The official Dolby Atmos thread (home theater version) - Page 1962 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #58831 of 58893 Old 06-18-2020, 04:33 AM
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Curious opinions of Mask Of Zorro's Atmos mix? I find it awfully bright!

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post #58832 of 58893 Old 06-18-2020, 10:10 AM
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My room is 13' x 16' x 10'. I'm only concerned with MLP which is currently 7' from the back wall but can be moved back if necessary. I'm going for 7.2.4 with in-ceiling Top Speakers.

1. Should my surrounds be monopole or bipole?

2. Should my in-ceiling Tops be monopole or bipole?

Media: LG 88" 8K OLED Z9 / Denon AVR-X8500H 7.1.4 / Oppo UDP-203 / Nvidia SHIELD (2017) / Apple TV 4K / Sony 4K FMP-X10 / Gaming PC (Threadripper 1950X / 2x GeForce GTX 1080 Ti SLI) / PlayStation 4 Pro with PS VR / PlayStation (original)
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post #58833 of 58893 Old 06-18-2020, 10:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bryantc View Post
My room is 13' x 16' x 10'. I'm only concerned with MLP which is currently 7' from the back wall but can be moved back if necessary. I'm going for 7.2.4 with in-ceiling Top Speakers.

1. Should my surrounds be monopole or bipole?

2. Should my in-ceiling Tops be monopole or bipole?
You don't indicate what your current speakers are. Are you going to replace them all?
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post #58834 of 58893 Old 06-18-2020, 10:43 AM
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Originally Posted by fookoo_2010 View Post
You don't indicate what your current speakers are. Are you going to replace them all?
Yes

Media: LG 88" 8K OLED Z9 / Denon AVR-X8500H 7.1.4 / Oppo UDP-203 / Nvidia SHIELD (2017) / Apple TV 4K / Sony 4K FMP-X10 / Gaming PC (Threadripper 1950X / 2x GeForce GTX 1080 Ti SLI) / PlayStation 4 Pro with PS VR / PlayStation (original)
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post #58835 of 58893 Old 06-18-2020, 11:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bryantc View Post
My room is 13' x 16' x 10'. I'm only concerned with MLP which is currently 7' from the back wall but can be moved back if necessary. I'm going for 7.2.4 with in-ceiling Top Speakers.

1. Should my surrounds be monopole or bipole?

2. Should my in-ceiling Tops be monopole or bipole?
I would go with monopoles all around for that setup.

If you're going in-ceiling, you might want to find out the ones with the best aimed response and that also have matching bed level speakers. Personally, I find it more important to having matching drivers wherever possible across the line. All my drivers, for example are the same size and make, although the rear four speakers are a newer model (necessary to mount them on the ceiling and fit the slimmer towers in the space provided; fortunately they have the same timbre. The drivers are updated versions of the same size ones, however). With 17 speakers, the sound matches seamlessly despite 5 different models from PSB (14 speakers of which have identical drivers). I also would go with 3 matching front speakers, if possible instead of a "center channel speaker" which even with the same drivers, never seem to match the dispersion pattern leading to people wishing they had things like "Center Spread" in DSU when it doesn't matter with identical speakers.

In other words, even if you're going to use tower speakers only for the front, try to find a bookshelf pair with the same midrange/tweeters and hopefully the same for the ceiling, but that may be more difficult to match up given the size of most in-ceiling speakers. I went with on-ceiling speakers in the back (it's a PSB Image B speaker inside an enclosure that can be aimed and mounted on a ceiling or wall called the PSB CS500). My "surround heights" (also doing "top middle" duty) are bipoles, but they're aimed to the front/back rows, not being used to create a null of any sort. I basically reused them from my 6.1 setup and it fits the Auro-3D setup perfectly and with my not-so-wide room suffices for top middle as well. I put actual bookshelf speakers on the top row of my bookshelf in the front aimed downward, only because it would have looked terrible to mount speakers on the ceiling just in front of the bookshelf and I wanted "heights" so to use the full ceiling length plus work with Auro-3D. I have top middle to bridge them so it's perfectly even, but then I have three rows of seating.

But for only the MLP and using "tops" in-ceiling, monopoles are the way to go for sure for the sharpest possible imaging.

Click THEATER (Updated: Nov-12-2019) for pics: Epson 3100 3D Projector, DaLite 92" screen, 11.1.6 (Marantz SR7012 + Yamaha HTR-5960 + Onkyo ESPro) - Dialog Lift - PSB T45/B15/S50/X1T/CS500 Speakers & Def Tech PF-1500 15" sub; 2nd Room (Updated Apr-22-2019): 48" Plasma TV, Carver AL-III, Carver C-5 Pre-Amp, Technics SH-AC500D, Dual Carver TFM-35x Amps (Active Bi-Amp), Klipsch Surrounds ; Sources: PS4, LG UP875 UHD, Nvidia Shield (KODI), ATV4K, Zidoo X9S, LD, GameCube : Props (Updated 6-22-20)
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post #58836 of 58893 Old 06-18-2020, 11:25 AM
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Originally Posted by bryantc View Post
Yes
Given your 88" OLED, your budget, in comparison, can be whatever you are willing to spend. Given that, I would suggest your base layer of speakers, including the wides, should all be the same drivers. For the height speakers, you can go the same way or somewhat depart from the base layer. There isn't a lot of stress put on the height speakers, compared to the all important center speaker. Monopole or dipole? I would see no reason in a home theater to choose dipoles. Your media room has about the same width dimensions as my home theater room and I went with 9.2.6, not that the third pair of middle height speakers makes much of a difference because of virtual imaging between the front and rear height speakers. The same rationale could be applied to wides in that there could be a virtual image between the front speakers and the two surround speakers. I went with the 9.2.6 because I could, given the redoing of my own home theater room in which placements of speakers were somewhat hampered by what is in the room.
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post #58837 of 58893 Old 06-18-2020, 01:29 PM
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Given your 88" OLED, your budget, in comparison, can be whatever you are willing to spend. Given that, I would suggest your base layer of speakers, including the wides
Including the wides? He said 7.2.4, not 9.2.4.

Quote:
Monopole or dipole? I would see no reason in a home theater to choose dipoles.
He said monopole or bipole, not dipole.
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post #58838 of 58893 Old 06-18-2020, 04:19 PM
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Actually I just realized I don't HAVE to do in-ceiling. I could just as easily mount them if that provides better options. But I definitely want them in the Top positions rather than Height.

Media: LG 88" 8K OLED Z9 / Denon AVR-X8500H 7.1.4 / Oppo UDP-203 / Nvidia SHIELD (2017) / Apple TV 4K / Sony 4K FMP-X10 / Gaming PC (Threadripper 1950X / 2x GeForce GTX 1080 Ti SLI) / PlayStation 4 Pro with PS VR / PlayStation (original)
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post #58839 of 58893 Old 06-18-2020, 06:14 PM
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Originally Posted by bryantc View Post
Actually I just realized I don't HAVE to do in-ceiling. I could just as easily mount them if that provides better options. But I definitely want them in the Top positions rather than Height.
I recommend PSB while you can still get the current lineup. PSB X1T or X2T towers and/or Image B bookshelves plus either CS500 or CS1000 for on-ceiling mounts (latter has deeper bass on each case) and your choice of sub and you'll be all set.

There are other good brands out there, of course, but few are rated +/- 1dB across most of the range for the price.

Click THEATER (Updated: Nov-12-2019) for pics: Epson 3100 3D Projector, DaLite 92" screen, 11.1.6 (Marantz SR7012 + Yamaha HTR-5960 + Onkyo ESPro) - Dialog Lift - PSB T45/B15/S50/X1T/CS500 Speakers & Def Tech PF-1500 15" sub; 2nd Room (Updated Apr-22-2019): 48" Plasma TV, Carver AL-III, Carver C-5 Pre-Amp, Technics SH-AC500D, Dual Carver TFM-35x Amps (Active Bi-Amp), Klipsch Surrounds ; Sources: PS4, LG UP875 UHD, Nvidia Shield (KODI), ATV4K, Zidoo X9S, LD, GameCube : Props (Updated 6-22-20)
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post #58840 of 58893 Old 06-21-2020, 07:14 AM
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Originally Posted by bryantc View Post
Actually I just realized I don't HAVE to do in-ceiling. I could just as easily mount them if that provides better options. But I definitely want them in the Top positions rather than Height.
I would do in-ceiling's if you can. They work really well to make the Atmos bubble seamless, and aesthetically you can't beat the look.

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post #58841 of 58893 Old 06-21-2020, 12:17 PM
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I would do in-ceiling's if you can. They work really well to make the Atmos bubble seamless, and aesthetically you can't beat the look.
They do look better, but I take issue with the implied notion that on-ceiling speakers wouldn't be seamless. It's much easier to find matching driver sets with bed-level and get deeper bass with on-ceiling.

Click THEATER (Updated: Nov-12-2019) for pics: Epson 3100 3D Projector, DaLite 92" screen, 11.1.6 (Marantz SR7012 + Yamaha HTR-5960 + Onkyo ESPro) - Dialog Lift - PSB T45/B15/S50/X1T/CS500 Speakers & Def Tech PF-1500 15" sub; 2nd Room (Updated Apr-22-2019): 48" Plasma TV, Carver AL-III, Carver C-5 Pre-Amp, Technics SH-AC500D, Dual Carver TFM-35x Amps (Active Bi-Amp), Klipsch Surrounds ; Sources: PS4, LG UP875 UHD, Nvidia Shield (KODI), ATV4K, Zidoo X9S, LD, GameCube : Props (Updated 6-22-20)
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post #58842 of 58893 Old 06-21-2020, 02:53 PM
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They do look better, but I take issue with the implied notion that on-ceiling speakers wouldn't be seamless. It's much easier to find matching driver sets with bed-level and get deeper bass with on-ceiling.
I was lucky enough to buy some closeout DT in-ceiling speakers that use the same tweeters as the other DT's in my system. Plus, with 9" woofers they have pretty good bass extension. I see your point however if someone can't get a decent match for in-ceiling speakers, but can get on-ceiling models that do.

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post #58843 of 58893 Old 06-21-2020, 06:17 PM
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I was lucky enough to buy some closeout DT in-ceiling speakers that use the same tweeters as the other DT's in my system. Plus, with 9" woofers they have pretty good bass extension. I see your point however if someone can't get a decent match for in-ceiling speakers, but can get on-ceiling models that do.
On-ceiling (or on wall for that matter if one does the Auro layout) are also considerably easier to install yourself. My home theater is below another room above so there's no attic access, etc. so it would be very difficult to fish wires through the ceiling. You can move on-ceiling around to try different locations as well if you don't finalize the wiring. Sound wise, there should be no difference in terms of imaging. Real Atmos theaters are on-ceiling/hanging as well. A clean look is the best thing about in-ceiling, I think.

Click THEATER (Updated: Nov-12-2019) for pics: Epson 3100 3D Projector, DaLite 92" screen, 11.1.6 (Marantz SR7012 + Yamaha HTR-5960 + Onkyo ESPro) - Dialog Lift - PSB T45/B15/S50/X1T/CS500 Speakers & Def Tech PF-1500 15" sub; 2nd Room (Updated Apr-22-2019): 48" Plasma TV, Carver AL-III, Carver C-5 Pre-Amp, Technics SH-AC500D, Dual Carver TFM-35x Amps (Active Bi-Amp), Klipsch Surrounds ; Sources: PS4, LG UP875 UHD, Nvidia Shield (KODI), ATV4K, Zidoo X9S, LD, GameCube : Props (Updated 6-22-20)
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post #58844 of 58893 Old 06-21-2020, 06:45 PM
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I inquired in this thread about my Def Tech system and which Atmos speakers would be best. I can’t recall who recommended the DT DI 8R, but they were spot on. They sound great with my SM55 and two DI 6.5S surround speakers. I did end up replacing my center channel speaker with a DT CS9040 as it became apparent my PC2000 was the weak point in my 5.1.4 system.

I love watching movies in Atmos. Four Atmos speakers is the way to go if you can swing it. The sound is really immersive. Paying $600+ to run speaker wires up into my attic and down a couple of walls plus installing the two in-wall surrounds and four in-ceiling Atmos speakers was worth every penny. Love the look too.
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post #58845 of 58893 Old 06-22-2020, 01:50 PM
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Originally Posted by bryantc View Post
My room is 13' x 16' x 10'. I'm only concerned with MLP which is currently 7' from the back wall but can be moved back if necessary. I'm going for 7.2.4 with in-ceiling Top Speakers.

1. Should my surrounds be monopole or bipole?

2. Should my in-ceiling Tops be monopole or bipole?
In a perfect world, all speakers would be monopole in an Atmos setup.

With your 10' ceilings, there is zero concern with "hot spotting" from excessively close overheads, so 100% go with monopoles up top. Same with being 7' from the back wall for back surrounds.

The only dimension of "concern" is the 13' width for monopole side surrounds, especially for off-axis listeners who would only be a few feet from the speakers. But since you only care about MLP, then I would keep it simple and do matching monopoles everwhere.

If you have the budget, Triad in-walls + in-ceilings would be an excellent fit. The in-ceiling satellites have 45 degree angled baffles which makes them perfect for Atmos use. And using in-walls will give you extra "breathing room" preserving space vs freestanding bookshelf speakers in the room (especially for the side surrounds).

The Bronze Sat models (5.25" woofer) run about $400/each and the Silver Sat (6.5" woofer) are $450/each. I would use the same model for all 8 speakers which will give you seamless tonal blend in the surround field. Around $5K total cost for 3 x Bronze LCR + 8 x Bronze Sat and that should sound fantastic in a room that size


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post #58846 of 58893 Old 06-23-2020, 07:10 AM
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Happy Birthday Atmos!


It's been 6 exciting years already, since Dolby announced it for AVRs. Congratulations to everyone here, from the enthusiastic pioneers to the recent newcomers!
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post #58847 of 58893 Old 06-23-2020, 07:17 AM
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Originally Posted by scarabaeus View Post
Happy Birthday Atmos!


It's been 6 exciting years already, since Dolby announced it for AVRs. Congratulations to everyone here, from the enthusiastic pioneers to the recent newcomers!
scarabaeus,




Atmos is totally "AWESOME" ...





Terry
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post #58848 of 58893 Old 06-23-2020, 09:35 AM
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Yup! Atmos rocks! And it just keeps getting better with age as all things do! well, except bread and a few other things
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post #58849 of 58893 Old 06-23-2020, 02:09 PM
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Yes indeed. Love my Atmos.

Btw, anybody know why all the Atmos white paper links go to Dolby’s useless generic page?
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post #58850 of 58893 Old 06-24-2020, 07:15 AM
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Originally Posted by Polyrythm1k View Post
Btw, anybody know why all the Atmos white paper links go to Dolby’s useless generic page?

I do not know, but it looks like some designers have gotten hold of their website...


If you switch to the professional section on dolby.com, and search for Atmos, there's a lot of info. I found a sort-of "home page" for all things Home Atmos:



https://professional.dolby.com/tv/home/dolby-atmos/



Among the docs:


Installation manual: https://professional.dolby.com/sitea...21318_r3.1.pdf


Upfiring speakers: https://professional.dolby.com/sitea...technology.pdf


Soundbars: https://professional.dolby.com/sitea...etup-guide.pdf


And, last but not least, the Whitepaper you mentioned: https://professional.dolby.com/sitea...me-theater.pdf


Cheers!
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post #58851 of 58893 Old 06-24-2020, 07:25 AM
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Originally Posted by Polyrythm1k View Post
Yes indeed. Love my Atmos.

Btw, anybody know why all the Atmos white paper links go to Dolby’s useless generic page?
Well-There's a toilet paper shortage, so maybe the folks at Dolby Labs were forced to use whatever they had.
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post #58852 of 58893 Old 06-24-2020, 07:36 AM
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Originally Posted by scarabaeus View Post
I do not know, but it looks like some designers have gotten hold of their website...


If you switch to the professional section on dolby.com, and search for Atmos, there's a lot of info. I found a sort-of "home page" for all things Home Atmos:



https://professional.dolby.com/tv/home/dolby-atmos/



Among the docs:


Installation manual: https://professional.dolby.com/sitea...21318_r3.1.pdf


Upfiring speakers: https://professional.dolby.com/sitea...technology.pdf


Soundbars: https://professional.dolby.com/sitea...etup-guide.pdf


And, last but not least, the Whitepaper you mentioned: https://professional.dolby.com/sitea...me-theater.pdf


Cheers!

Thank you! I guess I didn’t do enough deep diving.
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post #58853 of 58893 Old 06-24-2020, 07:38 AM
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Well-There's a toilet paper shortage, so maybe the folks at Dolby Labs were forced to use whatever they had.

Good point!
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post #58854 of 58893 Old 06-29-2020, 06:28 AM
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Originally Posted by scarabaeus View Post
Happy Birthday Atmos!

It's been 6 exciting years already, since Dolby announced it for AVRs. Congratulations to everyone here, from the enthusiastic pioneers to the recent newcomers!

***While not the greatest of movies or even a Dolby Atmos mix, “A Hole In The Ground” on Amazon Prime in 5.1 and upmixed via DSU on my Denon 6700H sounded fantastic. Lots of side to side, back and front plus height action. Worth a look just for the audio track.



P.S. - Just seeing if this thread has a database problem as I couldn't post regularly.
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SONY 75X900F & 49X900E, Denon X6700H & Emotiva XPA-3, OPPO 103 - 9.1.4 Setup - Speakers - Studio 60's-V.5 (FL/FR), CC-690-V.5 (C), ADP 590-V.5 (SS), MilleniaOne 2.0 (BS) - Velodyne 810 Sub, Cornered Audio (FH/RH), Definitive Technology (Front Wides). Stereo 2 Channel Only - Dali Evidence 470 & MartinLogan Forte Amplifier/Streamer with ARC.
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post #58855 of 58893 Old 06-29-2020, 09:56 AM
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Hi everyone, I have a 5.1.4 setup with huge tower speakers from Klipsch. Now I found another pair and I am thinking of a 7.1.4 setup. Would it make sense to move the surround to the sides 80 y90 degrees and have the other pair as back rear speakers angeled towards the couch? I dont want to place the rears in the middle of the room.

TIA
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post #58856 of 58893 Old 06-29-2020, 10:04 AM
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Would it make sense to move the surround to the sides 80 y90 degrees and have the other pair as back rear speakers angeled towards the couch?
No need to move anything. Just place the new pair of speakers against the side walls, slightly forward of the listeners (around ±80° from centre). I would aim ALL speakers towards the listener at the opposite end of the couch to compensate for distance.
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post #58857 of 58893 Old 06-29-2020, 11:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Nima View Post
Hi everyone, I have a 5.1.4 setup with huge tower speakers from Klipsch. Now I found another pair and I am thinking of a 7.1.4 setup. Would it make sense to move the surround to the sides 80 y90 degrees and have the other pair as back rear speakers angeled towards the couch? I dont want to place the rears in the middle of the room.

TIA
N.
I was wondering this as well-I have a 5.1.4 also and, as such, have my surrounds at the recommended 5.1 angle (kind of back corners of room). It would be impossible for me to move them directly behind and would be too close in the recommended 7.1.4 setup but want to explore 7.1.4 with “rear” surrounds left in corners and new side surrounds at 75-80 degrees in front of MLP

Sony 75Z9D (5.2.4) Samsung 65JS9500
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post #58858 of 58893 Old 07-01-2020, 12:55 AM
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No need to move anything. Just place the new pair of speakers against the side walls, slightly forward of the listeners (around ±80° from centre). I would aim ALL speakers towards the listener at the opposite end of the couch to compensate for distance.
What exactly do you mean with opposite of the couch? I am sitting in the middle of the couch which is my MLP. No one else on the couch. Do you mean to point the right front speaker to the left of the MLP?

Driving 7-8 hours to pick up those new monsters tomorrow. I hope it is worth it going from 5.1.4 to 7.1.4

TIA
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post #58859 of 58893 Old 07-01-2020, 04:11 AM
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What exactly do you mean with opposite of the couch? I am sitting in the middle of the couch which is my MLP. No one else on the couch. Do you mean to point the right front speaker to the left of the MLP?
He explains it (time/energy trading) here.
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post #58860 of 58893 Old 07-01-2020, 08:02 AM
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I am sitting in the middle of the couch which is my MLP. No one else on the couch.
IF you're going to be the only listener, then ignore my previous suggestion about time/energy trading, since it was for evening out the response across the entire couch.
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