Official JTR speaker thread - Page 1333 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #39961 of 40384 Old 03-31-2020, 08:42 AM
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Yeah! It looks like I'll be getting to do some mental gymnastics with 499 lb of JTR weights today after all. My noûs is much relieved.


Interesting note: 'Noēsis' is an anagram of 'noises'. Convenient, I wonder if that entered Jeff's mind when he decided the name of the speakers?



I'm picking it up at the Fedex facility so it's there, they'll call soon to tell me I can come pick it up.


Thank you Jeff!


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post #39962 of 40384 Old 03-31-2020, 09:14 AM
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Originally Posted by mechtheist View Post
I'm picking it up at the Fedex facility so it's there, they'll call soon to tell me I can come pick it up.
I picked up my 210RTs on Friday, to go along with my 210RM. Fantastic upgrade. I believe others have said this, but it is amazing that the sound doesn't seem to emanate from the speakers, it is just all around you.

The 'emergency' part of the delivery is just that Fedex has new processes in place due to coronavirus. I imagine there is more oversight into the delivery process that affects the previous 'automatic' delivery.
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post #39963 of 40384 Old 03-31-2020, 06:07 PM
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Originally Posted by gmmiddle View Post
I picked up my 210RTs on Friday, to go along with my 210RM. Fantastic upgrade. I believe others have said this, but it is amazing that the sound doesn't seem to emanate from the speakers, it is just all around you.
Were you able to make the 210RTs work next to the subs?

Speakers: L/C/R: JTR Noesis 212HT. Surrounds: Jamo C103, KEF Q100, Polk Audio RTiA3.
Subwoofer: JTR Captivator 4000ULF.
AVR: Denon AVR-X4400H. TV: Samsung UN75NU8000FXZA.
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post #39964 of 40384 Old 03-31-2020, 06:20 PM
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Originally Posted by yosh7 View Post
Ok, looking at the graph on databass/ricci's site it appears the 215 RT has a sensitivity of ~97-102 from 40hz-200hz. Sensitivity is STILL really, really high all the way down to the tuning point (18 hz to my recollection). So sensitivity is 87-97 from tuning point up to 40 hz or so. Incredible. I have quoted Josh Ricci below and attached the graph that I am trying to interpret...

I cross my 215 RT's (and all my speakers) to my quad 24" subs at 60 hz. From Ricci's website it looks like I can safely assume that the 215 reach an efficiency close to the 212's above around 40Hz? Amazing. I am currently powering with a Sunfire amp that does 800 watts @4ohm . Crossing at 60 would still get one to almost 124 db at 3 feet with a 100 watt receiver (at the sensitivity I am assuming) Seems like that only people that want to run these absolutely FULL RANGE at the highest possible db output need to throw more power at them.
Let me know if I am reading this right and coming to the appropriate conclusions?

From data-bass:
----
"Voltage Sensitivity
Since the 10 meter sensitivity measurement is the more representative measurement of the 215RT's true output we will look at it to gauge the 215RT's sensitivity with a 2 volt input. From 44-135Hz the 215RT's sensitivity is between 100-102dB which is quite good. The 2 volt sensitivity is still hovering near 90dB down at 21Hz."
Just wanted to point out. Ricci's sensitivity numbers are 1M GP, which are 3dB higher than 1M in free air or in anechoic chamber. However, when you put speakers in room, you also get 3dB more per additional speaker, and 3dB per boundary they are near by.

In any event, 90dB or 87dB sensitivity at 21Hz is just crazy.

Speakers: L/C/R: JTR Noesis 212HT. Surrounds: Jamo C103, KEF Q100, Polk Audio RTiA3.
Subwoofer: JTR Captivator 4000ULF.
AVR: Denon AVR-X4400H. TV: Samsung UN75NU8000FXZA.

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post #39965 of 40384 Old 04-01-2020, 05:03 AM
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Originally Posted by chucky7 View Post
Were you able to make the 210RTs work next to the subs?
I ended up moving one sub to the 1/3 spot under the screen. The other went behind me .

The 210s are huge. I can't imagine a 215 up close.
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post #39966 of 40384 Old 04-01-2020, 05:44 AM
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Originally Posted by gmmiddle View Post
I ended up moving one sub to the 1/3 spot under the screen. The other went behind me .

The 210s are huge. I can't imagine a 215 up close.
The 210RT’s are so cute 😀

215RT - 212RT - 210RT
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JTR (3 215 RT, 5 212HTR, 2 Growlers, 4 S2's)
PSA (4 Triax's, 3 210T's)
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post #39967 of 40384 Old 04-01-2020, 06:12 AM
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Originally Posted by raynist View Post
The 210RT’s are so cute 😀

215RT - 212RT - 210RT
Actually, the cost of the 215s isn't really that much more, outside of the divorce proceedings...
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post #39968 of 40384 Old 04-01-2020, 06:37 AM
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Originally Posted by gmmiddle View Post
Actually, the cost of the 215s isn't really that much more, outside of the divorce proceedings...
I have mine hidden behind an AT screen in my gameroom.
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post #39969 of 40384 Old 04-01-2020, 01:10 PM
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Originally Posted by raynist View Post
I have mine hidden behind an AT screen in my gameroom.
Wait. Everybody said it was for better sound?! NOBODY SAID IT COULD BE USED TO HIDE SPEAKERS!

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post #39970 of 40384 Old 04-01-2020, 01:29 PM
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Originally Posted by gmmiddle View Post
Wait. Everybody said it was for better sound?! NOBODY SAID IT COULD BE USED TO HIDE SPEAKERS!

Exactly!

My wife still doesn’t know what lurks behind that screen.

I worked from home the day they were delivered and installed them before she got home.
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post #39971 of 40384 Old 04-01-2020, 03:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gmmiddle View Post
Actually, the cost of the 215s isn't really that much more, outside of the divorce proceedings...
I'll likely be getting JTR LCR next. I love my Chanes but I really want the extra umph that the JTR's will provide. I haven't sold my 218ht and the wife wasn't overly excited about the dual 2400's. She won't be overly excited about the next set of JTR's when they arrive but thats ok, she'll deal w/ it. Maybe I'll just get her another Camry so I don't have to hear any gibberish. Lol
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AVR = Sherbourn SR-120
Speakers = 2 Arx/Chane towers(5.1), dual Arx bookshelves(1.1) as center duty +LR/RR
Subs = Dual JTR 2400's
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post #39972 of 40384 Old 04-02-2020, 02:24 AM
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Originally Posted by powerlifter405 View Post
I'll likely be getting JTR LCR next. I love my Chanes but I really want the extra umph that the JTR's will provide. I haven't sold my 218ht and the wife wasn't overly excited about the dual 2400's. She won't be overly excited about the next set of JTR's when they arrive but thats ok, she'll deal w/ it. Maybe I'll just get her another Camry so I don't have to hear any gibberish. Lol
Well, if you think the JTR subs are great, you will be blown away by the speakers.

Let's just say that the speakers have even more of Jeff's magic dust that will transform every frequency above 80Hz.
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Speakers: L/C/R: JTR Noesis 212HT. Surrounds: Jamo C103, KEF Q100, Polk Audio RTiA3.
Subwoofer: JTR Captivator 4000ULF.
AVR: Denon AVR-X4400H. TV: Samsung UN75NU8000FXZA.
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post #39973 of 40384 Old 04-02-2020, 07:50 AM
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What would be the circumstances where one would choose the 210RT over the 212RT.I dont understand the the 210's place in the line up.
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post #39974 of 40384 Old 04-02-2020, 07:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Dirt9 View Post
What would be the circumstances where one would choose the 210RT over the 212RT.I dont understand the the 210's place in the line up.
The 210RT is much shorter (15 inches!!) than the 212RT. If you are putting these in a living room the 210RT will blend in much better.

It in a dedicated room or behind a screen I would pick the 212RT or 215RT.
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post #39975 of 40384 Old 04-02-2020, 08:48 AM
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What would be the circumstances where one would choose the 210RT over the 212RT.I dont understand the the 210's place in the line up.
Just wanna piggyback on what raynist already said above.

The 210RTs are less than $2,499 each (or under $5,000 a pair before shipping is added) so they are more like $2,000 each something than almost $3,000 each speakers. They are also narrower @ 12.25" wide. With the tweeter on top, the 210RTs have the more common speaker look that might be appealing to some.

Speakers: L/C/R: JTR Noesis 212HT. Surrounds: Jamo C103, KEF Q100, Polk Audio RTiA3.
Subwoofer: JTR Captivator 4000ULF.
AVR: Denon AVR-X4400H. TV: Samsung UN75NU8000FXZA.
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post #39976 of 40384 Old 04-02-2020, 09:37 AM
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Originally Posted by chucky7 View Post
Just wanna piggyback on what raynist already said above.

The 210RTs are less than $2,499 each (or under $5,000 a pair before shipping is added) so they are more like $2,000 each something than almost $3,000 each speakers. They are also narrower @ 12.25" wide. With the tweeter on top, the 210RTs have the more common speaker look that might be appealing to some.
Other factors for me were:
210s are 30 lbs less each
Same coax tweeter, already have subs for low end
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post #39977 of 40384 Old 04-02-2020, 09:44 AM
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Originally Posted by gmmiddle View Post
Other factors for me were:
210s are 30 lbs less each
Same coax tweeter, already have subs for low end
The 212RT and 210RT cover the same frequency response so you still need subs with the 212RT’s if watching movies. Only the 215’s can be used without subs.

Really the reason for the 210RT’s is their small size. They will sound just like the 212RT’s. You can’t go wrong with either

The 212RT’s are more efficient and can play louder with less amplification.

You really can’t go wrong with either.

If I was buying speakers for my living room I would choose 210RT’s for sure. In a dedicated room I would choose the 212RT’s. Behind a screen I would (and did) choose the 215RT’s.
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post #39978 of 40384 Old 04-02-2020, 07:34 PM
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Originally Posted by chucky7 View Post
Well, if you think the JTR subs are great, you will be blown away by the speakers.

Let's just say that the speakers have even more of Jeff's magic dust that will transform every frequency above 80Hz.
Yep, thats the hope. Improved clarity and output. I do really enjoy what I have but I see so often guys mentioning how the larger JTR towers really takes those two ideas and take it to the next level. I'd really consider the 215, just because, but my moves are not paid so moving that huge tower is a something I have to consider.

Time will tell.
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post #39979 of 40384 Old 04-02-2020, 07:39 PM
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Yep, thats the hope. Improved clarity and output. I do really enjoy what I have but I see so often guys mentioning how the larger JTR towers really takes those two ideas and take it to the next level. I'd really consider the 215, just because, but my moves are not paid so moving that huge tower is a something I have to consider.

Time will tell.
I have mine on furniture sliding pads and a child can move them around. If they have to be moved to a different room or further a refrigerator dolly is helpful.
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post #39980 of 40384 Old 04-03-2020, 06:31 AM
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I have mine on furniture sliding pads and a child can move them around. If they have to be moved to a different room or further a refrigerator dolly is helpful.
I did that w/ the subs, its super handy.

I was meaning that I have to move for work. If I want to promote, they are not paid moves and I have a bunch of garage equipment, engine hoist etc.. so it is a challenge for the family. I'm blessed, not complaining just having to deal w/ the pluses and minuses of life.

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Speakers = 2 Arx/Chane towers(5.1), dual Arx bookshelves(1.1) as center duty +LR/RR
Subs = Dual JTR 2400's
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post #39981 of 40384 Old 04-03-2020, 06:43 AM
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I did that w/ the subs, its super handy.

I was meaning that I have to move for work. If I want to promote, they are not paid moves and I have a bunch of garage equipment, engine hoist etc.. so it is a challenge for the family. I'm blessed, not complaining just having to deal w/ the pluses and minuses of life.
Ah - I see thanks for the clarification
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post #39982 of 40384 Old 04-03-2020, 09:27 AM
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Anybody using Anthem amps w/ their JTRs?

While I'm stuck away from my system, been doing alot of reading haha. When I get back to La, my cherry amp will be delivered for the front stage. I obviously haven't heard it yet, but I know Jeff uses them. I have always wanted to own Anthem, and now w/ their spring sale, I can get a good deal on their 3 channel amp. I might just buy it soon and a/b them when I'm back home. Not even sure what differences I'll hear at this point LOL. Anybody driving theirs w/ Anthem, specifically the MCA line?

Speakers: JTR 212RTs - JTR 210RM - JTR 110HTs (x4)
Subwoofer: Dual Rythmik G25HPSE
Audio Gear: Marantz 8805 - Krell Chorus 5200 + D-Sonic M3a-800S - BS Node 2i - Oppo 203
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post #39983 of 40384 Old 04-03-2020, 12:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Landmonster View Post
JTR subs vs "regular" home theater subs?


Hi guys...
So I've been hearing great things about JTR. I've never highly considered them...due to size and space constraints, and money contstraints.
But the entry level Capivator JTR 118 is a possibility for me Given that it costs around $1800, it is in the same realm as an SVS pb4000, or similar enthusiast subs.
How would the JTR Capivator sound vs a comparable SVS offering? Or how would it compare to a top of the line HSU vtf-15 mk2?
Is JTR in a different league all together? Furthermore , could it be used in a regular living room?
As @chucky7 said, hit up the JTR sub thread for a better reply.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jlpowell84 View Post
The 118 uses a pro style woofer, will have a diff sound characteristic to it. Lower moving mass and higher sensitivity, lower 2HD. Seems more are moving to pro style woofers for this reason. Many of them being tested on Data bass lately. You will sacrifice the ULF but it also seems that craze where everyone thought they needed to be flat to 5hz in room has faded. I would see if you can find anyone close that has some pro style woofer setups, most likely a DIY but you can hear what lower 2HD sounds like. Not everyone likes it, 2HD is not offensive like 3HD so some actually prefer it.
And my bad if this was stated before but I don't notice a big sound difference there, and my bad for being late to the game.

Fwiw I have a 218HT and dual 2400's.

The 2400's go lower and louder when pushed hard. 4800 watts vs 1400 watts so thats not hard to understand BUT aside from a slight midbass nod to the 218ht/118 driver, they both sound pretty similar to me in SQ and characteristics. Both play Badklaat, Phiso-Jotaro, Metallica or Willie Nelson about the same. EOT LDR pushes both hard, the lfe wattage and tuning advantage goes to the 2400's but the 218 holds it's own, comfortably I might add. And so on and so forth.
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post #39984 of 40384 Old 04-03-2020, 01:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Dirt9 View Post
What would be the circumstances where one would choose the 210RT over the 212RT.I dont understand the the 210's place in the line up.
WAF - the 210RT fits the mental model for a more conventional-looking tower speaker. I sold me 228HT simply because my wife could never wrap her head around their size for a "bookshelf" speaker. I am presently eyeing 210RT for LR, with 110HT for C. Hopefully, if the stars align right, I'll be in a position to make that call in a couple of months!

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* Ascend Acoustics CMT-340SE L/C/R, Rythmik Audio E15HP sub-woofer.
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post #39985 of 40384 Old 04-03-2020, 01:51 PM
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Originally Posted by choombak View Post
WAF - the 210RT fits the mental model for a more conventional-looking tower speaker. I sold me 228HT simply because my wife could never wrap her head around their size for a "bookshelf" speaker. I am presently eyeing 210RT for LR, with 110HT for C. Hopefully, if the stars align right, I'll be in a position to make that call in a couple of months!
Get a full 210 line for your LCR. W/ my Chane set up, I did like the SQ but I was using a single A1. Its a bookshelf w/ a planar tweeter and 5.25 woofer. It worked but when I added a second one into my center setup it did a better job keeping w/ the A5 towers.

The 110 would work of course but I think your sound output blending would be smoother using all three. I really had to up the level on my center to better blend and a single 10" vs two 10's, you've just doubled your available cone area. If you could economically swing it, that would be my suggestion.

When the time comes, I no longer say "if", when I upgrade I'll have my 3 LCR match. No rush and I'm thinking the 10s will work fine so I'll go up to the 212 series. I'll have the extra output that I'll never "need" but will likely use w/ some regularity.

Save up, make it a one and done.

AVR = Sherbourn SR-120
Speakers = 2 Arx/Chane towers(5.1), dual Arx bookshelves(1.1) as center duty +LR/RR
Subs = Dual JTR 2400's
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post #39986 of 40384 Old 04-03-2020, 09:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Ethos4Lyfe View Post
While I'm stuck away from my system, been doing alot of reading haha. When I get back to La, my cherry amp will be delivered for the front stage. I obviously haven't heard it yet, but I know Jeff uses them. I have always wanted to own Anthem, and now w/ their spring sale, I can get a good deal on their 3 channel amp. I might just buy it soon and a/b them when I'm back home. Not even sure what differences I'll hear at this point LOL. Anybody driving theirs w/ Anthem, specifically the MCA line?
I have an anthem MCA 2 channel. Sounds fine. Also have a a wyred 4 sound 2 channel, 2 monoblock outlaws, and a 7 channel sunfire. Have 13 channels in my theater lol.

Really don’t want to start a war, but don’t think any good amps sound that different from amp to amp. I am just am a believer in getting good quality with lots of power. And a believer in small but audible gains going from an integrated setup to separates.

Bought the anthem and wyred 4 sound used. Going new in that lower 200 watt or so per channel power range and I would probably go monoprice monolith or maybe emotiva. Mid tier power 400-800 watts then sunfire. Love that thing. nice power (800 watts @ 4onm) and runs ultra cool. If you go for what I would call Uber amps that have capability of going 1000-2000 watts then would probably put cherry or d sonic on top of the list for price/performance/high power capability. When I eventually get a few more 215 RTs I will probably look to sell everything but the sunfire and add some super high power d sonic amps. If you really have the budget to spring for new anthem amps then I would absolutely skip the anthem and put the money into 1500 watt at 8 ohm d sonic or high power cherry - because why worry about “what if I had more power?” Question down the road.

Just the opinion of one. Really no wrong answers to this amp question. Just depends on how much power you want and that answer can send you down many different paths. Also depends on how loud you want to listen and the sensitivity of your speakers. (Can’t remember-you got 210 towers right?). If you did and want to use full range and/or super loud then I’d go higher power. If no full range or not super loud then I honestly don’t think it matters that much. Good luck!



Edit- I see you got 212 towers. Those things are so sensitive I bet a solar powered calculator could power them!

Last edited by yosh7; 04-03-2020 at 09:26 PM.
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post #39987 of 40384 Old 04-04-2020, 12:13 AM
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I have an anthem MCA 2 channel. Sounds fine. Also have a a wyred 4 sound 2 channel, 2 monoblock outlaws, and a 7 channel sunfire. Have 13 channels in my theater lol.

Really don’t want to start a war, but don’t think any good amps sound that different from amp to amp. I am just am a believer in getting good quality with lots of power. And a believer in small but audible gains going from an integrated setup to separates.

Bought the anthem and wyred 4 sound used. Going new in that lower 200 watt or so per channel power range and I would probably go monoprice monolith or maybe emotiva. Mid tier power 400-800 watts then sunfire. Love that thing. nice power (800 watts @ 4onm) and runs ultra cool. If you go for what I would call Uber amps that have capability of going 1000-2000 watts then would probably put cherry or d sonic on top of the list for price/performance/high power capability. When I eventually get a few more 215 RTs I will probably look to sell everything but the sunfire and add some super high power d sonic amps. If you really have the budget to spring for new anthem amps then I would absolutely skip the anthem and put the money into 1500 watt at 8 ohm d sonic or high power cherry - because why worry about “what if I had more power?” Question down the road.

Just the opinion of one. Really no wrong answers to this amp question. Just depends on how much power you want and that answer can send you down many different paths. Also depends on how loud you want to listen and the sensitivity of your speakers. (Can’t remember-you got 210 towers right?). If you did and want to use full range and/or super loud then I’d go higher power. If no full range or not super loud then I honestly don’t think it matters that much. Good luck!



Edit- I see you got 212 towers. Those things are so sensitive I bet a solar powered calculator could power them!
Thanks for the input - totally open to any and all opinions. I have the Krell 5200 for the main 5 now, but adding a cherry 3 channel (per Jeff and Tommy @ Cherry recommendation) to power some 110HTs im adding to the sides. So the idea is use the new 3 channel to power the front 3 and keep the Krell for ohter 4 (and have an extra channel LOL). I may still decide to go with a much bigger power cherry model if i like the sound, or dsonic..because....why not? haha

I'm thinking my $ might be better spent in getting 2 channel pre to improve 2 channel. Im guessing that would be a more noticeable improvement.

Speakers: JTR 212RTs - JTR 210RM - JTR 110HTs (x4)
Subwoofer: Dual Rythmik G25HPSE
Audio Gear: Marantz 8805 - Krell Chorus 5200 + D-Sonic M3a-800S - BS Node 2i - Oppo 203
TV: LG 65 OLED
Bedroom: ML Ethos - ML Motion 30 - Samsung Q8 LED
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post #39988 of 40384 Old 04-04-2020, 08:13 AM
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Thanks for the input - totally open to any and all opinions. I have the Krell 5200 for the main 5 now, but adding a cherry 3 channel (per Jeff and Tommy @ Cherry recommendation) to power some 110HTs im adding to the sides. So the idea is use the new 3 channel to power the front 3 and keep the Krell for ohter 4 (and have an extra channel LOL). I may still decide to go with a much bigger power cherry model if i like the sound, or dsonic..because....why not? haha

I'm thinking my $ might be better spent in getting 2 channel pre to improve 2 channel. Im guessing that would be a more noticeable improvement.
Your current Marantz is already providing a signal that is completely audibly transparent. Noise and distortion far below the threshold of hearing, and with a completely accurate, neutral response. Spending a lot of money for an "audiophile" 2 channel pre will make no audible difference, and might actually have worse measured performance. An external amp can make sense if the extra power is of benefit. The signal from the pre-outs of your Marantz is going to be cleaner than the signal of most external amps....another reason why an expensive pre makes no sense even if you are lucky to find one that actually measures better.

Also, if an external amp sounds different to you, its probably not a great amp imo...amps shouldn't have a sound, only the speakers. There shouldn't be any eq baked into a well designed amp.

There are plenty of really good amps out there with detailed objective measurement data available to be sure you are getting great quality. My opinion is that once you are below a certain level of noise and distortion, the only thing that really matters is power. You won't hear the difference between .008% distortion or .0008% distortion even though its a 10x difference. But if the "lower" distortion amp runs out of clean power and clips, the "worse" measuring amp will sound drastically better due to the extra power.

I've seen so much very high priced audio gear touted as superb audiophile quality that actually has mediocre or even poor measured performance that I would never spend $ on something that doesn't have objective data available. It's just a crap shoot otherwise.

Couple of examples of great amps with detailed performance data available(vs just "our amps are the best and sound great"):
-Monolith 2/3/5/7 channel. If these have enough power, great bang for the buck and superb measured performance.
-Hypex NC500 as good or better performance as the Monolith but a good deal more power available, doesn't serve double duty as a space heater, and doesn't weight 100 lbs if that matters. Nord Acoustics is who I'd look at for these.
There are other amps with very good measured performance but usually at higher cost without improved performance.
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post #39989 of 40384 Old 04-04-2020, 08:37 AM
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Thanks for the input - totally open to any and all opinions. I have the Krell 5200 for the main 5 now, but adding a cherry 3 channel (per Jeff and Tommy @ Cherry recommendation) to power some 110HTs im adding to the sides. So the idea is use the new 3 channel to power the front 3 and keep the Krell for ohter 4 (and have an extra channel LOL). I may still decide to go with a much bigger power cherry model if i like the sound, or dsonic..because....why not? haha

I'm thinking my $ might be better spent in getting 2 channel pre to improve 2 channel. Im guessing that would be a more noticeable improvement.
A little more info regarding your system and thoughts of adding an audiophile 2 channel pre:

Your Marantz processor is sending a signal to your Krell amp that has more than 4x lower distortion than the signal your Krell amp sends to the speakers. And remember that, unless you have reliable 3rd party measurement data, a pre will more than likely have worse measured performance than your Marantz. Even if you find one that is "measurably" better, it will still make no audible difference.

Krell distortion: .008%(at very low wattage, much higher at higher levels)
Marantz distortoin: less than .002%
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post #39990 of 40384 Old 04-04-2020, 08:40 AM
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A little more info regarding your system and thoughts of adding an audiophile 2 channel pre:

Your Marantz processor is sending a signal to your Krell amp that has more than 4x lower distortion than the signal your Krell amp sends to the speakers. And remember that, unless you have reliable 3rd party measurement data, a pre will more than likely have worse measured performance than your Marantz. Even if you find one that is "measurably" better, it will still make no audible difference.

Krell distortion: .008%(at very low wattage, much higher at higher levels)
Marantz distortoin: less than .002%
Thanks for the info - if I don't notice a big differnce in adding the cherry (I'll need the 2 channels anyways), I was thinking of Nord of something that uses Hypex.

As far as 2 channel goes, I heard @muscles system as blown away by how loud it goes. We have the same speakers, but his Mac 2600 pre as significantly louder than his Marantz for 2 channel. I don't usually get to listen that that, but I think there was an audible difference. I'm sure he will chime in here and speak to that effect - I have always been under the belief that a dedicated 2 channel pre will make my 2 channel sound better. I don't really get to a/b in my space, so I just have to go buy what I'm told by people smarter than I! haha

Speakers: JTR 212RTs - JTR 210RM - JTR 110HTs (x4)
Subwoofer: Dual Rythmik G25HPSE
Audio Gear: Marantz 8805 - Krell Chorus 5200 + D-Sonic M3a-800S - BS Node 2i - Oppo 203
TV: LG 65 OLED
Bedroom: ML Ethos - ML Motion 30 - Samsung Q8 LED
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