RAAL tweeter missing crispness, clarity, presence, and detail? - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
Forum Jump: 
 29Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 52 Old 12-16-2015, 05:40 AM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Michael79's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 138
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 117 Post(s)
Liked: 15
RAAL tweeter missing crispness, clarity, presence, and detail?

Has anyone else heard a speaker with a RAAL tweeter and found it to be missing crispness, clarity, presence, and detail, or is it just me?

I took a leap of faith and ordered speakers with RAAL tweeters after reading so many people sing their praises. I finally had a chance to get them setup, and I think I'm disappointed not only relative to different types of speakers I've heard in store show rooms, but even the much less expensive non-RAAL bookshelves I setup at the same time as surrounds.

The highs are there, they just seem less alive and present, and are instead somehow duller and more subdued. Speakers I heard at the store had soaring voices, cymbals you could hear shimmer as if they were in the room, and a stereo soundstage that transported me somewhere else and made listening an experience.

I'd blame the acoustics in my room, but when I listen closely to the non-RAAL speakers in the same room, which cost significantly less, I hear the crispness my RAAL speakers seem to be lacking.

Has anyone else heard RAAL speakers and observed the same, or am I "doing it wrong" somehow?

Note: None or the above is meant to insult anyone's prodcut, preference, etc. I am merely seeking others' impressions/experience so I can determine whether what I've observed is a known characterstic to help inform my decision whether to try to learn to love them or return them.

Last edited by Michael79; 12-16-2015 at 05:47 AM.
Michael79 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 52 Old 12-16-2015, 06:19 AM
Advanced Member
 
HOTDIGITY's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: SouthWest of Cleveland, OH
Posts: 781
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 114 Post(s)
Liked: 89
Since their are only a handful of speakers available with the RAAL ribbon, especially in bookshelf/monitor form, we can narrow down the contenders


I think I know what you are experiencing. I currently have Ascend Sierra-2's which I converted from the NrT tweeters. The NrT's were crisp, airy and very dynamic. I was not sure what the RAAL upgrade would bring to the table compared to them. While the RAALs don't have, how can I put this.....an "Etched", or "Boosted" type of presence that a lot of conventional tweeters can have where the detail/crispness is in your face, the RAAL's give what is best described as a natural, relaxed presentation. The detail is there, even more so than the NrT, without "Sounding" as if it is being boosted by the speaker tuning. Your ears will (or at least my ears did) thank you for the non-fatiguing nature of the ribbons. Do a little test. Listen to sounds around you during your day, specifically how voices sound. Are they "Crisp" & "Airy"? Do they have "Bite" or are they "Smooth"? If they are more akin to how the dome tweeter sounds rather than the RAALs then by all means stick with the domes if you prefer. We all have our preferences. For me it was a no brainer.


BTW, I had a pair of Wavecrest Audio HVL-1's hooked up in place of the Sierra-2's to see how they sound. Very nice, especially at $199/pr. Their Silk dome tweeters sound very nice in typical Ascend Acoustics-like fashion. Not fatiguing with good extension and detail. They cannot touch the RAAL in their natural presentation, clarity, detail and dynamic capability. They are really good though. There's just no way they can realistically compete with the RAAL, which has only one moving part.....the ribbon element. In the end you must trust your ears and keep what you like.
monkuboy likes this.
HOTDIGITY is offline  
post #3 of 52 Old 12-16-2015, 06:23 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
smurraybhm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Down South
Posts: 4,633
Mentioned: 20 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2291 Post(s)
Liked: 3127
Quote:
Originally Posted by HOTDIGITY View Post
I currently have Ascend Sierra-2's which I converted from the NrT tweeters. The NrT's were crisp, airy and very dynamic. I was not sure what the RAAL upgrade would bring to the table compared to them. While the RAALs don't have, how can I put this.....an "Etched", or "Boosted" type of presence that a lot of conventional tweeters can have where the detail/crispness is in your face, the RAAL's give what is best described as a natural, relaxed presentation. The detail is there, even more so than the NrT, without "Sounding" as if it is being boosted by the speaker tuning. Your ears will (or at least my ears did) thank you for the non-fatiguing nature of the ribbons. Do a little test. Listen to sounds around you during your day, specifically how voices sound. Are they "Crisp" & "Airy"? Do they have "Bite" or are they "Smooth"? If they are more akin to how the dome tweeter sounds rather than the RAALs then by all means stick with the domes if you prefer. We all have our preferences. For me it was a no brainer.
Nice writeup, I would just add what Dave has posted on the Ascend website regarding the RAAL upgrade. Some may find it helpful as well.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf Ascend Sierra Ribbon Tower(4).pdf (151.6 KB, 388 views)

There is no perfect display, quit looking for faults and enjoy

LG OLED 65” B7 and 55” C8
Ascend's with RAAL, Love my PSA v1800 and a 7.2.4 speaker config, Oppo 203 and other stuff
smurraybhm is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 52 Old 12-16-2015, 06:37 AM
Advanced Member
 
HOTDIGITY's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: SouthWest of Cleveland, OH
Posts: 781
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 114 Post(s)
Liked: 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by smurraybhm View Post
Nice writeup, I would just add what Dave has posted on the Ascend website regarding the RAAL upgrade. Some may find it helpful as well.
Nice find.....thanks!
HOTDIGITY is offline  
post #5 of 52 Old 12-16-2015, 09:14 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Elihawk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Iowa City, Iowa
Posts: 6,015
Mentioned: 30 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1893 Post(s)
Liked: 2017
First, as stated there are not that many speakers with true RAAL tweeter. Second, there are several tweeters that are similar, but not true Ribbon tweeter. AMT tweeters, Leaf tweeters, etc...

I have only heard the Philharmonic RAAL Ribbon tweeters (Phil Slims, which my brother owns and Phil-BMR, which I own) and they are excellent. Absolutely crystal clear detail and Clarity, so that you can hear individual strokes of instruments, etc and yet, not one bit bright! I am not sure what the OP means by "presence", but my RAAL is there and speakinng too me, and with a clarity that I have never heard from any other tweeter.
Cvetan1 likes this.

Set up #1: EMP e5Ti, e5Ci, and EMP e5Bi surrounds, Outlaw LFM1 Plus sub, SVS NSD SB12 sub, Marantz Slimeline 1504 AV receiver
Set up #2: Def Tech SM450, CLR2002, SLS Qline surrounds and EMPtek10i10i sub, Denon 1910 AV receiver
Set up #3: Philharmonics- BMR in a 2.0 system, music only, Yamaha RXV-363 AV receiver
Elihawk is offline  
post #6 of 52 Old 12-16-2015, 09:40 AM
AVS Forum Addicted Member
 
cschang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Manhattan Beach, CA
Posts: 15,010
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 181 Post(s)
Liked: 188
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elihawk View Post
....Second, there are several tweeters that are similar, but not true Ribbon tweeter. AMT tweeters, Leaf tweeters, etc...
This can not be emphasized enough...in fact, I might even replace similar to "seem similar". No other tweeter has a lower mass to surface area ratio. This is basically how the RAAL achieves its superior transient response and detail.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael79 View Post
The highs are there, they just seem less alive and present, and are instead somehow duller and more subdued. Speakers I heard at the store had soaring voices, cymbals you could hear shimmer as if they were in the room, and a stereo soundstage that transported me somewhere else and made listening an experience.
Yes...this is the first impression of many, especially if you like treble emphasis. RAALs are extremely transparent and natural, with the most detail I have heard from a tweeter, without the need of any emphasis.

It is definitely not everyone's preference, but it is the best tweeter I have heard..for me.

-curtis
Owner of Wavecrest Audio
Volunteer Mod at the Ascend Acoustics Forum
Like all things on the Internet, do your research, as forums have a good amount of misinformation.
Help beat breast cancer!

Last edited by cschang; 12-16-2015 at 09:48 AM.
cschang is offline  
post #7 of 52 Old 12-16-2015, 10:19 AM
Newbie
 
Benj805's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Oxnard, California
Posts: 9
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)
Liked: 2
When I first hooked up my Sierra 2's, my initial impression was that the high's sounded terrible. Then I realized that I forgot to remove the magnetic covers protecting the ribbons during shipment. I didn't notice because the grills were on. I just wanted to throw that out there just in case.
cschang and dsrussell like this.
Benj805 is offline  
post #8 of 52 Old 12-16-2015, 10:34 AM
Advanced Member
 
HOTDIGITY's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: SouthWest of Cleveland, OH
Posts: 781
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 114 Post(s)
Liked: 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benj805 View Post
When I first hooked up my Sierra 2's, my initial impression was that the high's sounded terrible. Then I realized that I forgot to remove the magnetic covers protecting the ribbons during shipment. I didn't notice because the grills were on. I just wanted to throw that out there just in case.

Excellent point! Nothing can alter the sound of a tweeter like blocking it entirely with a cover!!
beaveav likes this.
HOTDIGITY is offline  
post #9 of 52 Old 12-16-2015, 12:18 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Michael79's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 138
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 117 Post(s)
Liked: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benj805 View Post
When I first hooked up my Sierra 2's, my initial impression was that the high's sounded terrible. Then I realized that I forgot to remove the magnetic covers protecting the ribbons during shipment. I didn't notice because the grills were on. I just wanted to throw that out there just in case.
I removed the protective wrapping from under the grill, but didn't notice anything removable from on top of the tweeter. I will be very happy if it turns out I overlooked said cover and it changes the sound signficantly. Unfortunately I won't be able to check until tomorrow.

Can you describe the difference removing the cover made?
Michael79 is offline  
post #10 of 52 Old 12-16-2015, 12:43 PM
Advanced Member
 
HOTDIGITY's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: SouthWest of Cleveland, OH
Posts: 781
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 114 Post(s)
Liked: 89
Here's two pics I snapped while doing the upgrade on my Sierra's.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	RAAL W-Cover.jpg
Views:	843
Size:	58.0 KB
ID:	1124282   Click image for larger version

Name:	RAAL No cover.jpg
Views:	829
Size:	50.3 KB
ID:	1124290  
HOTDIGITY is offline  
post #11 of 52 Old 12-16-2015, 12:51 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Michael79's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 138
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 117 Post(s)
Liked: 15
Thanks, Hotdigity. I don't recall anything like that covering the tweeter, unfortunately. Rats, I really had my hopes up that there was a simple change I could make that would unlock the speakers' full potential.
Michael79 is offline  
post #12 of 52 Old 12-16-2015, 12:58 PM
Advanced Member
 
HOTDIGITY's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: SouthWest of Cleveland, OH
Posts: 781
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 114 Post(s)
Liked: 89
Are we talking about Ascend speakers?
HOTDIGITY is offline  
post #13 of 52 Old 12-16-2015, 01:59 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Dennis Murphy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,691
Mentioned: 39 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 957 Post(s)
Liked: 1491
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael79 View Post
Thanks, Hotdigity. I don't recall anything like that covering the tweeter, unfortunately. Rats, I really had my hopes up that there was a simple change I could make that would unlock the speakers' full potential.

You're absolutely certain this is a RAAL? If it is, and if it's one of my speakers, please e-mail me so we can straighten this out.
Dennis Murphy is offline  
post #14 of 52 Old 12-16-2015, 02:17 PM
Senior Member
 
ien2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Oahu
Posts: 320
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 55 Post(s)
Liked: 70
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dennis Murphy View Post
You're absolutely certain this is a RAAL? If it is, and if it's one of my speakers, please e-mail me so we can straighten this out.
This.

There is the possibility of damage in shipping or something like that, maybe even defective. As was said above, the list of places that use the RAAL's is rather short and all of them (that I'm aware of anyways) have excellent customer service. I'd suggest contacting them and work with them to see if there's an actual problem with the tweeters.
ien2 is offline  
post #15 of 52 Old 12-16-2015, 02:28 PM
Advanced Member
 
Ascend's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: San Clemente, CA
Posts: 810
Mentioned: 20 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 188 Post(s)
Liked: 519
Same here Michael79, if our speakers -- please don't hesitate to give us a call.


That said, regardless of the manufacturer, if you set the system up using any form of Auto-EQ (like Audyssey for example), turn it completely off and then have a listen. I have found, through extensive experience with RAAL ribbons, that these auto-eq systems typically rolloff the highs way too much with ribbon tweeters. This might be due to the different dispersion characteristics compared to domes, or the much faster settling times.


In any case, you are in good hands.
BuddTX, Shadowed and unretarded like this.

David Fabrikant

audio professional and soft spoken representative of www.AscendAcoustics.com

Ascend is offline  
post #16 of 52 Old 12-16-2015, 02:40 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
grasshoppers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: aridzona
Posts: 3,730
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 952 Post(s)
Liked: 699
'Mystery' speakers....LOL
The suspense is killing me!

(Main)-Marantz 6012*Outlaw Audio M2200*Rythmik F12 subs*Paradigm Signature S6,C1,S1
******Harman Kardon DMC1000 (music)-Assassin HTPC (movies).
(Bedroom)-Marantz SR5003*Paradigm Studio 40,SE Center,SE One*SVS SB-2000 subs*Sony S6200
(Music room)-Outlaw Audio RR2150*Sierra Two ribbon speakers*Rythmik L12 sub*Yamaha CDR-HD1500
grasshoppers is offline  
post #17 of 52 Old 12-16-2015, 07:10 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
darthray's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Cold lake Alberta Canada
Posts: 6,280
Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2097 Post(s)
Liked: 2984
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dennis Murphy View Post
You're absolutely certain this is a RAAL? If it is, and if it's one of my speakers, please e-mail me so we can straighten this out.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ascend View Post
Same here Michael79, if our speakers -- please don't hesitate to give us a call.


That said, regardless of the manufacturer, if you set the system up using any form of Auto-EQ (like Audyssey for example), turn it completely off and then have a listen. I have found, through extensive experience with RAAL ribbons, that these auto-eq systems typically rolloff the highs way too much with ribbon tweeters. This might be due to the different dispersion characteristics compared to domes, or the much faster settling times.


In any case, you are in good hands.
Quote:
Originally Posted by grasshoppers View Post
'Mystery' speakers....LOL
The suspense is killing me!

I agree, knowing the brand might help.


I never heard the RAAL ribbons.
But this is the first time, I see someone not happy, they always had outstanding review for music.


It could be a personal preference in sound and more than likely is.
When I first got my Aperion, I thought the sound was a little bit more subdue, after a while you find you have more details, just not over done to impress.


I believe the RAAL fall in the same category.
Not for soft dome versus ribbons, just a different preference in sound.


Ray
darthray is offline  
post #18 of 52 Old 12-16-2015, 07:36 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Cvetan1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Bloomington, IL
Posts: 1,015
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 36 Post(s)
Liked: 50
First time I've seen a complaint. Unless something was faulty.

I have Salk VST's and the RAAL is what makes it sing. Night and day difference to me from a conventional dome.
Cvetan1 is offline  
post #19 of 52 Old 12-16-2015, 07:43 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
darthray's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Cold lake Alberta Canada
Posts: 6,280
Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2097 Post(s)
Liked: 2984
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cvetan1 View Post
First time I've seen a complaint. Unless something was faulty.

I have Salk VST's and the RAAL is what makes it sing. Night and day difference to me from a conventional dome.

Me too.
This is why, I think it might be a preference in sound has my previous post.
Also two faulty driver, instead of one is very unlikely.


Ray
darthray is offline  
post #20 of 52 Old 12-16-2015, 08:12 PM
Senior Member
 
t1337Dude's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 397
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 189 Post(s)
Liked: 136
Can't say I share your opinion. RAAL tweeters are easily some of the best I've ever heard, and I've done my fair share of auditioning at my local A/V shop. Your ears simply might just prefer a different type of tweeter - not everyone's ears and hearing are the same so there's no reason why everyone should have the same favorites. I've said it before and I've said it again - they present some of the crispest highs I've ever heard with the least fatiguing sound signature I've ever heard. For me they strike that perfect balance between being relaxed and present. They're pretty neutral sounding I believe so your ears might prefer a brighter sounding tweeter. Having said that, it's hard to imagine anyone being disappointed with them - reviewers very often think they're the most stand-out component in whatever speakers they're placed in.

Last edited by t1337Dude; 12-16-2015 at 08:15 PM.
t1337Dude is online now  
post #21 of 52 Old 12-16-2015, 08:15 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Elihawk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Iowa City, Iowa
Posts: 6,015
Mentioned: 30 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1893 Post(s)
Liked: 2017
Hard to trouble shoot for you, since you don't seem to want to mention the speaker...
1. You have something very wrong with your set up, like something covering your tweeter. Please check the manufacture set up conditions. When I got my Phil- BMR speakers, Dennis made it very clear that the RAAL was covered to protect it during shipping. Sounds like Ascend Acoust also covers their RAAL tweeter during shipping, based on HOTDIGGITY's post and photos.
2. You have a or two defective ribbon tweeters and need to speak to the person(s) who sold you the speaker.
3. Room reflections, set up issues or defective electronics are prevents your ribbon from producing sound with clarity and detail!

Set up #1: EMP e5Ti, e5Ci, and EMP e5Bi surrounds, Outlaw LFM1 Plus sub, SVS NSD SB12 sub, Marantz Slimeline 1504 AV receiver
Set up #2: Def Tech SM450, CLR2002, SLS Qline surrounds and EMPtek10i10i sub, Denon 1910 AV receiver
Set up #3: Philharmonics- BMR in a 2.0 system, music only, Yamaha RXV-363 AV receiver
Elihawk is offline  
post #22 of 52 Old 12-16-2015, 08:22 PM
Senior Member
 
t1337Dude's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 397
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 189 Post(s)
Liked: 136
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elihawk View Post
Hard to trouble shoot for you, since you don't seem to want to mention the speaker...
1. You have something very wrong with your set up, like something covering your tweeter. Please check the manufacture set up conditions. When I got my Phil- BMR speakers, Dennis made it very clear that the RAAL was covered to protect it during shipping. Sounds like Ascend Acoust also covers their RAAL tweeter during shipping, based on HOTDIGGITY's post and photos.
2. You have a or two defective ribbon tweeters and need to speak to the person(s) who sold you the speaker.
3. Room reflections, set up issues or defective electronics are prevents your ribbon from producing sound with clarity and detail!
Maybe he has Audyssey or similar equalizer on (or off and needs to turn it on)?
t1337Dude is online now  
post #23 of 52 Old 12-17-2015, 05:53 AM
Advanced Member
 
HOTDIGITY's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: SouthWest of Cleveland, OH
Posts: 781
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 114 Post(s)
Liked: 89
All of this assistance offered and now radio silence!


Michael79, where'd you go?!!


We are dying to know what speakers you have.
HOTDIGITY is offline  
post #24 of 52 Old 12-17-2015, 06:17 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
smurraybhm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Down South
Posts: 4,633
Mentioned: 20 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2291 Post(s)
Liked: 3127
Maybe he realized it wasn't a RAAL tweeter? Mysterious how one posts and disappears suddenly when the detailed questions begin.

Great to see Dave and Dennis jump in with offers to help if it turns out to be one of their speakers. A perfect example of what the right ID speaker maker brings to the table in regards to service/support, not just one of the staff either, but the guys who designed the speakers and own the business.
beaveav and unretarded like this.

There is no perfect display, quit looking for faults and enjoy

LG OLED 65” B7 and 55” C8
Ascend's with RAAL, Love my PSA v1800 and a 7.2.4 speaker config, Oppo 203 and other stuff
smurraybhm is online now  
post #25 of 52 Old 12-17-2015, 09:02 AM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Michael79's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 138
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 117 Post(s)
Liked: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by smurraybhm
Mysterious how one posts and disappears suddenly when the detailed questions begin.
I'm glad I wasn't tied up for a full day if not posting since 5 pm yesterday is enough to suggest I'm a fraud.

It is definitely a RAAL tweeter, and I checked when I got home late last night and there is nothing covering the tweeter under the grill. I hadn't mentioned the brand because I really didn't want it to sound like I was suggesting the brand is anything less than terrific. I had limited my post to the tweeter because the speaker manufacturer is clearly top notch based on everything I've seen and read, and I understand it really comes down to preference as several have said. My post was really meant to explore if others had had the same impression or if it was owing to my inexperience.

I don't want to leave anyone who has contributed to this thread hanging, but out of respect to the speaker manufacturer, who is evidently a living, breathing person as opposed to a monolithic global corporation like I'm used to dealing with, I want to reach out to them first (which I'd of done before starting this thread had I realized there were so few players in this space that my post suggested one of a handful of small companies).

I have no doubt they will help me when I do, and I'd rather my next update here be about solutions and not just more about the perceived "problem".

Thanks, everyone!
Michael79 is offline  
post #26 of 52 Old 12-17-2015, 09:22 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Cvetan1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Bloomington, IL
Posts: 1,015
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 36 Post(s)
Liked: 50
I don't believe saying who the speaker builder is calling them out on the RAAL tweeter issue? Sounds like a malfunction or setup issue, no dig on whoever it is. I can promise you to hear a properly setup, well executed RAAL system to be nothing but the finest you might ever hear.
Cvetan1 is offline  
post #27 of 52 Old 12-17-2015, 09:23 AM
Advanced Member
 
HOTDIGITY's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: SouthWest of Cleveland, OH
Posts: 781
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 114 Post(s)
Liked: 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael79 View Post
I'm glad I wasn't tied up for a full day if not posting since 5 pm yesterday is enough to suggest I'm a fraud.

It is definitely a RAAL tweeter, and I checked when I got home late last night and there is nothing covering the tweeter under the grill. I hadn't mentioned the brand because I really didn't want it to sound like I was suggesting the brand is anything less than terrific. I had limited my post to the tweeter because the speaker manufacturer is clearly top notch based on everything I've seen and read, and I understand it really comes down to preference as several have said. My post was really meant to explore if others had had the same impression or if it was owing to my inexperience.

I don't want to leave anyone who has contributed to this thread hanging, but out of respect to the speaker manufacturer, who is evidently a living, breathing person as opposed to a monolithic global corporation like I'm used to dealing with, I want to reach out to them first (which I'd of done before starting this thread had I realized there were so few players in this space that my post suggested one of a handful of small companies).

I have no doubt they will help me when I do, and I'd rather my next update here be about solutions and not just more about the perceived "problem".

Thanks, everyone!

Fair enough, Sir! At least you can take what's said here with a grain of salt. It's a bit surprising, though, that the manufacturer would've shipped them without the protective covers, unless it was another company other than those mentioned implementing the RAAL and do not use them.


Good luck and please post the outcome, whatever that may be.
HOTDIGITY is offline  
post #28 of 52 Old 12-17-2015, 09:32 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
smurraybhm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Down South
Posts: 4,633
Mentioned: 20 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2291 Post(s)
Liked: 3127
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael79 View Post
I'm glad I wasn't tied up for a full day if not posting since 5 pm yesterday is enough to suggest I'm a fraud.

I have no doubt they will help me when I do, and I'd rather my next update here be about solutions and not just more about the perceived "problem".

Thanks, everyone!
If you have spent time on AVS you will have seen more than a few members who post things or start threads merely to generate responses - the all things sound the same being the most famous or start a thread about Emotiva either good/bad and stand clear. I am by no means implying this for you, it just happens unfortunately and trying to explain the where's Waldo comment. Hey, but we are glad you back and none too soon

I would disagree with not posting who the made the speakers, besides getting help from whoever put them together there are likely to be owners - maybe even me - who with some more information regarding your setup (like Dave suggested a possible issue with Audyssey), listening environment and music/movie choices could help walk you through some things to try as well. Most of us on AVS realize what sounds good to us may not always sound good to the other person. Look at my signature, I have a few different types of tweeters in my system and will admit to still having a fondness for the original Sierra 1 with is soft dome tweeter, not that I'm giving up my speakers with RAAL tweeters. Different stokes for different folks - its more than okay if you decide you like a tweeter other than a RAAL, you wouldn't be the first or the last. Good luck and keep us posted please. Steve

There is no perfect display, quit looking for faults and enjoy

LG OLED 65” B7 and 55” C8
Ascend's with RAAL, Love my PSA v1800 and a 7.2.4 speaker config, Oppo 203 and other stuff
smurraybhm is online now  
post #29 of 52 Old 12-17-2015, 03:09 PM
Senior Member
 
Henry Lambert's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 240
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 63 Post(s)
Liked: 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by HOTDIGITY View Post
Fair enough, Sir! At least you can take what's said here with a grain of salt. It's a bit surprising, though, that the manufacturer would've shipped them without the protective covers, unless it was another company other than those mentioned implementing the RAAL and do not use them.


Good luck and please post the outcome, whatever that may be.
My Sierra 2's did not have any covers on the tweeters. I have had mine for two years now. IMO, they are one of the best speakers I have ever heard.
Henry Lambert is offline  
post #30 of 52 Old 12-17-2015, 03:40 PM
Advanced Member
 
Ascend's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: San Clemente, CA
Posts: 810
Mentioned: 20 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 188 Post(s)
Liked: 519
This thread is funny, everyone waiting in suspense... Considering the amount of RAAL ribbons that we sell compared to other companies, the chances are that the OP is one of our customers. Which it turned out that he is.


He is a real nice guy but is fairly new to this level of audio and, without question, there are some issue with his setup - which we started to discuss.


In my experience with these ribbons, the consumers that are "blown away" are the ones that have more experience with high end audio, not the ones just jumping right in. With today's typical sources, digital files, earbuds, insane volume levels at movies theaters and concerts - the subtleness, transparency and detail of RAAL ribbons often takes a bit of getting used to before one can learn to truly critically listen and appreciate what these tweeters are capable of.


If I recall, there was another thread similar to this one several months ago... And as the listener started to actually spend more time listening, the more he started to prefer the speakers with the ribbons. He then even started to bring in other highly regarded speakers to compare and even after that -- still ended up keeping the Ascend ribbon speakers...


Now - it could also be that the OP prefers the more forward and aggressive nature of domes, and that is OK too. It will take some time to figure out but either way, the OP knows we are behind him 100%.


Sorry if I killed all of the suspense, but Happy Holidays to all!

David Fabrikant

audio professional and soft spoken representative of www.AscendAcoustics.com

Ascend is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply Speakers

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off