The Official Anthem AVM 60 thread - Page 4 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #91 of 10045 Old 08-12-2015, 09:46 AM
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Nick, can you confirm it only has one Sub out? Thx
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post #92 of 10045 Old 08-12-2015, 09:50 AM
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Originally Posted by stanger89 View Post
Why? External players are always light years ahead of the players built into TVs/AVRs/etc.



I guess I'd like to know what good this does?
External players don't decode FLAC or DSD any different only benefit may be the interface... I personally prefer the convenience and less clutter of having that built in to the processor. Plus in the case of DSD I rather not convert it to PCM. With new units this should also be upgradeable able via firmware.

As for THX I like the THX modes for movies and reference volume setting. Seems like a step backwards that the previous model had it and the new one will not. honestly if everything else on the processor was amazing I could do without this. I prefer better room correction to THX. Part of the reason I am looking is Integra/Onkyo dropped Audussy in favor of a in house solution that isn't up to par. Anthem ARC on the other hand would be a step up.
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post #93 of 10045 Old 08-12-2015, 10:04 AM
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Originally Posted by lexiconthx View Post
External players don't decode FLAC or DSD any different only benefit may be the interface... I personally prefer the convenience and less clutter of having that built in to the processor. Plus in the case of DSD I rather not convert it to PCM. With new units this should also be upgradeable able via firmware.
For me, once support lossless audio, the interface is the most important thing. There's still nothing that can hold a candle to J River Media Center or Squeezbox Server for managing, selecting, playing music. And while yes, you can upgrade the units, do you really think Anthem will be willing or able to keep up with development of the built in media player? I doubt it. Very, very few devices I've used get managing of music right, even some specifically designed for that purpose.

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As for THX I like the THX modes for movies and reference volume setting. Seems like a step backwards that the previous model had it and the new one will not. honestly if everything else on the processor was amazing I could do without this.
For one, remember that it looks like the price of the AVM60 looks to be on the order of 1/2 that of the AVM50V 3D. As far as reference volume setting, I see no reason to expect that 0.0dB on the AVM60 would not be reference level, with or without THX.
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post #94 of 10045 Old 08-12-2015, 10:38 AM
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Originally Posted by stanger89 View Post
For me, once support lossless audio, the interface is the most important thing. There's still nothing that can hold a candle to J River Media Center or Squeezbox Server for managing, selecting, playing music. And while yes, you can upgrade the units, do you really think Anthem will be willing or able to keep up with development of the built in media player? I doubt it. Very, very few devices I've used get managing of music right, even some specifically designed for that purpose.



For one, remember that it looks like the price of the AVM60 looks to be on the order of 1/2 that of the AVM50V 3D. As far as reference volume setting, I see no reason to expect that 0.0dB on the AVM60 would not be reference level, with or without THX.
For me those interfaces aren't worth the extra equipment. I have had no issue with the built in media player in my Integra and these formats don't change that often (I also can't see a need for a resolution higher then 24bit flac at 192khz). Also Squeezebox only supports up to 96khz 24bit...

The AVM60 is made in Vietnam vs Canada for the AVM 50... The previous generation was also upgradeable ie 40 to 50... I wonder if the AVM 60 will be upgradeable as well... So for the extra money you weren't only getting THX but a upgradeable processor. I would agree I would assume 0 is reference... I also like the THX re-eq but guess that is something they could also add as well. Like I said THX is a nice to have feature but not a deal breaker.

Looking forward to hearing/ seeing this processor don't get me wrong, Will be interesting to see how it stacks up to the Marantz though that does decode HD Audio files and has a upgrade to Auro if wanted although costs extra... Both don't have THX though... My ideal processor would have HD Audio Playblack, DTS-X and Atmos 7.1.4, Good roome correction and THX. So far I'm yet to find this...
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post #95 of 10045 Old 08-12-2015, 10:57 AM
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Originally Posted by lexiconthx View Post
24bit flac at 192khz
DTS Play-Fi supports it and was added as much for wireless IP control (app, ARC) as for streaming.

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post #96 of 10045 Old 08-12-2015, 11:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Roudan View Post
Nick, can you confirm it only has one Sub out? Thx
MRX - Two jacks, same content.
AVM - Two RCA and two XLR jacks, same content aside from voltage etc differences between single ended and balanced.
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post #97 of 10045 Old 08-12-2015, 11:02 AM
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Originally Posted by Nick @ Anthem View Post
DTS Play-Fi supports it and was added as much for wireless IP control (app, ARC) as for streaming.
Very cool I was wondering what DTS Play-Fi was This is exactly what I was looking for. IOS app interface looks great as well Thanks for the responce
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post #98 of 10045 Old 08-12-2015, 11:04 AM
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Originally Posted by DS-21 View Post
So no amp assignment, i.e. use a seven channel amp for the floor speakers and the internal amps for the heights? (Or external amps for LCR/side/front height, with internal amps for rear and rear height, etc.)
A valid desire but it would add cost and complexity moving down the model range since the two higher models have no need to deal with that level of reassignment, nor do custom installers who use 6-12 zone distribution amps for ceiling speakers (just connect two zones to the main room).

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post #99 of 10045 Old 08-12-2015, 11:29 AM
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Just have to use that 7-channel amp for the heights and LCR then. Works for me.

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post #100 of 10045 Old 08-12-2015, 04:56 PM
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Originally Posted by lexiconthx View Post
As for THX I like the THX modes for movies and reference volume setting. Seems like a step backwards that the previous model had it and the new one will not. honestly if everything else on the processor was amazing I could do without this. I prefer better room correction to THX. Part of the reason I am looking is Integra/Onkyo dropped Audussy in favor of a in house solution that isn't up to par. Anthem ARC on the other hand would be a step up.

If it sounds as good as the 50v and has ARC you won't need THX re-EQ.

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post #101 of 10045 Old 08-12-2015, 06:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lexiconthx View Post
The AVM60 is made in Vietnam vs Canada for the AVM 50... The previous generation was also upgradeable ie 40 to 50... I wonder if the AVM 60 will be upgradeable as well... So for the extra money you weren't only getting THX but a upgradeable processor. I would agree I would assume 0 is reference... I also like the THX re-eq but guess that is something they could also add as well. Like I said THX is a nice to have feature but not a deal breaker.
I don't think the 40 was upgradable to the 50, they were parallel models. And while the 30 could be upgraded to a 50, it could not be upgraded to a 50V. The 50V "upgrade" was a trade-in program. Though the 50V was upgradable to 3D (limited as it was).
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post #102 of 10045 Old 08-13-2015, 05:58 AM
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Will be interesting to hear the difference between the avm 60 and the mrx720 with a separate set of amps. Curious besides the balanced outputs how much difference there will be between the two. Upgrade to Atmos is going to be pricy for sure, going to need 4 in ceiling speakers and the new AVR/Processor... Can save some money on amps if I use the ones in the 720 to power the ceiling speakers. Looking forward to seeing these at Cedia and hopefully some new Onkyo/Integra and Denon/Marantz gear.
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post #103 of 10045 Old 08-13-2015, 05:58 AM
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the network rendering device - make it work!

Quote:
Originally Posted by lexiconthx View Post
External players ... only benefit may be the interface... I personally prefer the convenience and less clutter of having that built in to the processor. ....
Quote:
Originally Posted by stanger89 View Post
For me, ... the interface is the most important thing. There's still nothing that can hold a candle to J River Media Center or Squeezbox Server for managing, selecting, playing music... .
Quote:
Originally Posted by lexiconthx View Post
... interfaces aren't worth the extra equipment. I have had no issue with the built in media player in my Integra ...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick @ Anthem View Post
DTS Play-Fi supports it and was added as much for wireless IP control (app, ARC) as for streaming.
My personal experience is there is no single media player that fits all needs. It's rather the opposite with many players fit many needs - the plethora of different approaches to media player interfaces out in the wild is my proof

So what is really important and IMHO a good step forward is the capability to address the new Anthems as a rendering device in a DLNA enabled environment. So anybody can chose any network app or player and send the streams via IP network to the Anthem to get rendered e.g. DAC'ed.
I hope this works out really well in the end - including remote volume control.
In my view any Anthem provided/specific player interface would be superflous - also with first MRX series the integrated player wasn't really a success story and got axed for good.

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post #104 of 10045 Old 08-13-2015, 06:04 AM
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My personal experience is there is no single media player that fits all needs. It's rather the opposite with many players fit many needs - the plethora of different approaches to media player interfaces out in the wild is my proof

So what is really important and IMHO a good step forward is the capability to address the new Anthems as a rendering device in a DLNA enabled environment. So anybody can chose any network app or player and send the streams via IP network to the Anthem to get rendered e.g. DAC'ed.
I hope this works our really well in the end - including remote volume control.
In my view any Anthem provided/specific player interface would be superflous - also with first MRX series the integrated player wasn't really a success story and got axed for good.
After reading Nick's reply to my post I'm excited to see what Play-Fi has to offer in this area. For What I do mainly listening to hires stuff from HD-Tracks this looks like it is going to do the job quite nicely. I like this approach because DTS will be maintaining it and it will be on multiple platforms so they have incentive to do so. Seems like a win win to me Anthem doesn't have to design a media player and maintain it and the processor comes with a competent player that will be maintained. Looking at the DTS site the interface looks great also, works on IOS so I can still use my ipad to control it. The interface looks much better then what is in my current integra which does the job but this will be a step up.
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post #105 of 10045 Old 08-13-2015, 06:51 AM
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... I'm excited to see what Play-Fi has to offer in this area...
Just went to the Play-Fi marketing BS that is available online. I'm a little concerned they only describe taking music vom DLNA servers. There is no description that a Play-Fi app could work as a router for rendering devices and react on other DLNA players so to say. Looks like a half assed thing at the moment, but hey its marketing matereial only. It really woud be a bummer if the DTS player is mandatory for any player controls.
Hope that Anthem gets the DLNA render device right though.
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post #106 of 10045 Old 08-13-2015, 07:05 AM
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Just went to the Play-Fi marketing BS that is available online. I'm a little concerned they only describe taking music vom DLNA servers. There is no description that a Play-Fi app could work as a router for rendering devices and react on other DLNA players so to say. Looks like a half assed thing at the moment, but hey its marketing matereial only. It really woud be a bummer if the DTS player is mandatory for any player controls.
Hope that Anthem gets the DLNA render device right though.
It is still early on to tell how good it will be. From what I can tell it works similar to sonos but supports hi-res formats. Looks promising to me. Hoping they add support for apple music and Rhapsody at some point as well... For me I just need support for hi-res files off my media server, Rhapsody and apple music and it will do what I need. Check out the ios app page https://play-fi.com/apps/ios looks like a nice interface.
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post #107 of 10045 Old 08-19-2015, 10:58 AM
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So does the AVM (60) still have more horsepower than the MRX? ie more advance ARC? What I'm wondering is, assuming the price between the AVM60 and the MRX1120 are the same, what's the benefit for those of us without balanced amps? ...And very efficient speakers .
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post #108 of 10045 Old 08-19-2015, 04:49 PM
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Same DSP, slightly different audio path besides balanced output e.g. lower THD+N ADCs in AVM 60, a headphone amp since in MRX the L/R amps are also the headphone amp. The assumption that prices will be the same appears to be based on preliminary info rounded to nearest ten-thousand in Hong Kong currency and I doubt that this is how the MSRPs will play out.

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post #109 of 10045 Old 08-19-2015, 04:59 PM
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Quote:
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Hope that Anthem gets the DLNA render device right though.
DTS creates the player hardware and its control app. The Aug 13 app release notes on the Play store include the following, and when there's a new release it's usually on the Play store a bit sooner than on iTunes:

- Updated “Media Server”: We now have a broader range of compatibility with DLNA media servers for smoother playback and browsing

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post #110 of 10045 Old 08-19-2015, 06:38 PM
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Same DSP, slightly different audio path besides balanced output e.g. lower THD+N ADCs in AVM 60.
And I hope the "processor like" preamp outputs 6/12vrms ?

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post #111 of 10045 Old 08-19-2015, 09:21 PM
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Hardly any home amp puts out more than 400W which means hardly any home amp will ever use more than 2V input. 6V is for 3600W amps if 29 dB gain and 11400W amps if 34 dB gain. Our most powerful amp uses 3.2V to put out 1000W and MRX x10 pre-out goes to 3.5V. All voltages shown are RMS and all power figures are per channel into 8 ohms.

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post #112 of 10045 Old 08-20-2015, 05:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick @ Anthem View Post
Same DSP, slightly different audio path besides balanced output e.g. lower THD+N ADCs in AVM 60, a headphone amp since in MRX the L/R amps are also the headphone amp. The assumption that prices will be the same appears to be based on preliminary info rounded to nearest ten-thousand in Hong Kong currency and I doubt that this is how the MSRPs will play out.
Thanks Nick, I kind of figured it was something like that. Normally I'd go for the prepro, but I've come to realize that no matter what I think, when it comes to audio I think I'm a beer taste/campaign budget kind of person. I just don't listen to the type of content, and don't listen closely enough to the type of content, that shows "audiophile" differences. When I was first putting my HT together for real, I had... I think it was an MCA50, a few Crown XLS 602, and a Sonic Impact T-Amp. I played with all of them in my HT and honestly could not tell a difference between them. All could drive my Klipsch mains to uncomfortable volume levels, none of them imparted any sort of color to the sound that I could make out. Only real difference between them was the Crowns were terribly loud with their built-in fans. Since I was going 7.1 I ended up selling the MCA50. I'm now running an Outlaw 7125.

So when I look and see that the MRX1120 and AVM60 appear to be built on the same chassis, have the same DSP, and knowing that the better audio path is not something my ears/brain care to notice, the MRX1120 looks an awful lot like an AVM60 with free amps thrown in. Which would be quite handy considering I'd be short 4 channels in a 7.1.4 setup.
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post #113 of 10045 Old 08-20-2015, 09:23 AM
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Thanks Nick, I kind of figured it was something like that. Normally I'd go for the prepro, but I've come to realize that no matter what I think, when it comes to audio I think I'm a beer taste/campaign budget kind of person. I just don't listen to the type of content, and don't listen closely enough to the type of content, that shows "audiophile" differences. When I was first putting my HT together for real, I had... I think it was an MCA50, a few Crown XLS 602, and a Sonic Impact T-Amp. I played with all of them in my HT and honestly could not tell a difference between them. All could drive my Klipsch mains to uncomfortable volume levels, none of them imparted any sort of color to the sound that I could make out. Only real difference between them was the Crowns were terribly loud with their built-in fans. Since I was going 7.1 I ended up selling the MCA50. I'm now running an Outlaw 7125.

So when I look and see that the MRX1120 and AVM60 appear to be built on the same chassis, have the same DSP, and knowing that the better audio path is not something my ears/brain care to notice, the MRX1120 looks an awful lot like an AVM60 with free amps thrown in. Which would be quite handy considering I'd be short 4 channels in a 7.1.4 setup.
+1. In my case I wouldn't be using analog inputs or balanced outputs, so it sounds like there would be no difference in the MRX1120 and AVM60 signal processing. Based on Nick's comment on HK pricing, the MRX1120 amps probably won't be free. But unless the price delta is huge, they would certainly be a bargain. I'll need 6 of the internal amps in my setup.
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post #114 of 10045 Old 08-20-2015, 10:41 AM
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Odds are the MRX will be cheaper anyway, that's how they usually work. You pay a premium for the "better sound" (I use quotes only because to my ears/brain it's the same) on the SSP.
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post #115 of 10045 Old 08-20-2015, 12:32 PM
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^ I wouldn't bet on that unless you're referring to the MRX 720. (Has there been 11-channel amplification in an AVR before the MRX 1120?)

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post #116 of 10045 Old 08-20-2015, 02:13 PM
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^ I wouldn't bet on that unless you're referring to the MRX 720. (Has there been 11-channel amplification in an AVR before the MRX 1120?)
The Onkyo TX-NR3030 has 11 channels of amplification, but not sure what the all channels driven power rating is as they only provide 185W 1channel driven at 6ohms at 1KHz IEC.

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post #117 of 10045 Old 09-16-2015, 06:44 PM
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Quote:
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DTS creates the player hardware and its control app. The Aug 13 app release notes on the Play store include the following, and when there's a new release it's usually on the Play store a bit sooner than on iTunes:

- Updated “Media Server”: We now have a broader range of compatibility with DLNA media servers for smoother playback and browsing
Nick, can you confirm that Play-Fi works as a DLNA renderer? I would like to use it with my HTPC running JRiver as the DLNA server and the JRemote app as the controller. I don't want to be forced to use the DTS app. Could you confirm that gapless is supported (this is often an overlooked problem)? What about DSD support? Thanks.
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post #118 of 10045 Old 09-17-2015, 09:22 PM
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^ I haven't used JRiver and based on a little use with Windows Media Player, it can be used on its own (right-click file, Send To, Play-Fi device). fyi, the Play-Fi app supports 24/176.4 and 24/192 wav and flac. There are gaps when playing from a phone, I haven't checked from a computer, and I don't know of plans to add DSD support. Releases are ongoing - the latest changes from two days ago as shown in the Play store, noting that this app release also updates the hardware:

- Spotify Multi-Room! You can now create Spotify groups of multiple speakers within the DTS Play-Fi app, which can be selected in the Spotify app for playback.

- Hardware volume controls can be used on lock screen (Android Lollipop user only).

- Additional streaming and playback improvements.

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^ I haven't used JRiver and based on a little use with Windows Media Player, it can be used on its own (right-click file, Send To, Play-Fi device). fyi, the Play-Fi app supports 24/176.4 and 24/192 wav and flac. There are gaps when playing from a phone, I haven't checked from a computer, and I don't know of plans to add DSD support. Releases are ongoing - the latest changes from two days ago as shown in the Play store, noting that this app release also updates the hardware:

- Spotify Multi-Room! You can now create Spotify groups of multiple speakers within the DTS Play-Fi app, which can be selected in the Spotify app for playback.

- Hardware volume controls can be used on lock screen (Android Lollipop user only).

- Additional streaming and playback improvements.
I could easily live without DSD support but if they don't have gapless playback then streaming would be almost useless. Let's hope they get this right. A lack of gapless support was fairly common in many DLNA renderers just a few years ago. It's my understanding that if the renderer does not have the correct supportive hardware then software updates will not be able to solve the problem.
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post #120 of 10045 Old 09-28-2015, 01:19 PM - Thread Starter
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Nick, any news when we will see the new line up and pricing? I am looking at making a change!
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