Definitive Owners Thread - Page 1332 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #39931 of 40602 Old 09-24-2018, 09:51 PM
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Quick question and not sure if I've asked this before. As you can see below as to my equipment. I have older BP7004 towers and a CLR 2300 center. The Optional LFE on the center is disconnected and the same for the towers. All speakers are set to small with 80hz crossover for the sub.


Should the tower's LFE be disconnected when doing a Audyssey calibration?

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post #39932 of 40602 Old 09-24-2018, 10:19 PM
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Originally Posted by inspector View Post
Quick question and not sure if I've asked this before. As you can see below as to my equipment. I have older BP7004 towers and a CLR 2300 center. The Optional LFE on the center is disconnected and the same for the towers. All speakers are set to small with 80hz crossover for the sub.


Should the tower's LFE be disconnected when doing a Audyssey calibration?
Always do your Audyssey calibration with the same connections you're using for everyday listening.
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post #39933 of 40602 Old 09-25-2018, 03:41 AM
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Originally Posted by inspector View Post
Quick question and not sure if I've asked this before. As you can see below as to my equipment. I have older BP7004 towers and a CLR 2300 center. The Optional LFE on the center is disconnected and the same for the towers. All speakers are set to small with 80hz crossover for the sub.


Should the tower's LFE be disconnected when doing a Audyssey calibration?
It seems from your post that you are not using the LFE connection on your towers. So in this configuration the answer would be - Yes. Keep the LFE disconnected when running Audyssey.


Are you intending to try connecting the LFE channel to your towers? If so, then you will want to run Audyssey as you intend to use them. However, in this configuration, Audyssey will stop EQ'ing at the F3 point of your weakest sub. I'm not sure of the spec's on the P12 but I'd guess they will go a bit deeper than your 10" woofers in the BP7004's. This may or may not be a problem and you could certainly experiment to see what you think.


If you really wanted to get the most out of this type of configuration, then using REW to see what is going on in your room, along with something like the MiniDSP 2x4HD would be highly beneficial to get some EQ on your lowest extension to really dial it all in.
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post #39934 of 40602 Old 09-25-2018, 09:07 AM
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Thanks for all your input!

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post #39935 of 40602 Old 10-01-2018, 06:21 AM
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Just getting ready to pull the trigger on a pair of ceiling speakers to go to 5.1.2. I’m using SM65s and a CS8060 up front, SR9040s in back, and an SVS SB2000 sub in a small room.

Would the DT6.5R be adequate, or would I get a lot more benefit from the 8R?

Thanks, I’ll hang up and listen.
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post #39936 of 40602 Old 10-01-2018, 09:39 AM
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Originally Posted by roland6465 View Post
Just getting ready to pull the trigger on a pair of ceiling speakers to go to 5.1.2. I’m using SM65s and a CS8060 up front, SR9040s in back, and an SVS SB2000 sub in a small room.

Would the DT6.5R be adequate, or would I get a lot more benefit from the 8R?

Thanks, I’ll hang up and listen.

I use the DI8R myself, but yes - the 6.5 would be absolutely fine.

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post #39937 of 40602 Old 10-01-2018, 11:02 AM
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Originally Posted by roland6465 View Post
Just getting ready to pull the trigger on a pair of ceiling speakers to go to 5.1.2. I’m using SM65s and a CS8060 up front, SR9040s in back, and an SVS SB2000 sub in a small room.

Would the DT6.5R be adequate, or would I get a lot more benefit from the 8R?

Thanks, I’ll hang up and listen.
I went from the DT6.5R to DI8R. The 6.5's were good in my smaller place and lower ceiling. They sounded good, clear, and trim levels were about -4dB when level matched. When I moved, I upsized to the 8's for my higher ceiling and bigger room.

Majority of the movies don't author much of a full range frequency in overhead channels so in most cases you will be fine. However, some more recent movies put in more content in the overheads with wider frequencies so if it's in your budget you might as well upsize for more headroom.

The -3dB point for my DT 6.5s was around 120hz I believe, and the DI 8s went to 80hz.

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post #39938 of 40602 Old 10-01-2018, 11:23 AM
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Thanks for the insight. I’m getting a great price, so I’ll go with the 8’s. I’m already compromising on 2 heights due to space, so why not have a little more bottom end?
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post #39939 of 40602 Old 10-01-2018, 05:32 PM
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Originally Posted by roland6465 View Post
Thanks for the insight. I’m getting a great price, so I’ll go with the 8’s. I’m already compromising on 2 heights due to space, so why not have a little more bottom end?

Because you risk sacrificing some of that mid-range clarity, which I think is probably more important than low end, unless you're sub-less. Some will disagree.....

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post #39940 of 40602 Old 10-02-2018, 03:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roland6465 View Post
Thanks for the insight. I’m getting a great price, so I’ll go with the 8’s. I’m already compromising on 2 heights due to space, so why not have a little more bottom end?

Because you risk sacrificing some of that mid-range clarity, which I think is probably more important than low end, unless you're sub-less. Some will disagree.....[IMG class=inlineimg]/forum/images/smilies/redface.gif[/IMG]
Dammit, y’all are helping too much!
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post #39941 of 40602 Old 10-03-2018, 08:43 AM
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Dammit, y’all are helping too much!
It's height effects; not orchestra or critical vocals coming from the ceiling

They will sound 99% exactly the same in most scenarios for movies...the 8's just dig a little deeper.

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post #39942 of 40602 Old 10-03-2018, 09:41 AM
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It's height effects; not orchestra or critical vocals coming from the ceiling

They will sound 99% exactly the same in most scenarios for movies...the 8's just dig a little deeper.
The wife shot me down again, anyway.
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post #39943 of 40602 Old 10-03-2018, 02:59 PM
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Originally Posted by roland6465 View Post
The wife shot me down again, anyway.

Too bad!


Quote:
Originally Posted by pbz06 View Post
It's height effects; not orchestra or critical vocals coming from the ceiling

They will sound 99% exactly the same in most scenarios for movies...the 8's just dig a little deeper.

Not necessarily true. Depends on the content. There are good examples in which the heights are used heavily for the musical score. Multi-channel/Atmos music, etc., etc. The use of heights is well beyond just ambient effects, though yes, there is also plenty of content that does not use them beyond that which probably wouldn't matter much. But it can matter. Depends on what you listen to....

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post #39944 of 40602 Old 10-06-2018, 01:47 PM
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I have 8060 towers run full range with speaker wire and no external sub right now. I think it sounds really good in my room. I find myself wanting to add a external sub and run lfe to the towers also to essentially have 3 subwoofers in the room. I like the idea of the towers outputting the below crossover frequencies of the center and surrounds, I feel it helps fill the room better than one sub doing it.

My question is what type of sub pairs best with the passive radiators in the towers? Ported or sealed?

Also from what I understand audyssey will only eq to the drop off of the subs in the towers ( since they are the weakest) so since the -3 is about 39 hz, I assume everything below that for the additional sub is just not eq’ed? Are there any issues with that? Thanks for any advice
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post #39945 of 40602 Old 10-06-2018, 05:07 PM
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I have 8060 towers run full range with speaker wire and no external sub right now. I think it sounds really good in my room. I find myself wanting to add a external sub and run lfe to the towers also to essentially have 3 subwoofers in the room. I like the idea of the towers outputting the below crossover frequencies of the center and surrounds, I feel it helps fill the room better than one sub doing it.

My question is what type of sub pairs best with the passive radiators in the towers? Ported or sealed?

Also from what I understand audyssey will only eq to the drop off of the subs in the towers ( since they are the weakest) so since the -3 is about 39 hz, I assume everything below that for the additional sub is just not eq’ed? Are there any issues with that? Thanks for any advice
I was thinking of doing the same thing. I run BP9020's up front set to small crossed at 80hz with LFE to the powered woofers right now. I like the sound very much. I was talking to Tom at PSA about adding a PSA 15S subwoofer to the mix. He strongly recommends NOT using the smaller (less output) tower subs with LFE with a stronger more output powered subwoofer. Quote: ( they will have a significant "phase shift" relative to any of our products(which are all designed to extend much deeper). This phase shift will cause all sorts of cancellations.) He recommended i do what your doing right now and run speaker wires only to the BP9020's and cross the towers over at 60hz or 80hz and just use the 15S for the lower bass with LFE.

I was thinking the same thing. That the tower subs connected as LFE along with the PSA 15S would help with room nulls and other bass issue's but i guess not? I do have Audyssey XT32. I do know that the dual subwoofers in the towers connected as LFE sound much better then a single lower ouput subwoofer like a SVS SB1000 or RSL 10S speedwoofer which i had in the past.

And many other's on here don't recommend running 2 or 3 different subwoofers together. Try to run one good subwoofer or 2 matched subwoofers for duals.

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post #39946 of 40602 Old 10-06-2018, 06:39 PM
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Definitive Owners Thread

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I was thinking the same thing. That the tower subs connected as LFE along with the PSA 15S would help with room nulls and other bass issue's but i guess not? .

That’s a bummer that Tom advises against doing this because of cancellations. I always figured this flexibility was one of the strengths of owning these speakers. If you google Sandy Gross set up tips for Goldenear (I read them because he designed def tech and golden ear is very similar) he says that you can connect lfe to towers, then run them full range with an additional subwoofer. Maybe that’s because ge has more powerful amps and digs deeper.

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post #39947 of 40602 Old 10-07-2018, 04:36 AM
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That’s a bummer that Tom advises against doing this because of cancellations. I always figured this flexibility was one of the strengths of owning these speakers. If you google Sandy Gross set up tips for Goldenear (I read them because he designed def tech and golden ear is very similar) he says that you can connect lfe to towers, then run them full range with an additional subwoofer. Maybe that’s because ge has more powerful amps and digs deeper.
Yeah that is interesting. I run 4 supertowers lfe plus a Psa v1801 soon to be 2. Once I get my second I will switch all speakers to large instead of lfe. I wonder if any of the DT owners in this thread measured what exactly is going on when combining all of these subs. I’m pretty happy with my setup but I’m no bass expert.
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post #39948 of 40602 Old 10-07-2018, 04:59 AM
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I have 8060 towers run full range with speaker wire and no external sub right now. I think it sounds really good in my room. I find myself wanting to add a external sub and run lfe to the towers also to essentially have 3 subwoofers in the room. I like the idea of the towers outputting the below crossover frequencies of the center and surrounds, I feel it helps fill the room better than one sub doing it.

My question is what type of sub pairs best with the passive radiators in the towers? Ported or sealed?

Also from what I understand audyssey will only eq to the drop off of the subs in the towers ( since they are the weakest) so since the -3 is about 39 hz, I assume everything below that for the additional sub is just not eq’ed? Are there any issues with that? Thanks for any advice
Since the passive radiators are ports, you would think ported subs would be the better match, and they might be, but I'm running sealed Rythmiks with my 9040's and they blend very well. So I would make your decision of ported vs sealed upon other factors such as your room size, how much you prioritize low end extension vs mid base punch, and any WAF that might apply.

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post #39949 of 40602 Old 10-07-2018, 12:24 PM
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That’s a bummer that Tom advises against doing this because of cancellations. I always figured this flexibility was one of the strengths of owning these speakers. If you google Sandy Gross set up tips for Goldenear (I read them because he designed def tech and golden ear is very similar) he says that you can connect lfe to towers, then run them full range with an additional subwoofer. Maybe that’s because ge has more powerful amps and digs deeper.
I thought the same thing when buying the BP9020's. A very versatile speaker in many ways with the powered woofers and atmos modules on top which i have. He did say it wouldn't hurt anything to try it!

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Yeah that is interesting. I run 4 supertowers lfe plus a Psa v1801 soon to be 2. Once I get my second I will switch all speakers to large instead of lfe. I wonder if any of the DT owners in this thread measured what exactly is going on when combining all of these subs. I’m pretty happy with my setup but I’m no bass expert.
Maybe because your running much larger towers with a much larger subwoofer it works fine. That's a lot bass you have going there!

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post #39950 of 40602 Old 10-07-2018, 12:28 PM
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I thought the same thing when buying the BP9020's. A very versatile speaker in many ways with the powered woofers and atmos modules on top which i have. He did say it wouldn't hurt anything to try it!



Maybe because your running much larger towers with a much larger subwoofer it works fine. That's a lot bass you have going there!
I would put money on there being some cancelations like Tom has said. Eventually I’ll play around wiith REW and see what’s going on. Once I get my second v1801 I will use those solely for LFE.
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I haven’t been on here much lately but I’m reading some of the comments about the towers and running sub cables for LFE. Some of you know I did this awhile back and I’m very pleased with them. Here is an REW measurement of the bass in my room. This is a pic of my VTF-3 MK5 sub by itself and a pic with the BP8080’s and sub together... big difference!




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I haven’t been on here much lately but I’m reading some of the comments about the towers and running sub cables for LFE. Some of you know I did this awhile back and I’m very pleased with them. Here is an REW measurement of the bass in my room. This is a pic of my VTF-3 MK5 sub by itself and a pic with the BP8080’s and sub together... big difference!




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Good info. Thanks for posting. Where have you been?
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I have to say even though I have a slight beef with Def Tech the company, my setup, the SM 65 LCR and SM 55 surrounds are extremely impressive. I really do love them. Sound for movies and music is extremely good. Very dynamic and beautiful sounding.

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post #39954 of 40602 Old 10-08-2018, 11:36 AM
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Good info. Thanks for posting. Where have you been?


Hey @keeper ! I’ve just been working and hanging with the girlfriend! I had to stay off of here because it kept making me want more and spend more money. Plus, it’s football season!And now I know I have a good setup “for now” in the house I’m in. There’s really nothing else I can do with the space I have. I’m hoping to sell within the next two years and buy a new house. Then I’ll be upgrading big time!!!


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I haven’t been on here much lately but I’m reading some of the comments about the towers and running sub cables for LFE. Some of you know I did this awhile back and I’m very pleased with them. Here is an REW measurement of the bass in my room. This is a pic of my VTF-3 MK5 sub by itself and a pic with the BP8080’s and sub together... big difference!




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Thanks for the graphs falconsfan71. So I guess the proof is in the graphs, you didn't experience any cancellations running the built in tower subs using lfe along with an external (more powerful) sub, in fact you experienced a drastic (in my opinion) evening of the lower hz frequencies. That is what i was looking for! thanks. Are those results from Audyssey eq on your denon?
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Thanks for the graphs falconsfan71. So I guess the proof is in the graphs, you didn't experience any cancellations running the built in tower subs using lfe along with an external (more powerful) sub, in fact you experienced a drastic (in my opinion) evening of the lower hz frequencies. That is what i was looking for! thanks. Are those results from Audyssey eq on your denon?


Yes, I have the Denon X4300H 9.2 AVR which of course has Audyssey MultEQ XT32. This is a bad angle for a pic.. it makes the towers look funny or look like they’re leaning or facing out but they’re not.



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post #39957 of 40602 Old 10-08-2018, 12:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Falconsfan71 View Post
Yes, I have the Denon X4300H 9.2 AVR which of course has Audyssey MultEQ XT32. This is a bad angle for a pic.. it makes the towers look funny or look like they’re leaning or facing out but they’re not.

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Nice pics, I like your set up. So out of curiosity the frequency response with all three subs is that even with only audyssey? That’s really good considering audyssey is supposed to stop eq’ing below the tower subs drop off. I only have the 8060 with 10 inch subs but this gives me hope I could mix them with an external sub and get good results. Thanks
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post #39958 of 40602 Old 10-08-2018, 01:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by j4894 View Post
Nice pics, I like your set up. So out of curiosity the frequency response with all three subs is that even with only audyssey? That’s really good considering audyssey is supposed to stop eq’ing below the tower subs drop off. I only have the 8060 with 10 inch subs but this gives me hope I could mix them with an external sub and get good results. Thanks


Yea, that’s the only way I tested it since that’s how I listen to them. I admit though, for music, as far as detail and clarity, I like my SM45’s better. But for loudness and movies these BP8080’s are bad ass! Getting a bigger center made a big difference in movies also!


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post #39959 of 40602 Old 10-08-2018, 01:41 PM
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post #39960 of 40602 Old 10-08-2018, 01:46 PM
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Definitive Owners Thread

@j4894 This was me experimenting with using a PB-1000 connected to my Hsu sub running a splitter. You can see around the 3 minute mark my camera shaking on the back of the sofa! lol



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