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-   -   KEF R11 or GoldenEar Triton One.R...? (https://www.avsforum.com/forum/89-speakers/3089458-kef-r11-goldenear-triton-one-r.html)

New24K 09-07-2019 09:45 PM

KEF R11 or GoldenEar Triton One.R...?
 
KEF R11 or GoldenEar Triton One.R...?

70% music, 30% movies.

Any thoughts?

Russdawg1 09-07-2019 10:19 PM

I personally would go with the Kef’s.

Are you using a sub?

torii 09-07-2019 10:28 PM

I really enjoyed some of goldenear towers, but crossed off my list due to not having flat top to put something on top of speakers...guess Im picky. havent heard kefs.

Anygreg 09-08-2019 12:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Russdawg1 (Post 58528402)
I personally would go with the Kef’s.

Are you using a sub?



I agree, the new R series from KEF is almost on par with the current reference, certainly closed the gap considerably.

KenM10759 09-08-2019 03:44 AM

Very biased opinion with me but I'll also vote R11's. When I heard them I was quite impressed that the little things I didn't like about the previous R900 (larger drivers less controlled) has been eliminated with the new series.

Plenty of bass there for 90% of the music most people listen to, but either speaker would benefit from true subwoofers to give frequencies below 25-30hz the force they should have.

mmiles 09-08-2019 07:08 AM

Not listened to KEF in long time but I am very familiar with the GE line being a dealer.

The soundstage is amazing and you get 2 subs. Agreed to dig below 30hz at higher volume will probably require a standalone sub. This also depends on any room gain that is present.

aarons915 09-08-2019 08:59 AM

The new R series is pretty good but a bit laid back, if you have Dirac live, XT32 or another way to EQ your response, that shouldn't matter but it's something to think about. At this price point you really have to at least listen to the Revel F206 or F208 and probably the Sierra towers as well to see if you might prefer a ribbon. I would probably narrow your choice down to 2 solid speakers and audition both in your own home, it's very difficult to compare speakers in showrooms, especially different ones.

New24K 09-08-2019 09:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Russdawg1 (Post 58528402)
I personally would go with the Kef’s.

Are you using a sub?


Well, if I went with the KEF R11 - I would get a sub(s) - so the total price for the set up would be about the same.

Russdawg1 09-08-2019 09:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by New24K (Post 58529540)
Well, if I went with the KEF R11 - I would get a sub(s) - so the total price for the set up would be about the same.


Then yeah, the bass will outperform the goldenears, but even regardless I’d prefer the Kef’s because I like the looks and there’s something about the UniQ tech I just like.

gajCA 09-08-2019 11:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by New24K (Post 58529540)
Well, if I went with the KEF R11 - I would get a sub(s) - so the total price for the set up would be about the same.

Top is listening window for the KEF's, bottom is the Golden Ears.


https://www.soundstagenetwork.com/in...=16&Itemid=140

https://www.soundstagenetwork.com/im...ningwindow.png

https://www.soundstagenetwork.com/im...ningwindow.png

KenM10759 09-08-2019 03:32 PM

It should be noted that the method of measurement used doesn't take into consideration the contribution of the ports on the R11, and that's typically what fills in that dip you see. Also, if you go to the actual reviews there's some good info on manipulating the R11's response with the port plugs, with very positive results for the reviewer. When I heard them, they were driven by mid-level Naim gear and that drive the bass with very effective power and speed.

https://www.soundstagehifi.com/index...1-loudspeakers

New24K 09-08-2019 07:19 PM

Have to admit, am a little surprised that everyone who gave an opinion on the two stated the KEF R11 - and not one GE One.R.

aarons915 09-08-2019 07:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by New24K (Post 58531580)
Have to admit, am a little surprised that everyone who gave an opinion on the two stated the KEF R11 - and not one GE One.R.

You should really audition both and not rely on opinions on the internet. Comparing the listening window, for example, is a very amateurish way of deciding, considering most people listen to speakers a bit off-axis. The overall measurements of both are very good and you should really listen to both and see how you feel. The good news is you'll probably be happy with both speakers.

gajCA 09-09-2019 12:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aarons915 (Post 58531640)
You should really audition both and not rely on opinions on the internet. Comparing the listening window, for example, is a very amateurish way of deciding, considering most people listen to speakers a bit off-axis. The overall measurements of both are very good and you should really listen to both and see how you feel. The good news is you'll probably be happy with both speakers.

"Amateurish?"

Listening window
20Hz - 20kHz (measured @ 2m, plotted @ 1m)
Response curve is an average of five measurements: on-axis, 15 degrees left and right off-axis, 15 degrees up and down off-axis


Complete off axis measurements were provided in the link.

All show a stark difference above 5khz and you know very well that the flatter the response the higher the preference.

aarons915 09-09-2019 12:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gajCA (Post 58534258)
"Amateurish?"

Listening window
20Hz - 20kHz (measured @ 2m, plotted @ 1m)
Response curve is an average of five measurements: on-axis, 15 degrees left and right off-axis, 15 degrees up and down off-axis


Complete off axis measurements were provided in the link.

All show a stark difference above 5khz and you know very well that the flatter the response the higher the preference.

Sorry I wasn't meaning to direct that toward you even though I can see why you would think so. I just meant that since most people don't listen directly on-axis, the listening window isn't necessarily a great measurement to rely on. In Harman's model, if you take out the bass extension (this is assuming that you're using subs of course), the on-axis accounts for 40% of the preference and off-axis is about 60%. So not only is it more important but I also believe that because of the way the testing is done, which is a single speaker directly on-axis in front of the listener, it might make the on-axis measurements seem more important than they really are since most of us don't point our speakers directly toward our ears. One of these days I'll get around to posing that question in the Science thread.

Either way, I think the OP has found a few really good speakers and he should probably audition them at this point.

gajCA 09-09-2019 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aarons915 (Post 58534416)
Sorry I wasn't meaning to direct that toward you even though I can see why you would think so. I just meant that since most people don't listen directly on-axis, the listening window isn't necessarily a great measurement to rely on. In Harman's model, if you take out the bass extension (this is assuming that you're using subs of course), the on-axis accounts for 40% of the preference and off-axis is about 60%. So not only is it more important but I also believe that because of the way the testing is done, which is a single speaker directly on-axis in front of the listener, it might make the on-axis measurements seem more important than they really are since most of us don't point our speakers directly toward our ears. One of these days I'll get around to posing that question in the Science thread.

Either way, I think the OP has found a few really good speakers and he should probably audition them at this point.

I toe in my two sets of speakers so they aim at the main listening position; the cone and domes in my main HT and the AMTs in my secondary room.

But even at other seating positions I don't notice any "bad" effects.

My cone and domes measure well, my AMTs not so much; like them both!

torii 09-09-2019 03:51 PM

you need to listen to em. here are some crappy measurements and I assure you they the most raved about speakers of the year. amazing....
https://www.stereophile.com/content/...r-measurements

Steve Dodds 09-09-2019 08:44 PM

As a long term owner of dipoles and an objectivist, I can assure you that all dipole speakers will exhibit similar behaviour when measured near-field. To get flat bass at the listening position requires a 6dB octave boost due to dipole cancellation.

torii 09-09-2019 08:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Dodds (Post 58536432)
As a long term owner of dipoles and an objectivist, I can assure you that all dipole speakers will exhibit similar behaviour when measured near-field. To get flat bass at the listening position requires a 6dB octave boost due to dipole cancellation.

I have subs with mine and I boost 6-12db....but I boost my focals also. in my setup I can eq flat response on focals and its not what I want....and they measure pretty flat anyways....the maggies dont measure flat and I dont eq them to and they sound great.

New24K 09-10-2019 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aarons915 (Post 58531640)
You should really audition both...


I have (well the R11 and the Triton One - not One.R) - but at different times and different places.

I listened to the R11 yesterday and to me it sounded quite "laid back" - as another commenter noted.

Now I am not sure if it was just because the music the guy was playing was in Tidal or...

tonygeno 09-10-2019 09:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by New24K (Post 58538208)
I have (well the R11 and the Triton One - not One.R) - but at different times and different places.

I listened to the R11 yesterday and to me it sounded quite "laid back" - as another commenter noted.

Now I am not sure if it was just because the music the guy was playing was in Tidal or...

Tidal should have zero to do with it.

aarons915 09-10-2019 10:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by New24K (Post 58538208)
I have (well the R11 and the Triton One - not One.R) - but at different times and different places.

I listened to the R11 yesterday and to me it sounded quite "laid back" - as another commenter noted.

Now I am not sure if it was just because the music the guy was playing was in Tidal or...

The whole new R series is voiced that way, I'm really not sure why they choose to do that but they did. The good news is because the on and off-axis is so well behaved, they could easily be EQ'd to sound more neutral. If you don't have Dirac live or XT32 and don't want to mess with EQ, I would choose another speaker. I still think it's a good idea to audition the Revel F206/F208 but the Goldenears appear to be very good as well.

KenM10759 09-10-2019 03:27 PM

I for one do not feel that they are laid-back. If you are accustomed to speakers with bright tweeters or ones with higher volume output of upper treble, perhaps you feel that way but I think they're already neutral.

New24K 09-10-2019 04:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KenM10759 (Post 58540010)
I for one do not feel that they are laid-back. If you are accustomed to speakers with bright tweeters or ones with higher volume output of upper treble, perhaps you feel that way but I think they're already neutral.


I guess I like a more "forward" sounding speaker vs. "laid back"... :confused:

I like to hear the singer singing "right in front" of me so to speak - and not back by the actual speakers...

Does that make sense?

KenM10759 09-10-2019 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by New24K (Post 58540168)
I guess I like a more "forward" sounding speaker vs. "laid back"... :confused:

I like to hear the singer singing "right in front" of me so to speak - and not back by the actual speakers...

Does that make sense?

That's not a function of forward or laid-back, that's a function of how a speaker presents the soundstage. I get the feeling the R11's you heard were NOT set up right because they are one of the best speakers I've ever heard in that price range for creating a well-defined soundstage which had the ability to put a singer out front, the piano player stage right, the drummer behind the front of the speakers, a guitarist stage left, etc.

torii 09-10-2019 05:00 PM

that type of soundstage with singer out front I have heard with focal sopras in small space and speakers close to walls. also had simaudio electronics. the catch however is I have only heard that type of stage with that particular room setup and electronics. so might of been a fluke. maybe you can experiment with your current gear and positioning to see if can replicate. most speakers designed to have image/stage behind the speakers.

sigpig 09-11-2019 11:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by New24K (Post 58538208)
I listened to the R11 yesterday and to me it sounded quite "laid back" - as another commenter noted.

I auditioned the R900 vs the Paradigm Prestige 85F with the same electronics, same positioning, and same music. Both my wife and I didn't like the Kefs as they sounded congested(?), too laid back, and with poor bass punch compared to the Paradigms. This was shocking, since the two sets of speakers were approx the same price.

Russdawg1 09-11-2019 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sigpig (Post 58543472)
I auditioned the R900 vs the Paradigm Prestige 85F with the same electronics, same positioning, and same music. Both my wife and I didn't like the Kefs as they sounded congested(?), too laid back, and with poor bass punch compared to the Paradigms. This was shocking, since the two sets of speakers were approx the same price.


I think the R11 and R900 are quite different.

I wonder how you’d rate them if you did the same comparison with the Paradigms.

New24K 09-11-2019 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sigpig (Post 58543472)
I auditioned the R900 vs the Paradigm Prestige 85F with the same electronics, same positioning, and same music. Both my wife and I didn't like the Kefs as they sounded congested(?), too laid back, and with poor bass punch compared to the Paradigms. This was shocking, since the two sets of speakers were approx the same price.


This is exactly how I felt while auditioning the R11...

PhilH930 09-11-2019 06:38 PM

I can only speak to the KEFs vs. comparable models from B&W and ML, but to me the KEFs were superior in every way. I will say the amp/receiver made a big difference. I'm sure all testing is on high end equipment, but with any Denon (up to 8500) the KEFs did sound flat, slightly boring and dead. They really opened up with Marantz, more lively and energetic, and Arcam took them to a whole other level (I know Denon and Marantz are the same parent company and share 99.9% of parts, but everyone that heard the audition agreed). This was based on an R11.

I ended up ordering R7s as they fit my room better, coupled with some subs. Good luck - all wonderful speakers.


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