Calling all Polkies:Official Polk thread - Page 1516 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #45451 of 45499 Old 11-07-2019, 09:58 PM
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Originally Posted by mtrot View Post
Hmm, regarding that issue, I just picked up a LSiM706 for my center channel and am powering it with my Denon AVR-x5200, which is a pretty stout AVR. The 5200 also powers my two PSB Image 5T surround speakers, but not my front L/R speakers, which are driven by a separate amp. So, the 5200 is driving a total of three speakers.



Can any of you with experiene with the LSiM706 comment on how adequately the 5200 should drive the 706 and the two PSB towers? The 5200 is rated at 140 watts/channel. The Image 5T are rated at 92dB sensitivity and 6 ohm. The LSiM706 is rated at 88dB sensitivity and 8 ohm. I don't really play movies or music very loud, but I do run all channels as LARGE, since I don't currently have a sub. Thanks!
Even though you are running large, you should be just fine since you are only driving three speakers and none are your mains.
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post #45452 of 45499 Old 11-07-2019, 09:59 PM
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Originally Posted by dtran00s View Post
Do you have a link to the 707's sale?
Adorama seems to be out of stock on the LSiM 707's. They do still have the cherry 705's on sale.

https://www.adorama.com/pkalsm705mv2...ce=rflaid62905
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post #45453 of 45499 Old 11-07-2019, 10:37 PM
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Originally Posted by cocrh View Post
Adorama seems to be out of stock on the LSiM 707's. They do still have the cherry 705's on sale.

https://www.adorama.com/pkalsm705mv2...ce=rflaid62905
Thanks for the link. I wanted the 707's, not sure if the 705's have same sound soundstage as 707's.
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post #45454 of 45499 Old 11-08-2019, 12:56 AM
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Thanks for the link. I wanted the 707's, not sure if the 705's have same sound soundstage as 707's.
Bass differences. Connect a subwoofer.
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post #45455 of 45499 Old 11-08-2019, 05:44 AM
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Originally Posted by dtran00s View Post
Thanks for the link. I wanted the 707's, not sure if the 705's have same sound soundstage as 707's.
When I bought my 707s I actually wanted 705s but the 707s at that time were cheaper. I felt there was no way your ears would be level with tweeter in the 707s and 705s were a little smaller. It hasn't played out and my sound quality is fantastic with 707s. To get the best soundstage search on youtube for masters speaker placement process. If you follow it your soundstage will amaze you.

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post #45456 of 45499 Old 11-08-2019, 05:47 AM
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Guys. Please stop.

You're making me want to buy more speakers. And Amps. And more Amps. And more speakers. I'm gonna end up sleeping on the couch, like for a year!

Can I blame the Polkies group when my wife banishes me to the couch?

Trust me, it's worth it! Eventually the wife will come around.
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post #45457 of 45499 Old 11-08-2019, 05:48 AM
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Thanks for the link. I wanted the 707's, not sure if the 705's have same sound soundstage as 707's.

The 705's bring it big time, and are the most balanced between the 703's, 705's and 707's. You will not regret purchasing them.
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post #45458 of 45499 Old 11-08-2019, 05:55 AM
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This is what Ive referred to as the speaker placement Masters process.
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post #45459 of 45499 Old 11-08-2019, 10:22 AM
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Originally Posted by dtran00s View Post
Do you have a link to the 707's sale?
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Originally Posted by cocrh View Post
Adorama seems to be out of stock on the LSiM 707's. They do still have the cherry 705's on sale.

https://www.adorama.com/pkalsm705mv2...ce=rflaid62905
My 705's are cherry, and the fit and finish is first-rate IMO. It isn't a high gloss finish like my Salk Song Towers, but are every bit as nice, cosmetically speaking. I don't know how long they will stay like that, but even if the veneer starts peeling, they will still sound good.

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post #45460 of 45499 Old 11-08-2019, 12:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Geoff4RFC View Post
Yeah man, I've had nothing but great experience with these guys. You can ask for Mark, dude is great with customer service. Down at the bottom of the page you'll see contact info.

Best of luck to you, I hope you get the deal you want. That 3070 should have no problem driving your LSiM's and in-walls for your application. And if you get it, it's an awesome feature to have with the balanced audio connections....just another level of enjoyment to be had with your 707's
Talked to mark and he said no more 3060 and no discount on 3070.He then went on a rant about Yamaha being weakest amp receivers they sell and moved me over to the Pioneer 701 which was their Christmas special.He claimed Pioneer elite are only receiver they sell that pushes 135 watts into all 9 channels. Got very excited about this but when I checked some reviews of 701 people like Audioholics said it pushes 135 only into two channels and it doesn't sound as good as Yamaha 1060 which is a 110 watt receiver. Well Im pretty confused now and don't know who to believe.

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post #45461 of 45499 Old 11-08-2019, 01:29 PM
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Originally Posted by mattg3 View Post
Talked to mark and he said no more 3060 and no discount on 3070.He then went on a rant about Yamaha being weakest amp receivers they sell and moved me over to the Pioneer 701 which was their Christmas special.He claimed Pioneer elite are only receiver they sell that pushes 135 watts into all 9 channels. Got very excited about this but when I checked some reviews of 701 people like Audioholics said it pushes 135 only into two channels and it doesn't sound as good as Yamaha 1060 which is a 110 watt receiver. Well Im pretty confused now and don't know who to believe.
yet the yamaha avr are the ones that don't need external amps to sound good running your polks. Everyone with onkyo and dennon need something extra. Me, emotiva on or off the 2030 sounds the same and awsome.
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post #45462 of 45499 Old 11-08-2019, 09:48 PM
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Talked to mark and he said no more 3060 and no discount on 3070.He then went on a rant about Yamaha being weakest amp receivers they sell and moved me over to the Pioneer 701 which was their Christmas special.He claimed Pioneer elite are only receiver they sell that pushes 135 watts into all 9 channels. Got very excited about this but when I checked some reviews of 701 people like Audioholics said it pushes 135 only into two channels and it doesn't sound as good as Yamaha 1060 which is a 110 watt receiver. Well Im pretty confused now and don't know who to believe.
I haven't looked at the site yet but I can tell you if the pio has ICE amp on board, it's a winner.

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post #45463 of 45499 Old 11-08-2019, 10:03 PM
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Originally Posted by mattg3 View Post
Talked to mark and he said no more 3060 and no discount on 3070.He then went on a rant about Yamaha being weakest amp receivers they sell and moved me over to the Pioneer 701 which was their Christmas special.He claimed Pioneer elite are only receiver they sell that pushes 135 watts into all 9 channels. Got very excited about this but when I checked some reviews of 701 people like Audioholics said it pushes 135 only into two channels and it doesn't sound as good as Yamaha 1060 which is a 110 watt receiver. Well Im pretty confused now and don't know who to believe.
I took a look at it, very nice Pio, I'd check with the Pioneer guys here on this site and see what they say.

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post #45464 of 45499 Old 11-08-2019, 10:19 PM
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Originally Posted by mattg3 View Post
Talked to mark and he said no more 3060 and no discount on 3070.He then went on a rant about Yamaha being weakest amp receivers they sell and moved me over to the Pioneer 701 which was their Christmas special.He claimed Pioneer elite are only receiver they sell that pushes 135 watts into all 9 channels. Got very excited about this but when I checked some reviews of 701 people like Audioholics said it pushes 135 only into two channels and it doesn't sound as good as Yamaha 1060 which is a 110 watt receiver. Well Im pretty confused now and don't know who to believe.
Of course being able to audition anything we are considering would be the best way to go. Blind buys are always a gamble. I myself have considered the Elite series a few times, of course "Elite" is the way to go for Pioneer stuff IMO. I tried out the Elite 500 bluray player for a week and it was very impressive however my justification for keeping the $800 player in my set up

But my suggestion is to check it out, go to the LX701 thread in this site and kick around some. 899 for a beautiful 1600 dollar unit is a pretty decent deal!!! I've always liked the Pio's but your mileage may vary

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post #45465 of 45499 Old 11-09-2019, 03:20 AM
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Of course being able to audition anything we are considering would be the best way to go. Blind buys are always a gamble. I myself have considered the Elite series a few times, of course "Elite" is the way to go for Pioneer stuff IMO. I tried out the Elite 500 bluray player for a week and it was very impressive however my justification for keeping the $800 player in my set up

But my suggestion is to check it out, go to the LX701 thread in this site and kick around some. 899 for a beautiful 1600 dollar unit is a pretty decent deal!!! I've always liked the Pio's but your mileage may vary
Can you tell if this 701 has an ICE amp on board? They actually sell this same amp for 100 less refurbished! thanks for your help. My issue was that Mark insisted that the 701 pushed 135 watts through all channels and blows away the Yamaha. My checking around showed that this is not true, in fact no listed watts for any Amps push those watts into all channels.It may not be a big issue and perhaps mark knows more about this but he moved me away from the Yamaha interest so fast and kept praising that Pioneer so much I felt a little like I was in a car dealership!

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post #45466 of 45499 Old 11-09-2019, 05:58 AM
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Can you tell if this 701 has an ICE amp on board? They actually sell this same amp for 100 less refurbished! thanks for your help. My issue was that Mark insisted that the 701 pushed 135 watts through all channels and blows away the Yamaha. My checking around showed that this is not true, in fact no listed watts for any Amps push those watts into all channels.It may not be a big issue and perhaps mark knows more about this but he moved me away from the Yamaha interest so fast and kept praising that Pioneer so much I felt a little like I was in a car dealership!

You are correct that no major AVR manufacturer lists the wattage with all channels driven. If they did, the rating per channel would be in the neighborhood of 50W to 80W max. But since power ratings are a source of marketing competition, many CEM's use deceptive practices to inflate them (such as showing the rating at 4 or 6 Ohms instead of 8).

The Pioneer Elite SC-LX701 is listed at 135 W/ch (8 Ohms, 20 Hz-20 kHz, THD 0.08 %, 2ch Driven). That should suffice to drive your setup at less than ear-splitting levels.
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post #45467 of 45499 Old 11-09-2019, 11:40 AM
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Can you tell if this 701 has an ICE amp on board? They actually sell this same amp for 100 less refurbished! thanks for your help. My issue was that Mark insisted that the 701 pushed 135 watts through all channels and blows away the Yamaha. My checking around showed that this is not true, in fact no listed watts for any Amps push those watts into all channels.It may not be a big issue and perhaps mark knows more about this but he moved me away from the Yamaha interest so fast and kept praising that Pioneer so much I felt a little like I was in a car dealership!
Lol, sounds like he may have gotten over zealous! I did some checking, it looks like the Elites no longer employ the ICE amplification in their receivers but have moved to class D3 amps, here's a read on a review of the 701:

Class D3 Amplifier
Pioneer Class D3 amplifiers contain advanced integrated circuitry technology creating unmatched power without sacrificing sound quality or performance. Class D3 amplifiers use a Direct Signal Path Design to provide the shortest audio signal path possible. By eliminating EMI filters, feedback loops, and current limiters of previous designs, Class D3 reduces ringing distortion and noise, especially in the high frequency audio band.
The power consumption of the Digital Class D3 Amplifier is significantly lower than traditional A/B amplifiers - letting you save energy and generate less heat without compromising performance. The Digital Class D3 Amplifier uses a simple structure employing a straight signal path, resulting in improved sound quality requiring less energy than competitive models yet producing more simultaneous power output. This direct signal path means no EMI filters, feedback loops or current limiting - a true engineering art. Unlike traditional designs, these amps deliver the strength to handle multiple low-impedance speakers without dramatic power loss. The efficiency of Class D3 means cooler operation while drawing just a fraction of the power consumed by conventional amplifiers, enhancing and extending component life and reliability.


I'm not sure why Mark would mention "all" channels, like chi dude said, pretty much "all" receivers are rated with 2 channels driven.

My guess would be with the class D3 amps in the unit, "less" power is dropped with more channels added.

Set up:
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post #45468 of 45499 Old 11-09-2019, 12:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Geoff4RFC View Post
Lol, sounds like he may have gotten over zealous! I did some checking, it looks like the Elites no longer employ the ICE amplification in their receivers but have moved to class D3 amps, here's a read on a review of the 701:

Class D3 Amplifier
Pioneer Class D3 amplifiers contain advanced integrated circuitry technology creating unmatched power without sacrificing sound quality or performance. Class D3 amplifiers use a Direct Signal Path Design to provide the shortest audio signal path possible. By eliminating EMI filters, feedback loops, and current limiters of previous designs, Class D3 reduces ringing distortion and noise, especially in the high frequency audio band.
The power consumption of the Digital Class D3 Amplifier is significantly lower than traditional A/B amplifiers - letting you save energy and generate less heat without compromising performance. The Digital Class D3 Amplifier uses a simple structure employing a straight signal path, resulting in improved sound quality requiring less energy than competitive models yet producing more simultaneous power output. This direct signal path means no EMI filters, feedback loops or current limiting - a true engineering art. Unlike traditional designs, these amps deliver the strength to handle multiple low-impedance speakers without dramatic power loss. The efficiency of Class D3 means cooler operation while drawing just a fraction of the power consumed by conventional amplifiers, enhancing and extending component life and reliability.


I'm not sure why Mark would mention "all" channels, like chi dude said, pretty much "all" receivers are rated with 2 channels driven.

My guess would be with the class D3 amps in the unit, "less" power is dropped with more channels added.
The description on the Pioneer site says it outputs a total of 760 watts, which translates to ~84.5 WPC with all channels driven (I didn't include the .2 because I don't think powered subwoofers really count since they have their own amps? Otherwise it would be pretty much 82.5 WPC). Whether that would be for 8 or 6 ohms, I don't know.

Although, to be honest, I think my math is a fair bit fuzzy.

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post #45469 of 45499 Old 11-09-2019, 02:24 PM
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Lol, sounds like he may have gotten over zealous! I did some checking, it looks like the Elites no longer employ the ICE amplification in their receivers but have moved to class D3 amps, here's a read on a review of the 701:

Class D3 Amplifier
Pioneer Class D3 amplifiers contain advanced integrated circuitry technology creating unmatched power without sacrificing sound quality or performance. Class D3 amplifiers use a Direct Signal Path Design to provide the shortest audio signal path possible. By eliminating EMI filters, feedback loops, and current limiters of previous designs, Class D3 reduces ringing distortion and noise, especially in the high frequency audio band.
The power consumption of the Digital Class D3 Amplifier is significantly lower than traditional A/B amplifiers - letting you save energy and generate less heat without compromising performance. The Digital Class D3 Amplifier uses a simple structure employing a straight signal path, resulting in improved sound quality requiring less energy than competitive models yet producing more simultaneous power output. This direct signal path means no EMI filters, feedback loops or current limiting - a true engineering art. Unlike traditional designs, these amps deliver the strength to handle multiple low-impedance speakers without dramatic power loss. The efficiency of Class D3 means cooler operation while drawing just a fraction of the power consumed by conventional amplifiers, enhancing and extending component life and reliability.


I'm not sure why Mark would mention "all" channels, like chi dude said, pretty much "all" receivers are rated with 2 channels driven.

My guess would be with the class D3 amps in the unit, "less" power is dropped with more channels added.
Thanks,I think Im going to stick with Yamahas and wait a bit.Im sure for holiday season there will be more choices on Accessories4less. Odd but this past week my LSIM 707 and 706 seem to have come alive.Fuller and more intense. Perhaps it just took a few weeks break in to loosen them up. My Yamaha 681 is driving them and at -24 Im as loud and as dynamic as I can handle in my condo.
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post #45470 of 45499 Old 11-09-2019, 02:38 PM
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Thanks,I think Im going to stick with Yamahas and wait a bit.Im sure for holiday season there will be more choices on Accessories4less. Odd but this past week my LSIM 707 and 706 seem to have come alive.Fuller and more intense. Perhaps it just took a few weeks break in to loosen them up. My Yamaha 681 is driving them and at -24 Im as loud and as dynamic as I can handle in my condo.
Good for you, no need to rush into a big purchase like that. And, if your sound is good, you really have time to stroll through your next upgrade!
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post #45471 of 45499 Old 11-09-2019, 07:27 PM
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Just cracked open my 702's. They state that the mid-range and tweeter should point towards the listening area - but what if you have your surrounds mounted to the sides or slightly forward of the listening area? I guess they'll be aimed towards the rear of the room. Will comment later on how they sound, these things are beefy as hell. Never seen such heavy surround speakers.
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post #45472 of 45499 Old 11-09-2019, 11:04 PM
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I am really impressed by these. The bass is good for a surround, but won't command too much attention. The real star of the show is the midrange and tweeter combination. Neutral, detailed, and powerful.

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LSiM 702 F/X proving its worth on the Buchardt S400 stand

HT: Samsung PN64H5000 (recommended settings) | NAD T758 V3 | Buchardt S400 (2) | Polk LSiM 702 F/X (2) | Infinity RS152 (4) | Subs TBD (2)
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post #45473 of 45499 Old 11-09-2019, 11:41 PM
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Just cracked open my 702's. They state that the mid-range and tweeter should point towards the listening area - but what if you have your surrounds mounted to the sides or slightly forward of the listening area? I guess they'll be aimed towards the rear of the room. Will comment later on how they sound, these things are beefy as hell. Never seen such heavy surround speakers.
Glad you're liking your 702's. I was just as impressed with mine. Impressive sound all the way around and not too intrusive like my FXiA6's were.

Mine are almost exactly to the side of the listening area so the midrange and tweeter fire toward the front of the room and not the rear. Do you have your left and right correctly mounted?

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Marantz AV8802A w/Pangea Premium XLR's-Source: Oppo 103-CD Player: Emotiva ERC 3 w/Pangea Premium XLR's
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Mains: PolkAudio LSiM707, C 706, SS 702, RS RTiA9
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post #45474 of 45499 Old 11-09-2019, 11:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Geoff4RFC View Post
Glad you're liking your 702's. I was just as impressed with mine. Impressive sound all the way around and not too intrusive like my FXiA6's were.

Mine are almost exactly to the side of the listening area so the midrange and tweeter fire toward the front of the room and not the rear. Do you have your left and right correctly mounted?
Not mounted yet - just testing for now. The location in which they can be placed is fixed due to a window on one side and a door on the other. So they are right up against those, and that corresponds to around 0 degrees from the seats.

Is there a verdict on these when placed at 0 degrees? Should they fire to the front or back of the room? I could see either working, for different reasons. To the front, it may blend with the front speakers better. To the rear, you may get more convincing rear effects.

HT: Samsung PN64H5000 (recommended settings) | NAD T758 V3 | Buchardt S400 (2) | Polk LSiM 702 F/X (2) | Infinity RS152 (4) | Subs TBD (2)
PC: Micca OriGen G2 | Mackie MR624 (2)
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post #45475 of 45499 Old 11-10-2019, 03:56 AM
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Which do you think would be a better pairing for surround/atmos on-wall heights with 703/704c fronts between KEF E301 eggs or B&W M1s? Or do you have another suggestion for small, easily mountable/aim-able speakers that would pair well?
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post #45476 of 45499 Old 11-10-2019, 08:54 AM
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Not mounted yet - just testing for now. The location in which they can be placed is fixed due to a window on one side and a door on the other. So they are right up against those, and that corresponds to around 0 degrees from the seats.

Is there a verdict on these when placed at 0 degrees? Should they fire to the front or back of the room? I could see either working, for different reasons. To the front, it may blend with the front speakers better. To the rear, you may get more convincing rear effects.
I have my side surround 702s forward of the first row seats, where my wife and I sit, with the tweeters/mids firing back. This way the back row sofa also benefits. If they were pointing forward, the frequency response in both rows would be seriously lacking in treble as the seating will be seriously off axis. This would not blend well with the fronts.

Note that I also have 2 702s for rear surrounds on the back walls firing towards the middle of the room. All 4 702s are just above ear level as I have on-ceiling Atmos speakers.

If you only have side surrounds, then they ideally would be behind your seating. The 0° position would not seem to be ideal for the 702s no matter which way you point the tweeters.

SONY VPL-VW385ES, Da-Lite 92" 0.9 HD progressive 16x9 screen, Apple TV 4K, HDFury Integral 2, Oppo UDP 203, Panasonic DP-UB820, Anthem AVM 60, D-Sonic 4000 (800x3, 400x4) for bed layer, 2 Crown XLS 1002 (225x4) for Atmos; Speakers: Polk LSiM 705s, 703 front, 4 702F/X surround, 4 Polk TL3 (Atmos), Dual Velodyne DD15 Subwoofers.
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post #45477 of 45499 Old 11-10-2019, 09:22 AM
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I will probably be just doing a 5.2.4 configuration, so standard side surrounds only. One row of seats.

I agree that this speaker seems designed to be either forward or rearward of the seats. I'll have to evaluate that, though reflected sound could work in either configuration. I can stick with rearward and firing towards the front, but I wanted to experiment with bringing them up due to recent conversations about better blending with the mains. Unfortunately it's hard to experiment as I don't have stands that go that high for temporary listening.

The room is just a rectangle, with the seats 2/3 of the way back. Pretty standard.

HT: Samsung PN64H5000 (recommended settings) | NAD T758 V3 | Buchardt S400 (2) | Polk LSiM 702 F/X (2) | Infinity RS152 (4) | Subs TBD (2)
PC: Micca OriGen G2 | Mackie MR624 (2)

Last edited by Soulburner; 11-10-2019 at 09:32 AM.
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post #45478 of 45499 Old 11-10-2019, 09:41 AM
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I will probably be just doing a 5.2.4 configuration, so standard side surrounds only. One row of seats.

I agree that this speaker seems designed to be either forward or rearward of the seats. I'll have to evaluate that, though reflected sound could work in either configuration. I can stick with rearward and firing towards the front, but I wanted to experiment with bringing them up due to recent conversations about better blending with the mains. Unfortunately it's hard to experiment as I don't have stands that go that high for temporary listening.

The room is just a rectangle, with the seats 2/3 of the way back. Pretty standard.
Blending with the mains requires a similar or ideally identical frequency response. With the seating well off-axis for the side surrounds that is not optimal for sure. I really like my side surrounds forward of my seat in my 7.1(2subs).4 setup as it does help fill the gap between the rear surrounds and the fronts.

SONY VPL-VW385ES, Da-Lite 92" 0.9 HD progressive 16x9 screen, Apple TV 4K, HDFury Integral 2, Oppo UDP 203, Panasonic DP-UB820, Anthem AVM 60, D-Sonic 4000 (800x3, 400x4) for bed layer, 2 Crown XLS 1002 (225x4) for Atmos; Speakers: Polk LSiM 705s, 703 front, 4 702F/X surround, 4 Polk TL3 (Atmos), Dual Velodyne DD15 Subwoofers.
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post #45479 of 45499 Old 11-10-2019, 09:48 AM
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kjYTGV0LMcs&t=46s

This is what Ive referred to as the speaker placement Masters process.

Thanks for posting this. I had my LSiM's toed in 45 degrees and just thought that was the way I should go to (pointing in to the MLP). After hearing what this guy was saying about his LSiM 707's not liking toe in, I went through this process, and sure enough, it sounds much better now.

I went from toeing them in directly to the middle of a four seat setup to toeing them in so they point to the outside of the two inside seats closest to each speaker (between seats one and two for the left speaker and between seats three and four for the right speaker).
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Last edited by m0j0; 11-11-2019 at 07:06 PM.
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post #45480 of 45499 Old 11-14-2019, 09:58 PM
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Are the current LSiMs going out of production? I just picked up the 703s and am enjoying the sound quite a bit. I'm considering getting the 704c or 706c as well... so trying to understand if I need to jump on this immediately (if this generation of LSiM is going out of production), or if I have some time to consider it.
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