*Official* Marantz 2015 NR-1506/1606, SR-5010/6010/7010 & AV7702mkII owner's thread - Page 373 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #11161 of 12466 Old 09-03-2018, 02:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guerojose View Post
Update just went live for NR1606.



(Arizona)



Version: 4400-6451-4002

DTS: 3.90.50.00



Onward to testing, woo-hoo.


Glad you got it. Looks like Marantz is reversing the order of the models getting the update from what they did for the 2016 models so I will probably have to wait a bit for my 7010.


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post #11162 of 12466 Old 09-03-2018, 02:59 AM
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Just curious is there a big difference between the Dolby or neuralX upmixer? What exactly do they add? I never noticed anything when I had a 5.1 setup but now that I moved to a 5.1.2 Atmos setup yesterday I see it enables some sort of emulation for the Atmos/height channels. Is it just basically to enable your extra channels when playing a source with less than what you have?


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post #11163 of 12466 Old 09-03-2018, 04:30 AM
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NR1606 Changelog

Quote:
Originally Posted by guerojose View Post
Update just went live for NR1606.

(Arizona)

Version: 4400-6451-4002
DTS: 3.90.50.00

Onward to testing, woo-hoo.
Live in the UK

Dolby Vision worked first time
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post #11164 of 12466 Old 09-03-2018, 05:23 AM
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Originally Posted by flyinion View Post
Just curious is there a big difference between the Dolby or neuralX upmixer? What exactly do they add? I never noticed anything when I had a 5.1 setup but now that I moved to a 5.1.2 Atmos setup yesterday I see it enables some sort of emulation for the Atmos/height channels. Is it just basically to enable your extra channels when playing a source with less than what you have?


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The Dolby Surround and the DTS Neural X upmixers send discreet signals to any Dolby Atmos or DTS:X height speakers you may have when playing a soundtrack that is just floor based. They try to simulate a Dolby Atmos or DTS:X soundtrack and , in my experience, can be very effective.

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post #11165 of 12466 Old 09-03-2018, 05:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flyinion View Post
Just curious is there a big difference between the Dolby or neuralX upmixer? What exactly do they add? I never noticed anything when I had a 5.1 setup but now that I moved to a 5.1.2 Atmos setup yesterday I see it enables some sort of emulation for the Atmos/height channels. Is it just basically to enable your extra channels when playing a source with less than what you have?


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In addition to my last post I should have said that played with the Marantz AVR DTS Neural X seems to be favoured because it is a little stronger to the upper speakers. However I also have an Arcam AVR 850 and find with that the Dolby Surround mode beats the DTS Neural X.

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post #11166 of 12466 Old 09-03-2018, 05:50 AM
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Originally Posted by alexbarbel View Post
In addition to my last post I should have said that played with the Marantz AVR DTS Neural X seems to be favoured because it is a little stronger to the upper speakers.:
More than a little stronger, audibly more activity in the upper speakers with Neural:X.
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post #11167 of 12466 Old 09-03-2018, 06:28 AM
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Why are the people who paid more (7010) getting it last? That’s messed up to me honestly. It’s more of a principle issue in my eyes.
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post #11168 of 12466 Old 09-03-2018, 06:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Csbooth View Post
Why are the people who paid more (7010) getting it last? That’s messed up to me honestly. It’s more of a principle issue in my eyes.


Marantz released the 7011 and 6011 updates first when they updated the 2016 models last September. Don’t know why they reversed it this time. If they keep the same schedule our 7010s should get in about a week.
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post #11169 of 12466 Old 09-03-2018, 07:56 AM
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Originally Posted by vsorgi View Post
Marantz released the 7011 and 6011 updates first when they updated the 2016 models last September. Don’t know why they reversed it this time. If they keep the same schedule our 7010s should get in about a week.
Yeah who the hell knows what they are doing? They started on the Marantz and never finished the Denon line so the 4200 and 6200 owners are still waiting too. My guess is there are simply more owners of the lower models and the higher models are the minority which is why they have historically released both brands higher models together vs 2 at a time for the lower models. I can be completely wrong but that is my guess and for whatever reason they have chose not to do it the same this time.

Gonna really sting if the 4200 and 6200 owners gotta wait if they do end up releasing it with the higher Marantz models last. Doesn't really make any sense to me but only Denon knows their reasons.

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post #11170 of 12466 Old 09-03-2018, 08:15 AM
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That's good to hear.

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post #11171 of 12466 Old 09-03-2018, 08:41 AM
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USA 6010 & 7010 - nothing yet

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post #11172 of 12466 Old 09-03-2018, 08:50 AM
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If they did the 1506 and 5010 then the 1606 and 6010 are probably next in another 10 days or so followed by the higher models of both brands last 10-12 days after that. That seams to be the pattern.

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post #11173 of 12466 Old 09-03-2018, 08:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cdx47 View Post
More than a little stronger, audibly more activity in the upper speakers with Neural:X.
Yes, that's another way of putting it.
I do find it strange though that with my Arcam AVR 850 the DTS Neural X upmixer is more behind the Dolby Surround mixer. Much more so than the Doly is behind the DTS on the Marantz 7010.

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post #11174 of 12466 Old 09-03-2018, 09:27 AM
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Originally Posted by aKa DaShiznit View Post
If they did the 1506 and 5010 then the 1606 and 6010 are probably next in another 10 days or so followed by the higher models of both brands last 10-12 days after that. That seams to be the pattern.
1606 already updated. I don’t think we have had any reports on the 1506 yet.
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post #11175 of 12466 Old 09-03-2018, 09:58 AM
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Originally Posted by BuGsArEtAsTy View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by aKa DaShiznit View Post
If they did the 1506 and 5010 then the 1606 and 6010 are probably next in another 10 days or so followed by the higher models of both brands last 10-12 days after that. That seams to be the pattern.
1606 already updated. I don’t think we have had any reports on the 1506 yet.
That must be included as I can’t imagine they’d skip over it. Denon started with the 710, 910 and 1200. Then the 2200 and 3200 so that would mean the 6010 and 7010 would be next. Is there an 8010? Or hopefully the 6010, 7010 and whatever processor will be next with the 4200 and 6200. But at this point who knows? Lol

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post #11176 of 12466 Old 09-03-2018, 11:12 AM
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Originally Posted by aKa DaShiznit View Post
That must be included as I can’t imagine they’d skip over it. Denon started with the 710, 910 and 1200. Then the 2200 and 3200 so that would mean the 6010 and 7010 would be next. Is there an 8010? Or hopefully the 6010, 7010 and whatever processor will be next with the 4200 and 6200. But at this point who knows? Lol
Yes, it's quite possible the 1506 update was already released, but nobody has reported that yet.

Then again, last year the 7703 and 7011 were released together, and the 1607, 5011, and 6011 were all released together on a different date (after the 7703 and 7011). (There was no 1507 model.)

In contrast, so far we only have reports of the 1606 and 5010 available. The 6010 and 7010 didn't get updates, and we have no reports on the 1506.

So, clearly the update schedule has changed compared to 2017 for whatever reasons.

But all in all, things are coming along nicely. I'd expect all the updates for both Denon and Marantz to be available within a week or two.
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post #11177 of 12466 Old 09-03-2018, 12:09 PM
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....so far we only have reports of the 1606 and 5010 available....
blah blah blah 1606 blah blah blah
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post #11178 of 12466 Old 09-03-2018, 12:16 PM
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blah blah blah 1606 blah blah blah
Yeah, the 1606 is a nice little receiver.

I'm surprised these slim receivers aren't more popular in places like Toronto, given the huge boom in construction of tiny condos. It's not just that the slimness helps to save space in small entertainment consoles, but also that many people in these small condos don't need ultra powerful amplifiers.

I'd like it even better if it were shorter than its 4.1 inches, although I understand it'd be harder to cram the amplifiers in there.
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post #11179 of 12466 Old 09-03-2018, 12:22 PM
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Yeah, the 1606 is a nice little receiver.

I'm surprised these slim receivers aren't more popular in places like Toronto, given the huge boom in construction of tiny condos. It's not just that the slimness helps to save space in small entertainment consoles, but also that many people in these small condos don't need ultra powerful amplifiers.

I'd like it even better if it were shorter than its 4.1 inches, although I understand it'd be harder to cram the amplifiers in there.
A little surprised myself. It hits reference volume no problem but I can never play it higher than about -20db (or around -15 for Disney)

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post #11180 of 12466 Old 09-03-2018, 01:05 PM
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Yes, it's quite possible the 1506 update was already released, but nobody has reported that yet.

Then again, last year the 7703 and 7011 were released together, and the 1607, 5011, and 6011 were all released together on a different date (after the 7703 and 7011). (There was no 1507 model.)

In contrast, so far we only have reports of the 1606 and 5010 available. The 6010 and 7010 didn't get updates, and we have no reports on the 1506.

So, clearly the update schedule has changed compared to 2017 for whatever reasons.

But all in all, things are coming along nicely. I'd expect all the updates for both Denon and Marantz to be available within a week or two.
I hope so too as we are 12 days between updates right now. Not sure whether the update actually released yesterday or today so if there are 2 more rounds of updates, one of them isn't making the Summer, technically speaking. Is there a chance the 1506 isn't going to get the update? I think the Denon 510 did just the 710 and up.

If they usually do the 7702, 7010, 6200, and 4200 together then thats one update but where does the 6010 fall in then? It's own? That's why I think the 1506 and 6010 are next followed by the other 4. Oh well I guess theres no figuring it out and anything can happen at this point but we shall see.

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post #11181 of 12466 Old 09-03-2018, 01:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aKa DaShiznit View Post
I hope so too as we are 12 days between updates right now. Not sure whether the update actually released yesterday or today so if there are 2 more rounds of updates, one of them isn't making the Summer, technically speaking. Is there a chance the 1506 isn't going to get the update? I think the Denon 510 did just the 710 and up.

If they usually do the 7702, 7010, 6200, and 4200 together then thats one update but where does the 6010 fall in then? It's own? That's why I think the 1506 and 6010 are next followed by the other 4. Oh well I guess theres no figuring it out and anything can happen at this point but we shall see.
Last year the Marantz receivers were done in two batches, not three.

The 510 isn't a networked device, so there's that. All the updated 2015 models were networked devices.

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post #11182 of 12466 Old 09-03-2018, 01:40 PM
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Yes, that's another way of putting it.
I do find it strange though that with my Arcam AVR 850 the DTS Neural X upmixer is more behind the Dolby Surround mixer. Much more so than the Doly is behind the DTS on the Marantz 7010.
That makes no sense. I'm not aware of Dolby updating/upgrading their DSU for newer models so that it does more than it ever did. Surely, some of the usual suspects on here would have been all over that, if it were the case.

I do find, however, what is "better" is always subjective. I find DSU sounds better with many music programs because it's clearer and closer to stereo. Shoving too much into the overheads can provide blurry, uneven weird sound for music programs (as opposed to airplanes where you'd want them there).

I was playing with multi-channel stereo mode last night on the 7010. I found the OPTION button to adjust the speaker levels worked similarly to my Yamaha's ability to tailor multi-channel stereo levels to my liking. After changing most of the surround levels (and enabling the height channels), it sounded FANTASTIC, an extension of regular stereo with out-of-phase info appearing in a 180 degree arc regularly (similar to Sonic Holography with 2-channel in the MLP) and some sounds from behind and around, all without steering. I then matched regular stereo/sub levels to match and found it to sound the same, but without the surrounding extension of out-of-phase information. The problem is that those option changed levels are for EVERYTHING (all surround modes) for a given input. Fortunately, you can save the levels and input and everything in a Smart Select button. This then gives me a "Music" Stereo/Multi-channel stereo mode and a "Movie" mode for the same primary device (in this case an NVidia Shield running KODI).

I will say that Yamaha did this in a more intelligent manner in that you could modify the specific surround modes for channel levels (i.e. multi-channel stereo lets you change the center, sides, rear, etc. for that mode to use with music from ANY source and yet does not interfere with the proper levels for multi-channel driven sound like movies or TV shows. It's almost mind-boggling that Marantz would think you'd want all surround channels at 100% for multi-channel stereo (ridiculous sounding at any volume and subwoofer levels shrink accordingly with every channel outputting the same signal with 80Hz cut-out bass so the sub level MUST come UP to match all those channels, etc. It only makes sense to match each mode to the speakers rather than match all speaker settings to ALL MODES regardless. Thank goodness for the smart select buttons or it would be useless.

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post #11183 of 12466 Old 09-03-2018, 02:39 PM
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That makes no sense. I'm not aware of Dolby updating/upgrading their DSU for newer models so that it does more than it ever did. Surely, some of the usual suspects on here would have been all over that, if it were the case.

I do find, however, what is "better" is always subjective.
I find DSU sounds better with many music programs because it's clearer and closer to stereo. Shoving too much into the overheads can provide blurry, uneven weird sound for music programs (as opposed to airplanes where you'd want them there).

I was playing with multi-channel stereo mode last night on the 7010. I found the OPTION button to adjust the speaker levels worked similarly to my Yamaha's ability to tailor multi-channel stereo levels to my liking. After changing most of the surround levels (and enabling the height channels), it sounded FANTASTIC, an extension of regular stereo with out-of-phase info appearing in a 180 degree arc regularly (similar to Sonic Holography with 2-channel in the MLP) and some sounds from behind and around, all without steering. I then matched regular stereo/sub levels to match and found it to sound the same, but without the surrounding extension of out-of-phase information. The problem is that those option changed levels are for EVERYTHING (all surround modes) for a given input. Fortunately, you can save the levels and input and everything in a Smart Select button. This then gives me a "Music" Stereo/Multi-channel stereo mode and a "Movie" mode for the same primary device (in this case an NVidia Shield running KODI).

I will say that Yamaha did this in a more intelligent manner in that you could modify the specific surround modes for channel levels (i.e. multi-channel stereo lets you change the center, sides, rear, etc. for that mode to use with music from ANY source and yet does not interfere with the proper levels for multi-channel driven sound like movies or TV shows. It's almost mind-boggling that Marantz would think you'd want all surround channels at 100% for multi-channel stereo (ridiculous sounding at any volume and subwoofer levels shrink accordingly with every channel outputting the same signal with 80Hz cut-out bass so the sub level MUST come UP to match all those channels, etc. It only makes sense to match each mode to the speakers rather than match all speaker settings to ALL MODES regardless. Thank goodness for the smart select buttons or it would be useless.
It is odd, but it is true, that with the Arcam and the Marantz the two sound modes behave , and sound, very different. When the Marantz was my primary receiver I always used DTS Neural X. Now that the Arcam is my primary receiver I use exclusively Dolby surround. I am not suggesting that anything has been changed but I just put it down to the way the two receivers handle things. In that respect I have to say that in my room, which I would class as very challenging due to sloping attic ceilings, the Arcam is streets ahead (and then some) of the Marantz when it comes to rendering an Atmos /DTS:X soundtrack. If I hadn't heard it's superiority for myself I would not have believed it. The two are miles apart. Where the Marantz does score higher than the Arcam is in it's configurability. I do miss those SMART buttons.

You are very right when you say "better" is very subjective. As I always say "Beauty is in the eye of the beholder".

LG 77C8 (UK) - Arcam AVR 850 - Arcam FMJ P7 - 7.2.4 Atmos setup.
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post #11184 of 12466 Old 09-03-2018, 03:22 PM
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SR5010 update is available (WV US). Updating now.

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post #11185 of 12466 Old 09-03-2018, 06:36 PM
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SR5010 update is available (WV US). Updating now.
It was available as of late yesterday actually.

Welcome to the Dolby Vision club!
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post #11186 of 12466 Old 09-03-2018, 06:42 PM
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It was available as of late yesterday actually.

Welcome to the Dolby Vision club!
My QLED doesn't have Dolby Vision and my projector isn't even 4K. I guess I'll have to be happy with being a member of the Colecovision club. Your vision is our vision--Colecovision!

Click THEATER (Updated: Nov-12-2019) for pics: Epson 3100 3D Projector, DaLite 92" screen, 11.1.6 (Marantz SR7012 + Yamaha HTR-5960 + Onkyo ESPro) - Dialog Lift - PSB T45/B15/S50/X1T/CS500 Speakers & Def Tech PF-1500 15" sub; 2nd Room (Updated Apr-22-2019): 48" Plasma TV, Carver AL-III, Carver C-5 Pre-Amp, Technics SH-AC500D, Dual Carver TFM-35x Amps (Active Bi-Amp), Klipsch Surrounds ; Sources: PS4, LG UP875 UHD, Nvidia Shield (KODI), ATV4K, Zidoo X9S, LD, GameCube : Props (Updated 3-24-20)
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post #11187 of 12466 Old 09-03-2018, 06:56 PM
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BTW, this update does nothing for my Atmos lip sync issue with Netflix on my TV over ARC.

However, for that I put the blame on the Netflix app, and its implementation on my TV. For some reason, it is not bit streamed. For DD+ and Atmos, it would appear the audio is converted to PCM and then transmitted to the receiver, but this adds audio delay, thereby causing lip sync issues. There are no lip sync issues over optical, but that's just the old school Dolby Digital 5.1, bit streamed and processed by the Marantz.

I suspect if they simply bit streamed DD+ and Atmos, this wouldn't be a problem.

---

It's fixed, with Auto Lip Sync. (Not sure if it's because I didn't set it up right the first time I tried it (before the update) or if this firmware update fixed Auto Lip Sync. I assume it's because I just didn't set it up right since the firmware didn't mention anything about lip sync.)

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post #11188 of 12466 Old 09-03-2018, 10:13 PM
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BTW, this update does nothing for my Atmos lip sync issue with Netflix on my TV over ARC.

However, for that I put the blame on the Netflix app, and its implementation on my TV. For some reason, it is not bit streamed. For DD+ and Atmos, it would appear the audio is converted to PCM and then transmitted to the receiver, but this adds audio delay, thereby causing lip sync issues. There are no lip sync issues over optical, but that's just the old school Dolby Digital 5.1, bit streamed and processed by the Marantz.

I suspect if they simply bit streamed DD+ and Atmos, this wouldn't be a problem.
You could use another display device (e.g. FireTV 4K, NVidia Shield, AppleTV 4K, etc.) which might solve your lip-sync issue. Netflix works perfectly fine here with any of those devices (obviously my projector doesn't have apps). I did have problems trying to do ARC with DD+ on a QLED using the internal app at a family member's house that also has one. The receiver didn't want to recognize DD+ over ARC for some reason (I had to switch inputs on the receiver back and forth to get the audio to play whereas DD regular output from the QLED had no such issue, but then she only has a 5.1 speaker setup so it didn't matter there).

Click THEATER (Updated: Nov-12-2019) for pics: Epson 3100 3D Projector, DaLite 92" screen, 11.1.6 (Marantz SR7012 + Yamaha HTR-5960 + Onkyo ESPro) - Dialog Lift - PSB T45/B15/S50/X1T/CS500 Speakers & Def Tech PF-1500 15" sub; 2nd Room (Updated Apr-22-2019): 48" Plasma TV, Carver AL-III, Carver C-5 Pre-Amp, Technics SH-AC500D, Dual Carver TFM-35x Amps (Active Bi-Amp), Klipsch Surrounds ; Sources: PS4, LG UP875 UHD, Nvidia Shield (KODI), ATV4K, Zidoo X9S, LD, GameCube : Props (Updated 3-24-20)
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post #11189 of 12466 Old 09-04-2018, 02:14 AM
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Just pulled the trigger on a 2018 LG B8 OLED and could not remember if the 6010's received the Dolby Vision update. I'll be waiting patiently for the update which hopefully comes around the time I take delivery of my new display.
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post #11190 of 12466 Old 09-04-2018, 05:56 AM
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CEC still whack

Sadly, the NR1606 update did nothing to fix the CEC problem I have with the B6P OLED. Even though HDMI Control is off, the damn amp still powers up when I turn the TV on. People say the LG implementation is the problem, but there seems equal blame to me. Somehow, in order to have ARC and passthru, the Marantz isn't ignoring the CEC signal the LG insists on sending. I even resorted to making a mangled-pin-13 cable, but that breaks ARC also.

I really fear eARC will be no better, simply because these manufacturers don't seem to understand that features should be discreet, and that you may not ALWAYS wish to do a certain thing.
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