"OFFICIAL" 2017 Denon "S-Series" / "X-Series" AVR Owner's Thread + FAQ (Posts 1-8) - Page 438 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #13111 of 13149 Old 05-20-2020, 07:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Brian_Barros View Post
It does have it. There seems to be an issue between lg 9 series oled and this generation AVR. I called Denon yesterday. First the guy told me eARC wasn't a feature of this AVR. Then he told me Dolby True HD doesn't pass through eARC. After I corrected him on his wrong information he then told me it was an LG problem. I told him I also own a 3500. eARC works perfectly fine with x500 series and the lg C9. He was baffled after that. He told me that I would get an email or phone call from his supervisor within 24 hours. I never gave him my phone number or email address which I realized after I hung up the phone. I guess he got the last laugh.

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My dad has an LG C9 and a 4400 and has no issues at all with eARC. But he doesn’t run anything through the tv anyways. Everything is done through the receiver.

Could be an issue with an HDMI cable that may not be receiving the full signal or a handshake issue.


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post #13112 of 13149 Old 05-20-2020, 07:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Quicksilv3r View Post
My dad has an LG C9 and a 4400 and has no issues at all with eARC. But he doesn’t run anything through the tv anyways. Everything is done through the receiver.

Could be an issue with an HDMI cable that may not be receiving the full signal or a handshake issue.


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Then he's not using eARC......

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post #13113 of 13149 Old 05-20-2020, 07:59 AM
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There is a LG eARC thread here:
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/40-ol...fo-thread.html
This shows that the 4400 does not work with the C9. I dont have this TV so dont have any first hand exp but recall seeing that thread. hopefully it helps
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post #13114 of 13149 Old 05-20-2020, 08:02 AM
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Originally Posted by Brian_Barros View Post
Then he's not using eARC......

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Yes he is. He doesn't use it. I tested it out. So don't make this into a thing because I know what he has and what it can do.

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post #13115 of 13149 Old 05-20-2020, 08:05 AM
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Originally Posted by Quicksilv3r View Post
Yes he is. He doesn't use it. I tested it out. So don't make this into a thing because I know what he has and what it can do.

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What exactly are you doing to test? If everything is plugged into the AVR then ARC or eARC isn't used. I'm not making it into a thing.

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post #13116 of 13149 Old 05-20-2020, 08:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Brian_Barros View Post
What exactly are you doing to test? If everything is plugged into the AVR then ARC or eARC isn't used. I'm not making it into a thing.

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I've tested his Oppo 203 player as well as I've had my Xbox connected to the tv and seen TrueHD and DTS HD MA through eARC. He has everything running to the AVR, I was just playing around.

So yes, i know what it can do. I have seen it. My dad is a huge audiophile for over 50yrs. He has his system configured. So stop arguing with me that he isn't using it.

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post #13117 of 13149 Old 05-20-2020, 08:25 AM
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Originally Posted by Quicksilv3r View Post
I've tested his Oppo 203 player as well as I've had my Xbox connected to the tv and seen TrueHD and DTS HD MA through eARC. He has everything running to the AVR, I was just playing around.

So yes, i know what it can do. I have seen it. My dad is a huge audiophile for over 50yrs. He has his system configured. So stop arguing with me that he isn't using it.

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Not once was I arguing. Im asking is all.

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post #13118 of 13149 Old 05-20-2020, 08:27 AM
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Originally Posted by sjm817 View Post
There is a LG eARC thread here:

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/40-ol...fo-thread.html

This shows that the 4400 does not work with the C9. I dont have this TV so dont have any first hand exp but recall seeing that thread. hopefully it helps
I've read allot of that thread. Not one person has it working. I'm intrigued that someone here says it works.

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post #13119 of 13149 Old 05-20-2020, 08:30 AM
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Originally Posted by Brian_Barros View Post
Not once was I arguing. Im asking is all.

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ok cool.

So why not just hook everything up to the avr? the tv apps regardless of what you use, doesn't use anything beyond DD+, unless you can't install anything more into the 4400, you add an extra point of failure (which is what you've encountered) with ARC and eARC.
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post #13120 of 13149 Old 05-20-2020, 08:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Quicksilv3r View Post
ok cool.



So why not just hook everything up to the avr? the tv apps regardless of what you use, doesn't use anything beyond DD+, unless you can't install anything more into the 4400, you add an extra point of failure (which is what you've encountered) with ARC and eARC.
Because at some point the ps5 will be out. I shouldnt have to choose between all the video features or audio features of all the new tech. I picked out what I wanted so I could have both. I should get both since both tv and AVR are advertised to support the tech

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post #13121 of 13149 Old 05-20-2020, 09:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quicksilv3r View Post
I've tested his Oppo 203 player as well as I've had my Xbox connected to the tv and seen TrueHD and DTS HD MA through eARC. He has everything running to the AVR, I was just playing around.

So yes, i know what it can do. I have seen it. My dad is a huge audiophile for over 50yrs. He has his system configured. So stop arguing with me that he isn't using it.

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Didn’t seem to me like anyone was arguing with you. Curious as to how you think anyone would have known that you tested anything or that eARC was in use at all when your initial post specifically stated that nothing was being run thru the tv. None of us have esp to know that you did something you didn’t include in your post...
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post #13122 of 13149 Old 05-20-2020, 02:31 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Brian_Barros View Post
Is there a site to download updates and see change logs?

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Download updates ---> https://usa.denon.com/en-us/downloads/productupdates

See change logs ---> no, other than what is listed in post 6.
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post #13123 of 13149 Old 05-20-2020, 02:33 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by PJL99 View Post
Well I have a X2400H with a Samsung Q900 and eARC is working. I would think that the X4400H would have it too.
Unfortunately, as noted in post 1 of this thread, only the X3400H/X4400H/X6400H were provided with the eARC firmware update. The X2400H only features ARC as provided from the factory; however, ARC can still pass DD+ which is the best audio that any TV smart app is currently passing.
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post #13124 of 13149 Old 05-20-2020, 04:08 PM
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Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post
Unfortunately, as noted in post 1 of this thread, only the X3400H/X4400H/X6400H were provided with the eARC firmware update. The X2400H only features ARC as provided from the factory; however, ARC can still pass DD+ which is the best audio that any TV smart app is currently passing.
Ah so the 2400 doesn't support it.

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post #13125 of 13149 Old 05-21-2020, 05:43 AM
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Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post
Unfortunately, as noted in post 1 of this thread, only the X3400H/X4400H/X6400H were provided with the eARC firmware update. The X2400H only features ARC as provided from the factory; however, ARC can still pass DD+ which is the best audio that any TV smart app is currently passing.
Do you know the HDMI version that supports DD+ over "non-eARC?'" All specs I can find say DD 5.1 only.
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post #13126 of 13149 Old 05-21-2020, 05:51 AM
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I have zone 2 set for my outside deck. I'm connected with Heos. Is there a way to be sitting on the deck and choose the music through my phone? I want to be able to play a specific song stored on a card in my phone or an Amazon Music song.
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post #13127 of 13149 Old 05-21-2020, 06:00 AM
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I have zone 2 set for my outside deck. I'm connected with Heos. Is there a way to be sitting on the deck and choose the music through my phone? I want to be able to play a specific song stored on a card in my phone or an Amazon Music song.
Don't use Heos.... Connect via Bluetooth

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post #13128 of 13149 Old 05-21-2020, 06:22 AM
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Originally Posted by Brian_Barros View Post
Don't use Heos.... Connect via Bluetooth
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Originally Posted by supercell View Post
I have zone 2 set for my outside deck. I'm connected with Heos. Is there a way to be sitting on the deck and choose the music through my phone? I want to be able to play a specific song stored on a card in my phone or an Amazon Music song.
I might be missing something, but I have DefTechs wired to zone 2 on my deck as well. If I pull up the Heos app on my Droid it gives me a "This Phone" source on the Music screen which allows me to play tracks stored in music folders on the phone. As suggested, Bluetooth is also supposed to work, I just haven't had to use it in my situation.
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post #13129 of 13149 Old 05-21-2020, 06:41 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by supercell View Post
I have zone 2 set for my outside deck. I'm connected with Heos. Is there a way to be sitting on the deck and choose the music through my phone? I want to be able to play a specific song stored on a card in my phone or an Amazon Music song.
Yup. If you look at the HEOS music page, you'll note an input called "This phone" as well as an "Amazon Music" input too.
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post #13130 of 13149 Old 05-21-2020, 06:44 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by PJL99 View Post
Do you know the HDMI version that supports DD+ over "non-eARC?'" All specs I can find say DD 5.1 only.
Dolby Digital Plus may be transmitted across HDMI 1.3 or newer, according to IEC 61937-3.

https://denon-uk.custhelp.com/app/an...-compatibility
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post #13131 of 13149 Old 05-21-2020, 11:26 AM
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Do you know the HDMI version that supports DD+ over "non-eARC?'" All specs I can find say DD 5.1 only.
To augment jdsmoothie's reply, bear in mind that few TVs even try to send DD+ over plain ARC.
Modern LG TVs do (which of course means that if that DD+ stream contains Atmos, then Atmos works too - albeit lossy).
The Samsung 2016 TV used to have, did not.

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To augment jdsmoothie's reply, bear in mind that few TVs even try to send DD+ over plain ARC.

Modern LG TVs do (which of course means that if that DD+ stream contains Atmos, then Atmos works too - albeit lossy).

The Samsung 2016 TV used to have, did not.
My 2018 Samsung Q9 has DD+

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post #13133 of 13149 Old 05-21-2020, 02:28 PM
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Originally Posted by mrtickleuk View Post
To augment jdsmoothie's reply, bear in mind that few TVs even try to send DD+ over plain ARC.
Modern LG TVs do (which of course means that if that DD+ stream contains Atmos, then Atmos works too - albeit lossy).
The Samsung 2016 TV used to have, did not.
TVs have been sending DD+ over ARC for many years. Dont think you can buy one that doesnt. DD+ cant go over optical so ARC is the only real way with TV apps. My 2013 Samsung didnt support DD+ when Netflix started using it. It would send as PCM 2.0. After many complaints they updated FW to convert DD+ to a DD output. I think many did that until they fully supported DD+

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DD+ cant go over optical so ARC is the only real way with TV apps.
I know.

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DD+ cant go over optical so ARC is the only real way with TV apps.
My 2013 Samsung didnt support DD+ when Netflix started using it. It would send as PCM 2.0. After many complaints they updated FW to convert DD+ to a DD output. I think many did that until they fully supported DD+
That's good news for the model you had, but I can only restate my experience with the 2016 Samsung which definitely didn't support DD+ over ARC, ever. Not in 2 years of firmware updates.

With my current LG I realise I've got the "sweet spot" in terms of support. DD+ over ARC works, and DTS over ARC works as well. To get both of these in the same TV is apparently now going to be difficult . I say this because the new 2020 LGs have completely removed support for DTS-out (some people are going completely crazy about this as if the world is ending), and it's my understanding that Samsung did the same a few years ago too.

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post #13135 of 13149 Old 05-21-2020, 04:10 PM
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I know.



That's good news for the model you had, but I can only restate my experience with the 2016 Samsung which definitely didn't support DD+ over ARC, ever. Not in 2 years of firmware updates.

With my current LG I realise I've got the "sweet spot" in terms of support. DD+ over ARC works, and DTS over ARC works as well. To get both of these in the same TV is apparently now going to be difficult . I say this because the new 2020 LGs have completely removed support for DTS-out (some people are going completely crazy about this as if the world is ending), and it's my understanding that Samsung did the same a few years ago too.
Thats a shame, DD+-> DD conversion was a pretty common feature that TVs were doing early on. It is still available on some TVs. My 2019 Sony has setting to convert DD+ to DD output which would be needed if you had an old AVR that doesnt support DD+. I thinks DTS support is probably not much of a focus because pretty much every streaming service uses DD+.
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post #13136 of 13149 Old 05-23-2020, 12:15 PM - Thread Starter
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Hi everyone,

I have a Denon AVR-X4400H. I just recently installed outdoor speakers. I was planning on powering them with my receiver. After they were installed, I went to hook up the wires to the receiver only to find that the zone inputs were not speaker wire hookups. Now I am wondering what I can do to power them.

What options do I have? I have a Memorial Day party tomorrow that I am wanting to play music outside for. So if needed, I can use the main F and L speaker hookups in the meantime to not rush it. Would it be best to get a separate receiver to power them or do I need an amplifier by itself?

Could someone provide more insight in what I should do?
The X4400H is a 9CH model so:

(a) With a standard 5.1 speaker setup in the main zone, it can also power 2 speakers in each of Zones 2 and 3 (ie. AMP ASSIGN = 5.1Ch + Zone 2/3 with the Zone 2 speakers connected to the Height 1 speaker posts and the Zone 3 speakers connected to the Height 2 speaker posts.
(b) With a 7.1 or 5.1.2 speaker setup in the main zone, it can also power 2 speakers in Zone 2 (ie. AMP ASSIGN = 7.1Ch + Zone 2 with the Zone 2 speakers connected to the Height 2 speaker posts.
(c) If you only have a 5.1 setup, you can use either of the above settings.

Otherwise, you would only have to connect a 2CH amp to the Zone 2 pre-outs if you had an 9.1 or 11.1 setup in the main zone.

Refer to post 3 item 12 "Zone 2" for more information.
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post #13137 of 13149 Old 05-23-2020, 01:11 PM
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Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post
The X4400H is a 9CH model so:

(a) With a standard 5.1 speaker setup in the main zone, it can also power 2 speakers in each of Zones 2 and 3 (ie. AMP ASSIGN = 5.1Ch + Zone 2/3 with the Zone 2 speakers connected to the Height 1 speaker posts and the Zone 3 speakers connected to the Height 2 speaker posts.
(b) With a 7.1 or 5.1.2 speaker setup in the main zone, it can also power 2 speakers in Zone 2 (ie. AMP ASSIGN = 7.1Ch + Zone 2 with the Zone 2 speakers connected to the Height 2 speaker posts.
(c) If you only have a 5.1 setup, you can use either of the above settings.

Otherwise, you would only have to connect a 2CH amp to the Zone 2 pre-outs if you had an 9.1 or 11.1 setup in the main zone.

Refer to post 3 item 12 "Zone 2" for more information.
Thanks! This helped a ton. I plan on running a 9.1 or 9.2 setup, so I think I will definitely need to go with the additional amp. So, I buy the amp and then run an RCA cable between the two? Does anyone know if I can play two different sources from the receiver between the main and zone or is it limited to playing one source from the main zone be cast to the other zones?

I see the amp recommended in the post isn't sold anymore on Amazon. Is there another option that anyone would recommend?

https://www.amazon.com/Audio-Source-.../dp/B00ZSEFU94

Currently, 5.1 setup
AVR - Denon AVR-X4400H
Sub - SVS PB-4000
Mains - Klipsch RP-600M
Surrounds - Klipsch satellite speakers
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post #13138 of 13149 Old 05-23-2020, 03:06 PM
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Thanks! This helped a ton. I plan on running a 9.1 or 9.2 setup, so I think I will definitely need to go with the additional amp. So, I buy the amp and then run an RCA cable between the two? Does anyone know if I can play two different sources from the receiver between the main and zone or is it limited to playing one source from the main zone be cast to the other zones?



I see the amp recommended in the post isn't sold anymore on Amazon. Is there another option that anyone would recommend?



https://www.amazon.com/Audio-Source-.../dp/B00ZSEFU94
The AVR is capable of running each zone individually or all together

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post #13139 of 13149 Old 05-23-2020, 03:54 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by pfar54 View Post
Thanks! This helped a ton. I plan on running a 9.1 or 9.2 setup, so I think I will definitely need to go with the additional amp. So, I buy the amp and then run an RCA cable between the two? Does anyone know if I can play two different sources from the receiver between the main and zone or is it limited to playing one source from the main zone be cast to the other zones?

I see the amp recommended in the post isn't sold anymore on Amazon. Is there another option that anyone would recommend?

https://www.amazon.com/Audio-Source-.../dp/B00ZSEFU94
You would connect the Zone 2 pre-outs to an input on the external amp.

Other zones allow you to play the same source as the main zone (if 2CH PCM or ALL ZONE STEREO is selected) or a different source in each zone.

Note also, that you can connect up to 32 HEOS speakers as additional zones, either as single speakers, or up to 16 can be grouped together for whole house audio playing up to 8 different sources. Two HEOS speakers of the same model can also be grouped together as a stereo L/R pair.

The amp recommended in the link you posted is still available when I click on it.
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post #13140 of 13149 Old 05-23-2020, 10:13 PM
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Best Buy carries the Russound P75 amplifier. It may be available at a store near you in time for your party.
https://www.bestbuy.com/site/russoun...?skuId=7263263

If it's not in stock, consider that a stereo receiver should suit your needs. BB has 3 that have similar features from Yamaha, Sony and Insignia (looks like it's Sony-made) for a little less money.
https://www.bestbuy.com/site/insigni...?skuId=4156007
https://www.bestbuy.com/site/sony-2-...?skuId=6187501
https://www.bestbuy.com/site/yamaha-...?skuId=5037100

There's also a Pioneer stereo receiver and 2 Gemini amps, but that's going up in price for no real reason it would seem.

Hopefully one of those is in stock, otherwise Costco, Target, Walmart, BJ's, etc may have something in their electronics departments.

You could also just reallocate 2 of your 9 surround channels to the outside zone for the party and/or until you resolve the amplifier issue.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pfar54 View Post
I have a Denon AVR-X4400H. I just recently installed outdoor speakers. I was planning on powering them with my receiver. After they were installed, I went to hook up the wires to the receiver only to find that the zone inputs were not speaker wire hookups. Now I am wondering what I can do to power them.
What options do I have? I have a Memorial Day party tomorrow that I am wanting to play music outside for. So if needed, I can use the main F and L speaker hookups in the meantime to not rush it. Would it be best to get a separate receiver to power them or do I need an amplifier by itself?
Quote:
Originally Posted by pfar54 View Post
I plan on running a 9.1 or 9.2 setup, so I think I will definitely need to go with the additional amp.

Last edited by philpoe; 05-23-2020 at 10:48 PM.
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