How to Choose a Loudspeaker -- What the Science Shows - Page 170 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
Forum Jump: 
 6394Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #5071 of 5323 Old 09-21-2019, 06:32 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
torii's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 7,245
Mentioned: 54 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3594 Post(s)
Liked: 2028
look at 80db line for both measurements...obviously bookshelves more or less sensitive...IDK

Power: Marantz sr7008, NAD C 275Bee x 2, Video: Oppo 103, Samsung 75un6300
Speakers: Focal aria 948, Focal cc900, Klipsch synergy KSF 10.5, Magnepan LRS
Subs: Rythmik FV25HP, Rythmik FV15HP
torii is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #5072 of 5323 Old 09-22-2019, 08:46 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
lefthandluke's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Dayton, Ohio
Posts: 1,343
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 181 Post(s)
Liked: 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Dressler View Post
Yes, my SACDs and DVD-As were collecting dust, too, until I started using Roon. Having ripped them into the library, they integrate seamlessly into playback with 2-channel material. No need to compromise quality for convenience.
woah now...that's a game changer. Special software needed? I don't have a multi-channel dac tho. Still...

once downloaded did you sell your discs?

at the zenith of his nadir...
lefthandluke is offline  
post #5073 of 5323 Old 09-22-2019, 09:03 AM
AVS Forum Addicted Member
 
Kal Rubinson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: NYC + Connecticut
Posts: 30,290
Mentioned: 23 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1354 Post(s)
Liked: 1289
Quote:
Originally Posted by lefthandluke View Post
woah now...that's a game changer. Special software needed? I don't have a multi-channel dac tho. Still...
Most of the major quality music player apps will handle multichannel as well as stereo without problems.

Kal Rubinson

"Music in the Round"
Senior Contributing Editor, Stereophile
http://www.stereophile.com/category/music-round

Kal Rubinson is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #5074 of 5323 Old 09-22-2019, 09:30 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
lefthandluke's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Dayton, Ohio
Posts: 1,343
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 181 Post(s)
Liked: 334
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kal Rubinson View Post
Most of the major quality music player apps will handle multichannel as well as stereo without problems.


I have imported all of my hybrid sacds. I have a micromega mydac that feeds my parasound P5 pre via analog for stereo only and a dragonfly black feeding my Marantz 8801 for multichannel...tho its matrixed only, not discrete. To my ears neither sounds as good as played thru my oppo udp-203 which plays discretely of course.

at the zenith of his nadir...
lefthandluke is offline  
post #5075 of 5323 Old 09-22-2019, 09:56 AM
Member
 
papashango61's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: USA
Posts: 150
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 29 Post(s)
Liked: 20
Figure this is the best place to ask - wth does it mean when these reviews say a speaker "demands your attention" ???? Im seeing it quite often.
papashango61 is offline  
post #5076 of 5323 Old 09-22-2019, 10:34 AM
Member
 
noway1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 96
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 59 Post(s)
Liked: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by papashango61 View Post
Figure this is the best place to ask - wth does it mean when these reviews say a speaker "demands your attention" ???? Im seeing it quite often.
It means different things to different people but to me it means that they are not well suited for background music. Some people may find it distracting to use a speaker for background music if it is providing the correct amount of dynamics, detail, imaging, etc. and may instead prefer something boring that allows them to focus on the food, the conversation, a busy road, the elevator, etc. depending on where they are.
noway1 is offline  
post #5077 of 5323 Old 09-22-2019, 10:40 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2018
Posts: 48
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 58 Post(s)
Liked: 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by noway1 View Post
It means different things to different people but to me it means that they are not well suited for background music. Some people may find it distracting to use a speaker for background music if it is providing the correct amount of dynamics, detail, imaging, etc. and may instead prefer something boring that allows them to focus on the food, the conversation, a busy road, the elevator, etc. depending on where they are.
Ahhh so it basically means its detailed, probably forward, and maybe has an energetic sound?
Del Boca Vista is offline  
post #5078 of 5323 Old 09-22-2019, 10:54 AM
AVS Forum Addicted Member
 
Roger Dressler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Oregon
Posts: 11,519
Mentioned: 93 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2978 Post(s)
Liked: 1743
Quote:
Originally Posted by lefthandluke View Post
woah now...that's a game changer. Special software needed? I don't have a multi-channel dac tho. Still...

once downloaded did you sell your discs?
I fear we are OT for this thread. Perhaps start a new one unless this wraps it up.

I did not sell my discs.

The multi-channel DAC is simply that of my AV processor -- same one I use when playing optical discs (SSP-800). I run Roon in a media PC with HDMI output.

Loading DVD-A into Roon is simple with DVD-A Extractor. SACD is rather more involved, but there's a whole community of folks to lend support. The process I use is described in my build thread. Link It's also possible to extract audio from Blu-ray -- with its own unique process. All I can say is the results are worth the effort.

Deadwood II Theater (Previous Deadwood Theater HTOM)
Anthem AVM 60 7.4.4; Classé SSP-800 PLIIx 7.4; MiniDSP OpenDRC-AN
Oppo UDP-203; Oppo BDP-93; Win10 media PC w/Roon+Kodi; Roku Ultra; DirecTV Genie
Adam Audio S3V/S3H LCR, KEF Ci200QS 4 srrnd, Tannoy Di6 DC 4 hts, Hsu ULS-15 4 subs
JVC RS520; Stewart Cima Neve screen 125" diag 2.35:1, MLP at 115"
Roger Dressler is online now  
post #5079 of 5323 Old 09-22-2019, 11:23 AM
Oppo Beta Group
 
RichB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 11,188
Mentioned: 33 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1969 Post(s)
Liked: 1431
Quote:
Originally Posted by lefthandluke View Post
woah now...that's a game changer. Special software needed? I don't have a multi-channel dac tho. Still...

once downloaded did you sell your discs?
For SACD, you will need a vintage PS3 or Oppo 105 to rip them.
You will have to google.

- Rich
lefthandluke likes this.

Oppo UPD-205 x 2 | UPD-203 | Sonica DAC | Emotiva XMC-1 (v3) | Revel Salon2s, Voice2, Studio2s | Benchmark AHB2 x 4 | ATI AT522NC | Velodyne HGS-15 | LG 77C9 | Lumagen 2020 | HDFury Vertex x 2
RichB is online now  
post #5080 of 5323 Old 09-22-2019, 01:07 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
krabapple's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: in a state bordered by Kentucky and Maine
Posts: 5,779
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 485 Post(s)
Liked: 469
Quote:
Originally Posted by lefthandluke View Post
woah now...that's a game changer. Special software needed? I don't have a multi-channel dac tho. Still...

once downloaded did you sell your discs?
Even the free foobar2000 player software for Windows, with the right plugins (also free), can play multichannel files, of any format.
lefthandluke, SDX-LV and drh3b like this.
krabapple is offline  
post #5081 of 5323 Old 09-22-2019, 01:10 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
krabapple's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: in a state bordered by Kentucky and Maine
Posts: 5,779
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 485 Post(s)
Liked: 469
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichB View Post
For SACD, you will need a vintage PS3 or Oppo 105 to rip them.
You will have to google.

- Rich
Fortunately there are many more hardware options than that.

https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/t...comment-940992
RichB, lefthandluke and drh3b like this.
krabapple is offline  
post #5082 of 5323 Old 09-22-2019, 01:23 PM
Member
 
noway1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 96
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 59 Post(s)
Liked: 30
Wink

Quote:
Originally Posted by Del Boca Vista View Post
Ahhh so it basically means its detailed, probably forward, and maybe has an energetic sound?
Or like watching an amazing dancer where you can't keep your eyes off her vs. one that makes you just want to drink beer, eat potato chips and figure out your football picks.
Soulburner and Scotth3886 like this.
noway1 is offline  
post #5083 of 5323 Old 09-22-2019, 01:32 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
drh3b's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Saint Louis, MO
Posts: 3,777
Mentioned: 34 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2034 Post(s)
Liked: 4064
Quote:
Originally Posted by krabapple View Post
Fortunately there are many more hardware options than that.

https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/t...comment-940992
Yup, I have two Pioneer BDP-80FD's, one in use, and one as a backup. Works great for SACD. Use DVD Audio Extractor for DVD-A, DVD-V, and Blu Rays extracted with MakeMKV. Works great. Play with JRiver on my HTPC.

I also have an OPPO-203 that I never use since I found out how to extract music files. I should sell it and make a profit. It's possible without the convenience of JRiver, I might never got into multichannel music. I tried it when it was originally pushed in the early 2000's, but wasn't impressed, as my system also wasn't as good then. Gave up on it until about 2 years ago.

My World Beating System!
Spoiler!
drh3b is offline  
post #5084 of 5323 Old 09-22-2019, 03:37 PM
AVS Forum Addicted Member
 
Kal Rubinson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: NYC + Connecticut
Posts: 30,290
Mentioned: 23 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1354 Post(s)
Liked: 1289
Quote:
Originally Posted by lefthandluke View Post
I have imported all of my hybrid sacds. I have a micromega mydac that feeds my parasound P5 pre via analog for stereo only and a dragonfly black feeding my Marantz 8801 for multichannel...tho its matrixed only, not discrete. To my ears neither sounds as good as played thru my oppo udp-203 which plays discretely of course.
Yeah. Skip the DACs unless you have a multichannel DAC and use HDMI.

Kal Rubinson

"Music in the Round"
Senior Contributing Editor, Stereophile
http://www.stereophile.com/category/music-round

Kal Rubinson is online now  
post #5085 of 5323 Old 09-22-2019, 03:39 PM
AVS Forum Addicted Member
 
Kal Rubinson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: NYC + Connecticut
Posts: 30,290
Mentioned: 23 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1354 Post(s)
Liked: 1289
Quote:
Originally Posted by papashango61 View Post
Figure this is the best place to ask - wth does it mean when these reviews say a speaker "demands your attention" ???? Im seeing it quite often.
It is an attempt to say that "If you are in the market for such a product, this is one that you must audition and/or consider."

Kal Rubinson

"Music in the Round"
Senior Contributing Editor, Stereophile
http://www.stereophile.com/category/music-round

Kal Rubinson is online now  
post #5086 of 5323 Old 09-22-2019, 03:40 PM
AVS Forum Addicted Member
 
Kal Rubinson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: NYC + Connecticut
Posts: 30,290
Mentioned: 23 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1354 Post(s)
Liked: 1289
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichB View Post
For SACD, you will need a vintage PS3 or Oppo 105 to rip them.
You will have to google.
Those two, yes, but there are many other options these days.

Kal Rubinson

"Music in the Round"
Senior Contributing Editor, Stereophile
http://www.stereophile.com/category/music-round

Kal Rubinson is online now  
post #5087 of 5323 Old 09-22-2019, 05:12 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Milt99's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: The Great Pacific Northwest
Posts: 5,920
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 536 Post(s)
Liked: 525
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kal Rubinson View Post
Those two, yes, but there are many other options these days.
Care to share, Kal?

 
Milt99 is offline  
post #5088 of 5323 Old 09-22-2019, 05:38 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
drh3b's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Saint Louis, MO
Posts: 3,777
Mentioned: 34 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2034 Post(s)
Liked: 4064
Quote:
Originally Posted by Milt99 View Post
Care to share, Kal?
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/89-sp...l#post58593540
krabapple likes this.

My World Beating System!
Spoiler!
drh3b is offline  
post #5089 of 5323 Old 09-22-2019, 05:55 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Milt99's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: The Great Pacific Northwest
Posts: 5,920
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 536 Post(s)
Liked: 525
Quote:
Originally Posted by drh3b View Post
Thanks.
I bought a retro'd PS3 years ago & have an Oppo 105.
Thought there may be a new double-secret simple method I wasn't aware of.

 

Last edited by Milt99; 09-22-2019 at 06:06 PM.
Milt99 is offline  
post #5090 of 5323 Old 09-22-2019, 07:01 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Milt99's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: The Great Pacific Northwest
Posts: 5,920
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 536 Post(s)
Liked: 525
I've been using ISO2DSD for years but not with JRiver or FooBar.
Straight to HD.
Next up is a NAS & Roon for everything.
I follow technological advancements until I feel they reach a balance of usability\price\performance\value ratio, i.e., The Leap.
NAS & storage tech has been solid for years but it advances in capacity, reliability & price.
Seems as Roon has been there for some time as well.
For me it's all about needs & budget.
Thanks

 
Milt99 is offline  
post #5091 of 5323 Old 09-22-2019, 08:24 PM
AVS Forum Addicted Member
 
Kal Rubinson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: NYC + Connecticut
Posts: 30,290
Mentioned: 23 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1354 Post(s)
Liked: 1289
Quote:
Originally Posted by Milt99 View Post
Thanks.
I bought a retro'd PS3 years ago & have an Oppo 105.
Thought there may be a new double-secret simple method I wasn't aware of.
Easy-peasy with the 105.

Kal Rubinson

"Music in the Round"
Senior Contributing Editor, Stereophile
http://www.stereophile.com/category/music-round

Kal Rubinson is online now  
post #5092 of 5323 Old 09-22-2019, 08:44 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Milt99's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: The Great Pacific Northwest
Posts: 5,920
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 536 Post(s)
Liked: 525
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kal Rubinson View Post
Easy-peasy with the 105.
Nice to know, Kal.
Thanks.

 
Milt99 is offline  
post #5093 of 5323 Old 09-23-2019, 03:14 PM
AVS Forum Club Gold
 
craig john's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Lancaster, PA
Posts: 11,799
Mentioned: 65 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1339 Post(s)
Liked: 1578
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Dressler View Post
Yes, my SACDs and DVD-As were collecting dust, too, until I started using Roon. Having ripped them into the library, they integrate seamlessly into playback with 2-channel material. No need to compromise quality for convenience.
Hi Roger,


The above is interesting, and I intend to check it out. I know you're retired from Dolby now, but do you have any "insider" insights into Dolby Atmos Music? Are you planning to use the tech and how do you think it will play out in the marketplace? Do you think consumers will jump on it and embrace it, or will it go the way of DVD-A/SACD?



Craig

Lombardi said it:
"Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence."

My System
craig john is offline  
post #5094 of 5323 Old 09-23-2019, 04:53 PM
AVS Forum Addicted Member
 
Roger Dressler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Oregon
Posts: 11,519
Mentioned: 93 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2978 Post(s)
Liked: 1743
Quote:
Originally Posted by craig john View Post
Hi Roger,

The above is interesting, and I intend to check it out. I know you're retired from Dolby now, but do you have any "insider" insights into Dolby Atmos Music? Are you planning to use the tech and how do you think it will play out in the marketplace? Do you think consumers will jump on it and embrace it, or will it go the way of DVD-A/SACD?

Craig
Hi Craig,

I have no insider insights.

Funny how he pendulum swings sometimes. The MP3 craze being a race to low bitrates, low quality, low cost, high convenience, thence followed by higher bitrate MP3, AAC, lossless, etc. It's not a matter of everyone wanting higher quality streaming, the significance is that the few who do want it can at least get it. Such was not always possible before.

The trend to immersive 3D video is introducing people to new experiences in sight and sound, and just as movie theaters ignited an appetite for bigger, better pictures and sound at home in the '70s, perhaps those who experience immersive tech will develop a taste for immersive music -- duh, more like real virtual life.

As with Atmos for movies, I'd expect there's going to be two flavors of Atmos for music. Streaming and optical disc-based. DD+ with parametric immersive coding is fine for streaming movies, but it is not interesting to me unless it comes either from lossless (hi res) downloads, or on physical media.

When DVD-A and SACD came out, streaming was not prevalent, so all those 5.1 mixes were not offered to folks interested in surround effect but not hung up on lossless quality. That kept the 5.1 mixing market small. Even the 2-ch high-res market was rough because streaming DSD and PCM was not practical. It's still not. Enter MQA.

Atmos music is not about lossless, it's about surround/immersion. If enough people are happy to hear streamed Atmos music, that could help spread the production cost, and that could mean there'd be a growing supply of titles we could obtain via HD download or MQA, if not from physical media.

Setting aside all the techobabble, 5.1 music mixes offer a compelling benefit IMHO. To me it already produces a lovely spatial bubble of immersive effect. I am not yet convinced that adding height channels would do significantly or consistently better, but I'm willing to be convinced.

Sorry for the fragmented O/T reply.
Milt99 and Aja like this.

Deadwood II Theater (Previous Deadwood Theater HTOM)
Anthem AVM 60 7.4.4; Classé SSP-800 PLIIx 7.4; MiniDSP OpenDRC-AN
Oppo UDP-203; Oppo BDP-93; Win10 media PC w/Roon+Kodi; Roku Ultra; DirecTV Genie
Adam Audio S3V/S3H LCR, KEF Ci200QS 4 srrnd, Tannoy Di6 DC 4 hts, Hsu ULS-15 4 subs
JVC RS520; Stewart Cima Neve screen 125" diag 2.35:1, MLP at 115"
Roger Dressler is online now  
post #5095 of 5323 Old 09-24-2019, 05:44 AM
AVS Forum Club Gold
 
craig john's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Lancaster, PA
Posts: 11,799
Mentioned: 65 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1339 Post(s)
Liked: 1578
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Dressler View Post
Hi Craig,

I have no insider insights.
If Dolby Labs didn't retain a relationship with you much like Harman did with Dr. Toole, then they're a much less intelligent organization than I've usually given them credit for. OTOH, if YOU decided not to retain that relationship for whatever reason, then good on ya! (I know you went on to work for SRS Labs, which was eventually acquired by DTS, which is Dolby's primary competitor, but that doesn't mean you couldn't retain some relationship with Dolby. I mean Brett Farve is now back in the Packer fold after having gone to the Vikings for 2 years, so ANYTHING can happen, right?)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Dressler View Post
Funny how he pendulum swings sometimes. The MP3 craze being a race to low bitrates, low quality, low cost, high convenience, thence followed by higher bitrate MP3, AAC, lossless, etc. It's not a matter of everyone wanting higher quality streaming, the significance is that the few who do want it can at least get it. Such was not always possible before.

The trend to immersive 3D video is introducing people to new experiences in sight and sound, and just as movie theaters ignited an appetite for bigger, better pictures and sound at home in the '70s, perhaps those who experience immersive tech will develop a taste for immersive music -- duh, more like real virtual life.
"...real virtual life." Isn't that an oxymoron?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Dressler View Post
As with Atmos for movies, I'd expect there's going to be two flavors of Atmos for music. Streaming and optical disc-based. DD+ with parametric immersive coding is fine for streaming movies, but it is not interesting to me unless it comes either from lossless (hi res) downloads, or on physical media.

When DVD-A and SACD came out, streaming was not prevalent, so all those 5.1 mixes were not offered to folks interested in surround effect but not hung up on lossless quality. That kept the 5.1 mixing market small. Even the 2-ch high-res market was rough because streaming DSD and PCM was not practical. It's still not. Enter MQA.

Atmos music is not about lossless, it's about surround/immersion. If enough people are happy to hear streamed Atmos music, that could help spread the production cost, and that could mean there'd be a growing supply of titles we could obtain via HD download or MQA, if not from physical media.

Setting aside all the techobabble, 5.1 music mixes offer a compelling benefit IMHO. To me it already produces a lovely spatial bubble of immersive effect. I am not yet convinced that adding height channels would do significantly or consistently better, but I'm willing to be convinced.

Sorry for the fragmented O/T reply.
Thanks for the insights. They're quite interesting. I'm not sure this is completely OT, as there was as much "science" involved in the things you developed as there was in the speaker development done at the NRC and Harman. It's important to understand the science of the signals we send to the speakers to help understand the benefits of the Spinorama. You were a giant in that science, much the same as Dr. Toole was a giant in his arena.

Just to be sure we keep it on topic, let me ask you this: What do you think would be the ideal dispersion pattern for ceiling speakers for Atmos Music? I doubt there will be much highly-directional content in the overhead channels, and they will likely contain much more ambiance-enhancing type sounds. Therefore, will less directional speakers be more beneficial? Would you preferentially "aim" the speakers at the LP, or use speakers that spray sound to a much wider area?

In a similar vein, do you think it will be important for the success of Atmos Music for sound engineers to place directional sounds in the overheads? Many people make the investment in 3D audio specifically to hear the directional content in movies. Do you think that same will hold true for Music, or is ambiance enhancement going to be "enough"?

Craig
SouthernCA likes this.

Lombardi said it:
"Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence."

My System
craig john is offline  
post #5096 of 5323 Old 09-24-2019, 10:27 AM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: Russia
Posts: 346
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 245 Post(s)
Liked: 71
I don't know a better thread to ask, but are there any spl formulas for bass frequencies and calculating how much air I need to move (there are formulas for "free air" to calculate excursion, but it is certainly not the same in the room)

Maybe related to room volume or similar characteristic?

Last edited by aats; 09-24-2019 at 10:56 AM.
aats is online now  
post #5097 of 5323 Old 09-24-2019, 01:58 PM
AVS Forum Addicted Member
 
Roger Dressler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Oregon
Posts: 11,519
Mentioned: 93 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2978 Post(s)
Liked: 1743
Quote:
Originally Posted by craig john View Post
Just to be sure we keep it on topic, let me ask you this: What do you think would be the ideal dispersion pattern for ceiling speakers for Atmos Music? I doubt there will be much highly-directional content in the overhead channels, and they will likely contain much more ambiance-enhancing type sounds. Therefore, will less directional speakers be more beneficial? Would you preferentially "aim" the speakers at the LP, or use speakers that spray sound to a much wider area?
IMHO the question is not so much about finding special speaker characteristics to favor ambiance or reverb, but for music producers to realize it is their responsibility to convey the desired effect from conventional speakers in any given configuration. Just as we have seen from the best stereo and 5.1 productions, so too would we hope to see that in immersive productions. It does of course help to have some consistency in the speaker configurations, and by that I do not mean we must all use the same 7.1.4 structure, but that there be commonalities in the nested subsets across the various speaker configurations.

My preference for aiming is to consider not just the MLP as the sole target, but the extents of the listening area when there are multiple seats present. One strategy being to aim the surrounds toward the most distant seat from the given speaker. Within reason.

Quote:
In a similar vein, do you think it will be important for the success of Atmos Music for sound engineers to place directional sounds in the overheads? Many people make the investment in 3D audio specifically to hear the directional content in movies. Do you think that same will hold true for Music, or is ambiance enhancement going to be "enough"?
What creators place in any of the speakers is purely their artistic decision. Listeners ought not rate these productions on the statistical preponderance of directional sounds in the overheads, but rather on whether the overall effect is compelling.

Deadwood II Theater (Previous Deadwood Theater HTOM)
Anthem AVM 60 7.4.4; Classé SSP-800 PLIIx 7.4; MiniDSP OpenDRC-AN
Oppo UDP-203; Oppo BDP-93; Win10 media PC w/Roon+Kodi; Roku Ultra; DirecTV Genie
Adam Audio S3V/S3H LCR, KEF Ci200QS 4 srrnd, Tannoy Di6 DC 4 hts, Hsu ULS-15 4 subs
JVC RS520; Stewart Cima Neve screen 125" diag 2.35:1, MLP at 115"

Last edited by Roger Dressler; 09-24-2019 at 06:26 PM.
Roger Dressler is online now  
post #5098 of 5323 Old 09-24-2019, 04:08 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 16
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 17 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by aats View Post
I don't know a better thread to ask, but are there any spl formulas for bass frequencies and calculating how much air I need to move (there are formulas for "free air" to calculate excursion, but it is certainly not the same in the room)

Maybe related to room volume or similar characteristic?
Is this what you are looking for?
http://linkwitzlab.com/SPL%20nomographs.htm
NTK-129 is offline  
post #5099 of 5323 Old 09-24-2019, 08:05 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Soulburner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Lincoln
Posts: 4,901
Mentioned: 47 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 194 Post(s)
Liked: 1634
I'd like to see a spin of the Infinity RS152 to see how the back-firing woofer affects its frequency response as compared to the bookshelves and towers that are direct-firing.

HT: Samsung PN64H5000 (recommended settings) | NAD T758 V3 | Buchardt S400 (2) | Emotiva E2 (2) | Rythmik Audio F12 (2)
Soulburner is online now  
post #5100 of 5323 Old 09-25-2019, 04:45 AM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: Russia
Posts: 346
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 245 Post(s)
Liked: 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by NTK-129 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by aats View Post
I don't know a better thread to ask, but are there any spl formulas for bass frequencies and calculating how much air I need to move (there are formulas for "free air" to calculate excursion, but it is certainly not the same in the room)

Maybe related to room volume or similar characteristic?
Is this what you are looking for?
http://linkwitzlab.com/SPL%20nomographs.htm
It is for free space, so can't be applied to a room.
probably have to find some subwoofer with a known sensetivity and measure.
aats is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply Speakers

Tags
cea 2034 , double-blind , listening tests , loudspeaker measurements , spinorama

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off