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post #9661 of 9683 Old 07-10-2019, 07:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Dawn Gordon View Post
I have heard the difference.

The Cinema Reference speakers have more dynamics and extension than the Plats. But the Plats are phenomenal speakers so you can't really go wrong selecting them. However, at $15k each, your budget doesn't cover the Cinema Reference speakers, so it may be a moot point.
The CR's are spec'd with an F3 of 80 Hz. The Plat's are spec'd with an F3 of 60 Hz. I'm sure the CR's have more output than the Plat's but they don't seem to have more extension. In any even, both speakers are designed for use with, and require subwoofers, so their absolute extension below the crossover is not really all that important. Just being pedantic.



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post #9662 of 9683 Old 07-10-2019, 10:40 AM
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I had a chance to pick up the CRS's at a stupid low cost but the massive amount of work, increased screen size, and many other changes (forgetting about the price of the speakers) was just way too daunting - and expensive.

BUT ...... as many home theaters as I have heard in other homes and at CEDIA, I have only heard one that I liked more than mine with Plats, Silver Monitors, etc. It was an all Wisdom Audio System. And the MSRP of the LCRs was $45,000 ($15,000 each) , and another $60,000 for the 6 surrounds, and another $20,000 for the ceiling speakers. Then, to that, you get to add a whole flock more of amp channels and a processor to make it all work. And then the price of 4 gigantic subs!!

Summary: For less than the price of a starter home, the Triad Platinums and attendant other Triad speakers are a very difficult combination to beat when put into a properly designed room.
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post #9663 of 9683 Old 07-11-2019, 08:14 AM
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I've read in this thread many times that ATI amps match well with Triad loudspeakers. I have an all Triad "Gold" dedicated theater. InRoom Gold LCR's up front and OnWall Gold surrounds at side and back.

Thinking of upgrading my amp for the front three channels. Looking at either the ATI AT4000 3 channel or the ATI AT523NC 3 channel. Have read many reviews and comparisons. For the Gold LCR's, which do you think would be a better fit?

Thanks for any feedback!
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post #9664 of 9683 Old 07-11-2019, 08:46 AM
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Originally Posted by craig john View Post
If you have the means, I think the price of a plane ticket to Portland would be a good investment. Not only could you hear them, but you could get first hand advice on optimizing them.

Craig

They don’t let you into their Portland office for some reason.

I even had my dealer call them to try and get even a shred of a demo.

Nada.

Makes you wonder....

I mean they have a full Silver and Platinum system there. Why wouldn’t they allow demos to the public?

Leave it at 8 ohms and call it a day :)
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post #9665 of 9683 Old 07-11-2019, 08:54 AM
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Originally Posted by bambam View Post
I've read in this thread many times that ATI amps match well with Triad loudspeakers. I have an all Triad "Gold" dedicated theater. InRoom Gold LCR's up front and OnWall Gold surrounds at side and back.

Thinking of upgrading my amp for the front three channels. Looking at either the ATI AT4000 3 channel or the ATI AT523NC 3 channel. Have read many reviews and comparisons. For the Gold LCR's, which do you think would be a better fit?

Thanks for any feedback!
The new ATI digital amps are fantastic. We have installed several of them and they have been very well received!
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post #9666 of 9683 Old 07-11-2019, 10:52 AM
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Originally Posted by bambam View Post
I've read in this thread many times that ATI amps match well with Triad loudspeakers. I have an all Triad "Gold" dedicated theater. InRoom Gold LCR's up front and OnWall Gold surrounds at side and back.

Thinking of upgrading my amp for the front three channels. Looking at either the ATI AT4000 3 channel or the ATI AT523NC 3 channel. Have read many reviews and comparisons. For the Gold LCR's, which do you think would be a better fit?

Thanks for any feedback!
One think to consider with the At4000 you can always send it back to Ati to add more channels. You can’t do that with the 523!

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post #9667 of 9683 Old 07-11-2019, 12:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Russdawg1 View Post
They don’t let you into their Portland office for some reason.

I even had my dealer call them to try and get even a shred of a demo.

Nada.

Makes you wonder....

I mean they have a full Silver and Platinum system there. Why wouldn’t they allow demos to the public?
I don't get it either. Triad doesn't seem like the most consumer friendly of companies. Their "market" is the custom installer market, and they don't seem interested in helping out individual consumers. I think people who hire custom installers let the decision making up to the CI. Therefore, they don't need to spend much energy on "consumers."



Another complaint I have with them is that they don't release ANY MEASUREMENT data on their speakers. No on-axis FR response plots, no off-axis response plots, no "spinorama"-type measurements... NOTHING. Even CI's don't get any useful measurements that they could use to help them install Triad products. I don't understand the secrecy. What is the harm in releasing measurement info???


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post #9668 of 9683 Old 07-11-2019, 12:33 PM
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Originally Posted by bambam View Post
I've read in this thread many times that ATI amps match well with Triad loudspeakers. I have an all Triad "Gold" dedicated theater. InRoom Gold LCR's up front and OnWall Gold surrounds at side and back.

Thinking of upgrading my amp for the front three channels. Looking at either the ATI AT4000 3 channel or the ATI AT523NC 3 channel. Have read many reviews and comparisons. For the Gold LCR's, which do you think would be a better fit?

Thanks for any feedback!
I am using Earthquake Cinenova amps with my Plat's and Silver Monitors. I have a Cinenova Grande5 and a Cinenova Grande7 BR. Both amps put out 650 wpc into 4 ohms. They sound fantastic. Just throwing another option out there.


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post #9669 of 9683 Old 07-11-2019, 12:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by craig john View Post
I am using Earthquake Cinenova amps with my Plat's and Silver Monitors. I have a Cinenova Grande5 and a Cinenova Grande7 BR. Both amps put out 650 wpc into 4 ohms. They sound fantastic. Just throwing another option out there.


Craig
It's interesting you say that Craig as I'm currently running an Earthquake Cinenova Grande3 for my front 3 channels! I think it sounds really good - just wondering if the ATI's would bring anything additional to the party?! But believe me, I could continue to live with the Cinenova!
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post #9670 of 9683 Old 07-11-2019, 01:01 PM
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Originally Posted by bambam View Post
It's interesting you say that Craig as I'm currently running an Earthquake Cinenova Grande3 for my front 3 channels! I think it sounds really good - just wondering if the ATI's would bring anything additional to the party?! But believe me, I could continue to live with the Cinenova!
I haven't heard the ATI amps with any Triad speakers, so I can't comment with any authority. However, I would find it surprising if the ATI amps sounded "better" than the Cinenovas, especially since the Cinenovas already provide more power than the Triads are rated to handle. Amplifier distortion and/or clipping is never an issue with the Cinenovas!!!


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post #9671 of 9683 Old 07-11-2019, 01:09 PM
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Originally Posted by craig john View Post
I don't get it either. Triad doesn't seem like the most consumer friendly of companies. Their "market" is the custom installer market, and they don't seem interested in helping out individual consumers. I think people who hire custom installers let the decision making up to the CI. Therefore, they don't need to spend much energy on "consumers."

Another complaint I have with them is that they don't release ANY MEASUREMENT data on their speakers. No on-axis FR response plots, no off-axis response plots, no "spinorama"-type measurements... NOTHING. Even CI's don't get any useful measurements that they could use to help them install Triad products. I don't understand the secrecy. What is the harm in releasing measurement info???

Craig

Well my only thoughts are that they are clearly hiding something.

I wouldn’t be extremely surprised if they didn’t measure up properly.

They could be burying all the spins as they just don’t match up to all the other speakers on the market currently.

Of course this is speculation. But I would like to see some actual measurements before I change my opinion on why they are doing this.

But I find this as also surprising.

Take B&W for example. Their speakers measure from bad to horrific. They still post their measurements though. Now this could be because B&W is a much larger company than Triad and have no worries of losing their market share. Triad on the other hand, a much smaller company, has something to worry about if they lose their market share.

Leave it at 8 ohms and call it a day :)
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post #9672 of 9683 Old 07-11-2019, 01:18 PM
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Well my only thoughts are that they are clearly hiding something.

I wouldn’t be extremely surprised if they didn’t measure up properly.

They could be burying all the spins as they just don’t match up to all the other speakers on the market currently.

Of course this is speculation. But I would like to see some actual measurements before I change my opinion on why they are doing this.

But I find this as also surprising.

Take B&W for example. Their speakers measure from bad to horrific. They still post their measurements though. Now this could be because B&W is a much larger company than Triad and have no worries of losing their market share. Triad on the other hand, a much smaller company, has something to worry about if they lose their market share.
Frankly, I think you're way off base here. How much experience do you have with Triad speakers? I doubt Triad is withholding the measurements because their speaker "don't measure up properly." I have measured and listened to quite a few Triad products and they all measure as "neutral" as anything else I've seen. I don't have the capability of doing Spinoramas, but I suspect they would measure pretty well. Floyd Toole even mentioned to me once that the Triad engineers had been to the NRCC and that he was impressed with Triad products. They sound neutral as well. So I doubt there are any significant issues with their on- or off-axis measurements. But seeing them would certainly put that to rest.


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post #9673 of 9683 Old 07-11-2019, 01:27 PM
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Originally Posted by craig john View Post
Frankly, I think you're way off base here. How much experience do you have with Triad speakers? I doubt Triad is withholding the measurements because their speaker "don't measure up properly." I have measured and listened to quite a few Triad products and they all measure as "neutral" as anything else I've seen. I don't have the capability of doing Spinoramas, but I suspect they would measure pretty well. Floyd Toole even mentioned to me once that the Triad engineers had been to the NRCC and that he was impressed with Triad products. They sound neutral as well. So I doubt there are any significant issues with their on- or off-axis measurements. But seeing them would certainly put that to rest.

Craig

I have zero experience with Triad products other than seeing their office that has two full systems set up closed to the public for some reason, and does not disclose measurements to the public also.

Now I may be way off base here and I’m fine with that, but I currently have no reason to think otherwise. If Floyd Toole was so impressed, you’d think they’d publish the measurements, along with his stamp of approval, right? Having Floyd Toole be impressed by your speakers is not something to be taken lightly.

When we see the measurements, feel free to color me wrong!

But we may not see them ever.... Mmiles had a interesting topic to bring up that no one wanted to bite on.

Leave it at 8 ohms and call it a day :)
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post #9674 of 9683 Old 07-14-2019, 04:53 PM
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This is super confusing. You've got surrounds in the CEILING but for the Atmos heights you want to install speakers in the wall? I get you'll be reflecting them upwards but this is all sorts of weird... Atmos needs distinct separation from the ear level and overhead layers to work properly. It's not just about jamming more speakers in the room.

What we really need is a diagram and/or photos of the room to understand what's happening in terms of the layout and position of the speakers.

But my first thought absent this info is why wouldn't you use the speakers you already have installed in the ceiling for Atmos?
Sorry about the first post, I will try to explain again. The room is "L" shaped roughly 24' x 24' with a 10' x 12' room making the cutout of the "L".


There is a supply and return duct right above the seating area. The wall to the left of the seating area is a bar area with cabinets and a fridge about 9 feet away and to the right there are sliding doors and a built in desk about 14 feet away. there is a wall directly behind the couch.



The only place to put the surrounds was in the ceiling about 8 feet from the centerline of the TV. There are no rear surrounds because the general consensus I received was the rear surrounds would have to go in the wall directly above the couch and they would be too close to the seating area. The front and center speakers are in wall, and the ducts make the ceiling height very low in the seating area. I realize it might not be possible but I figured I would ask for thoughts on how or if to proceed. I've attached some photos, hopefully they will help. Sorry the room is a bit of a mess.



Thanks
Any thoughts?
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post #9675 of 9683 Old 07-15-2019, 07:07 AM
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Hey everyone, need to make a decision and looking for some input. I am being offered a choice between using in ceiling silver satellites as a surround speaker or in ceiling bronze LCRs as the surround speakers. It looks to be about a $500 increase to go with the bronze LCRs as surrounds. Is there a big difference with using the Satellites vs the LCRs as surrounds? Not sure it matters but the front LCRs will be in ceiling silver 8s. Thanks in advance for any input.
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post #9676 of 9683 Old 07-15-2019, 07:42 AM
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It's going to depend on the size of your room and the proximity of your seating to the walls.

What is the room size (WDH) and how close will the couch be to your surround speakers?

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post #9677 of 9683 Old 07-15-2019, 07:48 AM
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It's going to depend on the size of your room and the proximity of your seating to the walls.

What is the room size (WDH) and how close will the couch be to your surround speakers?
Room size is roughly 19x23x8. So, it is a larger room. The seating position is probably 6-7 feet off of the back wall. The satellites or bronze LCRs will be in ceiling so we can move them around to be closer or further from the couch. I dont want to use the satellites if there will be a big quality difference.
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post #9678 of 9683 Old 07-15-2019, 07:53 AM
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What speakers are you using for your LCRs?

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post #9679 of 9683 Old 07-15-2019, 08:12 AM
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Silver 8 LCRs
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post #9680 of 9683 Old 07-15-2019, 09:42 AM
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Then you will want to go with InCeiling Silver/6 Sats for your surrounds.

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Last edited by Dawn Gordon; 07-15-2019 at 09:47 AM.
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post #9681 of 9683 Old 07-15-2019, 09:45 AM
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Dawn - I assume you mean Silver/6 not Silver/4?

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post #9682 of 9683 Old 07-15-2019, 09:48 AM
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Good catch BP, I changed it to /6.

Thanks!

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post #9683 of 9683 Old 07-15-2019, 11:04 AM
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Thanks Dawn.
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