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post #61 of 115 Old 11-09-2018, 10:42 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by BluesDaddy56 View Post
For movies, I'm willing to bet you will NEVER notice any "mismatch". For music, especially if the surrounds are close to you and used significantly in the mix, you could notice. I'd squeeze extra and get 2 170Es got along with the 340s, but it's YOUR money.

BTW, I'll echo what everyone has said about budget slippage. I first started looking at getting a single sub to go with a pair of Magnepan MMGs and wound up with dual Rythmik L22s. No intention of upgrading front speakers, until I started reading about speakers with RAAL tweeters. Started looking at a Ascends then, but ultimately wound up going with Philharmonic BMRs based on literally universal reviews in the price range and cost/performance ratio. In the interim I also upgraded my AVR (that was essentially operating as a pre-pro as well as powering surrounds) to a separate pre-pro. Fortunately, I've enough amplification around to not have to spend money there. Still...
Thank you for the useful comments on surround speakers and sharing your experience @BluesDaddy56 . I looked it up about Philharmonic BMRs ... I can't afford those by any means not even in the future.

As you have shared your experience with dual Rythmik L22s, I am planning to get one LV12R for now but was also looking at the LVX12 for the extra watts, front ports, and tunability. So I was wondering two of LV12R (recommendation was to add one later) vs. one LVX12 suffice the purpose. Then, I don't have to spend more in the future.The size of my basement is 12x20x8 ft. It’s ‘L shape’ so, there is little bit of adjacent open space 3x7ft. No placement restrictions, except I will be projecting along the line of long-hand of the ‘L’ (upward and away from the short-hand). My couch will be roughly 15 ft away from the projection screen.
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post #62 of 115 Old 11-09-2018, 10:46 AM
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@baddogud Sonically matching speakers, as best as possible, is beneficial. Unmatched speakers can "work" but they likely won't work as well as matched speakers. And personally, I believe some on this forum trivialize the benefits of sonically matching the surrounds. With discrete sounds being placed in the surround and overhead positions with codecs such as Dolby TrueHD and Atmos, it is more beneficial than ever to have a sonic match with ALL the speakers.


Sonic matching doesn't necessarily mean "identical" either. The key is to find speakers that all have the same sound signature, or voicing, or timbre, no matter who makes them. You can mix and match speakers from different manufacturers if you want. Just be sure to try to match their sonic characteristics as much as possible. Having said that, I will say again that using identical speakers in all positions offers the greatest opportunity for a sonic match.



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post #63 of 115 Old 11-09-2018, 10:47 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by craig john View Post
It may be true that the OP would never notice a mismatch. However, that doesn't mean that matched speaker wouldn't work "better" than unmatched speakers. If the OP uses unmatched speakers, he would never know... and may never care. However, some people would always wonder... "What if..." Especially if they continue to spend time on the AVS Forum.



I will say that, In My Experience, sonically matched speakers always work better than unmatched speakers. I personally have never encountered a situation where it was not possible to find a sonically matched speaker to use in any position in a multichannel system. Please note that I am not saying "identical" speakers, (although 3 identical speakers do provide the best opportunity for a sonic match), I'm saying that sonically matched speakers, whether from the same manufacturer or another manufacturer will work more cohesively than 2 matched speakers and an unmatched 3rd speaker.



Craig
Thank you @craig john for sharing your thoughts. I am learning here from everyone's comment. I'm a bit of a perfectionist type and will be listening to music/orchestra. Trying to get best out of what I can afford and gaining knowledge about audio systems.
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post #64 of 115 Old 11-09-2018, 10:59 AM
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Try to just read my post instead.
I did. You already acknowledged you failed to communicate well in it. Don't be such an ass.

Display: Vizio P55-E1l Pre-pro: Marantz 7703; Amps: Emotiva XPA-2 Gen 2, Emotiva XPA-3 Gen 1, H/K AVR 520 (direct in to amps); Sources: Sony UBP-X700; X-box 1 S; Technics 1200 Mk II; Win10 PC for digital; Phono Preamp: Emotiva XPS-1; Speakers - LR: Philharmonic BMR LR; Center: Selah Audio BMR-CC; Surrounds: Wharfedale Reva-2; Rear Surrounds: Wharfedale Diamond 220; Atmos: TF - Monoprice Alpha 8; TR - BIC VI-38; Subwoofers: dual Rythmik L22s

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post #65 of 115 Old 11-09-2018, 11:12 AM
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@baddogud Sonically matching speakers, as best as possible, is beneficial. Unmatched speakers can "work" but they likely won't work as well as matched speakers. And personally, I believe some on this forum trivialize the benefits of sonically matching the surrounds. With discrete sounds being placed in the surround and overhead positions with codecs such as Dolby TrueHD and Atmos, it is more beneficial than ever to have a sonic match with ALL the speakers.
And some of us believe there are those on this forum that make way too much regarding "sonically matching" speakers without anything more than anecdotal evidence that it is critical in non-dedicated rooms. Plus, they typically throw in totally impractical caveats regarding how to go about determining this, such as:

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The key is to find speakers that all have the same sound signature, or voicing, or timbre, no matter who makes them. You can mix and match speakers from different manufacturers if you want. Just be sure to try to match their sonic characteristics as much as possible.
The ONLY way to really even attempt such a thing is to order multiple sets of speakers and listen to them in YOUR room. In my experience, I've never heard speakers in different positions that actually sounded alike, other than properly set up front LR speakers. The rest of the speakers, especially in non-dedicated rooms whether "sonically matched" or not, are going to have different sonic "signature" based on room interaction. Trying to identify speakers from different manufactures that are "voiced" similar to yours IN YOUR ROOM, is a practical impossibility for MOST people with real rooms, lives, and budgets.

Do what works for YOU and your budget. Again, IF you're going to be listening to a lot of multi channel music, getting a set of the same speakers all the way around is going to give you a higher quality musical experience. For movies, I'll stick to my observation that I doubt you will notice the difference between the Sonys and getting "matching" speakers.

Display: Vizio P55-E1l Pre-pro: Marantz 7703; Amps: Emotiva XPA-2 Gen 2, Emotiva XPA-3 Gen 1, H/K AVR 520 (direct in to amps); Sources: Sony UBP-X700; X-box 1 S; Technics 1200 Mk II; Win10 PC for digital; Phono Preamp: Emotiva XPS-1; Speakers - LR: Philharmonic BMR LR; Center: Selah Audio BMR-CC; Surrounds: Wharfedale Reva-2; Rear Surrounds: Wharfedale Diamond 220; Atmos: TF - Monoprice Alpha 8; TR - BIC VI-38; Subwoofers: dual Rythmik L22s
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post #66 of 115 Old 11-09-2018, 11:20 AM
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Thank you for the useful comments on surround speakers and sharing your experience @BluesDaddy56 . I looked it up about Philharmonic BMRs ... I can't afford those by any means not even in the future.
Certainly understood, it was simply an illustration regarding others' statements about going down a rabbit hole. BTW, Philharmonic DOES have less expensive speakers, including the Affordable Accuracy Plus. Five of those would be somewhere in the range of $650 plus shipping. They probably would NOT have quite the dynamic range of the Ascend you're looking at for your fronts.

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As you have shared your experience with dual Rythmik L22s, I am planning to get one LV12R for now but was also looking at the LVX12 for the extra watts, front ports, and tunability. So I was wondering two of LV12R (recommendation was to add one later) vs. one LVX12 suffice the purpose. Then, I don't have to spend more in the future.The size of my basement is 12x20x8 ft. It’s ‘L shape’ so, there is little bit of adjacent open space 3x7ft. No placement restrictions, except I will be projecting along the line of long-hand of the ‘L’ (upward and away from the short-hand). My couch will be roughly 15 ft away from the projection screen.
Well, with subs going more is usually better. I'd start with one LVX12 and then, when budget permits, get a second. One thing I think you'll be amaze at is how addicting quality bass is from a sub from a manufacturer like Rythmk. Dual subs will typically even out room response, all things being equal. But one properly set up will certainly start to get you there.

Display: Vizio P55-E1l Pre-pro: Marantz 7703; Amps: Emotiva XPA-2 Gen 2, Emotiva XPA-3 Gen 1, H/K AVR 520 (direct in to amps); Sources: Sony UBP-X700; X-box 1 S; Technics 1200 Mk II; Win10 PC for digital; Phono Preamp: Emotiva XPS-1; Speakers - LR: Philharmonic BMR LR; Center: Selah Audio BMR-CC; Surrounds: Wharfedale Reva-2; Rear Surrounds: Wharfedale Diamond 220; Atmos: TF - Monoprice Alpha 8; TR - BIC VI-38; Subwoofers: dual Rythmik L22s
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post #67 of 115 Old 11-09-2018, 11:23 AM
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I did. You already acknowledged you failed to communicate well in it. Don't be such an ass.
Right back atcha...

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Originally Posted by BluesDaddy56 View Post
And some of us believe there are those on this forum that make way too much regarding "sonically matching" speakers without anything more than anecdotal evidence that it is critical in non-dedicated rooms. Plus, they typically throw in totally impractical caveats regarding how to go about determining this, such as:
The ONLY way to really even attempt such a thing is to order multiple sets of speakers and listen to them in YOUR room. In my experience, I've never heard speakers in different positions that actually sounded alike, other than properly set up front LR speakers. The rest of the speakers, especially in non-dedicated rooms whether "sonically matched" or not, are going to have different sonic "signature" based on room interaction. Trying to identify speakers from different manufactures that are "voiced" similar to yours IN YOUR ROOM, is a practical impossibility for MOST people with real rooms, lives, and budgets.
Do what works for YOU and your budget. Again, IF you're going to be listening to a lot of multi channel music, getting a set of the same speakers all the way around is going to give you a higher quality musical experience. For movies, I'll stick to my observation that I doubt you will notice the difference between the Sonys and getting "matching" speakers.
Cool! I totally get your (@BluesDaddy56) point as well as @craig john 's ... you all are audio gurus and correct at your own grounds

What's your comment on the following question I have in mind:
As you have shared your experience with dual Rythmik L22s, I am planning to get one LV12R for now but was also looking at the LVX12 for the extra watts, front ports, and tunability. So, I was wondering two of LV12R (recommendation was to add one later) vs. one LVX12 suffice the purpose. Then, I don't have to spend more in the future. Is it true two subwoofers will be more uniform or its just the power/watts matter?
The size of my basement is 12x20x8 ft. It’s ‘L shape’ so, there is a little bit of adjacent open space 3x7ft. No placement restrictions, except I will be projecting along the line of long-hand of the ‘L’ (upward and away from the short-hand). My couch will be roughly 15 ft away from the projection screen.
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post #69 of 115 Old 11-09-2018, 11:26 AM
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Originally Posted by BluesDaddy56 View Post
And some of us believe there are those on this forum that make way too much regarding "sonically matching" speakers without anything more than anecdotal evidence that it is critical in non-dedicated rooms. Plus, they typically throw in totally impractical caveats regarding how to go about determining this, such as:
My evidence is my own personal experience. I know from my experience that sonically matched speaker system work better than mismatched speakers systems. EVERY matched system I've ever setup or installed has been more cohesive than any other unmatched system I've heard, I don't design or setup unmatched systems for my friends or family. I heard one such system that cost over $300,000 and the CC sounded completely different than the L/R's and the surrounds sounded completely different than all the other speakers. It simply didn't work. In fact, every system I've ever heard with speakers that are not sonic matches has sounded less cohesive than any matched set.


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Originally Posted by BluesDaddy56 View Post
The ONLY way to really even attempt such a thing is to order multiple sets of speakers and listen to them in YOUR room. In my experience, I've never heard speakers in different positions that actually sounded alike, other than properly set up front LR speakers. The rest of the speakers, especially in non-dedicated rooms whether "sonically matched" or not, are going to have different sonic "signature" based on room interaction. Trying to identify speakers from different manufactures that are "voiced" similar to yours IN YOUR ROOM, is a practical impossibility for MOST people with real rooms, lives, and budgets.

Do what works for YOU and your budget. Again, IF you're going to be listening to a lot of multi channel music, getting a set of the same speakers all the way around is going to give you a higher quality musical experience. For movies, I'll stick to my observation that I doubt you will notice the difference between the Sonys and getting "matching" speakers.
There is an easy way to do this... don't use "bright" speakers with "warm" speakers. Use speakers that have similar sonic characteristics. Believe it or not, using measurements to evaluate the sonic characteristics can be really useful in this regard.


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post #70 of 115 Old 11-09-2018, 11:35 AM
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My evidence is my own personal experience. I know from my experience that sonically matched speaker system work better than mismatched speakers systems. EVERY matched system I've ever setup or installed has been more cohesive than any other unmatched system I've heard, I don't design or setup unmatched systems for my friends or family. I heard one such system that cost over $300,000 and the CC sounded completely different than the L/R's and the surrounds sounded completely different than all the other speakers. It simply didn't work. In fact, every system I've ever heard with speakers that are not sonic matches has sounded less cohesive than any matched set.
Yes, "my own personal experience" would equate to "anecdotal evidence". I'm sure you controlled for confirmation bias and actually did A/B comparisons in the same room with unmatched versus matched, right? In MY PERSONAL EXPERIENCE, I've never heard a supposedly matched center channel speaker in a non dedicated room sound the SAME as the LRs using white noise.

Display: Vizio P55-E1l Pre-pro: Marantz 7703; Amps: Emotiva XPA-2 Gen 2, Emotiva XPA-3 Gen 1, H/K AVR 520 (direct in to amps); Sources: Sony UBP-X700; X-box 1 S; Technics 1200 Mk II; Win10 PC for digital; Phono Preamp: Emotiva XPS-1; Speakers - LR: Philharmonic BMR LR; Center: Selah Audio BMR-CC; Surrounds: Wharfedale Reva-2; Rear Surrounds: Wharfedale Diamond 220; Atmos: TF - Monoprice Alpha 8; TR - BIC VI-38; Subwoofers: dual Rythmik L22s
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post #71 of 115 Old 11-09-2018, 11:36 AM
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Cool! I totally get your (@BluesDaddy56) point as well as @craig john 's ... you all are audio gurus and correct at your own grounds

What's your comment on the following question I have in mind:
As you have shared your experience with dual Rythmik L22s, I am planning to get one LV12R for now but was also looking at the LVX12 for the extra watts, front ports, and tunability. So, I was wondering two of LV12R (recommendation was to add one later) vs. one LVX12 suffice the purpose. Then, I don't have to spend more in the future. Is it true two subwoofers will be more uniform or its just the power/watts matter?
The size of my basement is 12x20x8 ft. It’s ‘L shape’ so, there is a little bit of adjacent open space 3x7ft. No placement restrictions, except I will be projecting along the line of long-hand of the ‘L’ (upward and away from the short-hand). My couch will be roughly 15 ft away from the projection screen.
You may have missed my response from above:

Quote:
Well, with subs going more is usually better. I'd start with one LVX12 and then, when budget permits, get a second. One thing I think you'll be amaze at is how addicting quality bass is from a sub from a manufacturer like Rythmk. Dual subs will typically even out room response, all things being equal. But one properly set up will certainly start to get you there.

Display: Vizio P55-E1l Pre-pro: Marantz 7703; Amps: Emotiva XPA-2 Gen 2, Emotiva XPA-3 Gen 1, H/K AVR 520 (direct in to amps); Sources: Sony UBP-X700; X-box 1 S; Technics 1200 Mk II; Win10 PC for digital; Phono Preamp: Emotiva XPS-1; Speakers - LR: Philharmonic BMR LR; Center: Selah Audio BMR-CC; Surrounds: Wharfedale Reva-2; Rear Surrounds: Wharfedale Diamond 220; Atmos: TF - Monoprice Alpha 8; TR - BIC VI-38; Subwoofers: dual Rythmik L22s
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post #72 of 115 Old 11-09-2018, 12:26 PM
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Cool! I totally get your (@BluesDaddy56) point as well as @craig john 's ... you all are audio gurus and correct at your own grounds

What's your comment on the following question I have in mind:
As you have shared your experience with dual Rythmik L22s, I am planning to get one LV12R for now but was also looking at the LVX12 for the extra watts, front ports, and tunability. So, I was wondering two of LV12R (recommendation was to add one later) vs. one LVX12 suffice the purpose. Then, I don't have to spend more in the future. Is it true two subwoofers will be more uniform or its just the power/watts matter?
The size of my basement is 12x20x8 ft. It’s ‘L shape’ so, there is a little bit of adjacent open space 3x7ft. No placement restrictions, except I will be projecting along the line of long-hand of the ‘L’ (upward and away from the short-hand). My couch will be roughly 15 ft away from the projection screen.
I have two smaller subs in my secondary due to limited placement and the fact that just one led to major localization issues.

In my main room a single sub works just fine as it is near the front three.

So starting with one is a great idea as you may not be a "basshead" (I'm certainly not).

As to spending a little more for the more powerful sub and the Ascends for surrounds vs the Sony's, I'd certainly do it unless the extra few hundred dollars would be a severe budget strain.

The more powerful sub increases the chances in my view that you may not need a second which, in the long run, will actually save you money.
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post #73 of 115 Old 11-09-2018, 02:01 PM
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Yes, "my own personal experience" would equate to "anecdotal evidence". I'm sure you controlled for confirmation bias and actually did A/B comparisons in the same room with unmatched versus matched, right? In MY PERSONAL EXPERIENCE, I've never heard a supposedly matched center channel speaker in a non dedicated room sound the SAME as the LRs using white noise.
As you know, doing a controlled test of certain things is not always possible. Even in medicine we can't do controlled, blinded tests of some things. Here is just one example:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6140446/

In some cases, "expert opinion" is the final arbiter of whether procedures are beneficial or not. In others, consensus of opinion is the best evidence available. It's never the *best* evidence, and it should never override a randomized, double-blind, placebo controlled clinical trial. However, sometimes it's all we've got. In fact, there are actually classifications of evidence, and physicians are encouraged to use these levels to make the best clinical recommendations for their patients. In that regard, "expert opinion" is considered the lowest level of evidence and should only be considered last.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3124652/


In Open Heart Surgery, where I know the literature the best, Clinical Practice Guidelines are still sometimes based on expert opinion, but with acknowledgement of that limitation of the evidence:
https://www.jtcvs.org/article/S0022-5223(17)30103-4/pdf


Quote:
There is broad agreement that Clinical Practice Guidelines, (CPGs) should be based on rigorous evidence. However, high-quality randomized studies are often lacking in the surgical literature. Nevertheless, this lack of randomized studies does not necessarily preclude development of CPGs. Well-designed prospective cohort studies, or large registry studies that compare 2 interventions, can result in useful recommendations. In the surgical field, much of the published literature is based on single-center, noncomparative case series. Higher-quality evidence may never be obtained in certain areas, but lower-level data and case series may still provide opportunities to optimize outcomes that address important and often common clinical questions. In such scenarios it may be appropriate for the expert panel to use their best judgments to make specific and unambiguous consensus statements designed to reduce poor outcomes. The consensus of a diverse group of experts can provide enormous value in these areas with little to no comparative evidence....

I am not holding myself out as an "expert" in this regard. I don't imagine you are either. We're both just expressing our own opinions and personal experiences. I am merely relating my years of experience with design and installation in multiple home theater environments, for myself, friends and family. (I'm not a professional installer, I don't do installations for hire, and I don't accept money from friends or family for helping them.) Nonetheless, I have designed and/or installed at least 30 or 40 HT's for friends and family, all at different price points and layouts. In every case where I have been allowed to using matching or even identical speakers, the result has been significantly better, IMO. I recently did this theater for a friend:





Five JBL LSR 305's @ $129 ea. They include the amps. There wer also 2 Monolith subwoofers. That system sounded incredible... way above its' price point.


In my own particular case, I've had multiple different CC's in my system over the years, some identical, some sonically matching, and some not matching at all. I've had multiple surrounds in my system, some matching and some not. In every single case, there has been a benefit from matching the speakers as closely as possible.



My current system is not all identical speakers. I have a horizontal CC. It uses the exact same driver complement as my L/R's and the internal box volume is the same as the L/R's. The only difference is the woofers are deployed horizontally, not vertically. I am using smaller versions of my L/R's as surrounds. They use the same mids and tweets as the L/R's but the tweeters are not in a "dispersion lens" and there are no woofers., so they don't have the bass output of my mains. To compensate, I cross them to my subs at a higher frequency. I have just installed Atmos speakers that are completely different than all my other speakers. I need to spend more time listening to them and optimizing the installation before I decide if they are an adequate timbre-match for the rest of the system. The jury is still out on that one.


Of course, then there's always the simple logic that says that speakers that sound the same should work together better than speakers that sound different. That seems intuitively obvious. In fact, virtually all of us observe that logic when we match the Left and Right speakers in our systems.



BTW, white noise is not a good signal for evaluating speaker timbre. It is an in-room, "steady state" noise. It will be more influenced by room reflections, and will portray those influences better due to the steady state nature of the noise. No speakers will sound identical in different locations within a room especially with a steady state noise signal. Anechoic or psuedo-anechoic, gated frequency response plots, especially on- and off-axis frequency response plots, are much better signals to use to evaluate speaker timbre. Decay plots are also useful to check for cabinet resonances.



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post #74 of 115 Old 11-10-2018, 07:52 AM - Thread Starter
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Quick update: Started shopping... enjoying it and feeling excited!

Got extra $50 off on Denon AVR-X3400H as BF deal struck from accessoriesforless. - $449 + S/H
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LVX12 is back-order... will be available in mid-December/January... I'll wait for it

I received the projector BenQ HT2550 but returning it.
Posted a thread for suggestions
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post #76 of 115 Old 11-10-2018, 07:57 PM - Thread Starter
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@Zorba922 @Rgarc @IrishHT @pase22 @javan robinson @Disarmer @gajCA @Russdawg1 @BluesDaddy56 @craig john
what's your opinion on HTD level 3 bookshelf and center, compared to Ascend CMT 340? Was thinking to try out because of free in-home trial

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post #77 of 115 Old 11-10-2018, 08:21 PM
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Originally Posted by baddogud View Post
@Zorba922 @Rgarc @IrishHT @pase22 @javan robinson @Disarmer @gajCA @Russdawg1 @BluesDaddy56 @craig john

what's your opinion on HTD level 3 bookshelf and center, compared to Ascend CMT 340? Was thinking to try out because of free in-home trial

Never heard the HTD, Buy both return the loser if you are willing to lose a tiny bit of money to make the best decision.
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Leave it at 8 ohms and call it a day :)
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post #78 of 115 Old 11-10-2018, 08:46 PM
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Originally Posted by baddogud View Post
@Zorba922 @Rgarc @IrishHT @pase22 @javan robinson @Disarmer @gajCA @Russdawg1 @BluesDaddy56 @craig john
what's your opinion on HTD level 3 bookshelf and center, compared to Ascend CMT 340? Was thinking to try out because of free in-home trial
HTD is really nice/decent -- the Ascend will have a little more detail and be somewhat more linear. However, it will not be a head and shoulders difference.

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post #79 of 115 Old 11-10-2018, 08:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Russdawg1 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by baddogud View Post
@Zorba922 @Rgarc @IrishHT @pase22 @javan robinson @Disarmer @gajCA @Russdawg1 @BluesDaddy56 @craig john

what's your opinion on HTD level 3 bookshelf and center, compared to Ascend CMT 340? Was thinking to try out because of free in-home trial

Never heard the HTD, Buy both return the loser if you are willing to lose a tiny bit of money to make the best decision.
Depends where you are located as to if you will lose "a tiny bit of money" or not. Best I could do for return shipping on my 3 Ascends was $140. And that was the smallish 170 SEs. I would get quotes on return shipping before you even order for a trial period just to see if the cost is worth it.
If you like a neutral speaker, you can't go wrong with the Ascend. I just preferred the presentation of the Phils.
I've read a few threads and the HTDs seem to be viewed pretty positive. I'd sub to that comparo thread 🙂
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post #80 of 115 Old 11-10-2018, 09:45 PM
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Originally Posted by baddogud View Post
@Zorba922 @Rgarc @IrishHT @pase22 @javan robinson @Disarmer @gajCA @Russdawg1 @BluesDaddy56 @craig john
what's your opinion on HTD level 3 bookshelf and center, compared to Ascend CMT 340? Was thinking to try out because of free in-home trial
I'd expect the HTD L3 to be close, equal, or even slightly better.

With the FRS, it's a no-brainer to order them first alone, and ONLY IF you are not happy with them, try out the Ascends.

Another good FRS option would be 2 x JBL Studio 230 + 1 Studio 235C for $550 shipped from jbl.com

If you're risk averse then a JBL vs HTD shootout would be very interesting.

~ Are you a "geek hobbyist" obsessed with squeezing out that last 5-10% improvement? The economy will thank you...especially the Chinese one. Or are you more of a get-set-and-forget "casual user" who simply wants to increase your enjoyment of movies, TV and gaming? Relax, HT isn't rocket science, nor does it have to cost an arm and a leg---especially if you ignore the aforementioned vocal minority. And remember to smile...it's just a silly hobby, after all. :)
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post #81 of 115 Old 11-11-2018, 08:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by baddogud View Post
@Zorba922 @Rgarc @IrishHT @pase22 @javan robinson @Disarmer @gajCA @Russdawg1 @BluesDaddy56 @craig john
what's your opinion on HTD level 3 bookshelf and center, compared to Ascend CMT 340? Was thinking to try out because of free in-home trial
Free returns (for bookshelves/centers) makes that decision easy if they have piqued your interest.

AVS members who've bought them really like them soundwise and rave about how nice they look.

Geoff A. J., California
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post #82 of 115 Old 11-11-2018, 07:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by baddogud View Post
@Zorba922 @Rgarc @IrishHT @pase22 @javan robinson @Disarmer @gajCA @Russdawg1 @BluesDaddy56 @craig john
what's your opinion on HTD level 3 bookshelf and center, compared to Ascend CMT 340? Was thinking to try out because of free in-home trial
I haven't heard either speaker, but both get excellent feedback in the forum. Since you get FRS with the HTD, they may be worth a shot. Another great resource would be Cruthfield with their $10 flat rate to return a pair of bookshelf speakers. They have a lot of different speakers to choose from.
https://www.crutchfield.com/g_37900/...ers.html?&pg=2

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post #83 of 115 Old 11-12-2018, 04:21 AM
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I can't add more than others have commented. I've not heard the HTDs. I have looked at their center and in ceiling speakers and was impressed. For free return shipping, no reason NOT to order a pair and see how you like them. I've not read anything regarding how reliable their sensitivity spec is, but as rated they should be fairly easy to drive.

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post #84 of 115 Old 11-13-2018, 10:57 AM - Thread Starter
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Transitioning from being a noob then in a state of confusion and then, hustle like a faux-pro audiophile, finally, my shopping is done.

Here is where I landed:

Denon AVR-X3400H Refurb - $449 + $9 S/H
2 Monoprice monolith 10" THX - $950 + $57 Tax
2 CMT-340 SE mains - $498
1 CMT-340 SE center - $298
2 HMT-200 SE surr - $298
Speaker bundle discount $96 + $90 S/H

I didn't get the HTD speakers and Rhythmik sub as they are a backorder.

I thank all of you for responding to my naive questions and sharing the knowledge base. With your help, I could make the system as best as it can be within the budget. I really appreciate it. @Zorba922 @Rgarc @IrishHT @pase22 @javan robinson @Disarmer @gajCA @Russdawg1 @BluesDaddy56 @craig john @zieglj01

I'm getting a hang for this forum, so, I'm gonna stick around and learn from it. Anyway, I have to set it up correctly when everything shows up. I'll have questions again.

If anyone is in or visiting Frederick/Bethesda in Maryland, please ping me and I'll be very happy to share the experience of audio nirvana that I would be in because of your contributions.
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Last edited by baddogud; 11-13-2018 at 11:01 AM.
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post #85 of 115 Old 11-13-2018, 11:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by baddogud View Post
Transitioning from being a noob then in a state of confusion and then, hustle like a faux-pro audiophile, finally, my shopping is done.

Here is where I landed:

Denon AVR-X3400H Refurb - $449 + $9 S/H
2 Monoprice monolith 10" THX - $950 + $57 Tax
2 CMT-340 SE mains - $498
1 CMT-340 SE center - $298
2 HMT-200 SE surr - $298
Speaker bundle discount $96 + $90 S/H

I thank all of you for responding to my naive questions and sharing the knowledge base. With your help, I could make the system as best as it can be within the budget. I really appreciate it. @Zorba922 @Rgarc @IrishHT @pase22 @javan robinson @Disarmer @gajCA @Russdawg1 @BluesDaddy56 @craig john @zieglj01

I'm getting a hang for this forum, so, I'm gonna stick around and learn from it. Anyway, I have to set it up correctly when everything shows up. I'll have questions again.

If anyone is in or visiting Frederick/Bethesda in Maryland, please ping me and I'll be very happy to share the experience of audio nirvana that I would be in because of your contributions.
Very very nice.

Nicer than my first setup in the dark ages of 1989 when I had to pay $10,000 in today's money for a lesser system!

Congratulations.

Looking forward to your impressions.

Geoff A. J., California
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post #86 of 115 Old 11-13-2018, 11:35 AM
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Cool! I totally get your (@BluesDaddy56) point as well as @craig john 's ... you all are audio gurus and correct at your own grounds

What's your comment on the following question I have in mind:
As you have shared your experience with dual Rythmik L22s, I am planning to get one LV12R for now but was also looking at the LVX12 for the extra watts, front ports, and tunability. So, I was wondering two of LV12R (recommendation was to add one later) vs. one LVX12 suffice the purpose. Then, I don't have to spend more in the future. Is it true two subwoofers will be more uniform or its just the power/watts matter?
The size of my basement is 12x20x8 ft. It’s ‘L shape’ so, there is a little bit of adjacent open space 3x7ft. No placement restrictions, except I will be projecting along the line of long-hand of the ‘L’ (upward and away from the short-hand). My couch will be roughly 15 ft away from the projection screen.
Well outside of evening the bass across the room with 2 subs, if you look at Rythmik's output comparison the F12 is the baseline at $980 the LVR12 will get you 2.5db additional spl at 20hz, and the LVX12 4db additional. So technically 2 LVR12's will get you about 4db more spl at 20 hz over a single LVX12, adding a second identical sub is good for about 3db additional gain. A 1db difference is not perceptible generally speaking, I think the smallest noticeable difference is 2 or 3 db, but the 2 LVR12 will cost you about $300 more than a single LVX12. I would go with the LVX12 myself, I have one, and maybe get another one down the line.
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post #87 of 115 Old 11-13-2018, 11:50 AM
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at this point its time to sit back, enjoy your system, and don't second guess yourself. Great speaker will outlast the rest of your AV gear at least in my experience.
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post #88 of 115 Old 11-13-2018, 12:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by baddogud View Post
Transitioning from being a noob then in a state of confusion and then, hustle like a faux-pro audiophile, finally, my shopping is done.



Here is where I landed:



Denon AVR-X3400H Refurb - $449 + $9 S/H

2 Monoprice monolith 10" THX - $950 + $57 Tax

2 CMT-340 SE mains - $498

1 CMT-340 SE center - $298

2 HMT-200 SE surr - $298

Speaker bundle discount $96 + $90 S/H



I didn't get the HTD speakers and Rhythmik sub as they are a backorder.



I thank all of you for responding to my naive questions and sharing the knowledge base. With your help, I could make the system as best as it can be within the budget. I really appreciate it. @Zorba922 @Rgarc @IrishHT @pase22 @javan robinson @Disarmer @gajCA @Russdawg1 @BluesDaddy56 @craig john @zieglj01



I'm getting a hang for this forum, so, I'm gonna stick around and learn from it. Anyway, I have to set it up correctly when everything shows up. I'll have questions again.



If anyone is in or visiting Frederick/Bethesda in Maryland, please ping me and I'll be very happy to share the experience of audio nirvana that I would be in because of your contributions.

That is a fantastic setup, I would love to come by sometime. Good call on the monolith subwoofers, you won’t be disappointed.

Leave it at 8 ohms and call it a day :)
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post #89 of 115 Old 11-13-2018, 12:30 PM
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That's going to be a great sounding setup for sure! Looking forward to your impressions! Welcome to the forums as well.

Video: JVC RS35 or Optoma HD8600 on 120". - 60" Panasonic plasma. - Darby Darblet video processor. - Panasonic BD85 Blu-ray playback.
Audio: Denon X1100W. - Speakers: Philharmonic AA+ LRC, Mirage Omnipolar Spherex surrounds. Subwoofers: - MFW-15 Turbo(amp only), Dual 12".
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post #90 of 115 Old 11-13-2018, 10:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by baddogud View Post
Transitioning from being a noob then in a state of confusion and then, hustle like a faux-pro audiophile, finally, my shopping is done.

Here is where I landed:

Denon AVR-X3400H Refurb - $449 + $9 S/H
2 Monoprice monolith 10" THX - $950 + $57 Tax
2 CMT-340 SE mains - $498
1 CMT-340 SE center - $298
2 HMT-200 SE surr - $298
Speaker bundle discount $96 + $90 S/H

I didn't get the HTD speakers and Rhythmik sub as they are a backorder.

I thank all of you for responding to my naive questions and sharing the knowledge base. With your help, I could make the system as best as it can be within the budget. I really appreciate it. @Zorba922 @Rgarc @IrishHT @pase22 @javan robinson @Disarmer @gajCA @Russdawg1 @BluesDaddy56 @craig john @zieglj01

I'm getting a hang for this forum, so, I'm gonna stick around and learn from it. Anyway, I have to set it up correctly when everything shows up. I'll have questions again.

If anyone is in or visiting Frederick/Bethesda in Maryland, please ping me and I'll be very happy to share the experience of audio nirvana that I would be in because of your contributions.
That's going to be quite an awesome setup! Good call on doubling down with the subs.

Proper setup will be important so don't be shy about asking questions. Most of us started where you are and some with much lower quality setups. This forum is a great resource that I have learned a lot from.

Kef LS50,Q200C, Q100, SVS SB-2000, Denon AVR-X3400H, NAD 216, Panasonic 50" Plasma, Xbox One.
Bedroom: Kef Q100 ,JBL Loft 20, Bic F-12, Denon AVR-S710W, PS3, 32" Insigna LED.
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