Can you suggest a good modern system to replace my Atlantic Technology System 350? - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 26 Old 07-04-2019, 11:02 PM - Thread Starter
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Can you suggest a good modern system to replace my Atlantic Technology System 350?

I have had these Atlantic Technology System 350THX speakers for over 15 years. They still sound great, but I cannot find an affordable receiver that can power them without shutting off at any reasonable volume.

I have a brand new Onkyo TX-RZ830 that I absolutely love. It’s rated for 4ohm speakers, but if I turn the sound up anywhere above 70 (82 is reference) it won’t make it through an entire movie without shutting off and going into amp diag mode at least once. I had the same problem with the Sony STR-DN1080 I had before. The only thing I ever had that would run them reliably was a set of old Marantz MA500U mono thx amps. I think it’s probably time to get some newer speakers rather than another external amp.

What would be an affordable new system that would give me the same sound I’ve been used to without being quite so hard on my receiver? Or if there just isn’t one under $1500.. Can you suggest a good 5 channel amp that could handle them that I could use with the pre-outs on the Onkyo?
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post #2 of 26 Old 07-05-2019, 11:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brett Hays View Post
I have had these Atlantic Technology System 350THX speakers for over 15 years. They still sound great, but I cannot find an affordable receiver that can power them without shutting off at any reasonable volume.

I have a brand new Onkyo TX-RZ830 that I absolutely love. It’s rated for 4ohm speakers, but if I turn the sound up anywhere above 70 (82 is reference) it won’t make it through an entire movie without shutting off and going into amp diag mode at least once. I had the same problem with the Sony STR-DN1080 I had before. The only thing I ever had that would run them reliably was a set of old Marantz MA500U mono thx amps. I think it’s probably time to get some newer speakers rather than another external amp.

What would be an affordable new system that would give me the same sound I’ve been used to without being quite so hard on my receiver? Or if there just isn’t one under $1500.. Can you suggest a good 5 channel amp that could handle them that I could use with the pre-outs on the Onkyo?
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post #3 of 26 Old 07-05-2019, 11:06 AM
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Are you running that receiver in an airflow-restricted cubbyhole?

Good 5 channel amp, look at Outlaw Audio Model 5000. Excellent 4 Ohm capability AND rated with all channels driven (good luck finding that elsewhere at anywhere near the price).

As to a speaker set, what are your criteria for sound, aesthetics/size, room size, seating distance, usage?

Does that budget include a sub?
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post #4 of 26 Old 07-05-2019, 11:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brett Hays View Post

I have a brand new Onkyo TX-RZ830 that I absolutely love. It’s rated for 4ohm speakers, but if I turn the sound up anywhere above 70 (82 is reference) it won’t make it through an entire movie without shutting off and going into amp diag mode at least once. I had the same problem with the Sony STR-DN1080 I had before. The only thing I ever had that would run them reliably was a set of old Marantz MA500U mono thx amps. I think it’s probably time to get some newer speakers rather than another external amp.
Another option, as the center channel gets the most workout in a movie, is to get a monoblock amp for the center channel.

Ask Emotiva if this will likely solve your problem.

https://emotiva.com/collections/amps/products/hc-1

Actually, to test that theory, go into your Onkyo's menu and tell it you don't have a center channel to see if you still have the shut down problem running 4.1 with phantom center.

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post #5 of 26 Old 07-05-2019, 12:01 PM
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That looks like a great deal.
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post #7 of 26 Old 07-05-2019, 01:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brett Hays View Post

What would be an affordable new system that would give me the same sound I’ve been used to without being quite so hard on my receiver? Or if there just isn’t one under $1500.. Can you suggest a good 5 channel amp that could handle them that I could use with the pre-outs on the Onkyo?
Not easy tp beat that sysrem
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/89-sp...tml#post623545

Look at the Outlaw Amp
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post #8 of 26 Old 07-05-2019, 06:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brett Hays View Post
I have had these Atlantic Technology System 350THX speakers for over 15 years. They still sound great, but I cannot find an affordable receiver that can power them without shutting off at any reasonable volume.

I have a brand new Onkyo TX-RZ830 that I absolutely love. It’s rated for 4ohm speakers, but if I turn the sound up anywhere above 70 (82 is reference) it won’t make it through an entire movie without shutting off and going into amp diag mode at least once. I had the same problem with the Sony STR-DN1080 I had before. The only thing I ever had that would run them reliably was a set of old Marantz MA500U mono thx amps. I think it’s probably time to get some newer speakers rather than another external amp.

What would be an affordable new system that would give me the same sound I’ve been used to without being quite so hard on my receiver? Or if there just isn’t one under $1500.. Can you suggest a good 5 channel amp that could handle them that I could use with the pre-outs on the Onkyo?
Something's amiss Brett. Any THX Select certified AVR like your new Onkyo should have no issues cleanly driving all amplified channels of a system comprising of THX certified speakers** to Reference Level (0.0dB/82 MV) in a room up to "Select sized". Your listening distance may be longer than 12ft, but at say -7.0dB/75 MV you're only calling for 1/5th of the power from the Onkyo than would be needed at 0.0dB/82 MV. In addition, you're apparently not using all 9 of the Onkyo's amps.

As the Onkyo seems to make it a fair way through a movie before shutting off, I wonder if cumulative heat build-up is the issue. Is the Onkyo adequately ventilated?

Also, did you dutifully follow the Onkyo's manual and set the speaker impedance to 4Ω? If so, I strongly recommend you change it back to 6Ω. See this post for an explanation, particularly the comparative output figures for the high and low impedance settings in the linked Audioholics measurements. The Onkyo's protection circuits could be detecting that amps are being overdriven due to the voltage limiting the 4Ω setting applies.

It's going to be tough to match the performance of your current speakers with a $1500 budget, so a bit of diagnosis is probably worth a shot.

** Edit: While the speakers comprising the AT System 350THX are indeed 4Ω nom. impedance, like any THX speakers they are designed as a strictly sub/satellite system and therefore can trade off LF extension to gain above average sensitivity, in this case "90dB" (no units). This good sensitivity means these speakers should not be difficult to drive to high levels with a mid-tier AVR.

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post #9 of 26 Old 07-05-2019, 06:28 PM
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check out the monoprice monolith amps if you want an outboard amp. but an AC infinity fan would be a lot cheaper!

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check out the monoprice monolith amps if you want an outboard amp. but an AC infinity fan would be a lot cheaper!
Those are very cool ...

https://www.acinfinity.com/receiver-amp-cooling-fans/

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post #11 of 26 Old 07-05-2019, 10:41 PM - Thread Starter
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I do have a cooler on the receiver, it’s not an ac infinity but it’s similar.. moves quite a bit of air.

I decided I didn’t want to give up on my speakers so I ordered an Emotiva A-500 BasX amp. It seemed to have pretty solid reviews and I got a great deal.

Thanks for the recommendations.
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post #12 of 26 Old 07-08-2019, 11:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Brett Hays View Post
I do have a cooler on the receiver, it’s not an ac infinity but it’s similar.. moves quite a bit of air.

I decided I didn’t want to give up on my speakers so I ordered an Emotiva A-500 BasX amp. It seemed to have pretty solid reviews and I got a great deal.

Thanks for the recommendations.
Be sure to update us with your impressions of the Emo Amp ...
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post #13 of 26 Old 07-13-2019, 10:43 AM - Thread Starter
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Ok, update.

Hooked up the Emotiva Amp and it shut off even more quickly than the Onkyo receiver. Started pulling speakers one at a time to isolate and narrowed it to the left front speaker. Replaced the speaker cable, no change. Ugh, 20 year old speakers, how am I going to find a replacement?

So, I started disconnecting drivers in the speaker one by one and the amp would shut off exactly the same with no drivers connected at all, so I'm assuming that means the crossover module is the problem. I emailed Atlantic Technology to see if I can get a replacement crossover module.

I searched everywhere for 351LR speakers and found nothing. I did find a 353C center channel speaker on Ebay (same drivers and crossovers in the 351LR and 353C) and purchased that. So when it gets here I will hook it up in place of the left front.. if it solves the issue I will swap all of the components, starting with the crossover into the left speaker cabinet.

Ugh,

I have gone through purchasing a set of Marantz mono block amps (which never shut off with this issue.. crazy)
Getting a new Sony STRDN1080 receiver and returning it when it was shutting off
Getting a new Onkyo TX-RZ830 receiver thinking it would be able to handle the 4ohm speakers better
Ordering the Emotiva A500 when the Onkyo kept shutting off.. and now this..

Finally found the problem, at least.. so.. assuming this fixes the problem, I will hook the Onkyo back directly to the speakers and assuming it handles them fine, decide whether to keep or return the Emotiva... good grief
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post #14 of 26 Old 07-13-2019, 10:45 AM - Thread Starter
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Something's amiss Brett.
It turned out to be the left front speaker (specifically the crossover I believe) see my post just now.. what an odyssey this has been
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post #15 of 26 Old 07-13-2019, 12:38 PM
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Sounds like you have a handle on the actual problem and it's solution, at least for now. Keep us updated, as you work through the problem.
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post #16 of 26 Old 07-13-2019, 01:01 PM - Thread Starter
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Sounds like you have a handle on the actual problem and it's solution, at least for now. Keep us updated, as you work through the problem.
Hopefully. Feeling really dumb at the moment. I've been fighting this for years and never stopped to think about it being the speakers. I checked the cables.

It's just crazy that the Marantz mono amp that was on that speaker just powered right through whatever the problem is..
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post #17 of 26 Old 07-13-2019, 01:48 PM
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Hopefully. Feeling really dumb at the moment. I've been fighting this for years and never stopped to think about it being the speakers. I checked the cables.

It's just crazy that the Marantz mono amp that was on that speaker just powered right through whatever the problem is..
Marantz:

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post #18 of 26 Old 07-13-2019, 02:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Brett Hays View Post
I have had these Atlantic Technology System 350THX speakers for over 15 years. They still sound great, but I cannot find an affordable receiver that can power them without shutting off at any reasonable volume.

I have a brand new Onkyo TX-RZ830 that I absolutely love. It’s rated for 4ohm speakers, but if I turn the sound up anywhere above 70 (82 is reference) it won’t make it through an entire movie without shutting off and going into amp diag mode at least once. I had the same problem with the Sony STR-DN1080 I had before. The only thing I ever had that would run them reliably was a set of old Marantz MA500U mono thx amps. I think it’s probably time to get some newer speakers rather than another external amp.

What would be an affordable new system that would give me the same sound I’ve been used to without being quite so hard on my receiver? Or if there just isn’t one under $1500.. Can you suggest a good 5 channel amp that could handle them that I could use with the pre-outs on the Onkyo?
Do you have subs in your setup?
Are you running your speakers full range, I.E set to large?
Low frequencies are very power demanding on your AVR.

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post #19 of 26 Old 07-14-2019, 08:22 AM - Thread Starter
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Do you have subs in your setup?
Are you running your speakers full range, I.E set to large?
Low frequencies are very power demanding on your AVR.
Yes, two powered subs run from the sub out on the Onkyo RZ830.
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post #20 of 26 Old 07-14-2019, 10:03 AM
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Do you have subs in your setup?

Are you running your speakers full range, I.E set to large?

Low frequencies are very power demanding on your AVR.


Kinda sounding like there was some type of dead short on the crossover board.


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So my dad ran into this problem awhile back and it was the arc HDMI cable causing problems. The tv would try to talk to the receiver and then it would shut the receiver off. Check you tv settings

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post #22 of 26 Old 07-15-2019, 04:27 AM
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It turned out to be the left front speaker (specifically the crossover I believe) see my post just now.. what an odyssey this has been
Thanks for the update! Some handy diagnosing there, I reckon. Assuming the replacement crossover does the trick, I think you'll find the Onkyo will have no problem cleanly driving the A/T's to high SPL's. I'd return the Emotiva as surplus to requirements in that case.

The Marantz mono's could have had less sensitive fault/protection circuitry than the Sony, Onkyo and Emotiva.
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post #23 of 26 Old 07-16-2019, 08:31 PM
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Originally Posted by GIEGAR View Post
Thanks for the update! Some handy diagnosing there, I reckon. Assuming the replacement crossover does the trick, I think you'll find the Onkyo will have no problem cleanly driving the A/T's to high SPL's. I'd return the Emotiva as surplus to requirements in that case.

The Marantz mono's could have had less sensitive fault/protection circuitry than the Sony, Onkyo and Emotiva.
More likely, the Marantz are better built and therefore more fault-tolerant than the other options.

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post #24 of 26 Old 07-19-2019, 11:40 AM - Thread Starter
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I received the center channel from eBay. Plugged it in in place of the left front and it solved the issues, so I transferred all of the drivers and crossovers from the center channel into the left front cabinet and the Emotiva Amp is on it's way back!!
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post #25 of 26 Old 07-19-2019, 01:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Brett Hays View Post
I received the center channel from eBay. Plugged it in in place of the left front and it solved the issues, so I transferred all of the drivers and crossovers from the center channel into the left front cabinet and the Emotiva Amp is on it's way back!!

Congrats on dodging the bullet! Replacing all the speakers would have been many times more expensive.

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post #26 of 26 Old 07-20-2019, 11:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brett Hays View Post
I received the center channel from eBay. Plugged it in in place of the left front and it solved the issues, so I transferred all of the drivers and crossovers from the center channel into the left front cabinet and the Emotiva Amp is on it's way back!!
Congratulations!

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