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-   -   Denon AVR-x2200w vs Onkyo TX-NR646 (https://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-receivers-amps-processors/2263954-denon-avr-x2200w-vs-onkyo-tx-nr646.html)

soapboxpreacher 12-28-2015 07:43 AM

Denon AVR-x2200w vs Onkyo TX-NR646
 
So I am in the market for a new AV receiver and these two fit my budget. I currently have a Denon 2311ci that just lacks some features and I am looking to start building my 4K setup so the 2311ci will be on eBay shortly. My room is 18x18 with 8' ceilings. I currently have a 5.1 setup consisting over front klipsch reference 5.3I believe and kilpsch dipole 4.3 in the rear with an rc10 center. I also have a rythmik 12 port sub. My 2311ci is rated for 130 watts x7. I am first concerned that the x2200 might be under powered. But I like the feature set tremendously. I do like to turn it up some but not over board when we watch movies. It is purely a tv/movie setup, no music. I am planning on adding some ceiling speakers as well for my sides. I am trying to keep my expenses for the receiver under 700. The denon is on sale for 599 and the Onkyo is the same. The Onkyo is rated for 5 watts more. Power isn't as my driving factor as much as sound quality, sorround quality and 4K. I sorround fields and fullness, imaging and so on are my main points. Back in the day when I bought my 2311 I had a pioneer 1123k I tested along side the 2311 as well as a Yamaha and the denon clearly had the better fuller sound, better imaging, better dialogue and better fuller bass. So the other went back. Let me know what you guys think. Or if I should consider something else. Dts X/atoms seems like it would be wise to have considering my speaker layout with the two side ceiling so I believe I should be looking at units that support it. Once again let me know. Hope I gave you guys enough info. Thanks.

jdsmoothie 12-28-2015 08:08 AM

Power difference between the three models will be moot, although the 2311CI is rated at 105W/2CH and the 646 is rated at 100W/2CH and the X2200W is rated at 95W/2CH. The X2200W uses the same version of Audyssey as does your 2311CI which is likely to provide better audio quality than ACCUEQ on the Onkyo.

soapboxpreacher 12-28-2015 10:15 AM

thanks jdsmoothie, so it seems like you like the X2200W better. Considering the price is equal (because of the sale) the denon to me seems like a better option. I can get the Onkyo 838 for the same as the X2200W as well but it is last years model, has no DTS:X but does have power and a better block/transformer. But I do like the DAC on the 646. Seems like onkyo has stepped up their game! The 192K/24 Bit DACs Burr-Brown is on the 838 and the 646 has a 384 kHz/32-bit Hi-Grade DAC Asahi Kasei AKM4458. What does denon use for their DAC?

jdsmoothie 12-28-2015 10:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by soapboxpreacher (Post 40097378)
thanks jdsmoothie, so it seems like you like the X2200W better. Considering the price is equal (because of the sale) the denon to me seems like a better option. I can get the Onkyo 838 for the same as the X2200W as well but it is last years model, has no DTS:X but does have power and a better block/transformer. But I do like the DAC on the 646. Seems like onkyo has stepped up their game! The 192K/24 Bit DACs Burr-Brown is on the 838 and the 646 has a 384 kHz/32-bit Hi-Grade DAC Asahi Kasei AKM4458. What does denon use for their DAC?

Depends on the model. On the X3200W and lower models, AFAIK, 192K/24 bit PCM 1690.

nohcho 12-28-2015 10:53 AM

Denon AVR-x2200w vs Onkyo TX-NR646
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by soapboxpreacher (Post 40097378)
thanks jdsmoothie, so it seems like you like the X2200W better. Considering the price is equal (because of the sale) the denon to me seems like a better option. I can get the Onkyo 838 for the same as the X2200W as well but it is last years model, has no DTS:X but does have power and a better block/transformer. But I do like the DAC on the 646. Seems like onkyo has stepped up their game! The 192K/24 Bit DACs Burr-Brown is on the 838 and the 646 has a 384 kHz/32-bit Hi-Grade DAC Asahi Kasei AKM4458. What does denon use for their DAC?


Keep in mind that jd smoothie is heavily on Denon's side, in fact that is the only thing (and marantz) he ever recommends.

That being said, 646 has higher grade DAC, a little more robust amp section, both will have atmos and dts x. 646 is a purely pass through only avr so no upscaling of any sort. The smart phone app on onkyo is much better than what denon has going on. Two year warranty vs three on x2200. Onkyo has alot more music app built in for online listening like shazam deezer and Tune in which x2200 lacks.


X2200 has a lower grade dac so higher dsd files are a no go, it has audyssey xt, which is better than accueq, has hdcp 2.2 on all inputs vs three on 646. Three year warranty vs two on 646. X2200 has an analog upscaling as well as hdmi upscaling, atmos and dts x.


Hopefully this will help you make a decision.


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nohcho 12-28-2015 11:03 AM

Denon AVR-x2200w vs Onkyo TX-NR646
 
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Prime316 12-28-2015 11:22 AM

I have also been looking at these two receivers. I have an Onkyo 809 right now (going out for repairs) so I'm used to Audyssey XT. From what I've read, the 646 no longer has Audyssey but the X2200 does. I don't really do a lot of music streaming. I am watching movies 97% of the time. As recently as last night, I was going to forgo Atmos and maybe I will....all depends on watch DTS:X does. I believe both receiver have access to both.


I will be ordering one of the two within the next hour. Anymore input?

jdsmoothie 12-28-2015 11:50 AM

Either model gives you the option of Atmos and DTS:X 5.2.2, but the X2200W has the Audyssey MultEQ XT. ;)

Prime316 12-28-2015 01:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jdsmoothie (Post 40100082)
Either model gives you the option of Atmos and DTS:X 5.2.2, but the X2200W has the Audyssey MultEQ XT. ;)


I would like to stay with Onkyo and I guess I am by keeping my 809 (once it's fixed) but I'm am rather suspicious about their move to save money by dropping Audyssey which I happen to like. I'm not sure how well their new room correction works. I'm used to XT and maybe it's time to switch it up a little. I placed my order for the X2200.

soapboxpreacher 12-28-2015 09:12 PM

I ended up grabbing an Onkyo 747 as well as a Denon X2200W. Gonna hook them both up and the victor stays! Was able to find both for a very reasonable price. X2200W was 599 and the 747 I got for 639...open box.

nohcho 12-28-2015 09:15 PM

Let us know which one wins

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pooter03 12-30-2015 09:17 AM

I'm in the same position. Upgrading an older Onkyo and am waffling between the 646 and the Denon x220W. This is primarily for movies and games, not music. I'm leaning Onkyo, but the Denon is looking better and better.

jdsmoothie 12-30-2015 09:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by soapboxpreacher (Post 40116858)
I ended up grabbing an Onkyo 747 as well as a Denon X2200W. Gonna hook them both up and the victor stays! Was able to find both for a very reasonable price. X2200W was 599 and the 747 I got for 639...open box.

Denon has reduced the MSRP on the X2200W from $799 to $599 thru this Saturday. :)

pooter03 12-30-2015 10:30 AM

I decided to stick with what I know and ended up getting the Onkyo 646. It arrives on Saturday.

DrewB 12-30-2015 09:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pooter03 (Post 40158746)
I decided to stick with what I know and ended up getting the Onkyo 646. It arrives on Saturday.

Where from?

jplyman325 12-30-2015 10:40 PM

Sign up for Fry's promo code and if your local Fry's has the X3200 you can pick it up for $499 plus tax - I was looking at the X2200 or the Marantz SR5009 from A4L until I found out about this sale - i'm now enjoying my new X3200

spieg 12-30-2015 10:58 PM

A little late to the game here but I had always been an Onkyo fan. I went from a 505 to a 709 to a 646. After having the 646 for a little while, I really missed audyssey. AccuEQ was horrible for me. If you value room correction at all, its a no brainer in my opinion. I ended up jumping to an x4200w almost solely based on xt32. I definitely preferred the bluetooth implementation in the Onkyo, but other than that, I like everything about the Denon better. I realize that the 646 to the 4200 isnt really a fair comparison, but accueq was so horrible for me I wont own another Onkyo until they do something different/better. My 646 has been relegated to music duty in the basement for now.

nohcho 12-31-2015 12:08 AM

X4200 is a solid piece of equipment, enjoy

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pooter03 12-31-2015 06:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DrewB (Post 40177274)
Where from?

Amazon for $527. I had $50 in rewards and used a credit card that gave 10% cash back, so it was a decent deal. They even threw in a free copy of Kung Fu Panda. :)

jsb75 12-31-2015 07:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spieg (Post 40178970)
A little late to the game here but I had always been an Onkyo fan. I went from a 505 to a 709 to a 646. After having the 646 for a little while, I really missed audyssey. AccuEQ was horrible for me. If you value room correction at all, its a no brainer in my opinion. I ended up jumping to an x4200w almost solely based on xt32. I definitely preferred the bluetooth implementation in the Onkyo, but other than that, I like everything about the Denon better. I realize that the 646 to the 4200 isnt really a fair comparison, but accueq was so horrible for me I wont own another Onkyo until they do something different/better. My 646 has been relegated to music duty in the basement for now.

What was the problem with accueq? Wrong distance and such or just sounded like crap? Also is there a manual eq on the 646?

Prime316 12-31-2015 10:16 AM

I also left Onkyo behind for A Denon unit this time because of the lack of audyssey but it seems that even though the Denon has the same version that my Onkyo 800 has that it does not have the same capabilities.

spieg 12-31-2015 10:26 AM

1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by jsb75 (Post 40183890)
What was the problem with accueq? Wrong distance and such or just sounded like crap? Also is there a manual eq on the 646?

I dont want to give the wrong impression, its still a good receiver. It set distance and levels ok, but that's basically all it does. As far as flattening out response, it actually made some peaks worse in my room. It does offer manual EQ, but from memory I think you are only allowed 8 frequencies, and there isn't much granularity. Almost nothing on the low end. If room correction doesnt matter to someone, it's got a solid feature set. But if you value room correction, accueq is enough reason in and of itself to look elsewhere in my opinion. Here's a graph of accueq(orange line) vs audyssey(blue line; audyssey reference curve) in my room. I ran them back to back with the 646 and then the 4200. These are averages of my LCR+Sub.

Prime316 12-31-2015 11:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by soapboxpreacher (Post 40116858)
I ended up grabbing an Onkyo 747 as well as a Denon X2200W. Gonna hook them both up and the victor stays! Was able to find both for a very reasonable price. X2200W was 599 and the 747 I got for 639...open box.


And the winner is?

jsb75 12-31-2015 12:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spieg (Post 40189194)
I dont want to give the wrong impression, its still a good receiver. It set distance and levels ok, but that's basically all it does. As far as flattening out response, it actually made some peaks worse in my room. It does offer manual EQ, but from memory I think you are only allowed 8 frequencies, and there isn't much granularity. Almost nothing on the low end. If room correction doesnt matter to someone, it's got a solid feature set. But if you value room correction, accueq is enough reason in and of itself to look elsewhere in my opinion. Here's a graph of accueq(orange line) vs audyssey(blue line; audyssey reference curve) in my room. I ran them back to back with the 646 and then the 4200. These are averages of my LCR+Sub.

Thanks for the reply. Been trying to find out any info on accueq now that it eq's the fronts and sub. Guess it's just as crappy as last years

DrewB 12-31-2015 03:45 PM

I was just starting to settle on the 646 and now it sounds like Accueq is even worse than mcacc. guess it's now time to look at Denons.

jsb75 12-31-2015 04:55 PM

Yeah, I was leaning towards the 646 also. Might wait to see what the 2016 crop of receivers have to offer

spieg 12-31-2015 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jsb75 (Post 40201266)
Yeah, I was leaning towards the 646 also. Might wait to see what the 2016 crop of receivers have to offer

Since you're in GR, if you decide you want the 646 send me a PM. I know where you can get a good deal on a very lightly used one. ;)

soapboxpreacher 01-03-2016 06:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prime316 (Post 40190834)
And the winner is?

The x2200w just showed up late yesterday and the Onkyo is scheduled for tomorrow. Gonna get the denon in this afternoon. Will let you guys know.

soapboxpreacher 01-03-2016 06:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prime316 (Post 40190834)
And the winner is?

The x2200w just showed up late yesterday and the Onkyo is scheduled for tomorrow. Gonna get the denon in this afternoon. Will let you guys know.

jsb75 01-05-2016 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by soapboxpreacher (Post 40263010)
The x2200w just showed up late yesterday and the Onkyo is scheduled for tomorrow. Gonna get the denon in this afternoon. Will let you guys know.

So how do they sound?


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