Definitive Owners Thread - Page 1324 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #39691 of 40718 Old 08-10-2018, 03:40 PM
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Originally Posted by derekmoore View Post
I'm mostly a 2 channel music guy, but all this talk of upgrading surrounds is causing my upgraditis to flair up. The same guy selling the CLR2002 is selling a pair of BP-2X also. Since I'm agreeing to downsize the CLR2000 to the 2002, I figure I have some negotiation leverage to upgrade our surrounds if it would be a significant improvement over my current PM1000's. I have to position my surrounds very close to my MLP (left and right of my couch) instead of the recommended spacing and elevation. What difference in sound could I expect from the BP's?
A fuller sound, also since you have to have them close to mlp they aren’t blasting in your ears like a direct radiating speaker. I think you will like this upgrade.
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post #39692 of 40718 Old 08-10-2018, 03:42 PM
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+1 on calling Def Tech. They will likely send you what you need for free or next to it.
They may even throw in a free amp or two. That is how they roll. Lol jk.
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post #39693 of 40718 Old 08-10-2018, 07:04 PM
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Originally Posted by keeper View Post
They may even throw in a free amp or two. That is how they roll. Lol jk.
Unless your initials are HJ that is.
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5.1: Power - Denon 4308ci, Fronts - Def Tech BP9040's, Center - Def Tech CLR 2000, Surrounds - Def Tech PM1000's, Sub's - Rythmik E15HP x2, Display - Panasonic TC-55AS530U, TT - Rega Planar 2 w/ Dynavector 10x5
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post #39694 of 40718 Old 08-10-2018, 07:08 PM
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Originally Posted by keeper View Post
A fuller sound, also since you have to have them close to mlp they aren’t blasting in your ears like a direct radiating speaker. I think you will like this upgrade.

Thanks Keeper. For $100 I figure its a no lose proposition to pick em up and compare.


FYI, my initial post did not make total sense because I posted a previous one that was censored out. Apparently I broke a rule mentioning that if I get this CLR2002, I'm going to put my CLR2000 up for sale.


Hopefully that statement does not get my hand slapped.

5.1: Power - Denon 4308ci, Fronts - Def Tech BP9040's, Center - Def Tech CLR 2000, Surrounds - Def Tech PM1000's, Sub's - Rythmik E15HP x2, Display - Panasonic TC-55AS530U, TT - Rega Planar 2 w/ Dynavector 10x5
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post #39695 of 40718 Old 08-11-2018, 07:16 AM
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Hey again guys and gals- I love definitive tech speakers! Now that that's out of the way, I have another question. I live in an apartment and have Elac Debut 2.0 A4 Atmos (bounce off ceiling) speakers sitting on top of my BP2000TLs but I really don't like them. I don't get the Atmos effect I want. That being said, I can't do anything in ceiling, although mounting on ceiling would be fine. I just bought a new Denon AVR-X4400H so I can do 5.1.4. What would you suggest for (4) ceiling mounted Atmos speakers? I have def tech BP-2X rears right now as well, but I figured buying more of those for on-ceiling would be goofy, as I believe Atmos is supposed to be directed, and not Bi-Polar. Have a great day and thanks!

AVR: AudioControl Concert AVR-9 Front L/R: Def Tech BP2000TL Center: Def Tech CLR 3000
Surrounds: Def Tech DI 5.5BPS Ceiling Atmos: RSL C34E x4 Rear Surrounds: RSL W26
Subs: Monoprice Monolith 12" THX Ultra, Dayton Audio BST-1 Bass Shakers x2
TV: LG OLED65C8P Amps: Crestron CNAMPX-16x60, Dayton Audio APA150
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post #39696 of 40718 Old 08-11-2018, 10:31 AM
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Originally Posted by disturbedfuel15 View Post
Hey again guys and gals- I love definitive tech speakers! Now that that's out of the way, I have another question. I live in an apartment and have Elac Debut 2.0 A4 Atmos (bounce off ceiling) speakers sitting on top of my BP2000TLs but I really don't like them. I don't get the Atmos effect I want. That being said, I can't do anything in ceiling, although mounting on ceiling would be fine. I just bought a new Denon AVR-X4400H so I can do 5.1.4. What would you suggest for (4) ceiling mounted Atmos speakers? I have def tech BP-2X rears right now as well, but I figured buying more of those for on-ceiling would be goofy, as I believe Atmos is supposed to be directed, and not Bi-Polar. Have a great day and thanks!
I use Pro Monitor 800’s mounted on my ceiling. They were easy to place and they sound fantastic.
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post #39697 of 40718 Old 08-11-2018, 11:23 AM
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Thanks for letting me know. I am between the 800s and 1000s now. I know both will work, but I don't know if the bump up in price will make a difference just for overhead atmos speakers.
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post #39698 of 40718 Old 08-11-2018, 01:19 PM
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Thanks for letting me know. I am between the 800s and 1000s now. I know both will work, but I don't know if the bump up in price will make a difference just for overhead atmos speakers.
I actually have a pair of 1000’s that I used to use as my side surrounds. I got a wild hair one day and put them up in place of my top front 800’s and while I know they are superior Speaker I really didn’t notice much of a difference. So imo I would save the money and go with the 800’s if your trying to decide between the two.
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post #39699 of 40718 Old 08-11-2018, 01:22 PM
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thanks buddy- exactly what I was looking for. Rock on!
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post #39700 of 40718 Old 08-11-2018, 04:11 PM
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I actually have a pair of 1000’s that I used to use as my side surrounds. I got a wild hair one day and put them up in place of my top front 800’s and while I know they are superior Speaker I really didn’t notice much of a difference. So imo I would save the money and go with the 800’s if your trying to decide between the two.
Quick question - What mounts are you using for the ceiling 800s?
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post #39701 of 40718 Old 08-11-2018, 04:57 PM
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Quick question - What mounts are you using for the ceiling 800s?
I already had some cheap Rocketfish ones from Best Buy so I am using those for now. I plan on buying the ones from Def Tech eventually though. They have a smaller footprint, appear to rotate better and are undoubtedly higher quality. Not to mention they’re made to mount those speakers.
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post #39702 of 40718 Old 08-11-2018, 10:07 PM
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Where can I get the best deal on Def Tech 9000 series? Any recommended forum sponsors or dealers? Thanks in advance.

We got to move these refrigerators we gotta move these color TV's
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post #39703 of 40718 Old 08-12-2018, 11:30 AM
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So I finally purchased a clr3000 to replace my old clr2000 that I used for many years. Want to do a good comparison between the two. So how do you level match the sub in the 3000? I’m thinking it is probably done by ear?
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post #39704 of 40718 Old 08-12-2018, 01:39 PM
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Originally Posted by keeper View Post
So I finally purchased a clr3000 to replace my old clr2000 that I used for many years. Want to do a good comparison between the two. So how do you level match the sub in the 3000? I’m thinking it is probably done by ear?
That's pretty much it, you can try with a meter, but placement changes so much that it can measure ok, but still not sound right.
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post #39705 of 40718 Old 08-12-2018, 06:24 PM
 
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So I finally purchased a clr3000 to replace my old clr2000 that I used for many years. Want to do a good comparison between the two. So how do you level match the sub in the 3000? I’m thinking it is probably done by ear?
You have super towers all around and a stand alone sub as well. Id say set her to 11:00 and let her buck. That's what I did anyways. Its not contributing much in the bass category.
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post #39706 of 40718 Old 08-12-2018, 06:28 PM
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You have super towers all around and a stand alone sub as well. Id say set her to 11:00 and let her buck. That's what I did anyways. Its not contributing much in the bass category.
Yep that’s the plan. Do you use a crossover or set to large?
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post #39707 of 40718 Old 08-12-2018, 06:31 PM
 
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Yep that’s the plan. Do you use a crossover or set to large?
I'm probably gonna get tons of ***** for this...

I set all 7 speakers to large. Sometimes when the wife is asleep I have to turn my HSU's off, but I still want some LFE sent to the super tower subs.

Only shakes half the house then
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post #39708 of 40718 Old 08-12-2018, 06:37 PM
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I'm probably gonna get tons of ***** for this...

I set all 7 speakers to large. Sometimes when the wife is asleep I have to turn my HSU's off, but I still want some LFE sent to the super tower subs.

Only shakes half the house then
You need some earthquakes brother. They add another dimension to ht if set up correctly. They are small but not toys like some of the cheaper transducers. They don’t bottom out either. The train scene in Polar Express- you will think your riding on the train. My wife absolutely hates them so they must work well.
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post #39709 of 40718 Old 08-12-2018, 06:42 PM
 
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You need some earthquakes brother. They add another dimension to ht if set up correctly. They are small but not toys like some of the cheaper transducers. They don’t bottom out either. The train scene in Polar Express- you will think your riding on the train. My wife absolutely hates them so they must work well.
That's next after I run the wire for my front and rear heights.

What would a set up for 1 large couch set me back? (not including man hours)
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post #39710 of 40718 Old 08-12-2018, 06:48 PM
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That's next after I run the wire for my front and rear heights.

What would a set up for 1 large couch set me back? (not including man hours)
When your ready for them pm me, I have some info you should know. I have 3 earthquakes and 1 buttkicker 1000amp. You need 2 earthquakes and 1 amp. Can be done for less than $500.
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post #39711 of 40718 Old 08-13-2018, 05:25 AM
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Well my bedroom's about to join the Definitive Technology family. I've been looking for a CS8060 to replace my CS8040 for a while now, and I found a gentleman selling one for a very good price. Turned out he also had some of the older towers and a center for sale complete with a Denon AVR. I think I did well:

1 x CS8060HD still in the box and appeared unused.
2 x BP2006 towers in great shape (one of the socks has a very small tear in the back).
1 x CLR2002 also in great shape (slight nick on one of the end caps).
1 x Denon AVR 1513.

$525 for everything.

Goodbye soundbar in the bedroom, hello 3.0 system! I have to say that these towers sound really, really good as does the CLR2002. So much so that I'm debating selling the CS8040 and keeping the CLR2002 with the BP2006s which wasn't the original plan. Ah, the agony of choice.
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Current 7.2.4 Setup: 2 x BP8040ST Front L/R, CS8060HD Center, 2 x BP8040ST Surround L/R, 2 x SR8080BP Rear Surround L/R, 4 x Polk V60 Height, 2 x SVS SB2000 Subs, Denon X4300h AVR, ATI 1805 Amp.

Last edited by Speedie95; 08-13-2018 at 05:40 AM.
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post #39712 of 40718 Old 08-13-2018, 02:59 PM
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Well my bedroom's about to join the Definitive Technology family. I've been looking for a CS8060 to replace my CS8040 for a while now, and I found a gentleman selling one for a very good price. Turned out he also had some of the older towers and a center for sale complete with a Denon AVR. I think I did well:

1 x CS8060HD still in the box and appeared unused.
2 x BP2006 towers in great shape (one of the socks has a very small tear in the back).
1 x CLR2002 also in great shape (slight nick on one of the end caps).
1 x Denon AVR 1513.

$525 for everything.

Goodbye soundbar in the bedroom, hello 3.0 system! I have to say that these towers sound really, really good as does the CLR2002. So much so that I'm debating selling the CS8040 and keeping the CLR2002 with the BP2006s which wasn't the original plan. Ah, the agony of choice.
The 2002 is very good, so much so that you may even like it better than the 8060.

If it were me, I'd sell the 8040 and experiment with the other two centers in each room.

Or

Keep the 8040 for the bedroom, find another 2002, use both as rears, and end up with a 5.1 for the bedroom. LOL. Or at least a very good pair of speakers for a 2 .1 system somewhere else.
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post #39713 of 40718 Old 08-13-2018, 03:43 PM
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The 2002 is very good, so much so that you may even like it better than the 8060.

If it were me, I'd sell the 8040 and experiment with the other two centers in each room.

Or

Keep the 8040 for the bedroom, find another 2002, use both as rears, and end up with a 5.1 for the bedroom. LOL. Or at least a very good pair of speakers for a 2 .1 system somewhere else.
Yup, I'm going to play around with REW (my latest obsession) and see / hear what works best where before making any decisions. I've read about the old school Def Techs but this was my first time hearing them. They're impressive to say the least.

Not listening to you about 5.1 in the bedroom LOL. I already blame you for the fact that I have BP8040STs as surrounds, so given your propensity to be the devil on my shoulder it's best that I don't
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Current 7.2.4 Setup: 2 x BP8040ST Front L/R, CS8060HD Center, 2 x BP8040ST Surround L/R, 2 x SR8080BP Rear Surround L/R, 4 x Polk V60 Height, 2 x SVS SB2000 Subs, Denon X4300h AVR, ATI 1805 Amp.
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post #39714 of 40718 Old 08-13-2018, 04:35 PM
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Yup, I'm going to play around with REW (my latest obsession) and see / hear what works best where before making any decisions. I've read about the old school Def Techs but this was my first time hearing them. They're impressive to say the least.

Not listening to you about 5.1 in the bedroom LOL. I already blame you for the fact that I have BP8040STs as surrounds, so given your propensity to be the devil on my shoulder it's best that I don't
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post #39715 of 40718 Old 08-13-2018, 05:31 PM
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So I have all my supertowers setup for lfe. I notice that some people set them up as large. I guess my question is and I apologize in advance if It is confusing but as far as movie soundtracks what is large exactly? I know what lfe is but how much bass is sent to speakers minus the lfe track? Does low bass go to all speakers including surrounds when using the large setting?
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post #39716 of 40718 Old 08-13-2018, 08:24 PM
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So I have all my supertowers setup for lfe. I notice that some people set them up as large. I guess my question is and I apologize in advance if It is confusing but as far as movie soundtracks what is large exactly? I know what lfe is but how much bass is sent to speakers minus the lfe track? Does low bass go to all speakers including surrounds when using the large setting?
Here are the basics:

All Channels except LFE, including Atmos "overhead" positions and music, carry a signal that can range from 20Hz - 20KHz.
The LFE Channel carries a signal that can range from 3Hz - 120Hz.

So, you set your crossovers so that any frequency range your main speakers can't play "clean", is then mixed into the LFE channel for proper reproduction.

So Large or Small w/ LFE on the Supertowers ends up being dependant on many different circumstances:
- Separate Sub(s) or not
- Placement of those Sub(s)
- Placement of your Speakers
- Ability of your Speakers and Sub(s) to play those frequencies
- Room size and type (open concept or enclosed)
- Room acoustics
- And most of all, personal taste

While this is all up to the individual, my personal opinion on the matter is that, as long as the basic criteria is meet and you have separate Subs with proper coverage, along with speakers that can properly cover the frequency ranges, the Large setting makes sounds seem more natural, esp since those sounds/frequencies were mixed into those channels in the first place.
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post #39717 of 40718 Old 08-13-2018, 08:51 PM
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So I have all my supertowers setup for lfe. I notice that some people set them up as large. I guess my question is and I apologize in advance if It is confusing but as far as movie soundtracks what is large exactly? I know what lfe is but how much bass is sent to speakers minus the lfe track? Does low bass go to all speakers including surrounds when using the large setting?
To give you a direct but very basic example:

Let's say you have an explosion that belongs directly in the Right Front Corner of the room.
First off, most of that "bass" is actually mid-bass, in the 40-90Hz range.

"Usually" a mixer will place all of that sound, from 20Hz and up, into the RF channel. They can then take a duplicate of the "whole" sound from 3Hz and up, filtering out everything above 120Hz, and place it in the LFE channel as well, then blend those two accordingly.
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post #39718 of 40718 Old 08-14-2018, 12:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ALtlOff View Post
To give you a direct but very basic example:

Let's say you have an explosion that belongs directly in the Right Front Corner of the room.
First off, most of that "bass" is actually mid-bass, in the 40-90Hz range.

"Usually" a mixer will place all of that sound, from 20Hz and up, into the RF channel. They will then take a duplicate of the "whole" sound from 3Hz and up, filtering out everything above 120Hz, and place it in the LFE channel as well, then blend those two accordingly.
Thanks for the very detailed response.
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post #39719 of 40718 Old 08-14-2018, 12:56 AM
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So I have several questions I'm hoping you guys can help me out with.


My current setup:


Martin Logan Motion 4i (Left / Right)
Martin Logain Motion 8i (Center)
Martin Logan Dynamo 700W (Sub)
Denon AVRX1400H (Receiver)


I just picked up the sub a few days ago and I'm running into several issues. The first issue is its just damn loud. Even at 30% Volume from the back of the sub and doing -8 on the AVR volume control it still shakes the floors. Needless to say the neighbors aren't very happy below me. I'm still trying to get it dialed in but so far I'm not sure I'm real happy with it.


I started browsing on bestbuy (yea i know nobody likes bestbuy but I can get 0% interest for 2 years) and came across several def tech floor speakers that get as low as 20hz. I am wondering if these floor speakers (I do really want floor speakers so I can move the ML Motion 4i to the rear for surround sound) produce enough bass to where I don't need a sub but wont be shaking the hell out of my apartment (viewing room if u can call it that is roughly 16' x 14' but part of that is the kitchen. Couch is roughly 8' away from speakers / tv.). But I also don't want to lose anything as far as sound goes. My ML Motion 4i for how small they are, are quite impressive. I'm curious of these few speakers would do the trick to allow me to eliminate the sub but still have some punch just not earthquake like booms.



I'm looking at the following def tech speakers


BP6B $399.99 each (minimum frequency 25hz)
https://www.bestbuy.com/site/definit...?skuId=6638604



BP10B $599.99 each (minimum frequency 20hz)
https://www.bestbuy.com/site/definit...?skuId=6638524



BP-9020ST $519.98 each (minimum Frequency 30hz)

https://www.bestbuy.com/site/definit...?skuId=5023610


BP-9040ST $719.98 each (minimum Frequency 29hz)
https://www.bestbuy.com/site/definit...?skuId=5023606




Now for the next part. Will mixing Martin Logan center and rear speakers with Def Tech sound like crap or will it work ok. I was looking at Martin Logan floor speakers but they only go down to like 40hz which while better than what I currently have (Motion 4i L/R speakers are 70hz - 23kHz) it still seems like those are geared more toward music than 4k UHD Blurays.


Also obviously the BP-9040ST are better than the others however if what I'm trying to do can be accomplished without having to drop that much cash it would be ideal. I'm also curious and can't figure out how the BP10B can get all the way down to 20hz when the 9020 and 9040 with powered subs can only do 30hz and 29hz respectively.


I'm also curious about powered subs being in the same box as the speakers any pros / cons on that? Trying to figure stuff out but the more I dive in the more questions pop up. Honestly just want to be able to watch 4k UHD Blurays and have it sound good without shaking my house or sounding crappy.

Last edited by trinitynzxt; 08-14-2018 at 01:50 AM.
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post #39720 of 40718 Old 08-14-2018, 03:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trinitynzxt View Post
So I have several questions I'm hoping you guys can help me out with.
<Snip>
Before you go down that road, what surface is the ML sub sitting on? Hardwood floors? Carpet? If it's a hard surface then this might help:

Isolation Pad

The Dynamo 700 comes standard in down firing configuration but can be converted (page 12 of the manual). Have you tried switching it to front firing to see if that alleviates your problems? It's a few minutes of your time and no cost to try it.



Current 7.2.4 Setup: 2 x BP8040ST Front L/R, CS8060HD Center, 2 x BP8040ST Surround L/R, 2 x SR8080BP Rear Surround L/R, 4 x Polk V60 Height, 2 x SVS SB2000 Subs, Denon X4300h AVR, ATI 1805 Amp.
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