KEF Owners Thread - Page 614 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
Forum Jump: 
 5705Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #18391 of 18671 Old 08-16-2019, 07:01 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Posts: 1,372
Mentioned: 15 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 936 Post(s)
Liked: 283
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilH930 View Post
This is very interesting. I'll have the same setup next week. One of the reasons I ordered KEF in addition to B&W was how bright B&W sounded during demos. Truth be told the B&W doesn't sound as bright at home, although yet to run XT32 (will do so this weekend). Also had a brief test with a damaged set of Q350s (Q750s pending) and noticed a slightly warmer sound than B&W.



That said, if the KEFs do come through that bright, I'll be sticking with the B&Ws.
One suggestion. Have subs working when you demo both speakers. Lack of bass also makes speakers sound bright.
SouthernCA is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #18392 of 18671 Old 08-16-2019, 08:24 AM
Senior Member
 
PhilH930's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 247
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 62 Post(s)
Liked: 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by SouthernCA View Post
One suggestion. Have subs working when you demo both speakers. Lack of bass also makes speakers sound bright.
Thank you. Will do. Its not ideal but i do have a 10" older powered sub that I will use for the test. My untrained ears have certain movie soundtracks that I enjoy, coupled with certain music. Will be starting out with Top Gun intro and Bohemian Rhapsody! For me, I like the bass to complement, but not dominate. Will be testing 603s later pre and post XT32.
PhilH930 is online now  
post #18393 of 18671 Old 08-18-2019, 07:09 AM
Advanced Member
 
tr4a's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Rohnert Park CA
Posts: 519
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 112 Post(s)
Liked: 684
Spent some time at my local KEF dealer listening to Reference 1's.
Considering replacing my Ls50's with these.

Any idea if the Reference line is due for a refresh?

Steve
tr4a is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #18394 of 18671 Old 08-18-2019, 09:16 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Posts: 1,372
Mentioned: 15 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 936 Post(s)
Liked: 283
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilH930 View Post
Thank you. Will do. Its not ideal but i do have a 10" older powered sub that I will use for the test. My untrained ears have certain movie soundtracks that I enjoy, coupled with certain music. Will be starting out with Top Gun intro and Bohemian Rhapsody! For me, I like the bass to complement, but not dominate. Will be testing 603s later pre and post XT32.
Older subs, if not adequate for the room size, will make a good speaker sound too bright. So please remember that.
SouthernCA is offline  
post #18395 of 18671 Old 08-18-2019, 09:28 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
aarons915's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Cincinnati, OH
Posts: 1,260
Mentioned: 20 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 837 Post(s)
Liked: 670
Quote:
Originally Posted by tr4a View Post
Spent some time at my local KEF dealer listening to Reference 1's.
Considering replacing my Ls50's with these.

Any idea if the Reference line is due for a refresh?

Steve
I haven't heard what they're working on next but since they refreshed the Q and R series, I would have to think the Reference series is next. I could also see them updating the LS50 with the current UniQ driver.
aarons915 is online now  
post #18396 of 18671 Old 08-18-2019, 11:49 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Montecito, CA
Posts: 1,612
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 730 Post(s)
Liked: 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by aarons915 View Post
I haven't heard what they're working on next but since they refreshed the Q and R series, I would have to think the Reference series is next. I could also see them updating the LS50 with the current UniQ driver.
Of course, that's a rationale for never buying anything, because whatever you might buy could someday be refreshed. I was just reading the latest posts in a thread about Art Dudley's review of a corner loaded horn, a speaker I thought stereo and AR3s had killed off -- few of us have appropriate matching corners for a pair of corner loaded horns.
dbphd is offline  
post #18397 of 18671 Old 08-18-2019, 12:14 PM
Advanced Member
 
tr4a's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Rohnert Park CA
Posts: 519
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 112 Post(s)
Liked: 684
Quote:
Originally Posted by dbphd View Post
Of course, that's a rationale for never buying anything, because whatever you might buy could someday be refreshed. I was just reading the latest posts in a thread about Art Dudley's review of a corner loaded horn, a speaker I thought stereo and AR3s had killed off -- few of us have appropriate matching corners for a pair of corner loaded horns.
I am still stuck on Blade 2's.
Thought I could settle on Reference 1's for now.
My local dealer offered me a smoking' deal on Reference 5's but
at that point I might as well get the Blade 2's.

Steve
KenM10759 likes this.
tr4a is offline  
post #18398 of 18671 Old 08-18-2019, 12:17 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
pase22's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Montreal,Canada
Posts: 7,157
Mentioned: 83 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3292 Post(s)
Liked: 2736
Quote:
Originally Posted by aarons915 View Post
I haven't heard what they're working on next but since they refreshed the Q and R series, I would have to think the Reference series is next. I could also see them updating the LS50 with the current UniQ driver.
Seeing the LS50's on deep discount everywhere has me suspecting something coming soon for LS50's.
Lp85253 likes this.

Kef LS50,Q200C, Q100, SVS SB-2000, Denon AVR-X3400H, NAD 216, Panasonic 50" Plasma, Xbox One.
Bedroom: JBL Loft 50 , Loft 20, Bic F-12, Denon AVR-S710W, PS3, 32" Insigna LED.
pase22 is offline  
post #18399 of 18671 Old 08-18-2019, 03:19 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
KenM10759's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Central MA USA
Posts: 5,619
Mentioned: 25 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3389 Post(s)
Liked: 1873
Quote:
Originally Posted by pase22 View Post
Seeing the LS50's on deep discount everywhere has me suspecting something coming soon for LS50's.
KEF has become very adept at being tight-lipped about changes in the lines. That said, there's always the history and the competition to consider.

The one major factor in the decision tree that only KEF possesses, is sales data.

Until it happens, assume nothing. It's all conjecture. It might make sense that if the LS50 is a "50th Anniversary" product, perhaps there could be a 60th Anniversary series of new product introduction in 2021.

KEF R500, R200C, R100, R50, SVS SB2000 sub, NAD T758v3 AVR, LG UP875 4K BlueRay, Samsung UN55JU6500F 4K LED TV, KEF M500 headphones, Sony CDP-CE500 CD changer. Office: NAD M10, KEF LS50, KEF Kube 10b, Pro-Ject RPM1 TT w/ Ortofon 2M Red. Guest room: Hafler 300 L-R, KEF Reference Model 100 center, KEF iQ10 surrounds, modded M&K V-90 sub, Bluesound Vault 2.
KenM10759 is online now  
post #18400 of 18671 Old 08-18-2019, 04:11 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
pase22's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Montreal,Canada
Posts: 7,157
Mentioned: 83 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3292 Post(s)
Liked: 2736
Quote:
Originally Posted by KenM10759 View Post
KEF has become very adept at being tight-lipped about changes in the lines. That said, there's always the history and the competition to consider.

The one major factor in the decision tree that only KEF possesses, is sales data.

Until it happens, assume nothing. It's all conjecture. It might make sense that if the LS50 is a "50th Anniversary" product, perhaps there could be a 60th Anniversary series of new product introduction in 2021.
The latest Q series has been on sale (in Canada) since it launched. This could be a marketing tactic to boost sales and get rid of excess stock.

How do they improve the LS50 without getting too close to the reference or Blades and stay within the same price range. I've seen them referred to as miniature Blades, but not sure how accurate that statement is.

Kef LS50,Q200C, Q100, SVS SB-2000, Denon AVR-X3400H, NAD 216, Panasonic 50" Plasma, Xbox One.
Bedroom: JBL Loft 50 , Loft 20, Bic F-12, Denon AVR-S710W, PS3, 32" Insigna LED.
pase22 is offline  
post #18401 of 18671 Old 08-18-2019, 06:04 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
KenM10759's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Central MA USA
Posts: 5,619
Mentioned: 25 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3389 Post(s)
Liked: 1873
Quote:
Originally Posted by pase22 View Post
The latest Q series has been on sale (in Canada) since it launched. This could be a marketing tactic to boost sales and get rid of excess stock.

How do they improve the LS50 without getting too close to the reference or Blades and stay within the same price range. I've seen them referred to as miniature Blades, but not sure how accurate that statement is.
Well, I would have wondered how they could improve upon the R series without getting too close to the Reference series, they managed to do it.

I wouldn't consider them to be "mini Blade", they've got a long way to go for that. There's where an improved LS50 version could go.

The 2017 Q series isn't similarly discounted here in the US, so what you're seeing is likely a pricing adjustment for that market. In Canada, there are different distribution channels for various speaker brands, and different pressures.

KEF R500, R200C, R100, R50, SVS SB2000 sub, NAD T758v3 AVR, LG UP875 4K BlueRay, Samsung UN55JU6500F 4K LED TV, KEF M500 headphones, Sony CDP-CE500 CD changer. Office: NAD M10, KEF LS50, KEF Kube 10b, Pro-Ject RPM1 TT w/ Ortofon 2M Red. Guest room: Hafler 300 L-R, KEF Reference Model 100 center, KEF iQ10 surrounds, modded M&K V-90 sub, Bluesound Vault 2.
KenM10759 is online now  
post #18402 of 18671 Old 08-18-2019, 07:16 PM
Advanced Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: NB, Canada
Posts: 948
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 507 Post(s)
Liked: 272
My q750 have tremendous "neutral" bass with the x4500h ... It's LFE or boosted hip hop/ rap songs that can make them trip up (40hz and bellow)

Speakers: KEF Q100 / Q300 / Q750 / Q650C, Fluance Signature Series Bookshelf / SX6 / XL5F, Mirage M-190 Subwoofers: Outlaw Ultra X12 (x2), BIC H100-II Receiver: Denon AVR-X4500H, Denon AVR-X1400H Integrated Amplifier: Yamaha A-S501, Fosi Audio TPA3116 mini amp Extras: MiniDSP Umik-1 Headphones: Philips SPH9500s, Audio Tech. ATH-M40x, Takstar Pro 82.
macgallant is offline  
post #18403 of 18671 Old 08-19-2019, 06:09 AM
Advanced Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: NB, Canada
Posts: 948
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 507 Post(s)
Liked: 272
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilH930 View Post
This is very interesting. I'll have the same setup next week. One of the reasons I ordered KEF in addition to B&W was how bright B&W sounded during demos. Truth be told the B&W doesn't sound as bright at home, although yet to run XT32 (will do so this weekend). Also had a brief test with a damaged set of Q350s (Q750s pending) and noticed a slightly warmer sound than B&W.

That said, if the KEFs do come through that bright, I'll be sticking with the B&Ws.
Bright was probably a poor choice of words. They sound more open/increased resolution.

I associate bright with Harsh and i HATE harsh speakers.

Speakers: KEF Q100 / Q300 / Q750 / Q650C, Fluance Signature Series Bookshelf / SX6 / XL5F, Mirage M-190 Subwoofers: Outlaw Ultra X12 (x2), BIC H100-II Receiver: Denon AVR-X4500H, Denon AVR-X1400H Integrated Amplifier: Yamaha A-S501, Fosi Audio TPA3116 mini amp Extras: MiniDSP Umik-1 Headphones: Philips SPH9500s, Audio Tech. ATH-M40x, Takstar Pro 82.
macgallant is offline  
post #18404 of 18671 Old 08-19-2019, 06:24 AM
Advanced Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: NB, Canada
Posts: 948
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 507 Post(s)
Liked: 272
Quote:
Originally Posted by KenM10759 View Post
Well, I would have wondered how they could improve upon the R series without getting too close to the Reference series, they managed to do it.

I wouldn't consider them to be "mini Blade", they've got a long way to go for that. There's where an improved LS50 version could go.

The 2017 Q series isn't similarly discounted here in the US, so what you're seeing is likely a pricing adjustment for that market. In Canada, there are different distribution channels for various speaker brands, and different pressures.
I would love for KEF to come out with a more budget friendly 3 way bookshelf. Something in between the Q350 and the R3 since there's quite a huge gap in prices/market.

$1300-$1500 3-way bookshelf would be nice but i guess they're probably afraid of taking away sales from the R series. It's interesting they have nothing to compete against the Revel Concerta2, Dynaudio Emit, MA Silver speakers.

Speakers: KEF Q100 / Q300 / Q750 / Q650C, Fluance Signature Series Bookshelf / SX6 / XL5F, Mirage M-190 Subwoofers: Outlaw Ultra X12 (x2), BIC H100-II Receiver: Denon AVR-X4500H, Denon AVR-X1400H Integrated Amplifier: Yamaha A-S501, Fosi Audio TPA3116 mini amp Extras: MiniDSP Umik-1 Headphones: Philips SPH9500s, Audio Tech. ATH-M40x, Takstar Pro 82.
macgallant is offline  
post #18405 of 18671 Old 08-19-2019, 09:07 AM
Senior Member
 
PhilH930's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 247
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 62 Post(s)
Liked: 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by macgallant View Post
Bright was probably a poor choice of words. They sound more open/increased resolution.

I associate bright with Harsh and i HATE harsh speakers.
Makes sense. I hooked up the Q750s Saturday and was immediately impressed. Switching back and forth between those and B&W 603s in 2.0 setup. Initial reactions from an untrained amateur ear:

- KEF Q750 sound warmer, perhaps fuller and more rounded. Sometimes I wish there was more, but I haven't really stretched their legs yet and they are only a few hours old. I am quickly becoming a fan of the Uni-Q and how it ties sound together
- B&W 603 cleaner, better vocals. Sounds like more stage and distance with the sound. Brighter in comparison.

At their best the 603s make the 750s sound muddy; comparatively the 750s make the 603s sound overly clinical and sharp.

I'll hook up the respective centers tonight and continue playing around with it. I also went for the KEF Kube 10b (was planning to do two of them), but feel its lacking. Perhaps I am used to ported subs, and know I do want more balanced, accurate base, but am 99% certain I'll switch to the 12b ASAP.
PhilH930 is online now  
post #18406 of 18671 Old 08-19-2019, 09:24 AM
Newbie
 
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 7
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked: 0
Seeking the wisdom of the crowd for a HT setup in connection with a basement remodel. While I'm certainly focused on quality, I'm not an audiophile, and I'm not seeking perfection. I would appreciate any constructive criticism and/or suggestions for the following setup (which I have sketched out after a fair bit of research and listening):

- KEF R7 fronts
- KEF R2c center
- KEF R8a surrounds
- KEF KUBE 12b sub
- Marantz AV7705 pre/pro
- Marantz MM7055 5 channel amp

A bit more info on the project itself:

- Listening area is 16' x 16' x 8'.
- The left side of the listening area is entirely open to a larger 16' x 42' x 8' rectangular room (inclusive of the listening area). The area is otherwise enclosed by walls to the front, right and back.
- Primary use will be movies and sports viewing (~75%), secondary use will be music (~25%).
- I'm primarily focused on creating a solid 5.1 setup. I don't believe I would fully appreciate the marginal improvements achievable by adding additional speakers, cost and complexity.
- At some point, I may choose to upgrade (add?) components for a 2-channel setup for higher quality music listening. This is not a priority today, but is one reason I'm considering the R's rather than the Q's.
- In addition to sound quality, I place a high value on simplicity, ease of use and build quality.
- $12k to $15k budget for speakers and components.

A few questions:
1) The R8a's seem exorbitantly priced for surrounds. They appear to be the obvious match, but any suggestions for acceptable alternatives? The KEF in-wall options with Q drivers seem like a much more affordable possibility. Thoughts?
2) Any views on the capabilities of the 12b sub for this application? I appreciate the aesthetic appeal of brand matching, but I have had positive experience with the similarly-priced SVS SB2000.
3) Would it be worth considering additional investment for the R400b sub? The smaller footprint is very appealing, but not sure what to think about the twin 9" drivers. Any experience with this sub in a similar setup?
4) My preference for the separates is based on my understanding that the R's can be demanding from an amplification perspective. I'm prepared to spend the money for separates if this is actually true. Any experience using a single box (e.g. higher range Denon) to comfortably drive a similar configuration? Any suggestions for alternatives to the Marantz separates? I've had positive experience with the Marantz/Denon sound for HT applications, but I'm open to other ideas.

Thanks to everyone in advance - this forum has been a great learning resource.
Fairoaks is offline  
post #18407 of 18671 Old 08-19-2019, 10:02 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
pase22's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Montreal,Canada
Posts: 7,157
Mentioned: 83 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3292 Post(s)
Liked: 2736
Quote:
Originally Posted by macgallant View Post

$1300-$1500 3-way bookshelf would be nice but i guess they're probably afraid of taking away sales from the R series. It's interesting they have nothing to compete against the Revel Concerta2, Dynaudio Emit, MA Silver speakers.
That's where the LS50's fit in. It may not be a 3 way speaker, but the value/performance is certainly present.

Kef LS50,Q200C, Q100, SVS SB-2000, Denon AVR-X3400H, NAD 216, Panasonic 50" Plasma, Xbox One.
Bedroom: JBL Loft 50 , Loft 20, Bic F-12, Denon AVR-S710W, PS3, 32" Insigna LED.
pase22 is offline  
post #18408 of 18671 Old 08-19-2019, 10:07 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
pase22's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Montreal,Canada
Posts: 7,157
Mentioned: 83 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3292 Post(s)
Liked: 2736
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilH930 View Post
Makes sense. I hooked up the Q750s Saturday and was immediately impressed. Switching back and forth between those and B&W 603s in 2.0 setup. Initial reactions from an untrained amateur ear:

- KEF Q750 sound warmer, perhaps fuller and more rounded. Sometimes I wish there was more, but I haven't really stretched their legs yet and they are only a few hours old. I am quickly becoming a fan of the Uni-Q and how it ties sound together
- B&W 603 cleaner, better vocals. Sounds like more stage and distance with the sound. Brighter in comparison.

At their best the 603s make the 750s sound muddy; comparatively the 750s make the 603s sound overly clinical and sharp.

I'll hook up the respective centers tonight and continue playing around with it. I also went for the KEF Kube 10b (was planning to do two of them), but feel its lacking. Perhaps I am used to ported subs, and know I do want more balanced, accurate base, but am 99% certain I'll switch to the 12b ASAP.
As much as I like my SB-2000 sub musically, it does lack punch for HT. There are some very good hybrid subs on the market that can give you the best of both worlds.

Kef LS50,Q200C, Q100, SVS SB-2000, Denon AVR-X3400H, NAD 216, Panasonic 50" Plasma, Xbox One.
Bedroom: JBL Loft 50 , Loft 20, Bic F-12, Denon AVR-S710W, PS3, 32" Insigna LED.
pase22 is offline  
post #18409 of 18671 Old 08-19-2019, 10:23 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
pase22's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Montreal,Canada
Posts: 7,157
Mentioned: 83 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3292 Post(s)
Liked: 2736
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fairoaks View Post
Seeking the wisdom of the crowd for a HT setup in connection with a basement remodel. While I'm certainly focused on quality, I'm not an audiophile, and I'm not seeking perfection. I would appreciate any constructive criticism and/or suggestions for the following setup (which I have sketched out after a fair bit of research and listening):

- KEF R7 fronts
- KEF R2c center
- KEF R8a surrounds
- KEF KUBE 12b sub
- Marantz AV7705 pre/pro
- Marantz MM7055 5 channel amp

A bit more info on the project itself:

- Listening area is 16' x 16' x 8'.
- The left side of the listening area is entirely open to a larger 16' x 42' x 8' rectangular room (inclusive of the listening area). The area is otherwise enclosed by walls to the front, right and back.
- Primary use will be movies and sports viewing (~75%), secondary use will be music (~25%).
- I'm primarily focused on creating a solid 5.1 setup. I don't believe I would fully appreciate the marginal improvements achievable by adding additional speakers, cost and complexity.
- At some point, I may choose to upgrade (add?) components for a 2-channel setup for higher quality music listening. This is not a priority today, but is one reason I'm considering the R's rather than the Q's.
- In addition to sound quality, I place a high value on simplicity, ease of use and build quality.
- $12k to $15k budget for speakers and components.

A few questions:
1) The R8a's seem exorbitantly priced for surrounds. They appear to be the obvious match, but any suggestions for acceptable alternatives? The KEF in-wall options with Q drivers seem like a much more affordable possibility. Thoughts?
2) Any views on the capabilities of the 12b sub for this application? I appreciate the aesthetic appeal of brand matching, but I have had positive experience with the similarly-priced SVS SB2000.
3) Would it be worth considering additional investment for the R400b sub? The smaller footprint is very appealing, but not sure what to think about the twin 9" drivers. Any experience with this sub in a similar setup?
4) My preference for the separates is based on my understanding that the R's can be demanding from an amplification perspective. I'm prepared to spend the money for separates if this is actually true. Any experience using a single box (e.g. higher range Denon) to comfortably drive a similar configuration? Any suggestions for alternatives to the Marantz separates? I've had positive experience with the Marantz/Denon sound for HT applications, but I'm open to other ideas.

Thanks to everyone in advance - this forum has been a great learning resource.
Kef R7 series would excel with both music and movies. Kef off axis response is excellent for rooms with multiple seating positions. For surround duty, a pair of Q150's would be just fine since you're mostly getting background music and ambient sounds out of the surrounds. For mostly HT, I'd go with 2 large ported subs. HSU makes some good hybrid subs as does SVS though SVS has the advantage of having a remote app. SVS are more expensive, but have a 5 year unconditional warranty and bill of rights. NOTE: the subs do not need to match the speakers and room size will determine how much sub you'll need to adequately pressurize the space.

Kef LS50,Q200C, Q100, SVS SB-2000, Denon AVR-X3400H, NAD 216, Panasonic 50" Plasma, Xbox One.
Bedroom: JBL Loft 50 , Loft 20, Bic F-12, Denon AVR-S710W, PS3, 32" Insigna LED.
pase22 is offline  
post #18410 of 18671 Old 08-19-2019, 10:31 AM
Advanced Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: NB, Canada
Posts: 948
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 507 Post(s)
Liked: 272
Quote:
Originally Posted by pase22 View Post
That's where the LS50's fit in. It may not be a 3 way speaker, but the value/performance is certainly present.
In a smaller room i agree they are hard to beat! But in a medium to large room they can't keep up vs the competition without a sub. If you factor in the cost of a rythmik sub then you're already at the R3's price.

I understand why KEF doesn't do this (KEF R sales are most likely too good) but i wish they did.

Speakers: KEF Q100 / Q300 / Q750 / Q650C, Fluance Signature Series Bookshelf / SX6 / XL5F, Mirage M-190 Subwoofers: Outlaw Ultra X12 (x2), BIC H100-II Receiver: Denon AVR-X4500H, Denon AVR-X1400H Integrated Amplifier: Yamaha A-S501, Fosi Audio TPA3116 mini amp Extras: MiniDSP Umik-1 Headphones: Philips SPH9500s, Audio Tech. ATH-M40x, Takstar Pro 82.
macgallant is offline  
post #18411 of 18671 Old 08-19-2019, 10:48 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
aarons915's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Cincinnati, OH
Posts: 1,260
Mentioned: 20 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 837 Post(s)
Liked: 670
Quote:
Originally Posted by macgallant View Post
In a smaller room i agree they are hard to beat! But in a medium to large room they can't keep up vs the competition without a sub. If you factor in the cost of a rythmik sub then you're already at the R3's price.

I understand why KEF doesn't do this (KEF R sales are most likely too good) but i wish they did.
Anyone who's serious about good bass should have at least 2 subs though, just due to positioning constraints of your mains, dealing with room modes, etc. The R3 have really good bass but they'll still greatly benefit from subs.
aarons915 is online now  
post #18412 of 18671 Old 08-19-2019, 11:44 AM
Newbie
 
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 7
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked: 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by pase22 View Post
Kef R7 series would excel with both music and movies. Kef off axis response is excellent for rooms with multiple seating positions. For surround duty, a pair of Q150's would be just fine since you're mostly getting background music and ambient sounds out of the surrounds. For mostly HT, I'd go with 2 large ported subs. HSU makes some good hybrid subs as does SVS though SVS has the advantage of having a remote app. SVS are more expensive, but have a 5 year unconditional warranty and bill of rights. NOTE: the subs do not need to match the speakers and room size will determine how much sub you'll need to adequately pressurize the space.
Thanks for this - I will certainly look into the Hsu subs.

Any view on the importance of separates to drive the R series? I'm guessing they are preferable in any case, but curious to know if anyone has had real world problems driving these speakers with a decent quality single AVR box.
Fairoaks is offline  
post #18413 of 18671 Old 08-19-2019, 12:35 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
pase22's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Montreal,Canada
Posts: 7,157
Mentioned: 83 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3292 Post(s)
Liked: 2736
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fairoaks View Post
Thanks for this - I will certainly look into the Hsu subs.

Any view on the importance of separates to drive the R series? I'm guessing they are preferable in any case, but curious to know if anyone has had real world problems driving these speakers with a decent quality single AVR box.
It does depend on your listening habits, but most mid level AVR's & up can easily handle a multi-channel setup. That said, Kef speakers are power hungry and can dip down below 4ohms. A seperate amp for the front 3 or even just the R7's would be beneficial for 2.0/2.1 music.

Kef LS50,Q200C, Q100, SVS SB-2000, Denon AVR-X3400H, NAD 216, Panasonic 50" Plasma, Xbox One.
Bedroom: JBL Loft 50 , Loft 20, Bic F-12, Denon AVR-S710W, PS3, 32" Insigna LED.
pase22 is offline  
post #18414 of 18671 Old 08-19-2019, 01:49 PM
Senior Member
 
sb01gt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Victoria, BC, Canada
Posts: 234
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 189 Post(s)
Liked: 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fairoaks View Post


A few questions:
1) The R8a's seem exorbitantly priced for surrounds. They appear to be the obvious match, but any suggestions for acceptable alternatives? The KEF in-wall options with Q drivers seem like a much more affordable possibility. Thoughts?
2) Any views on the capabilities of the 12b sub for this application? I appreciate the aesthetic appeal of brand matching, but I have had positive experience with the similarly-priced SVS SB2000.
3) Would it be worth considering additional investment for the R400b sub? The smaller footprint is very appealing, but not sure what to think about the twin 9" drivers. Any experience with this sub in a similar setup?
4) My preference for the separates is based on my understanding that the R's can be demanding from an amplification perspective. I'm prepared to spend the money for separates if this is actually true. Any experience using a single box (e.g. higher range Denon) to comfortably drive a similar configuration? Any suggestions for alternatives to the Marantz separates? I've had positive experience with the Marantz/Denon sound for HT applications, but I'm open to other ideas.

Thanks to everyone in advance - this forum has been a great learning resource.

1) In terms of the R8a's the price looks to be mostly due to the matching finish of the R series. I use the cheaper Q50a's personally in my setup which retain the same angled cabinet shape if you're wall mounting these for surrounds. If you're not wall mounting, you can easily go with cheaper bookshelves like the Q350 on stands. Also as an option, you can try and track down the now discontinued R50's which have been replaced by the R8a earlier this year, whether it be through your dealer or the used market.


2/3) Although I personally haven't tested them in home, I've researched the 12b & R400b as potential options in the past 6 months for my living room setup for the nice finish and smaller footprint. Going by reviews and measurements though, these subs just don't stack up to the other internet direct companies subs like most here will tell you when it comes to performance and pricing.


4) The need/usefulness of seperates will definitely depend on your volume and listening habits. If you're going to get one of the higher end Marantz/Denon units, they may be perfectly sufficient for your needs. I have always used bookshelves and never ran full towers before though, so in that application maybe someone with better knowledge can chime in. If seperates are the way to go - then it would allow you to just stick with the AVR that has the necessary processing channels that you need (7,9,11,etc.), and not worry so much about going for the highest powered unit. I will mention in regard to Denon models, I know they are currently rolling out the 2019 models, so you may be able to save some of your budget with a 2018 model on closeout pricing or something... again that would be dealer specific.



Quote:
Originally Posted by pase22 View Post
As much as I like my SB-2000 sub musically, it does lack punch for HT. There are some very good hybrid subs on the market that can give you the best of both worlds.

Like pase22 says, there's a really good selection of subs, especially if you're located in the US and don't have to worry about crazy shipping costs and customs fees. Most people will recommend ported subs for your application, and multiple of them. It will mainly come down to your budget, and if other things matter like the size/finish/footprint of the cabinet then you might want a sealed option. For example, because I have a living room setup, and want to move my sub placement to the front soundstage - I have been specifically looking for a smaller footprint sub with a nice finish to match my KEF R300/600c combo. I was pretty set on the SVS SB3000 (since I am in Canada all the other sub companies I contacted for final to the door pricing were crazy)... but with luck I came across someone with a used ad selling his 2 HSU ULS-15 mk2's, and I will be picking one of those up today! It allows me to move up to a 15" driver with a decent looking box that's a smaller footprint than my current ported model.

Panasonic EZ1000 65" OLED / Panasonic DMP UB400 / NAD T758v3 / Nvidia Shield TV
5.1.2 speaker setup - KEF R300 / R600c / Q50a / Focal Chorus SR800V / HSU ULS-15 mk2
sb01gt is online now  
post #18415 of 18671 Old 08-19-2019, 03:19 PM
Member
 
activestatic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 37
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 23 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Q750. What would be the he minimum WPC to push these towers?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
activestatic is online now  
post #18416 of 18671 Old 08-19-2019, 04:52 PM
Advanced Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: NB, Canada
Posts: 948
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 507 Post(s)
Liked: 272
Quote:
Originally Posted by sb01gt View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fairoaks View Post


A few questions:
1) The R8a's seem exorbitantly priced for surrounds. They appear to be the obvious match, but any suggestions for acceptable alternatives? The KEF in-wall options with Q drivers seem like a much more affordable possibility. Thoughts?
2) Any views on the capabilities of the 12b sub for this application? I appreciate the aesthetic appeal of brand matching, but I have had positive experience with the similarly-priced SVS SB2000.
3) Would it be worth considering additional investment for the R400b sub? The smaller footprint is very appealing, but not sure what to think about the twin 9" drivers. Any experience with this sub in a similar setup?
4) My preference for the separates is based on my understanding that the R's can be demanding from an amplification perspective. I'm prepared to spend the money for separates if this is actually true. Any experience using a single box (e.g. higher range Denon) to comfortably drive a similar configuration? Any suggestions for alternatives to the Marantz separates? I've had positive experience with the Marantz/Denon sound for HT applications, but I'm open to other ideas.

Thanks to everyone in advance - this forum has been a great learning resource.

1) In terms of the R8a's the price looks to be mostly due to the matching finish of the R series. I use the cheaper Q50a's personally in my setup which retain the same angled cabinet shape if you're wall mounting these for surrounds. If you're not wall mounting, you can easily go with cheaper bookshelves like the Q350 on stands. Also as an option, you can try and track down the now discontinued R50's which have been replaced by the R8a earlier this year, whether it be through your dealer or the used market.


2/3) Although I personally haven't tested them in home, I've researched the 12b & R400b as potential options in the past 6 months for my living room setup for the nice finish and smaller footprint. Going by reviews and measurements though, these subs just don't stack up to the other internet direct companies subs like most here will tell you when it comes to performance and pricing.


4) The need/usefulness of seperates will definitely depend on your volume and listening habits. If you're going to get one of the higher end Marantz/Denon units, they may be perfectly sufficient for your needs. I have always used bookshelves and never ran full towers before though, so in that application maybe someone with better knowledge can chime in. If seperates are the way to go - then it would allow you to just stick with the AVR that has the necessary processing channels that you need (7,9,11,etc.), and not worry so much about going for the highest powered unit. I will mention in regard to Denon models, I know they are currently rolling out the 2019 models, so you may be able to save some of your budget with a 2018 model on closeout pricing or something... again that would be dealer specific.



Quote:
Originally Posted by pase22 View Post
As much as I like my SB-2000 sub musically, it does lack punch for HT. There are some very good hybrid subs on the market that can give you the best of both worlds.

Like pase22 says, there's a really good selection of subs, especially if you're located in the US and don't have to worry about crazy shipping costs and customs fees. Most people will recommend ported subs for your application, and multiple of them. It will mainly come down to your budget, and if other things matter like the size/finish/footprint of the cabinet then you might want a sealed option. For example, because I have a living room setup, and want to move my sub placement to the front soundstage - I have been specifically looking for a smaller footprint sub with a nice finish to match my KEF R300/600c combo. I was pretty set on the SVS SB3000 (since I am in Canada all the other sub companies I contacted for final to the door pricing were crazy)... but with luck I came across someone with a used ad selling his 2 HSU ULS-15 mk2's, and I will be picking one of those up today! It allows me to move up to a 15" driver with a decent looking box that's a smaller footprint than my current ported model.
Fyi rythmik shipping to Canada is really cheap

Speakers: KEF Q100 / Q300 / Q750 / Q650C, Fluance Signature Series Bookshelf / SX6 / XL5F, Mirage M-190 Subwoofers: Outlaw Ultra X12 (x2), BIC H100-II Receiver: Denon AVR-X4500H, Denon AVR-X1400H Integrated Amplifier: Yamaha A-S501, Fosi Audio TPA3116 mini amp Extras: MiniDSP Umik-1 Headphones: Philips SPH9500s, Audio Tech. ATH-M40x, Takstar Pro 82.
macgallant is offline  
post #18417 of 18671 Old 08-19-2019, 05:19 PM
Senior Member
 
sb01gt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Victoria, BC, Canada
Posts: 234
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 189 Post(s)
Liked: 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by macgallant View Post
Fyi rythmik shipping to Canada is really cheap

It's a combination of the shipping and the exchange rate being terrible. I inquired about the F12SE and the price was $1279 USD (~$1750 CND) and I'd assume you get hit with charges at the door as well. The gloss black SB3000 is $1575 CND to the door and you get 45 days of trial and the upgrade program. I can't complain now though with the deal I got on the HSU sub!

Panasonic EZ1000 65" OLED / Panasonic DMP UB400 / NAD T758v3 / Nvidia Shield TV
5.1.2 speaker setup - KEF R300 / R600c / Q50a / Focal Chorus SR800V / HSU ULS-15 mk2
sb01gt is online now  
post #18418 of 18671 Old 08-19-2019, 05:30 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
KenM10759's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Central MA USA
Posts: 5,619
Mentioned: 25 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3389 Post(s)
Liked: 1873
Quote:
Originally Posted by activestatic View Post
Q750. What would be the he minimum WPC to push these towers?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
In what application? Just 2.1 music or are there more speakers involved?

What sources, how big is the room, how far from the speaker do you sit, and how loud do you need it to go?

More information results in better answers!


KEF R500, R200C, R100, R50, SVS SB2000 sub, NAD T758v3 AVR, LG UP875 4K BlueRay, Samsung UN55JU6500F 4K LED TV, KEF M500 headphones, Sony CDP-CE500 CD changer. Office: NAD M10, KEF LS50, KEF Kube 10b, Pro-Ject RPM1 TT w/ Ortofon 2M Red. Guest room: Hafler 300 L-R, KEF Reference Model 100 center, KEF iQ10 surrounds, modded M&K V-90 sub, Bluesound Vault 2.
KenM10759 is online now  
post #18419 of 18671 Old 08-19-2019, 05:47 PM
Member
 
activestatic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 37
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 23 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by KenM10759 View Post
In what application? Just 2.1 music or are there more speakers involved?



What sources, how big is the room, how far from the speaker do you sit, and how loud do you need it to go?



More information results in better answers!





2 channel. Only a sub if needed. 100% music. Room is maybe 12 by 15 with 10ft ceiling. This is my bed room and I’ll never be more than the given dimensions away from the speakers. I’m just taking baby steps into this after years dumping money into another hobby.

Current set up is Yamaha RN303 with Elac Debut 2.0 6.2’s. The RN303 won’t be enough. I was told that the Outlaw Audio RR2160 is nice.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
activestatic is online now  
post #18420 of 18671 Old 08-19-2019, 06:24 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
KenM10759's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Central MA USA
Posts: 5,619
Mentioned: 25 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3389 Post(s)
Liked: 1873
Quote:
Originally Posted by activestatic View Post
2 channel. Only a sub if needed. 100% music. Room is maybe 12 by 15 with 10ft ceiling. This is my bed room and I’ll never be more than the given dimensions away from the speakers. I’m just taking baby steps into this after years dumping money into another hobby.

Current set up is Yamaha RN303 with Elac Debut 2.0 6.2’s. The RN303 won’t be enough. I was told that the Outlaw Audio RR2160 is nice.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
You haven't mentioned budget, though the R2160 goes for around $850. In that range there's a few as powerful that also add to the mix with streaming, wireless, and Bluetooth features.

The NAD C368 or C388 with BluOS module would be killer, and you could control just about everything on them with your phone or (better) a tablet. The Yamaha R-N803 would be the near equivalent, though without the slick app interface of the NAD. So many more as budget increases!

While the Q750's put out decent bass (depending upon placement and distance from walls & corners), I'd still suggest a modest sealed sub to augment more modern recordings that have frequencies well below what the Q750's can handle. Something like an SVS SB2000, Hsu Research ULS15, etc.
activestatic likes this.

KEF R500, R200C, R100, R50, SVS SB2000 sub, NAD T758v3 AVR, LG UP875 4K BlueRay, Samsung UN55JU6500F 4K LED TV, KEF M500 headphones, Sony CDP-CE500 CD changer. Office: NAD M10, KEF LS50, KEF Kube 10b, Pro-Ject RPM1 TT w/ Ortofon 2M Red. Guest room: Hafler 300 L-R, KEF Reference Model 100 center, KEF iQ10 surrounds, modded M&K V-90 sub, Bluesound Vault 2.
KenM10759 is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply Speakers

Tags
Kef , Kef Audio , kef blade 2 , Kef Bookshelf Speaker , Kef C4 Subwoofer Black , Kef Center Channel Speaker , Kef Ls50 2 Way Speaker System , Kef Q100bl Bookshelf Speaker , Kef Q700wa Floorstanding Speaker , kef reference 3 , Kef T Series Floor Stand Pair

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off