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post #301 of 2675 Old 11-10-2015, 02:48 PM
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Originally Posted by madhuxs View Post
How much of a step up are the 530s? updates please...
I own the RBH R5Bi’s, auditioned the JBL 530’s in my home and heard the ELAC B5’s at this year’s audio show. All very good speakers. I did review both the R5Bi’s and the JBL’s on Amazon if you want to take a look.

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post #302 of 2675 Old 11-10-2015, 04:45 PM
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How much of a step up are the 530s? updates please...
They arrived today. Need to let them warm up to room temp and run them in a bit. Will post initial impressions in a couple days.
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post #303 of 2675 Old 11-10-2015, 06:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pacodutaco View Post
Again, hacking up a budget speaker doesn't make sense to me.
I'm sure that hacking up a really expensive doesn't make sense.

I think it makes more sense the modify cheaper speakers.
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post #304 of 2675 Old 11-10-2015, 08:28 PM
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Quick report on the JBL 530's:

They have a fatal flaw in 2-ch mode without a sub - the woofers bottom out and pop at moderate volume with tracks with a lot of bass. And I'm not talking rap or hip-hop bass (not my musical taste). The woofers bottom out on the Delbert McClinton track "Watchin' the Rain", which has a strong electric bass line.

Based on this, I would not recommend the JBL 530's in a 2.0 system if you plan to play at moderate to high volume with music with a lot of bass energy. Perhaps a highpass filter at 80 or 100 Hz would eliminate the issue, used in conjunction with a sub.

I never heard the B6 woofers bottom out on the same track, or any other tracks I listened to with them.
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post #305 of 2675 Old 11-10-2015, 10:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adam2434 View Post
Quick report on the JBL 530's:

They have a fatal flaw in 2-ch mode without a sub - the woofers bottom out and pop at moderate volume with tracks with a lot of bass. And I'm not talking rap or hip-hop bass (not my musical taste). The woofers bottom out on the Delbert McClinton track "Watchin' the Rain", which has a strong electric bass line.

Based on this, I would not recommend the JBL 530's in a 2.0 system if you plan to play at moderate to high volume with music with a lot of bass energy. Perhaps a highpass filter at 80 or 100 Hz would eliminate the issue, used in conjunction with a sub.

I never heard the B6 woofers bottom out on the same track, or any other tracks I listened to with them.

Sorry to hear you have an concern issues / experience w/ the 530s, but I can attest that something else is wrong either w/ your receiver (or maybe bad crossover inside the speaker).
I own / use an RX-A1040 and also used the Marantz 5010 w/ the 530s and me coming from a pair of B&W 685 (S1), these 530s are stunning speakers and I do listen to them in 2.0. Even though I own a JL Fantom sub, these speakers are stunning w/o a sub and sound much bigger than they are. JBL did great w/ the 530. Sorry to place this in an Elac thread but I though I share my input.

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post #306 of 2675 Old 11-10-2015, 10:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adam2434 View Post
Quick report on the JBL 530's:

They have a fatal flaw in 2-ch mode without a sub - the woofers bottom out and pop at moderate volume with tracks with a lot of bass. And I'm not talking rap or hip-hop bass (not my musical taste). The woofers bottom out on the Delbert McClinton track "Watchin' the Rain", which has a strong electric bass line.

Based on this, I would not recommend the JBL 530's in a 2.0 system if you plan to play at moderate to high volume with music with a lot of bass energy. Perhaps a highpass filter at 80 or 100 Hz would eliminate the issue, used in conjunction with a sub.

I never heard the B6 woofers bottom out on the same track, or any other tracks I listened to with them.
Might just need some more break-in. Either that, or the speakers are malfunctioning. That doesn't seem normal, from what I've read of the 530s.
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post #307 of 2675 Old 11-11-2015, 12:12 AM
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Could it be port chuffing? Take a look at the following video review:


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post #308 of 2675 Old 11-11-2015, 08:03 AM
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dsrussell: Completely off axis listening, must be the horn, never been a horn fan but when I heard these they didn't sound bad, not sure I would go out on a very long limb and calling them the best speaker ever, maybe to his "ears". I like his comments about about leaving them in a room at Rocky Mountain Audio show in room by themselves. I like the Elac, but they are too big for the shelf I have them on and the PSB I tested out I liked better. JBL just doesn't do the consumer route very well, so it's nice to see reviews but this guy should be playing some music instead of just spewing Adjectives describing them! lol

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post #309 of 2675 Old 11-11-2015, 09:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Garman View Post
dsrussell: Completely off axis listening, must be the horn, never been a horn fan but when I heard these they didn't sound bad, not sure I would go out on a very long limb and calling them the best speaker ever, maybe to his "ears". I like his comments about about leaving them in a room at Rocky Mountain Audio show in room by themselves. I like the Elac, but they are too big for the shelf I have them on and the PSB I tested out I liked better. JBL just doesn't do the consumer route very well, so it's nice to see reviews but this guy should be playing some music instead of just spewing Adjectives describing them! lol
A really odd review, I’ll grant you that . The guy seems to be really out in left field, but he makes some interesting points on setup and the early problems with port chuffing. When I had them in my home, I didn’t get a chance to play them loud enough to hear any port chuffing (it came with a bad tweeter, so I sent them back the next day). I will say that in the short time I heard them, I loved their soundstage. Closest thing to dipole panels, meaning, a nice holographic soundstage. BTW, he did have a video just playing music on these. I just didn't bother with viewing it.

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post #310 of 2675 Old 11-11-2015, 03:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adam2434 View Post

Based on this, I would not recommend the JBL 530's in a 2.0 system if you plan to play at moderate to high volume with music with a lot of bass energy. Perhaps a highpass filter at 80 or 100 Hz would eliminate the issue, used in conjunction with a sub.
Something does not seem right - I played mine in 2.0 and did not have any problems in that area - and have
heard no major complaints about this.

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post #311 of 2675 Old 11-11-2015, 03:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shift View Post
Sorry to hear you have an concern issues / experience w/ the 530s, but I can attest that something else is wrong either w/ your receiver (or maybe bad crossover inside the speaker).
I own / use an RX-A1040 and also used the Marantz 5010 w/ the 530s and me coming from a pair of B&W 685 (S1), these 530s are stunning speakers and I do listen to them in 2.0. Even though I own a JL Fantom sub, these speakers are stunning w/o a sub and sound much bigger than they are. JBL did great w/ the 530
Agree - they are not a wimp - still one of the better speakers around.

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post #312 of 2675 Old 11-11-2015, 04:29 PM
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Regarding all the replies on the JBL 530 woofer pop:

I am am using a Rotel 1582 mk 2 amp and Rotel preamp to power them (tone controls flat), so power or electronics are not the issue. I'll do some more testing in the next few days and get some spl measurements to determine the level at which the woofer pop occurs. Maybe I am just driving the woofers beyond their limits on some tracks.

I'll also try the port plugs. However, the I believe the sound is the mechanical bottoming out of the woofers, not port noise.

Other than the woofer pop, I am pleased with their clarity and resolution in the short time I had with them last night.
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post #313 of 2675 Old 11-11-2015, 08:34 PM
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Have been enjoying my S12EQ for a while now

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Originally Posted by lifedoc View Post
Received my two F5s and one C5 earlier this week. I was order #90 . They sound great! Watched an episode of Doctor Who, streamed from Netflix in PCM surround audio. Lots of special effects sounds,as well as a musical soundtrack all handled well by the speakers. Have also listened to Phantom of the Opera on CD, as well as streamed classical, jazz, and Hawaiian music. Nice!

(I finally replaced my expensive, at the time, 46 year old AR-3a speakers. In today's 2015 dollars, my original $500 AR-3as would now be equivalent to $3419. That's inflation.)

Awaiting the S12EQ sub. I spoke with an ELAC rep today, learned the warehouse has just received the subs. Andrew wants to personally do some QC testing on samples of the EQ subs prior to giving his blessing and allowing them to be shipped out. Should be available on the ELAC website the end of next week.

Remember ELAC ships all their Debut Andrew Jones speakers at no cost to the customer.
***********************************
I wanted to follow-up my report on the above ELAC Debut speakers with the new addition of the S12EQ subwoofer. Setting up the unit was quite easy, using the free app available for Apple or Android devices. It's quite ingenious, using one's device and Bluetooth to equalize the speaker for the listening area, set up volume, cross-over, etc.

It's a very powerful, yet effortless deep pure sound, without boominess or distortion. The subwoofer contains a powerful 1000 watt BASH power source, which turns itself on when there is a signal. In standby mode, this speaker uses only one half of one watt of power.

When listening accompanied by the other ELAC Debut speakers, there is a smooth, seamless transition from all the channels and frequencies. Truly a complete sound system well worth the price. The old expression, 'you only get what you paid for' is now obsolete. Here you are not getting what you paid for, but a whole lot more.
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post #314 of 2675 Old 11-11-2015, 09:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adam2434 View Post
Regarding all the replies on the JBL 530 woofer pop:

I am am using a Rotel 1582 mk 2 amp and Rotel preamp to power them (tone controls flat), so power or electronics are not the issue. I'll do some more testing in the next few days and get some spl measurements to determine the level at which the woofer pop occurs. Maybe I am just driving the woofers beyond their limits on some tracks.

I'll also try the port plugs. However, the I believe the sound is the mechanical bottoming out of the woofers, not port noise.

Other than the woofer pop, I am pleased with their clarity and resolution in the short time I had with them last night.

Adam, is the pop happening on both speakers at the same time? If its just one popping, try switching the speakers and see what happens and keep it at the same trim level on the avr / prepro.
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post #315 of 2675 Old 11-11-2015, 09:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lifedoc View Post
***********************************
I wanted to follow-up my report on the above ELAC Debut speakers with the new addition of the S12EQ subwoofer. Setting up the unit was quite easy, using the free app available for Apple or Android devices. It's quite ingenious, using one's device and Bluetooth to equalize the speaker for the listening area, set up volume, cross-over, etc.

It's a very powerful, yet effortless deep pure sound, without boominess or distortion. The subwoofer contains a powerful 1000 watt BASH power source, which turns itself on when there is a signal. In standby mode, this speaker uses only one half of one watt of power.

When listening accompanied by the other ELAC Debut speakers, there is a smooth, seamless transition from all the channels and frequencies. Truly a complete sound system well worth the price. The old expression, 'you only get what you paid for' is now obsolete. Here you are not getting what you paid for, but a whole lot more.

What sub did you have prior to this S12eq?
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post #316 of 2675 Old 11-12-2015, 11:22 AM
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Has anyone who owns or has listened to the ELAC B6's compared them to the Polk Audio RTi A3 speakers which would be comparable between the two lines?

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post #317 of 2675 Old 11-12-2015, 12:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pacodutaco View Post
Has anyone who owns or has listened to the ELAC B6's compared them to the Polk Audio RTi A3 speakers which would be comparable between the two lines?
Elac B6
Frequency response: 44 to 20,000 Hz
Nominal impedance: 6 Ω
Sensitivity: 87 dB at 2.83 v/1m

Polk RTI A3
frequency response 50-26,000 Hz (-3dB)
8-ohm impedance
sensitivity 89 dB


Price point I think the B6 is a steal for a set less than $300 as the Polky are over $300
Also the bottom bass is by spec is little more deeper on the B6's.

At this price range, why not try both and keep the one you prefer after a demo?

Crutchfield has a good return policy, and I am sure Newegg does to if you would like to return the polks in the trial period.

Last edited by Shift; 11-12-2015 at 12:21 PM.
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post #318 of 2675 Old 11-12-2015, 01:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shift View Post
Elac B6
Frequency response: 44 to 20,000 Hz
Nominal impedance: 6 Ω
Sensitivity: 87 dB at 2.83 v/1m

Polk RTI A3
frequency response 50-26,000 Hz (-3dB)
8-ohm impedance
sensitivity 89 dB


Price point I think the B6 is a steal for a set less than $300 as the Polky are over $300
Also the bottom bass is by spec is little more deeper on the B6's.

At this price range, why not try both and keep the one you prefer after a demo?

Crutchfield has a good return policy, and I am sure Newegg does to if you would like to return the polks in the trial period.

You make a good point but before I go to the trouble of buying two pairs of speakers to test them out and return one set, I am just looking for info from people who have experienced both. It may not be worth doing to start with.

Also, according to http://www.polkaudio.com/rtia3/d/1012 the specs you quoted on the Polk are incorrect. They list them as:

Polk RTI A3
frequency response 40Hz-27kHz
8 ohms
Sensitivity 89 dB

Compared to the ELAC B6's, which are $110 less, on paper at least, the Polk's win out on Frequency Response and Nominal Impedance. From what people are saying, crisp highs just aren't there with the B6's. This is why I am asking for feedback from folks that have heard them. I guess my real question is are the Polk's worth $110 more based on this and cosmetic differences? I don't plan on using a sub-woofer for my 10' x 10' room so frequency response is important to me to get a bit of bass in my music. I always heard it is better to use higher ohm speaker if you can. Would I be giving up much using a 6 ohm vs 8 ohm speaker in conjunction with a 50 w/ch 2.0 receiver?

As always, thanks for any responses I can get.

John

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post #319 of 2675 Old 11-12-2015, 01:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pacodutaco View Post
You make a good point but before I go to the trouble of buying two pairs of speakers to test them out and return one set, I am just looking for info from people who have experienced both. It may not be worth doing to start with.

Also, according to http://www.polkaudio.com/rtia3/d/1012 the specs you quoted on the Polk are incorrect. They list them as:

Polk RTI A3
frequency response 40Hz-27kHz
8 ohms
Sensitivity 89 dB
40Hz to 27Hz is probably at -10dB, where 50Hz to 26kHz is at -3dB. Also, with Polk this probably needs to be taken with a grain of salt. I don't see any data stating the +/-3dB measurement for the ELAC's though.
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post #320 of 2675 Old 11-12-2015, 01:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mark.hayes0338 View Post
40Hz to 27Hz is probably at -10dB, where 50Hz to 26kHz is at -3dB. Also, with Polk this probably needs to be taken with a grain of salt. I don't see any data stating the +/-3dB measurement for the ELAC's though.
I do know Chris said in a video he was keeping their numbers in reality even though they may not look as attractive as some others that advertise exaggerated specs...
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post #321 of 2675 Old 11-12-2015, 03:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pacodutaco View Post
You make a good point but before I go to the trouble of buying two pairs of speakers to test them out and return one set, I am just looking for info from people who have experienced both. It may not be worth doing to start with.

Also, according to http://www.polkaudio.com/rtia3/d/1012 the specs you quoted on the Polk are incorrect. They list them as:

Polk RTI A3
frequency response 40Hz-27kHz
8 ohms
Sensitivity 89 dB

Compared to the ELAC B6's, which are $110 less, on paper at least, the Polk's win out on Frequency Response and Nominal Impedance. From what people are saying, crisp highs just aren't there with the B6's. This is why I am asking for feedback from folks that have heard them. I guess my real question is are the Polk's worth $110 more based on this and cosmetic differences? I don't plan on using a sub-woofer for my 10' x 10' room so frequency response is important to me to get a bit of bass in my music. I always heard it is better to use higher ohm speaker if you can. Would I be giving up much using a 6 ohm vs 8 ohm speaker in conjunction with a 50 w/ch 2.0 receiver?

As always, thanks for any responses I can get.

John
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post #322 of 2675 Old 11-12-2015, 04:44 PM
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Moved the JBL 530 woofer pop subject to the JBL Owner's Thread. Did some additional testing today and posted results there.
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post #323 of 2675 Old 11-14-2015, 02:55 PM
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I just hooked up my B5's and C5 yesterday. I've spent about 2 hours listening and played a few movie selections. So far I'm impressed. I wouldn't call myself an audiophile but I like quality products and am picky about sound. I've listened to and owned a few speakers ranging from Salk Songtowers and Wow1's to Wharfedale Diamond 10.1s, Paradigm, Totem, Kef's, PSB's, etc. I would say these would easily compete and sound better than many speakers I've heard for over $500. I still have my Wharfedales and will probably hook them up for a side-by-side comparison. I use my Wharfedales with my Peachtree Nova 125 and it sounds good, dynamic, but not as detailed and open as the Elacs, and I'm just using a Pioneer SC1323 receiver with the Elacs. Curious to hear them with the Peachtree. Sure, they're not perfect and they're not in the same league as the Salks, which were wonderful, but unless you're doing critical listening these are highly enjoyable and would meet 90% of most people's needs in my opinion. I do like them more than the LSA .5's I used to have, which sounded a bit veiled and restrained compared to these (but those were gorgeous to look at). The fit and finish on these is good for their price. The cabinets aren't the most solid, but the sound is tight for such a resonant box. I'm thinking these would be amazing in a better cabinet. The look is clean and modern and I like the gray vinyl wrap better than fake wood or matte black, but it is on the masculine/modern side. The only issue is that I'm either hearing some sibilance or something is wrong with one of the tweeters. When I hooked them up I first played Melody Gardot and there seemed to be a ringing sound from the right speaker. I couldn't hear it during movies, but just in the higher frequency vocals at higher volume. I was going to swap L/R speakers to see if the ringing followed the speaker, but I just sat down and I'm listening again and I'm not hearing it. Maybe they needed a little break in, but I'll keep listening and testing. The imaging, detail, texture is excellent for the money. It sounds like music is coming from the C%, but its off right now. The bass is tight and detailed. I was going to get the B6's but since I have a sub I figured the B5's are enough, and so far they are. The tweeters are surprisingly not harsh, maybe a slight touch bright, but very good and not fatiguing. For movies, I'm impressed. I've used a Paradigm Cinema 70 system for years and they were fine, but no mids and a bit bright. The Elac system is my front stage and I'm using the Paradigms for surrounds. I have a Reaction Audio sub, forget which model but it was one of the early builds with opposing 12" drivers and I think 500w. Its more than enough sound. Played the opening scene to Avengers and even though my kids have seen it many times my 3 boys were all riveted like they hadn't seen it before. They all had a few "wow's" and "that sounds amazing" that they hadn't said before.

In the next few days I'm hoping to test them against my Wharfedale Diamond 10.1's using my Peachtree Nova 125. If the ringing continues I'll swap L/R speakers and if it is a bad tweeter I may just try the F5's since I hate speaker stands. I also have to exchange the C5 because the corner was damaged in shipping, but that happens. If you're getting into HiFi and want a great starting speaker these are hard to beat.
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post #324 of 2675 Old 11-14-2015, 03:55 PM
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Speakers with a quiet mid range is one of my biggest pet peeves for home theater.
Hope they work out for you.
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post #325 of 2675 Old 11-14-2015, 05:46 PM
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Originally Posted by abd1 View Post
In the next few days I'm hoping to test them against my Wharfedale Diamond 10.1's using my Peachtree Nova 125.

Nice reveiw. I really look forward to hearing what you have to say when comparing the ELAC B5's and Wharfedale Diamond 10.1's. Both are on my short list when it comes to my next speaker purchase that I will be making very soon. I can't wait!

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post #326 of 2675 Old 11-16-2015, 08:48 AM
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First problems... Loud Dolby Surround musical passages have caused my Denon to go into protection mode. (Master volume around -14 dB) Note that I have thus far had no problems on 5-channel video sources, largely because the surrounds are so lightly used, I suspect.) And I've run the F5s at -2 dB though some pretty loud orchestral crescendi, so 2 channel appears to be no problem. I'm trying to decide whether to try upgrading the receiver or repurposing the B5 surrounds and getting something more efficient back there. I haven't played any loud BluRays yet, so I'm not sure whether this is just a DSU music issue or a generic shortage in wattage on five channel material. Thoughts welcome...

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post #327 of 2675 Old 11-16-2015, 09:18 AM
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Wink Where ELAC Debut is produced

For those who wondered where the loudspeakers are produced. Andrew brings in his knowledge and network capital into ELAC:

"Jones said the Debut Series speakers and subs are being built in the same factory in China as Jones used to make the Pioneer speakers and subs. He has a long working relationship with the factory techs, so the Pioneer-to-ELAC transition was super-smooth. Jones could communicate exactly what he wanted when going from making prototypes to full production."
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post #328 of 2675 Old 11-16-2015, 11:18 AM
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Originally Posted by jsfalk View Post
First problems... Loud Dolby Surround musical passages have caused my Denon to go into protection mode. (Master volume around -14 dB) Note that I have thus far had no problems on 5-channel video sources, largely because the surrounds are so lightly used, I suspect.) And I've run the F5s at -2 dB though some pretty loud orchestral crescendi, so 2 channel appears to be no problem. I'm trying to decide whether to try upgrading the receiver or repurposing the B5 surrounds and getting something more efficient back there. I haven't played any loud BluRays yet, so I'm not sure whether this is just a DSU music issue or a generic shortage in wattage on five channel material. Thoughts welcome...

Apologies if you already checked this, but check to see if any exposed speaker cable is touching anything, like other cables, or terminals. (Check both receiver end, and speaker end). Even a "wayward" strand or two can cause a problem. Hopefully that is your problem, and you don't have to buy a new receiver!
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post #329 of 2675 Old 11-16-2015, 11:40 AM
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I've now had the B6 pair for a little over two weeks. I've gone back and forth on the high frequency capability and extension but, in the end, there is no way I'm returning these speakers.

The speakers or my ears may have needed some time to break in a bit but I'm now happy with the high frequency performance. I happen to have a rather gentle sounding DAC/amp combo (Peachtree/NAD) but when I connected the B6's to a Wyred 4 Sound integrated and DAC, the high end was very extended; actually too much for me.

I paid $279 for these to my door and I'm 100% certain Andrew Jones and ELAC have again raised the threshold for quality and price.

I plan to save up to buy the center and a sub at some point.
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post #330 of 2675 Old 11-16-2015, 11:40 AM
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I've now had the B6 pair for a little over two weeks. I've gone back and forth on the high frequency capability and extension but, in the end, there is no way I'm returning these speakers.

The speakers or my ears may have needed some time to break in a bit but I'm now happy with the high frequency performance. I happen to have a rather gentle sounding DAC/amp combo (Peachtree/NAD) but when I connected the B6's to a Wyred 4 Sound integrated and DAC, the high end was very extended; actually too much for me.

I paid $279 for these to my door and I'm 100% certain Andrew Jones and ELAC have again raised the threshold for quality and price.

I plan to save up to buy the center and a sub at some point.
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