The "OFFICIAL" 2016 Denon "S-Series" / "X-Series" AVR Owner's Thread + FAQ - Page 343 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #10261 of 17361 Old 09-27-2017, 11:03 PM
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Originally Posted by gmace001 View Post
So what are everyone’s thoughts on the 730H? It isn’t rated very well on Amazon and CNET said the Sony DN1080 sounded better. I just don’t like the lag that people mentioned when switching inputs. I want to be able to hook up my PS4 Pro, XB1, Apple TV and Fire TV. I need 4K, HDR and Dolby Vision. I need my receiver to be shipped and sold by Amazon. Any recommendations are welcome.
The mods have a sticky for no price talk or who to buy from links in receiver owners threads but it's no secret that JDsmoothie is an authorized Denon dealer . Contacting him for pricing on a 2017 model Denon is something I have seen many here do in the past with great success.

As for Amazon and CNET reviews the former always seems to be full of flame posts for most receivers and CNET has had this strange love affair with Sony receivers for years for some odd reason contrary to even Sony's own interest in fully supporting their receiver division and the mostly utter fail of their in house DCAC room correction and poor power supplies(I still own multiple Sony products by the way.)

HDMI switching is slow on most all receivers as far as I know compared to legacy connections. It's a part of the tech that's making digital handshakes between multiple HDMI sources and verifying DRM restrictions.

I've researched Sony receivers back 2 or 3 years now as well as Denon and Yamaha and hung out daily in the latter two's owners threads before buying another Denon product but I almost bought a Yamaha which is also a good receiver in a limited market of good receivers. If a dealer is authorized and you get a valid receipt and a receiver with a good serial number you're good to go. The warranty issues come up with factory refurbished units through secondary Amazon sellers only I believe.


EDIT: Forgot the Amazon credit part. Check Denon's site directly for their listing of Authorized dealers and see which are selling through Amazon. Amazon as well is authorized. You're limited I know .

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post #10262 of 17361 Old 09-28-2017, 12:36 AM
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Originally Posted by g.costanza View Post
Long story short...bought new Jamo (klipsch clone) subs. The combination with my denon x3300w produced humming in the sub. Both the subs and denon have 2 prong, polarized plugs. After days of trial and error, I reversed the power cord polarity on the subs using a hacked sacrificial extension cord and the hum went away (mostly). There is still a slight hum when you are right up against the subs. I measured the voltage on the sub's plate amp using a digital multimeter as 118 volt ac in factory polarity and 1volt ac in reversed polarity. I measured by placing 1 probe on the plate amp metal chassis and the 2nd probe on the center screw of the wall outlet, which is connected to ground.
You're testing hot to ground versus neutral to ground when you test the reversed polarity. What is hot to neutral voltage?

http://en-us.fluke.com/community/flu...eceptacle.html

The fact that reversing polarity helps suggests hot and neutral have been switched somewhere, but it could well be elsewhere in the building.

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BUT, the quietest combination was not the denon and the subs. It was with an old Sony receiver I had on hand. Its chassis measures 1 volt ac in factory polarity and was dead silent in combination with the subs. It measured 70 volt ac in reversed polarity. Sadly, the x3300 measures 50-60 volt ac in both polarities.
My bet is the old Sony was probably using a 3-prong grounded plug and so you see 1V similar to neutral to ground test above?

The Denon chassis is a class-II double-insulated design. You can try to connect a ground wire between the Denon's signal ground and the subs, or even between the Denon and the receptacle and see whether that makes a similar improvement.
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post #10263 of 17361 Old 09-28-2017, 01:04 AM
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Originally Posted by gmace001 View Post
So what are everyone’s thoughts on the 730H? It isn’t rated very well on Amazon and CNET said the Sony DN1080 sounded better. I just don’t like the lag that people mentioned when switching inputs. I want to be able to hook up my PS4 Pro, XB1, Apple TV and Fire TV. I need 4K, HDR and Dolby Vision. I need my receiver to be shipped and sold by Amazon. Any recommendations are welcome.
You'd be better served posting this in the correct thread. This is the 2016 thread. The 730H is a 2017 model.

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post #10264 of 17361 Old 09-28-2017, 03:42 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by aaronburro View Post
Dangit, posted too soon. It's a PEBKAC error.
Wasn't familiar with this term .... PEBKAC - "Problem exists between keyboard and chair" (aka user error).
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post #10265 of 17361 Old 09-28-2017, 03:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Madmax67 View Post
The mods have a sticky for no price talk or who to buy from links in receiver owners threads but it's no secret that JDsmoothie is an authorized Denon dealer . Contacting him for pricing on a 2017 model Denon is something I have seen many here do in the past with great success.

As for Amazon and CNET reviews the former always seems to be full of flame posts for most receivers and CNET has had this strange love affair with Sony receivers for years for some odd reason contrary to even Sony's own interest in fully supporting their receiver division and the mostly utter fail of their in house DCAC room correction and poor power supplies(I still own multiple Sony products by the way.)

HDMI switching is slow on most all receivers as far as I know compared to legacy connections. It's a part of the tech that's making digital handshakes between multiple HDMI sources and verifying DRM restrictions.

I've researched Sony receivers back 2 or 3 years now as well as Denon and Yamaha and hung out daily in the latter two's owners threads before buying another Denon product but I almost bought a Yamaha which is also a good receiver in a limited market of good receivers. If a dealer is authorized and you get a valid receipt and a receiver with a good serial number you're good to go. The warranty issues come up with factory refurbished units through secondary Amazon sellers only I believe.


EDIT: Forgot the Amazon credit part. Check Denon's site directly for their listing of Authorized dealers and see which are selling through Amazon. Amazon as well is authorized. You're limited I know .
Thank you for all of this information. I really appreciate it.
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post #10266 of 17361 Old 09-28-2017, 03:49 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by gmace001 View Post
So what are everyone’s thoughts on the 730H? It isn’t rated very well on Amazon and CNET said the Sony DN1080 sounded better. I just don’t like the lag that people mentioned when switching inputs. I want to be able to hook up my PS4 Pro, XB1, Apple TV and Fire TV. I need 4K, HDR and Dolby Vision. I need my receiver to be shipped and sold by Amazon. Any recommendations are welcome.
I would say 3.5/5.0 on Amazon is fairly good especially in light of the fact that the 1 star review references the HEOS app and lower star reviews are more often due to "user error" or PEBKAC as mentioned in the above post.

However, as jconjason just noted, the S730H is a 2017 model so please re-post in the 2017 Denon AVR Owner's thread linked below. Also review posts 1-8 in that thread for more helpful information.

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-rec...l#post51748441
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post #10267 of 17361 Old 09-28-2017, 03:52 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by robotrooster View Post
I know on my LG E6, I had to turn on HDMI Deep Color in the tv settings for each input on the TV. You can’t get HDR without that turned on in the tv.
A good reminder for all .... in order to pass HDR, the TV will generally have to have a "Deep Color" or "Enhanced" mode enabled.
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post #10268 of 17361 Old 09-28-2017, 04:01 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by ahblaza View Post
Yeah I hear you, I bought my second 4300 from Amazon when it was sold and shipped by them, they seem to have new sellers of Denon products now, I don't know how the warranty works for new Denon receivers if sold through them by another or third party seller. Maybe someone can answer that question as well, like shipped by Amazon and sold by Hi-Def Electronics, is this an authorized dealer sale, I honestly don't know. The only Denon authorized refurb seller I know of is AC4L...............
When Amazon is the shipper and the seller of a "new" unit, the Denon warranty applies. When Amazon Warehouse is the seller, there is no Denon warranty. When Amazon is only the shipper, you must determine if the "seller" is an authorized Denon dealer by going to Denon's authorized dealer website linked below. Select the "Find Online" for on-line dealers (24 currently listed) or "Find Locally" for the brick & mortar stores (of which there are several hundred currently listed).

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-rec...l#post51748441
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post #10269 of 17361 Old 09-28-2017, 04:03 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by gmace001 View Post
I see in the first post that the S920W is supposed to receive the Dolby Vision update, but has that been confirmed? I’m about to pull the trigger on a refurbished model from Amazon but want to be certain. Where was that bit of info obtained? Thanks!
I wouldn't have listed it if it wasn't confirmed by D+M.
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post #10270 of 17361 Old 09-28-2017, 04:08 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by mike929 View Post
I need some help/guidance

Today I connected a 23" monitor to my 4300h in zone2. What I was thinking I could do was play two different sources and have sound. Sound from either the monitor itself (which has speakers) or utilize some of my speakers connected to the receiver.

From my understand. The monitor2 output should simply display the selected source on both my TV and monitor.

I have the monitor connected into zone2 as mentioned. I am having a hard time getting all items to work together.

1. XBOX.
a. If I have the XBOX on and on the TV. Everything stops working if I turn on the 2nd monitor.
b. If I have the XBOX on an both are displaying the XBOX game. If the game is HDR I no longer get the HDR symbol ( injustice 2 game for example ). So do you get the lower of the two displays. If one is not a 4k screen that is HDR capable?

2. If I plug the monitor in the the monitor2 output. I get no signal.


Is what i'm expecting doable. I'm thinking it should be but i'm having a hard/odd time doing it.

I had to disconnect the monitor's connection to the receiver to get my picture back on the TV. What settings do I need to look at to accomplish my goal?

Thanks
Mike
The "monitor" must be set to a standard TV resolution (ie. 1080p) and not a computer monitor resolution. Then when passing a different source to each zone, there should be no issue passing audio+video to the Zone 2 display, otherwise, as you already noted, if the Zone 2 and main zone displays are of different resolution, when passing the same source, only the resolution common to both will display.
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post #10271 of 17361 Old 09-28-2017, 04:11 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Iceblade View Post
Sorry, I just thought that meant it was a thread about the X and S models STARTED in 2016... not that it pertained ONLY to that model year.

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The "official" threads for any brand/model refer to models released that year. We have been doing dedicated Denon threads since about 2011.
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post #10272 of 17361 Old 09-28-2017, 05:09 AM
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Originally Posted by cswiger View Post
You're testing hot to ground versus neutral to ground when you test the reversed polarity. What is hot to neutral voltage?

As measured on my outlets, hot to neutral and hot to ground are the same voltage. 120 vac, give or take a couple volts. Neutral to ground is 0 vac.

http://en-us.fluke.com/community/flu...eceptacle.html

The fact that reversing polarity helps suggests hot and neutral have been switched somewhere, but it could well be elsewhere in the building.

Nope. My dad is an electrician. I spent days running tests on my home wiring. All is wired correctly. First step was visual inspection. Black to hot on outlet hot and breaker hox hot, etc. Next was with fluke non-contact voltage detector in every outlet opening in the entire home. Next was the little 3-light tester stuck in every outlet. Voltage measurement was then made with my fluke 115 dmm

My bet is the old Sony was probably using a 3-prong grounded plug and so you see 1V similar to neutral to ground test above?

Nope. Sony is a 2 prong.

The Denon chassis is a class-II double-insulated design. You can try to connect a ground wire between the Denon's signal ground and the subs, or even between the Denon and the receptacle and see whether that makes a similar improvement.
Remember when I said I had already tried EVERYTHING? Lol. This was one of my very first tests I tried days ago

Apparently reversing power polarity has been "a thing" in audio/video for reducing noise for a while. I've discovered it isn't the audio voodoo I once thought it was.

I'm curious what other ppl's Denon receiver's measure to ground. EVERYTHING, minus the passive speaker connections on binding posts and optical connections, must be removed before measuring or else u gt a false reading due to all the other connections being connected to chassis ground.

Last edited by g.costanza; 09-28-2017 at 05:47 AM.
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post #10273 of 17361 Old 09-28-2017, 06:06 AM
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Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post
The "monitor" must be set to a standard TV resolution (ie. 1080p) and not a computer monitor resolution. Then when passing a different source to each zone, there should be no issue passing audio+video to the Zone 2 display, otherwise, as you already noted, if the Zone 2 and main zone displays are of different resolution, when passing the same source, only the resolution common to both will display.
Thanks, yea i'll have to check the monitor. I know there is a video or pc option.

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post #10274 of 17361 Old 09-28-2017, 06:29 AM
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Originally Posted by mike929 View Post
Thanks, yea i'll have to check the monitor. I know there is a video or pc option.
Can a pc monitor be directly connected to the 4300?

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post #10275 of 17361 Old 09-28-2017, 06:31 AM - Thread Starter
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Can a pc monitor be directly connected to the 4300?
Yes, if it can be configured for standard TV resolution (eg. 1080p).
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post #10276 of 17361 Old 09-28-2017, 06:37 AM - Thread Starter
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How does HEOS work? (X4300H/X6300H)

I've seen several posts from prospective 2016 and 2017 model owners believing you must purchase HEOS (Wifi/Bluetooth) speakers in order to take advantage of the built-in HEOS module in the Denon "H" series models, which is not entirely correct. There are two ways to take advantage of the built-in HEOS module:

(1) Use the HEOS app (iOS/Android; Free) to stream currently one of 14 different music services to the AVR (Pandora, Spotify, TuneIn, Amazon Music, DEEZER, Napster, iHeartRadio, SiriusXM, SOUNDCLOUD, TIDAL, Rhapsody, JUKE!, AWA, QPlay). Note unlike on non-HEOS models, the music services are no longer on board the AVR, but rather the app is used initially, and then the stream can be saved as a HEOS Favorite so the app is no longer required for that particular stream.

(2) Stream 2CH music sources to from 1 - 32 HEOS speakers set up around the home with the same limitation as passing Zone 2 sources for that particular model. You can effectively have 32 independent zones or can group up to 16 HEOS speakers for the same "whole house" audio. Additionally, 2 same model speakers can be configured as STEREO Left/Right.

Additionally, with a soon to be released firmware update to the "H" models, the Echo and Echo Dot (ie. products with Alexa) will be able to control the AVR and HEOS HS2 (version 2 only) speaker functionality using voice commands to Alexa.
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Last edited by jdsmoothie; 09-28-2017 at 07:05 AM.
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post #10277 of 17361 Old 09-28-2017, 06:43 AM
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Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post
I've seen several posts from prospective 2016 and 2017 model owners believing you must purchase HEOS (Wifi/Bluetooth) speakers in order to take advantage of the built-in
Additionally, with a soon to be released firmware update to the "H" models, the Echo and Echo Dot (ie. products with Alexa) will be able to control the AVR functionality using voice commands to Alexa.
Nice, thanks. I have 1 Heos speaker and 2 echos. I was not aware of this up-coming update.

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post #10278 of 17361 Old 09-28-2017, 07:35 AM
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Originally Posted by mtheeb View Post
Hi there,


I'm getting ready to enter the world of 4k and need to upgrade my trusty ole 818. It's been a few years since I've been in the receiver market after replacing my 805, which was a great receiver.

I run a 7.2 system, so looking for a recommendation/suggestion for a receiver with as much or slightly more punch than my 818. I keep looking at the Denon 4300, which has come down in price on closeout. Would I lose anything with the lower wattage going that route? Anyone have any experience going from the 818 to the 4300? Is this still an upgrade with 10 less watts per channel?

Thanks in advance for your help!
I just went from an Onkyo 808 to a 4300. If by "punch" you mean more power you're going the wrong way. However, the difference in power between the 808/818 and the 4300 is negligible, less than a dB. The 6300 has much more robust power supplies and can provide full rated power to all channels, it would have more punch but you pay a lot more. I get around the low power of AVR's by using a separate power amp for the main L & R speakers, then the AVR only has to power center and surround speakers.
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post #10279 of 17361 Old 09-28-2017, 07:49 AM
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On the subject of replacing an Onkyo 808 with a Denon X4300H, I don't see that the Denon has any choices for listening modes for 2 channel stereo other than "ALL ZONE STEREO". The Onkyo had a number of different listening modes that would take a stereo source and play it through all 7.1 speakers. Some of them were a little weird and sometimes it was better to turn them off depending on source material but they were there to try. Am I missing something or did Denon leave all that out?
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post #10280 of 17361 Old 09-28-2017, 08:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Madmax67 View Post
Consider luck wished. Oddly enough the other day I could have sworn I heard a relay click on my X4300H when watching TV but I can't tell for sure. Never happened before or since so it might have been my mind playing tricks on me. My last Denon had 10 years of trouble free duty so I'm confidant your replacement should be fine.
Bad news. While perhaps quieter, my new receiver (X3300) is clicking. Suspecting that something in my setup might be causing this.

The clicking sounds very much like the initial click from when turning the receiver on. It seems to be random but perhaps more often during a scene change. Receiver doesn't feel hot to the touch, not nearly as hot as my older Onkyo was. Onkyo was also clicking, I just figured it was going bad after 7+ years of use. Perhaps not?

I have Infinity Primus P363 Fronts, PC351 Center, and Polk PSW110 sub.
Connections are bananas at the receiver and stripped and screwed to post at speakers. Confirmed that polarity is correct.
Speaker wire is new monoprice 12ga.
Connected to Samsung 1080P TV, Xbox One, and Roku (model 2 i believe). All via HDMI.
Power via UPS. I believe receiver is plugged into the master.

Suggestions on what to check?

Denon X3300 | Front: Infinity Primus P363 (LR) and PC351 (CEN) | Sub: Polk PSW110
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post #10281 of 17361 Old 09-28-2017, 08:40 AM
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Ignore, sent twice

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post #10282 of 17361 Old 09-28-2017, 09:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Mustang37 View Post
Power via UPS. I believe receiver is plugged into the master.

Suggestions on what to check?
Yes, bypass the UPS for ALL devices and see if that solves the clicking problem.
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post #10283 of 17361 Old 09-28-2017, 09:57 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by dr_gallup View Post
On the subject of replacing an Onkyo 808 with a Denon X4300H, I don't see that the Denon has any choices for listening modes for 2 channel stereo other than "ALL ZONE STEREO". The Onkyo had a number of different listening modes that would take a stereo source and play it through all 7.1 speakers. Some of them were a little weird and sometimes it was better to turn them off depending on source material but they were there to try. Am I missing something or did Denon leave all that out?
You have a number of different choices by simply pressing the MOVIE (eg. Dolby Surround, DTS Neural:X, Multi CH Stereo) or MUSIC (Rock Arena, Jazz Club) buttons. Refer to p. 297 in your Owner's manual.
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post #10284 of 17361 Old 09-28-2017, 10:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Mustang37 View Post
Bad news. While perhaps quieter, my new receiver (X3300) is clicking. Suspecting that something in my setup might be causing this.

The clicking sounds very much like the initial click from when turning the receiver on. It seems to be random but perhaps more often during a scene change. Receiver doesn't feel hot to the touch, not nearly as hot as my older Onkyo was. Onkyo was also clicking, I just figured it was going bad after 7+ years of use. Perhaps not?

I have Infinity Primus P363 Fronts, PC351 Center, and Polk PSW110 sub.
Connections are bananas at the receiver and stripped and screwed to post at speakers. Confirmed that polarity is correct.
Speaker wire is new monoprice 12ga.
Connected to Samsung 1080P TV, Xbox One, and Roku (model 2 i believe). All via HDMI.
Power via UPS. I believe receiver is plugged into the master.

Suggestions on what to check?
My Onkyo would click every time the input signal changed formats. For instance, the cable box would send most programing in 5.1 but the ads were in stereo so the box would click and then click again when the programing came back. Sometimes it clicked pretty often with the little snippets they broadcast these days. Got the same click every time I changed sources. Same relay sound as turning the AVR on and off.
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post #10285 of 17361 Old 09-28-2017, 10:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post
You have a number of different choices by simply pressing the MOVIE (eg. Dolby Surround, DTS Neural:X, Multi CH Stereo) or MUSIC (Rock Arena, Jazz Club) buttons. Refer to p. 297 in your Owner's manual.
Thanks, found it, actually page 142.
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post #10286 of 17361 Old 09-28-2017, 10:18 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by dr_gallup View Post
Thanks, found it, actually page 142.
The info is listed several places to include pp.145 and 297.
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post #10287 of 17361 Old 09-28-2017, 10:22 AM
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Need help buying. I’m between the 930H (or maybe the 3300H?) and the 4300H. The principle difference (besides channel power) I’m looking at is being able to do 7.1/5.1.2 Atmos and 9.1/7.1.2 Atmos. Right now I have a 7.1 set up. I’m just not sure if the 4300H would be overkill. Do these receivers do the mixing for the upper speakers or does the content actually have to say like Dolby Atmos (kind of like Dolby TrueHD)? I don’t really see any 7.1.2 content out there, nor know how far into the future it will be before we do. But maybe that’s a moot point if the receiver is mixing, say, a 7.1 Dolby TrueHD to Atmos. I’m really ignorant on Atmos technology, as you can see. Reading as much as I can but I don’t feel like if I bought today, I’d be making an uninformed decision. Cost is about $300 difference, so not insignificant.

Last edited by bpeacock22; 09-28-2017 at 10:26 AM.
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post #10288 of 17361 Old 09-28-2017, 10:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post
The info is listed several places to include pp.145 and 297.
We must be looking at different copies of the OM but it's all good, thanks JD.
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post #10289 of 17361 Old 09-28-2017, 10:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dr_gallup View Post
My Onkyo would click every time the input signal changed formats. For instance, the cable box would send most programing in 5.1 but the ads were in stereo so the box would click and then click again when the programing came back. Sometimes it clicked pretty often with the little snippets they broadcast these days. Got the same click every time I changed sources. Same relay sound as turning the AVR on and off.
I wouldn't mind that, perhaps even expect it, but mine is doing it with constant feeds as well. For example, it clicks randomly while watching BluRay.

I'm going to remove UPS from equation this afternoon. Likely pull everything off UPS and see if that fixes. If it does, I may try and add a device back onto UPS one at a time. XBOX, then TV, then Roku, then receiver. See if its an all or nothing game. My UPS is getting a bit long in the tooth.

Denon X3300 | Front: Infinity Primus P363 (LR) and PC351 (CEN) | Sub: Polk PSW110
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post #10290 of 17361 Old 09-28-2017, 10:51 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bpeacock22 View Post
Need help buying. I’m between the 930H (or maybe the 3300H?) and the 4300H. The principle difference (besides channel power) I’m looking at is being able to do 7.1/5.1.2 Atmos and 9.1/7.1.2 Atmos. Right now I have a 7.1 set up. I’m just not sure if the 4300H would be overkill. Do these receivers do the mixing for the upper speakers or does the content actually have to say like Dolby Atmos (kind of like Dolby TrueHD)? I don’t really see any 7.1.2 content out there, nor know how far into the future it will be before we do. But maybe that’s a moot point if the receiver is mixing, say, a 7.1 Dolby TrueHD to Atmos. I’m really ignorant on Atmos technology, as you can see. Reading as much as I can but I don’t feel like if I bought today, I’d be making an uninformed decision. Cost is about $300 difference, so not insignificant.
Yup, using either Dolby Surround or DTS Neural:X.
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