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post #16381 of 18858 Old 01-12-2019, 02:54 PM
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Originally Posted by aarons915 View Post
Also, I have a feeling that someone skilled in crossover design could make the Q150 sound much more neutral, I'd bet the tweeter is padded too much. A lot of KEFs are designed to be more laid back so maybe it's a design choice but the cynic in me thinks it might be done purposely so that the new R series and the LS50 are bigger steps in sound quality above the Q150.
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Originally Posted by Lp85253 View Post
i think the q100s could be the same way.. a skilled xover guy could make them sound about ... great..
Maybe if @Dennis Murphy ever needs a new affordable accuracy monitor and the Q150 get cheap enough, we'll see that happen. The cabinet isn't nearly as robust as the ones he uses from parts express though.
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post #16382 of 18858 Old 01-12-2019, 02:59 PM
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Originally Posted by aarons915 View Post
Maybe if @Dennis Murphy ever needs a new affordable accuracy monitor and the Q150 get cheap enough, we'll see that happen. The cabinet isn't nearly as robust as the ones he uses from parts express though.
i know the cabs and xover aren't a+ but those drivers sure sound nice to me ,,, just too forward on the q100s

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post #16383 of 18858 Old 01-12-2019, 05:52 PM
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Originally Posted by aarons915 View Post
Maybe if @Dennis Murphy ever needs a new affordable accuracy monitor and the Q150 get cheap enough, we'll see that happen. The cabinet isn't nearly as robust as the ones he uses from parts express though.
Love the idea of Dennis upgrading the crossover. Would be very interesting to see what he would implement.

It would be great if KEF offered the Q series as it stands now but then a "Q+" series as an upgrade option.

So maybe for a little more money, you could buy a Q150+ or Q350+ with an upgraded crossover (more parts/better design). Some additional bracing would be good too but I'd pay extra just for the crossover.

And in the case of the Q towers and center channel, you could pay a extra to have a true three way design through an upgraded crossover.

I know I would happily pay extra to have the right upgrades "under the hood."
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post #16384 of 18858 Old 01-12-2019, 06:15 PM
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We have Dolby Atmos in our theater (7.2.4) with KEF Reference, etc. In our family room we have a second setup which I’ve never been as picky about. Just a basic 5.1 system, but now have R3s. Since my setup for this room can do Dolby Atmos and I also had a couple of extra channels in the 7 channel amp not used, I decided to add a pair of R8s as Dolby speakers. OMG what a great improvement in the sound stage. Glad KEF makes these small gems for Dolby Atmos. SJ
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post #16385 of 18858 Old 01-12-2019, 07:23 PM
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Originally Posted by SJHT View Post
We have Dolby Atmos in our theater (7.2.4) with KEF Reference, etc. In our family room we have a second setup which I’ve never been as picky about. Just a basic 5.1 system, but now have R3s. Since my setup for this room can do Dolby Atmos and I also had a couple of extra channels in the 7 channel amp not used, I decided to add a pair of R8s as Dolby speakers. OMG what a great improvement in the sound stage. Glad KEF makes these small gems for Dolby Atmos. SJ
I have the R50's in my modest 5.1.2 system and am really impressed with just how well they work. I'm sure my low ceiling and seating position both play a role in their effectiveness, but very happy just the same.

Those R3's are incredible for the money, as are all of the new R series. Bet they give your Reference a run for the money, but you tell us!

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post #16386 of 18858 Old 01-12-2019, 07:27 PM
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Originally Posted by dftkell View Post
Love the idea of Dennis upgrading the crossover. Would be very interesting to see what he would implement.

It would be great if KEF offered the Q series as it stands now but then a "Q+" series as an upgrade option.

So maybe for a little more money, you could buy a Q150+ or Q350+ with an upgraded crossover (more parts/better design). Some additional bracing would be good too but I'd pay extra just for the crossover.

And in the case of the Q towers and center channel, you could pay a extra to have a true three way design through an upgraded crossover.

I know I would happily pay extra to have the right upgrades "under the hood."
I had asked him about upgrading a pair of Q300's one time. He responded quickly to say it's not a project he particularly wants to take on as he's so busy with his own products. To do it would require sending him a pair of speakers, a wad of money, and a long time to do it. There would be a LOT of time involved in engineering, trial, measurements, adjustments and more measurements.

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post #16387 of 18858 Old 01-12-2019, 07:33 PM
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I have the R50's in my modest 5.1.2 system and am really impressed with just how well they work. I'm sure my low ceiling and seating position both play a role in their effectiveness, but very happy just the same.

Those R3's are incredible for the money, as are all of the new R series. Bet they give your Reference a run for the money, but you tell us!
Hard to say beacause of all the other things in our theater not related to the speakers. I can tell you they blow away my previous Qs which were really old and obviously not like more recent models... Even my wife who normally doesnt care noticed the improvement... SJ
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post #16388 of 18858 Old 01-13-2019, 01:17 AM
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Since the R series got a refresh, anyone know if any of the other lineups will be refreshed soon by Kef?
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post #16389 of 18858 Old 01-13-2019, 03:11 AM
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Since the R series got a refresh, anyone know if any of the other lineups will be refreshed soon by Kef?
The biggest-selling line, the Q series, was updated in 2017 and won't be touched for a while. Since there is no longer an entry C series that leaves LS50, Reference, and T-series. Maybe a new Egg too. Every year there's at least one, and of course completely new products like the LSX.

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post #16390 of 18858 Old 01-13-2019, 05:56 AM
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Keep thinking that. It can save you a lot of money that you can pass along to your kids so they can enjoy the high-end amps.


The science proves his point. The difference in amps and sound are features, not amplification.
Placebos do heal a lot of illnesses though.


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post #16391 of 18858 Old 01-13-2019, 06:16 AM
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Hi All,

First time poster! (Been lurking for a while though.)

Never had Kef on my radar before, but demo'ed a pair of R300's on clearance at my local audio place and just had to get them. Loving them so far.

Moved my B&W 685 S2's to surround duty for now.

This could go in the subwoofer forum but it's Kef related so I'll post here...

Read several recent comments about the Kube subs, but seen no mentions about the R400b as that is the matching sub for the R series. Not sure about the twin 9 inch drivers or about the price (even on sale) considering that one could get two Kube 12b subs for only slightly more than the current sale price (and much less than the normal price).

Is the performance enough to justify the price over two Kubes?
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post #16392 of 18858 Old 01-13-2019, 06:57 AM
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Originally Posted by RustyFlyer View Post
Hi All,



First time poster! (Been lurking for a while though.)



Never had Kef on my radar before, but demo'ed a pair of R300's on clearance at my local audio place and just had to get them. Loving them so far.



Moved my B&W 685 S2's to surround duty for now.



This could go in the subwoofer forum but it's Kef related so I'll post here...



Read several recent comments about the Kube subs, but seen no mentions about the R400b as that is the matching sub for the R series. Not sure about the twin 9 inch drivers or about the price (even on sale) considering that one could get two Kube 12b subs for only slightly more than the current sale price (and much less than the normal price).



Is the performance enough to justify the price over two Kubes?


If you go to the subwoofer forum, they are going to tell you to stay away from all subs KEF. A lot of guys here have reported that the redesigned kubes are quite nice. Would your store let you demo them in your house? Room gain has a huge impact on subs.


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post #16393 of 18858 Old 01-13-2019, 07:01 AM
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Originally Posted by RustyFlyer View Post
Hi All,



First time poster! (Been lurking for a while though.)



Never had Kef on my radar before, but demo'ed a pair of R300's on clearance at my local audio place and just had to get them. Loving them so far.



Moved my B&W 685 S2's to surround duty for now.



This could go in the subwoofer forum but it's Kef related so I'll post here...



Read several recent comments about the Kube subs, but seen no mentions about the R400b as that is the matching sub for the R series. Not sure about the twin 9 inch drivers or about the price (even on sale) considering that one could get two Kube 12b subs for only slightly more than the current sale price (and much less than the normal price).



Is the performance enough to justify the price over two Kubes?


I am very interested if anyone has first hand knowledge but I would go with two Kube 12b subs. I believe they will work better in most rooms (multiple subs are the better choice than one single). Since the R400b is essentially twin 9” subs opposing at one location not certain but guessing harder to place. So it is my “guess” that two Kube 12b subs would be better.


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post #16394 of 18858 Old 01-13-2019, 07:14 AM
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I am very interested if anyone has first hand knowledge but I would go with two Kube 12b subs. I believe they will work better in most rooms (multiple subs are the better choice than one single). Since the R400b is essentially twin 9” subs opposing at one location not certain but guessing harder to place. So it is my “guess” that two Kube 12b subs would be better.
I don’t own and never heard the R400b but I do own a Goldenear SuperSub that uses dual opposing drivers and the idea behind them is to cancel vibrations coming from the enclosure. These designs shouldn’t be harder to place than any other subwoofer design since bass frequencies are Omni-directional. Though, I agree with the suggestion, going dual subwoofers no matter the design.
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post #16395 of 18858 Old 01-13-2019, 07:17 AM
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We have Dolby Atmos in our theater (7.2.4) with KEF Reference, etc. In our family room we have a second setup which I’ve never been as picky about. Just a basic 5.1 system, but now have R3s. Since my setup for this room can do Dolby Atmos and I also had a couple of extra channels in the 7 channel amp not used, I decided to add a pair of R8s as Dolby speakers. OMG what a great improvement in the sound stage. Glad KEF makes these small gems for Dolby Atmos. SJ
But it does not appear that the R8 can be mounted high on the wall and pointed down and used as an Atmos speaker. Correct? Does KEF have something comparable to SVS Prime Elevation speakers? Would like to check them out if they do.
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post #16396 of 18858 Old 01-13-2019, 07:20 AM
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Originally Posted by RustyFlyer View Post
Hi All,



First time poster! (Been lurking for a while though.)



Never had Kef on my radar before, but demo'ed a pair of R300's on clearance at my local audio place and just had to get them. Loving them so far.



Moved my B&W 685 S2's to surround duty for now.



This could go in the subwoofer forum but it's Kef related so I'll post here...



Read several recent comments about the Kube subs, but seen no mentions about the R400b as that is the matching sub for the R series. Not sure about the twin 9 inch drivers or about the price (even on sale) considering that one could get two Kube 12b subs for only slightly more than the current sale price (and much less than the normal price).



Is the performance enough to justify the price over two Kubes?


I would head over to the sub forum to learn sub basics, such as placement, room gain, etc.


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post #16397 of 18858 Old 01-13-2019, 07:22 AM
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But it does not appear that the R8 can be mounted high on the wall and pointed down and used as an Atmos speaker. Correct? Does KEF have something comparable to SVS Prime Elevation speakers? Would like to check them out if they do.
I didn’t do that, but it does have mounting components built in to allow that. SJ
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post #16398 of 18858 Old 01-13-2019, 07:38 AM
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But it does not appear that the R8 can be mounted high on the wall and pointed down and used as an Atmos speaker. Correct? Does KEF have something comparable to SVS Prime Elevation speakers? Would like to check them out if they do.
That is one of the biggest differences between the R50 and the new R8s. The new one has (like the Q50a) "keyhole mount" brackets for mounting in that orientation.
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post #16399 of 18858 Old 01-13-2019, 08:10 AM
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Originally Posted by RustyFlyer View Post
Hi All,

First time poster! (Been lurking for a while though.)

Never had Kef on my radar before, but demo'ed a pair of R300's on clearance at my local audio place and just had to get them. Loving them so far.

Moved my B&W 685 S2's to surround duty for now.

This could go in the subwoofer forum but it's Kef related so I'll post here...

Read several recent comments about the Kube subs, but seen no mentions about the R400b as that is the matching sub for the R series. Not sure about the twin 9 inch drivers or about the price (even on sale) considering that one could get two Kube 12b subs for only slightly more than the current sale price (and much less than the normal price).

Is the performance enough to justify the price over two Kubes?
Kef has put a lot time on R&D for the latest Kube subs. A few members have reported that they are very fast and accurate and sound fantastic. That said, the subwoofers do not need to match the rest of your setup.

If you're more into HT than music, a ported or hybrid sub(s) will have more output below 35hz if you're after that kick in the chest feeling. With a hybrid sub you can switch back and forth between poted (for HT) and sealed for a smooth and shallow drop off for better musical performance.

The size of your room will also determine how much sub is needed since subs see the entire space (including open areas and adjacent rooms) not just the listening area.

In short, if you're setting up a 2 channel music setup in a small to medium room, dual Kube 12 would sound fantastic. If you want high impact for HT and/or have a larger space to fill, there are other excellent options available. Dual subs will give you much smoother and even bass across the entire room regardless of the type of sub you choose.
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post #16400 of 18858 Old 01-13-2019, 07:16 PM
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Anybody have thoughts on the R11s?


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post #16401 of 18858 Old 01-13-2019, 08:36 PM
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Agreed, because all the measurements I've seen (and those I've done with my NAD T758v3 receiver's Dirac) show flat to perhaps a very slight bump for mid-bass with my R series. I don't have any of the Q100, Q150, Q300, or Q350 speakers at home, but perhaps my son would be willing to bring his Q100 and/or Q300 pairs over here. I'm not experienced with it, but I have a calibrated UMIK-1 and have downloaded REW so theoretically I could measure.
There's lots of measurements out there, you'd be wasting your time. There's no dip that is being suggested.

It has to be either a room node, a specific sound signature preference, or a comparison to non-neutral speakers.

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post #16402 of 18858 Old 01-14-2019, 05:45 AM
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Still not in my new home, these speakers are such a tease.

This is what the left surround and atmos rear left look like. From Atmos diagrams I know they want the back speakers to be behind you. This is about all I could afford to give them for space. I think it should be ok?

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I'm going to be purchasing a pair of Q350's to be used as a stereo pair for TV viewing. Seating distance will be 10 feet away in a medium size room. The 350's are 87db's efficient. Will occasionally listen a bit loud but will never, ever approach reference level. I am considering this Onkyo stereo receiver:

https://www.crutchfield.com/p_580TX8...er-reviews-tab

It's rated at 45 watts per channel. From what I can tell, I think that's an honest rating.

Using the Peak SPL calculator, I think 45 watts per channel should be absolutely fine.

http://myhometheater.homestead.com/splcalculator.html

But, just wanted to see what real world experiences owners of the 350's have had before I pull the trigger on the Onkyo.

Thanks
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post #16404 of 18858 Old 01-14-2019, 09:26 AM
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Originally Posted by dftkell View Post
I'm going to be purchasing a pair of Q350's to be used as a stereo pair for TV viewing. Seating distance will be 10 feet away in a medium size room. The 350's are 87db's efficient. Will occasionally listen a bit loud but will never, ever approach reference level. I am considering this Onkyo stereo receiver:

https://www.crutchfield.com/p_580TX8...er-reviews-tab

It's rated at 45 watts per channel. From what I can tell, I think that's an honest rating.

Using the Peak SPL calculator, I think 45 watts per channel should be absolutely fine.

http://myhometheater.homestead.com/splcalculator.html

But, just wanted to see what real world experiences owners of the 350's have had before I pull the trigger on the Onkyo.

Thanks
Dan

The other option I'm considering is getting two pair of the LSX's instead of the 350's+receiver. I am a little concerned about the smaller uni-q on the LSX though at 10 feet away. Again though, not blasting ridiculous volume.

In either scenario, I could add a subwoofer.

This if for two edit rooms at my office where we view cuts. I am trying to keep costs reasonable but we could do either scenario. (The editors are already set up with Genelecs for mixing etc, but I don't want to spend that much for us to just view rough cuts.)

So if there any LSX owners, please chime in as well.

Thanks
Dan
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post #16405 of 18858 Old 01-14-2019, 11:40 AM
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Originally Posted by dftkell View Post
The other option I'm considering is getting two pair of the LSX's instead of the 350's+receiver. I am a little concerned about the smaller uni-q on the LSX though at 10 feet away. Again though, not blasting ridiculous volume.

In either scenario, I could add a subwoofer.

This if for two edit rooms at my office where we view cuts. I am trying to keep costs reasonable but we could do either scenario. (The editors are already set up with Genelecs for mixing etc, but I don't want to spend that much for us to just view rough cuts.)

So if there any LSX owners, please chime in as well.

Thanks
Dan
LSX will definitely need a sub. Q350 may be played without one.

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post #16406 of 18858 Old 01-15-2019, 09:06 AM
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Looks like I might be back amplifier hunting for my LS50 +R400b. Nova150 I got has problems and will likely return it. I don't mind keeping it if it was 100% working, but since I'll return it I'm leaning towards just getting a refund and then getting a power amplifier. My Chord Mojo still beat the Nova150's DAC and at this point I'm convinced I'm better off getting a power amp+Mojo instead of an integrated amp. Also I tried directly connecting my Mojo, which has two audio jacks, to the sub via 3.5mm to RCA converter and it works! I'm thinking I can connect the Mojo to a power amp and then to my sub.

2.1: KEF LS50 + KEF R400b. Integrated Amp: Peachtree Nova150. Cables: QED Revelation and Chord C-line RCA
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post #16407 of 18858 Old 01-15-2019, 02:40 PM
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Looks like I might be back amplifier hunting for my LS50 +R400b. Nova150 I got has problems and will likely return it. I don't mind keeping it if it was 100% working, but since I'll return it I'm leaning towards just getting a refund and then getting a power amplifier. My Chord Mojo still beat the Nova150's DAC and at this point I'm convinced I'm better off getting a power amp+Mojo instead of an integrated amp. Also I tried directly connecting my Mojo, which has two audio jacks, to the sub via 3.5mm to RCA converter and it works! I'm thinking I can connect the Mojo to a power amp and then to my sub.
Budget?

I've been thinking about getting the NAD C658 pre-amp/DAC/streamer together with a C278 power amp, but after the announcement of the new Master Series M10...that's my new lust. Both have Dirac Live, Bluesound (for full MQA) and dual subwoofer outputs.

If looking at just a power amp, you'd be missing a lot of very desirable features.

KEF R500, R200C, R100, R50, SVS SB2000 sub, NAD T758v3 AVR, LG UP875 4K BlueRay, Samsung UN55JU6500F 4K LED TV, KEF M500 headphones, Sony CDP-CE500 CD changer. Office: NAD M10, KEF LS50, KEF Kube 10b, Pro-Ject RPM1 TT w/ Ortofon 2M Red. Guest room: Hafler 300 L-R, KEF Reference Model 100 center, KEF iQ10 surrounds, modded M&K V-90 sub, Bluesound Vault 2.
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post #16408 of 18858 Old 01-15-2019, 04:28 PM
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Budget?

I've been thinking about getting the NAD C658 pre-amp/DAC/streamer together with a C278 power amp, but after the announcement of the new Master Series M10...that's my new lust. Both have Dirac Live, Bluesound (for full MQA) and dual subwoofer outputs.

If looking at just a power amp, you'd be missing a lot of very desirable features.
Mostly features that I don't need though :P

Peachtree contacted me and so far haven't had the issue again today so right now I may be keeping the Nova150. If not, then I'd say $1000 max after taxes. Speaking of Master, I was looking at NAD Masters M22 and found out that it uses Hypex nCore amplifier. The Audio Alchemy DPA-1 I was initially looking at turns out to be using Hypex nCore too but at lower power. I'm back to considering that amp. I actually wonder how the volume works with power amp. My concern is the sub would be directly connected to the Mojo so I'm hoping the volumes of both the speakers and sub are close enough.
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post #16409 of 18858 Old 01-15-2019, 05:46 PM
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Mostly features that I don't need though 😛

Peachtree contacted me and so far haven't had the issue again today so right now I may be keeping the Nova150. If not, then I'd say $1000 max after taxes. Speaking of Master, I was looking at NAD Masters M22 and found out that it uses Hypex nCore amplifier. The Audio Alchemy DPA-1 I was initially looking at turns out to be using Hypex nCore too but at lower power. I'm back to considering that amp. I actually wonder how the volume works with power amp. My concern is the sub would be directly connected to the Mojo so I'm hoping the volumes of both the speakers and sub are close enough.
I can't seem to find what pre-amp output voltage of that little Chord Mojo might be. It seems to be more oriented to being a DAC and headphone amp, rather than a true pre-amp that a power and usually needs. It's very good and highly rated, just not clear it'll go straight out to a power amp without some issues.

As for the NAD C658/C368 or M10 thing, sure there are some features you feel you don't need. No one needs BluOS, but it's cool too use. No one needs Dirac Live, but having it now on my other system I want it in my office 2.1 system too! 😄

KEF R500, R200C, R100, R50, SVS SB2000 sub, NAD T758v3 AVR, LG UP875 4K BlueRay, Samsung UN55JU6500F 4K LED TV, KEF M500 headphones, Sony CDP-CE500 CD changer. Office: NAD M10, KEF LS50, KEF Kube 10b, Pro-Ject RPM1 TT w/ Ortofon 2M Red. Guest room: Hafler 300 L-R, KEF Reference Model 100 center, KEF iQ10 surrounds, modded M&K V-90 sub, Bluesound Vault 2.
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post #16410 of 18858 Old 01-15-2019, 09:05 PM
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I can't seem to find what pre-amp output voltage of that little Chord Mojo might be. It seems to be more oriented to being a DAC and headphone amp, rather than a true pre-amp that a power and usually needs. It's very good and highly rated, just not clear it'll go straight out to a power amp without some issues.

As for the NAD C658/C368 or M10 thing, sure there are some features you feel you don't need. No one needs BluOS, but it's cool too use. No one needs Dirac Live, but having it now on my other system I want it in my office 2.1 system too! 😄
The Mojo has line out option of 3v. I think I'm sending about .7v to the Nova150 and have the volume of Nova to ~40%. I'm actually a bit scared to send 3v to the Nova150.
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