 0:30!


My original audio recording in wav:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Bvz...5Fo71B_Lm/view
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Speakers: L/C/R: JTR Noesis 212HT. Surrounds: Jamo C103, KEF Q100, Polk Audio RTiA3.
Subwoofer: JTR Captivator 4000ULF.
AVR: Denon AVR-X4400H. TV: Samsung UN75NU8000FXZA.

FS: Jamo C103, KEF Q100 and Polk RTiA3

Last edited by chucky7; 11-26-2019 at 10:54 AM.
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post #39575 of 39610 Old 11-26-2019, 02:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chucky7 View Post
For those classical music fans out there:

My Noesis 212HTs and Captivator 4000ULF playing the last 1:30 of Tchaikovsky's 1812 Overture, Op. 49 by Erich Kunzel, The Cincinnati Pops Orchestra, TELARC edition. Yes, the one with cannon shots at around 0:30!

https://youtu.be/WKMlX5LwJSA

My original audio recording in wav:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Bvz...5Fo71B_Lm/view
Still available new at Amazon. The 3rd track, while not specifically a bass monster, is a full range monster, and will stress your system the last several minutes if you listen like I do. Not Chucky's system, but a more mundane one like mine. I need a pair of 20 amp lines.
The whole SACD is top notch, btw, and is a good intro to Classical at its best.
https://www.amazon.com/Tchaikovsky-O...53331378&psc=1
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Last edited by drh3b; 11-26-2019 at 07:09 PM.
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post #39576 of 39610 Old 11-26-2019, 05:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chucky7 View Post
For those classical music fans out there:

My Noesis 212HTs and Captivator 4000ULF playing the last 1:30 of Tchaikovsky's 1812 Overture, Op. 49 by Erich Kunzel, The Cincinnati Pops Orchestra, TELARC edition. Yes, the one with cannon shots at around 0:30!

https://youtu.be/WKMlX5LwJSA

My original audio recording in wav:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Bvz...5Fo71B_Lm/view
Nice. I felt the port wind from my Klipsch promedia 2.1 computer sub.
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post #39577 of 39610 Old 11-28-2019, 01:15 PM
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hey JTR owners - if any of you are looking to sell single 8ht’s shoot me a pm.

Selling in AVS classifieds
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post #39578 of 39610 Old 11-28-2019, 09:34 PM
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So I was told that the 1979 version had better dynamics:

Tchaikovsky's 1812 Overture - Erich Kunzel, The Cincinnati Pops Orchestra, Op. 49, TELARC 1979 vs. 1999 version:
0:00 1979 version.
1:04 1999 version.

The 1979 version is indeed louder and more dynamic.

My original audio recording in wav:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1NwK...MW4Kzw0MRRzniU

Speakers: L/C/R: JTR Noesis 212HT. Surrounds: Jamo C103, KEF Q100, Polk Audio RTiA3.
Subwoofer: JTR Captivator 4000ULF.
AVR: Denon AVR-X4400H. TV: Samsung UN75NU8000FXZA.

FS: Jamo C103, KEF Q100 and Polk RTiA3
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post #39579 of 39610 Old 11-29-2019, 09:55 AM
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Just a reminder, the introductory sale is ending soon on Nov 30th.

15% off for the 2020 210HT and 228HT:

2020 Noesis 210HT $1599 each @ 15% off = $1359 ea + shipping.
2020 Noesis 228HT $1299 each @ 15% off = $1104 ea + shipping.

Speakers: L/C/R: JTR Noesis 212HT. Surrounds: Jamo C103, KEF Q100, Polk Audio RTiA3.
Subwoofer: JTR Captivator 4000ULF.
AVR: Denon AVR-X4400H. TV: Samsung UN75NU8000FXZA.

FS: Jamo C103, KEF Q100 and Polk RTiA3
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post #39580 of 39610 Old 11-29-2019, 04:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chucky7 View Post
Just a reminder, the introductory sale is ending soon on Nov 30th.

15% off for the 2020 210HT and 228HT:

2020 Noesis 210HT $1599 each @ 15% off = $1359 ea + shipping.
2020 Noesis 228HT $1299 each @ 15% off = $1104 ea + shipping.
Do you know if there are going to be any revisions for the 215rt's and rm? Going to be pulling the trigger around Christmas.

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post #39581 of 39610 Old 11-30-2019, 10:55 AM
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Originally Posted by thisgsx View Post
Do you know if there are going to be any revisions for the 215rt's and rm? Going to be pulling the trigger around Christmas.
I just asked Jeff. There is no revisions planned for the 215RT and RM.

Speakers: L/C/R: JTR Noesis 212HT. Surrounds: Jamo C103, KEF Q100, Polk Audio RTiA3.
Subwoofer: JTR Captivator 4000ULF.
AVR: Denon AVR-X4400H. TV: Samsung UN75NU8000FXZA.

FS: Jamo C103, KEF Q100 and Polk RTiA3
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post #39582 of 39610 Old 11-30-2019, 11:01 AM
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Thanks for asking for me. I guess the next step is to place the order when I'm ready.

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post #39583 of 39610 Old 11-30-2019, 02:46 PM
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Question for those that may have heard both the 212 RT and 215 RT. Would larger horn of the 215 tower provide a larger image than the 212?

Also I would only be providing 800 watts at 4 ohm with a Sunfire Amp. I realize many use the 215 RT full range for music. If used with stand alone subs does that increase effective sensitivity? Most of my playback material would be crossed over to subs at 60 hz or so. This would theoretically increase the efficiency right?

Getting very close to pulling the trigger on replacing my front Definitive BP7000SC setup.
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post #39584 of 39610 Old 11-30-2019, 05:35 PM
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Originally Posted by madhuski View Post
hey JTR owners - if any of you are looking to sell single 8ht’s shoot me a pm.
Hey man, you looked at these?

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/209-a...ml#post5889284

Subwoofers: Dual Rythmik FV18s Rev2 with Paper cone, BOSS Platform mini riser, 2 BK LFE
Speakers: PSA MTM-210 L/C/R - Klipsch 250S Surrounds, PSA MT 110sr Rear Surrounds, 4 x SVS Prime Elevation for Atmos
Video: Epson PowerLite Home Cinema 6500 UB; Room: 2100 cuft sealed on suspended floor
Receiver & Players: Denon X4400H, Oppo UDP-203, Roku Ultra. Apple TV, Minidsp 2X4 HD
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post #39585 of 39610 Old 11-30-2019, 05:50 PM
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Originally Posted by imureh View Post


Thanks for the heads up- I’m looking for the non-slanted version, and also looking for a used set to cut down $$$$

Selling in AVS classifieds
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post #39586 of 39610 Old 11-30-2019, 11:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yosh7 View Post
Question for those that may have heard both the 212 RT and 215 RT. Would larger horn of the 215 tower provide a larger image than the 212?
I just asked Jeff regarding the reference speakers of different woofers. Relative to the 212RT, the 215RT would have larger horn and thus better mid range, because the coaxial tweeter/mid range is horn loaded.

Quote:
Originally Posted by yosh7 View Post
Also I would only be providing 800 watts at 4 ohm with a Sunfire Amp. I realize many use the 215 RT full range for music. If used with stand alone subs does that increase effective sensitivity? Most of my playback material would be crossed over to subs at 60 hz or so. This would theoretically increase the efficiency right?

Getting very close to pulling the trigger on replacing my front Definitive BP7000SC setup.
Please correct me if I am wrong.

My understanding is, technically, you can't increase sensitivity by using subs, as sensitivity is measured at 1KHz or 300~3000Hz. You can, however, make the speakers more efficient (as in using less power to arrive at the same spl) by using stand alone subs.

Speakers: L/C/R: JTR Noesis 212HT. Surrounds: Jamo C103, KEF Q100, Polk Audio RTiA3.
Subwoofer: JTR Captivator 4000ULF.
AVR: Denon AVR-X4400H. TV: Samsung UN75NU8000FXZA.

FS: Jamo C103, KEF Q100 and Polk RTiA3
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post #39587 of 39610 Old 12-01-2019, 06:45 AM
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Originally Posted by chucky7 View Post
I just asked Jeff regarding the reference speakers of different woofers. Relative to the 212RT, the 215RT would have larger horn and thus better mid range, because the coaxial tweeter/mid range is horn loaded.


Please correct me if I am wrong.

My understanding is, technically, you can't increase sensitivity by using subs, as sensitivity is measured at 1KHz or 300~3000Hz. You can, however, make the speakers more efficient (as in using less power to arrive at the same spl) by using stand alone subs.
@chucky7 , appreciate your expertise. Thanks to your explanation I think the amp I have will be fine since I will be crossing over to subs for most applications. This is a tough choice. The 212RT's would look and fit better in the room but I THINK the 215's will work (and sound quality is king). The extra width of the 215's is what is giving me pause as it MAY block the screen for two of my 5 seats (although it is usually just me in the center seat).

Right now I am leaning towards trying the 215 RT's. If they are too wide for the front channels I can eventually move them to surround back channels and get 212 RT's for front L/R .

Currently have a 9.4.4 setup with Definitive BP7000 series speakers for all 9 channels and 4 atmos channels. And 4 24" DSS subs. Planning to replace the front 3 with JTR and leave the Definitives in place for surround duty. Will probably replace the rest of the speakers over time.
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post #39588 of 39610 Old 12-01-2019, 08:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yosh7 View Post
@chucky7 , appreciate your expertise. Thanks to your explanation I think the amp I have will be fine since I will be crossing over to subs for most applications. This is a tough choice. The 212RT's would look and fit better in the room but I THINK the 215's will work (and sound quality is king). The extra width of the 215's is what is giving me pause as it MAY block the screen for two of my 5 seats (although it is usually just me in the center seat).

Right now I am leaning towards trying the 215 RT's. If they are too wide for the front channels I can eventually move them to surround back channels and get 212 RT's for front L/R .

Currently have a 9.4.4 setup with Definitive BP7000 series speakers for all 9 channels and 4 atmos channels. And 4 24" DSS subs. Planning to replace the front 3 with JTR and leave the Definitives in place for surround duty. Will probably replace the rest of the speakers over time.
Short of actually having the 215RTs in your room, you could build mockup boxes the same size as the 215s to be sure. Since the 215RT is 7" wider and 6" deeper than the Def BP7000, alternatively you can build 2 17" W x 22.5" templates (the footprint of a 215RT) and put your current mains on top at the inner front corners.

Your Def BP7000s are bipolar ones that require clearance around them to have the proper sound. Therefore, you probably already have the space for the 215RTs.

The 215RTs are the bee's knees!

Speakers: L/C/R: JTR Noesis 212HT. Surrounds: Jamo C103, KEF Q100, Polk Audio RTiA3.
Subwoofer: JTR Captivator 4000ULF.
AVR: Denon AVR-X4400H. TV: Samsung UN75NU8000FXZA.

FS: Jamo C103, KEF Q100 and Polk RTiA3
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post #39589 of 39610 Old 12-01-2019, 05:23 PM
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@chucky7 great suggestion on the template. The 215 rt will certainly take up lots of real estate but not as much as I thought. When it’s just me (most of the time) I can toe them in. When I have all seats taken I will have to straighten them out so screen is viewable from all seating positions. A minor annoyance. May give em a try as fronts.
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post #39590 of 39610 Old 12-01-2019, 08:17 PM
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If you are not going to use the 215rt full range then wouldn’t the 215rm be a better choice? Or the 212htr if you want better sensitivity. Crossing over the 215rt at 60hz seems like a waste of space when smaller options can hit 60hz just as well. Unless you just like big speakers.
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post #39591 of 39610 Old 12-01-2019, 09:50 PM
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If you are not going to use the 215rt full range then wouldn’t the 215rm be a better choice? Or the 212htr if you want better sensitivity. Crossing over the 215rt at 60hz seems like a waste of space when smaller options can hit 60hz just as well. Unless you just like big speakers.
You are spot on. Trust me, would love to get an AT screen but others in the family already complain the screen is too close and big. I will attach a picture of the room. Screen is 133" diagonal for scale. (I refuse to get a smaller screen - I am down there solo 95% of the time). That is a basement and solid concrete behind that pine. The cabinetry was built like that because the entire right side (L shape from the side of the processor to the right surround) is a giant concrete footer. I just had something built to make everything symmetrical and went from there. The previous owner had the room as a workshop. Again, always compromises.

Given my screen is a bit high already, I think I would prefer trying a taller speaker anyway. From what I can tell the JTR 215 horn center would be around 48" off the ground. I estimated the 212 RT horn center would be at 38". My Definitive tweeter is at around 43". So I could go slightly lower or slightly higher. Higher it is. But I may call tomorrow and get different advice from Jeff.

If I am completely crazy/wrong I can always move the 215 towers to surround back L/R and get 212 towers for front L/R. Would like to switch everything out to JTR eventually anyway and would want to keep the same "htr horn" for as may speaker positions as possible. Sides will probably warrant the 110 for better dispersion. Maybe eventually 210 RM's for wides. People think I am crazy for having towers for rear speakers but they sure come in handy for gaming. Shocking how much source material comes from back there during a game of Uncharted, Rainbow Six or COD.

I would say I have a 9.4.4 system. Installed 4 height channels in addition to having wides. (ATMOS doesn't use them enough). And four 24" subs. I think the pic is a bit dated and doesn't reflect my height channels and upgraded processor, etc.

Yes it is overkill. But why not? Every time I tell my wife I am thinking about "upgrading" the basement she just cringes. But we can always make our sound or picture better - right? I probably won't ever be completely satisfied. Like an old car to work on in the garage. Always something to tinker with and improve.
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post #39592 of 39610 Old 12-02-2019, 12:46 PM
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Just got off the phone with Jeff. Officially a member of the JTR owners club. Ordered a pair of 215 RT’s. Also ordered a custom center (about an 8 week lead time) to fit under my screen. Very patient with all my questions and came up with a very cool solution for my center. After lurking on this thread for years it is nice to finally make a decision.
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post #39593 of 39610 Old 12-02-2019, 05:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yosh7 View Post
Just got off the phone with Jeff. Officially a member of the JTR owners club. Ordered a pair of 215 RT’s. Also ordered a custom center (about an 8 week lead time) to fit under my screen. Very patient with all my questions and came up with a very cool solution for my center. After lurking on this thread for years it is nice to finally make a decision.
Let me guess...

Jeff is gonna build you a quad 10" with virtually the same woofer surface area as a 215RM and uses a 90x60 degree horn?

Or something like below when viewed from the side:

and still using the 15" woofers and horn...
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Speakers: L/C/R: JTR Noesis 212HT. Surrounds: Jamo C103, KEF Q100, Polk Audio RTiA3.
Subwoofer: JTR Captivator 4000ULF.
AVR: Denon AVR-X4400H. TV: Samsung UN75NU8000FXZA.

FS: Jamo C103, KEF Q100 and Polk RTiA3
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post #39594 of 39610 Old 12-02-2019, 06:16 PM
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@chucky7 , you are far more creative than me. Interesting ideas for sure. My challenge is that I needed a center only 10” tall. Didn’t want to raise the screen and can’t go AT screen. Again this is a custom speaker that will take more lead time for Jeff to build (8 weeks min). Jeff is going to make me what I believe he is calling a 4x8 RM. I am not sure if he settled on the final dimensions. I think 43” wide, 14” deep and 10” high. Will have four 8” woofers (two on each side of the horn) with the nicer “htr” compression driver. Going to have a 95 dB sensitivity and still go down to 70 hz. Can’t wait to see this executed. Think it will look very, very cool. And sound even better! Thanks to Jeff at JTR for working with me on this!
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post #39595 of 39610 Old 12-02-2019, 06:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yosh7 View Post
@chucky7, you are far more creative than me. Interesting ideas for sure. My challenge is that I needed a center only 10” tall. Didn’t want to raise the screen and can’t go AT screen. Again this is a custom speaker that will take more lead time for Jeff to build (8 weeks min). Jeff is going to make me what I believe he is calling a 4x8 RM. I am not sure if he settled on the final dimensions. I think 43” wide, 14” deep and 10” high. Will have four 8” woofers (two on each side of the horn) with the nicer “htr” compression driver. Going to have a 95 dB sensitivity and still go down to 70 hz. Can’t wait to see this executed. Think it will look very, very cool. And sound even better! Thanks to Jeff at JTR for working with me on this!
Ahhh, I didn't know about your height restriction, otherwise I would have guessed a quad 8" RM. Of course I completely forgot that Jeff still uses 8" drivers for the 228HT. Quad 8" woofers are effectively dual 11" drivers.

Can't wait to see this!
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Speakers: L/C/R: JTR Noesis 212HT. Surrounds: Jamo C103, KEF Q100, Polk Audio RTiA3.
Subwoofer: JTR Captivator 4000ULF.
AVR: Denon AVR-X4400H. TV: Samsung UN75NU8000FXZA.

FS: Jamo C103, KEF Q100 and Polk RTiA3

Last edited by chucky7; 12-02-2019 at 07:45 PM.
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post #39596 of 39610 Old 12-02-2019, 06:56 PM
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Ahhh, I didn't know about your requirement for height, otherwise I would have guessed a quad 8" RM. Of course I complete forgot that Jeff still uses 8" drivers for the 228HT. Quad 8" woofers are effectively dual 11" drivers.

Can't wait to see this!
Wonder if he will make it a 2.5 way design as quad woofer centers often are in order to improve off axis?
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post #39597 of 39610 Old 12-02-2019, 07:44 PM
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Originally Posted by bear123 View Post
Wonder if he will make it a 2.5 way design as quad woofer centers often are in order to improve off axis?
Jeff can't really do a 2.5 way because the Reference series has the horn loaded coaxial tweeter/mid range.

If he were doing a quad 8" HT center instead, then he could do a 2.5 way with the 2 center woofers pulling mid range duty.
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post #39598 of 39610 Old 12-02-2019, 09:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bear123 View Post
Wonder if he will make it a 2.5 way design as quad woofer centers often are in order to improve off axis?
Hmmm...Given the mid range and highs are coming from the center of the horn, combined with a lower crossover to the 8” drivers, is off axis as big of an issue? I would assume the compression driver would be crossed at around 500 like it is in the 210rm. Then the four 8” woofers are only handling 70-500 hz. Most of the vocals and dialogue would be coming straight from the horn right?
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post #39599 of 39610 Old 12-08-2019, 08:44 AM
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Hello JTR experts,

My buddy has Martin Logan ESL left and right speakers and a Martin Logan Motion center channel. He’s considering upgrading his center to a JTR center but was wondering if that would work out with the existing speakers. He may eventually swap out all his Martin Logan speakers for JTr but wants to start with his center potentially. FYI, he already has a S2 so he’s familiar the awesome JTR quality of sound. What do you guys think? He’s somewhat budget conscience as well what’s a good model that has good price/performance? TIA

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Last edited by leehan76; 12-08-2019 at 08:50 AM.
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post #39600 of 39610 Old 12-08-2019, 09:00 AM
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Originally Posted by leehan76 View Post
Hello JTR experts,

My buddy has Martin Logan ESL left and right speakers and a Martin Logan Motion center channel. He’s considering upgrading his center to a JTR center but was wondering if that would work out with the existing speakers. He may eventually swap out all his Martin Logan speakers for JTr but wants to start with his center potentially. FYI, he already has a S2 so he’s familiar the awesome JTR quality of sound. What do you guys think? He’s somewhat budget conscience as well what’s a good model that has good price/performance? TIA
I believe @muscles went from ESL to JTR, he may have an opinion on this. I do know he enjoys his JTR speakers.
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