Center for B&W DM580 or a set instead - Page 3 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #61 of 111 Old 02-11-2020, 03:23 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Zorba922 View Post
Surrounds don't need to play much bass, so I wouldn't worry about the QA books having a little more extension. If the QAs are much cheaper than the JBLs for you, then sure why not as long as you don't have any trouble mounting them.
I already have the JBLs, I got them "2nd hand" still sealed in a box for ~$146. I thought of trying to unload them for about that price or possibly a bit more. They about $235 landed from amazon.com and a known brand, may have takers for them.

QA sells on Amazon.UK for ~$245 landed. The 3020 graphite (same color as my towers) is much cheaper there than all the other colors listed (which seem to be sold by other sellers) and same price as the 3010. When I wrote the first post, they had the 3-4 in stock and like an hour or two later it was down to just 1, so I pulled the trigger in case restock price would be higher. I suppose I can refuse or RMA it if I change my mind.

As you said before, one starts by wanting to just get a couple of pieces and ends up spiraling into spending quite a bit more, so I thought why not just go for that. I like the look, I thought they are smaller, they have better specs on paper and they have tailored wall mounts that don't cost a ton.

I wish I had the flexibility Americans or Brits etc have to get stuff back and forth at such ease til settling on something.
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Use Audyssey settings as a starting point only, and manually readjust to suit your own tastes. When running a subwoofer in play, I'd set the QA towers on "small" at 60Hz or 80Hz crossover. The surrounds should definitely be 80Hz.
Great, I will try that once I have everything ready to be plugged. Have to remember how to re-enble the manual EQ part. IIRC it had a long list of frequencies you can custom set a db value for each of them. I have about zero idea what to do with that but I'm sure the wise web will help me. I've been slowly reading through the QA owners thread here and writing down tips, only covered about 15% of the thread so far, heh.

I've had several drawbacks of the silliest kind. Like not being able to find wires or even an RCA cable at reasonable prices locally. e.g The cheapest 12 or 14 AWG copper covered wires are like $1.5 per 3 feet vs ~$0.75 on Amazon. OFC ones are near $4 vs under $1.5. I need about 70 feet, so it adds up to quite a lot. I'm not going to buy those $300 a foot cables that some people believe gives you a 100 times better sound, but I don't want the lowest quality either. The snake oil industry seems to be thriving in Audiophilia.

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post #62 of 111 Old 02-12-2020, 04:00 AM - Thread Starter
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With the C1, make sure your receiver has them set on "small" and use an 80Hz crossover. You will need to set the correct distance and level match them to the QA towers through your receiver.
Much much better now. Whether I can tell if the center works well with the towers or not is too early to tell. With all the recent changes in sound I've had after over 30 years with 2.0, and my lack of experience, it's hard to be objective. Certainly when in the back of my mind I know it could be problematic to match different of brands of centers to fronts.

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post #63 of 111 Old 02-12-2020, 12:05 PM
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Much much better now. Whether I can tell if the center works well with the towers or not is too early to tell. With all the recent changes in sound I've had after over 30 years with 2.0, and my lack of experience, it's hard to be objective. Certainly when in the back of my mind I know it could be problematic to match different of brands of centers to fronts.
How do the QA 3050s sound vs the DM580s.

I'm guessing more similar than different.

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post #64 of 111 Old 02-12-2020, 12:24 PM - Thread Starter
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How do the QA 3050s sound vs the DM580s.
I'm guessing more similar than different.
That is a very good question that I have not yet put to the test for various reasons. I'm still learning my way through the various AVR settings, as you may have read, I had the center setup all wrong.

Not everything is set up yet, and if I'm being honest, I'm afraid to be disappointed if I end up thinking the B&Ws are better to my ears, haha.

To properly compare them, I would need an option to be able to switch between them on the fly without unhooking one and rehooking the other - think you call it AB.
I wouldn't trust my memory to carry the impressions long enough if it takes more than a 2mins to switch between them

Could this be done on an AVR level? Like connect 2 as Fronts and 2 as surrounds (but with fronts settings) and then enable/disable a set each time.


I used to be a very heavy record collector for many many years till I decided it's enough. I think this whole chase is some regression I'm having

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post #65 of 111 Old 02-12-2020, 12:27 PM
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That is a very good question that I have not yet put to the test for various reasons. I'm still learning my way through the various AVR settings, as you may have read, I had the center setup all wrong.

Not everything is set up yet, and if I'm being honest, I'm afraid to be disappointed if I end up thinking the B&Ws are better to my ears, haha.

To properly compare them, I would need an option to be able to switch between them on the fly without unhooking one and rehooking the other - think you call it AB.
I wouldn't trust my memory to carry the impressions long enough if it takes more than a 2mins to switch between them

Could this be done on an AVR level? Like connect 2 as Fronts and 2 as surrounds (but with fronts settings) and then enable/disable a set each time.
If your AVR has a Zone 2 it could work but the speaker volumes would have to be level matched using an SPL meter or SPL App on a smartphone.

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post #66 of 111 Old 02-12-2020, 12:39 PM - Thread Starter
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If your AVR has a Zone 2 it could work but the speaker volumes would have to be level matched using an SPL meter or SPL App on a smartphone.
Ah, zones. My AVR doesn't have them. It's a pretty basic Marantz one I picked mostly because they seem to be one of the only ones available that make them short enough to fit into the cabinet I have. I now regret not starting the 2nd hand chase with that. But I wasn't planning on any of it till I got it and decided I have to fill all the ports it has for more speakers It was either between that of a Sony one that is fairly short too but the Sony didn't have a phono-in option. Now unless I can find a better AVR for cheap, I probably won't replace it before they start making AVRs that support all the "latest" tech, such as HDR10+ passthrough and HDMI 2.1. I would then also upgrade the TV.
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post #67 of 111 Old 02-12-2020, 12:45 PM
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Ah, zones. My AVR doesn't have them. It's a pretty basic Marantz one I picked mostly because they seem to be one of the only ones available that make them short enough to fit into the cabinet I have. I now regret not starting the 2nd hand chase with that. But I wasn't planning on any of it till I got it and decided I have to fill all the ports it has for more speakers It was either between that of a Sony one that is fairly short too but the Sony didn't have a phono-in option. Now unless I can find a better AVR for cheap, I probably won't replace it before they start making AVRs that support all the "latest" tech, such as HDR10+ passthrough and HDMI 2.1. I would then also upgrade the TV.
Which Marantz?

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post #68 of 111 Old 02-12-2020, 12:53 PM - Thread Starter
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which marantz?
nr1509
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post #69 of 111 Old 02-12-2020, 01:01 PM - Thread Starter
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SPL App on a smartphone.
Can you recommend an Android one?

Sound meter appears to be the most popular, but that doesn't always means it's the best one.
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post #70 of 111 Old 02-12-2020, 01:40 PM
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Can you recommend an Android one?

Sound meter appears to be the most popular, but that doesn't always means it's the best one.
I'm sure they will all be good enough to level match speakers.

I don't have a smart phone.

AS your receiver is just 5.2 you need a switching box to A/B them quickly.

Something similar to this.

https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_...xoCt0cQAvD_BwE

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post #71 of 111 Old 02-12-2020, 02:51 PM - Thread Starter
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I'm sure they will all be good enough to level match speakers.

I don't have a smart phone.

AS your receiver is just 5.2 you need a switching box to A/B them quickly.

Something similar to this.

https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_...xoCt0cQAvD_BwE
A rare breed no doubt. I resisted mobile phones in general for as long as I could. I do avoid social media though.

Thanks. I will look into A/B switchers such as the one you suggested. I'm not sure I'd spend $45 just to compare the 2 sets of fronts I have.
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post #72 of 111 Old 02-12-2020, 02:56 PM
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A rare breed no doubt. I resisted mobile phones in general for as long as I could. I do avoid social media though.

Thanks. I will look into A/B switchers such as the one you suggested. I'm not sure I'd spend $45 just to compare the 2 sets of fronts I have.
There are simpler options for an A/B switch.

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post #73 of 111 Old 02-14-2020, 02:41 AM - Thread Starter
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There are simpler options for an A/B switch.
I may look into it then. The B&W aren't going anywhere for now. I'm a bit of a hogger

So far I'm quite enjoying the 3050 but as I said I don't have a capacity to "brain save" data. I also never had a reference recording/movie to test stuff with cause I haven't changed anything in 30 years.

I'm currently struggling to figure out all the options on the receiver. It still sounds a bit weird on a setup of 2 fronts and 1 center. I'm also being over-conscious since it's all new. Right now it sounds best to me if I set it to Stereo Mutli Ch which seems to output the sound through all 3 rather than separates dialog to center and rest to fronts which is what the multi channel (I think they call it DTS Neo 6). I think part of it is that dilaog sound is a lot less forgiving when you split the channels (audio format, bitrate, level of compression, quality of recording etc) rather than just have them all downmixed together into 2 channels like I'm used to.

I turned off Audssey reference to Manual EQ and copied the Audssey curve. That also confused me cause It only offers to copy the Flat curve. Where to go from there unknown to me, as I have little to no understanding as to what to do with the frequencies chart. I'd have to do some deep research.

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post #74 of 111 Old 02-14-2020, 10:11 AM
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I may look into it then. The B&W aren't going anywhere for now. I'm a bit of a hogger

So far I'm quite enjoying the 3050 but as I said I don't have a capacity to "brain save" data. I also never had a reference recording/movie to test stuff with cause I haven't changed anything in 30 years.

I'm currently struggling to figure out all the options on the receiver. It still sounds a bit weird on a setup of 2 fronts and 1 center. I'm also being over-conscious since it's all new. Right now it sounds best to me if I set it to Stereo Mutli Ch which seems to output the sound through all 3 rather than separates dialog to center and rest to fronts which is what the multi channel (I think they call it DTS Neo 6). I think part of it is that dilaog sound is a lot less forgiving when you split the channels (audio format, bitrate, level of compression, quality of recording etc) rather than just have them all downmixed together into 2 channels like I'm used to.

I turned off Audssey reference to Manual EQ and copied the Audssey curve. That also confused me cause It only offers to copy the Flat curve. Where to go from there unknown to me, as I have little to no understanding as to what to do with the frequencies chart. I'd have to do some deep research.
I have some DM100i B&Ws as my rears from the mid 80s.

I have never once sold a single piece of stereo or a/v gear.

I always give it away in 100 percent functioning condition.

I assume you told the Marantz that you do not have surround rear speakers.

Make sure Dynamic EQ is "off."

I'm assuming you are using manual EQ to try and balance the Q Acoustics with your center?

What center are you using?

And IIRC you are not using a sub.

I'd still set the center to "small" though, with a 100 hz crossover or even 120hz if you are using the Q Acoustics center.

Unless, of course, setting it to "large" sounds better to you.

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post #75 of 111 Old 02-14-2020, 11:44 AM - Thread Starter
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I have some DM100i B&Ws as my rears from the mid 80s.

I have never once sold a single piece of stereo or a/v gear.

I always give it away in 100 percent functioning condition.

I assume you told the Marantz that you do not have surround rear speakers.

Make sure Dynamic EQ is "off."

I'm assuming you are using manual EQ to try and balance the Q Acoustics with your center?

What center are you using?

And IIRC you are not using a sub.

I'd still set the center to "small" though, with a 100 hz crossover or even 120hz if you are using the Q Acoustics center.

Unless, of course, setting it to "large" sounds better to you.
My B&Ws are from the early-mid 90s (I think they were made in the late 80s). Bought them from a guy I worked with who bought new ones.
Reading your comments on the QA thread leads me to believe you have a very big place. I don't really have a lot of storage space but I sure am not letting them go till I'm settled. And even then I'm not sure I will.

Yes, I told the AVR I don't have Surrounds or a Subwoofer as they are not connected yet. I'm waiting for a longer cable for the PB1000 I got, as buying anything here is too expensive and I only found some jenky old short RCA is my cable pile. I don't particularly buy into the high-end cable stuff, but specifically for SW I understand having something better helps to avoid hums and such, so I ordered the SVS interconnect. As Amazon doesn't send it here I have someone bringing me one from the states at the end of the month. I could buy it here but it's double the already high price.

For the surrounds I have the JBL B15 but I also have the QA 3020 arriving some time soon, I will then decide which to use + need a friend to help me hang them. It's a tricky part as I'd like to use the QA designated mounting gear which won't fit the JBL, and I don't want to have to drill the wall twice One of them I may convert to be my PC bookshelf instead of the crappy tiny ones I've been using all this years. I don't do a lot of music anymore after retiring from record collecting which consumed a lot of my time and money over the years.

Dynamic EQ and Volume are turned off. D-MAX too, whatever that thing is.

For Center I'm using the Emotiva C1 that Zorba highly recommended as something that is neutral enough to work with other brands and I was able to find here 2nd hand (but never used). It is set as Small (fronts at Large and was told to change to Small when the sub is connected).

Please excuse me if I'm talking complete rubbish here, totally new to this and I lack the understanding. I appreciate you guys being patient with someone who is practically taking his first baby steps here.

I'm unsure what I'm doing tbh. I looked at Manual EQ and it has a long list of frequencies that you can tweak their db values. To do anything with that I'd need to get some idea on what each frequency would change. I copied the Audssey curve to see what happens. It has almost every single frequency changed to something from the default 0db. I guess playing with all the center (or any other speaker) frequencies would make things different, but with about 10 different frequencies and +/- values for each I don't really know where to start. The reply I got on the Marantz NR thread to trust what Audssey suggests, leads me to believe I'm not alone in this. Probably the easiest route for someone without the experience and knowledge.

The center seems to mostly do just the dialogs and the fronts do all the rest (till I add the other bits). At least on the few occasions I went closely to listen to what each speaker is doing, it didn't seem to output anything but dialogs. In other words, I'm not sure what I'm balancing when the center and fronts are doing completely different things. My understanding was that this is mostly essential for panning/passing sounds (like a passing train).

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post #76 of 111 Old 02-14-2020, 11:52 AM
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It still sounds a bit weird on a setup of 2 fronts and 1 center. I'm also being over-conscious since it's all new. Right now it sounds best to me if I set it to Stereo Mutli Ch which seems to output the sound through all 3 rather than separates dialog to center and rest to fronts which is what the multi channel (I think they call it DTS Neo 6). I think part of it is that dilaog sound is a lot less forgiving when you split the channels (audio format, bitrate, level of compression, quality of recording etc) rather than just have them all downmixed together into 2 channels like I'm used to.

I turned off Audssey reference to Manual EQ and copied the Audssey curve. That also confused me cause It only offers to copy the Flat curve. Where to go from there unknown to me, as I have little to no understanding as to what to do with the frequencies chart. I'd have to do some deep research.
1. Try using normal Dolby surround mode, but with Audyssey turned off completely.
2. Make sure you level match the center to the L/R speakers, to compensate for sensitivity and impedance differences.
3. Make sure that all 3 front speakers are set on "small" with a standard 80Hz crossover and your sub on.

If the above steps still leave you preferring 2.1 rather than 3.1 then you just might be in the (minority) group of users who actually prefers NOT using a center.

~ Are you a "geek hobbyist" obsessed with squeezing out that last 5-10% improvement? The economy will thank you...especially the Chinese one. Or are you more of a get-set-and-forget "casual user" who simply wants to increase your enjoyment of movies, TV and gaming? Relax, HT isn't rocket science, nor does it have to cost an arm and a leg---especially if you ignore the aforementioned vocal minority. And remember to smile...it's just a silly hobby, after all. :)
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post #77 of 111 Old 02-14-2020, 11:53 AM
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The center seems to mostly do just the dialogs and the fronts do all the rest (till I add the other bits). At least on the few occasions I went closely to listen to what each speaker is doing, it didn't seem to output anything but dialogs. In other words, I'm not sure what I'm balancing when the center and fronts are doing completely different things. My understanding was that this is mostly essential for panning/passing sounds (like a passing train).
No, the center actually does three quarters of the work even with soundtracks.

So if there is a disconnect perhaps the center volume is too high vs the left right; would need to use an SPL app and test tones to verify.

I verified my center with test tones and SPL meter and even so did indeed bump it up a db or two.

I assume all tweeters are aimed at your ears while seated even if that means tilting up the center AND the 3050s a bit.

By UK standards my house is "big" at around 2000 sq/ft but by American standards it is actually below average in size.

My main listening room is about 18x14 or so with my couch 15 feet away from the front speakers and 60" Plasma TV so my left and right towers are closer together than "ideal" but it works just fine.

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post #78 of 111 Old 02-14-2020, 01:50 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the help, guys.

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Originally Posted by Zorba922 View Post
1. Try using normal Dolby surround mode, but with Audyssey turned off completely.
2. Make sure you level match the center to the L/R speakers, to compensate for sensitivity and impedance differences.
3. Make sure that all 3 front speakers are set on "small" with a standard 80Hz crossover and your sub on.

If the above steps still leave you preferring 2.1 rather than 3.1 then you just might be in the (minority) group of users who actually prefers NOT using a center.
1) Audyssey turned off completely, means all frequencies at 0db?
2) I'd have to read how to do that.
3) Fronts currently at Large, Center at small. All at 80Hz crossover. Sub will come into the picture later on this month. Done that bit a few days ago.
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No, the center actually does three quarters of the work even with soundtracks.
So if there is a disconnect perhaps the center volume is too high vs the left right; would need to use an SPL app and test tones to verify.
I verified my center with test tones and SPL meter and even so did indeed bump it up a db or two.
I assume all tweeters are aimed at your ears while seated even if that means tilting up the center AND the 3050s a bit.
I stand corrected. I just put on some big bucks movie (latest Tarantino and Joker) and there is more coming from the center than just dialog, but dialog is most dominant. I mostly watch TV shows, on those the separation was a lot more evident. Barely anything but dialog from center, and pretty much all the rest from fronts. I tried a few of those SPL meter apps with the default -4.5db test tone on the AVR. They pretty much all clock about the same results. I'm not sure I'm doing it 100% right. If I need to be closer to them or just in my standard sitting position. They all showed around 55db with the AVR volume set to 60. This was using Manual EQ with all frequencies at 0db though. I'll give it a try with a AUD curve copy too.

The fronts tweeters are more of less in ear level I'd say. Center is a bit lower but I did tilt it up the other day with some hard foam bit I found.
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By UK standards my house is "big" at around 2000 sq/ft but by American standards it is actually below average in size.
My main listening room is about 18x14 or so with my couch 15 feet away from the front speakers and 60" Plasma TV so my left and right towers are closer together than "ideal" but it works just fine.
OK, not as big as I thought. I'm coming from metric measurements so 2000 sounds huge till I convert it. 18x14 equals 5.3x4.2 meters. Seems like a pretty good setup to me. Not too big and not too small. Mine is something like 10x6.5 and I'm about 9.2 feet from a 55" TV, not a lot of room to give the speakers a nice distance between them. It's not actually a room but more of a corner in an open main space. I could upgrade it but it requires quite some effort I'm not willing to currently put in.

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post #79 of 111 Old 02-14-2020, 02:01 PM
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Thanks for the help, guys.


1) Audyssey turned off completely, means all frequencies at 0db?
2) I'd have to read how to do that.
3) Fronts currently at Large, Center at small. All at 80Hz crossover. Sub will come into the picture later on this month. Done that bit a few days ago.

I stand corrected. I just put on some big bucks movie (latest Tarantino and Joker) and there is more coming from the center than just dialog, but dialog is most dominant. I mostly watch TV shows, on those the separation was a lot more evident. Barely anything but dialog from center, and pretty much all the rest from fronts. I tried a few of those SPL meter apps with the default -4.5db test tone on the AVR. They pretty much all clock about the same results. I'm not sure I'm doing it 100% right. If I need to be closer to them or just in my standard sitting position. They all showed around 55db with the AVR volume set to 60. This was using Manual EQ with all frequencies at 0db though. I'll give it a try with a AUD curve copy too.

The fronts tweeters are more of less in ear level I'd say. Center is a bit lower but I did tilt it up the other day with some hard foam bit I found.

OK, not as big as I thought. I'm coming from metric measurements so 2000 sounds huge till I convert it. 18x14 equals 5.3x4.2 meters. Seems like a pretty good setup to me. Not too big and not too small. Mine is something like 10x6.5 and I'm about 9.2 feet from a 55" TV, not a lot of room to give the speakers a nice distance between them. It's not actually a room but more of a corner in an open main space. I could upgrade it but it requires quite some effort I'm not willing to currently put in.
I think you are on the right track.

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post #80 of 111 Old 02-14-2020, 02:15 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by gajCA View Post
I think you are on the right track.
Could be I'm overanalyzing it. Things sounded odd when I put in the new AVR too but I got used to it.

btw, just out of curiosity, gajCA and Zorba922, Can I ask what do you have for your main systems? I saw lot of mentions of a MartinLogan LX16 bookshelves and I think about a $4000 sub from gajCA and about Wharefdales 10.1 from Zorba on the QA thread. But I'm still on the 2017 posts
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post #81 of 111 Old 02-14-2020, 02:32 PM
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Originally Posted by AlexLac View Post
Could be I'm overanalyzing it. Things sounded odd when I put in the new AVR too but I got used to it.

btw, just out of curiosity, gajCA and Zorba922, Can I ask what do you have for your main systems? I saw lot of mentions of a MartinLogan LX16 bookshelves and I think about a $4000 sub from gajCA and about Wharefdales 10.1 from Zorba on the QA thread. But I'm still on the 2017 posts
My main system:

AVR Denon AVR1912, 9 year old
Main speakers Usher V602, 10 years old?
Center Usher V603, (nobody on AVS owns the Usher V series not because they are exclusive or anything, the US distributor sucks).
Rears B&W DM100i, 30+ years old
Sub Velodyne DD15, 9 years old, got if for 1/4 msrp as Velodyne couldn't repair the servo amp for my older wonderful ULD15
Panasonic 60" ST 1080p Plasma, 9 years old

Secondary system:

NAD 7250PE stereo analog receiver, 30+ years old
NAT 902 amp bridged to mono to drive center speaker, 30+ years old
Main speaker Martin Logan LX16, 3 years old
Center, Martin Logan Motion 8, 2 years old
MiniDSP used as EQ and crossover for subs, 3 years old
Subs, two Yamaha SW012 8" subs, 3 years old
Panasonic 50" 720p Plasma, 12 years old or so

Have zero desire to upgrade a single thing.

I generally replace when something fails so when my Denon in my main system dies I'll get another Denon or Marantz and add 4 in ceilings for Atmos (probably some Polks) as I love the effect in movie theaters.

4k TV I don't see moving to as I will simply repair my Plasma TVs when they fail I love the picture so much and don't need larger screens.

If my DD15 sub dies again I'll likely repair it, give it to my daughter or sister in law, and buy two Rhythmik L12s.

Geoff A. J., California
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post #82 of 111 Old 02-14-2020, 05:53 PM
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Originally Posted by AlexLac View Post
btw, just out of curiosity, gajCA and Zorba922, Can I ask what do you have for your main systems? I saw lot of mentions of a MartinLogan LX16 bookshelves and I think about a $4000 sub from gajCA and about Wharefdales 10.1 from Zorba on the QA thread. But I'm still on the 2017 posts
Living Room:
Philharmonic BMRs x 2
JBL 550p sub x 2
Pioneer LX502

Media room:
JBL Arena 170 x 2
Chane A2.4 center
JBL Arena 120 x 2 rears
RBH I-12 sub

Desktop:
Wharfedale Diamond 10.1
Trends Audio T-amp

~ Are you a "geek hobbyist" obsessed with squeezing out that last 5-10% improvement? The economy will thank you...especially the Chinese one. Or are you more of a get-set-and-forget "casual user" who simply wants to increase your enjoyment of movies, TV and gaming? Relax, HT isn't rocket science, nor does it have to cost an arm and a leg---especially if you ignore the aforementioned vocal minority. And remember to smile...it's just a silly hobby, after all. :)
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post #83 of 111 Old 02-14-2020, 05:57 PM
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1) Audyssey turned off completely, means all frequencies at 0db?
2) I'd have to read how to do that.
3) Fronts currently at Large, Center at small. All at 80Hz crossover. Sub will come into the picture later on this month. Done that bit a few days ago.


1) Audyssey off = all tone/EQ controls will be off, nothing boosted or reduced.

2) Download a free SPL Meter app to your phone. Sitting at your main position, run pink noise through all your speakers one by one...adjust the trim level inside the receiver so that every speaker shows the same decibel level on the SPL meter. (Obviously, having a $40 SPL meter device is going to be more accurate than a phone app, but it'll do to start with.)

3) Try setting the L/R to 80 Hz as well, just to see how much better the front 3 will integrate.

~ Are you a "geek hobbyist" obsessed with squeezing out that last 5-10% improvement? The economy will thank you...especially the Chinese one. Or are you more of a get-set-and-forget "casual user" who simply wants to increase your enjoyment of movies, TV and gaming? Relax, HT isn't rocket science, nor does it have to cost an arm and a leg---especially if you ignore the aforementioned vocal minority. And remember to smile...it's just a silly hobby, after all. :)
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post #84 of 111 Old 02-15-2020, 01:28 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by gajCA View Post
My main system:

AVR Denon AVR1912, 9 year old
Main speakers Usher V602, 10 years old?
Center Usher V603, (nobody on AVS owns the Usher V series not because they are exclusive or anything, the US distributor sucks).
Rears B&W DM100i, 30+ years old
Sub Velodyne DD15, 9 years old, got if for 1/4 msrp as Velodyne couldn't repair the servo amp for my older wonderful ULD15
Panasonic 60" ST 1080p Plasma, 9 years old

Secondary system:

NAD 7250PE stereo analog receiver, 30+ years old
NAT 902 amp bridged to mono to drive center speaker, 30+ years old
Main speaker Martin Logan LX16, 3 years old
Center, Martin Logan Motion 8, 2 years old
MiniDSP used as EQ and crossover for subs, 3 years old
Subs, two Yamaha SW012 8" subs, 3 years old
Panasonic 50" 720p Plasma, 12 years old or so

Have zero desire to upgrade a single thing.

I generally replace when something fails so when my Denon in my main system dies I'll get another Denon or Marantz and add 4 in ceilings for Atmos (probably some Polks) as I love the effect in movie theaters.

4k TV I don't see moving to as I will simply repair my Plasma TVs when they fail I love the picture so much and don't need larger screens.

If my DD15 sub dies again I'll likely repair it, give it to my daughter or sister in law, and buy two Rhythmik L12s.
Thanks for sharing the info. I've not heard of Usher but that means just about nothing, as I've not heard of most brands that aren't the ones everyone knows (like Bose, JBL etc).

I used to have a Panasonic plasma 42" before moving to 55" OLED. I thought it would be too big but it turned out OK.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zorba922 View Post
Living Room:
Philharmonic BMRs x 2
JBL 550p sub x 2
Pioneer LX502

Media room:
JBL Arena 170 x 2
Chane A2.4 center
JBL Arena 120 x 2 rears
RBH I-12 sub

Desktop:
Wharfedale Diamond 10.1
Trends Audio T-amp
Thanks for sharing. I actually am familiar with most the brand names but most of them just from recent times, since I started assembling my 5.1 and reading on these forums.
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post #85 of 111 Old 02-15-2020, 01:50 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Zorba922 View Post
1) Audyssey off = all tone/EQ controls will be off, nothing boosted or reduced.

2) Download a free SPL Meter app to your phone. Sitting at your main position, run pink noise through all your speakers one by one...adjust the trim level inside the receiver so that every speaker shows the same decibel level on the SPL meter. (Obviously, having a $40 SPL meter device is going to be more accurate than a phone app, but it'll do to start with.)

3) Try setting the L/R to 80 Hz as well, just to see how much better the front 3 will integrate.
1) That's what I did. Had AUD all turned off and set Manual EQ to defaults so all frequencies are at 0db.
2) Tried a few and ended up using one called Sound Meter HQ. Some youtube clips compared 3 of them and found it more accurate (though he used Sound Meter HD, but the UI looked the same).
3) All 3 are set to 80Hz on the crossovers settings.
I did measurements using all frequencies at 0db - all came at about the same db. around 45-47db (AVR volume at 60, I usually have the volume at 53-60 depending on source). I tried the same with the AUD flat curve copy. That also was pretty much the same for all 3, slightly lower, maybe 43-44 db.

As I said, I might be over-critical/conscious at this time as I seem to pay more attention to the sound than to what I'm watching and after so many years with just 2.0, different speakers/AVR it's bound to sound different . I had an adjustment period with just moving from the old Nakamichi to Marantz but got used to it pretty quickly. I can probably improve things with adjusting the center frequencies.

Since I got/getting 2 sets of bookshelf pairs, I think one of them may end up to be for my new desktop. I made some space next to the side of my desktop PC. I can place my old Audio stuff (CD player, Turntable) if they still works after not being turned on in like 10 years. Music has been such a consuming part of my life for so many years that I just cut it out cold turkey to stop the madness. I still love music but I consume it randomly nowdays. I still have my huge collection. Maybe I can find joy in it again.
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Last edited by AlexLac; 02-15-2020 at 01:56 AM.
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post #86 of 111 Old 02-15-2020, 10:07 AM
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Thanks for sharing the info. I've not heard of Usher but that means just about nothing, as I've not heard of most brands that aren't the ones everyone knows (like Bose, JBL etc).

I used to have a Panasonic plasma 42" before moving to 55" OLED. I thought it would be too big but it turned out OK.


Thanks for sharing. I actually am familiar with most the brand names but most of them just from recent times, since I started assembling my 5.1 and reading on these forums.
How did you like the Plasma to OLED switch?

Forgot to mention in the secondary music room I use a very good old Denon 2910 as my CD player even though it is also an excellent non HD DVD player.

In the main theater we do have a BluRay player, Sony I think, for the few times we break out an old BluRay. In the secondary room I have an old HD DVD player that works fine on the few HD DVDs I have and the many non HD DVDs we still have.

In both rooms we also use Roku for streaming Netflix, Amazon, Hulu and in the secondary room to stream all the cable channels in the main room.

Geoff A. J., California
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post #87 of 111 Old 02-15-2020, 10:10 AM
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Originally Posted by AlexLac View Post
Music has been such a consuming part of my life for so many years that I just cut it out cold turkey to stop the madness. I still love music but I consume it randomly nowdays. I still have my huge collection. Maybe I can find joy in it again.
My daughter and her husband had my old very expensive for its time DVD 2910 Denon in the electronic recycle pile as it no longer worked.

I thought I'd try CDs again as I have thousands of them but all are on computer streamed to my stereo in the secondary room.

I'd forgotten how much better CDs in that Denon used as a CD player sounded than even lossless streaming via the computer.

Night and day better.

Highly recommended to try out old audio gear in your closet.

Geoff A. J., California
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post #88 of 111 Old 02-15-2020, 10:45 AM - Thread Starter
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How did you like the Plasma to OLED switch?

Forgot to mention in the secondary music room I use a very good old Denon 2910 as my CD player even though it is also an excellent non HD DVD player.

In the main theater we do have a BluRay player, Sony I think, for the few times we break out an old BluRay. In the secondary room I have an old HD DVD player that works fine on the few HD DVDs I have and the many non HD DVDs we still have.

In both rooms we also use Roku for streaming Netflix, Amazon, Hulu and in the secondary room to stream all the cable channels in the main room.
I find that the OLED 4K is a lot brighter and lively. The Plamsa got a small burn in from subtitles soon after I got it and I've been annoyed noticing it for years. I take a long time to get new gear and it usually takes months and sometimes years till I decide what I want. This venture has been a lot faster in by my standards. I have a semi-region free player that I used maybe 5 times in the many years I used it. It's just so much more convenient playing media files. Also resisted getting into collecting blu-rays, I do have a problem with collecting stuff.

I have Amazon Prime but I don't use it that much. The streaming industry is becoming so crowded that I think it's not sustainable.

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Originally Posted by gajCA View Post
My daughter and her husband had my old very expensive for its time DVD 2910 Denon in the electronic recycle pile as it no longer worked.

I thought I'd try CDs again as I have thousands of them but all are on computer streamed to my stereo in the secondary room.

I'd forgotten how much better CDs in that Denon used as a CD player sounded than even lossless streaming via the computer.

Night and day better.

Highly recommended to try out old audio gear in your closet.
I pulled out the 2 Marantz CD players I got. Both turned on, but one won't spin the discs. The other I thought would be DOA actually works fine. It's an interesting one too. It's a player that has a recording option on blank CDs, long before you could burn discs with every CD Rom. My old Technics turntable works too. I've repurposed the old AV cabinet to carry them. It's bulky and scratched, so I'll try and find something more compact second hand. Purposed Audio stands seem to cost a fortune. I'm debating whether I should re-purpse one of the bookshelf sets for a desktop (QA 3020 or JBL B15), or if I should use the old B&Ws for it. I'd be sitting like 3 feet from them which feels to me too close for towers. What do you think?
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post #89 of 111 Old 02-15-2020, 10:52 AM
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I'm debating whether I should re-purpse one of the bookshelf sets for a desktop (QA 3020 or JBL B15), or if I should use the old B&Ws for it. I'd be sitting like 3 feet from them which feels to me too close for towers. What do you think?
If you have the space the towers would sound the best I would think as they would be more full range.

The B&W DM series from the past still sound great to my ear.

Geoff A. J., California
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post #90 of 111 Old 02-15-2020, 11:42 AM - Thread Starter
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If you have the space the towers would sound the best I would think as they would be more full range.

The B&W DM series from the past still sound great to my ear.
I could make room but I'll need a more compact stand. I'm just thinking it will be too overwhelming sitting that close to towers (3 feet).
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