The official Auro 3D thread (home theater version) - Page 218 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #6511 of 6566 Old 02-29-2020, 11:02 AM
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Has anyone just gone all out and installed speakers for all formats and switched?


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post #6512 of 6566 Old 02-29-2020, 11:21 AM
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Originally Posted by ClawAndTalon View Post
Has anyone just gone all out and installed speakers for all formats and switched?
I've got a speaker switch for surround height versus rear height and extracted top middle. I can play surround height only (true Auro 9.1), surround height plus rear height (run in parallel on switch, although the rear level should be reduced 3dB as it will got up 3dB with both playing the same thing) for "Theater" Auro 9.1 or extract top middle like I do with Atmos plus rear height (makes Auro just like Atmos save the rear bed speakers, which I can copy from the sides if need be). For three rows of seats, surround height +rear height works best for accurate Auro imaging with music for all seats. True is best for only the front row and extracted works best for movies, IMO (more discrete separation of front/rear events over the entire 24' room length). I've also got FW and Surround#1 "matrixed" speakers added that work in all modes so Auro only has 2 less speakers running normally out of 17.1 total.

Click THEATER (Updated: Nov-12-2019) for pics: Epson 3100 3D Projector, DaLite 92" screen, 11.1.6 (Marantz SR7012 + Yamaha HTR-5960 + Onkyo ESPro) - Dialog Lift - PSB T45/B15/S50/X1T/CS500 Speakers & Def Tech PF-1500 15" sub; 2nd Room (Updated Apr-22-2019): 48" Plasma TV, Carver AL-III, Carver C-5 Pre-Amp, Technics SH-AC500D, Dual Carver TFM-35x Amps (Active Bi-Amp), Klipsch Surrounds ; Sources: PS4, LG UP875 UHD, Nvidia Shield (KODI), ATV4K, Zidoo X9S, LD, GameCube : Props (Updated 6-22-20)
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post #6513 of 6566 Old 03-01-2020, 02:04 PM
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Has anyone compare Auro vs Dolby Surround? Currently I'm running 9.2.2, and I can easily reconfigure for Auro (I have a Marantz AV8805). Just curious if it's worth the effort for movies/TV shows
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post #6514 of 6566 Old 03-01-2020, 02:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by exm View Post
Has anyone compare Auro vs Dolby Surround? Currently I'm running 9.2.2, and I can easily reconfigure for Auro (I have a Marantz AV8805). Just curious if it's worth the effort for movies/TV shows
I don't care for it for non-native Auro-3D movies. Some like it for upmixing music.
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Click THEATER (Updated: Nov-12-2019) for pics: Epson 3100 3D Projector, DaLite 92" screen, 11.1.6 (Marantz SR7012 + Yamaha HTR-5960 + Onkyo ESPro) - Dialog Lift - PSB T45/B15/S50/X1T/CS500 Speakers & Def Tech PF-1500 15" sub; 2nd Room (Updated Apr-22-2019): 48" Plasma TV, Carver AL-III, Carver C-5 Pre-Amp, Technics SH-AC500D, Dual Carver TFM-35x Amps (Active Bi-Amp), Klipsch Surrounds ; Sources: PS4, LG UP875 UHD, Nvidia Shield (KODI), ATV4K, Zidoo X9S, LD, GameCube : Props (Updated 6-22-20)
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post #6515 of 6566 Old 03-02-2020, 02:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ClawAndTalon View Post
Has anyone just gone all out and installed speakers for all formats and switched?


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Yes. I did.

I already explained it in this previous post: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-re...l#post59202818

AVR: Denon AVC X8500H (Atmos 7.1.6, DTS:X, Auro-3D 13.1)
DPY: Optoma UHZ65 / Lumene Majestic Premium 270C / TV LG C9
Ply:: Dune HD Solo 4K / Dune HD PRO 4K / Oppo 203 / Fire Stick 4K
SPs: Pulsar Audio Ambiente 7 /Ambiente Center /Master M5 /Access AC / B&W CCM 683
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post #6516 of 6566 Old 03-02-2020, 04:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by exm View Post
Has anyone compare Auro vs Dolby Surround? Currently I'm running 9.2.2, and I can easily reconfigure for Auro (I have a Marantz AV8805). Just curious if it's worth the effort for movies/TV shows
I agree with those saying it's a significant improvement in music than any of the other Marantz soundfields.
I've used it both with 7.1 and occasionally Atmos discs and it's not that much "better" than Atmos, sometimes it's a better soundfield to me, sometimes it's not, but it's usually good on a 6.1 or 7.1 non-Atmos presentations IMNSHO, I'm using a Marantz SR7011 in a 9.1 config.
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post #6517 of 6566 Old 03-02-2020, 12:06 PM
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Note to admin

can this be pinned to the top with the Dolby Atmos thread


(I keep losing it )

Infocus SP8600 DLP, Denon AVC X8500H, Sony UBP X800 player, Denon DBT3313 Player, Kef 203/1 Main, 202C Center, Kef204ds Surround, HTS 2001 Rear Surround and FP, RP, Kef Ci130er Top, Kef 1001 Center Front Height 2x Kenwood SW-X1 12" Subs fitted Earthquake BA-550 plate amps.
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post #6518 of 6566 Old 03-02-2020, 10:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dianebrat View Post
I agree with those saying it's a significant improvement in music than any of the other Marantz soundfields.
I've used it both with 7.1 and occasionally Atmos discs and it's not that much "better" than Atmos, sometimes it's a better soundfield to me, sometimes it's not, but it's usually good on a 6.1 or 7.1 non-Atmos presentations IMNSHO, I'm using a Marantz SR7011 in a 9.1 config.
I use Auro 3D for upmixing stereo music sources, but for Dolby or DTS multich sources I prefer to use their native codecs

Sony XBR75-X940D, Samsung UBD-K8500, Xfinity X1 Voice DVR, Marantz AV-7703 Pre/Pro w/Auro, (3) Adcom GFA-545II amps, (2) Adcom GFA-535II amps for ATMOS speakers.
4 JBL HDI-3600 speakers, 1 HDI-4500 center channel & (2) HSU STF-2 subwoofers.
Klipsch HT500 satellites (4) for ceiling mounted ATMOS playback
DIY Linux desktop w/Strawberry bit perfect media center. Emotiva Stealth DC-1 DAC
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post #6519 of 6566 Old 03-19-2020, 10:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by exm View Post
Has anyone compare Auro vs Dolby Surround? Currently I'm running 9.2.2, and I can easily reconfigure for Auro (I have a Marantz AV8805). Just curious if it's worth the effort for movies/TV shows


it is worth it

Last edited by satsok; 03-19-2020 at 10:28 AM.
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post #6520 of 6566 Old 03-26-2020, 05:07 AM
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hi to all my friends..is there a demo to test the auro3d (channel test for example) or i have to order the disc from them?
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post #6521 of 6566 Old 03-26-2020, 10:30 AM
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Originally Posted by djvagelis80 View Post
hi to all my friends..is there a demo to test the auro3d (channel test for example) or i have to order the disc from them?
The disc is all I know about.

Sony XBR75-X940D, Samsung UBD-K8500, Xfinity X1 Voice DVR, Marantz AV-7703 Pre/Pro w/Auro, (3) Adcom GFA-545II amps, (2) Adcom GFA-535II amps for ATMOS speakers.
4 JBL HDI-3600 speakers, 1 HDI-4500 center channel & (2) HSU STF-2 subwoofers.
Klipsch HT500 satellites (4) for ceiling mounted ATMOS playback
DIY Linux desktop w/Strawberry bit perfect media center. Emotiva Stealth DC-1 DAC
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post #6522 of 6566 Old 03-26-2020, 11:16 AM
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There's several demos for speakers on both demo discs, Volume 1 and 2 (same channel tests both discs).

The demo material varies quite a lot between the two, though. I like the Fireworks demo on volume 1, but I think the music tracks are generally better on volume 2. I ended up buying four music album so far based on the demo tracks. Three were very good (favorite was Mando Diao's Aelita album. They're a Swedish rock band (album lyrics are in English) that to me sounded somewhere between Billy Idol and Duran Duran or something along those lines). Lichtmond 3 was also excellent.

The string quartet (Spektral Quartet) one was misleading, IMO. It had a lot of boring/odd tracks. I was looking for something soothing luke the demo track and there were "string" impersonations of famous people... A whole bunch of them. Awful.

Click THEATER (Updated: Nov-12-2019) for pics: Epson 3100 3D Projector, DaLite 92" screen, 11.1.6 (Marantz SR7012 + Yamaha HTR-5960 + Onkyo ESPro) - Dialog Lift - PSB T45/B15/S50/X1T/CS500 Speakers & Def Tech PF-1500 15" sub; 2nd Room (Updated Apr-22-2019): 48" Plasma TV, Carver AL-III, Carver C-5 Pre-Amp, Technics SH-AC500D, Dual Carver TFM-35x Amps (Active Bi-Amp), Klipsch Surrounds ; Sources: PS4, LG UP875 UHD, Nvidia Shield (KODI), ATV4K, Zidoo X9S, LD, GameCube : Props (Updated 6-22-20)
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post #6523 of 6566 Old 04-10-2020, 04:07 AM
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Are there people that use Dolby Enabled speakers for VOG?

I read about it on the Dutch maranzforum (use google translate)
ttps://marantzforum.nl/forum/index.php/topic,14641.90.html

The user CBdicX uses 2 KEF R50 Dolby Enabled speakers on top of his fronts to create a diffuse VOG channel on his ceiling and that is worked really well!

He writes that he had contact about this with Auro in nov 2017 and that they are/where also experimenting with this but nothing heard from again...

I just ordered 4x KEF R8a as direct (high)wall mounted speakers for 5.1.4 sound and thinking to upgrade that in the future with a VOG channel.
Currently have a SR7013 so only 9 amplified channels + 2 pre-outs that I can use with a second amp for VOG but need to buy an extra amp and 2 Dolby Enabled speakers for VOG and do not know if its worth the while.

Mean use will be auro-matic with 30% movies (mostly 5.1) / 40% series (mostly 5.1) / 30% stereo music)

Pro:
- no speakers on the ceiling
- more difuse sound form the ceiling

Possible cons:
- VOG not used in Atmos/DSU
- Will VOG add that much extra with Auro-matic upmixing of 5.1 and stereo?

Also it is still not clear to me if the VOG channel can be used on the SR7013 with Atmos input and then can be upmixed with Auro-matic 3D? to include the VOG speakers as a upmixed output.
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post #6524 of 6566 Old 04-10-2020, 06:18 AM
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Originally Posted by lennart View Post
Are there people that use Dolby Enabled speakers for VOG?
I use extracted side heights for everything (save 'pure' Auro mode where it's not extracted, but surround height which already simulates VOG if no VOG isn't configured). I can also use rear heights for Auro and extract a top/middle side height, which makes it sound/behave more like Atmos). This works well either way (it just changes how far and fast the overheads move into the back of the room).

It's hard to tell if VOG is used without the specific speaker configured since Auro simulates it if it's not configured. So I couldn't even say if the upmixer uses it for certain since it technically comes out of surround height or rear height.

I tested the demo disc outputs to see what it uses with or without the real speaker for the actual Auro-3D signal and it uses front height + VOG with it and front height + rear height (or surround height) without it.

The odd thing is VOG ends up overhead and in front of you with the 'ideal' (FH+SH) setup regardless of whether you use a a real VOG or not since it combines with front height to phantom in-between.

But with front height plus rear height with no VOG it images directly overhead (middle phantom), but then adding a real VOG overhead puts it in front of you again (FH+VOG phantom). This changes the imaging location of some effects.

Click THEATER (Updated: Nov-12-2019) for pics: Epson 3100 3D Projector, DaLite 92" screen, 11.1.6 (Marantz SR7012 + Yamaha HTR-5960 + Onkyo ESPro) - Dialog Lift - PSB T45/B15/S50/X1T/CS500 Speakers & Def Tech PF-1500 15" sub; 2nd Room (Updated Apr-22-2019): 48" Plasma TV, Carver AL-III, Carver C-5 Pre-Amp, Technics SH-AC500D, Dual Carver TFM-35x Amps (Active Bi-Amp), Klipsch Surrounds ; Sources: PS4, LG UP875 UHD, Nvidia Shield (KODI), ATV4K, Zidoo X9S, LD, GameCube : Props (Updated 6-22-20)

Last edited by MagnumX; 04-10-2020 at 06:34 AM.
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post #6525 of 6566 Old 04-10-2020, 07:23 AM
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Originally Posted by MagnumX View Post
I use extracted side heights for everything (save 'pure' Auro mode where it's not extracted, but surround height which already simulates VOG if no VOG isn't configured). I can also use rear heights for Auro and extract a top/middle side height, which makes it sound/behave more like Atmos). This works well either way (it just changes how far and fast the overheads move into the back of the room).

It's hard to tell if VOG is used without the specific speaker configured since Auro simulates it if it's not configured. So I couldn't even say if the upmixer uses it for certain since it technically comes out of surround height or rear height.

I tested the demo disc outputs to see what it uses with or without the real speaker for the actual Auro-3D signal and it uses front height + VOG with it and front height + rear height (or surround height) without it.

The odd thing is VOG ends up overhead and in front of you with the 'ideal' (FH+SH) setup regardless of whether you use a a real VOG or not since it combines with front height to phantom in-between.

But with front height plus rear height with no VOG it images directly overhead (middle phantom), but then adding a real VOG overhead puts it in front of you again (FH+VOG phantom). This changes the imaging location of some effects.
I looked at your impressive theatre and see that you use 2 Top Middle (height) speakers for 11.1.6
Because they are left and right they phantom a speaker like is it overhead?

I wondered how did you derived the middle height channel audio.
You usesd 2x Onkyo ES-600 Pro, this looks a 3.0 amp and you drive the left and right sides with 2x Onkyo ES-600 Pro with the height middle L + R on the center channels for both sides?
And you can also switch to pure Auro and then switch to the VOG input from the SR7012?

The information that the VOG channel is mixed into the FH en RH speakers (in auro 9.1 mode) for phantom VOG is new to me.
So you found out that VOG is never a discrete channel because if you have a dedicated VOG speakers that is always phantomed with the FH speakers with Auro 3D and Auro-matic upmixing? Or could it be that the FH and VOG where mixed in with the demo disc and it depends on how they mixed the master?
Can anyone corroborate the behaviour MagnumX perceived?


Still wondering if someone also ventured in using upward firing Dolby Enabled 'Atmos Speakers' like the KEF R50, R8a, Q50a on top of the front speakers firing upward to the ceiling to create a 'virtual' VOG on the ceiling since I'm not allowed to mount speakers on the ceiling, hence WAF...
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post #6526 of 6566 Old 04-10-2020, 11:07 AM
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I looked at your impressive theatre and see that you use 2 Top Middle (height) speakers for 11.1.6
Because they are left and right they phantom a speaker like is it overhead?
Yes. The simulated VOG output is a mono (correlated stereo) output through the rear height (or surround height if configured instead). The front height output is also correlated (centered between them). The end result ends up on the ceiling in-between them for a normal Auro VOG test signal. Where you put your couch/chair affects where you hear it to some extent (stereo phantom with precedent effect).


Quote:
I wondered how did you derived the middle height channel audio.
You usesd 2x Onkyo ES-600 Pro, this looks a 3.0 amp and you drive the left and right sides with 2x Onkyo ES-600 Pro with the height middle L + R on the center channels for both sides?
I only use the center output on the Onkyo for each top middle channel (one unit for Left and one for Right). The L/R inputs (front and rear heights) get passed through to a stereo amplifier with the center information removed (near discrete). They run in 3-channel stereo mode so the surround uncorrelated output information (if any) go to the front/rear heights) as they would image front/back of those speakers beyond the walls if anything is in them. The VOG is only as dispersed sounding as the signal sent to it. The test signals image like any other speaker at a specific area on the ceiling.

Quote:
And you can also switch to pure Auro and then switch to the VOG input from the SR7012?
Not from the 7012. I use a Monoprice 2-in/2-out speaker switchbox with dual volume control. Once set up, the volume isn't touched again on it. I press button to select either the extracted top middle signal from the Onkyo units or the rear height channel or on/off. Thus, I can send rear height to the side height speakers and they become surround height instead of rear height.

Since Auro is channel based, there is literally no difference between rear height and surround height in terms of the signal output so there is no reason to select surround height output at all as it will just disable Atmos output and nothing else. Atmos sounds fine with surround height speakers (just pulls the image slightly outward towards the middle the same as side surrounds do with any image panning around the room. Here there's less than a two foot difference so it's not really noticeable, especially if I purposely leak a bit of top middle to the front/rear heights as it then phantoms the distance between the two. It sounds like a straight line then to my ears.

Moving rear height to surround height and turning off the rear heights lets me easily configure 5.1.4 Atmos (cuts off back half of the room if I also disable rear surrounds in the 7012). I can then easily compare how a movie sounds in 5.1.4 or even 7.1.4 with front height plus top middle.

I can also leave rear surround enabled to both sets of speakers (driven in parallel then). That gives me Auro 9.1 cinema style output (rear level needs turned down 3dB to sound even then). That actually sounds surprisingly good in Atmos too from the second and third rows and brings Auro into the back of the room. Auto also sounds good with extracted middle most of the time. It's a bit like stretching the room out, especially with surround#1 carrying the signal also (bed level gets copied almost all the way to the back).

I could also play the extracted middle from the rear speakers, but that wouldn't be terribly useful. I can quickly disable either set of speakers to compare as well.

Quote:
The information that the VOG channel is mixed into the FH en RH speakers (in auro 9.1 mode) for phantom VOG is new to me.
So you found out that VOG is never a discrete channel because if you have a dedicated VOG speakers that is always phantomed with the FH speakers with Auro 3D and Auro-matic upmixing?
I said I can't easily test the upmixer without actually connecting a real speaker to that output. I can test the rest through the official Auro test disc signals and listening to which speakers are active with each signal. I don't have to hear the VOG signal in the test to know it's on when it's in that channel test and it makes it easy to plainly hear the front heights are playing. Auro won't work at all without configured front heights.

Quote:
Or could it be that the FH and VOG where mixed in with the demo disc and it depends on how they mixed the master?
Why would the official test tones for Auro-3D from the company erroneously use the VOG channel?

The cinema version (not Auromax but Auro-3D 11.1) is actually an array of many overhead VOG speakers so it would even make sense at home if it engaged rear heights as well, if available as that would more closely simulate a cinema array, but it doesn't for some reason, probably because it considered rear height a compromise to begin with as Auro 11.1 at home is considered to be a 5.1 based format. I don't know if Auro 13.1 on the Denon 8500 does anything differently in that regard. I think it uses unused channels as upmixed with Auromatic (more reverb than anything else).

Click THEATER (Updated: Nov-12-2019) for pics: Epson 3100 3D Projector, DaLite 92" screen, 11.1.6 (Marantz SR7012 + Yamaha HTR-5960 + Onkyo ESPro) - Dialog Lift - PSB T45/B15/S50/X1T/CS500 Speakers & Def Tech PF-1500 15" sub; 2nd Room (Updated Apr-22-2019): 48" Plasma TV, Carver AL-III, Carver C-5 Pre-Amp, Technics SH-AC500D, Dual Carver TFM-35x Amps (Active Bi-Amp), Klipsch Surrounds ; Sources: PS4, LG UP875 UHD, Nvidia Shield (KODI), ATV4K, Zidoo X9S, LD, GameCube : Props (Updated 6-22-20)
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post #6527 of 6566 Old 04-27-2020, 06:33 PM
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Has anyone just gone all out and installed speakers for all formats and switched?


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Manual DIY Speaker Switch to Have ATMOS and AURO 3d Setup
Well if anyone is interested I solved my issue.

Denon X4500
You will need the $20 Denon Multi EQ App
Allows you to create profiles ie Atmos and AURO 3d profiles you can load and send to the AVR

Last part was to install two of these https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I wired up the 8 speakers so now when I want to swap depending on what Im watching total time is about 2 min.
Flip the A/B switch and upload the proper config from my phone using the app

100% Happy.
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post #6528 of 6566 Old 04-28-2020, 06:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Soze887 View Post
Manual DIY Speaker Switch to Have ATMOS and AURO 3d Setup
Well if anyone is interested I solved my issue.

Denon X4500
You will need the $20 Denon Multi EQ App
Allows you to create profiles ie Atmos and AURO 3d profiles you can load and send to the AVR

Last part was to install two of these https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I wired up the 8 speakers so now when I want to swap depending on what Im watching total time is about 2 min.
Flip the A/B switch and upload the proper config from my phone using the app

100% Happy.
The link you provide is a non accessible or non existing link at amazon for me.

Can you repost the amazon link or post the complete name of the amazon item?

AVR: Denon AVC X8500H (Atmos 7.1.6, DTS:X, Auro-3D 13.1)
DPY: Optoma UHZ65 / Lumene Majestic Premium 270C / TV LG C9
Ply:: Dune HD Solo 4K / Dune HD PRO 4K / Oppo 203 / Fire Stick 4K
SPs: Pulsar Audio Ambiente 7 /Ambiente Center /Master M5 /Access AC / B&W CCM 683
Oth: HDFury Vertex2
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post #6529 of 6566 Old 04-28-2020, 09:33 AM
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The link you provide is a non accessible or non existing link at amazon for me.

Can you repost the amazon link or post the complete name of the amazon item?

The AB switch I used



I should add that at least for me using Denon the speaker outputs / AMP Config on the AVR are the same for the AURO 3D Front L and R Height Surrounds and Rear L and R Surrounds compared to the Top Front and Top Rear for ATMOS..
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post #6530 of 6566 Old 05-01-2020, 05:54 AM
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Originally Posted by MagnumX View Post
I finished watching Death Machine in Auro-3D. The movie is essentially about a new lady taking over as CEO in a company that's secretly making front line terror weapons and she's trying to clean their act up while the mad scientist making the weapons is having none of that idea and yet falls in love with her so he's up for killing everyone but her to make the world his way. It feels absurd and yet if you throw reality out the window, it has its moments just the same. It's obviously a bit of a B-grade horror movie, but I can see why it's a bit of a cult classic at the same time. It definitely has some appeal to it in a sense that's hard to define. The acting could be better in many many places, but the effects and crazed pace at times gives it a very high class feel too. It creates suspense and an almost claustrophobic feel of terror and I think with better actors and dialog, it could have been something much bigger at least until I question why no bullets every snag any of those hydraulic hoses on the robot (it's near invincibility lent it a hard to believe factor and yet the almost animal-like stupidity of its AI compared to say a Terminator made it possible to evade despite all its tracking measures. The cyber-programmed human warrior bit was harder to believe and the guy yelling Arnold like commands wasn't well done...the bad acting thing again. Even Arnold portrayed a robot-like demeanor better. The CEO lady did better and the crazy bad guy was pretty believable as a nut job so it wasn't a total acting failure).

The new Auro-3D soundtrack seems to take the original Auro-3D philosophy into account (instead of a conversion of an Atmos track that sounds like Atmos 5.1.4). By that I mean the the entire soundfield is one giant continuous one rather than some arbitrary division of bed/height like most Atmos stuff tends to do (i.e. height stuff is overhead and bed stuff is below with some objects that fly between them sometimes). I'm not saying Atmos couldn't go "big" but it seems to go for pin-point most of the time rather than a giant wall of sound. The sound is so continuous in Auro-3D, that it's often hard to be sure if the heights are in use or it's just the impression they are from the stereo mix phase relationships or whatever. One push of my MUTE button for the AVR that powers the height channels answers that question (the entire sound field collapsed into the bottom third of the room; it was freaky to hear how much of the soundtrack was in the height channels and NOT in the bed channels (you could hear faint/muffled bits of some of the upper sounds but it's clear there IS a division and often far more was in the heights than the beds, but you'd never guess it with the overheads on as it just sounds like sounds come from anywhere and everywhere in the room WITH NO INDICATION OF SPEAKERS WHATSOEVER. It sounded like there was often far more in the heights than the beds. It was a giant 8 foot wall of sound in every direction.

There were plenty of moments of direct overhead sound, but they were often big sounds blending in with the rest of the field rather than "Oh there's the ceiling!" except in a few places like the thunder in the storm outside which were clearly all above. Most of the overhead action was to the sides and front creating the impression the entire wall was made of speakers as again, there was no direct indication of sounds from specific speakers save perhaps the dialog, except that I use dialog 'lift' and and so it comes from the center of the screen where there are no speakers. The closest exception I can think of is when the one guy is talking to the other guy from a monitor above him and the sound clearly came from the vicinity of the front right height speaker at the top of the screen to the right of it. Bass was plentiful and deep. Some of the sound effects were oddly muffled for what appeared to be effect rather than going for loud sounds (for example where the one guy breaks the glass on a door to get through it or where instead of loud sounds of grinding flesh and screams, it goes for a quiet effect of freaky music blaring with a muffled slow motion type effect.

If I had a complaint about the soundtrack, it would be I'd like more direct overhead sounds in the middle of the ceiling, but then this soundtrack was designed for 1994 so there were few parts where that would make sense and when it could have (e.g. in the elevator when the machine attacks), it came from the floor into the elevator, not from above and so the opportunity for overhead sound there was missed. But clearly it had tons of sounds in the heights to the sides and front. But if you closed your eyes, it seemed far more surreal with no visuals to make you realize no objects were actually in the middle of the room between you and the screen (similar things apply to height effects that are distinctly above; they're much more clear to tell where they're coming from when you're not hunting for invisible objects that your brain rejects as not existing and therefore diminishes the effect a bit or so at least it seemed.

But certainly this was an interesting "immersive" mix in that it did NOT sound like a typical Atmos or X soundtrack, but more like the Auro-3D demo of the tractor pass or Amsterdam street corner in that you don't realize there's anything coming from speakers until you cut off the top or bottom and the room divides in two. There are no speakers, just the sound field all around you.
I finally got to use my copy with Auro on my Arcam AV40. Not sure I can add more than @MagnumX on this but there was a nice cohesive sound field in my "13.1" setup and the film was entertaining in its own cheesey way.
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post #6531 of 6566 Old 05-10-2020, 08:48 PM
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Hi. Need some help in determining why I am not getting any audio while playing the 8.0 Auro-3D track on the Haydn Portrait Pure Audio disc. I get audio on DTSX and can select Auro-3D on the 5.1 DTS HD MA track, but no audio out of the Marantz AV8805 on the Auro-3D track. The info screen does show Auro-3D but no audio. Any ideas what’s going on here? Thank you.
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post #6532 of 6566 Old 05-11-2020, 02:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Krobar View Post
I finally got to use my copy with Auro on my Arcam AV40. Not sure I can add more than @MagnumX on this but there was a nice cohesive sound field in my "13.1" setup and the film was entertaining in its own cheesey way.
You and @MagnumX have both tempted me on trying "Death Machine" on Auro-3D.

I just told my wife to give it to me for my birthday, from Amazon Germany. Hope that would be the right Limited Edition with Auro-3D mix.

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post #6533 of 6566 Old 05-11-2020, 03:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MagnoliaMOE View Post
Hi. Need some help in determining why I am not getting any audio while playing the 8.0 Auro-3D track on the Haydn Portrait Pure Audio disc. I get audio on DTSX and can select Auro-3D on the 5.1 DTS HD MA track, but no audio out of the Marantz AV8805 on the Auro-3D track. The info screen does show Auro-3D but no audio. Any ideas what’s going on here? Thank you.
I have that album. Unfortunately I think it's the problem. It looks to me like they put the DTS-MA 5.1 track on there twice as it and the Auro labeled track seem to be identical. The 2+2+2 track comes out on my 7012 as DTS:X--4.1 (no center) and front heights are active. It sounds good, but it's not full Auro. I do think this is some sort of mistake as the first track from that album is on the second Auro demo disk and it is certainly Auro 8.0--and yes, it does sound better.


It's disappointing, but it's still a very good sounding album. Track 10 might be one of the better dynamic range tests for your system ever recorded.
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post #6534 of 6566 Old 05-11-2020, 07:47 AM
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I have that album. Unfortunately I think it's the problem. It looks to me like they put the DTS-MA 5.1 track on there twice as it and the Auro labeled track seem to be identical. The 2+2+2 track comes out on my 7012 as DTS:X--4.1 (no center) and front heights are active. It sounds good, but it's not full Auro. I do think this is some sort of mistake as the first track from that album is on the second Auro demo disk and it is certainly Auro 8.0--and yes, it does sound better.


It's disappointing, but it's still a very good sounding album. Track 10 might be one of the better dynamic range tests for your system ever recorded. [IMG class=inlineimg]/forum/images/smilies/smile.gif[/IMG]
Thank you. I’ll give track 10 a listen.

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post #6535 of 6566 Old 05-14-2020, 02:17 AM
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Interesting how Auro-2D behaves

Yesterday was the first time I critically listened Auro-2D

Normally I listen Music with an Auro-3D 13.1 configuration, with the proper FH, CH, SH, TS speakers positions.

But I had my AVR and Speakers with Dolby Atnos configuration 7.1.4 with TF, TR, in-cealing speakers. In that situation, I was listening music and No Auro-Matic (Auro-3D) was available, because the Speakers designation. I was listening Stereo, tried DSU upmixer, but not really good. It was better in only Stereo.

But then I changed to Auro-2D that was available, and the sound changed to a much better sound bubble ambient. Even in Auro-2D it sounds almost like Auro-3D without any Height Speaker, just the 7.1
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post #6536 of 6566 Old 05-15-2020, 02:30 PM
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Are there people that use Dolby Enabled speakers for VOG?

I read about it on the Dutch maranzforum (use google translate)
ttps://marantzforum.nl/forum/index.php/topic,14641.90.html

The user CBdicX uses 2 KEF R50 Dolby Enabled speakers on top of his fronts to create a diffuse VOG channel on his ceiling and that is worked really well!

He writes that he had contact about this with Auro in nov 2017 and that they are/where also experimenting with this but nothing heard from again...

I just ordered 4x KEF R8a as direct (high)wall mounted speakers for 5.1.4 sound and thinking to upgrade that in the future with a VOG channel.
Currently have a SR7013 so only 9 amplified channels + 2 pre-outs that I can use with a second amp for VOG but need to buy an extra amp and 2 Dolby Enabled speakers for VOG and do not know if its worth the while.

Mean use will be auro-matic with 30% movies (mostly 5.1) / 40% series (mostly 5.1) / 30% stereo music)

Pro:
- no speakers on the ceiling
- more difuse sound form the ceiling

Possible cons:
- VOG not used in Atmos/DSU
- Will VOG add that much extra with Auro-matic upmixing of 5.1 and stereo?

Also it is still not clear to me if the VOG channel can be used on the SR7013 with Atmos input and then can be upmixed with Auro-matic 3D? to include the VOG speakers as a upmixed output.
Yes indeed I have good results for VOG to use Dolby enabled speakers.
Even now I use 2 Magnat satellite speakers that "bounce" from behind the screen, to the backwall, to the ceiling, to MLP.

For me this works great for VOG or as Front Height, or even Top Middle.
Had also direct speakers for FH, TM and VOG but like the defused sound of bouncers (hard popcorn ceiling).
I do not hear any differents for actual Dolby Enabled speakers, or "normal" speakers that are pointed to the ceiling.
I do like the design of DE speakers like the Kef R50, I am now waiting for a set of Canton AR800 to be used on the SVS Ultra Bookshelfs, because they will fit the SVS perfect

So even most Atmos/DTSX/Auro users will say, if you want sound coming from above, get speakers there, I do not agree !
Even on Audio shows where Dolby had a "Bouncer room" and "Direct room", most people liked the bouncers !

A bit like VHS and Video 2000.
Video 2000 (Bouncers) was the better system, VHS (Direct) had better marketing, and what did we buy...……..
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post #6537 of 6566 Old 05-26-2020, 02:41 AM
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Anyone have a download source for the Auro-3D demo discs? Hard to contact Denon CS lately.

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post #6538 of 6566 Old 05-30-2020, 12:40 AM
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I suspect timbre matching your heights to your base speakers in Auro is more important than Atmos due to the way in which they are used - so how much attention should I pay to this when looking for height speakers?

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post #6539 of 6566 Old 05-30-2020, 02:46 PM
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I suspect timbre matching your heights to your base speakers in Auro is more important than Atmos due to the way in which they are used - so how much attention should I pay to this when looking for height speakers?
I bought PSB speakers with the same tweeters and woofers but several different models/sizes (T-45 for mains and Center, B15 for front wides, front heights, side surround and surround#2, S50 bipolars for side height/top middle (faces both directions for 3 rows of seats) and X1T for rear surround and CS500 for rear height) (save the rear speakers, which are updated versions, but still sound nearly the same and match each other) and it all sounds the same moving around the room to my ears.

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post #6540 of 6566 Old 06-10-2020, 04:55 AM
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Originally Posted by MagnoliaMOE View Post
Hi. Need some help in determining why I am not getting any audio while playing the 8.0 Auro-3D track on the Haydn Portrait Pure Audio disc. I get audio on DTSX and can select Auro-3D on the 5.1 DTS HD MA track, but no audio out of the Marantz AV8805 on the Auro-3D track. The info screen does show Auro-3D but no audio. Any ideas what’s going on here? Thank you.


I have no problem with this at 8.0





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