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post #2041 of 3952 Old 06-08-2016, 04:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Movie78 View Post
DTS:X could be slow, but we have been waiting for years for you to purchase an immersive audio equipment.
And there those of us who have, and are still waiting for DTS/Denon to pull their fingers out and release the DTS:X firmware "later in 2015".

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post #2042 of 3952 Old 06-08-2016, 06:13 PM
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Originally Posted by vollans View Post
And there those of us who have, and are still waiting for DTS/Denon to pull their fingers out and release the DTS:X firmware "later in 2015".
There are a lot of us still waiting!
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post #2043 of 3952 Old 06-08-2016, 06:20 PM
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Let's hope they don't scam us and only put the update into the 2016 models..
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post #2044 of 3952 Old 06-08-2016, 06:23 PM
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If they do, it'd actually be quite good; instant refund from my credit card for goods not being as ordered, and then I could buy a 2016 model of something that already has it.

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post #2045 of 3952 Old 06-08-2016, 07:40 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CBdicX View Post
Think i am the only one on the planet, but can DTS:X (Neural) do a down mix to 2.1.2 like Dolby Surround and Atmos will do ?
Hi CB,

I've read your earlier posts on this subject; it is very rare indeed a 2.1.2 setup and you did mention that it works with Dolby Surround up-mixer but not with DTS Neural:X - Manni had a reply that I thought was the best: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-rec...l#post44561289

You are the first person on the planet who is experimenting with a 2.1.2 immersive audio setup, from my very restricted readings on DTS:X and its upmixer in that type of setup with only two main channels (Stereo Left and Right), and two overheads (plus the sub).
Perhaps the definitive answer is with the DTS:X developer people? Did you consider emailing them, and then relate to us what you learn from them?

Cheers,
Bob

* BONUS: http://www.highdefdigest.com/news/sh...sneuralx/32382

Last edited by NorthSky; 06-08-2016 at 07:44 PM.
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post #2046 of 3952 Old 06-08-2016, 09:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthSky View Post
Hi CB,

I've read your earlier posts on this subject; it is very rare indeed a 2.1.2 setup and you did mention that it works with Dolby Surround up-mixer but not with DTS Neural:X - Manni had a reply that I thought was the best: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-rec...l#post44561289

You are the first person on the planet who is experimenting with a 2.1.2 immersive audio setup, from my very restricted readings on DTS:X and its upmixer in that type of setup with only two main channels (Stereo Left and Right), and two overheads (plus the sub).
Perhaps the definitive answer is with the DTS:X developer people? Did you consider emailing them, and then relate to us what you learn from them?

Cheers,
Bob

* BONUS: http://www.highdefdigest.com/news/sh...sneuralx/32382
Hi Bob,
I am doing what Manni suggested, the incoming signal is Multi channel, it only needs to be down mixed to 2.1.2
He thinks i am using a stereo signal and then go to stereo + Heights, but its not up mixing, its down mixing.
Even his tip for 4.1.2 will not work, DTS seems also in "need" of a center, so the setup has a minimum of 5.1, then Heights will be addet.
Very stange that both Dolby an Auro can do this "stereo" immersive down mix trick of Multi Channel to 2.1.2, not DTS.
Even with 2.1.2 Dolby shows Dolby Atmos (with Atmos content) in the display


I mailed DTS 2 days ago, no relpy yet........

Last edited by CBdicX; 06-08-2016 at 09:38 PM.
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post #2047 of 3952 Old 06-08-2016, 10:30 PM
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FYI
If you don't use a centre speaker, you can't activiate Neural X..
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post #2048 of 3952 Old 06-09-2016, 12:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by petetherock View Post
FYI
If you don't use a centre speaker, you can't activiate Neural X..
Well, i can activate Neural X on a 2.1.2 setup (it is active) but it will only use the fronts and the sub, not the Heights.
So DTS never thought people want to use just the fronts, a sub or not, and 2 or 4 Heights ?
Ok, 99% will use immersive in a surround setup, but think this is a mistake of DTS.
Dolby and Auro did made this setup option possible in the software, and why not ?
If DTS will not, or can not, change this, i will stick with Dolby and let Dolby down mix a DTSX track what i will sent as Multi Channel PCM to 2.1.2


It would be nice to see DTS will change this.......
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post #2049 of 3952 Old 06-09-2016, 08:42 AM
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I'm thinking of getting a Marantz SR7010. I've got no room for rear sl sr, can I use front wides as well as four ceiling speakers? Basically, 5.1 plus 6 height speakers?
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post #2050 of 3952 Old 06-09-2016, 09:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skinnydoggy View Post
I'm thinking of getting a Marantz SR7010. I've got no room for rear sl sr, can I use front wides as well as four ceiling speakers? Basically, 5.1 plus 6 height speakers?
Yes, however, Front Wide are floor speakers, so the configuration would still be 7.1.4.
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post #2051 of 3952 Old 06-09-2016, 09:02 AM
 
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Your receiver can operate twelve channels simultaneously: 7.1.4
If you substitute Rear surround speakers for Front Wides you still have seven main (floor) channels:



Then four overhead speakers can run simultaneously with those seven main 'floor' channels, and the sub (numb. 8), for still a total of twelve (7.1.4).
{You can install two more overheads to make it six above, but only four can be running; having six permits you to alternate between different setups.}

And not all surround modes, I believe, can run the front wides. The insider experts will tell you more about...
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post #2052 of 3952 Old 06-09-2016, 10:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthSky View Post
Your receiver can operate twelve channels simultaneously: 7.1.4
If you substitute Rear surround speakers for Front Wides you still have seven main (floor) channels:



Then four overhead speakers can run simultaneously with those seven main 'floor' channels, and the sub (numb. 8), for still a total of twelve (7.1.4).
{You can install two more overheads to make it six above, but only four can be running; having six permits you to alternate between different setups.}

And not all surround modes, I believe, can run the front wides. The insider experts will tell you more about...
Cool! Can they also be front heights? Like 2 monitor speakers above the floorstanders?
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post #2053 of 3952 Old 06-09-2016, 10:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skinnydoggy View Post
Can they also be front heights? Like 2 monitor speakers above the floorstanders?
Max number of heights is 2 pairs. The Wides cannot be used as a 3rd pair of heights.

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post #2054 of 3952 Old 06-09-2016, 11:25 AM
 
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You have five main floor channels; no rear surrounds and no front wides.
You are asking now if in addition to the normal four overheads you can install a pair of front heights...like a la Audyssey DSX and Dolby Pro LogicIIz.

Me, if I was you, I would simply use a 5.1.4 Atmos setup (dts:X). And that way you won't need to use your additional separate stereo amp.
Yeah, keep your immersive audio experience simple...and effective.
And if you can move your couch away from your back wall...that would be swell. Then you can add that pair of rear surrounds and have the full 7.1.4 setup.
If not...like I said...5.1.4 is what I would do.
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post #2055 of 3952 Old 06-09-2016, 11:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthSky View Post
You have five main floor channels; no rear surrounds and no front wides.
You are asking now if in addition to the normal four overheads you can install a pair of front heights...like a la Audyssey DSX and Dolby Pro LogicIIz.

Me, if I was you, I would simply use a 5.1.4 Atmos setup (dts:X). And that way you won't need to use your additional separate stereo amp.
Yeah, keep your immersive audio experience simple...and effective.
And if you can move your couch away from your back wall...that would be swell. Then you can add that pair of rear surrounds and have the full 7.1.4 setup.
If not...like I said...5.1.4 is what I would do.
Hmm, so would the Marantz SR6010 ($1150) be good enough for this setup? I have external amplification... Or am I better with the Denon X4200 ($1299)? 5.1.4 sounds ideal for a 14.5x14.5 room, right?

Last edited by skinnydoggy; 06-09-2016 at 11:50 AM.
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post #2056 of 3952 Old 06-09-2016, 12:35 PM
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Dts:x

Both the Denon & Marantz are expandable but need external amp for 5.1.4. Your choice as these AVRs are very close and sisters in same company. I'd personally get the Marantz.

Fyi... I just purchased this week a refurb Yamaha A2050 for less $$ and it's a true 9 channel amp. Good luck


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post #2057 of 3952 Old 06-09-2016, 12:51 PM
 
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Both the Marantz 6010 and Denon 4200 can do 5.1.4 (or 7.1.2) when adding a stereo amp, which you already have.
If you are certain that you won't need the 7.1.4 setup in a near future, yes either one above would do the job for you.


http://us.marantz.com/us/products/pa...oductId=SR6010
https://usa.denon.com/us/product/hom...vers/avrx4200w

* Your room's dimension (14.5 by 14.5); is fine for either setup...5.1.4 or 7.1.4
But you don't want to install the rear surrounds, because your couch is against the wall.
If you won't move your couch forward into your room, then 5.1.4 is good. ...Even 5.1.2 - but because you have the additional amplification experiment with four overheads.
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post #2058 of 3952 Old 06-09-2016, 08:51 PM
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I can say from experians, Denon has more bottom power (bass) then Marantz.
Also like the Denon receivers better, as with Marantz you get the silly small porthole, or must leave the Display door fliped down :-(
Marantz sound is a bit layed back, Denon has more muscles......
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post #2059 of 3952 Old 06-10-2016, 02:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skinnydoggy View Post
Hmm, so would the Marantz SR6010 ($1150) be good enough for this setup? I have external amplification... Or am I better with the Denon X4200 ($1299)? 5.1.4 sounds ideal for a 14.5x14.5 room, right?
The Denon 4200w is upgradeable to Auro3D. You can't with the Marantz 6010.
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post #2060 of 3952 Old 06-10-2016, 09:43 AM
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I may be looking into the Yamaha A-2060 now... it actually eq's for axis, so sounds like it could be better than Audyssey for Atmos and DTS. Should be interesting, but it seems I have more research to do before jumping head first into a new endeavour
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post #2061 of 3952 Old 06-12-2016, 02:53 PM
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Thumbs up

Quote:
Originally Posted by krichter1 View Post
FWIW and for those still with the D&M DTS-7/X "bug" on Sony BDP's (and changers), I found a workable fix…

I found a solution I tested last night to success (including DTS:X)! I bought a $60 HDMI 4x2 matrix switch off Amazon that had some EDID mgmt dip switches and found by forcing 1080p or 4K2K 7.1 output it seemingly bypasses the DTS bug on the Denon
krichter1, that's fantastic. Thank you.

Question: when using this solution, were you able to find a specific combination of the EDID switches that work well with all track sources? What I mean is: do you need to keep changing the EDID switches when you change from a DTS track to a DolbyTrueHD track?

Thank you
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post #2062 of 3952 Old 06-12-2016, 09:04 PM
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Never received an answer from DTS why it can not do a downmix to 2.x.2
Asked again but think this may not be very importent for them, to bad......
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post #2063 of 3952 Old 06-12-2016, 10:16 PM
 
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It's not very important for roughly 99.99999999999999999999999999999999999999999% of the dts:X customers.
It is mainly important for the rest, you. ...Who wants to set a 2.1.2 dts Neural:X immersive audio system setup? ...Only @CBdicX

* Did you try 3.1.2 dts Neural:X ?
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post #2064 of 3952 Old 06-13-2016, 02:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthSky View Post
It's not very important for roughly 99.99999999999999999999999999999999999999999% of the dts:X customers.
It is mainly important for the rest, you. ...Who wants to set a 2.1.2 dts Neural:X immersive audio system setup? ...Only @CBdicX

* Did you try 3.1.2 dts Neural:X ?
Indeed, also 3.1.2 will not work for DTS !
It seems they "need" surround and center to work with Heights.
Also 4.1.2 is not working.
So DTS can not downmix to 2.x.2 where Dolby and Auro have no problems, strange desision from DTS and can not see why.......
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post #2065 of 3952 Old 06-13-2016, 05:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CBdicX View Post
Indeed, also 3.1.2 will not work for DTS !
It seems they "need" surround and center to work with Heights.
Also 4.1.2 is not working.
So DTS can not downmix to 2.x.2 where Dolby and Auro have no problems, strange desision from DTS and can not see why.......
Let's be fair, you are probably the only one trying to do this as Bob mentioned, most folks getting into immersive sound are adding speakers, not taking them away as you've done over the past year
Give DTS some time (maybe), we all know the issues with getting DTS:X rolled out and a few manufacturers have still not made it available and its summer (norther hemisphere).

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post #2066 of 3952 Old 06-13-2016, 05:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smurraybhm View Post
Let's be fair, you are probably the only one trying to do this as Bob mentioned, most folks getting into immersive sound are adding speakers, not taking them away as you've done over the past year
Give DTS some time (maybe), we all know the issues with getting DTS:X rolled out and a few manufacturers have still not made it available and its summer (norther hemisphere).
Fair enough, i hope they will reply.
Dolby and Auro seem to see that also 2.x.2 would be an option for some
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post #2067 of 3952 Old 06-13-2016, 07:53 AM
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Maybe there is a way for you to apply DTS:X headphone technology to your setup.


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post #2068 of 3952 Old 06-13-2016, 05:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jgslima View Post
krichter1, that's fantastic. Thank you.

Question: when using this solution, were you able to find a specific combination of the EDID switches that work well with all track sources? What I mean is: do you need to keep changing the EDID switches when you change from a DTS track to a DolbyTrueHD track?

Thank you
Most welcome.

Been solid so far although I did come across one issue (fix one thing; break another), in that this switch apparently doesn't support Sony's x.v.color discs, so that's a bit of a bummer (although I can still play as a normal BD; just not with the expanded ycc colorspace which my JVC PJ supports). When I want to play a Sony "SuperBlu" disc I have to go direct from my Sony changer #1 (where all my x.v.color discs are loaded), but then if it also has a DTS track I'm pooched.

The EDID only needs to be setup once (haven't touched it since setup day), and #3 works best…


EDID Selector: Select HDMI output signal format via EDID Selector.
Number / EDID Dip Selector / Description
1 0000 1080P,Stereo Audio 2.0
2 0001 1080P,Dolby/DTS 5.1
3 0010 1080P,HD Audio 7.1
4 0011 1080I,Stereo Audio 2.0
5 0100 1080I,Dolby/DTS 5.1
6 0101 1080I,HD Audio 7.1
7 0110 3D,Stereo Audio 2.0
8 0111 3D,Dolby/DTS 5.1
9 1000 3D,HD Audio 7.1
10 1001 4K2K,Stereo Audio 2.0
11 1010 4K2K,Dolby/DTS 5.1
12 1011 4K2K,HD Audio 7.1
13 1100 Reserve
14 1101 Reserve
15 1110 Reserve
16 1111 Auto mode(default)

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~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


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post #2069 of 3952 Old 06-13-2016, 10:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigdogaxis View Post
Maybe there is a way for you to apply DTS:X headphone technology to your setup.
Hi, can you please explain a but more what you exact mean ?
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post #2070 of 3952 Old 06-14-2016, 06:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CBdicX View Post
Hi, can you please explain a but more what you exact mean ?
He's messing with you I believe due to your speaker limit - thus why not try just using headphones. Logitech has some headphones that support the tech right now, not aware of any others jumping on wagon.
http://dts.com/headphonex?gclid=CLnm...FdgGgQod8RoC9w

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