Energy Owners Thread - Page 1858 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #55711 of 55767 Old 09-11-2019, 05:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post
Yes, IMO, having three identical vertical speakers for LCR is a very noticeable difference. Absolutely seamless panning across the front soundstage.

The issue is that it's often impractical because the TV would be blocked by the speaker, so it's generally only done with projection and acoustically transparent screens.
Well I am planning on doing a 75-85" LCD on the wall so I think this RC-70 could fit below it.

I'll have to take some exact measurements first, obviously!

😎It's just life, dude. We are all gonna die sometime--Might as well try and have a kickass time while we're still here.😜
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post #55712 of 55767 Old 09-12-2019, 08:11 PM
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🤤🤤🤤:::salivatingggggg:::🤤🤤🤤


I just found 3 pair of NIB RC-70's on CL for $2k.

Just flew to Vegas (Free), got a rental SUV ($85), drove 5 hours home to PHX, and the 3rd pair I getting shipped as they are currently at his second house in TX.

Cannot WAIT to get all these hooked up and running off my Parasound A51/A21 I bought last month from a fellow forum member!!!!


House will be done in January, woooHooooo!!!!!!
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post #55713 of 55767 Old 09-14-2019, 08:55 PM
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I'm sending out an SOS for help and guidance from anyone here, as my worst nightmare in Energy-land has happened:

Wife and I are finally (somewhat) moved into the house in Colorado (from CA), and I was checking to make sure all the speakers made the journey safe.
Cosmetically, everything looks great. However...

One of my 2.2i's has a woofer that is hardly moving or putting out volume whatsoever.
Trying each set of terminals on the speaker separately, it's the bottom set that seems affected, which I assume drives the woofer. .

The speaker is definitely not matching the other 2.2i if I swap them from the same receiver channel and it definitely doesn't sound right.

I'm 99.99% sure these are 2.2i's, so I didn't think frozen woofers should happen?

Basically at this point I'm looking for guidance. I know all the veritas woofers are different (at least parts-wise?) and I know drivers are next to impossible to track down.
I'm *hoping* that maybe something on the inside of the speaker is just loose and that with some guidance from you folks I can pop open the cabinet and see if anything can be done.

Any and all guidance is greatly accepted and appreciated -- and thank you!

John
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post #55714 of 55767 Old 09-14-2019, 09:11 PM
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My recollection is that the woofer is bolted back through the rear of the cabinet. There should be a round cover on the back when removed will expose the head of the bolt that you can loosen, at which point the woofer will pop out the front.

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post #55715 of 55767 Old 09-15-2019, 03:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnb4467 View Post
I'm sending out an SOS for help and guidance from anyone here, as my worst nightmare in Energy-land has happened:

Wife and I are finally (somewhat) moved into the house in Colorado (from CA), and I was checking to make sure all the speakers made the journey safe.
Cosmetically, everything looks great. However...

One of my 2.2i's has a woofer that is hardly moving or putting out volume whatsoever.
Trying each set of terminals on the speaker separately, it's the bottom set that seems affected, which I assume drives the woofer. .

The speaker is definitely not matching the other 2.2i if I swap them from the same receiver channel and it definitely doesn't sound right.

I'm 99.99% sure these are 2.2i's, so I didn't think frozen woofers should happen?

Basically at this point I'm looking for guidance. I know all the veritas woofers are different (at least parts-wise?) and I know drivers are next to impossible to track down.
I'm *hoping* that maybe something on the inside of the speaker is just loose and that with some guidance from you folks I can pop open the cabinet and see if anything can be done.

Any and all guidance is greatly accepted and appreciated -- and thank you!

John
If you gently push the woofer cones and they move freely, without any mechanical voice coil rubbing, then it's the internal wiring that you want to examine. It is far more likely that sustained vibration in a truck (was it an air-ride trailer?) could shake loose an already loose connection.

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post #55716 of 55767 Old 09-15-2019, 11:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post
My recollection is that the woofer is bolted back through the rear of the cabinet. There should be a round cover on the back when removed will expose the head of the bolt that you can loosen, at which point the woofer will pop out the front.
Excellent -- this is what I think I recall you posting a long while back, but I wasn't sure if that was all that was involved (loosening the bolt).
I will be opening it up soon and hopefully finding something simple that's loose.
If you have any other guidance on what to expect from the Veritas 2.x once they are opened up, let me know!

Quote:
Originally Posted by KenM10759 View Post
If you gently push the woofer cones and they move freely, without any mechanical voice coil rubbing, then it's the internal wiring that you want to examine. It is far more likely that sustained vibration in a truck (was it an air-ride trailer?) could shake loose an already loose connection.
Thank you for the help, KenM! The woofer does seem to be as flexible as the other, so I'm hoping that is a good sign. It was a POD unit that moved everything. I had the all the speakers wrapped pretty nicely, so there was no physical damage.

That being said, there was most definitely water damage on a good number of boxes, but thankfully nothing 'went through' the electronics or speaker wrappings. The projector and my main AVR were close calls though! Thankfully I had their original packaging wrapping.

I'm not too sure what to expect once I open up the 2.2i, aside from the regular + - cables for the crossovers (which I'm still not sure what they would look like).
Anything else I should know about before proceeding?

Thank you for the help, both of you -- and anyone else that has any knowledge in this area...please do chime in! Always thankful for this wonderful community.

John
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post #55717 of 55767 Old 09-15-2019, 10:34 PM
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As a follow-up to my issues 2.2i issues:

Batpig was right in his advice on just loosening the bolt in the back to pop out the woofer.

KenM was also correct that something came disconnected internally -- one of the electrical wire terminals.

As a (not elegant) solution...
...the connector would not fit all the way on; somehow it had gotten mangled and wouldn't fit, even after about an hour of [cramped, in-cabinet] tinkering by my wife and I.
As an effect, I got it on as much as I could (maybe 20%?) and put a bit of electrical tape around to hold the ends together.

The speaker now sounds pretty much exactly like the other.

Is there any concerns with it not being completely connected?
I could, perhaps, buy some electrical wire terminals, snip off the one in there...and try and [again, cramped] swap it out -- but if there's no concern over it not being 'fully on there', then I'll leave it as-is and continue to enjoy the speakers....

Thank you both for your help -- you saved me!!
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post #55718 of 55767 Old 09-16-2019, 04:35 AM
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At some point the connection should be restored to original to assure it doesn't corrode.

Do you have any photos of what it all looked like? Do you possibly have a nearby friend with equipment and soldering skills?

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post #55719 of 55767 Old 09-16-2019, 08:11 AM
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@johnb4467 is it a matter of not reaching or just not going back on all the way?
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post #55720 of 55767 Old 09-16-2019, 12:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KenM10759 View Post
At some point the connection should be restored to original to assure it doesn't corrode.

Do you have any photos of what it all looked like? Do you possibly have a nearby friend with equipment and soldering skills?
I do have some photos! I took one of the model number of the driver (which I assume is an 'i' series woofer?) and trying to get photos of the electrical connector. It was mangled and/or corroded (or something) enough to where it wouldn't fit on. The wife and I messed with it with pliers & other tools for a while to try and get it fitting, but it wouldn't go on more than a bit.

Thoughts on what you see?

My wife and I just moved to the state so don't know too many people here. If it came down to just clipping off the existing connector and putting another one in there, I might be able to do that. It would just be very cramped and I'm not too eager to do alterations unless they're necessary. Do you think corrosion was a factor in what we are already seeing...since I can't think of any way that thing was fitted all the way on there before?


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Originally Posted by laserjock II View Post
@johnb4467 is it a matter of not reaching or just not going back on all the way?
It won't go on all the way, but (very thankfully!) reaches. Which I suppose either means it never fit to begin with (maybe it was just glued in place?) or something odd happened inside the cabinet throughout its life, though I can't think of much that could physically affect it inside of there...aside from corrosion.

Thank you for your input as well, laserjock!
If you have other thoughts, do let me know.
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post #55721 of 55767 Old 09-16-2019, 01:03 PM
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I would try spritzing some Deoxit on the connector, if it's corrosion that should help restore the contact points by removing the corrosion. You can also solder the connection, which isn't that hard to do with a cheap solder kit from Amazon.

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post #55722 of 55767 Old 09-16-2019, 01:30 PM
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Looks like it was soldered previously but doesn’t make sense, since it came off..?

I’d be tempted to make a small female to male spade “extension to attempt a better connection on both sides.

Deoxit is a good suggestion either way.

Might try putting a new bare female spade lug on the speaker terminal first and if you have enough wire on current one to work outside the speaker, clip the old one and strip the wire and crimp a new one on.
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post #55723 of 55767 Old 09-16-2019, 02:51 PM
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Yeah, if it's not corrosion but rather just some leftover residue from a solder, you should be able to just touch it with the soldering iron, and then when the residue liquifies a bit you shove the connector in place and it's done.

I actually just did this exact thing a few days ago replacing a driver on one of my (Triad, not Energy) speakers. WARNING: I discovered that speaker wire heats up fast when you do this! I wasn't thinking about that pesky old "metal is a great conductor" thing and got a few burns on the fingertips
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post #55724 of 55767 Old 09-16-2019, 03:10 PM
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Anyone remember Circuit City?

I got a pair of Infinity bookies on the cheap because one wouldn’t work.

I told the salesman I’d fix it and buy them. Took a woofer out and put the spade lug/wire on terminal. Walla!

Instant speaker bliss.

Still rocking them as surrounds.
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post #55725 of 55767 Old 09-16-2019, 05:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnb4467 View Post
I do have some photos! I took one of the model number of the driver (which I assume is an 'i' series woofer?)
It is an "i" series woofer. Below is copied and pasted from post # 49071 courtesy of AVS member Fears4Ears:


4DR//51869 - woofer for v2.0c
4DR//51914 - woofer for v2.0ci

4DR//51868 - woofer for v2.1/v2.2/v2.0r
4DR//51911 - woofer for v2.2i/v2.0ri *Note - there's no v2.1 with "i series"

4DR//51870 - woofer for v2.3
4DR//51912 - woofer for v2.3i

4DR//51871 - woofer for v2.4
4DR//51913 - woofer for v2.4i

5DR//53106 - tweeter for v2.0c/v2.0ci
5DR//53107 - tweeter for v2.1/v2.0r/v2.0ri *Note - there's no v2.1 with "i series"
4DR//52030 - tweeter for v2.2/v2.2i/v2.3/v2.3i/v2.4/v2.4i

5DR//61088 - midrange for v2.0r/v2.0ri


5DR//53311 - tweeter for v1.0cm

5DR//53312 - twt/mid for v2.0cm


5DR//63111 - woofer for v2.1wm/V2.2wm/V2.2hm in wall

5DR//63112 - woofer for v2.3wm

5DR//53313 - tweeter for v2.1wm

5DR//53314 - twt/mid for v2.2wm/v2.2hm/v2.3wm in wall
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post #55726 of 55767 Old 09-16-2019, 10:37 PM
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No reserve $.99 starting bid for an RC-LCR on ebay currently:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/ENERGY-Cent...YAAOSwhbNdgD-Q

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post #55727 of 55767 Old 09-17-2019, 06:49 AM
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https://www.ebay.com/itm/Energy-Veri...3e6f%7Ciid%3A1


Veritas 2.4 "Non I-Series" pair (Piano Black) under $400

Watch for frozen drivers maybe. Could be a nice pickup, but to be clear it is "local pickup only"
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post #55728 of 55767 Old 09-17-2019, 07:42 PM
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https://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/ele...978019821.html


Listed as 2.3i towers in San Francisco for $200, but the grills suggest they are non-i. Look pretty rough but could be a good buy for spare parts.


Quote:
Originally Posted by brendelac View Post
...and the matching center and rear channels (both i models) in WA for $200


https://seattle.craigslist.org/see/e...974548058.html
Down to $160 now. Wish I were a bit closer...

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post #55729 of 55767 Old 09-17-2019, 07:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brendelac View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by brendelac View Post
...and the matching center and rear channels (both i models) in WA for $200


https://seattle.craigslist.org/see/e...974548058.html
Down to $160 now. Wish I were a bit closer...
Helluva deal

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post #55730 of 55767 Old 09-17-2019, 08:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KenM10759 View Post
At some point the connection should be restored to original to assure it doesn't corrode.

Do you have any photos of what it all looked like? Do you possibly have a nearby friend with equipment and soldering skills?
you would not even have to know how to solder, Get a spade crimp connector, and a bit of equal gauge speaker wire and use a heat shrink connector that will great a solder point with either a heat gun or hair dryer in a crunch. I got a 2.2 shipped with this issue as well. Same solution: open it up and find severed connect. Use a flat head to reshape the female spade fitting and open it up just a little so that. When you get it back on can apply some light pressure with needle nose pliers. to close it up so it doesn't slip. Glad you got it working but you can do better than the electrical tape Enjoy the 2.2s/2.2is
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post #55731 of 55767 Old 09-18-2019, 12:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brendelac View Post
It is an "i" series woofer. Below is copied and pasted from post # 49071 courtesy of AVS member Fears4Ears:
Very relieved to hear it is an 'i' series driver. I figured it should be...but on the used market you never quite know.

Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post
Yeah, if it's not corrosion but rather just some leftover residue from a solder, you should be able to just touch it with the soldering iron, and then when the residue liquifies a bit you shove the connector in place and it's done.

I wasn't thinking about that pesky old "metal is a great conductor" thing and got a few burns on the fingertips
Had never heard of deoxit, I'll have to look at that. Haha, I'll be sure to adhere to the 'metal is a great conductor' point!! I'll mention my issue in another quote below though:

Quote:
Originally Posted by laserjock II View Post
Looks like it was soldered previously but doesn’t make sense, since it came off..?

I’d be tempted to make a small female to male spade “extension to attempt a better connection on both sides.

Might try putting a new bare female spade lug on the speaker terminal first and if you have enough wire on current one to work outside the speaker, clip the old one and strip the wire and crimp a new one on.
The main issue I am running into is that the current spade (is that the right name?) got crushed on one end somehow, where it 'grips around'. The wife and I were trying to use a flathead and other objects to try and 'lift' it up, but it's pretty smashed down. No idea how it got like that, but at this point it's pretty deformed...between its initials state and us using needle-nose pliers and flatheads, etc.

To really fix that thing, the only solution (unless I'm not reading some other quotes correctly) is to clip the current one off and add another one ... which I've never done before. :-/

Quote:
Originally Posted by nc88keyz View Post
you would not even have to know how to solder, Get a spade crimp connector, and a bit of equal gauge speaker wire and use a heat shrink connector that will great a solder point with either a heat gun or hair dryer in a crunch. I got a 2.2 shipped with this issue as well. Same solution: open it up and find severed connect. Use a flat head to reshape the female spade fitting and open it up just a little so that. When you get it back on can apply some light pressure with needle nose pliers. to close it up so it doesn't slip. Glad you got it working but you can do better than the electrical tape Enjoy the 2.2s/2.2is
Mentioned slightly in my previous quote response that, well, I don't think I can reshape the female spade as one end has been smashed down. Will your approach still work if I can't do that?

Thank you, EVERYONE, for the help -- and I apologize for my non-knowledge in this area. If you need more pictures or something of that sort let me know and I can try and take some. Right now it is put back together, but thankfully the woofer is easy enough to pop back out if needed.
It *does* seem to be working as-is, so are these approaches for the sake of a more proper / elegant solution, or are there performance issues in how I've (ghetto) rigged the solution?

Thanks again.
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post #55732 of 55767 Old 09-18-2019, 06:37 PM
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Anyone know a fair market value for a near mint pair of piano black reference connoisseur 22's? They've been safely stored for quite a while, but the seller says they are recently tested and still sound great. He's asking $800. The ref-con 22's are pretty rare and of the ones I have seen listed for sale, almost all are the standard black ash. I know new ferrofluid would be a couple hundred dollars more when the time comes. Does ferrofluid dry up from age, usage or both?
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post #55733 of 55767 Old 09-18-2019, 10:57 PM
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For a speaker like that, I honestly don't know if there is such a thing as "fair market value". It's not like there's a robust market to compare against because they are so rare. And especially in this case since you are talking about an even rarer version with the piano finish. So IMO it's really more of a luxury collector's item and therefore "market value" isn't that relevant, it's about what you are willing to pay to get that heirloom.

Obviously there are limits -- you wouldn't pay $5,000 for them, my recollection is that they typically sell for well under $1,000 -- but I don't think $800 is at all unreasonable if they are indeed in excellent condition and you really really want them (and you're in Canada, so that $800 is less in US terms). You might literally wait decades to find another pair like that, so it seems almost nonsensical to worry if they are actually "worth" say $600 and not $800. You're not buying them for the value.

You either want them or you don't, and you can either afford them or you can't.

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post #55734 of 55767 Old 09-18-2019, 11:01 PM
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Originally Posted by brendelac View Post
Anyone know a fair market value for a near mint pair of piano black reference connoisseur 22's? They've been safely stored for quite a while, but the seller says they are recently tested and still sound great. He's asking $800. The ref-con 22's are pretty rare and of the ones I have seen listed for sale, almost all are the standard black ash. I know new ferrofluid would be a couple hundred dollars more when the time comes. Does ferrofluid dry up from age, usage or both?
Do you mean 2.2?

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post #55735 of 55767 Old 09-18-2019, 11:20 PM
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Do you mean 2.2?
the fact that it seems you aren't even aware of the speaker being discussed illustrates my point

We are talking about these legendary classics from the 1980's, one of the first great Energy speakers that put the company on the map:






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post #55736 of 55767 Old 09-19-2019, 12:38 PM
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Originally Posted by brendelac View Post
Anyone know a fair market value for a near mint pair of piano black reference connoisseur 22's? The ref-con 22's are pretty rare and of the ones I have seen listed for sale, almost all are the standard black ash. I know new ferrofluid would be a couple hundred dollars more when the time comes. Does ferrofluid dry up from age, usage or both?
WOW! I have never even seen those for sale and this is one of the first times I've seen them mentioned here (admittedly, I'm here sporadically).

I had the 'e' series speakers for a good while (5.1e, 2.1e...latter of which I still have and use!) and LOVED them. But...that's as far back in Energy lineage as I've ever gone.

It would be super special to own a piece of history like that. Then again...I suppose it'd be more akin to having a museum piece (that happens to sound amazing, lol) -- likely not something you'd use daily, or maybe so?

Either way, cool post.

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post #55737 of 55767 Old 09-19-2019, 04:07 PM
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Originally Posted by johnb4467 View Post

It would be super special to own a piece of history like that. Then again...I suppose it'd be more akin to having a museum piece (that happens to sound amazing, lol) -- likely not something you'd use daily, or maybe so?

Either way, cool post.
Museum piece for sure.
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post #55738 of 55767 Old 09-19-2019, 05:15 PM
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I don't know about "museum piece." Apparently started in 1973 in Canada, perhaps it's more known and revered there but it doesn't seem to be a long history before they either went out of business or got bought out by Klipsch.

Educate me?

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post #55739 of 55767 Old 09-19-2019, 09:02 PM
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Originally Posted by batpig View Post
the fact that it seems you aren't even aware of the speaker being discussed illustrates my point

We are talking about these legendary classics from the 1980's, one of the first great Energy speakers that put the company on the map:

these?



https://sandiego.craigslist.org/csd/...982159163.html

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Energy-22-2...AAAOSw1rpcRQqH

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Energy-22-3...4AAOSwHBJdgh-l

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Last edited by 355F1; 09-19-2019 at 09:08 PM.
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post #55740 of 55767 Old 09-19-2019, 09:38 PM
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Originally Posted by KenM10759 View Post
I don't know about "museum piece." Apparently started in 1973 in Canada, perhaps it's more known and revered there but it doesn't seem to be a long history before they either went out of business or got bought out by Klipsch.

Educate me?
Trophy piece is probably a better term for these.



The craigslist link from San Diego is a lower tier variation of the reference connoisseur 22s. There is also the reference 22 (missing the word "connoisseur"). The ref-con 22s are on top from that era, although don't ask me to explain their differences other than the ref-con 22s having the stand built into the cabinet whereas the others had a separate detachable stand with them however they do seem to be missing from the speakers in the craigslist link.



The two ebay links were later offerings from Energy (early 90s I think) which I don't know much about but aren't as highly regarded as the ref-con 22s. As far as I know, the only speaker Energy ever made before the ref-con 22s was the Energy One/Two/Three models which are even more rare, but don't seem to have much of a reputation either.

Last edited by brendelac; 09-19-2019 at 10:02 PM.
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