Emotiva RMC-1 speculation thread - Page 21 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #601 of 745 Old 11-14-2018, 10:00 AM
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Originally Posted by krholmberg View Post
Heads up... Dirac will not be enabled at launch. It will come at a later date via firmware update per Keith at Emotiva.

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I just read that. Funny thing is that there is not even an ETA for the firmware that would enable Dirac Live on the RMC-1. Knowing Emotiva firmware development speed, it could take months before the RMC-1 has Dirac on it.

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post #602 of 745 Old 11-14-2018, 11:47 AM
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So I guess they may release the product "on time" 2 years later, but missing one of it's most important features.

Sounds about right.

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post #603 of 745 Old 11-14-2018, 11:58 AM
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jeez, that’s a buzzkill

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post #604 of 745 Old 11-14-2018, 12:06 PM
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Emotiva strikes again. I was floored that they were keeping the 11/15 date and was waiting for the catch...and as usual they delivered!!!!

I have a webcam feed from their home office:

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post #605 of 745 Old 11-14-2018, 12:06 PM
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Wow, had not heard that. Launching without arguably one of its greatest features seems <insert whatever here, words fail me>. I've been tracking but don't really need it, barely got my XMC-1 working after the v3 board debacle, and certainly don't want to give up Dirac Live. Guess I won't be starting the owner's thread...
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post #606 of 745 Old 11-14-2018, 12:17 PM
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This may explain their Holiday promotion, getting folks to buy stuff now to get credit towards the RMC-1 - which they may not want to buy but feel forced to (to use their store credit)...just speculating
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post #607 of 745 Old 11-14-2018, 01:31 PM
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The most ironic and bizarre thing is tomorrow those RMC-1 are going to sell like hotcakes. Pretty sure they will be all gone no more than 2 hours after they go live. You have to be on drugs and have a ton of $$ to pay for a product that most likely will come with hundreds of bugs and without calibration software. Hey, Keith said that most XMC-1 users only use Presets 1 and 2 with REW filters so not having Dirac front start is not a big deal....
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post #608 of 745 Old 11-14-2018, 02:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by krholmberg View Post
Heads up... Dirac will not be enabled at launch. It will come at a later date via firmware update per Keith at Emotiva.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk

Is it the same flavor of Dirac that's on the XMC-1 or a new improved version, maybe with Unison ?? Any news on that?

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post #609 of 745 Old 11-14-2018, 02:15 PM
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It is not Unison
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post #610 of 745 Old 11-14-2018, 03:09 PM
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Originally Posted by krholmberg View Post
Heads up... Dirac will not be enabled at launch.


Then what’s the point?

One would think Dirac on time would be a non-issue. They have experience with the XMC-1 and it’s not like the channel count is an issue (see Datasat, Storm).

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post #611 of 745 Old 11-14-2018, 03:24 PM
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Then what’s the point?
9.1.6 processing for $5k is a good point if any. $3k if you have a 40% off card.

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post #612 of 745 Old 11-14-2018, 04:56 PM
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Originally Posted by DS-21 View Post
Then what’s the point?

One would think Dirac on time would be a non-issue. They have experience with the XMC-1 and it’s not like the channel count is an issue (see Datasat, Storm).
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post #613 of 745 Old 11-14-2018, 05:45 PM
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Originally Posted by enricoclaudio View Post
The most ironic and bizarre thing is tomorrow those RMC-1 are going to sell like hotcakes. Pretty sure they will be all gone no more than 2 hours after they go live. You have to be on drugs and have a ton of $$ to pay for a product that most likely will come with hundreds of bugs and without calibration software. Hey, Keith said that most XMC-1 users only use Presets 1 and 2 with REW filters so not having Dirac front start is not a big deal....
I realize this is the internet and people enjoy exaggerating to try to make their reasoning seem meaningful, so I got a good laugh out of your "hundreds of bugs" comment. Perhaps with a larger roll out hundreds of people could experience the same few issues, but to make the claim there will be hundreds of bugs is a bold stance.

Releasing without calibration software is only a big deal if your room has issues you can't resolve with treatments or you think the software is a magic bullet to better sound. I've had a Marantz 7704 in my system since my room's completion and not once have I considered running the ARC software based on the results I've heard from other Audyessy implementations. I did enjoy what Dirac did to the sound on the XMC and my previous room, so once Dirac is released I'll give it a whirl. But it's not a deal breaker. Dirac working day one doesn't prevent the RMC-1 from working all it's other magic. But hey, that's just my opinion... a drug user who has a ton of money.
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post #614 of 745 Old 11-14-2018, 05:57 PM
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Releasing without calibration software is only a big deal if your room has issues you can't resolve with treatments or you think the software is a magic bullet to better sound.
I'd love to see your room treatments that can effectively deal with modes at low frequencies.
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post #615 of 745 Old 11-14-2018, 06:14 PM
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I realize this is the internet and people enjoy exaggerating to try to make their reasoning seem meaningful, so I got a good laugh out of your "hundreds of bugs" comment. Perhaps with a larger roll out hundreds of people could experience the same few issues, but to make the claim there will be hundreds of bugs is a bold stance.

Releasing without calibration software is only a big deal if your room has issues you can't resolve with treatments or you think the software is a magic bullet to better sound. I've had a Marantz 7704 in my system since my room's completion and not once have I considered running the ARC software based on the results I've heard from other Audyessy implementations. I did enjoy what Dirac did to the sound on the XMC and my previous room, so once Dirac is released I'll give it a whirl. But it's not a deal breaker. Dirac working day one doesn't prevent the RMC-1 from working all it's other magic. But hey, that's just my opinion... a drug user who has a ton of money.
The lack of Dirac is not what you have to be worry about, trust me. Good luck with your purchase. Glad to see people enjoying paying $5000 for been a beta tester I already paid my beta tester share with the V3 HDMI Board which after 5 months of release is still broken.
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post #616 of 745 Old 11-14-2018, 06:24 PM
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I just read that. Funny thing is that there is not even an ETA for the firmware that would enable Dirac Live on the RMC-1. Knowing Emotiva firmware development speed, it could take months before the RMC-1 has Dirac on it.
Wow... They have been talking about this thing for over 2 years now. Any potential buyers should be very weary of what else is missing/not working correctly, if one of the main features is MIA.
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post #617 of 745 Old 11-14-2018, 06:49 PM
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I'd love to see your room treatments that can effectively deal with modes at low frequencies.
Feel free to check out my build thread and ask any questions about my room. This thread is for the RMC-1. Speaking about the RMC-1 and your comment, remember the announcement is Dirac won't be included on day one, the same as when the XMC was released. Doesn't mean I'll never have Dirac loaded on my RMC or be able to make adjustments. I'm buying this processor for the long haul, as long as it receives and sends 0's and 1's, can create audio for the speakers and passes video to my projector on day one I'm pretty sure the product will checkoff my needs. Do I expect a few hi-cups at first, yup. Do I expect that after a firmware update or two I'll have one of the best sounding processors money can buy for less than $10K, yup.

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The lack of Dirac is not what you have to be worry about, trust me. Good luck with your purchase. Glad to see people enjoying paying $5000 for been a beta tester I already paid my beta tester share with the V3 HDMI Board which after 5 months of release is still broken.
I'm sorry to hear you are having issues with the V3 hdmi board that was built for the RMC and then shoe-horned into the XMC. I've owned several Emotiva processors and have never experienced a major issue. Maybe I'm lucky. but my luck never runs out when it comes to not enjoying a "beta tester" comment. It's the go to bash against Emotiva. Here's to hoping my RMC-1 experience isn't so bad I feel the need to post in other Emotiva threads about products I don't own or plan to own.

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post #618 of 745 Old 11-14-2018, 06:49 PM
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I realize this is the internet and people enjoy exaggerating to try to make their reasoning seem meaningful, so I got a good laugh out of your "hundreds of bugs" comment. Perhaps with a larger roll out hundreds of people could experience the same few issues, but to make the claim there will be hundreds of bugs is a bold stance.

Releasing without calibration software is only a big deal if your room has issues you can't resolve with treatments or you think the software is a magic bullet to better sound. I've had a Marantz 7704 in my system since my room's completion and not once have I considered running the ARC software based on the results I've heard from other Audyessy implementations. I did enjoy what Dirac did to the sound on the XMC and my previous room, so once Dirac is released I'll give it a whirl. But it's not a deal breaker. Dirac working day one doesn't prevent the RMC-1 from working all it's other magic. But hey, that's just my opinion... a drug user who has a ton of money.
I totally agree. It's just like buying a car without the promised air conditioning is only an issue if you live in a warm part of the world. Many people live in mild climates so its not really a big deal. Plus the dealer said they will come install the AC at some future undetermined time. No big deal. Doesn't change a thing about how I feel about the car.

The truth is Emotiva has a pretty bad track record with releasing products on time and with the promised features. They have been working on this product for over two years and selling Dirac as a prominent feature. To announce one day before the release that Dirac will not be available at launch is shady as heck. Surely they knew this way ahead of time but just communicate this now. If this was an isolated incident, not many people would say anything about it. They have a bad reputation on AVS for pre/pros for a reason...they earned it.
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post #619 of 745 Old 11-14-2018, 06:52 PM
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The truth is Emotiva has a pretty bad track record with releasing products on time and with the promised features. They have been working on this product for over two years and selling Dirac as a prominent feature. To announce one day before the release that Dirac will not be available at launch is shady as heck. Surely they knew this way ahead of time but just communicate this now. If this was an isolated incident, not many people would say anything about it. They have a bad reputation on AVS for pre/pros for a reason...they earned it.
Yet here you are, following along and posting to a thread about a product from a company you think is shady as heck. If I was as worked up about it as some who post here, Emotiva would never get a dime of my money.

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post #620 of 745 Old 11-14-2018, 07:14 PM
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Yet here you are, following along and posting to a thread about a product from a company you think is shady as heck. If I was as worked up about it as some who post here, Emotiva would never get a dime of my money.
You do know what thread you're in right? It's the "Emotiva RMC-1 speculation thread".

In a shocking development, you have people in the the thread...........speculating and giving their opinions about the product.
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Feel free to check out my build thread and ask any questions about my room.
It was a rhetorical question. When you factor in room size and the massive cubic feet required for LF treatments, room correction is pretty much the only way to effectively do it.

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Deewan - your room looks great. Seriously, job well done. My comments were about Emotiva and their reputation here on AVS. I was following this thread because the product interests me but I will likely not buy it because of my concerns with Emotiva over-promising on timelines and functionality (in my opinion). Had this release gone off without a hitch and the reviews came in positive, I would have put it on the short list. I will look for another solution. I know they have plenty of happy owners. Good luck.
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post #623 of 745 Old 11-14-2018, 07:40 PM
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Then what’s the point?

One would think Dirac on time would be a non-issue. They have experience with the XMC-1 and it’s not like the channel count is an issue (see Datasat, Storm).
I think they spent so much time getting eARC and Dolby Vision and Atmos and DTS:X in 9.1.6 working with XO's and with expandable modules and 4K 60hz 4:4:4 that they basically ran out of time trying to get DIRAC enabled.

They must have made that decision some months ago because it's not easy to disable features in firmware, unless it's specifically designed to run as isolated sub-processes (which any smart person would do).

In any case, enjoy being a $5000 no-DSP beta tester...

If the V3 boards on the XMC-1 are that bad, I can only imagine.

Sounds like Emotiva really needs to hire a senior software architect with brains, rather than just hardware monkeys and DSP monkeys and junior software people from India and China (or wherever they got them from...)

Anyone can write bad code, that's easy. Any fresh university graduate can do that. (All theory, no experience... )
Writing good code is extremely challenging for monkeys and noobs.

What makes hiring software developers really challenging is that management doesn't know how to code and thus couldn't tell a good coder from a bad one. Also, many people are very good at lying and falsifying resumes.

If they are charming or good-looking or good at lying, then they get the job. Rather than a skill-based interviewing.

I've been a full-stack software developer for almost 20 years. 90% of interviewers don't have a clue how to interview coders. (IQ tests/questions are a horrible way to filter resumes, equally as bad as asking no programming questions.)

The first thing I ask them is: what's the difference between public, protected and private.
or interfaces vs inheritance
or pointers vs delegates vs events
or dependency injection vs inversion of control
or SOLID vs GRASP vs ACID vs 1-3 normal-form vs MVP vs MVC
or give an ideal architecture with multi-threading and micro services and load-balancing and fault-tolerance and future scalability, with Op's monitoring and business-process flow management.
Based on that I can usually get a good picture of their skill level.

Or better yet: compose a coding challenge and solve it using all of those techniques and principles, and then upload your best code for that along with your resume.

Let's just say: few get hired.
and with almost 100% hiring-accuracy for my problem-space.

I'm sure Emotiva is heavy on the assembler and Dolby/DTS/HDMI/DSP knowledge, so their questions are substantially different, but essentially the same...

I could care less if "the fox, the chicken and the grain can get across a river in min-steps"
or "where do you see yourself in 5 years"
or "why do you want to work here / why did you apply"
or "what is this shape, rotated 90 degrees mirror imagined"
Irrelevant interview questions are Irrelevant.

That won't make my DAC bug-free and future-expandable or released-to-manufacturing on time...
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post #624 of 745 Old 11-14-2018, 07:48 PM
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In any case, enjoy being a $5000 no-DSP beta tester...

"At the beta test stage, the product has already passed through the first-level, internal pilot-test (alpha test) and glaring defects have been removed. But (since the product may still have some minor problems that require user participation) it is released to selected customers for testing under normal, everyday conditions of use to spot the remaining flaws."

http://www.businessdictionary.com/de...beta-test.html

I am having a hard time seeing how you can even beta test a product to expose "minor flaws" when that product isn't even fully functional yet.
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post #625 of 745 Old 11-14-2018, 07:50 PM
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I already paid my beta tester share with the V3 HDMI Board which after 5 months of release is still broken.
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They have been working on this product for over two years and selling Dirac as a prominent feature. To announce one day before the release that Dirac will not be available at launch is shady as heck. Surely they knew this way ahead of time but just communicate this now. If this was an isolated incident, not many people would say anything about it. They have a bad reputation on AVS for pre/pros for a reason...they earned it.
They have been working on the RMC-1 since 2008, when the UMC-1 was still a thing.

My UMC-1 wouldn't even boot half of the time, and could almost never stay locked on an HDMI signal of any audio type or video resolution.

I abandoned Emotiva in 2012 for an Oppo 105 which has been 100% stable on every firmware update since the initial release (up-to and including today.)

I was burned so bad by the UMC-1 that I find it extremely difficult to ever consider Emotiva as a processor making company. Every firmware was unstable and unusable (to this day.)

Their solution: to totally abandon their UMC-1 customers for the newer UMC-2 [side-grade]
and now: XMC-1/RMC-1 ["up"-grade].
Ye be warned.
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Last edited by BassThatHz; 11-14-2018 at 08:02 PM.
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post #626 of 745 Old 11-14-2018, 08:10 PM - Thread Starter
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Please others, beta test this for me and tell me when it is ready...
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post #627 of 745 Old 11-14-2018, 08:50 PM
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Emotiva updated the RMC-1 page for the second time today and now it's showing an ETA for Dirac (Q1 2019). I remember seeing the same note when I purchased my XMC-1 back in May 2017 for the V3 HDMI Board. By that time was Q2 2017. The V3 HDMI Board was finally released 1 year later.
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Enrico Castagnetti @ Rythmik Audio - Dialing In Rythmik Audio Subwoofers - REW for macOS
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post #628 of 745 Old 11-14-2018, 09:11 PM
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I too was surprised that Dirac wasn’t ready, but the same was true with the XMC. I actually use my XMC-1 a lot without Dirac as it drives my 2-channel system which I usually run flat (with subs), and my HT sounds very good flat too, maybe play with the subs a bit. If I was available to work on my system it wouldn’t delay my purchase, but I’m busy for a while. Hopefully some of the modules will come out pretty soon and I can purchase it with them. I’m anxious to hear how @deewan ’s install goes though.

HT: Emotiva XMC-1G2v3> XPA-7G3> B&W 805S, HTM3S, SCMS & SVS SB-4000 (7.2) | Sony XBR-85X900F
2C: Emotiva XMC-1G2v3> VTL MB-450> Magnepan 20.1R
Sources: Oppo UDP-203, DirecTV HS17/C61K, AppleTV4K, Mac mini, Thorens TD-295 IV w/ Grado Sonata > Emotiva XPS-1
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post #629 of 745 Old 11-14-2018, 09:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deewan View Post
Releasing without calibration software is only a big deal if your room has issues you can't resolve with treatments or you think the software is a magic bullet to better sound. I've had a Marantz 7704 in my system since my room's completion and not once have I considered running the ARC software based on the results I've heard from other Audyessy implementations. I did enjoy what Dirac did to the sound on the XMC and my previous room, so once Dirac is released I'll give it a whirl. But it's not a deal breaker. Dirac working day one doesn't prevent the RMC-1 from working all it's other magic. But hey, that's just my opinion... a drug user who has a ton of money.


Let’s be real. Audio electronic hardware is commodity parts. It doesn’t “sound” like anything unless it sucks or is deployed with abject incompetence. If you don’t care about good sounding bass (which requires comprehensive EQ) and “need” an absurd channel count, what does the RMC-1 have over the Marantz 8805 that costs about the same, supports more codecs, and will be certainly be less buggy as deployed in 2018?


The only answer was “Dirac Live.”

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post #630 of 745 Old 11-14-2018, 09:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jjackkrash View Post
"At the beta test stage, the product has already passed through the first-level, internal pilot-test (alpha test) and glaring defects have been removed. But (since the product may still have some minor problems that require user participation) it is released to selected customers for testing under normal, everyday conditions of use to spot the remaining flaws."

http://www.businessdictionary.com/de...beta-test.html

I am having a hard time seeing how you can even beta test a product to expose "minor flaws" when that product isn't even fully functional yet.
Room correction, while still being a major feature of the product, is still only 1 nice-to-have feature.

The critical features being:
Can it boot?
Can it hand-shake and lock onto HDMI signals/smooth port-switching?
Can it direct-analog bypass in 2 and 7.1?
Can it do analog to PCM with DSP?
Can it do USB DAC in 2 and 7.1?
Can it do NAS file streaming?
Can it eARC?
Can it decode flac and mp3 etc?
Can it perform TCPIP Cat-5 and 802.11 wifi handshakes for internet access and AV files?
Can it perform Dolby Atmos and DTS 9.1.6 decoding?
Can it perform AM/FM tuner stuff?
Do the menus make sense, fast, bug-free?
Test Tone generators working?
9.1.6 discrete XO's with delay/polarity inversion working?
Triggers working?
SPDIF Optical, COAX ports working?
All the audio bit-depths and sample-rates working?
All the color-spaces and HDR, HFR, and Dolby Vision working and all that good HDMI 2.0xyz stuff?
Can it accept new FW updates without bricking?
Will it screech and clip and explode all the amplifiers and speakers and subwoofers instantly on turn-off or use?

There are a LOT of features other than JUST: dirac room correction.

But chances are: If they can't get the basic base-features ALL working without it, then they won't be able to get it working WITH the additional complexity added...

and let's not even mention the: future-expandable modular-architecture it may/may-not have\get...

Competing directly against Trinnov is no easy task, even at smaller channel counts. (Especially for less money.)
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Last edited by BassThatHz; 11-14-2018 at 09:28 PM.
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