What do you think of my setup? - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 28 Old 12-06-2014, 03:34 PM - Thread Starter
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What do you think of my setup?

Hello,
I am a new to HT and I just wanted to know what some of you thought of my new 2 channel setup. This is my first post on AVS and I just purchased my new system:

1.Two B&W CM9 S2s- MSRP $1599 each, I paid $999 each
2. Denon AVR4000- MSRP $1299, I paid $799
3.Martin Logan 1500x- MSRP $1599, I paid $1399
4. Sony PS4- $399

An amp and surrounds will be added later.
What's your overall assessment of what I have? Is it good, bad, excellent, horrible, or what?
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post #2 of 28 Old 12-06-2014, 06:01 PM
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Curious - "An amp and surrounds will be added later."

Amp??? The Denon is an AV Receiver?

It looks to me like you are missing Center and Surround.

I have to say, I love a bargain. My motto is never pay retail.

I would say you are on your way to a fantastic system. In fact, I would say you already have a fantastic system.

When you bought the CM9, whether you like it or not, you committed yourself to buying the CM Center speakers, of which there are two

B&W CM Centre 2-S2, which I expect to be expensive -

http://www.bowers-wilkins.co.uk/Spea...ntre-2-S2.html

The Midrange driver on the Center is a real advantage as it lowers the crossover on the bass speakers, and reduced lobing.

However, realistically, the standard 2-way B&W CM Center S2 would still do a fantastic job of it.

http://www.bowers-wilkins.co.uk/Spea...Centre-S2.html

The standard price on the CM Center 2-S2 is a very considerable $1250 each.

The price on the cheaper CM Center S2 is a more modest $699 each.

These are for the CM-S2, the latest series. The last time I was in Best Buy the offered me a deal on the previous NOT-S2 models which are still very good. You might be able to get a deal on either of the older Center speakers, but likely only while stock lasts.

Surround are a little more flexible. You don't want them grossly different tonally than the front speakers, but in general, you can skimp here a bit. Typically people will do this when room circumstance force them to. But the surrounds are less critical and can be adapted to your need and budget.

That should be a fantastic system even as it stands now.

Steve/bluewizard
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post #3 of 28 Old 12-06-2014, 06:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Mballen View Post
Hello,
I am a new to HT and I just wanted to know what some of you thought of my new 2 channel setup. This is my first post on AVS and I just purchased my new system:

1.Two B&W CM9 S2s- MSRP $1599 each, I paid $999 each
2. Denon AVR4000- MSRP $1299, I paid $799
3.Martin Logan 1500x- MSRP $1599, I paid $1399
4. Sony PS4- $399

An amp and surrounds will be added later.
What's your overall assessment of what I have? Is it good, bad, excellent, horrible, or what?
I think you can do "a lot" better with 1400 for a sub. Emphasis on a lot...SVS, HSU, Rythmik, PA will give you a much better BANG for your buck. They're are ID companies and don't have the overhead of BB.
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post #4 of 28 Old 12-06-2014, 07:14 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Rexathor View Post
I think you can do "a lot" better with 1400 for a sub. Emphasis on a lot...SVS, HSU, Rythmik, PA will give you a much better BANG for your buck. They're are ID companies and don't have the overhead of BB.
I heard subs from those brands you(and everyone on here) mentioned and I didn't particularly care for them. The SVS SB13 for example didn't sound impressive but it seems to be the most popular, and it appears that pushing ID subs down people's throat is the "it" thing on this site.

I picked the 1500 because I liked the way it sounded the most, there was no need to pick one of the AVS cookie cutter "I know better than you" popularity subs you suggested.

But thanks anyway!
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post #5 of 28 Old 12-06-2014, 07:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Mballen View Post
I heard subs from those brands you(and everyone on here) mentioned and I didn't particularly care for them. The SVS SB13 for example didn't sound impressive but it seems to be the most popular, and it appears that pushing ID subs down people's throat is the "it" thing on this site.

I picked the 1500 because I liked the way it sounded the most, there was no need to pick one of the AVS cookie cutter "I know better than you" popularity subs you suggested.

But thanks anyway!
No one is pushing anything down anyone's throat. You posted for people to comment on your set up so I did. I recommend ID subs because of the value they represent and not because is "the thing to do here". I had ML subs with CM9's before and it made a huge different when I went elsewhere. You'll get more bang for your buck but the average person buying HT gear in BB probably doesn't know about them...
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post #6 of 28 Old 12-06-2014, 07:35 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Rexathor View Post
No one is pushing anything down anyone's throat. You posted for people to comment on your set up so I did. I recommend ID subs because of the value they represent and not because is "the thing to do here". I had ML subs with CM9's before and it made a huge different when I went elsewhere. You'll get more bang for your buck but the average person buying HT gear in BB probably doesn't know about them...
They have those brands you mentioned in Magnolia(BB). As I said, I've heard them. An SVS, PA, and also REL. Bang for Buck does not mean better sounding and it's not what I was trying to achieve anyway. The simple fact is most companies make good products based on varying tastes, it's up to us to choose which one we like based on our experience, not some vague suggestive ratio of bang/cost.

The reason I mentioned "shoving brands down throats" is because that comment is constantly repeated on this site with no regard to personal taste or style, it's the reason I hesitated to even join AVS. One could argue that Bose or Sonos is good bang for buck if they wanted to, but guess what: it doesn't sound as good as most of the brands you mentioned and the brand I chose.

Didn't mean to sound like I was attacking you, but I heard some of the brands you mentioned(at BB, which is another ridiculous hangup some on here have) and I didn't like them.
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post #7 of 28 Old 12-06-2014, 09:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Mballen View Post
I heard subs from those brands you(and everyone on here) mentioned and I didn't particularly care for them. The SVS SB13 for example didn't sound impressive but it seems to be the most popular, and it appears that pushing ID subs down people's throat is the "it" thing on this site.

I picked the 1500 because I liked the way it sounded the most, there was no need to pick one of the AVS cookie cutter "I know better than you" popularity subs you suggested.

But thanks anyway!
Well than....

As someone who is also new to HT and more specifically quality HT products, I've been on here a lot lurking and posting questions and making new threads etc.... A lot of people mention ID company but no one is pushing anything down anybodies throat. There are a lot of people on here who are way more knowledgeable than I am and probably you as well. Your thread title is "what do you think of my set up?" So people answered your questions. The reason people often suggest ID company is because they make quality products at a fraction of the cost.
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post #8 of 28 Old 12-07-2014, 06:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Mballen View Post
They have those brands you mentioned in Magnolia(BB). As I said, I've heard them. An SVS, PA, and also REL. Bang for Buck does not mean better sounding and it's not what I was trying to achieve anyway. The simple fact is most companies make good products based on varying tastes, it's up to us to choose which one we like based on our experience, not some vague suggestive ratio of bang/cost.

The reason I mentioned "shoving brands down throats" is because that comment is constantly repeated on this site with no regard to personal taste or style, it's the reason I hesitated to even join AVS. One could argue that Bose or Sonos is good bang for buck if they wanted to, but guess what: it doesn't sound as good as most of the brands you mentioned and the brand I chose.

Didn't mean to sound like I was attacking you, but I heard some of the brands you mentioned(at BB, which is another ridiculous hangup some on here have) and I didn't like them.
"I didn't like the SVS sub" is all you needed to say lol

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post #9 of 28 Old 12-07-2014, 09:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Mballen View Post
They have those brands you mentioned in Magnolia(BB). As I said, I've heard them. An SVS, PA, and also REL. Bang for Buck does not mean better sounding and it's not what I was trying to achieve anyway. The simple fact is most companies make good products based on varying tastes, it's up to us to choose which one we like based on our experience, not some vague suggestive ratio of bang/cost.

The reason I mentioned "shoving brands down throats" is because that comment is constantly repeated on this site with no regard to personal taste or style, it's the reason I hesitated to even join AVS. One could argue that Bose or Sonos is good bang for buck if they wanted to, but guess what: it doesn't sound as good as most of the brands you mentioned and the brand I chose.

Didn't mean to sound like I was attacking you, but I heard some of the brands you mentioned(at BB, which is another ridiculous hangup some on here have) and I didn't like them.
I've never seen ID brands in magnolia, where do you live?
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post #10 of 28 Old 12-07-2014, 10:06 AM - Thread Starter
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"I didn't like the SVS sub" is all you needed to say lol

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I did say that, even mentioned the model that I heard but it didn't appear that he read it so I repeated.
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post #11 of 28 Old 12-07-2014, 10:15 AM - Thread Starter
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I've never seen ID brands in magnolia, where do you live?
I'm in Georgia. There are 3 Magnolias near me and they all have them. I've had the opportunity to hear most of them in these stores and based my purchase on what I heard. The brands are listed on their website except SVS, but there were still a couple of them on display.

Unless I'm misinterpreting what ID means, it sounds like the Magnolias are different based on region. Even the ones here differ with each other somewhat. My main point of contention, though, was the SVS SB13 because it seems to be everyone's favorite.
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post #12 of 28 Old 12-07-2014, 10:23 AM - Thread Starter
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Well than....

As someone who is also new to HT and more specifically quality HT products, I've been on here a lot lurking and posting questions and making new threads etc.... A lot of people mention ID company but no one is pushing anything down anybodies throat. There are a lot of people on here who are way more knowledgeable than I am and probably you as well. Your thread title is "what do you think of my set up?" So people answered your questions. The reason people often suggest ID company is because they make quality products at a fraction of the cost.
I understand that, but that obviously doesn't guarantee superior quality, comparable, but not superior.

Based on the deal I got, it's clear I agree with saving money but not at the expense of what sounds good to me and I'm not about to make a decision just because everyone says so.
This post was meant to gain an outside opinion on these items I bought, not post copy and paste responses. I'd rather be told that what I chose sucks and I have horrible products.
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post #13 of 28 Old 12-07-2014, 10:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Mballen View Post
I'm in Georgia. There are 3 Magnolias near me and they all have them. I've had the opportunity to hear most of them in these stores and based my purchase on what I heard. The brands are listed on their website except SVS, but there were still a couple of them on display.

Unless I'm misinterpreting what ID means, it sounds like the Magnolias are different based on region. Even the ones here differ with each other somewhat. My main point of contention, though, was the SVS SB13 because it seems to be everyone's favorite.
Thats interesting. All the ones I have been to only carried the standard Energy, B&W, DefTech. MartainLogan etc. I guess it is a regional thing.
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post #14 of 28 Old 12-07-2014, 11:00 AM - Thread Starter
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Thats interesting. All the ones I have been to only carried the standard Energy, B&W, DefTech. MartainLogan etc. I guess it is a regional thing.
I believe I am misinterpreting what ID means. I checked and unless SVS, which is a brand the other poster mentioned is not ID then I cannot say that they are all on display there. I didn't see a Rhythmik, or HSU for example, but they have a couple of SVS subs.

Regardless of the situation, based on reviews I read the ML 1500 I bought is comparable to subs that cost two to three times as much as what I paid.
Of course there are cheaper ones, but I don't want cheaper ones if I sacrifice the sound I want. I definitely see the cost benefit to ID, but I'm not sold on the quality benefit. Maybe compared to most subs but not the one I bought. That's why I bought it.
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post #15 of 28 Old 12-07-2014, 11:17 AM
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Interesting - Magnolia is listed as one of the authorized (retail ) dealers for SVS. Haven't seen SVS subs in the magnolias nearby my place - http://www.svsound.com/support/authorized-svs-dealers

For $1400 range, the typical recommendation on subs here is SVS, HSU, outlaw, Rythmik....; but if somebody likes ML subs after listening/comparing, it is good that they went with what their ears told them to do

For a 2-ch setup, looks good with denon x4000 AVR
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post #16 of 28 Old 12-07-2014, 11:22 AM
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Nice setup, some great deals.
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post #17 of 28 Old 12-07-2014, 11:29 AM
 
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This is the oddest thread I have ever seen but..

ID means Internet direct. And the only ID that is in some magnolias is svs

But psa, hsu, rhythmic will 1000% be a better product than anything else bought in BB for 1400$ that goes for build quality, tone quality (modal ringing), extension, and max spl not to mention. The best Cs you could ever ask for

I think you are very close minded to NOT consider spending much less for as good or more likely better quality subs. And we are not pushing them. It's not the cool thing. It the smart thing.

Don't come and ask what do you think. Then scorn those who tel you what they think lol
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post #18 of 28 Old 12-07-2014, 01:22 PM - Thread Starter
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This is the oddest thread I have ever seen but..

ID means Internet direct. And the only ID that is in some magnolias is svs

But psa, hsu, rhythmic will 1000% be a better product than anything else bought in BB for 1400$ that goes for build quality, tone quality (modal ringing), extension, and max spl not to mention. The best Cs you could ever ask for

I think you are very close minded to NOT consider spending much less for as good or more likely better quality subs. And we are not pushing them. It's not the cool thing. It the smart thing.

Don't come and ask what do you think. Then scorn those who tel you what they think lol
I wonder how any audio business is able to sell any subs based on what you've said. I guess online conformity trumps economic principles on here because if what you're saying was totally true Bowers and Wilkins, Martin Logan, Goldenear, Rel, and others should all go bankrupt.
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post #19 of 28 Old 12-07-2014, 01:25 PM - Thread Starter
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Interesting - Magnolia is listed as one of the authorized (retail ) dealers for SVS. Haven't seen SVS subs in the magnolias nearby my place - http://www.svsound.com/support/authorized-svs-dealers

For $1400 range, the typical recommendation on subs here is SVS, HSU, outlaw, Rythmik....; but if somebody likes ML subs after listening/comparing, it is good that they went with what their ears told them to do

For a 2-ch setup, looks good with denon x4000 AVR
Thank you for being a clear thinking human being. Not for endorsing my purchase, I don't want that, but for allowing me the freedom of making a decision based on my own assessment.
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post #20 of 28 Old 12-07-2014, 02:45 PM
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I wonder how any audio business is able to sell any subs based on what you've said. I guess online conformity trumps economic principles on here because if what you're saying was totally true Bowers and Wilkins, Martin Logan, Goldenear, Rel, and others should all go bankrupt.
Mballen,

I think you're missing the point. No one is saying those brands, speakers/subs are bad. And, if you like them best from everything you heard than that's all that really matters. Sound is subjective and what sounds good to me may not be your cup of tea regardless of price, build quality, etc...

I'm also not saying that ID subs are better than your ML sub. This hobby can get expensive and if you can get the same performance or in my case better at a fraction of the price it makes is it easier to build a kick ass system without feeling the need to upgrade later. Is your money & your ears but I wouldnt scratch off SVS or other ID companies because you heard 1 SVS sub at BB.

Really, the only reason I'm replying to your post is because I started the same way as you with the same speakers & sub. It was the best I heard from Magnolia, Frys, etc. The ML did ok in my room but when I demoed other subs "in my room" I got gosebumps. I sold my ML & got multiple subs but that's me. If your happy with your ML and feels is worth the price is your $ & your ears...
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post #21 of 28 Old 12-07-2014, 03:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Mballen,

I think you're missing the point. No one is saying those brands, speakers/subs are bad. And, if you like them best from everything you heard than that's all that really matters. Sound is subjective and what sounds good to me may not be your cup of tea regardless of price, build quality, etc...

I'm also not saying that ID subs are better than your ML sub. This hobby can get expensive and if you can get the same performance or in my case better at a fraction of the price it makes is it easier to build a kick ass system without feeling the need to upgrade later. Is your money & your ears but I wouldnt scratch off SVS or other ID companies because you heard 1 SVS sub at BB.

Really, the only reason I'm replying to your post is because I started the same way as you with the same speakers & sub. It was the best I heard from Magnolia, Frys, etc. The ML did ok in my room but when I demoed other subs "in my room" I got gosebumps. I sold my ML & got multiple subs but that's me. If your happy with your ML and feels is worth the price is your $ & your ears...
Thanks Rex. Sorry to give a hard time earlier, I think I was letting out some frustration I had with some on you.
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post #22 of 28 Old 12-07-2014, 03:19 PM
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Thanks Rex. Sorry to give a hard time earlier, I think I was letting out some frustration I had with some on you.
No problem...I would suggest to get the magnetics tweeter covers for the CM9's. They're really fragile and tend to dent easily. That's a known brand & if you ever want to sell in the future it will a lot easier if they're in good shape. I also would recommend an amp if you're going for anything pass 2.0. I think their sensitivity is in the high 80's & you'll definitely hear more of the crisp/clear sound you heard is BB.
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post #23 of 28 Old 12-07-2014, 03:35 PM - Thread Starter
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No problem...I would suggest to get the magnetics tweeter covers for the CM9's. They're really fragile and tend to dent easily. That's a known brand & if you ever want to sell in the future it will a lot easier if they're in good shape. I also would recommend an amp if you're going for anything pass 2.0. I think their sensitivity is in the high 80's & you'll definitely hear more of the crisp/clear sound you heard is BB.
Yeah, the amp is my next purchase. I'm curious of something Rex, what is your favorite sub or what sub has sounded the best to you?
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post #24 of 28 Old 12-07-2014, 03:58 PM
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I heard the HSU VTF-15 at their location in SoCal. Is a massive sub but at that time I really never heard tight accurate bass. I also had the the SVS PC-13 ultra which was kool because is a barrel shape so placement was easier. I have a Outlaw LFM-ex in the bedroom which is one of the best value out there. I'm currently Saving for a JTR S2 which should be the end of the game for me. If you got the piano black towers I would strongly recommend to check out the Rythmik fv15hp in piano black. If you live in SoCal I think their office is in N SD. If you just bought & got the means i would advice on checking something out in your room. You'll heard the difference in no time. This way you can keep either one & and return the other since you'll be within their 30 day window. There's nothing worse than wondering what if, good luck!
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post #25 of 28 Old 12-07-2014, 04:17 PM
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Sorry for the typos, I'm on my phone...
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post #26 of 28 Old 12-07-2014, 07:37 PM - Thread Starter
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I heard the HSU VTF-15 at their location in SoCal. Is a massive sub but at that time I really never heard tight accurate bass. I also had the the SVS PC-13 ultra which was kool because is a barrel shape so placement was easier. I have a Outlaw LFM-ex in the bedroom which is one of the best value out there. I'm currently Saving for a JTR S2 which should be the end of the game for me. If you got the piano black towers I would strongly recommend to check out the Rythmik fv15hp in piano black. If you live in SoCal I think their office is in N SD. If you just bought & got the means i would advice on checking something out in your room. You'll heard the difference in no time. This way you can keep either one & and return the other since you'll be within their 30 day window. There's nothing worse than wondering what if, good luck!
Good suggestion on the Rythmik. I'll look into it.
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post #27 of 28 Old 12-10-2014, 11:18 AM
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Regarding the ID debate that got started by your solicitation of opinions, I should share my experience since it is totally different than yours and instructive because of that.

I think your system is probably higher quality than mine, but my system is physically much larger, more sophisticated, and a lot louder with high efficiency speakers and an honest total 1500W of continuous power. It also comes with 11.1, dual subs, 30TB usable RAID6 NAS/HTPC, linear tracking turntable with moving-coil cartridge, 3 head cassette, TV stand, HD TV.

By going with last years' model ID speakers and buying everything used (or re-using cast-off junk) I assembled everything all for about the same price you paid for far less equipment.

Mine is certainly a lot uglier, for whatever that is worth. It has no gaming capability. It was also a lot of DIY work repairing it and fabricating missing outriggers and custom hangers. It took years to collect it all at rock-bottom prices (or free).

With my hearing limitations, the surround processing is vital to maintaining a sense of immersion since bright room reflections in the top octave only add to ambiance when one can hear them. The only alternative to achieve realism is more channels and that gets expensive quickly.

One thing I noted when I was shopping is that the ID speaker companies tend to de-emphasize the looks. Fewer finishes, less veneer, less trim, stick-on logo, etc.

They also seem to concentrate on the basic technology rather than exotic materials like diamond drivers. If it was theoretically advantageous but in the real world under most conditions inaudible, it got left out.

Most people are balancing food clothing and shelter vs entertainment and not in a position to spend unlimited amounts of money for looks and class while propping up the share price of the manufacturer.

These factors I pointed out are only a small subset of the total picture. It all depends upon what your own goals are. People make recommendations based upon their own experiences and those experiences are driven by their circumstances and their goals. If you want honest and especially more helpful feedback about your system you might include some information about what your circumstances are, and what your goals are.

I am glad you are happy with your system. It may be that your system performs much better in your specific circumstances and fits your needs much better than a system like mine would, but it is also a slam-dunk that my system likewise meets my needs far better than yours would... but only because our circumstances and goals are different.
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post #28 of 28 Old 12-10-2014, 11:59 AM
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+1, seem the OP also prefer sounds from sealed sub.
I got rid of my ported subs and went with Essex(like REL), but been itch to try the Rhythmik to get into ~15hz zone.

Seem now a days 25Hz is almost considered a mid-bass, 10-15Hz are the new sub-bass.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mballen View Post
Good suggestion on the Rythmik. I'll look into it.

I see the atoms free and fine,

That bubble like a sparkling wine;
I see the songs Electrons sing,
Jumping from ring to outer ring;
              - Lister, The Physicist
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