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post #901 of 929 Old 05-07-2020, 07:53 AM
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Originally Posted by torii View Post
I am thinking of my next speaker upgrade and legacy audio is in my range. do they ever have sales? or best time o buy? and also, anyone in ABQ area willing to demo? thinking about focus se 10k models...any negatives or regrets? https://legacyaudio.com/products/view/focus-se/
Get a hold of Dennis . His call letters are Mark 1 on here.
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post #902 of 929 Old 05-07-2020, 08:47 AM
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Originally Posted by torii View Post
I am thinking of my next speaker upgrade and legacy audio is in my range. do they ever have sales? or best time o buy? and also, anyone in ABQ area willing to demo? thinking about focus se 10k models...any negatives or regrets? https://legacyaudio.com/products/view/focus-se/
Hi Torii, thanks for your interest in Legacy Audio. The quick answer is no, Legacy doesn't really run "sales". Legacy Audio has independent Authorized Dealers around the country that do direct sales to customers. (I am one such dealer/installer). I have helped quite a few AVS Forum members over the years and would be happy to discuss your needs and budget and give you a quote. Let's just say I take good care of AVS Forum members...PM me for more details. Thanks!

Oh, and BTW, you won't have any regrets going with the Focus SEs, I can assure you!
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post #903 of 929 Old 05-07-2020, 08:49 AM
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Get a hold of Dennis . His call letters are Mark 1 on here.
Thanks for the referral!

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post #904 of 929 Old 05-07-2020, 02:12 PM
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Thanks for the referral!
I'm looking forward to hearing back from you also Dennis.

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post #905 of 929 Old 05-08-2020, 08:06 AM
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Originally Posted by torii View Post
I am thinking of my next speaker upgrade and legacy audio is in my range. do they ever have sales? or best time o buy? and also, anyone in ABQ area willing to demo? thinking about focus se 10k models...any negatives or regrets? https://legacyaudio.com/products/view/focus-se/
I've had mine for about 4 years now and love them. Speaker setup wasn't hard, I managed to optimize the placement by sending a picture and room description to Legacy and received great placement advice. The bass is a bit boomy on poorly recorded music but I love the speakers.
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post #906 of 929 Old 05-08-2020, 09:04 AM
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I'm looking forward to hearing back from you also Dennis.

Thanks,
Rkeeney
Hi Robert, I haven't forgotten you...I will be sending you a message later today. Your project sounds great!! Thanks!

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post #907 of 929 Old 05-12-2020, 05:17 AM
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Hi All:
I'm a proud owner of a pair of used, but new to me, Legacy Whisper; man, those speakers are big and heavy. So far, I'm very happy with the sound and really like the look (my wife, not so much!). However, I have a few questions after running Audyssey XT32 with my Marantz AV7702 MK2.

The first question is easy: Audyssey throws an error that the front speakers are out of phase, I did check the polarity of the wire to be correct, so I ignored the warring. That should be OK, right?

The second question is a bit more puzzle, after running the Audyssey I checked the Reference Target cure for the front speakers and saw that Audyssey has to adjust the upper treble area of the curve to MAX (+10db) for the Right speakers and almost the same with the Left speaker, please see the screenshot for more details. Now, I'm worried that the tweeters are damaged or dead; however, I can hear the sound from both tweeters and don't feel like it missed anything. Can someone let me know what I have missed or if my tweeters are indeed damage?
Thanks!
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post #908 of 929 Old 05-12-2020, 01:12 PM
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Originally Posted by btran33 View Post
Hi All:
I'm a proud owner of a pair of used, but new to me, Legacy Whisper; man, those speakers are big and heavy. So far, I'm very happy with the sound and really like the look (my wife, not so much!). However, I have a few questions after running Audyssey XT32 with my Marantz AV7702 MK2.

The first question is easy: Audyssey throws an error that the front speakers are out of phase, I did check the polarity of the wire to be correct, so I ignored the warring. That should be OK, right?

The second question is a bit more puzzle, after running the Audyssey I checked the Reference Target cure for the front speakers and saw that Audyssey has to adjust the upper treble area of the curve to MAX (+10db) for the Right speakers and almost the same with the Left speaker, please see the screenshot for more details. Now, I'm worried that the tweeters are damaged or dead; however, I can hear the sound from both tweeters and don't feel like it missed anything. Can someone let me know what I have missed or if my tweeters are indeed damage?
Thanks!

Hey, so I could be wrong--but I think all Legacy's uber high-end speakers (Whisper, Aeris, V) have open baffles implemented for the midranges--I don't think they will play nice with auto-EQ for this reason. Mancual EQ seems to be the way to go-- @DMark1 can verify what the true cause is, though. I could be totally off, and there might be a quick and easy fix.
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post #909 of 929 Old 05-12-2020, 02:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by btran33 View Post
Hi All:
I'm a proud owner of a pair of used, but new to me, Legacy Whisper; man, those speakers are big and heavy. So far, I'm very happy with the sound and really like the look (my wife, not so much!). However, I have a few questions after running Audyssey XT32 with my Marantz AV7702 MK2.

The first question is easy: Audyssey throws an error that the front speakers are out of phase, I did check the polarity of the wire to be correct, so I ignored the warring. That should be OK, right?

The second question is a bit more puzzle, after running the Audyssey I checked the Reference Target cure for the front speakers and saw that Audyssey has to adjust the upper treble area of the curve to MAX (+10db) for the Right speakers and almost the same with the Left speaker, please see the screenshot for more details. Now, I'm worried that the tweeters are damaged or dead; however, I can hear the sound from both tweeters and don't feel like it missed anything. Can someone let me know what I have missed or if my tweeters are indeed damage?
Thanks!
Hi Btran:

Here are Bill Dudleston's thoughts (2013) on room correction and multi-channel audio using Legacy Audio's larger DSP speaker designs: https://www.audioholics.com/editoria...y-audio-dsp-eq

Brolic is right...the Whispers won't play well with automatic room correction systems like Audyssey. This is because the Whispers use some very sophisticated acoustic design to preserve the stereo image, even off-axis. Part of the design includes two baffles of woofers spaced apart by 4 inches, which are time aligned to "steer" the bass forward, but result in a null 90 degrees to the side to keep bass from reflecting off of side walls. There is alot of other acoustic processing going on in the Whispers, which probably includes some phasing that is confusing to Audyssey, since Audyssey is looking for a standard direct-firing box speaker that loads the room completely differently than the Whispers do.

In any case, manual EQ will work best with the Whisper. Which version Whisper do you have? (Original, XD, XDS) Over the past 10 or 15 years, Legacy has also made various DSP processors for the Whisper including the original analog Steradian processor, the Xilica 32-bit DSP processor, and now they offer the Wavelaunch 40-bit DSP processor that comes with the latest Whisper XDS, and the Wavelet 56-bit DSP/DAC/Preamp.

We can certainly integrate the Whispers into an awesome multi-channel audio system, BUT its not going to be as simple as buying a typical home theater AV processor and hitting "GO" on Audyssey. If you're interested in going further with tuning your system in your room, send me a Private Message and we can talk more about your situation and solutions. I'll get Bill D. involved if we have to. Thanks! - Dennis

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post #910 of 929 Old 05-13-2020, 06:26 AM
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Originally Posted by DMark1 View Post
Hi Btran:

Here are Bill Dudleston's thoughts (2013) on room correction and multi-channel audio using Legacy Audio's larger DSP speaker designs: https://www.audioholics.com/editoria...y-audio-dsp-eq

Brolic is right...the Whispers won't play well with automatic room correction systems like Audyssey. This is because the Whispers use some very sophisticated acoustic design to preserve the stereo image, even off-axis. Part of the design includes two baffles of woofers spaced apart by 4 inches, which are time aligned to "steer" the bass forward, but result in a null 90 degrees to the side to keep bass from reflecting off of side walls. There is alot of other acoustic processing going on in the Whispers, which probably includes some phasing that is confusing to Audyssey, since Audyssey is looking for a standard direct-firing box speaker that loads the room completely differently than the Whispers do.

In any case, manual EQ will work best with the Whisper. Which version Whisper do you have? (Original, XD, XDS) Over the past 10 or 15 years, Legacy has also made various DSP processors for the Whisper including the original analog Steradian processor, the Xilica 32-bit DSP processor, and now they offer the Wavelaunch 40-bit DSP processor that comes with the latest Whisper XDS, and the Wavelet 56-bit DSP/DAC/Preamp.

We can certainly integrate the Whispers into an awesome multi-channel audio system, BUT its not going to be as simple as buying a typical home theater AV processor and hitting "GO" on Audyssey. If you're interested in going further with tuning your system in your room, send me a Private Message and we can talk more about your situation and solutions. I'll get Bill D. involved if we have to. Thanks! - Dennis
Hi Dennis and Brolic:
Thanks for the feedback, I currently have the original Whisper with the original Steradian processor ( I think?). I agreed that the Whisper is not playing well with Audyssey so currently, I'm only using the Audyssey to get the ballpark channel trimming and distance but bypassing the Audyssey for 2ch music (pure direct mode). The Whisper sounds great, I just have concerns regarding the tweeters problem reported by Audyssey, but I guess I should not trust that then. I'll need to play a bit more with the placement of the Whisper and setting of the bass using the processor, and also geting use to the sound first before I intergrate the Whisper to my HT room.
Thanks for the input!
BT
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post #911 of 929 Old 05-13-2020, 07:25 AM
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Ok, curiosity got the best of me, so I opened up the dome tweeter on my Whisper to see if there are any loose wires or anything going on with the tweeters. I found something very interesting, there are three 4 ohm resistors inserting between the + and - of the tweeter. However, on the Left speaker, the one that Audyssey does less adjusting to the treble area, only two of the resistors are connected. On the right speaker, where Audyssey has to max out the treble, all three resistors are connecting, see pictures! Why is this? and for what purpose? I'm so wanted to snip out the last third resistor on the right speaker to see if both speakers would behave the same; if needed, I can reconnect the resistor again, what do you think?
Thanks!
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post #912 of 929 Old 05-13-2020, 10:04 AM
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@btran33 i think Legacy voices each pair before shipping, so very possible that those resistor states were deliberate adjustments to get the pair voiced perfectly as a pair.

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post #913 of 929 Old 05-13-2020, 01:04 PM
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@btran33 i think Legacy voices each pair before shipping, so very possible that those resistor states were deliberate adjustments to get the pair voiced perfectly as a pair.

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You are correct! I reached out to Legacy's customer service and they started the same as well. The resistors are used to trim the tweeter, so they recommend to keep them as is.
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post #914 of 929 Old 05-14-2020, 04:09 AM
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I learned something interesting yesterday about my Whisper speakers. I don't know if you guys realize this but the Steradian DSP for the Whisper mixed a low level of the right speaker signal to the left and vice versa! I found that out when running the pink noise for channel level balance from my AV processor that both speakers will generate the pink noise. I think they did this to anchor the stereo image or room correction? It's kind of weird but then I have nothing to complain about the beautiful music this speaker makes, so all good to me!
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post #915 of 929 Old 05-19-2020, 01:40 AM
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You've come to the right place for great performing, all-around speakers. Welcome to the Legacy Family!!
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post #916 of 929 Old 05-19-2020, 04:54 AM
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I learned something interesting yesterday about my Whisper speakers. I don't know if you guys realize this but the Steradian DSP for the Whisper mixed a low level of the right speaker signal to the left and vice versa! I found that out when running the pink noise for channel level balance from my AV processor that both speakers will generate the pink noise. I think they did this to anchor the stereo image or room correction? It's kind of weird but then I have nothing to complain about the beautiful music this speaker makes, so all good to me!
Btran: Very perceptive!! Yes, there is some cross-feed used in the Whisper to mimic the natural HRTF (Head Related Transfer Function) that humans have. It is a psychoacoustic effect that helps our brains create a 3D acoustic image from our two ears. Essentially, a sound on our right side will be heard by both ears, BUT the left ear hears it at a slight delay from the right ear. Your brain then "decodes" this information to place the sound as coming from your right side. This ability came in very handy back when we were cavemen and had to quickly figure out where that sabretooth tiger was coming from in the dark!! (Those that survived have evolved into mancave-men today)

The crossfeed also helps to produce a more natural stereo presentation that is wider and less fatiguing to listen to over long periods, mainly because it's more like what we actually hear in the real world. Because of this ability of the Whispers, be sure to set them up properly in your room...they can be toed-in quite aggressively and still maintain a strong center image and a huge soundstage. Try pointing the left speaker at your right ear and vice versa and see how you like that setup.
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post #917 of 929 Old 05-19-2020, 05:12 AM
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The Whispers are so amazing! The best I’ve ever heard. Also the most expensive I’ve ever heard, but that’s not the point.

They are so flexible, I’ve heard they’ve been setup in rooms as small as 9’ x 9’ and still work out good!. Given the nature of the speaker producing a rather strict dispersion pattern that also steers the bass. Legacy calls it an acoustic shotgun and I think it’s very appropriate.

I am still very grateful for being able to visit Legacy and demo some of their speakers including the Whisper XDs at the time. That was a special time in my life, one that I will never forget. I hope they haven’t been negatively impacted by the pandemic

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post #918 of 929 Old 05-19-2020, 06:56 AM
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[QUOTE

The crossfeed also helps to produce a more natural stereo presentation that is wider and less fatiguing to listen to over long periods, mainly because it's more like what we actually hear in the real world. Because of this ability of the Whispers, be sure to set them up properly in your room...they can be toed-in quite aggressively and still maintain a strong center image and a huge soundstage. Try pointing the left speaker at your right ear and vice versa and see how you like that setup.[/QUOTE]

Thanks, Mark! Currently, I toed-in the Whisper at quite a lot compared to my old Tyler Woodmere II, but should I do more? Please see the picture of my room, I sit right in the middle of the screen.
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post #919 of 929 Old 05-19-2020, 07:30 AM
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The Whispers are so amazing! The best I’ve ever heard. Also the most expensive I’ve ever heard, but that’s not the point.

They are so flexible, I’ve heard they’ve been setup in rooms as small as 9’ x 9’ and still work out good!. Given the nature of the speaker producing a rather strict dispersion pattern that also steers the bass. Legacy calls it an acoustic shotgun and I think it’s very appropriate.

I am still very grateful for being able to visit Legacy and demo some of their speakers including the Whisper XDs at the time. That was a special time in my life, one that I will never forget. I hope they haven’t been negatively impacted by the pandemic
Yes, I have to agree with you that the Whispers are amazing! I have owned a number of good speakers, two of my favorite are the Thiel CS3.6 and most recently the Tyler Woodmere II, both are amazing speakers but nothing compares to the Whispers. I would never and ever be able to afford the Whispers when new, so I'm counting myself as very lucky to find this used pair at a very affordable price (but still it's the most expensive pair of speakers I've ever owned) and in great condition.
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post #920 of 929 Old 05-23-2020, 01:22 PM
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So who here has or knows someone with Valors in their home....doing some research and would love to see what folks have to say.

Cheers,
Jason

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post #921 of 929 Old 06-18-2020, 06:17 PM
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I'm researching the Focus XDs for my dedicated turntable set up and use the internal amp to drive all the speakers. Question... If i feed the XDs an analog signal from my phono preamp, does it convert it to digital and then back to analog? Can't tell from what's out there. Not many reviews anywhere.

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post #922 of 929 Old 06-23-2020, 12:37 PM
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I'm researching the Focus XDs for my dedicated turntable set up and use the internal amp to drive all the speakers. Question... If i feed the XDs an analog signal from my phono preamp, does it convert it to digital and then back to analog? Can't tell from what's out there. Not many reviews anywhere.
Hi Adz523: The answer is NO...the Focus XD's internal 750W ICEpower Class D amplifier DOES NOT convert the analog input to digital (ones and zeros).

A Class D amplifer works by taking the analog input signal and creating a PWM (pulse width modulation) replica of it - essentially a series of pulses, which directly correspond to the amplitude and frequency of the input signal. This process seems digital but is in fact completely analog in nature. The pulses are then demodulated back into the analog signal that drives the loudspeaker.

For more technical info and/or special pricing on any Legacy Audio loudspeaker, feel free to drop me a Private Message.

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post #923 of 929 Old 06-23-2020, 01:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Adz523 View Post
I'm researching the Focus XDs for my dedicated turntable set up and use the internal amp to drive all the speakers. Question... If i feed the XDs an analog signal from my phono preamp, does it convert it to digital and then back to analog? Can't tell from what's out there. Not many reviews anywhere.

Hi Adz523: The answer is NO...the Focus XD's internal 750W ICEpower Class D amplifier DOES NOT convert the analog input to digital (ones and zeros).

A Class D amplifer works by taking the analog input signal and creating a PWM (pulse width modulation) replica of it - essentially a series of pulses, which directly correspond to the amplitude and frequency of the input signal. This process seems digital but is in fact completely analog in nature. The pulses are then demodulated back into the analog signal that drives the loudspeaker.

For more technical info and/or special pricing on any Legacy Audio loudspeaker, feel free to drop me a Private Message.
Thanks !

Adz
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post #924 of 929 Old 06-27-2020, 11:34 PM
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Hi everyone, I'm giving the Focus SEs some serious thought. Heard them today for the first time, really impressed and had a couple of questions please.

Currently running a Yamaha RXA-3070 A/V receiver that is putting out 150 watts per channel. Since this speaker if pretty efficient, will my Yamaha give the SEs decent sound or hamstring it, or should I add something like the Parasound New Classic 2250 v.2 to my system? If I go for the SEs, that will use up the major portion of my budget, buying a big buck amp really is not be an option, so would the Parasound be a good alternate choice? Thanks!

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post #925 of 929 Old 06-28-2020, 08:01 AM
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Originally Posted by pcarnut View Post
Hi everyone, I'm giving the Focus SEs some serious thought. Heard them today for the first time, really impressed and had a couple of questions please.

Currently running a Yamaha RXA-3070 A/V receiver that is putting out 150 watts per channel. Since this speaker if pretty efficient, will my Yamaha give the SEs decent sound or hamstring it, or should I add something like the Parasound New Classic 2250 v.2 to my system? If I go for the SEs, that will use up the major portion of my budget, buying a big buck amp really is not be an option, so would the Parasound be a good alternate choice? Thanks!
I don't know what "dynamic power" means but here are the stats that I found on the web: Dynamic Power / Ch (Front L/R, 8/6/4/2 ohms) : 175 / 220 / 295 / 410 Watts.

The Focus SEs are nominally 4 ohms. Notice that your amp doesn't double its power from 8 -> 4 -> 2 ohms which is often a sign that it may not be capable of handling the current demands of a speaker being driven at higher levels. The SEs impedance curve often dips to 2 ohms under certain conditions (look it up please ). If you are driving the speakers hard, then your amp isn't the best match for them.

If you are only using the Yamaha for music (or would be satisfied with 2 channel video), perhaps you could consider replacing it with an audio only integrated amplifier with a DAC.

Sony AE1, Oppo 203, Esoteric F 05, Aurender N10, Legacy Focus SE, Rega Planar 10
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post #926 of 929 Old 06-28-2020, 11:30 AM
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I don't know what "dynamic power" means but here are the stats that I found on the web: Dynamic Power / Ch (Front L/R, 8/6/4/2 ohms) : 175 / 220 / 295 / 410 Watts.

The Focus SEs are nominally 4 ohms. Notice that your amp doesn't double its power from 8 -> 4 -> 2 ohms which is often a sign that it may not be capable of handling the current demands of a speaker being driven at higher levels. The SEs impedance curve often dips to 2 ohms under certain conditions (look it up please ). If you are driving the speakers hard, then your amp isn't the best match for them.

If you are only using the Yamaha for music (or would be satisfied with 2 channel video), perhaps you could consider replacing it with an audio only integrated amplifier with a DAC.
Thanks for the feedback. I won't be driving these hard, more interested in quality than volume. Could I bi-amp the SEs using the Parasound for the woofers, and the Yamaha for the mids and highs, or perhaps vice-versa?

Last edited by pcarnut; 06-28-2020 at 11:36 AM.
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post #927 of 929 Old 06-29-2020, 04:38 AM
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Originally Posted by pcarnut View Post
Thanks for the feedback. I won't be driving these hard, more interested in quality than volume. Could I bi-amp the SEs using the Parasound for the woofers, and the Yamaha for the mids and highs, or perhaps vice-versa?
I would think that just using the Parasound without any bypassing would sound better. BUT, you should try it and use whichever configuration you feel is best.

Also, the folks at Legacy are usually very helpful if you have specific questions about your speakers. They certainly can tell you more about impedances at various frequencies.

Sony AE1, Oppo 203, Esoteric F 05, Aurender N10, Legacy Focus SE, Rega Planar 10
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post #928 of 929 Old 06-29-2020, 08:43 AM
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Originally Posted by robertawillisjr View Post
Also, the folks at Legacy are usually very helpful if you have specific questions about your speakers. They certainly can tell you more about impedances at various frequencies.
Great, that's good to know, and nice to know the manufacturer is accessible to these questions, thanks again.
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post #929 of 929 Old 07-01-2020, 09:31 AM
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Originally Posted by pcarnut View Post
Hi everyone, I'm giving the Focus SEs some serious thought. Heard them today for the first time, really impressed and had a couple of questions please.

Currently running a Yamaha RXA-3070 A/V receiver that is putting out 150 watts per channel. Since this speaker if pretty efficient, will my Yamaha give the SEs decent sound or hamstring it, or should I add something like the Parasound New Classic 2250 v.2 to my system? If I go for the SEs, that will use up the major portion of my budget, buying a big buck amp really is not be an option, so would the Parasound be a good alternate choice? Thanks!

Just a quick tidbit of my experience:

I had a Denon AVR4310 when I first got my Legacy Focus SEs...At this point, I already had monoblocks on order. I never pushed them too hard because with the 150wpc in the Denon, I didn’t want to risk damaging the Focus SEs...but when I got the monoblocks and installed them, the sound really opened up....even at the volumes I had been listening to with just the Denon amp.


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