KEF Q100 with Wharfedale 10.1 & RBH R5Bi - The 90% Question - Page 3 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #61 of 102 Old 01-26-2018, 10:03 AM
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No, I am very curious about the KEF speakers. I have never heard them at all. Am very much aware of Dennis's speakers as well. In fact, I have been looking at the BMR's for as long as I remember. Just working to pay some things off first before I pull the trigger. However, KEF has my full attention. Thanks for your insights. I have learned a lot from reading your posts. The same can be said about Zorba. You guys rock! Thanks!


Cheers,

Phil
I've found WhatHiFis subjective reviews to be spot on and comparing the $650 Q350s favorably to the $1000 Dynaudios is high praise indeed.
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post #62 of 102 Old 01-26-2018, 12:16 PM
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1/23

It was with considerable reluctance that I finally decided to return the KEFs to Best Buy, right on the last day of the half-month return period. I tried and tried to concoct various rationalizations to keep them, but in the end I just couldn’t do it. Why not? Because as much as I liked the superior detail, dynamics and imaging of the Q100, when I put the Wharfedales back in after 2 weeks of continuous listening to the KEFs, there was an immediate and visceral sense of “Ahhhhhh, now THAT’s what I’ve been missing!” This prolonged-exposure-to-one-speaker-then-sudden-switchback-to-another-speaker technique continues to be the most useful, in my experience.

As I noticed before in my previous speaker comparisons that included various models by Q-Acoustics, RBH, SVS, and Sony, the Wharfedales simply produce a combination of richness, smoothness and sweetness with my preferred musical genres that the KEFs just like the others simply could not compete with.

None of the other speakers had the effect of me wanting to sit and listen effortlessly for hours and hours. None of them produced music that created a palpable and indescribable EMOTIONAL response like the Wharfedales, even if they might have easily surpassed it in analytical performance categories (detail, dynamics, and imaging).

There is no denying that this is largely dependent on one’s personal preferences, musical tastes, usage habits, and of course, room acoustics.

If I listened to a lot of dynamic, high tempo music especially that with a lot of guitar, I am sure that I would have kept the KEFs and put the Wharfedales on Craigslist. As a couple of folks on this forum have remarked here and in other threads, the Q100s do amazing things with guitars, especially electric guitars---both the crunching Angus Young power chords and the more atmospheric, resonant Mark Knopfler variety, as well as general acoustic/classical guitar such as the Gypsy Kings and Andres Segovia. They also do very well with the likes of Dido due to their mid-bass punch and agility, which left my Wharfedales in the dust. (That said, neither speaker really requires a subwoofer during music listening.)

Yet the KEFs were not “bright” in terms of having screechy and irritating treble peaks like the SVS Primes, or worse, previous generation Klipsch. They didn’t make me grab the remote control to turn down the volume during musical peaks. However, I think it would be fair to say that their presentation is definitely “FORWARD”---the instruments certainly do seem dramatically closer to the listener. Everything just STANDS OUT.

This had its advantages and disadvantages, of course. Yes, I definitely could hear more of whatever was going on in each vocalist’s throat/mouth: the saliva/tongue noises, the lips parting in the half-second before the singing starts, their in-breaths and out-breaths throughout, etc. This was certainly arresting, since it almost never occurs with the Wharfedales. However, once the gee-whiz novelty wore off, the inevitable question comes up: is it actually NECESSARY, or even all that ENJOYABLE?

All I knew was, after about 30-60 minutes of listening to the KEFs at 70db or higher, I would find myself checking my watch. I would feel restless in my chair, and suddenly remember something or another that I just HAD to do, giving me an excuse to get up and otherwise move around. It might have been more psychological than physiological---because my physical EARS never felt “fatigued” in the regular sense of ringing, or being “tired” or “strained.” It was more as if my BRAIN was just saying, “Enough! Give me something else to process please, a different input. Distract me!”

The above is in marked contrast to the spontaneously relaxed-yet-absorbed, semi-hypnotic states that the Wharfedales very often trigger in me: namely, the experience of music as one organic, sensuous and continuous FLOW, wherein different notes and instruments and voices are constantly coming and going as a UNIFIED WHOLE, rather than as distinct BITS AND PIECES. This is impossible to truly convey in words, let alone empirically measure or verify. There are simply no specs for this. One thing is for sure: it is the direct opposite of ANALYTICAL listening.

Try this metaphor on for size: You could stand on a bridge watching the water flow past, noting the play of certain ripples, shadings and sparkles on the surface. Or, you could be dropped INTO the river, and happily drown in it without even noticing it.

===

Predictably, for movies the KEFs were excellent at making whatever that is happening onscreen that much more vivid and compelling, precisely because of their forward presentation and ample detail/dynamics. For anyone who mostly watches TV and movies, the KEFs are an impeccable choice, especially at the ridiculous $230/pair pricepoint.

I also tried a single Q100 as a center, first in vertical alignment and then on its side. As expected, there was no perceptible difference due to the concentric driver design, making it an ideal choice for a “matching” center if one were to go with the Q100s for the front L/R. Compared to previous centers I’ve had, there was no lack of voice clarity nor spaciousness. Male voices sounded as realistic as female voices, although I did notice that a single Wharfedale as the center produced richer male voices. Surprisingly, the soundstage was surprisingly of comparable scale, and overall detail/clarity was not that far apart. I am now very close to ordering another set of Wharfedales to use one as the center, unless Chane finally gets its act together and puts the A2.4 back on its website very soon, in which case my curiosity might get the better of me.

===

In a nutshell: I feel like I ran off with a stripper for two weeks.

She was definitely a head-turner, and probably coked up most of the time, which only made her that much hotter.

But in the end, it’s damn good to come home again.
Ha! Coked up hookers are fun ... for a while, but you don't want to bring them home.

Your experience mirrors my feelings about all these treble-enhanced speakers on the market. All that excessive detail overwhelms the natural balance of the music. The emotional component of the music is in the midrange, often lost in the drive for more treble and bass. I want to just be able to sit back and enjoy the music, without focusing on whether the cymbals shimmer (never understood that fascination).

Thanks for the tour!
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post #63 of 102 Old 01-26-2018, 12:51 PM
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I've found WhatHiFis subjective reviews to be spot on and comparing the $650 Q350s favorably to the $1000 Dynaudios is high praise indeed.
Thanks Geoff as that is good to know. However, now I am leaning more towards the Q350's. Right now, my budget will not allow me to make my move. Paying some things off before I do. No need in going into debt for a set of speakers. Soon I will own some KEF speakers!


Cheers,

Phil
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post #64 of 102 Old 01-26-2018, 01:18 PM
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Ha! Coked up hookers are fun ... for a while, but you don't want to bring them home.

Your experience mirrors my feelings about all these treble-enhanced speakers on the market. All that excessive detail overwhelms the natural balance of the music. The emotional component of the music is in the midrange, often lost in the drive for more treble and bass. I want to just be able to sit back and enjoy the music, without focusing on whether the cymbals shimmer (never understood that fascination).

Thanks for the tour!

I don't think I'd classify the Kefs as treble-enhanced speakers. Or at least not in the same way I would as Klipsch or Def tech I have heard. It's not like you listen and wonder where the lower frequencies are, or why everyone sounds like they were inhaling helium (a bit of an exaggeration there).

Basically 'forward', like Zorba mentioned, is how I'd describe them. What they are missing, if one's use is primarily music listening, is warmth or lushness... the Kefs do the detail thing great, and for certain types of music that's a plus.. for other types, maybe not (especially if source material isn't the greatest).

So for HT use, the Kefs work really well (to my ears)... for music, it'll depend on preference.
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post #65 of 102 Old 01-26-2018, 01:25 PM
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I don't think I'd classify the Kefs as treble-enhanced speakers. Or at least not in the same way I would as Klipsch or Def tech I have heard. It's not like you listen and wonder where the lower frequencies are, or why everyone sounds like the were inhaling helium (a bit of an exaggeration there).

Basically 'forward', like Zorba mentioned, is how I'd describe them. What they are missing, if one's use is primarily music listening, is warmth or lushness... the Kefs do the detail thing great, and for certain types of music that's a plus.. for other types, maybe not (especially if source material isn't the greatest).

So for HT use, the Kefs work really well (to my ears)... for music, it'll depend on preference.
agreed... imo, humbly, these are , after much listening not bright treble enhanced speakers... they are aimed at the many of us looking for accurate even toned speakers that reproduce guitar & other mid/ high toned music ... clearly different than my whaferdale 10.1s but just as pleasing (sometimes more) for certain music...my question to @Zorba922 and @RayGuy ... how do the qa 3020s compare?....
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post #66 of 102 Old 01-26-2018, 01:36 PM
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agreed... imo, humbly, these are , after much listening not bright treble enhanced speakers... they are aimed at the many of us looking for accurate even toned speakers that reproduce guitar & other mid/ high toned music ... clearly different than my whaferdale 10.1s but just as pleasing (sometimes more) for certain music...my question to @Zorba922 and @RayGuy ... how do the qa 3020s compare?....
One thing I noticed with the kefs, and my cantons as well, is that they aren't exactly forgiving with bad sources. But I think the main difference, and it depends a ton on the type of music being listened to, is that certain types of speakers may sound more musical (if warmer), while the kefs (and my cantons) at times can sound too analytical, almost like an audio scientist (whatever they are called) is replicating every single note, but is more interested in 100% accuracy vs the overall musical tone.

The water flowing past metaphor that Zorba mentioned seems pretty accurate to me. If I wanted speakers just for music listening, 100%, I'd probably want something a bit warmer. For HT or gaming use however, the kefs seem good to me. That shimmering cymbals comment earlier by RayGuy works really well for movies... that's when extra detail helps a lot.
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post #67 of 102 Old 01-26-2018, 02:57 PM - Thread Starter
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how do the qa 3020s compare?....
I think they are kind of in the middle ground, though the 3020s lean a little bit towards the Wharfedales at times than the Concept 20s which are slightly more neutral. The QAs don't really knock your socks off with dynamics nor with warmth, but they don't do anything BADLY. They are certainly more forgiving than the KEFs when it comes to poor sources, and I could listen to them a lot longer at a stretch than I could the KEFs.

So, if I had to recommend one speaker for a newbie who had no idea where his own tastes stood in the bright/warm spectrum, the QAs would be a very safe choice. Particularly if WAF is in play.

It's too bad that their 3090 center is rather lackluster...I would always recommend a mismatched center.
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post #68 of 102 Old 01-26-2018, 03:03 PM - Thread Starter
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The emotional component of the music is in the midrange, often lost in the drive for more treble and bass.
You might've nailed it right there.

Still, there's that little audio Lucifer sitting on my shoulder who keeps whispering, "Psssst! Pssst! Wuddabout THIS speaker or THAT speaker? Might it be able to DO IT ALL, both the top end dynamics/detail AND the midrange warmth and lushness?"

Reminds me of when I was in my 20s and 30s, and had a similar "Looking For The Perfect Woman" disease...sigh!
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~ Are you a "geek hobbyist" obsessed with squeezing out that last 5-10% improvement? The economy will thank you...especially the Chinese one. Or are you more of a get-set-and-forget "casual user" who simply wants to increase your enjoyment of movies, TV and gaming? Relax, HT isn't rocket science, nor does it have to cost an arm and a leg---especially if you ignore the aforementioned vocal minority. And remember to smile...it's just a silly hobby, after all. :)
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post #69 of 102 Old 01-26-2018, 03:33 PM
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You might've nailed it right there.

Still, there's that little audio Lucifer sitting on my shoulder who keeps whispering, "Psssst! Pssst! Wuddabout THIS speaker or THAT speaker? Might it be able to DO IT ALL, both the top end dynamics/detail AND the midrange warmth and lushness?"

Reminds me of when I was in my 20s and 30s, and had a similar "Looking For The Perfect Woman" disease...sigh!
Not sure that the perfect speaker exists. I've never heard one, although Maggies have a lot to recommend them, even they lack certain characteristics of that "live" sound. So, if we take it as a given that there is no reproducing "live", we then have to decide where we want to compromise, in women or in audio systems!

Also, I agree with your comment that the QA 3020 would be the perfect rec for the newbie. Not bright, but relatively detailed. Not warm, but present (that slight midrange bump). Not neutral, but can pass as such. Does nothing really wrong, and that's saying a lot at the price point it inhabits.
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post #70 of 102 Old 01-26-2018, 03:45 PM
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One thing I noticed with the kefs, and my cantons as well, is that they aren't exactly forgiving with bad sources. But I think the main difference, and it depends a ton on the type of music being listened to, is that certain types of speakers may sound more musical (if warmer), while the kefs (and my cantons) at times can sound too analytical, almost like an audio scientist (whatever they are called) is replicating every single note, but is more interested in 100% accuracy vs the overall musical tone.

The water flowing past metaphor that Zorba mentioned seems pretty accurate to me. If I wanted speakers just for music listening, 100%, I'd probably want something a bit warmer. For HT or gaming use however, the kefs seem good to me. That shimmering cymbals comment earlier by RayGuy works really well for movies... that's when extra detail helps a lot.
And therein lies the rub. Analytical is the polar opposite of emotional, and music listening SHOULD be an emotional experience! Like sex with someone you don't really care anything about, it can be fun the first few times, but ultimately an empty experience.
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I think they are kind of in the middle ground, though the 3020s lean a little bit towards the Wharfedales at times than the Concept 20s which are slightly more neutral. The QAs don't really knock your socks off with dynamics nor with warmth, but they don't do anything BADLY. They are certainly more forgiving than the KEFs when it comes to poor sources, and I could listen to them a lot longer at a stretch than I could the KEFs.

So, if I had to recommend one speaker for a newbie who had no idea where his own tastes stood in the bright/warm spectrum, the QAs would be a very safe choice. Particularly if WAF is in play.

It's too bad that their 3090 center is rather lackluster...I would always recommend a mismatched center.
thanks .. i think they may be a viable option for my mostly HT set up.. i am going to take my time and ponder .. i was going to get another pair of q100's .. but i have the thought that hearing a pretty safe new and different speaker may be fun.. i also am considering the aa phils or mini monitors..and the concept 20's(less so)...or maybe something else.. as different as the 10.1s and q100's are i like both, but i have the bug to hear something kinda "half way" in between sound wise..

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i was going to get another pair of q100's .. but i have the thought that hearing a pretty safe new and different speaker may be fun.. i also am considering the aa phils or mini monitors.
Would be very eager to hear your impression of the Phil AA vs the Q100 and 10.1!
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Would be very eager to hear your impression of the Phil AA vs the Q100 and 10.1!
i kind of feel that's a possibility.. it's a good bet that either the phil's or 3020's will get my interest up.. i am thinking that i may get a new pair as soon as march or april..
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You might've nailed it right there.

Still, there's that little audio Lucifer sitting on my shoulder who keeps whispering, "Psssst! Pssst! Wuddabout THIS speaker or THAT speaker? Might it be able to DO IT ALL, both the top end dynamics/detail AND the midrange warmth and lushness?"

Reminds me of when I was in my 20s and 30s, and had a similar "Looking For The Perfect Woman" disease...sigh!
You can get that, it just costs a lot more money unfortunately lol. My vintage Mirage SM 2.5's are much closer. Also I had vintage Polk Monitor 10's with upgraded Polk RDO tweeters that destroyed all these $300-$600 speakers we always talk about. Warm musical midrange and those RDO tweeters are so smooth yet detailed. Should have kept them.

I think the perfect speakers for you to try out are Wharfedale Dentons, Wharfedale Revas, and Focal Aria
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I think the perfect speakers for you to try out are Wharfedale Dentons, Wharfedale Revas, and Focal Aria
I like Focals, but I've never known any of them to be "warm"---I'd say "neutral" for their best, "bright" (though not horribly so) for the others.

The Dentons would be my first choice, if only they came in a simple black.

The Revas I've been curious about, am tempted to use Crutchfield's $10 flat rate return shipping policy to try out the R2s but would feel a bit guilty knowing that no way would I keep them at $1K/pair.
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Thanks Geoff as that is good to know. However, now I am leaning more towards the Q350's. Right now, my budget will not allow me to make my move. Paying some things off before I do. No need in going into debt for a set of speakers. Soon I will own some KEF speakers!


Cheers,

Phil
Heck no; I always pay for a/v equipment in cash.

The advantage in waiting is it gives you time to see if discounts kick in or not.
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Heck no; I always pay for a/v equipment in cash.

The advantage in waiting is it gives you time to see if discounts kick in or not.
Exactly, I agree 100% Geoff. Not going into serious debt anymore due to this hobby. Besides, it also gives me more times to narrow things down some. Honestly, there are several contenders that I am looking at as we speak. The process of elimination has begun. That is another reason that I am in no hurry. But, I take your advice to heart! Thanks!


Cheers,

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I like Focals, but I've never known any of them to be "warm"---I'd say "neutral" for their best, "bright" (though not horribly so) for the others.

The Dentons would be my first choice, if only they came in a simple black.

The Revas I've been curious about, am tempted to use Crutchfield's $10 flat rate return shipping policy to try out the R2s but would feel a bit guilty knowing that no way would I keep them at $1K/pair.
Focal Aria's sound very similar to 10.1's but better in every aspect. Slightly recessed mids and smooth tweeter. Very musical.

Music Direct has a pair of black Reva 2's open box for $699

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Exactly, I agree 100% Geoff. Not going into serious debt anymore due to this hobby. Besides, it also gives me more times to narrow things down some. Honestly, there are several contenders that I am looking at as we speak. The process of elimination has begun. That is another reason that I am in no hurry. But, I take your advice to heart! Thanks!


Cheers,

Phil
Here's a list of oft recommended bookshelves here on AVS with larger main drivers to peruse.

AVS FAVORITES: BOOKSHELF SPEAKER PAIRS WITH >6.4" MAIN DRIVER AND UNDER $650 MSRP, (**equals free returns)

NOTES: >note that most speakers do not actually reach within 10hz of their stated bass extension; check pro reviews

>CRUTCHFIELD carries many speakers that Best Buy does not listed below. Their return policy is very inexpensive and longer in time.
$10 per package, (not tower speakers), within 60days.

>check center speakr prices before choosing a pair for a surround system as some companies have VERY high prices for centers


MSRP/PR PORT? H/W/D ROUNDED TO NEAREST INCH
$225 REAR 15X9X11 2 way 7" [55hz] JBL ARENA 130**

$235 REAR 14X9X11 2 way 6.5" [48hz] PHILHARMONIC AUDIO AFFORDABLE ACCURACY MONITOR

$299 REAR 14x9x12 2 way 6.5" [40hz] WHARFEDALE DIAMOND 10.2, Music Direct Price

$300 REAR 15X9X14 2 way 6.5" [39hz] POLK SIGNATURE 20, often 10% off Best Buy**

$319 FRONT 16X9X12 2 way 6.5" [47hz] HTD LEVEL THREE**

$330 REAR 12X9X10 2 way 6.5" [58hz] ASCEND ACOUSTICS CBM 170 SE

$350 FRONT 14X8X12 2 way 6.5" [42hz] KEF Q 300

$350 SEALED 11X7X8 2 way 6.5" [56hz] NHT SUPERONE 2.1

$350 REAR 13x8x12 2 way 6.5" [32hz] DEFINITIVE TECHNOLOGY SM55^^ closeout price

$376 REAR 15X8X9 2 way 6.5" [60hz] HSU HB1

$400 REAR 15X9X11 2 way 6.5" [52hz] JBL STUDIO 230**

$450 DOWN 14X7X12 2 way 6.5" [45hz] WHARFEDALE DIAMOND 225, often 10% off Best Buy**

$500 FRONT 14X8X10 2 way 6.5" [42hz] MONITOR AUDIO BRONZE 2

$500 REAR 13X8X10 2 way 6.5" [48hz] SVS PRIME BOOKSHELF**

$560 REAR 14X8X11 2 way 7" [33hz] CANTON CHRONO 503.2 Accessories4less pice

$568 REAR 23X8X10 2 way 2 X 6.5" [60hz] HSU HC1

$608 REAR 21X8X11 2 way 2 X 6.5" [45hz] ASCEND ACOUSTICS CMT 340 SE

$650 REAR 14X8X12 2 way 6.5" [63hz] KEF Q 350

$650 REAR 17x9x13 2 way 6.5" [45hz] KLIPSCH RP 160M, often 10% off Best Buy, Crutchfield
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zorba922 View Post
I like Focals, but I've never known any of them to be "warm"---I'd say "neutral" for their best, "bright" (though not horribly so) for the others.

The Dentons would be my first choice, if only they came in a simple black.

The Revas I've been curious about, am tempted to use Crutchfield's $10 flat rate return shipping policy to try out the R2s but would feel a bit guilty knowing that no way would I keep them at $1K/pair.
Zorba, I have encouraged you many times to try the Dentons. That is, I found them to be very warm w/music with a great amount of detail w/o any listening fatigue whatsoever. The 220's were a bit warm, but more on the warm side of neutral if you will. Voices really excel with the Dentons. Especially, female voices. However, the Dentons did not perform so well w/HT inmho. Furthermore, the Dentons also need a sub as low end extension was rather limited. On the other hand, the 220's had plenty of low end for my needs.

You mention the Revas. I admit I am also curious about them. But, I am more interested in the Jades. The Revas seem like the 220's in a better cabinet/finish. Perhaps, I am wrong whereas the Jades are said to be a significant step-up. The Jade 1's would be more to my liking as the Jade 3's are rather larger. Here is a review of the Jade 3's:


https://www.stereophile.com/content/...-3-loudspeaker


Be sure to notice that the Jade 1's/3's are 3-ways. Find that very interesting. Here is a review of the Jade 1's:


https://hometheaterreview.com/wharfe...aker-reviewed/


Cheers,

Phil

Last edited by audiofreak38; 01-27-2018 at 10:23 AM.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gajCA View Post
Here's a list of oft recommended bookshelves here on AVS with larger main drivers to peruse.

AVS FAVORITES: BOOKSHELF SPEAKER PAIRS WITH >6.4" MAIN DRIVER AND UNDER $650 MSRP, (**equals free returns)

NOTES: >note that most speakers do not actually reach within 10hz of their stated bass extension; check pro reviews

>CRUTCHFIELD carries many speakers that Best Buy does not listed below. Their return policy is very inexpensive and longer in time.
$10 per package, (not tower speakers), within 60days.

>check center speakr prices before choosing a pair for a surround system as some companies have VERY high prices for centers


MSRP/PR PORT? H/W/D ROUNDED TO NEAREST INCH
$225 REAR 15X9X11 2 way 7" [55hz] JBL ARENA 130**

$235 REAR 14X9X11 2 way 6.5" [48hz] PHILHARMONIC AUDIO AFFORDABLE ACCURACY MONITOR

$299 REAR 14x9x12 2 way 6.5" [40hz] WHARFEDALE DIAMOND 10.2, Music Direct Price

$300 REAR 15X9X14 2 way 6.5" [39hz] POLK SIGNATURE 20, often 10% off Best Buy**

$319 FRONT 16X9X12 2 way 6.5" [47hz] HTD LEVEL THREE**

$330 REAR 12X9X10 2 way 6.5" [58hz] ASCEND ACOUSTICS CBM 170 SE

$350 FRONT 14X8X12 2 way 6.5" [42hz] KEF Q 300

$350 SEALED 11X7X8 2 way 6.5" [56hz] NHT SUPERONE 2.1

$350 REAR 13x8x12 2 way 6.5" [32hz] DEFINITIVE TECHNOLOGY SM55^^ closeout price

$376 REAR 15X8X9 2 way 6.5" [60hz] HSU HB1

$400 REAR 15X9X11 2 way 6.5" [52hz] JBL STUDIO 230**

$450 DOWN 14X7X12 2 way 6.5" [45hz] WHARFEDALE DIAMOND 225, often 10% off Best Buy**

$500 FRONT 14X8X10 2 way 6.5" [42hz] MONITOR AUDIO BRONZE 2

$500 REAR 13X8X10 2 way 6.5" [48hz] SVS PRIME BOOKSHELF**

$560 REAR 14X8X11 2 way 7" [33hz] CANTON CHRONO 503.2 Accessories4less pice

$568 REAR 23X8X10 2 way 2 X 6.5" [60hz] HSU HC1

$608 REAR 21X8X11 2 way 2 X 6.5" [45hz] ASCEND ACOUSTICS CMT 340 SE

$650 REAR 14X8X12 2 way 6.5" [63hz] KEF Q 350

$650 REAR 17x9x13 2 way 6.5" [45hz] KLIPSCH RP 160M, often 10% off Best Buy, Crutchfield

Thanks Geoff for the comprehensive list. However, the ONLY speakers from your list that interest me are the KEF Q350's and/or the JBL 230's. Have owned several others already on your list. The only reason that I am interested in the JBL 230's is b/c I loved the JBL 530's that I used to own. They were so much fun. I also currently own the JBL 305's and a set of JBL Everest 700 headphones. But, right now KEF has my full attention. There are a few other contenders as well. Still narrowing down my list. Thanks!


Cheers,

Phil
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Last edited by audiofreak38; 01-27-2018 at 10:43 AM.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audiofreak38 View Post
Thanks Geoff for the comprehensive list. However, the ONLY speakers from your list that interest me are the KEF Q350's and/or the JBL 230's. have owned several other already on your list. The only reason that I am interested in the JBL 230's is b/c I loved the JBL 530's that I used to own. They were so much fun. I also currently own the JBL 305's and a set of JBL Everest 700 headphones. But, right now KEF has my full attention. There are a few other contenders as well. Still narrowing down my list. Thanks!


Cheers,

Phil
Maybe a thumbnail "Phil Impression" of the ones on the list you've owned?

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Originally Posted by audiofreak38 View Post
And note that 5 db boost in frequency from 3 to 10 khz

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Originally Posted by gajCA View Post
Maybe a thumbnail "Phil Impression" of the ones on the list you've owned?
Perhaps, I can get around to it one day. Got some health issues that has really slowed me down lately and have had to merely go on cruise control. That being said, I will try to do just that when things improve. That is another reason why I am no hurry opting for my next set of speakers. Will get back to you on it as soon as I can. Very good idea Geoff.


Cheers,

Phil
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Originally Posted by zieglj01 View Post
And note that 5 db boost in frequency from 3 to 10 khz
Note that I am NOT too interested in the Jade 3's, but the Jade 1's instead as noted above in my earlier post. Never said I would keep them, but am very curious about hearing them. Speaker preference is highly subjective anyways. What I like others may not and vice versa.

As for me, I prefer a warmer sound presentation with lots of detail and is very non-fatiguing. Music is my preference as HT is the least of my concerns. Others, put more emphasis on HT and so forth. That is fine as there is no one way that fits us all. I am fully content w/that too. No worries.


Cheers,

Phil

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I'm currently auditioning LS50's and agree they can be a bit forward too. Like many people, I actually think they sound better with no toe, pointing straight ahead, the highs sound more balanced like that and the soundstage becomes wider as well. Might be worth trying on the Q100 as well.
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Originally Posted by zieglj01 View Post
And note that 5 db boost in frequency from 3 to 10 khz
yeah, I've read about Wharfedale Diamond owners moving up to the Jades but finding their metal tweeters a bit on the "bright" side.

Personally I would prefer that boost to be in the lower mids not the upper mids.

On the other hand, the R5Bi are said to have a bit of an upper-mid boost too, but that's never bothered me.
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~ Are you a "geek hobbyist" obsessed with squeezing out that last 5-10% improvement? The economy will thank you...especially the Chinese one. Or are you more of a get-set-and-forget "casual user" who simply wants to increase your enjoyment of movies, TV and gaming? Relax, HT isn't rocket science, nor does it have to cost an arm and a leg---especially if you ignore the aforementioned vocal minority. And remember to smile...it's just a silly hobby, after all. :)
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Originally Posted by audiofreak38 View Post
Zorba, I have encouraged you many times to try the Dentons. That is, I found them to be very warm w/music with a great amount of detail w/o any listening fatigue whatsoever. The 220's were a bit warm, but more on the warm side of neutral if you will. Voices really excel with the Dentons. Especially, female voices. However, the Dentons did not perform so well w/HT inmho. Furthermore, the Dentons also need a sub as low end extension was rather limited. On the other hand, the 220's had plenty of low end for my needs.
Hmmm, I wonder how hard it would be to apply a can of black spray paint to the Dentons...

I have considered getting a pair of the 220s to compare with my 10.1s, and whichever one I preferred for music I'd keep as mains while using one of the loser as the center...maybe there is a way to pry off or paint over those stupid shiny silver rings?

Ironic that the one time when I'm actually bothered by a speaker's looks, it happens with the one brand that so far as offered me the most satisfaction at the lowest pricepoint!

~ Are you a "geek hobbyist" obsessed with squeezing out that last 5-10% improvement? The economy will thank you...especially the Chinese one. Or are you more of a get-set-and-forget "casual user" who simply wants to increase your enjoyment of movies, TV and gaming? Relax, HT isn't rocket science, nor does it have to cost an arm and a leg---especially if you ignore the aforementioned vocal minority. And remember to smile...it's just a silly hobby, after all. :)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djp2k7 View Post
Focal Aria's sound very similar to 10.1's but better in every aspect. Slightly recessed mids and smooth tweeter. Very musical.

Music Direct has a pair of black Reva 2's open box for $699
"Recessed mids" might be a dealbreaker for me, depending on how much your perception of "slightly" differs from mine. But I've always heard very good things about the Arias, that's for sure.

Unfortunately I don't think MD allows non-defective returns for their open box speakers.

~ Are you a "geek hobbyist" obsessed with squeezing out that last 5-10% improvement? The economy will thank you...especially the Chinese one. Or are you more of a get-set-and-forget "casual user" who simply wants to increase your enjoyment of movies, TV and gaming? Relax, HT isn't rocket science, nor does it have to cost an arm and a leg---especially if you ignore the aforementioned vocal minority. And remember to smile...it's just a silly hobby, after all. :)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zorba922 View Post
Hmmm, I wonder how hard it would be to apply a can of black spray paint to the Dentons...

I have considered getting a pair of the 220s to compare with my 10.1s, and whichever one I preferred for music I'd keep as mains while using one of the loser as the center...maybe there is a way to pry off or paint over those stupid shiny silver rings?

Ironic that the one time when I'm actually bothered by a speaker's looks, it happens with the one brand that so far as offered me the most satisfaction at the lowest pricepoint!
Zorba, maybe you could use some black tape instead of paint around the trim rings, no? Of course, tape would be inexpensive. But, having it applied professionally might run a few bucks. My guess would be $50 or so. A local cabinet maker that applies veneer would be a good place to start. Never hurts to check. Personally, I did not find them that distracting at all. Hope one day you get to check out a set of the Dentons.


Cheers,

Phil
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