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Trying different wiring

3K views 111 replies 20 participants last post by  markrubin 
#1 ·
So I wanted to see if anyone does anything different that they think makes a difference. I've gone through a few different combinations over the years.

I'm sure some will post that high end cables is a waste of money or it sounds no different. Definitely not the case I've found! Right now I'm using kimber in a few rooms. Speaker wire is kimber 8vs and 12vs. Yesterday I removed jumpers and made my own. One room I did kimber 4vs and the other I did kimber 8vs. 8vs is probably overkill. Lol

After doing it I noticed a few things. It sounds a little different. Not like omg everyone needs to try this because it changed everything. Just sounds better. More focused and better depth. Just sounds cleaner especially loud. I even took them out and put factory jumpers in and I could hear a difference. I even did a Spl check on the speakers I did the new jumpers for. They were .5 db louder now. Which is strange and not explainable. I've noticed before when biwire or biamp was done that they were louder too. This is a gain thing not that my speakers get louder than before. Just louder faster. Slightly

I'll include a few other pictures of bi wiring on a adcom 7605 to definitive 7001. Also biwiring clr2000 with a single 8vs. Tried it for fun but went back to a single wire to my other adcom 7805. Was just to hard to pull 7805 out to wire like this. Also when you shotgun double runs like that there is a lot of speaker wire. Especially when your running dual 9awg runs.

Just wanted to see if anyone has tried any new things that they think helped them.
 

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#2 ·
Just wanted to see if anyone has tried any new things that they think helped them.
Scotch. It didn't help but I didn't care.

The list of audio tweaks is endless but not all, probably few, actually do something. Speaker wire is not on my list once it's large enough to do the job.
 
#5 ·
#4 ·
I've got a bunch from old Fulton Gold (silver-plated copper, forget the gauge but each conductor is about as big around as my thumb) to Monster Cable in various flavors (usually "thrown in" with speakers) to regular old lamp/zip cord from 16 to 10 AWG. I have some AQ and a few other "boutique" wires but none are in my current system. I have heard systems with Kimber cables but did not compare to see if there was any audible or measurable difference so no data for you, sorry. Last time I participated in a speaker cable comparison was decades ago and it basically showed that, unless you have very small or very large wires with pretty extreme loudspeaker impedance excursions and/or long runs, it is impossible to tell the difference in a blind test. As an engineer I fall more into the "wire is wire" camp unless you are talking RF/mW cables, and as an old Missouri boy "show me" is also at play. Too many times through the years some big difference went away the next day or under more careful testing, or the new sound I heard on some song that I'd never heard before, was still there when I switched back to the old wire (component, whatever).

Some tweaks actually worked, though sometimes there was system dependence (input shorting caps is an example that sometimes worked, sometimes not, but was rarely if ever audible), but many did not. Probably just my lousy system and hearing.
 
#6 ·
I've done all the reading and my family have been dealers for 50 years. I've heard 1$ cables to 10,000$ ones. Obviously you don't get a improved sound if you over spend. What's 400-500$ though when you've spent 50k.

Some would argue that a emotiva xpa5 sounds like my krell or even my adcom. Can't be further from the truth. I really didn't want to get into a thread of fighting.

Just wanted to see what people use. So if you could post what you are using and how you think it helps that's it. Just wanted to have a thread were people can feel comfortable about saying what they truthfully have. It's ok if you use monoprice or monster. The debate of people never trying or being skeptical will always be there. It's just sad that people want to fight over something they have never tried.

We have a local hifi get together and all 20 people know that better cables helps! Now with that being said I don't recommend spending $5000 on a set of super cables. Lol
 
#70 ·
LOL you started a thread about if speaker cables matter, that's going to start an argument haha. Most people here are probably using some monoprice cable or lamp cord or something else. I am using monoprice Access Series 14 gauge wires to my speakers. As has been proven time and time again as long as you run the proper gauge wire for the length of run and the amount of power your sending wire is wire. No need for fancy $100/foot or $1000/foot cable blessed by the pope and coated in unicorn blood and glitter.
 
#7 ·
So us the measurements that show a change from cheap wire to "cheap wire that you paid a lot for" and then I will believe it...otherwise, we have proven the placebo effect many times over.
 
#8 ·
Not super hard to understand what I asked for.

Not really sure what you're asking though. Hard to understand what you wrote????

Show graphs so you can understand sonic differences? You need me to post small sonic graphs?

Good luck with that.

If you want to share what you use please post. Otherwise ignore this thread it's not for you.
 
#9 ·
#10 ·
I use monoprice 14AWG wire.
https://www.amazon.ca/Monoprice-102...646305&sr=8-8&keywords=monoprice+speaker+wire
I'm sure that if I was to use the $12/foot Kimber wire you're advertising after running audyssey and properly positioning my speakers, I would have noticed a significant improvement in sound quality.
Have you ever look at the used market on thes cables? I just saw 3 8' 12vs kimber sell for $100 on eBay. Even terminated with wbt plugs. Like 4-5$ a foot of high quality cables. If I sold those I'd sell for $400-500. Not sure what he was thinking.

I use to buy bulk speaker wire. I'd spend $50-100 on 100' or 50'. Than I'd spend $20-40 on bananas. In the end not a big price difference except you can resell the kimber. Hard to sell used monoprice or bjc or monster wire.

I just sold 3 audioquest rocket 44 for $400. I only paid $350. I used them for 2 years and made money. Rocket 44 were nice too.
 
#12 ·
I still feel like I overspent on the monoprice wire. I may consider spending $100+ on wire if I can ever afford a $25000 setup.
 
#13 ·
I don't spend a lot on cables but I wont use stranded cable. There are good technical reasons for that but nobody is really interested. It sounds like you know what you are doing.
 
#14 ·
#16 ·
#25 ·
I have xlo for front 3. bought long time ago. they do sound a little better than zip cord...not the price i paid for better tho.
 
#26 ·
Gene say one thing and does another. He uses same kimber kables as me. Uses high dollar interconnects as well. Monoprice is a big supporter of audioholics so he brings them up often.

His beloved speakers are even internally wired with kimber. Lol and gene loves it.

Very typical of audioholics. Say one thing and do another.
 
#32 ·
This thread is going sideways with people that just want to tell people to buy cheap wire. I'm sure none have tried better cables.

Parts express? I wouldn't pay anything for those!

Buy whatever makes you happy but spreading your own agenda to make yourself feel better is ridiculous.

I'm sure gene could get any cable he wants for free. He feels like his kimber 8vs make a difference. So he keeps them. Maybe we should ask him if he'll trade it straight up for some nice 10awg cables we can make from monoprice???
I bet he'll laugh and say hell no these are nice cables.

Rbh is highly regarded on avs. Why do they use kimber to wire their speakers? Much more expensive for sure than just cheap stuff.

Anyone live in Sacramento area we can go through 10 or so cables. Can even have someone do switches for blind testing. I've heard these cables for years. I bet I could hear 9/10 and be right on.

Bring your cheap cables or I might have some from 15-20 years ago when I didn't know any better.
 
#33 ·
I'm sure none have tried better cables.
I've tested quite a few, sent to me gratis looking for my endorsement. None were worth the price, so no endorsement.
Knowing that this forum calls BS when BS is presented you shouldn't be surprised at the reaction.
 
#46 ·
Tim, send your wires to Bill. He can do measurements on them versus some Home Depot wires of the same gauge. If he can show measurable differences, I will gladly say I am wrong and you are correct. Until you show me some science, I will continue to place this in the conspiracy theory category. And of course, you are entitled to your opinion and spend your money anyway you want. I am not so much trying to dispute that, but make sure the anyone new to the "sport" knows that spending more money on cables and wires will have zero benefit on Sound quality.
 
#39 ·
Lost respect for me or bill?

I didn't know who he was so I looked him up. Had a bunch of posts and been around for a long time. Saw that he has over 40,000 posts. A lot of posts.

I just didn't know why he needs to posts on avs if he has his own large forum.

Not really sure what I did wrong. Lol
 
#41 ·
Well, he recommended 14 gauge speaker wire from Parts Express, not some BS he's producing and selling. He's also, I believe, an electrical engineer and speaker designer. I'm taking his word for it over the dude who believed he could taste the difference between Mt Fuji water and Amazonian rain water, when they were both city tap water from a garden hose.
 
#40 ·
not arguing, bill does a great job helping with his 2 cents and education. i dont always agree with him, but he is consistent.
 
#42 ·
I wasn't trying to argue with him at all or you. Im sure he's very helpful and a great asset.

Just interesting that he pretty much said he's calling BS on me.

It's not bs to me and many enthusiasts. I've been doing this a long time too. I don't feel it's a waste of time. He also had nothing important to say in this thread or was helpful. He just wanted to say I was wasting money and need to get educated.

I did read through 4-5 of his posts and he does seem helpful to some. Just not this time.

I didn't mean to give him as you say "low blow" at all. Just a question for him. That's all
 
#48 ·
thread has gone to a place that is no help.

Perception is key!!!

Brand leaders love this too. BMW??? Aren't that great. Honda and Toyota not that reliable? Mercedes not built that well.

Your perception of BMW is your own. Mine is my own.

If you've made your point telling me and everyone that uses higher end cables that we are fools move on.

I'd like to have a real discussion about people's experience with their favorite wire.
 
#49 ·
Tim, last time I am posting in this thread, in fact, i will suggest that moderators close it, since the integrity of contributors is getting called into question.
This is a science forum, you are making a suggestion that can be tested scientifically...and in fact has been tested many times and each of the real science tests have shown no audible differences in measurements between cheap and not so cheap wire. Properly functioning wire of the correct gauge carries electrons equally as well if it cost 20 cents per foot and/or 20 dollars per foot. If you are suggesting you have some unique and new wire that has not been tested, well, I am asking you to back up your claims with some science. I am certain that Bill would test your wires if you sent him some...
Other than that, you are entitled to own your expensive wire, your opinion about that wire and whatever else you want to do. I am only posting because I want others to know that not everyone agrees and that they is NO science to back up the claims.
 
#50 ·
Ok. Point taken. I'm not going to send someone cables that are expensive. Especially people I've never met.

Life isn't always measured with science. I understand what forum we are on. If we all took science as the gospel the gospel wouldn't be here.

Also their are threads that have been discussed that show we maybe know 1% of total scientific truth. So if something comes out and changes that perception people try to say impossible. People still use optical or coax because they think it sounds better than hdmi.

People can have whatever they want. Also suggestion of closing thread because some don't care what you or bill or me are saying is comical.

Wonder why when we use standard 10awg wire we have to boost treble to get same response as kimber or audioquest. Kimber isn't changing the sound but keeping it to as close to perfect as possible. That cheap 10awg is degrading the sound. Also if you just listen at 80-90db the cables don't matter much. When you turn the current up at get loud it matters. I'm talking 115-120db.
 
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